Falan.1839

Yeah, and Infiltrator's Arrow still has no CD and Phase Traversal 5 seconds, and unlike holo leap they actually cover significant range and are significantly faster than running...

 

"Holo has extreme mobility hurr durr"

 

I can't take this forum seriously and I hope Anet doesn't either...

I have the same problem in the Den of Whispers, it's telling me to learn the Raven's Flight mastery to use the gates, but I have already specced it. Another raven's gate worked fine.

 

Edit: It might just be that these are connected with the Meta event, but the message is misleading to say the least.

> @"Tayga.3192" said:

> > @"Falan.1839" said:

> > Good stats. The representation of Holo is unsurprisingly mostly from the older mATs in October and November, at least on EU. And even on NA it seems to be slowly vanishing as of January.

>

> Revenant becoming relevant is a huge factor for this. Same goes for S/D thieves, they changed to S/P and even D/P to have a chance at killing heralds and mirages. Even weavers and firebrands, to a lesser degree.

 

Revenant was always relevant.

Good stats. The representation of Holo is unsurprisingly mostly from the older mATs in October and November, at least on EU. And even on NA it seems to be slowly vanishing as of January.

Probably got buried under the all the Rev White Knights defending every broken shit and whining their asses off when it got pushed of of Ranked Meta by Macebow Berserker for a few months. I mean, even the patch that completely overtuned Impossible Odds and put a free 3k dmg + boon removal on Shiro F2 was sold as nerf here in the forum by some clowns. And even now there are still Rev mains shouting for more nerfs on Holo.

 

Unfortunately this seems to have worked on Anet, since when CMC reacted to a post about Rev he basically said that Rev was dominating in mATs because it is picked by top players. Unfortunately, it's the other way around, top players pick it because it is dominating. However after that statement I expect it come out of the balance patch even more dominant.

FB is still pretty much unrivalled in its combination of heal, boons, cleanse and survivability. Staff Tempest has huge res cheese potential when using the right traits/skills (Gylph of Renewal, Arcane Resurrection), but it's very vulnerable.

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> For anyone curious... here's a (

) demonstrating how much damage output demo Soulbeast has.

>

> And here are some videos/clips of me fighting against rangers on multiple classes:

>

> 1. [Ranger vs. Ranger](

) - Mirror Matchup

> 2. [Mesmer vs. Ranger](

) - Punishing Maul

> 3. [Mesmer vs. Ranger](

) - Countering Longbow and Punishing Evade Frames

> 4. [Engi 1v2 vs. Core Mantra Mes and Core Marksmanship Ranger](

) - Good example on how to avoid/bait out ranger skills whilst simultaneously keeping track of pet attacks in a winning 1v2.

 

Can you please stop peddling your crap videos in every thread, I watched the engi one and it was a bad joke, some messy 2v2 turning into a 1v2 with a core mes facetanking jump shot on node and getting hit by the biggest crit possible. There is nothing to learn there except how terrible many randoms are.

Literally no one who doesn't want to gimp himself is even playing holo more. Rev complaining about Holo is really the best joke I have read in a while, thx.

Just dont listen to noobs, ez. They will get farmed by anything anyway when someone competent plays it. The nerf threads became a meme anyway and several of them were trolling, so I wouldn't take those too seriously.

You know Engi can apply reveal to you without you even stealthing, right? =)

Some slight nerfs are definitely called for, but they aren't as broken as Weaver, Rev and Thief imo. Also 1v1 tournament really isn't very indicative, when you have two tanky builds it will always go to the gas stage, and that has literally nothing to do with normal fights. And even a build that wins a lot of 1v1s without that mechanic can still struggle in actual conquest when it dies too easily in 1vX.

Did the achievements there I think when I was going for 30k AP, and then never touched it again.

Weaver, Rev and Thief dominate the meta. Fb is still the only viable support for teamfight comps.

At least it's pretty sure to thake the meta up majorly and that's a very good thing at this point. If the new meta will actually be amazing remains to be seen, but I am so sick of this one that I'd settle for pretty much anything over this, except a total bunker meta like after HoT release maybe.

The thread is almost a year old and things have changed. However, SD thief is still not a good duelist, its only good matchups are Mesmer and Rev. With the SP build the situation has obviously changed, but as I said, the thread is several months old and doesn't reflect the newest meta. Either way, in most situations you still want the thief roaming and not wasting its mobility to cap close, despite thief having become a bit more flexible concerning 1v1s with the SP build. Also, most points like not facetanking on node still stand, and I still read "fight on points" in every 3rd game....

 

Soon TM

The power level of Rev in WvW is vastly different than in PvP. So this thread makes absolutely zero sense to start with.

 

The dmg of Rev in PvP is fine, what arguable should be nerfed however is the near endless chain of dodges and blocks that, together with some mobility, basically seamlessly bridges the timeframe between two glint heals except when under heavy condi pressure. That is too much for a class with very high mobility and strong dps imo. Another issue is that it can be stacked very well and has strong synergy with FB, the main support, so these 2 classes dominate teamfight comps. It's just that teamfight comps themselves have been become somewhat rare recently, and people prefer roaming comps with tanky sidenoders. But even there Rev is still a very good pick.

Just that the insane OP build actually stopped being insane OP over a year ago, but people are apparently either still stuck in 2017 or in Gold League where node is life and facetanking meta.

 

Yesterday mAT (EU) saw no holos in the semifinal. In the final one player swapped from Reaper to Holo, presumably to use the reveal proc against Core Mes (Oneshot PU), but it didn't work out well and he got bombed several times in focus. The defining classes rn are Ele (as weaver exclusively), thief, and Rev (mostly Herald). Guard (FB), Mes and War aren't as dominant, but still being used regularly. Necro and Ranger are in a similar state as Engi in competitive play. So that means 3 classes basically don't figure in meta comps atm, even if a few loyalists are holding on to them.

Those mechanics, and also res cheese mechanics. If damage get seriously shaved, they need to be adjusted aswell. Stuff like the Ele res trait, blood res (when scourge was a thing) or possibly even search and rescue are already hard to outcleave for pugs at the current powerlevel.

> @"TrollingDemigod.3041" said:

> > @"Falan.1839" said:

 

> Sorry, little one, but you need to learn how to kite, when to disengage, where and how to engage, you can't just yolo into point and expect broken class to carry you(holosmith need massive nerfs to either damage or sustain, or even better, both). There are classes without much access to stability and they're doing fine.

 

You can safely assume I am better at all those things then you will ever be in the next 100 years. Unlike 95% of the forum warriors here I've at played mAT finals and am regularly in p3/leg. Not claiming my record is impressive but at least I know how the gameplay looks at high level. The classes that do fine without stability usually have very high evade frame uptime and/or a lot of portengages and -disengages. Since Holo has neither, it always depended on high stability uptime for high counterpressure to stay alive.

 

Right now the class is doing relatively fine in ranked, unless you face a top level duo on two offensive builds like Sind/Trama constantly focusing you. However, that really doesnt mean much because the average match quality in Ranked has dropped so much that, as a good player, you can get away with pretty much any build as long as you have some game knowledge, know when to engage and disengage and which rotations to make. Otherwise you wouldn't regularly see Druids, FA weavers, Condi Revs, Core Guards and a bunch of other second rate builds in P2/P3.

 

In ATs however it has disappeared from high level, because with revs, thieves, oneshot mesmers, warrs and what not hardfocussing you in 2v1 or 3v1 there is just nothing that will keep you alive after Elixir S, with even Photon Wall being unreliable due to unblockables and port/stealthengages from the side/behind. Even Necro, which has similar issues, has always relied and relies on ports like Sand Swell, Flesh Worm or Spectral Walk to survive these situations.

 

I am fairly sure we won't see many engis from semifinal onwards on Saturday (unless some lfg teams gets insanely lucky matchups), and these nerfs are one of the reasons why. Not many high level players will argue otherwise, and those who do are usually on some selfish crusade against the class because they don't like it or play some of the few builds that still struggle with it.

 

 

Yes, sure, if warriors WOULDN'T shit out a hard cc every 5-10 (shield bash, bulls charge, full counter, Dagger 3 all on decently low cds when traited, + 3 more on rampage), if pistol whip thieves WOULDN'T immob and stun you about every 3-5s with not running into trouble on their initiative, if ranger pets WOULDN'T AI CC you at completely random moments etc, if Ele WOULDN'T have two instant ccs on his offhand alone, then Holo WOULD have enough stability. But it's a bit of a weird policy to delete one spec completely from competitive play while "the big balance patch" is still months away and nobody knows what it will bring in the end.

Or maybe it's because you at least have 2 ports and a stunbreak that gives more than 1s of stability. Also 4 stunbreaks overall when you refresh your F3.

If your mightstacks are going up rapidly it's yours. Revealed is another indicator as Ryan has pointed out.

Nerfing some burst rotations definitely isn't a bad idea, I hope they don't forget to resustain and - probably even more important - res cheese too in the same strike.

Saw in on a stream aswell, seems to happen a lot atm.