CrownOfSorrow.6137 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 I'm aware that persisting flames should not extend the fire field from overload as it isn't a weapon field, however should it not at least be proc by the field left behind? Conjured axe field (skill 3) does proc the trait, and yet it is technically a _conjured_ weapon skill. Maintaining the persisting flame buff is trouble enough already, this seems like an unintentional nerf to a trait meant to allow our flame attunement to _persist_. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkaile.5604 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 It can be a bit tough to keep up 10 stacks when solo, but that's what happens with Anet balancing PvE for raids and t4 fractals where people always have quickness and alacrity. It really isn't a huge deal, though. If you're doing solo stuff, it's probably better to focus on not dying instead of missing out on half of your potential 10% damage modifier. That said, I just tested this and can confirm the fire field from Overload Fire does not proc Persisting Flames. What's funnier is that Lava Skin, a skill which does not list a fire field in its tooltip, does proc Persisting Flames. I just looooove finding these little inconsistencies; they don't at all add support to the idea that this last "balance" update was rushed out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrownOfSorrow.6137 Posted August 1, 2020 Author Share Posted August 1, 2020 > @"Arkaile.5604" said: > It can be a bit tough to keep up 10 stacks when solo, but that's what happens with Anet balancing PvE for raids and t4 fractals where people always have quickness and alacrity. It really isn't a huge deal, though. If you're doing solo stuff, it's probably better to focus on not dying instead of missing out on half of your potential 10% damage modifier. Alacrity would help keep this buffs stacked, but honestly I've found having numerous enemies in a single field is what makes a difference. I've been running Drizzle Zergs so my buffs are garbage but I wouldn't call it solo work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Red Arachnid.2493 Posted August 2, 2020 Share Posted August 2, 2020 This sounds like an oversight more than anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jski.6180 Posted August 6, 2020 Share Posted August 6, 2020 Its not a bug the trait reads wepon skills only fire fields. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Persisting_Flames Its an odd chose for sure but it looks like all overload effects where made in mind of not effecting there cast speed or there after effect duration. I guess that why Transcendent Tempest dose not effect overloads cast time which i wish it did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DotDotWin.4357 Posted August 8, 2020 Share Posted August 8, 2020 Persistent flames, in fact, fire in general, is not worth using 90% of the time because of the recent nerfs. You don't have the mobility or armor to survive in fire and without Lesser Lava Font, when you go down you are totally ducked. I have really lost all interest in playing my Elementalist because it's just such a pain in the ass to keep him alive now knowing that if he dies I have to run back to where ever I am. The nerf to PF pretty much made the class not worth playing. It's just not worth the effort. Getting set back and having to travel over and over and over because you get gang banged by mobs is just lame. Even engineers are better than elementalists now, IMHO. It's a sad state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aigleborgne.2981 Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 > @"DotDotWin.4357" said: > Persistent flames, in fact, fire in general, is not worth using 90% of the time because of the recent nerfs. > You don't have the mobility or armor to survive in fire and without Lesser Lava Font, when you go down you are totally ducked. > I have really lost all interest in playing my Elementalist because it's just such a pain in the kitten to keep him alive now knowing that if he dies I have to run back to where ever I am. The nerf to PF pretty much made the class not worth playing. > > It's just not worth the effort. Getting set back and having to travel over and over and over because you get gang banged by mobs is just lame. > Even engineers are better than elementalists now, IMHO. It's a sad state. I feel the same. Fire lost too much with these changes and now I prefer air to fire. But without downed lava font, it seems difficult to play fire and air for a power build as you go down very fast without any tool if (read when) you go down. What strikes me through is, as usual, we got no words from devs about nerfing 2 of our best grandmaster traits and it is going to last for months at least. I mean, in this particular case, it is so obvious those changes were uncalled for and totally misplaced. But well, devs are most likely happy with it so... I feel bad because I still like this game, but balance policies are slowly pushing me out. I had great hopes for system teams but they prove to be no better than before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Red Arachnid.2493 Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 > @"Aigleborgne.2981" said: > > @"DotDotWin.4357" said: > > Persistent flames, in fact, fire in general, is not worth using 90% of the time because of the recent nerfs. > > You don't have the mobility or armor to survive in fire and without Lesser Lava Font, when you go down you are totally ducked. > > I have really lost all interest in playing my Elementalist because it's just such a pain in the kitten to keep him alive now knowing that if he dies I have to run back to where ever I am. The nerf to PF pretty much made the class not worth playing. > > > > It's just not worth the effort. Getting set back and having to travel over and over and over because you get gang banged by mobs is just lame. > > Even engineers are better than elementalists now, IMHO. It's a sad state. > > I feel the same. Fire lost too much with these changes and now I prefer air to fire. > But without downed lava font, it seems difficult to play fire and air for a power build as you go down very fast without any tool if (read when) you go down. > > What strikes me through is, as usual, we got no words from devs about nerfing 2 of our best grandmaster traits and it is going to last for months at least. I mean, in this particular case, it is so obvious those changes were uncalled for and totally misplaced. But well, devs are most likely happy with it so... > > I feel bad because I still like this game, but balance policies are slowly pushing me out. I had great hopes for system teams but they prove to be no better than before. You've got to look at it from a different perspective. These changes to fire were made specifically for fractal and raid groups. Damage modifiers and additional attacks are better than might and fury in a group setting, because might and fury are handled by teammates already. Power Ele benchmarks all increased by about 3.5k with those new changes to Persisting Flames. Though you guys shouldn't have trouble surviving just from the lack of fury and down-state lava font. The irony is that all of the best solo traits are now defensive (Burning Fire, Smothering Auras, Blinding Ashes), so enemies should have a hard time getting through all of the blind spam and condi cleansing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aigleborgne.2981 Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 > @"Blood Red Arachnid.2493" said: > > @"Aigleborgne.2981" said: > > > @"DotDotWin.4357" said: > > > Persistent flames, in fact, fire in general, is not worth using 90% of the time because of the recent nerfs. > > > You don't have the mobility or armor to survive in fire and without Lesser Lava Font, when you go down you are totally ducked. > > > I have really lost all interest in playing my Elementalist because it's just such a pain in the kitten to keep him alive now knowing that if he dies I have to run back to where ever I am. The nerf to PF pretty much made the class not worth playing. > > > > > > It's just not worth the effort. Getting set back and having to travel over and over and over because you get gang banged by mobs is just lame. > > > Even engineers are better than elementalists now, IMHO. It's a sad state. > > > > I feel the same. Fire lost too much with these changes and now I prefer air to fire. > > But without downed lava font, it seems difficult to play fire and air for a power build as you go down very fast without any tool if (read when) you go down. > > > > What strikes me through is, as usual, we got no words from devs about nerfing 2 of our best grandmaster traits and it is going to last for months at least. I mean, in this particular case, it is so obvious those changes were uncalled for and totally misplaced. But well, devs are most likely happy with it so... > > > > I feel bad because I still like this game, but balance policies are slowly pushing me out. I had great hopes for system teams but they prove to be no better than before. > > You've got to look at it from a different perspective. These changes to fire were made specifically for fractal and raid groups. Damage modifiers and additional attacks are better than might and fury in a group setting, because might and fury are handled by teammates already. Power Ele benchmarks all increased by about 3.5k with those new changes to Persisting Flames. > > Though you guys shouldn't have trouble surviving just from the lack of fury and down-state lava font. The irony is that all of the best solo traits are now defensive (Burning Fire, Smothering Auras, Blinding Ashes), so enemies should have a hard time getting through all of the blind spam and condi cleansing. I'm not sure I agree with you. Ele will not be a might bot with this new trait, so it's subpar. If and only if ele was included in allies getting might back, it would be good. Persisting Flames is a buff mostly for raids. In fractals, there are still many unorganised groups, so it doesn't fully count. Most players are not playing a typical situation where fury, might, and revives are provided by others. A 10% damage buff (not that easy to get to start with) is not a good tradeoff for fury+downed lava font. It's marginally better in raids, but who cares much? Maybe for ellitists that only play Meta professions but it's a minority. Let's say it covers 10% of players, 90% is leftover with blinding ashes. While it is a nice defensive trait, I personally think old Persisting Flames were better defensively while providing offensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliamRationem.5172 Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 > @"Aigleborgne.2981" said: > > @"Blood Red Arachnid.2493" said: > > > @"Aigleborgne.2981" said: > > > > @"DotDotWin.4357" said: > > > > Persistent flames, in fact, fire in general, is not worth using 90% of the time because of the recent nerfs. > > > > You don't have the mobility or armor to survive in fire and without Lesser Lava Font, when you go down you are totally ducked. > > > > I have really lost all interest in playing my Elementalist because it's just such a pain in the kitten to keep him alive now knowing that if he dies I have to run back to where ever I am. The nerf to PF pretty much made the class not worth playing. > > > > > > > > It's just not worth the effort. Getting set back and having to travel over and over and over because you get gang banged by mobs is just lame. > > > > Even engineers are better than elementalists now, IMHO. It's a sad state. > > > > > > I feel the same. Fire lost too much with these changes and now I prefer air to fire. > > > But without downed lava font, it seems difficult to play fire and air for a power build as you go down very fast without any tool if (read when) you go down. > > > > > > What strikes me through is, as usual, we got no words from devs about nerfing 2 of our best grandmaster traits and it is going to last for months at least. I mean, in this particular case, it is so obvious those changes were uncalled for and totally misplaced. But well, devs are most likely happy with it so... > > > > > > I feel bad because I still like this game, but balance policies are slowly pushing me out. I had great hopes for system teams but they prove to be no better than before. > > > > You've got to look at it from a different perspective. These changes to fire were made specifically for fractal and raid groups. Damage modifiers and additional attacks are better than might and fury in a group setting, because might and fury are handled by teammates already. Power Ele benchmarks all increased by about 3.5k with those new changes to Persisting Flames. > > > > Though you guys shouldn't have trouble surviving just from the lack of fury and down-state lava font. The irony is that all of the best solo traits are now defensive (Burning Fire, Smothering Auras, Blinding Ashes), so enemies should have a hard time getting through all of the blind spam and condi cleansing. > > I'm not sure I agree with you. > Ele will not be a might bot with this new trait, so it's subpar. If and only if ele was included in allies getting might back, it would be good. > Persisting Flames is a buff mostly for raids. In fractals, there are still many unorganised groups, so it doesn't fully count. > > Most players are not playing a typical situation where fury, might, and revives are provided by others. > A 10% damage buff (not that easy to get to start with) is not a good tradeoff for fury+downed lava font. It's marginally better in raids, but who cares much? Maybe for ellitists that only play Meta professions but it's a minority. > > Let's say it covers 10% of players, 90% is leftover with blinding ashes. While it is a nice defensive trait, I personally think old Persisting Flames were better defensively while providing offensive. That's really the problem with these changes. They target the aspects of these traits that were beneficial to solo players, specifically to benefit group play. Why? It wasn't needed. I actually really like the flame expulsion effect for hybrid weaver in PvP. That explosion isn't huge, but as it results passively from rotating out of fire you can use it to deliver some pretty good combinations. I just wish they'd rethink the might loss. I don't see any reason that ele should give up their might when other classes can do the same thing with fewer restrictions and without the kick in the balls to solo play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aigleborgne.2981 Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 > @"AliamRationem.5172" said: > I actually really like the flame expulsion effect for hybrid weaver in PvP. That explosion isn't huge, but as it results passively from rotating out of fire you can use it to deliver some pretty good combinations. I just wish they'd rethink the might loss. I don't see any reason that ele should give up their might when other classes can do the same thing with fewer restrictions and without the kick in the balls to solo play. I also like flame expulsion skill, it brings more depth in gameplay but loosing might is a very bad tradeoff as it is counter productive with Power Overwhelming effect (but not only that). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrownOfSorrow.6137 Posted August 21, 2020 Author Share Posted August 21, 2020 > @"Jski.6180" said: > Its not a bug the trait reads wepon skills only fire fields. > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Persisting_Flames > Its an odd chose for sure but it looks like all overload effects where made in mind of not effecting there cast speed or there after effect duration. I guess that why Transcendent Tempest dose not effect overloads cast time which i wish it did. "Fire fields created by weapon skills last longer. Your damage is increased whenever your fire fields hit a foe." I'll point out that while it specifies that the fields generated by weapons last longer, wording suggests all fire fields increase damage when hitting a foe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarzAttakz.9608 Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 > @"CrownOfSorrow.6137" said: > > @"Jski.6180" said: > > Its not a bug the trait reads wepon skills only fire fields. > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Persisting_Flames > > Its an odd chose for sure but it looks like all overload effects where made in mind of not effecting there cast speed or there after effect duration. I guess that why Transcendent Tempest dose not effect overloads cast time which i wish it did. > > "Fire fields created by weapon skills last longer. Your damage is increased whenever your fire fields hit a foe." I'll point out that while it specifies that the fields generated by weapons last longer, wording suggests all fire fields increase damage when hitting a foe. > > Agreed, pure lazy coding is what it boils down to. Essentially a development team with very little oversight and less time to consolidate disparate systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 > @"AliamRationem.5172" said: > > @"Aigleborgne.2981" said: > > > @"Blood Red Arachnid.2493" said: > > > > @"Aigleborgne.2981" said: > > > > > @"DotDotWin.4357" said: > > > > > Persistent flames, in fact, fire in general, is not worth using 90% of the time because of the recent nerfs. > > > > > You don't have the mobility or armor to survive in fire and without Lesser Lava Font, when you go down you are totally ducked. > > > > > I have really lost all interest in playing my Elementalist because it's just such a pain in the kitten to keep him alive now knowing that if he dies I have to run back to where ever I am. The nerf to PF pretty much made the class not worth playing. > > > > > > > > > > It's just not worth the effort. Getting set back and having to travel over and over and over because you get gang banged by mobs is just lame. > > > > > Even engineers are better than elementalists now, IMHO. It's a sad state. > > > > > > > > I feel the same. Fire lost too much with these changes and now I prefer air to fire. > > > > But without downed lava font, it seems difficult to play fire and air for a power build as you go down very fast without any tool if (read when) you go down. > > > > > > > > What strikes me through is, as usual, we got no words from devs about nerfing 2 of our best grandmaster traits and it is going to last for months at least. I mean, in this particular case, it is so obvious those changes were uncalled for and totally misplaced. But well, devs are most likely happy with it so... > > > > > > > > I feel bad because I still like this game, but balance policies are slowly pushing me out. I had great hopes for system teams but they prove to be no better than before. > > > > > > You've got to look at it from a different perspective. These changes to fire were made specifically for fractal and raid groups. Damage modifiers and additional attacks are better than might and fury in a group setting, because might and fury are handled by teammates already. Power Ele benchmarks all increased by about 3.5k with those new changes to Persisting Flames. > > > > > > Though you guys shouldn't have trouble surviving just from the lack of fury and down-state lava font. The irony is that all of the best solo traits are now defensive (Burning Fire, Smothering Auras, Blinding Ashes), so enemies should have a hard time getting through all of the blind spam and condi cleansing. > > > > I'm not sure I agree with you. > > Ele will not be a might bot with this new trait, so it's subpar. If and only if ele was included in allies getting might back, it would be good. > > Persisting Flames is a buff mostly for raids. In fractals, there are still many unorganised groups, so it doesn't fully count. > > > > Most players are not playing a typical situation where fury, might, and revives are provided by others. > > A 10% damage buff (not that easy to get to start with) is not a good tradeoff for fury+downed lava font. It's marginally better in raids, but who cares much? Maybe for ellitists that only play Meta professions but it's a minority. > > > > Let's say it covers 10% of players, 90% is leftover with blinding ashes. While it is a nice defensive trait, I personally think old Persisting Flames were better defensively while providing offensive. > > That's really the problem with these changes. They target the aspects of these traits that were beneficial to solo players, specifically to benefit group play. Why? It wasn't needed. > > I actually really like the flame expulsion effect for hybrid weaver in PvP. That explosion isn't huge, but as it results passively from rotating out of fire you can use it to deliver some pretty good combinations. I just wish they'd rethink the might loss. I don't see any reason that ele should give up their might when other classes can do the same thing with fewer restrictions and without the kick in the balls to solo play. Well, the trait seems to be designed for support tempests to help them providing might for their team, which is a requested boon in team content and one of the reasons why supports like druids are so requested. Limiting it's solo-play usability seems like intended design at this point. It is supposed to be a support trait, so they probably wanted it to perform worse while playing solo. Taking away the might from yourself is one way to achieve this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aigleborgne.2981 Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 > @"Kodama.6453" said: > Well, the trait seems to be designed for support tempests to help them providing might for their team, which is a requested boon in team content and one of the reasons why supports like druids are so requested. > > Limiting it's solo-play usability seems like intended design at this point. It is supposed to be a support trait, so they probably wanted it to perform worse while playing solo. Taking away the might from yourself is one way to achieve this. Maybe, but it is still counter-productive with its former effect and power overwhelming. This and downed lava font removal (along with fury), they just removed 2 great grand master traits for solo players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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