Feanor.2358 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. And the fact that there are no achievements tied to it clearly shows that it's not considered by devs to be on equal footing with the raid set. > > > > > > The ring ended up locked behind raids because they are simply treated better than any other part of the game. > > > > > > > Of course it isn't considered to be on equal footing. Raid armor is supposed to be the reward for the ultimate challenge, whereas the PvP/WvW ones do not require any special skills/efforts/achievements to obtain. The one set that actually requires a lot of effort, the Sublime Mistforged, has its own unique skin. > First, Raids are not an Ultimate Challenge. If Anet really wanted to reward that, the first legendary armor (and probably the only one with actual skin) would have been obtainable only by winning sPvP tournaments. First, your feelings on the subject are not relevant. Raids are *intended* to be the ultimate challenge in this game. That's their design goal. Regardless on where you stand on their success providing it, that's a reason enough to have exclusive rewards. > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > Second, Sublime Mistforged is not a legendary skin. WvW legendary armor has no skin of its own, it just reuses already preexisting ones. Into the sPvP and WvW legendary armor skins Anet put exactly **zero** effort. Which is really glaring difference when compared to the envoy set, anet spent at least a year (probably more) designing. Not the point. Sublime Mistforged is the skin that requires a lot of effort to obtain. It doesn't have to be legendary, because it would create exactly the same negative feedback: "omg why is this so hard to get, gimme". They added the WvW/PvP legendaries with relatively low requirements *on purpose*. The purpose being, to be accessible. And here's the thing, you can never have an accessible reward be on equal footing as an inaccessible one. It would render the latter pointless. Also note that you can have a legendary Sublime if you're a dedicated WvW player. Obtain both, transmute your legendary to Sublime, done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 Open World PVE got 6 armor sets, 6 weapon sets, +18 elite specialization weapons, +lots of other individual weapon and armor pieces. Open World PVE always has the most attention and gets everything while the rest of the game gets scraps. If the Ring is so important to you, then how would you feel if they swapped the rewards? Make Raid exclusive rewards exclusive in open world PVE, and make open world PVE exclusive rewards Raid exclusives. I don't think that would work very well, if at all. The Ring is a simple QoL feature, on the other hand, elite specializations and mastery points can only be unlocked in open world PVE, and never inside Raids. That's their actual progression system and is open world PVE exclusive, the Ring is not part of progression. > @Rennie.6750 said: > 1% of the players who bothered registering an API keys (less than 20k players, ie a very very small portion of the playerbase) have been raiding every week. 2.5% of them have been raiding regularly and now have 400 ish Lis. And we're talking about the most dedicated members of the community, because registering an API key is mostly for hardcore players, not for everyone. The thing is, raids are difficult, niche and exclusionary content. That's not an assumption, that's a fact. Fun fact: players with 4k playtime that have 400 LI are 12.5% and not 2.5%. You know players with 4k playtime are more likely to be ready for Raids anyway. But anyway that's how statistics work, their results depend on your filters. By the way, 14.5% of those players have a complete armor set. Interestingly enough, 13.5% of those players have Aurora, which is available in open world PVE. The same percentage of players that have Legendary Armor have Aurora. If we go to the everybody statistic, 0.5% have Aurora (!!!) while 1.5% have a complete armor set. We are talking about adding a new way to craft an item that 0.5% of the hardcore (as you call them) gw2efficiency players have.... I'm quite positive that the Raid exclusive parts won't be the reason why only few people craft it, otherwise more would have Aurora. Hint: it's stupidly expensive in materials and it's not worth crafting. Putting in behind Raids is the least of its problems Edit: And one more thing, you say 1% of the players have been raiding every week, but you take that 1% from the everybody category. Explain to me please how can a player with 500 hours of playtime would be able to have raided every week since raids were released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CptAurellian.9537 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 Haha, nice comparison between Aurora and the legy armor, doc. You are absolutely right in stating that the trinket is stupidly expensive for its almost non-existent benefit. Though the one thing that has always prevented me from even getting close to it was the need to do all those annoying LS achievements. They are just not fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"thrag.9740" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > Yeah your skin argument is a load of bull. Pvp and wvw gets unique skins without dropping 2k gold on gifts of blood/etc. Literally its like if raiders could unlock the skin for 150 LI, and upgrade to legendary for 2k gold only if they wanted to. > > They can. Those skins are called _precursor_ armor skins. The difference is that WvW and sPvP legendaries use precursor skins even _after_ upgrade. > > Here is a composite image I made. Envoy 1,2,3 on the top row, glorious hero and ardent hero on the bottom row. > https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/302790230576988160/391822566886604800/unknown.png > > Considering how envoy 1 and 2 are identical, Look again at the picture you supplied. They aren't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felipe.1807 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > Let's see: > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > Let's see: > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > Let's see: > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felipe.1807 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough shit to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rennie.6750 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"maddoctor.2738" said: > Open World PVE got 6 armor sets, 6 weapon sets, +18 elite specialization weapons, +lots of other individual weapon and armor pieces. > Open World PVE always has the most attention and gets everything while the rest of the game gets scraps. > If the Ring is so important to you, then how would you feel if they swapped the rewards? Make Raid exclusive rewards exclusive in open world PVE, and make open world PVE exclusive rewards Raid exclusives. I don't think that would work very well, if at all. > The Ring is a simple QoL feature, on the other hand, elite specializations and mastery points can only be unlocked in open world PVE, and never inside Raids. That's their actual progression system and is open world PVE exclusive, the Ring is not part of progression. > > > @Rennie.6750 said: > > 1% of the players who bothered registering an API keys (less than 20k players, ie a very very small portion of the playerbase) have been raiding every week. 2.5% of them have been raiding regularly and now have 400 ish Lis. And we're talking about the most dedicated members of the community, because registering an API key is mostly for hardcore players, not for everyone. The thing is, raids are difficult, niche and exclusionary content. That's not an assumption, that's a fact. > > Fun fact: players with 4k playtime that have 400 LI are 12.5% and not 2.5%. You know players with 4k playtime are more likely to be ready for Raids anyway. But anyway that's how statistics work, their results depend on your filters. By the way, 14.5% of those players have a complete armor set. Interestingly enough, 13.5% of those players have Aurora, which is available in open world PVE. The same percentage of players that have Legendary Armor have Aurora. > If we go to the everybody statistic, 0.5% have Aurora (!!!) while 1.5% have a complete armor set. We are talking about adding a new way to craft an item that 0.5% of the hardcore (as you call them) gw2efficiency players have.... > > I'm quite positive that the Raid exclusive parts won't be the reason why only few people craft it, otherwise more would have Aurora. > Hint: it's stupidly expensive in materials and it's not worth crafting. Putting in behind Raids is the least of its problems > > Edit: And one more thing, you say 1% of the players have been raiding every week, but you take that 1% from the everybody category. Explain to me please how can a player with 500 hours of playtime would be able to have raided every week since raids were released. I can't give a proper answer since I couldn't find these statistics on efficiency (this one is on me though), 13% players having aurora and 13% players having a full legendary armour do not mean there's any overlapping. Obviously, there's some, but the degree is unknown. You'd have to obtain the stats about who owns both to make that relevant. You're also cherrypicking your population. 4k hours is an unholy amount of playtime, we're looking at less than 1/5th of the registered players. And once again, they're all hardcore, so take this number with a grain of salt. If anything, according to other game devs, hardcore players are 5% of a community, so we're discussing minuscule numbers at this point and need to be careful when we're not looking at the general hardcore population, which is already very small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxwelgm.4315 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 Did you guys even get Sublime Mistforged Armor before they allowed you to upgrade it? **Stop saying the skin is legendary from the start, it is not, and it is not a precursor at all, you merely have the option to turn it legendary, as a perk. It's clearly improvised, you see?**. And while this is great (no other mode needed legendary armor like WvW), it clearly goes to show **Anet did never plan to introduce legendary armor outside of Raids**. There is no other reason for this lack of foresight. How many months did they take to develop the raid armor, to the point they confessed to not trying it again anytime soon? It was actually said the armor took a strain on the armor development team, and this drain of resources should never have passed given raids are supposedly not primary content. Anyway, this is not the WvW forums (not that the devs had habit of reading it back then), but it's also this kind of mentality that has to stop: > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. Just don't go there. It's not special to clear raids weekly (let alone farm 100k a week to slowly grind the LI to buy runs), and it should not be rewarded with exclusivity. If you have a game and want people to play it you ought to make it accessible, which Anet did. It's only players treating raids from this high ground that doesn't exist, and it's even worse if a raider does it. > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. I reckon people would actually be happier if they got WvW and/or PvP legendary skins parallel to raid ones. Anet probably expected most players to git gud and go raid eventually, so they weren't going to develop armor so elaborate for a long time, but people obviously didn't. Even if the issue weren't about cosmetics, it's also important that Anet sticks to a single position (i.e raids are very important and clearly the -end and -long goal of players alongside Fractals, not niche content that won't get exclusive to mode rewards). But at least for me, the issue is very much about cosmetics, this is fashion wars 2 after all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Rennie.6750" said: > I can't give a proper answer since I couldn't find these statistics on efficiency (this one is on me though), 13% players having aurora and 13% players having a full legendary armour do not mean there's any overlapping. Obviously, there's some, but the degree is unknown. You'd have to obtain the stats about who owns both to make that relevant. Who ever talked about overlapping? There is a 0.5% of the population that has Aurora and there is a discussion here on how to make something that is exactly like Aurora available outside Raids as if the lock behind Raids is the problem. > You're also cherrypicking your population. 4k hours is an unholy amount of playtime, we're looking at less than 1/5th of the registered players. And once again, they're all hardcore, so take this number with a grain of salt. If anything, according to other game devs, hardcore players are 5% of a community, so we're discussing minuscule numbers at this point and need to be careful when we're not looking at the general hardcore population, which is already very small. I'm not cherry picking my population, I'm taking those with the highest time played so we ignore the players without any play time that you conveniently included in your own fake percentages, according to gw2efficiency there is also a percentage of the players that never got into Heart of Thorns, or Path of Fire, so that 100% of the population is bogus and cannot be used for any kind of argument. I didn't use it btw, I just used different numbers to dismantle your argument about the numbers. Also I don't give a damn nor take as an argument what developers of other games say about the raiding population because we know for a fact that the developers of THIS game expected their raiding population to be like those other games but were surprised that in reality it wasn't. Finally, the percentage of players with Aurora (those who will also go for the Legendary Ring) is even smaller than the amount of players that are the most hardcore Raiders, therefore, a suggestion to make something like the Legendary Ring more "available" is worthless as it's a suggestion that affects a tiny minority of a tiny minority. And please don't tell me that more will go for the Ring rather than the trinket because that's also non-sense. Plus we will probably get another Legendary Trinket with the conclusion of Season 4. It's like whining at Ferrari that there is no car seller that sells Ferrari in your neighborhood, as if there was one you'd buy one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 Oh I don't know, how long did it take the first raiders to get the 150 LI together when there was only 3 LI per week possible? I'd estimate the first 150 LI were possible around 12 months after raids were introduced. Now? Well at maximum of 17 LI per week you are looking at 9 weeks (2.1 months) of raids minimum for LI alone. More realistic is 6-8 months for any one starting out to raid absolutely fresh. 9 weeks of around 5 hours per week (being very generous here, no way anyone clears all 5 wings that fast when starting out) that's around 45 hours minimum with a more realistic assessment of 120+ hours if we assume 6 months. That's another 120 days worth of pvp. How long does it take to farm around 2,500 gold and all the account bound materials on top of those LI to actually make the armor? At 20 gold per hour, that's another 162 hours only for the gold or approximately 160 days worth of pvp (at 1 hour spvp per day). Now adding both of that up: 120 + 160 = 280 days worth of pvp (with some very generous assumptions made). Considering for spvp and wvw all you need to do is sign up and go afk basically, I'd call that pretty even if not even favoring spvp heavily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 As far as I know, winning a tournament isn't a requirement for PvP legendary armor. Actually, not even winning a *game* is. You can simply grind your way to it by doing nothing special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felipe.1807 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 > > Oh I don't know, how long did it take the first raiders to get the 150 LI together when there was only 3 LI per week possible? I'd estimate the first 150 LI were possible around 12 months after raids were introduced. > > Now? Well at maximum of 17 LI per week you are looking at 9 weeks (2.1 months) of raids minimum for LI alone. More realistic is 6-8 months for any one starting out to raid absolutely fresh. 9 weeks of around 5 hours per week (being very generous here, no way anyone clears all 5 wings that fast when starting out) that's around 45 hours minimum with a more realistic assessment of 120+ hours if we assume 6 months. That's another 120 days worth of pvp. > > How long does it take to farm around 2,500 gold and all the account bound materials on top of those LI to actually make the armor? At 20 gold per hour, that's another 162 hours only for the gold or approximately 160 days worth of pvp (at 1 hour spvp per day). > > Now adding both of that up: 120 + 160 = 280 days worth of pvp (with some very generous assumptions made). > > Considering for spvp and wvw all you need to do is sign up and go afk basically, I'd call that pretty even if not even favoring spvp heavily. ahahahha go afk...really dude, its not like you can easily get carried by your group on Raid, or better yet, just buy from someone...also you talking about all the time necessary to get it...WvW armor needs like 22 weeks, and that if you actually get diamond chest every week, a thing that a new player dont even dream of getting...and PvP armor too is locked behind the League Seasons, so yeah you can grind as much as you want, but you aint getting nowhere fast... The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this...I am all for PvE getting cool stuff, but WvW/sPvP need those as well...just look at the new patch...PvE got several armor skins and weapons skins...and WvW/sPvP get just one...and is not even good looking, like the devs are trolling us...if the art team hate the only competive game mode that they can even bother to make new skins for these modes, why not make all game modes share the skins, so you can obtain it whatever game mode you play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > > > > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > > > > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 > > > > Oh I don't know, how long did it take the first raiders to get the 150 LI together when there was only 3 LI per week possible? I'd estimate the first 150 LI were possible around 12 months after raids were introduced. > > > > Now? Well at maximum of 17 LI per week you are looking at 9 weeks (2.1 months) of raids minimum for LI alone. More realistic is 6-8 months for any one starting out to raid absolutely fresh. 9 weeks of around 5 hours per week (being very generous here, no way anyone clears all 5 wings that fast when starting out) that's around 45 hours minimum with a more realistic assessment of 120+ hours if we assume 6 months. That's another 120 days worth of pvp. > > > > How long does it take to farm around 2,500 gold and all the account bound materials on top of those LI to actually make the armor? At 20 gold per hour, that's another 162 hours only for the gold or approximately 160 days worth of pvp (at 1 hour spvp per day). > > > > Now adding both of that up: 120 + 160 = 280 days worth of pvp (with some very generous assumptions made). > > > > Considering for spvp and wvw all you need to do is sign up and go afk basically, I'd call that pretty even if not even favoring spvp heavily. > > ahahahha go afk...really dude, its not like you can easily get carried by your group on Raid, or better yet, just buy from someone... Yes, buying raid boss kills for 50-150g a piece is similar to afking a spvp game and getting slightly less progress pips. You don't have to get carried in spvp, you can strait up just lose and get the armor. > @"Felipe.1807" said: > also you talking about all the time necessary to get it...WvW armor needs like 22 weeks, and that if you actually get diamond chest every week, a thing that a new player dont even dream of getting...and PvP armor too is locked behind the League Seasons, so yeah you can grind as much as you want, but you aint getting nowhere fast... WvW is balanced around people already having played the game mode. So yes if you start from absolute 0, it will take longer. Doesn't change the fact that it requires 0 skill to get. If spvp is easy to get progress, wvw is even easier. Hit reward rank 6, brain afk follow the zerg, progress. > @"Felipe.1807" said: > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this...I am all for PvE getting cool stuff, but WvW/sPvP need those as well...just look at the new patch...PvE got several armor skins and weapons skins...and WvW/sPvP get just one...and is not even good looking, like the devs are trolling us...if the art team hate the only competive game mode that they can even bother to make new skins for these modes, why not make all game modes share the skins, so you can obtain it whatever game mode you play? I agree on the part about skins being important to spvp, personally I'd not have added legendary armor to spvp at all since you have absolute 0 use of it there (spvp not having stats and all). A unique amazing skin would have fit the game mode way better. Yet we all know how arenanet has to supplement these niche game modes and entice people to play them even if they are on absolute life support. I'm sorry you disagree that the most work goes into the game modes which have the vast majority of players. Skin and content wise, the open world pve crowd gets the absolute most attention. Go have some discussion with how some of them and how they feel about raids (or spvp or wvw getting access to legendary armor for that matter). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > > > > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > > > > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 > > > > Oh I don't know, how long did it take the first raiders to get the 150 LI together when there was only 3 LI per week possible? I'd estimate the first 150 LI were possible around 12 months after raids were introduced. > > > > Now? Well at maximum of 17 LI per week you are looking at 9 weeks (2.1 months) of raids minimum for LI alone. More realistic is 6-8 months for any one starting out to raid absolutely fresh. 9 weeks of around 5 hours per week (being very generous here, no way anyone clears all 5 wings that fast when starting out) that's around 45 hours minimum with a more realistic assessment of 120+ hours if we assume 6 months. That's another 120 days worth of pvp. > > > > How long does it take to farm around 2,500 gold and all the account bound materials on top of those LI to actually make the armor? At 20 gold per hour, that's another 162 hours only for the gold or approximately 160 days worth of pvp (at 1 hour spvp per day). > > > > Now adding both of that up: 120 + 160 = 280 days worth of pvp (with some very generous assumptions made). > > > > Considering for spvp and wvw all you need to do is sign up and go afk basically, I'd call that pretty even if not even favoring spvp heavily. > > ahahahha go afk...really dude, its not like you can easily get carried by your group on Raid, or better yet, just buy from someone...also you talking about all the time necessary to get it...WvW armor needs like 22 weeks, and that if you actually get diamond chest every week, a thing that a new player dont even dream of getting...and PvP armor too is locked behind the League Seasons, so yeah you can grind as much as you want, but you aint getting nowhere fast... > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this...I am all for PvE getting cool stuff, but WvW/sPvP need those as well...just look at the new patch...PvE got several armor skins and weapons skins...and WvW/sPvP get just one...and is not even good looking, like the devs are trolling us...if the art team hate the only competive game mode that they can even bother to make new skins for these modes, why not make all game modes share the skins, so you can obtain it whatever game mode you play? I know what you mean by it feels like the Dev team is just trolling on the PvP/WvW crowed, and my guess would be the devs are doing as little as they can to keep the few remaining PvP/WvW type players they have left from running off to Overwatch. or [Camelot Unchained](http://camelotunchained.com/v3/ "Camelot Unchained"), or whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felipe.1807 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > > > > > > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > > > > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > > > > > > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 > > > > > > Oh I don't know, how long did it take the first raiders to get the 150 LI together when there was only 3 LI per week possible? I'd estimate the first 150 LI were possible around 12 months after raids were introduced. > > > > > > Now? Well at maximum of 17 LI per week you are looking at 9 weeks (2.1 months) of raids minimum for LI alone. More realistic is 6-8 months for any one starting out to raid absolutely fresh. 9 weeks of around 5 hours per week (being very generous here, no way anyone clears all 5 wings that fast when starting out) that's around 45 hours minimum with a more realistic assessment of 120+ hours if we assume 6 months. That's another 120 days worth of pvp. > > > > > > How long does it take to farm around 2,500 gold and all the account bound materials on top of those LI to actually make the armor? At 20 gold per hour, that's another 162 hours only for the gold or approximately 160 days worth of pvp (at 1 hour spvp per day). > > > > > > Now adding both of that up: 120 + 160 = 280 days worth of pvp (with some very generous assumptions made). > > > > > > Considering for spvp and wvw all you need to do is sign up and go afk basically, I'd call that pretty even if not even favoring spvp heavily. > > > > ahahahha go afk...really dude, its not like you can easily get carried by your group on Raid, or better yet, just buy from someone...also you talking about all the time necessary to get it...WvW armor needs like 22 weeks, and that if you actually get diamond chest every week, a thing that a new player dont even dream of getting...and PvP armor too is locked behind the League Seasons, so yeah you can grind as much as you want, but you aint getting nowhere fast... > > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this...I am all for PvE getting cool stuff, but WvW/sPvP need those as well...just look at the new patch...PvE got several armor skins and weapons skins...and WvW/sPvP get just one...and is not even good looking, like the devs are trolling us...if the art team hate the only competive game mode that they can even bother to make new skins for these modes, why not make all game modes share the skins, so you can obtain it whatever game mode you play? > > I know what you mean by it feels like the Dev team is just trolling on the PvP/WvW crowed, and my guess would be the devs are doing as little as they can to keep the few remaining PvP/WvW type players they have left from running off to Overwatch. or [Camelot Unchained](http://camelotunchained.com/v3/ "Camelot Unchained"), or whatever. lol to me looks like that they want to get rid of these game modes and let GW2 become a full PvE game....look at the last patch, supposed to balance condis, and yet not only didnt nerf the 2 biggest offenders(Scourge and Mirage) but it actually buffed then, they are completely out of touch with the game and its community. > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > > > > > > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > > > > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > > > > > > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 > > > > > > Oh I don't know, how long did it take the first raiders to get the 150 LI together when there was only 3 LI per week possible? I'd estimate the first 150 LI were possible around 12 months after raids were introduced. > > > > > > Now? Well at maximum of 17 LI per week you are looking at 9 weeks (2.1 months) of raids minimum for LI alone. More realistic is 6-8 months for any one starting out to raid absolutely fresh. 9 weeks of around 5 hours per week (being very generous here, no way anyone clears all 5 wings that fast when starting out) that's around 45 hours minimum with a more realistic assessment of 120+ hours if we assume 6 months. That's another 120 days worth of pvp. > > > > > > How long does it take to farm around 2,500 gold and all the account bound materials on top of those LI to actually make the armor? At 20 gold per hour, that's another 162 hours only for the gold or approximately 160 days worth of pvp (at 1 hour spvp per day). > > > > > > Now adding both of that up: 120 + 160 = 280 days worth of pvp (with some very generous assumptions made). > > > > > > Considering for spvp and wvw all you need to do is sign up and go afk basically, I'd call that pretty even if not even favoring spvp heavily. > > > > ahahahha go afk...really dude, its not like you can easily get carried by your group on Raid, or better yet, just buy from someone... > > Yes, buying raid boss kills for 50-150g a piece is similar to afking a spvp game and getting slightly less progress pips. You don't have to get carried in spvp, you can strait up just lose and get the armor. > Funny how you make it sound so easy, been playing this game legit for a long time, and yet, I am nowhere near to get the requirements to upgrade to legendary, maybe i am doing it wrong, gonna start losing matches left and right and just afk...according to you, i will get it in no time...I was such fool, just afk and get free legendary, wished i knew these things before... > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > also you talking about all the time necessary to get it...WvW armor needs like 22 weeks, and that if you actually get diamond chest every week, a thing that a new player dont even dream of getting...and PvP armor too is locked behind the League Seasons, so yeah you can grind as much as you want, but you aint getting nowhere fast... > > WvW is balanced around people already having played the game mode. So yes if you start from absolute 0, it will take longer. Doesn't change the fact that it requires 0 skill to get. If spvp is easy to get progress, wvw is even easier. Hit reward rank 6, brain afk follow the zerg, progress. > Been playing WvW since start of this game, i am rank 894...if i dont put some level of commitment or dont start looking for outnumbered maps i dont get my max tickets at the end of the week, also, try playing in a server without a big WvW community and see how easy is to just hit tier 6 and afk > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this...I am all for PvE getting cool stuff, but WvW/sPvP need those as well...just look at the new patch...PvE got several armor skins and weapons skins...and WvW/sPvP get just one...and is not even good looking, like the devs are trolling us...if the art team hate the only competive game mode that they can even bother to make new skins for these modes, why not make all game modes share the skins, so you can obtain it whatever game mode you play? > > I agree on the part about skins being important to spvp, personally I'd not have added legendary armor to spvp at all since you have absolute 0 use of it there (spvp not having stats and all). A unique amazing skin would have fit the game mode way better. Yet we all know how arenanet has to supplement these niche game modes and entice people to play them even if they are on absolute life support. > > I'm sorry you disagree that the most work goes into the game modes which have the vast majority of players. Skin and content wise, the open world pve crowd gets the absolute most attention. Go have some discussion with how some of them and how they feel about raids (or spvp or wvw getting access to legendary armor for that matter). Funny part was when Anet added ascended gear to sPvP the PvE crowd went insane..."free", "to easy to get", "they dont need it" lol and look now, make a ascended sPvP armor and WvW is way harder then to make the PvE one...also this talk that sPvP dont need high tier gear is pure bullshit, last time i checked, when I enter the Heart of the Mist i dont get locked and cant never leave...i play WvW too and some PvE as well...if the logic behind it is that on sPvP your gear dosent count, than no other place other then Fractals should have Ascended gear, since the only place you need agony resistence is there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > > > > > > > > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > > > > > > > > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 > > > > > > > > Oh I don't know, how long did it take the first raiders to get the 150 LI together when there was only 3 LI per week possible? I'd estimate the first 150 LI were possible around 12 months after raids were introduced. > > > > > > > > Now? Well at maximum of 17 LI per week you are looking at 9 weeks (2.1 months) of raids minimum for LI alone. More realistic is 6-8 months for any one starting out to raid absolutely fresh. 9 weeks of around 5 hours per week (being very generous here, no way anyone clears all 5 wings that fast when starting out) that's around 45 hours minimum with a more realistic assessment of 120+ hours if we assume 6 months. That's another 120 days worth of pvp. > > > > > > > > How long does it take to farm around 2,500 gold and all the account bound materials on top of those LI to actually make the armor? At 20 gold per hour, that's another 162 hours only for the gold or approximately 160 days worth of pvp (at 1 hour spvp per day). > > > > > > > > Now adding both of that up: 120 + 160 = 280 days worth of pvp (with some very generous assumptions made). > > > > > > > > Considering for spvp and wvw all you need to do is sign up and go afk basically, I'd call that pretty even if not even favoring spvp heavily. > > > > > > ahahahha go afk...really dude, its not like you can easily get carried by your group on Raid, or better yet, just buy from someone...also you talking about all the time necessary to get it...WvW armor needs like 22 weeks, and that if you actually get diamond chest every week, a thing that a new player dont even dream of getting...and PvP armor too is locked behind the League Seasons, so yeah you can grind as much as you want, but you aint getting nowhere fast... > > > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this...I am all for PvE getting cool stuff, but WvW/sPvP need those as well...just look at the new patch...PvE got several armor skins and weapons skins...and WvW/sPvP get just one...and is not even good looking, like the devs are trolling us...if the art team hate the only competive game mode that they can even bother to make new skins for these modes, why not make all game modes share the skins, so you can obtain it whatever game mode you play? > > > > I know what you mean by it feels like the Dev team is just trolling on the PvP/WvW crowed, and my guess would be the devs are doing as little as they can to keep the few remaining PvP/WvW type players they have left from running off to Overwatch. or [Camelot Unchained](http://camelotunchained.com/v3/ "Camelot Unchained"), or whatever. > > lol to me looks like that they want to get rid of these game modes and let GW2 become a full PvE game....look at the last patch, supposed to balance condis, and yet not only didnt nerf the 2 biggest offenders(Scourge and Mirage) but it actually buffed then, they are completely out of touch with the game and its community. > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > > > > > That's the point. PvP and WvW are intended to be accessible, raids are intended to not be. PvP/WvW armors do not require anything but participation in the respective game mode, raid armor does. Hence, the exclusivity. It''s not laziness, it is *intention*, get that already. You can't have the same level of reward for doing nothing special. > > > > > > > > > > lol doing nothing special...please try to join a tournament and make it to the 1º place, or how about climb on the leaderboard...believe, fighting AI is not a challenge, is funny that you think it is...the only challenge that Raids offer is test your patiance against 9 other douchebags. > > > > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"maxwelgm.4315" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Lunateric.3708" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Rennie.6750" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I find distasteful is that in spite of the consistent complaints about the current iteration of raids in GW2, the devs don't care at all, and in fact seem to be craving for more unrest. Yes, adding a new legendary to raids is fine, in theory, the problem is the timing. Why do raids get the first ring when it's by far the least popular and least accessible game mode? If that was the 3rd or 4th ring, unhappy players would probably not care at all, but it's the first > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe Anet tests these things on the smaller population first, treating them as beta testers, then releases the content to the larger population? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I mean, they did exactly that with legendary armor. Raiders had exclusive access to legendary armor for 3 months before pvp/wvw got it. 3 Months is a pretty typical time between updates for them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah. Legendary armor for WvW and sPvP was a rushed thing, a result of complains against raid armor being exclusive. That's why it has no armor skin of its own associated to it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you telling me legendary PvP and WvW armor don't have exclusive to the mode skins?, because that's a blatant lie. Or are you meaning to say you want them to be transforming skins too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Legendary armor in PvP and WvW are **not** unique skins. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, they are unique skins to their respective mode. Whether they were avaliable before or not before the introduction to legendary armor is irrelevant if the argument is "they aren't unique skins" because they are, they have no replica cross-mode. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The correct way to put it if you're gonna complain about it with logic is **"they aren't brand new skins"** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah, pvp and wvw legend armor are not new skins, just cheap retex...hell i guess is not even a retexture, probably use the same model of Mistforged Armor and Ardent Glorious Armor...yeah pretty lame of Anet to focus so much on pve related stuff and completely ignore sPvP and WvW...who would though that fighting AI would be more rewarding that going against real people > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's see: > > > > > > > > > Triumphant Hero's armor is a level 80, **WvW-exclusive** Ascended or Exotic armor set. > > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Triumphant_Hero%27s_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious armor is a **PvP-exclusive** Ascended armor set that can be acquired from earning rewards in PvP Leagues. > > > > > > > > - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ardent_Glorious_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now unless the wiki is wrong, those 2 sound as though they are exclusive to their respective game modes or are they not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are they brand new? No. Are they exclusive? Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Who here is talking about exclusive stuff? I aint...imagine if the legendary armor was just a retexture of Ascended crafted armor, lol thats the whole point dude, Anet didnt put any effort to sPvP and WvW, hell the new pvp armor that will be introduced in the next patch is just gonna be, once again, a retexture of Glorious Armor lol > > > > > > > > > > > > Spvp and wvw also don't cost thousands of gold to make. > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree though, they should have made some legendary armor skins and waited 6 months longer in adding legendary armor options for spvp and wvw. I'm sure people woild gave been a lot happier that way. > > > > > > > > > > okay, dosent cost gold, but how many pvp seasons you need to play in order to get enough kitten to even think about upgrading to legend...and I am pretty sure WvW armor follows the same rule, if you are not high rank you will have to grind WvW 24/7 > > > > > > > > Oh I don't know, how long did it take the first raiders to get the 150 LI together when there was only 3 LI per week possible? I'd estimate the first 150 LI were possible around 12 months after raids were introduced. > > > > > > > > Now? Well at maximum of 17 LI per week you are looking at 9 weeks (2.1 months) of raids minimum for LI alone. More realistic is 6-8 months for any one starting out to raid absolutely fresh. 9 weeks of around 5 hours per week (being very generous here, no way anyone clears all 5 wings that fast when starting out) that's around 45 hours minimum with a more realistic assessment of 120+ hours if we assume 6 months. That's another 120 days worth of pvp. > > > > > > > > How long does it take to farm around 2,500 gold and all the account bound materials on top of those LI to actually make the armor? At 20 gold per hour, that's another 162 hours only for the gold or approximately 160 days worth of pvp (at 1 hour spvp per day). > > > > > > > > Now adding both of that up: 120 + 160 = 280 days worth of pvp (with some very generous assumptions made). > > > > > > > > Considering for spvp and wvw all you need to do is sign up and go afk basically, I'd call that pretty even if not even favoring spvp heavily. > > > > > > ahahahha go afk...really dude, its not like you can easily get carried by your group on Raid, or better yet, just buy from someone... > > > > Yes, buying raid boss kills for 50-150g a piece is similar to afking a spvp game and getting slightly less progress pips. You don't have to get carried in spvp, you can strait up just lose and get the armor. > > > > Funny how you make it sound so easy, been playing this game legit for a long time, and yet, I am nowhere near to get the requirements to upgrade to legendary, maybe i am doing it wrong, gonna start losing matches left and right and just afk...according to you, i will get it in no time...I was such fool, just afk and get free legendary, wished i knew these things before... You are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say it took no time, I said it took no skill. You have to still disprove my claim. Spvp and wvw reward ticks (on which every reward is built around in those modes) are guaranteed, only differing in amount you get. > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > also you talking about all the time necessary to get it...WvW armor needs like 22 weeks, and that if you actually get diamond chest every week, a thing that a new player dont even dream of getting...and PvP armor too is locked behind the League Seasons, so yeah you can grind as much as you want, but you aint getting nowhere fast... > > > > WvW is balanced around people already having played the game mode. So yes if you start from absolute 0, it will take longer. Doesn't change the fact that it requires 0 skill to get. If spvp is easy to get progress, wvw is even easier. Hit reward rank 6, brain afk follow the zerg, progress. > > > > Been playing WvW since start of this game, i am rank 894...if i dont put some level of commitment or dont start looking for outnumbered maps i dont get my max tickets at the end of the week, also, try playing in a server without a big WvW community and see how easy is to just hit tier 6 and afk Point 1: you mean the commitment which some raiders put in for over 12 months and more? You haven't even HAD enough time to put so much commitment in because legendary armor via spvp and wvw is not even in game that long. Point 2: Playing on smaller servers is unfortunate, but that's an individual issue which you can always correct by changing servers. Yes, smaller servers might have a harder time. You can't balance rewards around the slowest progression or else people in T1 would rush through them and the pressure to be in T1 would be even higher. > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this...I am all for PvE getting cool stuff, but WvW/sPvP need those as well...just look at the new patch...PvE got several armor skins and weapons skins...and WvW/sPvP get just one...and is not even good looking, like the devs are trolling us...if the art team hate the only competive game mode that they can even bother to make new skins for these modes, why not make all game modes share the skins, so you can obtain it whatever game mode you play? > > > > I agree on the part about skins being important to spvp, personally I'd not have added legendary armor to spvp at all since you have absolute 0 use of it there (spvp not having stats and all). A unique amazing skin would have fit the game mode way better. Yet we all know how arenanet has to supplement these niche game modes and entice people to play them even if they are on absolute life support. > > > > I'm sorry you disagree that the most work goes into the game modes which have the vast majority of players. Skin and content wise, the open world pve crowd gets the absolute most attention. Go have some discussion with how some of them and how they feel about raids (or spvp or wvw getting access to legendary armor for that matter). > > Funny part was when Anet added ascended gear to sPvP the PvE crowd went insane..."free", "to easy to get", "they dont need it" lol and look now, make a ascended sPvP armor and WvW is way harder then to make the PvE one...also this talk that sPvP dont need high tier gear is pure kitten, last time i checked, when I enter the Heart of the Mist i dont get locked and cant never leave...i play WvW too and some PvE as well...if the logic behind it is that on sPvP your gear dosent count, than no other place other then Fractals should have Ascended gear, since the only place you need agony resistence is there. Again, spvp and wvw legendary armor is not HARDER, it's more timegated and thus LONGER (if you raid 24/7 and invest that much time into getting able to kill all raid bosses). If you can literally lose your way to the rewards you aim for you can't honestly convince someone that this approach is in any way harder. I was talking about spvp, not wvw when talking about spvp legendary armor. You might see them as one and the same and use the names for the modes interchangeably, I do not. When I say spvp, I mean spvp, when I say wvw, I mean wvw. Oh I agree that no other place should reward ascended gear besides fractals and for 99% of the game, this holds true. I also disagreed with giving away welfare ascended in spvp only to keep the game mode alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Felipe.1807" said: > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this... The logic is they aren't harder to get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrag.9740 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > Yeah your skin argument is a load of bull. Pvp and wvw gets unique skins without dropping 2k gold on gifts of blood/etc. Literally its like if raiders could unlock the skin for 150 LI, and upgrade to legendary for 2k gold only if they wanted to. > > > They can. Those skins are called _precursor_ armor skins. The difference is that WvW and sPvP legendaries use precursor skins even _after_ upgrade. > > > > Here is a composite image I made. Envoy 1,2,3 on the top row, glorious hero and ardent hero on the bottom row. > > https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/302790230576988160/391822566886604800/unknown.png > > > > Considering how envoy 1 and 2 are identical, > > Look again at the picture you supplied. They aren't > > Whatever helps you sleep bud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"thrag.9740" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > Yeah your skin argument is a load of bull. Pvp and wvw gets unique skins without dropping 2k gold on gifts of blood/etc. Literally its like if raiders could unlock the skin for 150 LI, and upgrade to legendary for 2k gold only if they wanted to. > > > > They can. Those skins are called _precursor_ armor skins. The difference is that WvW and sPvP legendaries use precursor skins even _after_ upgrade. > > > > > > Here is a composite image I made. Envoy 1,2,3 on the top row, glorious hero and ardent hero on the bottom row. > > > https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/302790230576988160/391822566886604800/unknown.png > > > > > > Considering how envoy 1 and 2 are identical, > > > > Look again at the picture you supplied. They aren't > > > > > > Whatever helps you sleep bud. Seriously, you put together a picture comparing 2 first tiers of envoy armor, and then claim they are identical, when they clearly aren't. Which can easily be seen on the very picture you used as proof. And then try to handwave it away when you're called in on it. But go ahead, pretend you've won that one. Maybe even someone will believe you. > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this... > > The logic is they aren't harder to get. It actually is. Maybe not more difficult, but definitely harder (as in, you need to put in a lot more work into it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > Yeah your skin argument is a load of bull. Pvp and wvw gets unique skins without dropping 2k gold on gifts of blood/etc. Literally its like if raiders could unlock the skin for 150 LI, and upgrade to legendary for 2k gold only if they wanted to. > > > > > They can. Those skins are called _precursor_ armor skins. The difference is that WvW and sPvP legendaries use precursor skins even _after_ upgrade. > > > > > > > > Here is a composite image I made. Envoy 1,2,3 on the top row, glorious hero and ardent hero on the bottom row. > > > > https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/302790230576988160/391822566886604800/unknown.png > > > > > > > > Considering how envoy 1 and 2 are identical, > > > > > > Look again at the picture you supplied. They aren't > > > > > > > > > > Whatever helps you sleep bud. > Seriously, you put together a picture comparing 2 first tiers of envoy armor, and then claim they are identical, when they clearly aren't. Which can easily be seen on the very picture you used as proof. And then try to handwave it away when you're called in on it. But go ahead, pretend you've won that one. Maybe even someone will believe you. > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > @"Felipe.1807" said: > > > The main point, one game mode have a new skin with special effects and animations, legendary tier and require a good lv skill and commitment...the other 2 game modes get just a legend tier armor that is not even retexture of the lower tier armor, and is also harder too get...what is the logic behind this... > > > > The logic is they aren't harder to get. > It actually is. Maybe not more difficult, but definitely harder (as in, you need to put in a lot more work into it). > It actually isn't. And I play both raids and WvW, so I have a pretty good grasp on how hard they are both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrag.9740 Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > > Yeah your skin argument is a load of bull. Pvp and wvw gets unique skins without dropping 2k gold on gifts of blood/etc. Literally its like if raiders could unlock the skin for 150 LI, and upgrade to legendary for 2k gold only if they wanted to. > > > > > They can. Those skins are called _precursor_ armor skins. The difference is that WvW and sPvP legendaries use precursor skins even _after_ upgrade. > > > > > > > > Here is a composite image I made. Envoy 1,2,3 on the top row, glorious hero and ardent hero on the bottom row. > > > > https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/302790230576988160/391822566886604800/unknown.png > > > > > > > > Considering how envoy 1 and 2 are identical, > > > > > > Look again at the picture you supplied. They aren't > > > > > > > > > > Whatever helps you sleep bud. > Seriously, you put together a picture comparing 2 first tiers of envoy armor, and then claim they are identical, when they clearly aren't. Which can easily be seen on the very picture you used as proof. And then try to handwave it away when you're called in on it. But go ahead, pretend you've won that one. Maybe even someone will believe you. I'm aware there are tiny differences. The fact you think they are meaningful says to me your looking for any excuse you can find, to whine about the fact that raiders have to pay 2k gold for their top tier skin and pvp/wvw players dont. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MashMash.1645 Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 I'm just looking forward to the other legendary accessory being WvW only, and the other ring being PvP only. (✿◠‿◠) That makes sense right? * One in open world general PvE (Aurora | Accessory) * One in Raids (????? | Ring ) * One in WvW (????? | Ring or Accessory) * One in PvP (????? | Ring or Accessory) Of course that leaves the Legendary Necklace. Fractals maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyson.5160 Posted December 19, 2017 Share Posted December 19, 2017 > @"MashMash.1645" said: > I'm just looking forward to the other legendary accessory being WvW only, and the other ring being PvP only. (✿◠‿◠) > > That makes sense right? > > * One in open world general PvE (Aurora | Accessory) > * One in Raids (????? | Ring ) > * One in WvW (????? | Ring or Accessory) > * One in PvP (????? | Ring or Accessory) > > Of course that leaves the Legendary Necklace. Fractals maybe? Yeah makes sense and sounds fair to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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