Astralporing.1957 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > If gearing them was a 10 min investment, we may not see the writing on the wall so vividly, but because it needed full ascended, we saw their weakness and their limitations long before we even got to the point of getting serious about infusions. and then needing to make the choice to put in that AR, or maybe just go with a +5 stat instead, or just not bother at all, we made the right choice and went with the +5 stat or no slot, because, we knew that this was never going to be a good fractal running character to start with, even if we love them dearly for other parts of the game. ...gearing up that char _was_ a 10 min investment. I just pulled up some stuff from bank, and used laurels/guild commendations. And, for example, lately i've made a mirage. I had gear for that char even before she was made. I had no idea how to play the build, and generally no deep thought beyond "well, let's see how it turns out". After all, vipers (or zerks) aren't likely to become any less useful in the future, so i can always reuse that gear for a different character if i'll find i don't like it. Yes, gathering gear in itself is an effort, but gearing up any specific character doesn't really have to be. Not unless you're a new player anyway. Agony may be an important consideration for your first or second character, but after a certain point it becomes just a material sink and loses completely any value as a limiting factor helping you to "learn the character better before you'll get to t4". All it does is creating a barrier to _poor_ players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > If gearing them was a 10 min investment, we may not see the writing on the wall so vividly, but because it needed full ascended, we saw their weakness and their limitations long before we even got to the point of getting serious about infusions. and then needing to make the choice to put in that AR, or maybe just go with a +5 stat instead, or just not bother at all, we made the right choice and went with the +5 stat or no slot, because, we knew that this was never going to be a good fractal running character to start with, even if we love them dearly for other parts of the game. > ...gearing up that char _was_ a 10 min investment. I just pulled up some stuff from bank, and used laurels/guild commendations. And, for example, lately i've made a mirage. I had gear for that char even before she was made. I had no idea how to play the build, and generally no deep thought beyond "well, let's see how it turns out". After all, vipers (or zerks) aren't likely to become any less useful in the future, so i can always reuse that gear for a different character if i'll find i don't like it. > > Yes, gathering gear in itself is an effort, but gearing up any specific character doesn't really have to be. Not unless you're a new player anyway. Agony may be an important consideration for your first or second character, but after a certain point it becomes just a material sink and loses completely any value as a limiting factor helping you to "learn the character better before you'll get to t4". All it does is creating a barrier to _poor_ players. > > I don't view it that way, I myself only have one character ready for Fractals, (high level at last), and I had them ready pretty fast, because that was what I enjoyed. It really is just a deftness of purpose gate, the GW2 equal to a _flagging quest_ , nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vxblade.6873 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Just make infusions for AR account bound in slots that only activate if a piece of gear is ascended? Or make it like magic find, were the account has agony resistance and then getting into T4 just requires unlocking a padlock that requires T3 of the same being completed. So Fractal 1, T1 needs to be done before Fractal 1 T2, before T3 etc... no system is going to be perfect, but this would reduce the grind a little. ON THE FLIP SIDE, even though currently your ability to bring different alts to a fractal are limited to the armor type since almost all of it is account bound so you can trade it to any other type with the same gear, partially negating my logic here. if you are playing with 1 toon and not 9, you get much better at the nuances of that toon and probably can play much better than flipping around to 9 different mechanics when coming to a t4 fractal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 > @"vxblade.6873" said: > Just make infusions for AR account bound in slots that only activate if a piece of gear is ascended? Or make it like magic find, were the account has agony resistance and then getting into T4 just requires unlocking a padlock that requires T3 of the same being completed. So Fractal 1, T1 needs to be done before Fractal 1 T2, before T3 etc... no system is going to be perfect, but this would reduce the grind a little. > > ON THE FLIP SIDE, even though currently your ability to bring different alts to a fractal are limited to the armor type since almost all of it is account bound so you can trade it to any other type with the same gear, partially negating my logic here. if you are playing with 1 toon and not 9, you get much better at the nuances of that toon and probably can play much better than flipping around to 9 different mechanics when coming to a t4 fractal. Look, no one is saying AR is the perfect. but it does it's intended job, as such, if it's not broke, there is no need to fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 AR is another indication of preparedness and understanding as well. What makes me think that a person who hasn't obtained the AR needed for a fractal is even ready to do the content? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > AR is another indication of preparedness and understanding as well. What makes me think that a person who hasn't obtained the AR needed for a fractal is even ready to do the content? Nothing. But then the same is true for having the required AR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > AR is another indication of preparedness and understanding as well. What makes me think that a person who hasn't obtained the AR needed for a fractal is even ready to do the content? > Nothing. But then the same is true for having the required AR. > > Well to be fair.. not having the AR, means at the very least, they did not take the time to learn what they needed to be prepared for this content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > AR is another indication of preparedness and understanding as well. What makes me think that a person who hasn't obtained the AR needed for a fractal is even ready to do the content? > > Nothing. But then the same is true for having the required AR. > > > > > > Well to be fair.. not having the AR, means at the very least, they did not take the time to learn what they needed to be prepared for this content. No. It means they don't have AR. And only that. A person that has no AR and attempts t4's is likely unprepared for the content, that's true, but having the gear does not mean that their skill and knowledge of the content is any better. Conversely, a person that has the skill and knowledge but no AR is far better prepared for t4 - it's just you won't see it because they won't show up. The artificial gear barrier will hold them back. Just the mere fact of having or not having AR tells you nothing (or, at least nothing more than AP would have told you, and that "indication" has long been acknowledged to be mostly useless). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysticjedi.6053 Posted January 20, 2018 Author Share Posted January 20, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > AR is another indication of preparedness and understanding as well. What makes me think that a person who hasn't obtained the AR needed for a fractal is even ready to do the content? > > > Nothing. But then the same is true for having the required AR. > > > > > > > > > > Well to be fair.. not having the AR, means at the very least, they did not take the time to learn what they needed to be prepared for this content. > No. It means they don't have AR. And only that. > > A person that has no AR and attempts t4's is likely unprepared for the content, that's true, but having the gear does not mean that their skill and knowledge of the content is any better. Conversely, a person that has the skill and knowledge but no AR is far better prepared for t4 - it's just you won't see it because they won't show up. The artificial gear barrier will hold them back. Just the mere fact of having or not having AR tells you nothing (or, at least nothing more than AP would have told you, and that "indication" has long been acknowledged to be mostly useless). > > I agree. Maybe if AR was rewarded for being able to complete tasks it would then show experience and act as a gate. Rather then a gold sink. If it is so easy to get, as the supporters say, then it really doesn't stop noobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeolus.3615 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 > @"FrostDraco.8306" said: > > @"mazut.4296" said: > > Its artificial, I dislike. > > This whole game is artificial. That's not an argument. That is not a clever answer as well. There are game "built in dificulties" mechanics and theres artificial dificulties created to be simple due the lack of those decent mechanics or mechanics that can make a game harder. The aritificial difilcuties on many games end's on lack of mechanics to make life harder to play or to make the game pretending to be hard while at reality is not that harder than w/o it. It is a artificial dificulty since it is counterable by infusions, it is not the gameplay itself geting harder, just the agony ticks more.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 > @"Mysticjedi.6053" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > AR is another indication of preparedness and understanding as well. What makes me think that a person who hasn't obtained the AR needed for a fractal is even ready to do the content? > > > > Nothing. But then the same is true for having the required AR. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well to be fair.. not having the AR, means at the very least, they did not take the time to learn what they needed to be prepared for this content. > > No. It means they don't have AR. And only that. > > > > A person that has no AR and attempts t4's is likely unprepared for the content, that's true, but having the gear does not mean that their skill and knowledge of the content is any better. Conversely, a person that has the skill and knowledge but no AR is far better prepared for t4 - it's just you won't see it because they won't show up. The artificial gear barrier will hold them back. Just the mere fact of having or not having AR tells you nothing (or, at least nothing more than AP would have told you, and that "indication" has long been acknowledged to be mostly useless). > > > > > > I agree. Maybe if AR was rewarded for being able to complete tasks it would then show experience and act as a gate. Rather then a gold sink. > If it is so easy to get, as the supporters say, then it really doesn't stop noobs. Like how AR infusions drops in fractals... good idea! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysticjedi.6053 Posted January 20, 2018 Author Share Posted January 20, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Mysticjedi.6053" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > AR is another indication of preparedness and understanding as well. What makes me think that a person who hasn't obtained the AR needed for a fractal is even ready to do the content? > > > > > Nothing. But then the same is true for having the required AR. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well to be fair.. not having the AR, means at the very least, they did not take the time to learn what they needed to be prepared for this content. > > > No. It means they don't have AR. And only that. > > > > > > A person that has no AR and attempts t4's is likely unprepared for the content, that's true, but having the gear does not mean that their skill and knowledge of the content is any better. Conversely, a person that has the skill and knowledge but no AR is far better prepared for t4 - it's just you won't see it because they won't show up. The artificial gear barrier will hold them back. Just the mere fact of having or not having AR tells you nothing (or, at least nothing more than AP would have told you, and that "indication" has long been acknowledged to be mostly useless). > > > > > > > > > > I agree. Maybe if AR was rewarded for being able to complete tasks it would then show experience and act as a gate. Rather then a gold sink. > > If it is so easy to get, as the supporters say, then it really doesn't stop noobs. > > Like how AR infusions drops in fractals... good idea! Was actually thinking having them linked to achievements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 20, 2018 Share Posted January 20, 2018 > @"Mysticjedi.6053" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Mysticjedi.6053" said: > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > AR is another indication of preparedness and understanding as well. What makes me think that a person who hasn't obtained the AR needed for a fractal is even ready to do the content? > > > > > > Nothing. But then the same is true for having the required AR. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well to be fair.. not having the AR, means at the very least, they did not take the time to learn what they needed to be prepared for this content. > > > > No. It means they don't have AR. And only that. > > > > > > > > A person that has no AR and attempts t4's is likely unprepared for the content, that's true, but having the gear does not mean that their skill and knowledge of the content is any better. Conversely, a person that has the skill and knowledge but no AR is far better prepared for t4 - it's just you won't see it because they won't show up. The artificial gear barrier will hold them back. Just the mere fact of having or not having AR tells you nothing (or, at least nothing more than AP would have told you, and that "indication" has long been acknowledged to be mostly useless). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree. Maybe if AR was rewarded for being able to complete tasks it would then show experience and act as a gate. Rather then a gold sink. > > > If it is so easy to get, as the supporters say, then it really doesn't stop noobs. > > > > Like how AR infusions drops in fractals... good idea! > > Was actually thinking having them linked to achievements. Maybe have the +9/+5 linked to Fractal Achievements, so it's not such a huge grind.. that I could see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laila Lightness.8742 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 Ar along with asc is a gold sink so anet can encourage gems to gold conversions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 21, 2018 Share Posted January 21, 2018 > @"Laila Lightness.8742" said: > Ar along with asc is a gold sink so anet can encourage gems to gold conversions +11 AR for 15 gold, if you farm the infusions yourself, is not that much a bank killer, just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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