Are Mounts Necessary?

[jia li ng.8415]

Personally, from all that I've seen in just this past week alone it appears to me that some players are using the 1-15 zones as a testing/proving ground for their utilities and their mounts. To me it makes no sense mainly because these post tutorial zones are frankly weak to start with, I mean having recently rolled a human Elemental I found I could one shot a plains wurm, an awakening elemental, or an orchard spider. I can't fathom what my Weaver would do much less my springer. How could rushing an event of no challenge be a proof of a great build?

If these dozens of players want to check their builds the PvP area has ample targets to choose from.

I suppose it would be far more difficult to test a build in Lake Doric than Queensdale because when they fight back you take damage.

...and it's not like I don't enjoy hopping on my Raptor with my level 4 Elemental buzzing the map.

It's not needed but because I can and want to. Since all my mounts are hot keyed I dismount instead of using an attack.

 

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

> @Arzurag.7506 said:

> Reading some of these comments makes me thinking that the starter-areas are the true endgame or that they´re challenging.^^

>

> As a dev I would just add a proper damage-scaling to the damaging mount-abilities and the job is done.

 

As to why level 80s go to starter maps, there are meta Bosses in 4 of the starter maps which draws these level 80s. There is map completion to be done for those that didn’t do it at low levels. There’s also jumping puzzles, harvesting and events for dailies in those areas, none of which are challenging or “endgame” but as long as the dailies suggest them then level 80s will be doing them. Damage scaling could use an adjustment so it’s not reasonable for the OP to suggest removing mounts when it’s the scaling, not the mounts, that are causing the problems.

[Ardid.7203]

No, mounts are not necessary, except in those places Anet have designed specially so you require mounts to continue.

[Menadena.7482]

> @Ohoni.6057 said:

> Using mounts in starting zones is great. It makes stale spaces fresh again.

 

Yes, I would need to look what is there but most zones have that POI or vista that you can never seem to get. Mounts remove that problem in most cases and let you explore places you never thought of going (especially if there is no reason to go there). I would not call using them in group content fair since things already do not scale well but for just exploring they refresh content people rarely have seen since leveling.

[pah.4931]

What really is necessary? Think about it.

[LanfearShadowflame.3189]

> @pah.4931 said:

> What really is necessary? Think about it.

Too much effort. Not enough caffeine yet. :lol:

 

Back on topic:

I think more than likely just having the mount damage scale down would be sufficient. Yes, those people do get around faster which is an advantage (at times), but if the damage is significantly reduced perhaps it would alleviate "some" of the issue in lower zones. Especially when everyone is trying to get dailies done in those zones. I can understand the gripe to an extent.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

> @"jia li ng.8415" said:

> I gave up on expecting player etiquette a few years ago, though when I receive common courtesy it is always greatly appreciated. This whine about how badly a player needs a mount in newbie zones, I wonder how the heck did you get by without them for the past three and a half years (serving cheese now)?

 

We just never went to the starting zones. If you want old players in the starting zones, mounts are a useful way of getting them there. Map completion was fun the first time around. The other times its just painful.

[Teofa Tsavo.9863]

I think level scaling of the mount attack is the best and only logical fix we can get. I have seen players thoughtlessly running ahead on escorts and stomping the ambush NPCs into oblivion far ahead of the actual noob pack, since they know the spawn pattern. These players did this pre mount, though.

 

You won't fix these players. They are the same players who will swoop in and commune while you deal with the HP guards. Same ones who won't step out of a sentry ring, ruin, or camp ring in wvw when you are 3m from it. Same players who are either doing nothing or trying to farm ledge champs till the last phase of Claw. Same ones who think they are entitled to drag 3 Ice trolls onto your head "because my time is important and yours isn't" while harvesting. Same players who needlessly burn supplies and randomly pull tacs in WvW. And so on. No game mechanic will fix lack of manners or consideration in the open world.

 

[Chicken Fro.6953]

I've always been for scaling down a higher-level player's power in low-level areas (to avoid griefing it for lowbies and to maintain a fun challenge). But for them to remove mounts entirely from low areas? No. Not fun and not necessary. There's a better solution than to kill everyone elses' joy.

[Chicken Fro.6953]

Also, to directly reply to the title: no, mounts are not necessary; but neither are gliders or dye or anything else that is added just for the fun of it. But they are a part of the game, and a darn enjoyable part at that.

[Menadena.7482]

> @"jia li ng.8415" said:

> Not if you are a true gamer.

 

Do I even NEED to read the rest of your posts?

 

"Not if you are a true elitist."

 

 

[Menadena.7482]

> @"jia li ng.8415" said:

> I started this tread as an observation

 

Too bad we do not have a groan reaction button.

 

Removing 1-15 zones from dailies will do nada, as people have pointed out to you we enjoy them there because it is like exploring a new world. The best solution is to campaign for dailies that require specific maps to be for anywhere in the none. For example, any player above level 15 would probably do ascalon dailies around meatoberfest, where events are plentiful, than trying to find 4 events in the Charr 1-15 area.

[Menadena.7482]

> @"Hamburger Jack.2543" said:

> Mounts or no Mounts RANGERS ARE STILL KILLING EVERYTHING BEFORE I CAN GET TO IT.

>

> If you wanna ban mounts in these areas, ban rangers too. I'm sick of them and their fast kitten es running past me when I haven't collected enough HPs a yet or am on a Guardian. No rangers in 1-15 areas. Sorry rangers. I've had ENOUGH.

 

Ban all non-rangers!

 

[Menadena.7482]

> @voltaicbore.8012 said:

> OP has been consistently, most likely intentionally, misinterpreting people wanting to retain mounts in 1-15 zones as a "desperate" desire of some sort. It's bad logic and even worse manners.

>

> Of course nobody ever required in the past (or presently needs) mounts to get around, make fast kills, or tag events. We'd get along fine if they were taken away. That being said, they're great for a whole range of game experience outside the extremely narrow (dare I suggest, essentially nonexistent?) use of greedily swallowing entire events before new f2p players can get to them. I do not think the benefit new/f2p players would get from mount-free maps would come anywhere close to the loss of enjoyment experienced by mounted players.

 

I rarely use the tail swipe anywhere, even in POF maps. My primary use is for speed and getting to places that were previously inaccessible.

 

[Erulogos.2591]

> @"jia li ng.8415" said:

> Get over the want ... tell me the absolute need for gliders or mounts in 1-15 zones.

 

There is no need. However, why should only necessary things exist? I mean, there's no need for this game at all, is there? But it is fun, so we enjoy its existence. Same with mounts in sub-80 zones. Not necessary, no, but fun, oh yes.

Oh, and as for F2P players having a disadvantage? So what. Really, F2P for any MMO these days is really just an extended trial. Some of those aren't terrible, but the game experience is much improved by coughing up a bit of money.

 

[Galaa.8475]

jai, just go away pls. why use a car when horse and buggy did just fine. why use a washing machine when we got away for 100 years with the washboard. why use a dryer when the clothesline...........................

[jia li ng.8415]

I just looked at all the 1-15 maps for myself to see which of the vistas are the most challenging without a mount, I found 1 out of 35 in Ventry Bay simply because of the half jump and my glider deploying, the rest are so easy even a Charr could do them.

Using a mount made it easy to rush the zone, but it didn't make me want to linger there.

My favorite zone for my mounts is Timberline Falls because I enjoy getting to the tallest peak and surveying the horizon, marveling at the detail.

 

We can't expect certain players to be Grinch and grow a heart. Player etiquette isn't something the community can teach. We either respect each other or we play like we're the only ones in the zone. I've been known to stop and kill the aggro I've drawn before harm comes to a player who might be afk at a Baoba Sapling.

 

As to F2P players spending cash to upgrade I am certain they will, I can't imagine going through every facet of the game without the "want" to experience more.

 

Out of all of Tyria the 1-15 zones are not the most interesting, having run 150 characters on 8 accounts I am still without the "need" of my Mounts. Rushing the map doesn't make it feel fresh or new, I don't see anything different in these zones that I haven't seen hundreds of times.

 

I've never felt the "need" to drive 65mph through a school zone ... weird.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

People who want to change the status quo need to demonstrate that it's worth the effort. It's not free to remove mounts from any particular zone, so it's up to the OP to offer a reason (a) why this is important and (b) how removing mounts resolves the issue. The OP has done neither.

 

Instead they have continually disparaged the motives and actions of anyone who disagrees. They have called use of mounts (in newbie zones) an exploit, the players that use them desperate.

 

> @"jia li ng.8415" said:

> Get over the want ... tell me the absolute need for gliders or mounts in 1-15 zones.

 

Absolute need? No one has claimed that. Not a single person. People have described why they like using mounts in the newbie zones. If you want them gone, offer a reason that can only be addressed by forbidding them altogether.

 

In other words, let's skip over everyone's wants & preferences, so you can tell us the absolute need for the removal of gliders (after two years) or the removal of mounts (after six weeks).

 

 

[Chickenooble.5014]

> @"jia li ng.8415" said:

> Out of all of Tyria the 1-15 zones are not the most interesting, having run 150 characters on 8 accounts I am still without the "need" of my Mounts. Rushing the map doesn't make it feel fresh or new, I don't see anything different in these zones that I haven't seen hundreds of times.

 

What is your /age across all accounts? That sounds like a LOT of playing...

 

 

[Ayumi Spender.1082]

> @Galaa.8475 said:

> jai, just go away pls. why use a car when horse and buggy did just fine. why use a washing machine when we got away for 100 years with the washboard. why use a dryer when the clothesline...........................

 

I um... still wash my clothes by hand and dry with clotheslines.

/waypoints away

[jia li ng.8415]

If you added all my achievement points from all my accounts I am nearing 38k and nearly 14khrs gametime, oh yeah I play!, about 10hrs a day sometimes up to 12hrs, I know I should have just concentrated on one account now, but back then less expensive to add an account than it was to add more characters, probably still is.

[Tiny Doom.4380]

> @"jia li ng.8415" said:

> And you have said nothing of "need" and therefore your comment is does nothing to address the fact that in 1-15 zones you would not be able to complete the map without your glider or mount as the crutch it has become.

 

Straw man. No-one "needs" to be playing GW2 or any other video game. There is only "want".

[Ayumi Spender.1082]

> @"jia li ng.8415" said:

> If you added all my achievement points from all my accounts I nearing 38k, oh yeah I play! I know I should have just concentrated on one account now, but back then less expensive to add an account than it was to add more characters.

 

Achievements just meant you went after achievements. I'm sure people could have like half of that and still played more than you did.

Just saying.

[eldrjth.7384]

Well mounts being avaiable in low level/core tyria maps is a little bid debatable I suppose, since there is the f2p side to consider and not having mounts is a significant disadvantage. So much imo that I wouldnt play this game on a free account or not get PoF making it a compulsory purchase a stance which may be too money grabby (although in my opinion expansions are mandatory anyway). Maybe they shouldve let f2p guys get the raptor mount atleast.

 

I thought the thread would be about if mounts shouldve been put in the game in the first place. I didnt like the idea of mounts when I found out about PoF since mounts themselves are too prominent next to the players model and it would make the game feel like every other generic mmo. It also takes away from the focus of gameplay. The advantage obviously is it gets you places faster, but I argue that it couldve been handled in another way. What if you could teleport to squad members in content that allows unrestricted respawn like open world PvE during meta events or always have a **nearby ** checkpoint after deaths? waypointing could be free and quickly accessible without requiring one to be out of combat. Maybe give players faster out of combat travel powers too like a 50% move speed sprint for instance. This would make mounts less compulsory for players without the expansion.

[HazyDaisy.4107]

Lets look at this from a different perspective, since this discussion is all about different perspectives.

 

As a 5 year player with both expansions, 5 Been there Done That's all earned prior to Hot (4 when wvw was required) and numerous level 80 toons, I've recently started working on completing little achievements like ambient killer and low used weapon slayer chieves like rifle slayer.

 

Having completed mace slayer prior to POF release, it's hard to ignore the players that stop and watch me trying to figure out exactly what form of "farming" I'm doing in a certain ambient over populated area within Queensdale.

 

No, I don't do all 2k or 5k or whatever is remaining on the achievments in 1 day because it's boring after awhile. I could bring in a low toon for this purpose, but, (being a 5 year player), I may not have one that utilizes the weapon in question I need kills on or even a lowby toon anyway, afterall, with 5 years, I have a million tomes of knowledge and several birthday scrolls of every flavor released thus far. Plus, ambients are not only an achievement in itself, but a guaranteed critical kill regardless of my personal level, so what's the point of bringing a low level in?

 

Go to Bloodtide you say, I suppose I could, but isn't that a banishment of sorts? I mean what's wrong with the frogs in Godlost are they too good to be individually clicked on by my level 80 hands? Would the ones in Bloodtide put up more of a fight?

 

The point is, just because I as a player could do something a certain way to minimize what others think or fit in with how they play vs how I play, why should I have to? At the end of the day its still my game, it's open world and everyone has the right to decide what they do or don't do.

 

Can I survive without those however many achievement points? Absolutely, afterall I've done it for 5 years

 

Is there anything else to occupy my playtime at that particular moment in time? Most times that'd be a NO

 

I find it hard to believe though that me wiping out the frog population of Godlost (atleast for the time it takes them to respawn) has any impact on new players ability to complete the heart in that area. What I could believe though, is that posts like the OPs make it twice as likely that any high level player reading this would begin thinking twice about stopping to help a newbie after having read it.

 

Furthermore, OP has admitting to mentoring in these low zones, which means there's atleast 1 level 80 in his possesion, yet doesn't or atleast not that I've read state if that character is the one he mentors on. Maybe that should be looked at as well huh? One can only tag on a map if they are within the appropriate map level? Afterall, the best way to teach is to be right there beside your mentorees is it not? But that's just a thought, and certainly not one I'd ever like to see implemented because then the tags and apples would no doubt plummet everywhere, and those just starting out would have absolutely no guidance and most likely little will to play anymore.