ZeftheWicked.3076

Not bad! If you want more damage it's easy:

1. Slot dhuumfire. Death Perception does nothing for you here. Decimate defenses + berserker's gear precision already overcap 100% crit chance.

2. i dunno about well of suffering, but i think shadow fiend will do better damage then well of corruption.

3. focus does way more damage then warhorn.

I play and main necro and my vote is necro. Forget raid damage or getting 1v5 in pvp, though they certainly contribute. Two top reason i voted necro are:

1. core necro is not viable no matter how you slice it compared other core classes. Death shroud is **horrible**. Power build gets destroyed by cc and doesnt' do that much damage, condi build takes forever to get it's damage going.

2. **overboard** profession weakness. I get everyone has their short end of the stick. But necro's lack of stability is just atrocious. To add insult to injury necro is not a boon span class, so any boon (except might) that he looses to boonhate is a serious loss, and it's hard for him to shield his stab with a wall of other boons. Because of that necro's top tier play is not about you being a great necro. It's about you having great teammates that babysit your ass. Something other professions aren't forced to do...

**Reality check:**

Scourge has no access to reaper's decimate defenses (50% free crit off vulnies), cannot go blood magic if he wants damage (spite + soul reaping), and must equip very squishy gear to get any real power damage. His desert shroud has fixed duration and longer cooldown then reaper's shroud - so 50% crit boost from soul reaping doesn't shine that much even if you do slot it.

It's damage **or** support for a power scourge.

Reaper has not only decimate defenses to allow him huge room for tankier stat sets, but also his own build in, very solid defenses (Rise!, Infusing Terror, Gs #4 blind zone). Not to mention ferocity boost with reaper's onslaught.

Reaper doesn't have isses when building power, he has options. There's a shitton of hybrid stats he can successfully use to builds himself into a power tank that will have no issues on the offense and very solid defense. Ol' reapy can trait blood magic just fine, and still have all the crit chance and power he needs to deliver.

nvm...can't confirm 100% atm.

I play a necro and don't feel like a scrub, quite the opposite.

Also necro is far from "easy" as ppl say. He is **forgiving** with his high sustain.

However he is complex to build (which is good) and also requires way deeper knowledge then most professions to play well vs tougher enemies.

Trait **Retribution**. Most revs will hang themselves over 10-20% dps loss, but this line is the shit for surviving. Retribution (especially planar protection) + Jalis = massive survivial.

Be a man. Get Twilight, and keep it that way. Dye armor black/red and if ppl ask about blue skills, say that's souls of the dead being burned in extreme heat of your infernal blaze! So hot it's blue not red!

Let's see....

holo power.

Spellbreaker power

revenant power

druid bunker/sb power

deadeye power

guardian power or burn (but he has few cover condies and is easy to put down as long as you're aware he's a burn guard)

necro - reaper power/scourge...nerfed

ele....yy...anyone seen these?

mirage - whatever it wants to be..

So currently we're suffering from overbearing condi meta of nerfed scourges, some mirages and a few (or less) burnguards.

A-net made a sound decision to curbstomp condi cancer. It was clearly overtaking the meta and driving the few, almost non existant power builds extinct!

I agree F2P should not be allowed in ranked. That being said, i also support pvp league awards (pip system and chests) to be available (and shared) across both ranked and unranked. F2P can grind their ascended shards of glory and other mats for lege/ascended while rank oriented players can have their matches suffer much less manipulation.

Tournament info is outta whack. 7 teams register, they're in "round 1". Teams that passed are also shown on eliminated list.

Technically seems to work fine, just the info displayed is bonkers.

Pick necro. You'll always be offmeta so safe zoned from the start B)

Just a short reminder this is "raid" scenario talk from most. It's a different game when you need solid defenses. Here from what i've experienced it's a simple divide - condi reaper will lose a lot of dps if he wants defensive utilities/ traits, scourge won't lose that much.

Reverse is true for power builds.

Just curious - where are the best reapers at in ranks? And how far can a solo (no buddy healer strapped to your leg) reaper get?

Oh come on. Everyone and their dog knows this one time a-net's on the money.

Look at any aspect of smokescale and you can say it's OP. Durability is way above canines which smokescale is part of (or should be looking it it's skills).

It's the sole land smokefield provider for ranger - huge for stealth generation. Oh for SB it also provides a leap finisher, how dandy!

Has a knockdown like all canines, even if purely melee.

And then there's smoke assault....or two if you're a SB.

Somone point me to a core Tyrian Pet that comes even close to that?

Tbh i wouldn't mind if that spec never happened. Only good thing about it is barriers and using them to give necro shield that doesn't deprive him of his utilities nor ability to be healed.

But other then that this is not a necro spec using shades. It's shade spec with necro taked on there somewhere. core necro is...ok it's shit. But still a necro. Reaper is fun, with tons of builds and engaging playstyle. Scourge is more boring then a warrior! And when i think something is more boring the a warrior, you know it's fucked!

> @"TexZero.7910" said:

> 32k is a bit on the ludicrous side of damage for this game, even more so for PvP which has a lower overall stat pool.

Deadeyes want a word..

In WvW you'll get to really understand what **short**bow means...

It seems they do the lazy approach:

1. Does profession have a meta build for a given game mode, or preffered damage type?

2. If yes, balance around that, screw other options.

3. ????

4. Profit.

Condi Herald and Renegade still await their viability in WvW and sPvP...

Wait wasn't core necro removed along with dungeons and 25 condi cap few years ago?

Simple solutions don't mean jack if they're not smart...and yours...

* double tougness - tougness has diminishing returns (as does vitality). If you're running a 0 toughness build, getting extra 180 from trait upgrade is a slight defense upgrade. If you're already running a high toughness build, result will be miliscule.

* double power boost from deathly strength - if you want to make Death magic viable by giving it real attack options it'll again have to be more then just that. Power too has diminishing returns, and necro already amasses insane amounts of raw power with Awaken the Pain and traited Signet of Spite..

* double protection duration won't do much in competitive where boonstrip is vicious. And with concentration you could reach absurd situation of having 100% protection uptime from a minor trait.

* Unholy Sanctuary - double regen would be a start, but the whole design of this regen is **garbage**. Twice the garbage is still garbage. Here's why it's garbage (yes I will use that word for current interation of this trait a lot). It's a **grandmaster/passive** regen. In layman's terms:

* it heals good? BROOO-OOOKEN! You can't let 100% passive heal outdo or match up to active ones or the semi-passives that feed on active actions (blighter's boon, signet of vampirism).

* it doesn't heal well? GAAA-AAARBAAAGE! It's a grandmaster! It's supposed to be **impactful**.

Bottom line is, current unholy sanctuary healing design is a failure out of the gate, no matter what numbers you put there. It needs passive, meaningful, powerful healing. But for that to slide from balance perspective it needs to be dependant on player's actions. I needs **a chance to fail** (you getting knocked outta shroud fast), if it is to be allowed to have **chance to succeed** (you managed shroud well and receive vastly more powerful regen the longer you drag it out).

In all you said, in my opinion you only hit the mark once. That is by noticing that Death Magic is underperforming and one reason to that might be lack of offense. That is very true. 5 outta seven lines offer **meaningful** tools for both offense and defense (curses, spite, soul reaping, reaper, scourge). Blood magic doesn't, but it makes up by being only core spec to heavily address party utility (reviving, healing, sharing protection and condi transfer), along with having really good utility traits (banshee's veil, quickening thirst).

Death Magic is indeed drop dead last. No party utility, no real offensive options, no healing (I would refuse to aknowledge Unholy Sanctuary as a meaningful healing option even in spite, let alone the heavily defense oriented Death Magic). Death magic has attack and healing tools in addition to damage mitigation, but they are **inconsequential** unlike other traitlines.

@"ZDragon.3046" yes- i'm well aware of corrupter's fervor - that is the reason passive has 10% condi damage reduction and not more - to not overshadow this grandmaster trait. It's intented to stack or act as poor man's corrupter's ferver when choosing a different grandmaster trait.

I honestly think boon eating is a very fun and unique idea, especially in terms of necro - the profession that does unthinkable and unholy things to boons and condies alike. Corrupting boons, pulling condies to munch on them like a fresh stake, or convert them to boons...it fits necro.

But all in all it's simply a mechanic of exempting outside boons from being made unremovable. I very much stand by the idea of boon lock for necro - he needs his own, personal way of dealing with boonhate without becoming a generic boon span class like just about anything that's not a thief or necro.

Seems you two ( @"ZDragon.3046" & @"Dadnir.5038" ) have given green light to another idea of mine. I don't mind the boon munching functionality going elsewhere. Necro is a **devourer** who will consume enemy's life, condies on himself (consume conditions), condies off allies (Unholy martyr), enemy's death (life force gain)....him munching on even his own boons sounds awesome.

But back to topic at hand. Alternative solution might be that allied boons are not removed, but neither do they get protected. When enemy corrupt/boon rip land on you when you're under sanctuary state, the boons you applied don't appear in their pool of boons to corrupt. So the chance of them stripping ally's boons is increased vs regular scenario when both yours and ally sourced boons are up for getting axed.

A third functionality (if boon munching is not gonna be part of the trait) I was thinking about for Unholy martyr, is condition duration reduction. Like -15% to condition duration when shrouded (next to incremental regen over time aspect0.

Point is to provide another passive anti-condi feature, since necro lacks resistance and should be **The** profession that can shrug off condi pressure like nothing.

@"Anchoku.8142" some good ideas there. The fear part is indeed sticking out like a sore thumb. I just didn't want to take a fear cast from a necro since terror builds are already not doing too hot, but getting it outta here and merging the "fear 4 fear" aspect with Soul Reaping's trait is something i can get behind.

As for **putrid defense** tbh what i feel is really lacking is a way to apply poison. Necro is a special beast in regard to condies. Even power necro has a use for damaging condies, and this trait should be one of them. If not for damage of condition itself, then for damage mitigation from this trait and healing reduction. But currently i got no good idea how to make this trait apply the poison it needs in a way that will be balanced and functional.

**Deadly Strength** is a no go, least not the way you'd like it. If you introduce now power boosting party buff to the meta, devs will have either curb warrior (his banner of strength or Empower Allies) or curb everyone's damage across the board because that would be changing the top dps for all power builds, and current #1 dps of all is power spellbreaker (the irony). Not to mention they would probably do something nasty to Necro for having such strong party utility...

Some time ago i suggested instead adding a hard cc duration reduction to it, like rune of melandru's. So that we have some passive anti-cc in here. If it's damage you want for Death magic - yes adding that would greatly boost it's viability. But you'd need another method of doing that.

**Death Nova** - an excellent idea! One thing that absolutely sucks about this trait is that you can only detonate some of your minions while others die "when and where it happens". Being able to manually decide when to trigger is is abrilliant idea!

@"ZDragon.3046" - soul comprehension change added to first post :)

@"Dadnir.5038"

This line already has a big toughness buff - the corrupter's fervor along with 180 tougness when in shroud. Total 480 tougness you can get for free when shrouded. Plus 20 for each minion if you trait for it.

Also Unholy Sanctuary is designed this way to protect party play. Imagine a necro that gets like 10 stab stacks from allies (mesmer and guard for example), resistance (mesmer and rev) and now he just sealed them up, **no one** can remove them. That would be beyond broken.

For that reason ally boons are to be destroyed (with a payout) and only necro's own boons shielded. That way balance is not broken as his own boonset is designed with his strenghths and weaknesses in mind.

And if you're in a raid, or organized PvE group - it is very unlikely you would pick death magic, let alone unholy sanctuary in the first place! In raid you pick spec lines that offer maximum damage or maximum party utility. Death magic meets none of these cryteria.

In other PvE content in general having your boons ripped is almost non-existant threat. You would sooner trait Death Nova or corrupter's fervor in such a case. Not to mention most of the time PvE is a solo endevour so ally boons aren't that big of a factor at all.

@"ZDragon.3046"

As mentioned in my reply to Dadnir - ally boons have to go, because if you could lock boons you're not supposed to get on your own at all, or at least not in huge abundance (stab, resistance) you could become unbeliveable menace. Yet without such a mechanic, especially in competitive we're down to "cc ragdoll" scenario, even if you're playing reaper. Too many enemies can remove your boons, and necro cannot just go "meh, whatever" at losing his stab or protection and keep recasting it every 3 seconds, or filling the void with dodges/blocks/invlunies.

Therefore this trait offers another choice i find **very** complelling for necro players:

* rely on allies and choose not to slot Unholy Sanctuary (after all it is not a minor trait, you're not forced to pick it).

* rely on yourself and choose it for moments when your own boons will stick with you no matter what.

About other traits:

* Beyond the veil - I have no issue with this trait whatsoever, i actually consider it a highlight. Death magic by design is great for making shroud builds, which suffer windows of vulnerablity when returning to base form. Some free protection on shroud exit is a very good minor for this line. More over with my Unholy Sanctuary it would receive protection from being removed. Excellent news for competitive necros that are almost always bursted after they drop shroud so they don't have time to gain lifeforce and shroud up again.

* Soul comprehension - didn't think about this one, but i will. Will update when i have solid idea for it.

#Changes:

**Putrid defense** - you take 10% less damage from poisoned foes. Poison applied to you is 50% effective when shrouded (damage & healing reduction).

**Soul Comprehension** - change the name to **corrupter's protection** - when you're under effect of protection, reduce condition damage taken by 10%.

**Reaper's protection** - gain protection when you stunbreak (3s). When you're feared, fear the enemy back (60s icd)

**Unholy Sanctuary** - when **you** trigger shroud (both activation and exit) enter "unholy sanctuary" state for 5 seconds. When entering this state consume all boons received from outside sources to heal yourself (small heal pre each boon type, stacks don't matter), and no new boons can be applied from outside sources for the duration of the state.

Your own boons however will function and when casted on yourself will be **immune to corrupting, removal or transfer** for the duration of this state.

Also regenerate increasing amounts of health when shrouded (200 hp base, 0.2 coefficient). Increase these values per 20% of base each second until reaching 100% bonus values cap at 6th second.

#Why:

Death Magic has a clearly defined role - passive defenses that synergize well with minion and shroud builds. Problem is the potency of these is just too low, especially when faced with other specializations that not only offer damage mitigation tools, but also potent healing (blood magic, spite, reaper to name a few). So to break down each change:

* **Putrid Defense** - being all about passive defenses Death Magic should address one of greatest banes that necro shroud builds face - being poisoned. It's hard enough to heal up when shrouded (unless you're scourge), if you're poisoned things get hairy. Since DM is about passive approach to defense i feel this way of doing things is proper.

* **Reaper's Protection** - not a lot of **protection** in the current interation. Also a lot of stunbreak skills are warming the bench because spectral armor is just too good. Adding some protection to them this way will add to their viability and give necros more build diversity.

* **Unholy Sanctuary** - current iteration is garbage. It's basically pressing F1 for the player with a poor regen when shrouded. Only saving grace is that it can ignore shroud cooldown and pop it regardless.

My proposition meets the needs of necro along with thematic of death magic's passive defense. Instead of more boons for necro a way to defend the few he has from boonhate. Necro is the absolute master of boon removal, so it makes sense for him to be able to defend against his own (or similar) tricks.

To keep it in line, this anti-boon defense applies only to boons the necro casts on himself. If you cast a traited well, when under "unholy sanctuary" state, protection you got from it won't be removable by enemies until the state is over. But protection your allies got can be ripped at any time.

Another balancing (and fun) aspect is how the boon protection competes with the healing. If you want a prolonged, no holes boon protect, you must leave shroud early - like 5s after you enter it. But that won't give you enough time to ramp up the heal to serious values. If you need decent healing you will want to camp shroud. But if you do so, initial boon protect will ware off and every second after that is a risk of getting your boons ripped off and becoming a cc ragdoll or eating more damage (protection ripped off). However taking that risk will not only net you more passive healing, but an opportunity to stack up more ally boons on self (now that they are no longer denied) to use for another healing burst on exit!

Also the boonstrip protection on exit will happen only when you exit shroud via pressing F1. If you let your life force get depleted to 0, you get nothing! Same for scourges - they can't leave their desert shroud on their own, it just runs out, so they get no exit bonus of unholy sanctuary. Similarly with heal - 6s desert shroud doesn't let them camp it and get huge passive heal for every extra second while shrouded.

That is deliberate. Scourges have no issues healing through barrier, and have ample amount of boons compared to reaper and core. They don't need that much power from this trait.

Well, don't be afraid to drop some feedback, it's what this thread is for!

> @"DeceiverX.8361" said:

> Reaper generally sucks everywhere but T4 fractals since the nerfs. I shelved mine and honestly believe core necro is better at this point. I do not play open-world PvE, however. From what I understand, anything still works there.

>

> Scourge isn't very good for PvE raids (necro in general isn't very strong here) but is on the OP side of sPvP, and completely and totally dominates everything in WvW except 1v1 against longbow rangers and rifle Deadeyes.

I play PvE reaper and let me tell you that if you plan to go core necro vs xpac content you're asking for it. Core necro has no business getting close to group of mobs if said group has hard cc, else it's gonna be a ragdoll show. And AoE is not that great. Reaper on the other hand has some proper stab and much better melee cleave. Also reaper's sustain eats core necro with a loud burp.

Scourge can also take on huge packs of mobs, despite low access to stab because his shades can be used even when cc'd. On top of that he doesn't use shroud mechanic, but barriers instead. They do not hinder healing in anyway, so scourge can heal himself up without any issues unlike core or reaper which lets him be the tank almost as much a reaper can.

To be fair however I still feel reaper is more fun of the two and if building for facing a strong enemy (like elite or a champ) reaper is better - both can be really tanky with crazy sustain if build and played right, but scourge be it power or condi will take a major hit to his damage. Condi tank scourge can't get expertise. Not if he wants some healing power and he'll need it. Power scourge is failing in crit chace dept - deadly perception is gimped by sand shroud mechanic (only 7s uptime + bigger cooldown), and decimate defenses is a reaper-only trait.

Reaper on the other hand, especially power reaper has no issues keeping a lot of his damage going while building real tanky, and healing up when shrouded is not longer a huge issue after recent Signets of Suffering rework (signet of vampirism is now suuupa powerful!).

So if it's open world PvE both scourge and reaper will rock your boat. For me the preference goes to reaper though.