Astralporing.1957 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Cyninja.2954 said: > > > @Cyninja.2954 said: > > > Yes, raids have a small team of developers who are working on them. It's by far one of the smallest dedicated teams. One can argue that the benefit to the game with this minimal amount of effort is huge, or not depending on which side one takes on the issue of value of raids. You've so far not given any argument which supports this team is doing a insufficient job. > > Oh, i think that they do their job splendidly. I also think that raids are a net loss for the game. The problems caused by raids are not caused by their specific implementation, but merely by them being based on an _idea_ that in a long run is damaging to this game. > > That's quite a bold assumption which is based more on subjective opinion than fact. Not saying there are no facts which might support this, I would like some of those stated please though. > Okay, i'll bite. > @Cyninja.2954 said: > As it stands now the addition of raids has: > - forced a stricter balance as far as classes are concerned, especially in pve > - has brought a lot of new and returning players to the game (if this is a net gain or loss one would have to check, my assumption though is it's a huge gain) > - legendary armor created an extra longterm incentive for players and was later added to spvp and wvw. no matter if you are working towards this goal or not, you can't deny that it has a lot of players interested or engaged > - toxicity and elitism is no better or worse than before raids. except now it can actually be disproven by use of damage meters. Before people would simply not take you along as class xyz, now they might give you a chance > - have added a layer of pve endgame content. Believe it or not, a huge part of GW2s problem was there was nothing to work towards. > - That balance now revolves around the peak performance and strict compositions only. If anything, raids (and the balance done around them) only caused the "meta" to be more strict, and brought it to the surface. Before raids most players didn't even know (or cared) what meta was, and this didn't limit them in any way from no PvE content. - it's debatable whether it caused more players to come back, or leave. Or even if those players brought back to the game were brought back by introduction of raids, or by new expacs. For one, i don't actually think that this game has now more players than it had before Raids. - yes, legendary gear does that. It's not raids however - and by tying it to a niche content, Anet decreased the impact legendary pve armor might have had on community. Additionally, seeing it accessible only through raids (initially) was a disincentive to a lot of people, and made them _less_ interested and engaged. - damage meters cause as much toxicity as they negate. On the other hand, by introducing a content like raids, and making it front-and-center showpiece of the game, Anet actually indirectly _encouraged_ the more toxic part of the community. In dungeons those people could safely be ignored, because most people knew that elitist behaviour and requirements were actually 100% unnecessary. In raids, they are a widely accepted norm. - by creating a specific endgame raids removed that layer from the rest of the game. You might think that the "whole game is the endgame" concept was uninteresting for you, but many people liked it. Now in pve there's only one endgame, and (by intent of design) most people _don't participate in it_. > @Cyninja.2954 said: > I get that some people might want to return to GW2 being more niche and more casual (which it still is, 90% of the content created for this game is super casual stuff), what I find very disheartening is how people go out of their way to bash on content which affects them in almost no way. If it really didn't affect me in no way, i wouldn't be speaking against it. It's because raids _do_ affect the whole game, directly or indirectly, that they generate so much friction. > @Cyninja.2954 said: Why should a casual on-off player care about the minimal amount of development time going into raids when their net benefit is so much bigger than any other content in this game besides maybe a new expansion? Because for said casual on-off player it's not a benefit, but a loss, perhaps? > @Cyninja.2954 said: > For anyone who thinks legendary armor would have been introduced to regular pve without raids, rest assured that it would have been made so expensive or timegated that if you can't manage to acquire it currently, you would not have been able to acquire it then too. I seriously doubt that it would have been on a level significantly greater than those of legendary weapons. The only reason why it's so bad in WvW and sPvP now is because Anet wanted to make it distinctly clear that Raids should be the primary source of legendary armor, with everything else far behind (again an example where Raids caused a negative impact on other modes). Yes, all of this is subjective, and you may see it differently - but then, it's not like you have anything more to support your side of argument than i do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oglaf.1074 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @"Hyper Cutter.9376" said: > > @Oglaf.1074 said: > > Alternative to raids? In terms of what? Getting legendary armour? > We actually do need that, since there's no non-raiding way to get legendary armor in PVE. > > Also I think the OP wanted new dungeons, something else we desperately need. 1) PvE Legendary Armour being raid-exclusive is perfectly fine. 2) No we do not need more dungeons; we need to make the old ones relevant again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @GreyWolf.8670 said: > > @mazut.4296 said: > > I think you already have the alternative to raiding. It's called "No raiding"... > > Cool... so they should sell the raids separately so those that don't want them don't have to pay for them. Cool. So they should also sell PvP, WvW, open world, dungeons, fractals and guild missions separately, following the same logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Torolan.5816 said: > No I can´t tell you how to unlock it. Open World indeed tends to take a lighter schedule with me because it is the bread and butter of this game. But I am more than willing to let raiders and fractal runners buy the Griffon with the raid or fractal currency to avoid the open world content, fair enough. What about the elite specialization collections? Funerary armor? Bounty Hunter armor? The other mounts? I don't think an expansion with nothing new to find, by also making the same things available in other types of content, would be a very good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Torolan.5816 said: > > @Lunateric.3708 said: > > > @Ellisande.5218 said: > > > > @DarcShriek.5829 said: > > > > > @GreyWolf.8670 said: > > > > > > @mazut.4296 said: > > > > > > I think you already have the alternative to raiding. It's called "No raiding"... > > > > > > > > > > Cool... so they should sell the raids separately so those that don't want them don't have to pay for them. > > > > > > > > No one is paying for raids. > > > > > > HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! > > > > > > Everyone pays for raids because developing raids costs money as people have to design, implement, test, redesign, reimplement, rinse and repeat. That takes time and time costs money. > > > > > > Also, items are locked inside raids even though not everyone enjoys raiding. So that's just fing kitten. The only people who truly believe that is fair are the people who enjoy raiding. There is NO reason why items should be locked in raids only. If you complain that raiders wouldn't have any reason to raid without raid only items then you've just proven that you don't really want raids and so the devs could save a lot of money by stopping developing raids since no one really wants to do them. > > > > There are items locked behind dungeons, fractals, PvP and WvW too, exclusive ONLY to that content. And guess what?, that's fine. > > No, it is not ok. It already was a stupid idea with fractals, and it has grown even more stupid with raids. The only way for all modes of play to work peacefully together is tha avaiability of the best content in every game mode. If a content is not exciting enough to win people over, it is nearly blackmailing to put exclusive rewards behind it. If raiders and fractal runners(I have all classic fractal achievments myself) insist on being special snowflakes, it would have been the best option from the get go to give everyone the same in a different clothing instrad of 2 years of yapping and dividing the players. Wrong. Not only it is fine, it is much better to have exclusive rewards. Making everything readily available everywhere diminishes its value and reduces the incentive for players to return to this content. Making content die a lot faster. Exclusive rewards are not only healthier for the game, they are also better for the players, because they create a feeling of achievement when you get them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oglaf.1074 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Feanor.2358 said: > > @Torolan.5816 said: > > > @Lunateric.3708 said: > > > > @Ellisande.5218 said: > > > > > @DarcShriek.5829 said: > > > > > > @GreyWolf.8670 said: > > > > > > > @mazut.4296 said: > > > > > > > I think you already have the alternative to raiding. It's called "No raiding"... > > > > > > > > > > > > Cool... so they should sell the raids separately so those that don't want them don't have to pay for them. > > > > > > > > > > No one is paying for raids. > > > > > > > > HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! > > > > > > > > Everyone pays for raids because developing raids costs money as people have to design, implement, test, redesign, reimplement, rinse and repeat. That takes time and time costs money. > > > > > > > > Also, items are locked inside raids even though not everyone enjoys raiding. So that's just fing kitten. The only people who truly believe that is fair are the people who enjoy raiding. There is NO reason why items should be locked in raids only. If you complain that raiders wouldn't have any reason to raid without raid only items then you've just proven that you don't really want raids and so the devs could save a lot of money by stopping developing raids since no one really wants to do them. > > > > > > There are items locked behind dungeons, fractals, PvP and WvW too, exclusive ONLY to that content. And guess what?, that's fine. > > > > No, it is not ok. It already was a stupid idea with fractals, and it has grown even more stupid with raids. The only way for all modes of play to work peacefully together is tha avaiability of the best content in every game mode. If a content is not exciting enough to win people over, it is nearly blackmailing to put exclusive rewards behind it. If raiders and fractal runners(I have all classic fractal achievments myself) insist on being special snowflakes, it would have been the best option from the get go to give everyone the same in a different clothing instrad of 2 years of yapping and dividing the players. > > Wrong. Not only it is fine, it is much better to have exclusive rewards. Making everything readily available everywhere diminishes its value and reduces the incentive for players to return to this content. Making content die a lot faster. Exclusive rewards are not only healthier for the game, they are also better for the players, because they create a feeling of achievement when you get them. Actual feeling of achievement, too. Not the fake, balogna feelig of achievement PR people spin about loot boxes, LOL. I'm 5/6 pieces of my Legendary Armour and yeah, doing all the precursor armour collections - and the damn Crystal Heart collection (I hate you Cairn, and your friggin' circles!) definitely has been both the most frustrating AND rewarding thing I've done in the game, ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyWolf.8670 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Joxer.6024 said: > > @GreyWolf.8670 said: > > > @mazut.4296 said: > > > I think you already have the alternative to raiding. It's called "No raiding"... > > > > Cool... so they should sell the raids separately so those that don't want them don't have to pay for them. > > I don't PVP or WVW, so does your logic apply there as well? It was already mention in a post earlier....other option, just don't raid. This game has so much other stuffs to do its silly. You have the option of walking into a PvP/WvW lobby and getting thrown straight into a group to play. You do not have that for Dungeons/Raids/Fractals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torolan.5816 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 A possibility is not an obligation. If you have fun playing HoT or PoF you can stil do it even without carrots or just for the AP and story. It would help massively if events were awesome and the story was superb of course. :) With the introduction of getting hero points in wvw, you could kiss HoT and PoF goodbye if you were interested in wvw only. You have to play wvw for an expended period of time of course, so no one got anything for free. A raid in another example does not give me any option to find something new if I don´t bend over and hail the meta overlords. In this case, Anet ignored the masses for the doubtful benefit of reeling in an unkown number of raiders against the large majority of people with no desire to raid. And yes, even a 70% majority would still be a large majority but I guess nobody is expecting a 30% raid population. This would still all have been fine if Anet had said that legendary armor was planned for other game modes in the future and people could put their torches and forks away. You probably remember as good as I what kind of carussel discussion this caused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carighan.6758 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @maddoctor.2738 said: > If you are talking about Episode 1 of Season 4 then I also hope it's a complete package and not only focused on the Raid and the Fractal Sure will be. It'll contain another half-baked zone like the LS3 zones, keeping us busy for all of 1 hour for excitement and then another few hours for grinding. Yippeeeee! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Torolan.5816 said: > A raid in another example does not give me any option to find something new if I don´t bend over and hail the meta overlords. I asked you how would the expansion be like if it had no unique rewards and instead every reward it offered was also available in other types of content. Since you didn't answer I'll answer it for you: the expansion would be dead. > Anet ignored the masses for the doubtful benefit of reeling in an unkown number of raiders against the large majority of people with no desire to raid I'd want to see the players stats on Monday. Let's say there are X players online on Monday prime time, how many are raiding and how many are not. That's a useful stat to find out how important a piece of content is. Percentages of "active" players is a worthless statistic because this "majority" of yours is impossible to count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Astralporing.1957 said: > > @Cyninja.2954 said: > > > > @Cyninja.2954 said: > > > > Yes, raids have a small team of developers who are working on them. It's by far one of the smallest dedicated teams. One can argue that the benefit to the game with this minimal amount of effort is huge, or not depending on which side one takes on the issue of value of raids. You've so far not given any argument which supports this team is doing a insufficient job. > > > Oh, i think that they do their job splendidly. I also think that raids are a net loss for the game. The problems caused by raids are not caused by their specific implementation, but merely by them being based on an _idea_ that in a long run is damaging to this game. > > > > That's quite a bold assumption which is based more on subjective opinion than fact. Not saying there are no facts which might support this, I would like some of those stated please though. > > > Okay, i'll bite. > > > @Cyninja.2954 said: > > As it stands now the addition of raids has: > > - forced a stricter balance as far as classes are concerned, especially in pve > > - has brought a lot of new and returning players to the game (if this is a net gain or loss one would have to check, my assumption though is it's a huge gain) > > - legendary armor created an extra longterm incentive for players and was later added to spvp and wvw. no matter if you are working towards this goal or not, you can't deny that it has a lot of players interested or engaged > > - toxicity and elitism is no better or worse than before raids. except now it can actually be disproven by use of damage meters. Before people would simply not take you along as class xyz, now they might give you a chance > > - have added a layer of pve endgame content. Believe it or not, a huge part of GW2s problem was there was nothing to work towards. > > > - That balance now revolves around the peak performance and strict compositions only. If anything, raids (and the balance done around them) only caused the "meta" to be more strict, and brought it to the surface. Before raids most players didn't even know (or cared) what meta was, and this didn't limit them in any way from no PvE content. > - it's debatable whether it caused more players to come back, or leave. Or even if those players brought back to the game were brought back by introduction of raids, or by new expacs. For one, i don't actually think that this game has now more players than it had before Raids. > - yes, legendary gear does that. It's not raids however - and by tying it to a niche content, Anet decreased the impact legendary pve armor might have had on community. Additionally, seeing it accessible only through raids (initially) was a disincentive to a lot of people, and made them _less_ interested and engaged. > - damage meters cause as much toxicity as they negate. On the other hand, by introducing a content like raids, and making it front-and-center showpiece of the game, Anet actually indirectly _encouraged_ the more toxic part of the community. In dungeons those people could safely be ignored, because most people knew that elitist behaviour and requirements were actually 100% unnecessary. In raids, they are a widely accepted norm. > - by creating a specific endgame raids removed that layer from the rest of the game. You might think that the "whole game is the endgame" concept was uninteresting for you, but many people liked it. Now in pve there's only one endgame, and (by intent of design) most people _don't participate in it_. So if GW2 was doing so great, why did arenanet have to: - move away from Living World Season 1 concept? - try to push the spvp aspect of the game in an attempt to draw in players? - introduce raids in the first place and move away from their casual open world approach? - write an open letter to the community to actively help in getting people to notice the game? You are seeing things through your subjective view without questioning why certain decision where made in the past and what the causes for these decisions might have been. As well as the fact that you are judging content based on how the game is now players wise without considering how the game would be with a much smaller player base. Balance should always revolve around peak performance. That's the only thing you can balance around. The game does not though. As mentioned, over 90% of the game is not meta required and honestly, if you can't see how better balance between classes benefits this area of the game as well I can't help you. > > @Cyninja.2954 said: > > I get that some people might want to return to GW2 being more niche and more casual (which it still is, 90% of the content created for this game is super casual stuff), what I find very disheartening is how people go out of their way to bash on content which affects them in almost no way. > If it really didn't affect me in no way, i wouldn't be speaking against it. It's because raids _do_ affect the whole game, directly or indirectly, that they generate so much friction. > > > @Cyninja.2954 said: > Why should a casual on-off player care about the minimal amount of development time going into raids when their net benefit is so much bigger than any other content in this game besides maybe a new expansion? > Because for said casual on-off player it's not a benefit, but a loss, perhaps? If raids were a net loss ot the games players base, I'm absolutely sure arenanet would have stopped developing them by now. That alone is a great benefit in and of itsself. Everything else is pure speculation no matter which side you stand on this topic. > > @Cyninja.2954 said: > > For anyone who thinks legendary armor would have been introduced to regular pve without raids, rest assured that it would have been made so expensive or timegated that if you can't manage to acquire it currently, you would not have been able to acquire it then too. > I seriously doubt that it would have been on a level significantly greater than those of legendary weapons. The only reason why it's so bad in WvW and sPvP now is because Anet wanted to make it distinctly clear that Raids should be the primary source of legendary armor, with everything else far behind (again an example where Raids caused a negative impact on other modes). Yes, it would have been on the level legendary weapons which would have been significantly higher gold cost wise. If we assume that arenanets approach to introducing items/content remains true that items are either expensive or timegated, legendary armor would definitely have been WAY more expensive and very likely beyond the level of what spvp and wvw legendary armor requires currently since it comes with the benefit of a legendary skin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Carighan.6758 said: > > @maddoctor.2738 said: > > If you are talking about Episode 1 of Season 4 then I also hope it's a complete package and not only focused on the Raid and the Fractal > > Sure will be. It'll contain another half-baked zone like the LS3 zones, keeping us busy for all of 1 hour for excitement and then another few hours for grinding. Yippeeeee! There are paid games out there that last 2-3 hours, this is free. I think for the purchase price, Path of Fire already surpassed the vast majority of game releases, even higher priced games, in terms of content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torolan.5816 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @maddoctor.2738 said: > > @Torolan.5816 said: > > A raid in another example does not give me any option to find something new if I don´t bend over and hail the meta overlords. > > I asked you how would the expansion be like if it had no unique rewards and instead every reward it offered was also available in other types of content. > Since you didn't answer I'll answer it for you: the expansion would be dead. > > > Anet ignored the masses for the doubtful benefit of reeling in an unkown number of raiders against the large majority of people with no desire to raid > > I'd want to see the players stats on Monday. Let's say there are X players online on Monday prime time, how many are raiding and how many are not. > That's a useful stat to find out how important a piece of content is. Percentages of "active" players is a worthless statistic because this "majority" of yours is impossible to count. I don´t know how many people raid, you don´t know too. Let´s not start this again please. I just wanted to point out that 70% or 7/10 is still a large majority. It is ok if a content has exklusive rewards when it is new. Anet knew this and on the one hand diminished the old content(yes, F2P, but you get the point) and made advertisment for the raids. They did the same with fractals but could not diminish core. I did not approve but I understood then and I understand the line of reasoning now. But the fallout and feedback this caused would have been avoidable if Anet had not adamantly said that legendary armor would be raid only but rather that it will or at least maybe come for other game modes later. My opinion is that you can enlarge that on as good as any content. In that way you keep your players at happy(I won´t get it now, I can get it later) and give the eager people something to do(YAY, I get it right now!). Edit: An expansion could be about a long, kick skritt story for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Torolan.5816 said: > But the fallout and feedback this caused would have been avoidable if Anet had not adamantly said that legendary armor would be raid only but rather that it will or at least maybe come for other game modes later. My opinion is that you can enlarge that on as good as any content. In that way you keep your players at happy(I won´t get it now, I can get it later) and give the eager people something to do(YAY, I get it right now!). Adding a new tier of gear (legendary armor) as a raid exclusive was a bad idea and they reverted that. I don't know how you are fixated only on legendary armor though, Raids give other skin rewards too, while the open world and other content types also have their own unique rewards. To get back to the original point: > There are items locked behind dungeons, fractals, PvP and WvW too, exclusive ONLY to that content. And guess what?, that's fine. Not talking only about Legendary armor. You seem to dislike the idea of every piece of content having its own unique rewards and your argument against it is for Legendary armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @Oglaf.1074 said: > Actual feeling of achievement, too. Not the fake, balogna feelig of achievement PR people spin about loot boxes, LOL. > > I'm 5/6 pieces of my Legendary Armour and yeah, doing all the precursor armour collections - and the kitten Crystal Heart collection (I hate you Cairn, and your friggin' circles!) definitely has been both the most frustrating AND rewarding thing I've done in the game, ever. And i'm the opposite. Frustrating? Yeah. Rewarding? Well, maybe, because otherwise i wouldn't be doing that, but it wasn't in a good way. I do not have any feeling of achievement for getting my legendary armor set. Nor do i feel any kind of satisfaction. What i feel is _relief_ that i do not have to do that again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torolan.5816 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @maddoctor.2738 said: > > @Torolan.5816 said: > > But the fallout and feedback this caused would have been avoidable if Anet had not adamantly said that legendary armor would be raid only but rather that it will or at least maybe come for other game modes later. My opinion is that you can enlarge that on as good as any content. In that way you keep your players at happy(I won´t get it now, I can get it later) and give the eager people something to do(YAY, I get it right now!). > > Adding a new tier of gear (legendary armor) as a raid exclusive was a bad idea and they reverted that. I don't know how you are fixated only on legendary armor though, Raids give other skin rewards too, while the open world and other content types also have their own unique rewards. To get back to the original point: > > > There are items locked behind dungeons, fractals, PvP and WvW too, exclusive ONLY to that content. And guess what?, that's fine. > > Not talking only about Legendary armor. You seem to dislike the idea of every piece of content having its own unique rewards and your argument against it is for Legendary armor. Because I gave a skritt about cosmetics then, and I give a skritt about cosmetics now. Contrary to common belief this game can be played in other ways than fashion wars 2. And as you rightfully said, adding a tier of armor which is a tangible improvement for the casual gamer too for raiders only made second class citizens out of anyone else. But I get the point you make. Still I wouild prefer if Anet made their advertisement a little bit friendlier for those of us who have no interest to strife for greatness in fotm content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notebene.3190 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 It's possible, I suppose, that 31 (at the time of this writing) people got it, or 31 people didn't get it, or some mix of 31 people got it and didn't get it, and we need to solve for 'it'. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyWolf.8670 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @maddoctor.2738 said: > > @Carighan.6758 said: > > > @maddoctor.2738 said: > > > If you are talking about Episode 1 of Season 4 then I also hope it's a complete package and not only focused on the Raid and the Fractal > > > > Sure will be. It'll contain another half-baked zone like the LS3 zones, keeping us busy for all of 1 hour for excitement and then another few hours for grinding. Yippeeeee! > > There are paid games out there that last 2-3 hours, this is free. > I think for the purchase price, Path of Fire already surpassed the vast majority of game releases, even higher priced games, in terms of content. It is not free. You must log in to the game while the episode is current to unlock it and you cannot play it unless you own PoF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opopanax.1803 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @TexZero.7910 said: > > @Opopanax.1803 said: > > > @Ordin.9047 said: > > > Moving title contents here: Please give the 80% of us who don't raid more to do than > > > > > > An hour worth of living story and a bunch of grind. > > > > I've got to say, I really wish they would keep raids just like they are as far as difficulty and coordination, and mechanics, but make them 5 man. 10 is too much scheduling on the back end. > > those are called fractals. more specifically CM's & 98-100 Except fractals have next to zero story and lore compared to raids or dungeons. Fractals are a complete disconnect. And I play pvew for the story, like I think most others do too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 > @GreyWolf.8670 said: > It is not free. You must log in to the game while the episode is current to unlock it and you cannot play it unless you own PoF. You don't need to own PoF to unlock it, you need to own PoF to play it. And as I said, Path of Fire alone was worth more, in terms of value over content, than most games out there. So anything else we get, without an extra price, is a nice bonus. If it's a 1-hour story or an 8-hour story it doesn't matter, the price of PoF was already worth it so the season episodes can be of any length really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 > @maddoctor.2738 said: > > @GreyWolf.8670 said: > > It is not free. You must log in to the game while the episode is current to unlock it and you cannot play it unless you own PoF. > > You don't need to own PoF to unlock it, you need to own PoF to play it. That was how it was until now, but i do kind of remember some of the most recent statements did make me think that may be changed for LS4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper Cutter.9376 Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 > @maddoctor.2738 said: > Adding a new tier of gear (legendary armor) as a raid exclusive was a bad idea and they reverted that. You still can't get legendary armor in PVE without raiding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkoNS.3261 Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > Only reason I don't raid is because of the raiding community, not the content itself, which I find to be quite easy actually. > > They should lower raid difficulty not because I want raids to be easier but because I want the raid community to be less elitist. that is just your opinion, and you dont speak for anyone else who raids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Healix.5819 Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 Raiding should be the alternative. It should have been its own things like fractals and reused existing bosses. They've already been using the raid team to design the bosses for the story, so they could have doubled up and used them for the raids, essentially meaning a story mode for raids, though in reverse. They could finally fix Zhaitan for example by turning it into a raid boss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 > @Healix.5819 said: > They could finally fix Zhaitan for example by turning it into a raid boss. That's a terrible idea because nobody would care at this point. If they make a raid out of existing content it will be as if it doesn't exist. Just see the massively revamped fractals that players don't put on their list of "new fractals" although gameplay-wise they are completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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