[Discussion] PoF is a great "one time playing experience" but that's pretty much it

[Professor Sprout.1560]

I think part of the problem that we are experiencing at the moment is not so much a lack of rewards but a disconnect between the requirements for the headline expansion rewards and the reward types given by the expansion maps. In discussions here, in-game and on reddit the rewards to which I see players attributing the most value are the griffon and the specialism weapons, and these are both gated by gold costs: ten direct 25G [sinks](http://https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sunspear_Tithe "https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sunspear_Tithe") for the griffon and [three](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wish_for_Unity) [direct](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Darehk%27s_Quick_End) and [indirect](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mordant_Slicer) gold sinks for the weapons. For the rest of these collections these items come from either [one](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warmed_Coastal_Griffon_Egg)-[off](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Spearmarshal%27s_Lament_(instance)) [solo](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Soulbeast%27s_Cache) [actions](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Riddle_of_the_Soulbeast), [meta-unrelated random drops](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Junundu_Bezoar), [one-off](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gundayo,_the_Rune_of_Honesty) [bounty kills](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharpened_Flint) or [a negligible karma payment after clearing a specific heart](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hollowed_Fang). If you are primarily focusing on these goals then you will get very little value out of doing a bounty or event chain to grind karma, trade contracts and/or elegy mosaics: as far as I know the methods to convert these currencies to gold are [slow](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Trader%27s_Key) [and/or inefficient](https://gw2efficiency.com/currencies/karma) [and/or are net loss](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Primeval_Steward).

 

This would be fine if the desert maps came with new alternative sources of gold that were exciting to engage with, but without any new expansion dungeons or AB Multiloot meta events we're stuck with using the gold farms from core/HoT: Festivals, Fractals, Silverwastes &c.. It would also be fine if the new trade contract and elegy mosaics could be spent on unique rewards as players could then work towards these rewards through desert play as an alternative to chasing the weapons/griffon: unfortunately unless you have an insatiable hunger for [arabesque](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mini_Captain_Rahim) [human](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mini_Cavalier_Hero) and [desert](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mini_Red_Choya) [creature](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mini_Green_Choya) minis there are no unique pure sinks for trade contracts and no unique pure sinks for mosaics at all. The other sinks that do use them are crafting sinks that also have [substantial gold](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Priory_Historian_Elisa) [costs involved](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Primeval_Steward) and are not what I would call "top tier" sinks ([ascended gear](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blood_Ruby_Backpack), [meta runes/sigils](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Leadership) and [visually noisy cosmetic items](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Aurora)).

 

So what we have at the moment is not one reward issue but three: not just that the repeatable desert content offers low gold rewards; but also that the collection-based desert rewards are gated behind gold rather than desert currencies; and that the expansion didn't drop with a broad enough range of top-tier rewards that require desert meta currencies.

[X T D.6458]

They need some kind of meta events/world bosses. Bounties are ok, but can range from somewhat fun to just plain tedious and annoying, they are not substitutes for large scale meta/boss events. Also the rewards need to be improved as it is really bad and unsatisfying.

[Sobx.1758]

> @Sodeni.6041 said:

> > @Narcemus.1348 said:

> > I would have to disagree. Albeit I am not done with all of the achievements, but I love playing the new maps. I especially love the griffon adventures but the bounty system is also fun when you have a good squad going. But no matter what you do, any zone will get old if you play it long enough. I think the only disappointment is that there aren't any large metas along the level of Heart of Thorns, but even those get old once played through too frequently. Still, i look forward to taking at least 2 more characters theough the content and I won't be bored on the playthrough.

>

> Yeah I love playing on these maps as well but not having repeatable content like meta events really hurt them in the long turn.

 

Kind of funny how you claim you've "played through the whole PoF already", but you don't even know about PoF meta events.

[Manasa Devi.7958]

> @Sobx.1758 said:

> > @Sodeni.6041 said:

> > > @Narcemus.1348 said:

> > > I would have to disagree. Albeit I am not done with all of the achievements, but I love playing the new maps. I especially love the griffon adventures but the bounty system is also fun when you have a good squad going. But no matter what you do, any zone will get old if you play it long enough. I think the only disappointment is that there aren't any large metas along the level of Heart of Thorns, but even those get old once played through too frequently. Still, i look forward to taking at least 2 more characters theough the content and I won't be bored on the playthrough.

> >

> > Yeah I love playing on these maps as well but not having repeatable content like meta events really hurt them in the long turn.

>

> Kind of funny how you claim you've "played through the whole PoF already", but you don't even know about PoF meta events.

I haven't seen all of them, and I've been all over all of the maps multiple times. I guess for some people, "playing through" something doesn't include "loitering in specific places where you've done everything that's apparent, doing nothing, in the hope that an interesting event will trigger."

[Mahou.3924]

It depends on what you prefer doing in GW2. I was never really interested in meta-or-nothing content of HoT (pre-LS) and only did the easier ones to get the bulk of mastery grind out of the way. Never did TD Meta and feel also no "regret" in having missed out on it. DS only once by pure coincidence, doube coincidence as i t was on my Ranger and I could finally get the gated Wyvern. Never did SW. So yeah, it's simply not my cup of tea. Likewise, I rather went for core Tyria HPs and the easy HoT ones, rather than fudling with all the HoT ones. You like it? More power to you. No sarcasm.

[Mea.5491]

Yup. PoF feels like a boring single player game. Bring back map-wide metas, this is an MMO!

 

> @Sobx.1758 said:

> Kind of funny how you claim you've "played through the whole PoF already", but you don't even know about PoF meta events.

 

You know what's "kind of funny"? The rewards from said "meta events". They are simply not worth the time, that's why no one is doing them.

[Shirlias.8104]

What do you expect from a meta map?

I mean, think about HoT which has its own maps with own currencies and related rewards ( maybe random, like it was DS ).

 

Would you like just meta events which drop like world bosses?

Some meta events like TD which has a small chance to drop an item like chak egg sack?

Or would you prefer somethin avaible only through tokens dropped from the specific event?

 

What do you expect whan you ask for "meta" ?

[Zaltys.7649]

I never completed PoF, ran out of steam in Desolation. It was too tedious: too many trash mobs, boring renown hearts, no metas, etc. The biggest problem for me was that it felt so dead: it was rare to see other players, and there were barely any NPCs either. Just aggros everywhere.

 

HoT felt alive. And call me weird, but I liked doing all the side things such as the adventures.

[Shinzan.2908]

That's not bad though, there's other games to play in the meanwhile and living season will be back at some point.

[maddoctor.2738]

> @Sobx.1758 said:

> Kind of funny how you claim you've "played through the whole PoF already", but you don't even know about PoF meta events.

 

I played every single meta event available in the expansion and completed all of their achievements. Some of them are on such ridiculous timers, that are not set so they can appear on gw2timer and similar websites, that makes those meta events tedious and boring. Not to mention in order to see the state of the meta for some of them you have to be in a tiny area that they take place, away of waypoints, and while surrounded by mobs and no events nearby. It's a beyond terrible design

[Mawtaw.7432]

If i remember correctly the same thing happened with hot, people said " ok i did everything on hot maps now what? ". Well, they were right of course but this is the game in my opinion!

.Level Up

.Explore

.Achievements

.Gear up ascended/legendaries

Then what? It happens to me all the time, i feel like i am just repeating the same things over and over again without achieving anything! This is one of the main reasons i am begging anet to increase rewards! I think it would be a much better feeling! Imagine if you repeat the same event for example and instead of getting 150 karma, 2 blue/green gear and 1 random matetial, you would get 10k karma, 1 random exotic, 50 wood and 1 random ascended material! I would gladly run this event 10 times a day and i would be happy!!! I know there are more things to do in the game, please ( really, PLEASE) don't get me wrong but it feels like there is no point in doing them!

[Deadly Moonshiner.1354]

I, for example, am not bored after "finishing" PoF and am now working on few remaining achievements and alt characters. I play the game (PVE and sPVP, also did some WvW) since beta and I could not care less for big meta's and loot etc. If I feel/want to do something or when I set a goal for myself to do something I will do it regardless of a map or an event or whatever. In my view, _it is a matter of personal gaming preferences and personal goals each player puts in front of him/her and the time one is willing to devote to the game vs. real life._

 

OP can state this or that (perfectly legitimate to express own opinion, as I did myself above) and some people will agree or disagree. The fact is that a few posts on a thread like this are not statistically significant and can't be taken as a "public opinion" or "general player consensus". Given there are few million players, a statistically significant sample would require many times more than a few posts in this (or other similar threads). Also, we need to keep in mind that not all players read or actively participate in forum discussions so opinions stated are from a "loud minority".

 

I see many threads like this one on the forum (PoF is empty, dead, what to do now after I finished, where are meta events, loot/events/bounties sucks big time, etc.). So, the real question is - what motivates people to start threads like this? After all, it is a game and one can play it the way one wishes and for as long as he/she wants.

[Arden.7480]

> @Sodeni.6041 said:

> Now that **PoF** **more than a month old**, the majority of players have already "finished" it.

>

> Most people (including me) have already unlocked all new elite specializations, explored every map, got all masteries and did most achievements of PoF.

> This leaves me with the impression that PoF's biggest flaw is that it's **not really repeatable**. It's not worth coming back to PoF maps once you've unlocked and discovered everything and there are no real beneficial farms you can do.

>

> Don't get me wrong, PoF was a great **one time playing experience** but that's pretty much it. I hope that Anet will put more repeatable content like HoT meta maps into the next expansion **and** add maps for exploring. Because only having meta maps (HoT) and just having explorable maps (PoF) isn't the best formula in my opinion.

>

 

I think it's a value of this expansion that's as you said "an one time playing experience". I think it was totally supposed to be.

 

I just want to remind you that devs had been working on this expansion since the middle of 2016.

 

I think this expansion just showed where Guild Wars 2 is heading to, and I think GW2 will be much better after this expansion!

 

New raids, fractals, maps, story. I just can't wait what's going to happen in the new fractal. Screw the Fractals, I wanna travel to the ancient times. :D

 

Switch DDR on, Switch DDR on!

 

 

[Arden.7480]

And BTW PoF story was just outstanding! The best story I've ever seen in this game so far! So good.

[Dream Shake.8741]

> @Ayrilana.1396 said:

> To be honest, bounties don’t really offer any more than what you could get from regular events during the time spent killing them and they’re essentially damage sponges with mechanics that just prolong the fights.

>

> Not exactly what I would consider repeatable content but that’s just me.

 

Honestly, I have no idea how people find bounties entertaining. They are glorified champ trains. If you have a big enough squad you can just auto attack and kill them no problem.

[Zaltys.7649]

> @"Dream Shake.8741" said:

> They are glorified champ trains. If you have a big enough squad you can just auto attack and kill them no problem.

Which is pretty much what you _have_ to do in trains. I still have no idea what some of the bounties look like, because everything's covered by the other players, flashy effects, and glitter. Can't see the attack indicators or tells.

[ProtoGunner.4953]

> @Sodeni.6041 said:

> Now that **PoF** **more than a month old**, the majority of players have already "finished" it.

>

> Most people (including me) have already unlocked all new elite specializations, explored every map, got all masteries and did most achievements of PoF.

> This leaves me with the impression that PoF's biggest flaw is that it's **not really repeatable**. It's not worth coming back to PoF maps once you've unlocked and discovered everything and there are no real beneficial farms you can do.

>

> Don't get me wrong, PoF was a great **one time playing experience** but that's pretty much it. I hope that Anet will put more repeatable content like HoT meta maps into the next expansion **and** add maps for exploring. Because only having meta maps (HoT) and just having explorable maps (PoF) isn't the best formula in my opinion.

>

 

"Most people finished all elite specs", omg dude, no I think about the least players did that... Don't project your own reflections on the rest. That's the biggest mistake every human being is doing.

 

I used to play a lot in the past, but got bored somewhere during HoT. Now, I haven't even finished PoF, I play other games and have other things to do, GW2 is not my priority anymore. The rest is fine. Came to my mind, there's nothing to do, so much for their 'this expansion is all about content' LOL. Biggest joke ever. There is content for maybe 1-2 weeks. There are no dungeons, no new race, no new crafting discipline, no new raid, nothing in addition. It's utterly barebone, and it's a shame, be cause the maps look and feel awesome.

[maddoctor.2738]

> @"Dream Shake.8741" said:

> Honestly, I have no idea how people find bounties entertaining. They are glorified champ trains. If you have a big enough squad you can just auto attack and kill them no problem.

 

There are even people who find farming in the lab entertaining. At least with the bounties you have some abilities to worry about, but farming in the lab is truly mindless.

This community likes mindless things I guess

[Thefarside.2178]

I only go to POF maps at this point, on any character, for the elon and if there is a daily. Otherwise, back to Silverwaste and HOT metas.

[Menadena.7482]

> @ProtoGunner.4953 said:

> "Most people finished all elite specs", omg dude, no I think about the least players did that... Don't project your own reflections on the rest. That's the biggest mistake every human being is doing.

 

Exactly, I have precisely 0 of the new elites. Most I were not interested in and the ones I was were either bugged or did not live up to expectations. Since I am not a completionist I figured "well, those are HPs I can use in the next expansion".

 

[Manasa Devi.7958]

I had all 9 new elites unlocked 5 minutes into the expansion, with points to spare. I haven't played with any of them yet though.

[battledrone.8315]

> @Arden.7480 said:

> And BTW PoF story was just outstanding! The best story I've ever seen in this game so far! So good.

 

what? the story is so bloated and unrealistic, that even star trek would have trouble selling it

i usually get several facepalms from my buddies, when i tell them about anets "boss mechanics"

specially those "invulnerable" shield , theý all get around 20% health...why dont the players get something , like that?

 

[MMAI.5892]

Though I am not a fan of HoT, I do think PoF went too far away from it as well. I don't think every map needs to be have huge, map wide metas on strict timers, but some that are wider scale would be nice. For the metas they currently have, a rewards buff and better map indications of when they're starting might help a lot. My biggest complaint with the bounty system is probably the scaling of some of the abilities and the sheer amount of visual noise some of these fights have. I do think the bounty system is one that they could deepen both in content and rewards that would have huge payoffs. (Given a small story behind the creatures, have us track them through the desert and maybe have small events tied to that as well.)

 

I know it will never happen, but I would like some dungeons on the PoF maps.

 

Still, I prefer the general map design of PoF to HoT and have enjoyed exploring them quite a bit and I'm split over whether or not I'd like new maps in LS4 or to see the content in current PoF maps deepen in LS4.

[Swagger.1459]

> @Sodeni.6041 said:

> Now that **PoF** **more than a month old**, the majority of players have already "finished" it.

>

> Most people (including me) have already unlocked all new elite specializations, explored every map, got all masteries and did most achievements of PoF.

> This leaves me with the impression that PoF's biggest flaw is that it's **not really repeatable**. It's not worth coming back to PoF maps once you've unlocked and discovered everything and there are no real beneficial farms you can do.

>

> Don't get me wrong, PoF was a great **one time playing experience** but that's pretty much it. I hope that Anet will put more repeatable content like HoT meta maps into the next expansion **and** add maps for exploring. Because only having meta maps (HoT) and just having explorable maps (PoF) isn't the best formula in my opinion.

>

 

Good post, and sums up what I’m feeling.

[Ashantara.8731]

It is not a "one time experience", since it is fun to do with every character. However, if you are looking for rewards outside of the story mode, options are limited and you won't find much to motivate you.

 

They should have included the new stats for purchase with ascended gear in the expansion, for instance, so that people would have to farm for trinkets and armor, since griever stats are a must-have for some of the new elite specs. The reward system for PoF is pretty limited and there is nothing, apart from also pretty unrewarding achievements, that you would want to come back for. :/