So what are necros supposed to be good at?

[obcan.1470]

> @"Dadnir.5038" said:

> > @"obcan.1470" said:

> > > @"Dadnir.5038" said:

> > > > @"obcan.1470" said:

> > > > > Obcan think highly of engineers and elementalists and poorly about any other profession. He got the misconception that these two professions are harder to play and thus more valuable than profession that he deem "easy". The reality is that as long as you play long enough with each and every professions, none of them are harder to play nor do they earn the right to be above other professions. The necromancer is just the easiest for him to hate because it's designed to be hated by other professions since it forcibly bring those professions down a notch with all it's boon hate and all it's outgoing conditions. Nobody like to see it's abilities crippled in PvP and sadly it's the only thing that the necromancer can do.

> > > >

> > > > No I certainly dont think poorly about other classes. I think poorly about Necro. Even warrior to me is at least 2x harder to play than necro.

> > > >

> > > > Also what is "as long as you play long enough with each and every professions, none of them are harder to play" supposed to mean? Am I supposed to pretend that me, wasting literally dozens of hours in training area learning elementalist dps combo, is something I should forget about once I can achieve at least 90% of what qtfy does? I tried necro. I spent 1 and half hour and I got 95% of what qtfy does. Or perhaps I should totaly forget about wrist pains I get trying to stay alive vs scourge in pvp. Cleansing every second because necro pressed one button.

> > > >

> > > > Necro is good class for bad players. Its easy to play, easy to learn, easy to hate.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Honestly what you do wrong is wasting your time playing against an immobile golem to learn a class. Help yourself fight with all profession, your like a schoolboy that never worked but think he know everything about every jobs. If you ever tried each professions you'd know all of their frustrating limitations and all their strength. It's obvious that you didn't.

> > >

> > > I've played steadily all professions since launch (well revenant appeared at hot he is an exception) and I can garantie you than absolutely none of the professions are harder to play. In the 1st year of core game the elementalist was almost doing everything in a group, be it damage, support or even tanking hit, you'd learn at this moment you'd never say it's hard. It's just a matter of whether or not you find your rythm. The only thing that the elementalist couldn't do was providing stealth by himself. It took me less than 3 dungeon run to learn the profession and find the rythm. 45 minutes. And I am not a great player by any mean.

> > >

> > > At that time the necromancer had no damage, no condi damage, no combo, it's field were more of an hindrance than anything and he had virtually no mobility. Even at that time you'd be lucky to find a group as a necromancer. In PvP it wasn't even good at anything.

> > >

> > > Then came _phallanx strength_ which simplified a lot the elementalist job. No seriously you think that the elementalist is hard to play and your not even using it to build might, fury, swiftness, heal and deal damage at the same time... Still, at that time the elementalist due to it's greater firepower even while doing the support thing was still prefered over a PS warrior in optimized group.

> > >

> > > The end of the elementalist era came with HoT. Oh it didn't became harder to play, no it's just the oposite, it became way easier to play again. Most of the elementalists took bad haits from the tempest, that's why you feel like it's harder to play than other profession. The player's skills have grown lazy.

> > >

> > > While all of this happen, you knw what the necromancer was doing? WvW. The only area where it's tools have a tiny bit of use. The necromancer is stuck in a niche were he corrupt boons. Yes it's not a novel thing, it's just that anet, over the years, piled up boon corruption over boon corruption on this poor thing that is the necromancer to strengthen a rotting niche whose only advantage is that it kitten of players that are overly dependant of boons.

> > >

> > > Is the necromancer easy or hard to play? Against an immobile target it's very easy yes, against a moving target that deal damage it's as hard as an elementalist to play. Against a sentient entity it's need a lot more wits because the necromancer is not a swift professions like other professions and that's where lie it's weakness.

> >

> > > @"Dadnir.5038" said:

> > > > @"obcan.1470" said:

> > > > > Obcan think highly of engineers and elementalists and poorly about any other profession. He got the misconception that these two professions are harder to play and thus more valuable than profession that he deem "easy". The reality is that as long as you play long enough with each and every professions, none of them are harder to play nor do they earn the right to be above other professions. The necromancer is just the easiest for him to hate because it's designed to be hated by other professions since it forcibly bring those professions down a notch with all it's boon hate and all it's outgoing conditions. Nobody like to see it's abilities crippled in PvP and sadly it's the only thing that the necromancer can do.

> > > >

> > > > No I certainly dont think poorly about other classes. I think poorly about Necro. Even warrior to me is at least 2x harder to play than necro.

> > > >

> > > > Also what is "as long as you play long enough with each and every professions, none of them are harder to play" supposed to mean? Am I supposed to pretend that me, wasting literally dozens of hours in training area learning elementalist dps combo, is something I should forget about once I can achieve at least 90% of what qtfy does? I tried necro. I spent 1 and half hour and I got 95% of what qtfy does. Or perhaps I should totaly forget about wrist pains I get trying to stay alive vs scourge in pvp. Cleansing every second because necro pressed one button.

> > > >

> > > > Necro is good class for bad players. Its easy to play, easy to learn, easy to hate.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Honestly what you do wrong is wasting your time playing against an immobile golem to learn a class. Help yourself fight with all profession, your like a schoolboy that never worked but think he know everything about every jobs. If you ever tried each professions you'd know all of their frustrating limitations and all their strength. It's obvious that you didn't.

> >

> > No, I played mostly 2 classes, engi and ele. I played Power PS long ago, I played condi PS when it was still okay, I also played and have fully geared druid and mesmer. All for PvE. I played power Daredevil, not cancerous 2 spamming condi, I played ranger before I started running meta. I have played power revenant when it was the most garbage class in roster and I enjoyed it. I played Reaper for whole month when HoT came out, and I am telling you. My friends who I did fractals with couldnt be more glad that I swapped to ele. Not because I was bad at necro (as if it was possible), there is simply so much you can do with class that was made tankier than all other classes, easier than all other classes. I know frustration of light classes, getting oneshot when others surive with half hp, I know limitations condi engi, doing mediocore dps with harderst rotation in the game. But I for sure dont know what kind of frustration you guys can have playing necro.

> >

> > > I've played steadily all professions since launch (well revenant appeared at hot he is an exception) and I can garantie you than absolutely none of the professions are harder to play. In the 1st year of core game the elementalist was almost doing everything in a group, be it damage, support or even tanking hit, you'd learn at this moment you'd never say it's hard. It's just a matter of whether or not you find your rythm. The only thing that the elementalist couldn't do was providing stealth by himself. It took me less than 3 dungeon run to learn the profession and find the rythm. 45 minutes. And I am not a great player by any mean.

> >

> > So according to you, my main should be necro because the rhytm you are talking about came to me on necro in 1/20th of the time in comparison to ele. Cool.

> >

> > > At that time the necromancer had no damage, no condi damage, no combo, it's field were more of an hindrance than anything and he had virtually no mobility. Even at that time you'd be lucky to find a group as a necromancer. In PvP it wasn't even good at anything.

> >

> > Necro, was made for soloing content. I dont understand why it is so hard to grasp for you. Every other class was obviously made for group content, guard protecting dps, mesmers and druid buffing dps. Have you ever tried to solo content with ele? With actual meta build? It sucks kitten. Have you tried it with heal druid? It sucks even more kitten. I could do solo content with necro with no armor. I was actually collecting petrified logs for my jewels, on necro, with only shoulderguards.

> >

> > > Then came _phallanx strength_ which simplified a lot the elementalist job. No seriously you think that the elementalist is hard to play and your not even using it to build might, fury, swiftness, heal and deal damage at the same time... Still, at that time the elementalist due to it's greater firepower even while doing the support thing was still prefered over a PS warrior in optimized group.

> >

> > I have played ele for 3 years now I think, and every time I saw other ele running celestial build to be this magical dps heal buffer carry you are talking about, he got kicked. Just like necro.

> >

> > > The end of the elementalist era came with HoT. Oh it didn't became harder to play, no it's just the oposite, it became way easier to play again. Most of the elementalists took bad haits from the tempest, that's why you feel like it's harder to play than other profession. The player's skills have grown lazy.

> >

> > Sc/Wh tempest was easy to play for you. Cool. You joined Snowcrows yet?

> >

> > > While all of this happen, you knw what the necromancer was doing? WvW. The only area where it's tools have a tiny bit of use. The necromancer is stuck in a niche were he corrupt boons. Yes it's not a novel thing, it's just that anet, over the years, piled up boon corruption over boon corruption on this poor thing that is the necromancer to strengthen a rotting niche whose only advantage is that it kitten of players that are overly dependant of boons.

> >

> > No, necros were running 4x necro + 1 druid fractals with 0 effort. I joined one such run as druid. Not only I wanted to kill myself out of boredom. They didnt even need me.

> >

> > > Is the necromancer easy or hard to play? Against an immobile target it's very easy yes, against a moving target that deal damage it's as hard as an elementalist to play.

> >

> > Againist moving target necro is as hard to play as ele. Maybe scourge, not reaper. I cant move my fire field or meteor shower over to the boss because he moves around during that phase. I have to remember when and where he will go. Every.Single.kitten.Raid.Or.Fractal.Boss . On reaper you have to walk to him. and for sake of argument im gona forget that necro has 2x less spells to cast during dps rotation than ele. Or that he has 2x more. Or that he has access to barrier or shroud. Or that he has access to reliable CC. Or that he is not overly dependant on alacrity and quickness.

> >

> > Against a sentient entity it's need a lot more wits because the necromancer is not a swift professions like other professions and that's where lie it's weakness.

> >

> > You mean in PvE? Where all bosses are locked up in arena? Or in PvE? Where you cant capture point, because shades are bigger than the points?

> >

> >

>

> Obcan, you are arguing for arguing here and you do not open yourself to other experiences.

 

Out of 15 characters I have 3 are eles, 2 are engis , 2 are guards , rest are 1 for each class. Out of all the time I have spent playing the game, mos time I have spent on ele second is Engi 3rd IS NECRO. I was more open to other experiences than SJW is open to new genders. So please, dont assume something you have no idea about.

 

It's obvious that you are deadset on your idea which is false. You see having more skills like having a harder time. The necromancer have more skills (numerically) than warriors, thiefs, guardians, mesmers (at least core and mirage) and rangers.

 

Idea of necro being easy class to play is not false. You have more hp than any other class - warrior, Any traitline gives you natural thoughness or any sort of defense, your spells are either lock on or have huge AoE, you have panic button other than evade - scourge(which still has barrier). My guild leader is raid elitist, and necro main. She played necro as long as I played ele and she never ever told me that learning ele for raids was as easy as necro. She also never told me that she considered eles rotation easy or comparable to necro. Only people who tell me that are necros who join raids, die first, deal least damage and even manage to say something stupid as, necro isnt tanky. Even ele is tankier.

 

> I never said that your main should be necro. I said that you had issue findind your rythm on elementalist and that it was due to the fact that you were accustomed to tempest while you never learned to use core elementalist properly.

 

I played core ele when tempest was a thing. I hated staff tempest more than anything. I uninstalled the game when they nerfed only interesting build Sc+Wh. Tempest is dumb. Also you say that it took me so long because I got used to tempest. Then why did it take me so short on necro? I havent played necro for over year.

 

> Necro was not made for soloing content. Before HoT you weren't even able to solo anything as a necromancer, it would have been a pipe dream. Best profession to solo content used to be warrior, and it's probably still the best. Elementalist meta solo build was just the fastest on some path, thiefs being superior on others.

 

Before HoT GW2 was about PvP and WvW not PvE. Necro was good in those all the time. After HoT necro can stack 25 might alone, have endless healing shroud , high dps, mobility, 100% crit chance with 0 precision.

 

> Tempest is easy to play. In it's history it even got the easiest elementalist build to play and this build was top dps. You just had to mash your skills and stay in fire attunment. As for any scepter power build, no they are not hard to play. You are honestly lacking and this profession isn't meant for you if you think that.

 

So you are actually saying that scepter warhorn tempest is easy to play. I didnt think you could be this dumb. Not only 37k top dps benchmark was achieved by cheesing first lightning overload, you also had to hit your warhorn fire 5 at exact distance of 300 units with + - 30 units to spare. Do you have any idea how hard it is to place your spell like that? Of course you dont because you think that scepter / wh could just spam spells in fire.

 

> Necro 4 minion builld and druid were a meme comp. It only happened because anet thought it was a good idea to design some PvE content around what they want the necromancer to do: counter boons. If they hadn't given a boon corruption at the last hit of the scepter chain auto and high level fractal mob hadn't so much toughness that only condi build could pass throught easily, you'd never have seen this meme live in GW2. No, nobody would ever have tried to play necro in fractal.

 

Then how did I get into group of 4 necros? I certainly dont have enough friends who wish to play necros.

 

> Be it in PvE or PvP, the necromancer is slow nonetheless. Slow in it's movement, slow in it's defense and slow in it's offense.

 

Except they had to add 0.5 second delay on his spells because he was, too slow? Except he has dash on on reaper. Except he has ranged cripple for days.

 

> What make me laugh is that you actually seem believe yourself when you say that elementalist is a hard profession to play. I'll give you a tip, stop pushing yourself to try and be and optimal elementalist dps player. Take a break and use your elementalist to have a bit of fun. Doing huge damage throught a rigorous rotation may be satisfying but it's not fun. You never learned to play correctly elementalist, you've just learnt to stick to kitten other do, at this rate you'll never grow and really understand this profession. Like you will never understand the necromancer's issues.

 

Im done with arguing with you. Necro mains are delusional. What do you mean playing elementalist correctly? You mean celestial heal dps build in fractals? Do you even understand concept of competetiveness? Also if you think I only play ele for dps. Why do I play him in pvp? Because in pvp ele for sure isnt dps.

 

[Agrippa Oculus.3726]

> @"obcan.1470" said:

> PvE was not ruined. You still have reaper that still does 30k dps and nothing changed about that.

Lol, this is just [wrong](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHaT4_su3NM) on [so](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3WYtr8H8Mw) many [levels](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Alacrity).

Therefore I'm not going to feed this troll! And no-one should!

For everyone else, check benchmarks and real statistics, it clearly states that the Necro is the worst class BY FAR in so many ways! It _already_ was in raids and T4 fractals, now it officially has hit rock bottom. I.e. the second worst dps class would probably be the Renegade which will hit about 32K, or maybe still (the buffed) Deadeye with also [32K](

) DPS. It's still at least 10% more than our DPS. Let's just not talk about the DPS gap between us Necros and what the Weaver is capable of; hint: still around [47K-ish](

)

All this, not a problem in the world, if and only if we are absolute top in another _important_ area: Say healing, utility, support, maybe even CC .... No ... we're mediocre at best in these areas, but most of the time: bottom-tier there as well! There's ABSOLUTELY nothing we excel at! And don't come with boon corruption or cleave, I'm talking about **useful** areas in endgame PvE. Because I'm really getting fed up about this, proving SO many times that you CAN split PvE from PvP and WvW, even stating it in the pre-posts of this particular balance patch, they just happen to forget to do it with the Necro ....

Absolutely a joke!

[Dadnir.5038]

> @"obcan.1470" said:

> Im done with arguing with you. Necro mains are delusional. What do you mean playing elementalist correctly? You mean celestial heal dps build in fractals? Do you even understand concept of competetiveness? Also if you think I only play ele for dps. Why do I play him in pvp? Because in pvp ele for sure isnt dps.

>

 

lol, you even assume that I am necro main. My first and favourite character is and will always be my mesmer. The reason that I'm more implicated in the necromancer's subforum is because I feel and know that the necromancer is probably the profession that need the most work in this game since launch. Just behind him come the ranger's pets.

 

You are sending this celestial thing whenever you want... Learn to play in an environment where you don't need to be competitive before trying to be competitive, that's what I meant. Obviously you don't want to learn the bases and just want to follow like a sheep the steps of others. That's what make you think falsely that necromancer is easier to play than elementalist. More skill don't mean better or harder. Despite what you think the necromancer is only short 5 skills in front of an elementalist, If a necromancer take lich form (as awfull as this transform skill can be, the necromancer have the exact same amont of skills than an elementalist.

 

You got issue with surviving as an elementalist. The necromancer's defense is just health point, while an elementalist have vigor, block, dodge on skill, invulnerability, load of sustain, protection movement skills and can still gear a bit of vitality. An elementalist that gear for survivability is unkillable and unkillable mean that you can hold a point in this PvP that is so important in your eyes. To be honest an elementalist who build for survivability can even just ignore a scourge.

 

The only real issue of the elementalist in PvP and thus since launch is that it struggle in glassy builds and this is frustrating for elementalists. The reason being that the elementalist need to spend time in PvP to survive which reduce the windows of opportunity for burst.

 

Since launch the necromancer have never been meta in PvE. Always despised and rejected. Since launch the elementalist have always been meta in PvE. Always sought out and praised. Obviously there were a few short lived exceptions but that's the naked truth.

 

Since launch the necromancer have been a roller coaster in PvP but on thing was sure the necromancer has always been the easy target to kill. The one that won't be able to flee and that you can easily counter. Scourge end up being oppressive, yes, but that doesn't mean that it wasn't something that you couldn't counter. Yes the necromancer have been meta in PvP, but did you even wonder why? Was it because it was good? No, the only reason the necromancer was meta was because it hard counter the boon meta and is the only one to do it.

 

The elementalist in PvP on it's side hovered between builds with huge sustain and nerf to these builds. Elementalists have dominated PvP as a meta profession for a long time in HoT. The only rant you can have about the elementalist in this game mode is that it's hard to hop out of the meta build and it hurt build diversity. It's hard for an elementalist to give up on it's sustain traitlines and thus it's hard to play a burst spec.

 

In WvW, ele as been meta the same way than necro has been meta since launch. We even had this slang to easily remember: GWEN (guardian, warrior, elementalist, necromancer).

 

And one last thing, I understand the meaning of competitiveness. That's why I can say that the elementalist is competitive and have always been while the necromancer isn't. The necromancer exist in PvP and WvW for a simple and single purpose and gimmick: Boon corruption. Does it make him competitive? No. Does it make him oppressive against a boon meta that player don't want to part with? Yes. Do that make necro player "bad" or "noob"? No.

 

The elementalist is not harder to play, he got it's own in built survivability mechanisms that are as good as the shroud as defensive mechanisms. The way you use them make you either a good player or a bad player.

[Axl.8924]

Eles have insane survivaiblity though.I mean you can change to earth get insta burst of stab and defensives then go out throw lightning bolts.Even then you have multiple ways to get a dash of speed.

 

If your dying:You got so many options too:

Go to water heal up with your multiple abilities under tempest, or use that one ability you have to heal yourself to full.Plus:I found out that glyph of water is suggested and it helps a lot with conditions duration reduction.

[ZeftheWicked.3076]

> @"ChenChilla.4652" said:

> maybe necro **nerfs** are coming next patch

 

FTFY.

[ZDragon.3046]

> @"Dadnir.5038" said:

> > @"obcan.1470" said:

> > Im done with arguing with you. Necro mains are delusional. What do you mean playing elementalist correctly? You mean celestial heal dps build in fractals? Do you even understand concept of competetiveness? Also if you think I only play ele for dps. Why do I play him in pvp? Because in pvp ele for sure isnt dps.

> >

>

> lol, you even assume that I am necro main. My first and favourite character is and will always be my mesmer. The reason that I'm more implicated in the necromancer's subforum is because I feel and know that the necromancer is probably the profession that need the most work in this game since launch. Just behind him come the ranger's pets.

>

> You are sending this celestial thing whenever you want... Learn to play in an environment where you don't need to be competitive before trying to be competitive, that's what I meant. Obviously you don't want to learn the bases and just want to follow like a sheep the steps of others. That's what make you think falsely that necromancer is easier to play than elementalist. More skill don't mean better or harder. Despite what you think the necromancer is only short 5 skills in front of an elementalist, If a necromancer take lich form (as awfull as this transform skill can be, the necromancer have the exact same amont of skills than an elementalist.

>

> You got issue with surviving as an elementalist. The necromancer's defense is just health point, while an elementalist have vigor, block, dodge on skill, invulnerability, load of sustain, protection movement skills and can still gear a bit of vitality. An elementalist that gear for survivability is unkillable and unkillable mean that you can hold a point in this PvP that is so important in your eyes. To be honest an elementalist who build for survivability can even just ignore a scourge.

>

> The only real issue of the elementalist in PvP and thus since launch is that it struggle in glassy builds and this is frustrating for elementalists. The reason being that the elementalist need to spend time in PvP to survive which reduce the windows of opportunity for burst.

>

> Since launch the necromancer have never been meta in PvE. Always despised and rejected. Since launch the elementalist have always been meta in PvE. Always sought out and praised. Obviously there were a few short lived exceptions but that's the naked truth.

>

> Since launch the necromancer have been a roller coaster in PvP but on thing was sure the necromancer has always been the easy target to kill. The one that won't be able to flee and that you can easily counter. Scourge end up being oppressive, yes, but that doesn't mean that it wasn't something that you couldn't counter. Yes the necromancer have been meta in PvP, but did you even wonder why? Was it because it was good? No, the only reason the necromancer was meta was because it hard counter the boon meta and is the only one to do it.

>

> The elementalist in PvP on it's side hovered between builds with huge sustain and nerf to these builds. Elementalists have dominated PvP as a meta profession for a long time in HoT. The only rant you can have about the elementalist in this game mode is that it's hard to hop out of the meta build and it hurt build diversity. It's hard for an elementalist to give up on it's sustain traitlines and thus it's hard to play a burst spec.

>

> In WvW, ele as been meta the same way than necro has been meta since launch. We even had this slang to easily remember: GWEN (guardian, warrior, elementalist, necromancer).

>

> And one last thing, I understand the meaning of competitiveness. That's why I can say that the elementalist is competitive and have always been while the necromancer isn't. The necromancer exist in PvP and WvW for a simple and single purpose and gimmick: Boon corruption. Does it make him competitive? No. Does it make him oppressive against a boon meta that player don't want to part with? Yes. Do that make necro player "bad" or "noob"? No.

>

> The elementalist is not harder to play, he got it's own in built survivability mechanisms that are as good as the shroud as defensive mechanisms. The way you use them make you either a good player or a bad player.

 

Lets be real ele tools and necro tools are far from the same in = utility and defensive strength. Simply having more hp is no real sub. for hard blocks, a source of true stability, good regeneration and many more evades (accounting weaver, and base ele with such easy access to vigor or even invulnerability! All of which ele have twice or more times over. Its always ALWAYS going to be better to avoid damage than soak damage taken or reduce damage taken. Currently necro has no real tools that allow them to truely avoid damage taken. I dont count shroud because in many situations it can easily be bursted through honestly core shroud works is really just the first iteration of what we now know as the barrier mechanic.

Shroud may be used as a damage reduction tool but its certainly no obsidian flesh, mist form, etc.

[Anchoku.8142]

Necro's are supposed to be good at downed state. The buff in 2013(?) ensured that by giving Necro's competitive downed state health instead of a reduced amount compared to other professions.

[Vlad Morbius.1759]

> @"Dragoth.7153" said:

> Warrior: Multiweapon class with decent dps, strong and unique support (boons and banners, hp and heavy armor.

> Berserker: Condi variant of warrior, with great condi dps and bursty feel.

> Spellbreaker: PvP focused "disabler" that really feels good.

>

> Elementalist: Best DPS class with tons of skills and strong and unique support (boons and auras)

> Tempest: Support/dps/healer with even better acces to auras.

> Weaver: Fun to play mage class with ability to combine element. Greatest dps in game.

>

> Revenant: Recently fixed multi-role warrior. Support/Healer and both condi and power DPS

> Herald: Unique boon support mechanic, great as power dps too. Accest to tons of boons.

> Renegade: Support/Condi DPS. Can be anything with really good efficency.

>

> Guardian: Supportive paladin. Good DPS, Aegis mechanic, can carry newbs.

> Dragonhunter: Amazing DPS/Trapper with great power. Very good in endgame pve and pvp.

> Firebrand: Similar to renegade, it can be both support and dps. OP in PvP.

>

> Ranger: Fun pet user class with great versatility. Unique boons(spirits), good power and condi dps.

> Druid: Best healer+support class in game, now probably similar to healing renegade/venatari. Acces to spirits makes him auto-included in endgame pve.

> Soulbeast: Very strong condi dps with some supportive abilities as well.

>

> Mesmer: Illusionist mage with mobility skills. Mass invisibility and portals anyone? Class mechanic great in pvp.

> Chronomancer: So far best tank in game with very needed aclarity+quickness+aegis combo, makes him auto-included in endgame pve.

> Mirage: Strong DPS and great "feel" of class.

>

> Engineer: Versatile gadget user. Can be realy anything

> Scraper: Now reworked, a tank with access to great party supportive/healing skills. Great in PvP.

> Holosmith: Amazing dps, fun to play, feels a bit easier than core engi.

>

> Thief: Hit and Run dps with a lot of invisibility skills and amazing mobility

> Daredevil: Meele dps with enhanced evasion. Great as condi

> Deadeye: Ranged focused power dps with some supportive abilities. Now boosted to be really good.

>

> Necromancer: Outperformed in every way by other classes: Low dps, almost zero support. Necromancer-themed minions are just bad.

> Reaper: This class was never explained how should actually work. Promised as power dps, was a condi solo dps for years. Now its just a bad and slow power dps.

> Scourge: Target for all nerfs. Supposed to be support but its so bad that i lack words to describe it. Doesn't deal dmg too.

>

>

> B**andaid fixes:**

> Core necro: Enhance all corruption skills to be twice as effective. Other classes have access to stronger condi utilites and our corruptions deals dmg to ourself and are worse in most cases. They should be enchanced by 200% minimum.

> Rework Minions. Make F2-F5 skills that will enhance their skills/heal them using our life force.

> Add a minion, pernament or summonable with Life Force.

>

> Reaper: If its meant to be power dps it should get higher numbers than Deadeye now. Ranged weapons always meant to deal less dmg than meele, because its harder to get to the enemy sometimes. Plus necro is really immobile, thus all reaper skills should be greatly enchanced. If Deadeye with suboptimal rotation can deal 31dps then reaper should do 34 minimum. Whats more, reaper should deal even more than meele thief because thief has superior mobility, allowing to close gaps,teleport to and from enemies and such. Reaper is a sitting duck so if he somehow gets to enemy, he should smash.

>

> Scourge: Here. We have support/condi dps elites in form of Renegade and Firebrand. We have pure condi in form of Soulbeast and Mirage. We have full support in form of Cronomancer and Druid. Few exaplmes how to fix scourge:

>

> - If it should be support/condi then dps should be equal to firebrand and mirage at their best. Supportive skills should generate full stacks of at least 4 different boons. On top of it, there should be 1-2 unique boons, synergised with Scourge. Boosting Vampiric Presence and scaling it with power does not help at all.

> - If it meant to be pure support, then barrier generation should get some necro-unique enchancements. Make barrier convert to HP after decay (or 50% of it, 75% when traited?). Make insta-kill raidboss skills deal 100% HP dmg, thus making barrier the way to survive them. Killing gorseval is easy with dps, surviving world eater with necro barrier could be funnier than button-mashing. Remove dps-increase traits. Give unique boons instead. Make Shade skills a god-tier in condi management. Rework F5, give us ability to channel our Life Force for permanent barrier party-wide. On top of that, scourge should generate might, fury, quickness, protection, renegeration and vigor. Replace elite skill with non-dmg support skill. Bring back condi removal in PvE.

> - If devs could remember what they once said... (necro cant get dps because shroud give too much survivability...) scrap all that support kittens out of this class and make it pure condi dps. Scourge doesn't have shroud anymore so it should be able to deal dps equal to that of other condi dps (or even more, because it feels like necro should be condi-god).

>

> **FOR THE KITTEN SAKE, MAKE US GOOD IN AT LEAST ONE THING, MAKE THIS CLASS UNIQUE IN SOME WAY, I CAN SACRIFICE SHROUD SURVIVABILITY, HP POOL AND EPIDEMIC SKILL IN FAVOR OF BEING COMPARABLE TO OTHER CLASSES IN ENDGAME PVE. OR LOWER ALL DPS CHECKS ON RAIDBOSSES, FRACTAL BOSSES, WORLD BOSSES AND STORY BOSSES. INSTEAD REQUIRING 30KDPS FROM MOST OF THE PARTY, MAKE IT 10K. REMOVE FIGHT TIMERS. CHANGE THE GAME SO EVERYONE CAN HAVE FUN, NOT ONLY CHRONO+DRUID+DPS COMBO. AND SPLIT SKILLS BETWEEN PVP AND PVE.**

>

> I main necro for more than 5 years now. I dropped the game soon after i realised that my class is unwanted and instakicked from dungeons back in core game. I came back because reaper was promising. Dropped game again because it was nerfed hard in PvE (because of pvp/wvw players complains) useless in team pve content. A class witn no identity, power dps being better as condi and only when alone. Came back again to see that promised support-condi dps scourge only to be hit by nerfs soon after release (because of PvP/wvw players complains). And again and again. And once more. Scourge barely alive? Let's nerf MORE! It still moves? NERF!!! Old forgotten Scraper was reworked, necro dropped from trash tier to kitten tier. Time to leave the game, waiting for another elite class promise. To see how fun it will be in exp3 beta and how hard it will be nerfed soon after in PvE (because of PvP and WvW players complains).

>

 

This is so spot on and i cannot for the life of me understand how management at Anet allows this to go on and on and on! I keep holding out hope that somebody there actually has the intestinal fortitude and takes the moral high-ground and actually attempts to push for the fixes this class deserves more than any other class in the game. We have been directionless and any good we bring quickly gets nerfed, every new elite build bring core Necro further down the hole now to the point that scourge is only barely viable in certain niche areas. Power builds are horrible despite the many promises to fix them and certainly some have been tweaked but every fix sent our way has some damned hitch to it, like forcing you down an entire trait-line for one decent trait, or allowing us one viable weapon without a decent offhand, hell even horrible long range weapons.

In 27 years of playing MMO's I've never seen one class so brutally botched patch after patch and year after year it's disgraceful.

[UnDeadFun.5824]

> @"Vlad Morbius.1759" said:

> > @"Dragoth.7153" said:

> > Warrior: Multiweapon class with decent dps, strong and unique support (boons and banners, hp and heavy armor.

> > Berserker: Condi variant of warrior, with great condi dps and bursty feel.

> > Spellbreaker: PvP focused "disabler" that really feels good.

> >

> > Elementalist: Best DPS class with tons of skills and strong and unique support (boons and auras)

> > Tempest: Support/dps/healer with even better acces to auras.

> > Weaver: Fun to play mage class with ability to combine element. Greatest dps in game.

> >

> > Revenant: Recently fixed multi-role warrior. Support/Healer and both condi and power DPS

> > Herald: Unique boon support mechanic, great as power dps too. Accest to tons of boons.

> > Renegade: Support/Condi DPS. Can be anything with really good efficency.

> >

> > Guardian: Supportive paladin. Good DPS, Aegis mechanic, can carry newbs.

> > Dragonhunter: Amazing DPS/Trapper with great power. Very good in endgame pve and pvp.

> > Firebrand: Similar to renegade, it can be both support and dps. OP in PvP.

> >

> > Ranger: Fun pet user class with great versatility. Unique boons(spirits), good power and condi dps.

> > Druid: Best healer+support class in game, now probably similar to healing renegade/venatari. Acces to spirits makes him auto-included in endgame pve.

> > Soulbeast: Very strong condi dps with some supportive abilities as well.

> >

> > Mesmer: Illusionist mage with mobility skills. Mass invisibility and portals anyone? Class mechanic great in pvp.

> > Chronomancer: So far best tank in game with very needed aclarity+quickness+aegis combo, makes him auto-included in endgame pve.

> > Mirage: Strong DPS and great "feel" of class.

> >

> > Engineer: Versatile gadget user. Can be realy anything

> > Scraper: Now reworked, a tank with access to great party supportive/healing skills. Great in PvP.

> > Holosmith: Amazing dps, fun to play, feels a bit easier than core engi.

> >

> > Thief: Hit and Run dps with a lot of invisibility skills and amazing mobility

> > Daredevil: Meele dps with enhanced evasion. Great as condi

> > Deadeye: Ranged focused power dps with some supportive abilities. Now boosted to be really good.

> >

> > Necromancer: Outperformed in every way by other classes: Low dps, almost zero support. Necromancer-themed minions are just bad.

> > Reaper: This class was never explained how should actually work. Promised as power dps, was a condi solo dps for years. Now its just a bad and slow power dps.

> > Scourge: Target for all nerfs. Supposed to be support but its so bad that i lack words to describe it. Doesn't deal dmg too.

> >

> >

> > B**andaid fixes:**

> > Core necro: Enhance all corruption skills to be twice as effective. Other classes have access to stronger condi utilites and our corruptions deals dmg to ourself and are worse in most cases. They should be enchanced by 200% minimum.

> > Rework Minions. Make F2-F5 skills that will enhance their skills/heal them using our life force.

> > Add a minion, pernament or summonable with Life Force.

> >

> > Reaper: If its meant to be power dps it should get higher numbers than Deadeye now. Ranged weapons always meant to deal less dmg than meele, because its harder to get to the enemy sometimes. Plus necro is really immobile, thus all reaper skills should be greatly enchanced. If Deadeye with suboptimal rotation can deal 31dps then reaper should do 34 minimum. Whats more, reaper should deal even more than meele thief because thief has superior mobility, allowing to close gaps,teleport to and from enemies and such. Reaper is a sitting duck so if he somehow gets to enemy, he should smash.

> >

> > Scourge: Here. We have support/condi dps elites in form of Renegade and Firebrand. We have pure condi in form of Soulbeast and Mirage. We have full support in form of Cronomancer and Druid. Few exaplmes how to fix scourge:

> >

> > - If it should be support/condi then dps should be equal to firebrand and mirage at their best. Supportive skills should generate full stacks of at least 4 different boons. On top of it, there should be 1-2 unique boons, synergised with Scourge. Boosting Vampiric Presence and scaling it with power does not help at all.

> > - If it meant to be pure support, then barrier generation should get some necro-unique enchancements. Make barrier convert to HP after decay (or 50% of it, 75% when traited?). Make insta-kill raidboss skills deal 100% HP dmg, thus making barrier the way to survive them. Killing gorseval is easy with dps, surviving world eater with necro barrier could be funnier than button-mashing. Remove dps-increase traits. Give unique boons instead. Make Shade skills a god-tier in condi management. Rework F5, give us ability to channel our Life Force for permanent barrier party-wide. On top of that, scourge should generate might, fury, quickness, protection, renegeration and vigor. Replace elite skill with non-dmg support skill. Bring back condi removal in PvE.

> > - If devs could remember what they once said... (necro cant get dps because shroud give too much survivability...) scrap all that support kittens out of this class and make it pure condi dps. Scourge doesn't have shroud anymore so it should be able to deal dps equal to that of other condi dps (or even more, because it feels like necro should be condi-god).

> >

> > **FOR THE KITTEN SAKE, MAKE US GOOD IN AT LEAST ONE THING, MAKE THIS CLASS UNIQUE IN SOME WAY, I CAN SACRIFICE SHROUD SURVIVABILITY, HP POOL AND EPIDEMIC SKILL IN FAVOR OF BEING COMPARABLE TO OTHER CLASSES IN ENDGAME PVE. OR LOWER ALL DPS CHECKS ON RAIDBOSSES, FRACTAL BOSSES, WORLD BOSSES AND STORY BOSSES. INSTEAD REQUIRING 30KDPS FROM MOST OF THE PARTY, MAKE IT 10K. REMOVE FIGHT TIMERS. CHANGE THE GAME SO EVERYONE CAN HAVE FUN, NOT ONLY CHRONO+DRUID+DPS COMBO. AND SPLIT SKILLS BETWEEN PVP AND PVE.**

> >

> > I main necro for more than 5 years now. I dropped the game soon after i realised that my class is unwanted and instakicked from dungeons back in core game. I came back because reaper was promising. Dropped game again because it was nerfed hard in PvE (because of pvp/wvw players complains) useless in team pve content. A class witn no identity, power dps being better as condi and only when alone. Came back again to see that promised support-condi dps scourge only to be hit by nerfs soon after release (because of PvP/wvw players complains). And again and again. And once more. Scourge barely alive? Let's nerf MORE! It still moves? NERF!!! Old forgotten Scraper was reworked, necro dropped from trash tier to kitten tier. Time to leave the game, waiting for another elite class promise. To see how fun it will be in exp3 beta and how hard it will be nerfed soon after in PvE (because of PvP and WvW players complains).

> >

>

> This is so spot on and i cannot for the life of me understand how management at Anet allows this to go on and on and on! I keep holding out hope that somebody there actually has the intestinal fortitude and takes the moral high-ground and actually attempts to push for the fixes this class deserves more than any other class in the game. We have been directionless and any good we bring quickly gets nerfed, every new elite build bring core Necro further down the hole now to the point that scourge is only barely viable in certain niche areas. Power builds are horrible despite the many promises to fix them and certainly some have been tweaked but every fix sent our way has some damned hitch to it, like forcing you down an entire trait-line for one decent trait, or allowing us one viable weapon without a decent offhand, hell even horrible long range weapons.

> In 27 years of playing MMO's I've never seen one class so brutally botched patch after patch and year after year it's disgraceful.

 

This has to change, please listen to your playerbase Anet. We need help for the Necromancer Profession! 5 years of abuse is enough. Please give us competitive dps, support or utility.

Gaile Gray.6029, Robert Gee.9246

[BobMctavish.7249]

for some reason, when we run in zergs in wvw, it's always the necros who die first, they might as well wear red shirts from starfleet