Locking Soulbeast to 1 pet isn't great

[Bealis.6023]

> @"Sobx.1758" said:

 

> No, it's not "the meaningful choice goes down" because you pretend there was such a great diversity in pet use. There were few same pets used all the time to ensure the best of all worlds. "it being talked about" doesn't make it correct and it's clearly not.

> Sure, there might have been "those 3 people" that just played around with all pets "for kitten and giggles", but stop pretending second pet enabled meaningful choices -it didn't. It made it so you didn't really need to make one.

 

Iam not pretending anything. You twist my words, I was reacting to that having one pet in combat is supposed to make your planing better, its really not in gameplay enviroment. And I had not used that mechanic for just giggles, for instance you could be supportive for a bit when disengaging. Same pets used all the time...well thats on those who do it, they had an option not to.

And I said it had been talked about, in reactions to patch notes, I meant it just as a remark to how they possibly collect feedback. But when we are at it, people actually had been all around this topic after the release.

 

 

[Sobx.1758]

> @"Bealis.6023" said:

> > @"Sobx.1758" said:

>

> > No, it's not "the meaningful choice goes down" because you pretend there was such a great diversity in pet use. There were few same pets used all the time to ensure the best of all worlds. "it being talked about" doesn't make it correct and it's clearly not.

> > Sure, there might have been "those 3 people" that just played around with all pets "for kitten and giggles", but stop pretending second pet enabled meaningful choices -it didn't. It made it so you didn't really need to make one.

>

> Iam not pretending anything. You twist my words, I was reacting to that having one pet in combat is supposed to make your planing better, its really not in gameplay enviroment. And I had not used that mechanic for just giggles, for instance you could be supportive for a bit when disengaging. Same pets used all the time...well thats on those who do it, they had an option not to.

> And I said it had been talked about, in reactions to patch notes, I meant it just as a remark to how they possibly collect feedback. But when we are at it, people actually had been all around this topic after the release.

 

I fail to see how I've twisted your words. You claim one pet lowers the availability of making a meaningful choice, that's a lie. If you pick a pet for every occasion -which is what was happening pretty much all the time- then it's not a meaningful choice at all. It's "picking" everything to be safe. With one pet you ACTUALLY have to make a decision that matters.

Well yeah, topics repeat themselves, there's no way around it.

[Hannelore.8153]

Just let us use the pet's Command F2 skill while in Beastmode as a fourth skill, problem solved (mostly).

[Bealis.6023]

> @"Sobx.1758" said:

> I fail to see how I've twisted your words. You claim one pet lowers the availability of making a meaningful choice, that's a lie. If you pick a pet for every occasion -which is what was happening pretty much all the time- then it's not a meaningful choice at all. It's "picking" everything to be safe. With one pet you ACTUALLY have to make a decision that matters.

> Well yeah, topics repeat themselves, there's no way around it.

So I am a pretender and a lier now. What will it be next? Do you always talk to people like that before actually try to ask them to clarify because you dont understand their point? I wont write it for the third time though. Have a nice day.

 

[Sobx.1758]

> @"Bealis.6023" said:

> > @"Sobx.1758" said:

> > I fail to see how I've twisted your words. You claim one pet lowers the availability of making a meaningful choice, that's a lie. If you pick a pet for every occasion -which is what was happening pretty much all the time- then it's not a meaningful choice at all. It's "picking" everything to be safe. With one pet you ACTUALLY have to make a decision that matters.

> > Well yeah, topics repeat themselves, there's no way around it.

> So I am a pretender and a lier now. What will it be next?

 

Where did I say anything like that? You said I twisted your words. I said "I don't see how I twisted your words" and you started playing a victim instead of quoting the exact point at which I supposedly twisted them. Nice.

 

 

This is literally what you wrote:

>That meaningful choice basically just goes down to choosing 1 pet instead of 2 for combat.

 

And this is what I answered to in my previous post, after which you claimed I twisted your words. If I twisted anything you said, then quote it.

[Bealis.6023]

> @"Sobx.1758" said:

> No, it's not "the meaningful choice goes down" because you pretend there was such a great diversity in pet use.

Pale Tree here. I wrote "goes down to" thats a word connection that creates a different context. In other words that the change doesnt offer extra thoughtful choices. Are we really doing this? :)

[Sobx.1758]

> @"Bealis.6023" said:

> > @"Sobx.1758" said:

> > No, it's not "the meaningful choice goes down" because you pretend there was such a great diversity in pet use.

> Pale Tree here. I wrote "goes down to" thats a word connection that creates a different context.

 

Ah, that's what you mean. Was that so hard to point out earlier? :D

 

>In other words that the change doesnt offer extra thoughtful choices. Are we really doing this? :)

 

One way or another, I still think most of what I wrote remains the same -1 pet offers more meaningful choice than 2 that just make the whole build safer. I might as well agree to disagree on this one, because what's the point of dragging this out. ;)

[jcbroe.4329]

I haven't had a problem with the single pet issue as much as the nerf to hard CC skills has inadvertently caused with pet choices.

 

It feels like there are only 2 real choices if you want to do damage - Siamoth (pig family) and Gazelle. Smokescale lost a ton of it's Merge combo damage by losing damage from the Merged Knockdown, to the point where I don't even consider it a viable pick for a fight.

 

There are 2 main issues being highlighted here - most pets just straight up aren't good, and pet merge skills and kits are almost all lackluster across the board.

 

Before the patch, at least there was a bit more damage in some of the Soulbeast merge kits that with 2 pets, having a bad pet with a good kit covered the weakness of how bad the pet is.

 

But now that you're forced to pick a good pet with a good kit - there's less that 5 fingers needed to count those pets on.

 

In my opinion this all comes back to the glaring issue that Ranger has always needed a major pet overhaul. AI, pathing, skill changes and updates. And in all likelihood, because of the current "strength" of pets in those gamemodes, Soulbeast is likely about to be indirectly nerfed even harder when ANet starts messing with pet skill coefficients.

 

Let's just hope that the message gets through this time that the pet mechanic has always been polarizing to balance and needs more than numerical tweaks to create a healthier balance across all the specializations, Soulbeast included.

 

PS I've been running Gazelle on my Soulbeast build and the next time it comes into combat and runs off into Narnia or headbutts the air, I'm going to smash my keyboard.

[Eurantien.4632]

> @"jcbroe.4329" said:

> I haven't had a problem with the single pet issue as much as the nerf to hard CC skills has inadvertently caused with pet choices.

>

> It feels like there are only 2 real choices if you want to do damage - Siamoth (pig family) and Gazelle. Smokescale lost a ton of it's Merge combo damage by losing damage from the Merged Knockdown, to the point where I don't even consider it a viable pick for a fight.

>

> There are 2 main issues being highlighted here - most pets just straight up aren't good, and pet merge skills and kits are almost all lackluster across the board.

>

> Before the patch, at least there was a bit more damage in some of the Soulbeast merge kits that with 2 pets, having a bad pet with a good kit covered the weakness of how bad the pet is.

>

> But now that you're forced to pick a good pet with a good kit - there's less that 5 fingers needed to count those pets on.

>

> In my opinion this all comes back to the glaring issue that Ranger has always needed a major pet overhaul. AI, pathing, skill changes and updates. And in all likelihood, because of the current "strength" of pets in those gamemodes, Soulbeast is likely about to be indirectly nerfed even harder when ANet starts messing with pet skill coefficients.

>

> Let's just hope that the message gets through this time that the pet mechanic has always been polarizing to balance and needs more than numerical tweaks to create a healthier balance across all the specializations, Soulbeast included.

>

> PS I've been running Gazelle on my Soulbeast build and the next time it comes into combat and runs off into Narnia or headbutts the air, I'm going to smash my keyboard.

 

I am eternally disapointed that the CC nerf basically gutted canines.

[Krispera.5087]

> @"jcbroe.4329" said:

> PS I've been running Gazelle on my Soulbeast build and the next time it comes into combat and runs off into Narnia or headbutts the air, I'm going to smash my keyboard.

 

You must smash your keyboard often :anguished: . What I've found to help is spam F1 right when you unmerge so it doesn't charge in another dimension.

 

> @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> I am eternally disapointed that the CC nerf basically gutted canines.

 

I loved to use Wolf or Fern Hound, but the CC damage nerf is :/.

[Bealis.6023]

> @"Sobx.1758" said:

> One way or another, I still think most of what I wrote remains the same -1 pet offers more meaningful choice than 2 that just make the whole build safer. I might as well agree to disagree on this one, because what's the point of dragging this out. ;)

 

Yeah I concede ive been on a bit of edge lately :# Its true thats a different vision on gameplay. Iam more into toying into mechanics, have thought that 3 triggers is really dope. But thats fine :)

[mistsim.2748]

This is fine. You still get two pets, but you simply must decide which one to use for an encounter. If you're doing 1v1 on side node, which pet you use depends on who's coming to face you.

 

Also, the second pet can be used for utility/mobility outside of combat. Any SB build can merge with bird and have a ton of mobility between nodes. This fact has allowed me to try some shortbow/axe/dagger builds.

 

SB having access to one pet in combat is the least of our concerns right now. Seriously.

[Swagger.1459]

> @"mistsim.2748" said:

> This is fine. You still get two pets, but you simply must decide which one to use for an encounter. If you're doing 1v1 on side node, which pet you use depends on who's coming to face you.

>

> Also, the second pet can be used for utility/mobility outside of combat. Any SB build can merge with bird and have a ton of mobility between nodes. This fact has allowed me to try some shortbow/axe/dagger builds.

>

> SB having access to one pet in combat is the least of our concerns right now. Seriously.

 

Nah, not fine. Seriously.

 

I’m not concerned with “1v1 on side node”.

 

I’m not concerned what happens “out of combat”, I care about in combat.

 

Ranger got 99 problems and pets adds one.

 

 

[kharmin.7683]

> @"jcbroe.4329" said:

> PS I've been running Gazelle on my Soulbeast build and the next time it comes into combat and runs off into Narnia or headbutts the air, I'm going to smash my keyboard.

Thanks for this. Best laugh I've had in a week. :)

 

[Deadly Moonshiner.1354]

In a way (talking from pvp perspective), now I am forced to think more when to swap pets not to end up in battle with wrong pet. So it (arguably) requires more situation awareness and skill - which is positive. But the price is too high - it can completely screw you in combat if for whatever reason you are unable to swap or if you can't disengage because your pet is not giving you good mobility. It also eliminated a diversity and options while in combat. I adjusted my play style but overall I see single pet in combat as an over-nerf. Ranger was not in a good position and now it is in even worse one.

[anduriell.6280]

> @"jcbroe.4329" said:

> PS I've been running Gazelle on my Soulbeast build and the next time it comes into combat and runs off into Narnia or headbutts the air, I'm going to smash my keyboard.

I gave up on the gazelle long time ago, i'm not interested in visiting Narnia to get the pet back . For the moment i'm stuck with bird perma-beastmode. I don't see any advantage of unmerging not enough traits with synergize with the merging/unmerging mechanic.

Most of them don't have any icons like Zephir's Speed or are broken and don't work like Clarion Bond. Also Predator's Cunning doesn't work and only provides 1 tick of heal each second independently of how many applications you made with vulture stance.

 

 

 

 

[memausz.7264]

> @"Swagger.1459" said:

> At least for me, pet lock has taken out even more diversity for builds. Overall I feel it was way too heavy handed to cut out 1 pet and 3 player skills from the equation.

>

> Edited to be less wordy.

 

Just use Juvenile wolf - little bit of everything.

[anduriell.6280]

> @"memausz.7264" said:

> > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > At least for me, pet lock has taken out even more diversity for builds. Overall I feel it was way too heavy handed to cut out 1 pet and 3 player skills from the equation.

> >

> > Edited to be less wordy.

>

> Just use Juvenile wolf - little bit of everything.

 

Canine pets are bad against other players after the nerfs. The F2 skill from the wolf (scary howl) is really bad because of the 60s CD. The archetype is really really bad (condi). The Beast ability when merged is really really really bad (Outcry or somthing) .

[Taril.8619]

1 pet on Soulbeast really does feel limiting.

 

Since, not only are you already limited because of the stats gained upon melding is tied to pet types (Meaning for Power builds you're looking for Ferocious while Condi builds are looking for Deadly. I'm not entirely sure what Ranger builds would be looking for Versatile/Supportive/Stout...)

 

But then you're being limited by going from 8 available pet skills (Due to pets having 3 skills used by themselves and then the Beast skill you activate) down to only 5 available pet skills (The 4 baseline pet skills + the single unique Beastmode) - Also, it's not as if the F1 and F2 skills granted by Beastmode count as "Beast" skills for the purposes of proccing Traits either.

 

Meanwhile, accessing that single unique Beastmode skill, means losing out on one of the baseline pet skills (Their standard attack, which can be relevant as some of them do have effects such as Felines with their Vuln stacks, some are Projectile Finishers, some apply Bleeds/Poisons), all the stats the pet has (More relevant in PvE than in PvP), many skill synergies (Commands, some Signet effects), like the entire Beastmastery Specialization as well as various other Traits (Opening Strike pet proc, Shared Anguish, Allies Aid, Poison Master pet proc, Refined Toxins pet proc, Moment of Clarity pet proc, Sharpened Edges pet proc as well as various "Allies get Boons" procs which can synergize with "We Heal as One")

 

Not to mention how Beastmode is also inherently Melee focused, which also provides a limitation in that use of it negates some of the notable worth of **Ranger's** ranged weapon sets (While being actively detrimental to Longbow and Farsighted which deal more damage at high range)

[Merzhin Hudour.4698]

The entire Soulbeast specialization is limiting. You don't fight with a vast majority of pets duos anymore, you don't use pets skills anymore, you don't use bow anymore and need to fight in melee.

And the way it works makes all rangers play with the exact same build, spec and pet because it's the only working for high level content.

[Murshid.9854]

Was a big soulbeast fan, after the nerfs I gave it a try and it was fine in PvE but in PvP I don't see a reason to pick it over core ranger anymore.

[lare.5129]

tip: you always can go out combat and change pet

[Deadly Moonshiner.1354]

> @"lare.5129" said:

> **sarcastic** tip: you always can go out combat and change pet

 

There, fixed it for you

[lare.5129]

> @"Deadly Moonshiner.1354" said:

> There, fixed it for you

you should be happy that for change u not need tp to Lion Arch, find npc, pay 50 gold, and select another pet.

 

[Deadly Moonshiner.1354]

> @"lare.5129" said:

> you should be happy that for change u not need tp to Lion Arch, find npc, pay 50 gold, and select another pet.

>

 

Perhaps to add a difficult jumping puzzle to find that NPC as well? Reading what some people on this forum suggest for rangers I would not be surprised to see it in some future patch :pensive: