Demented Sheep.1642 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > Not ALL are victims no, and how much is personal responsibility is arguable but you can't deny the physiological effect of loot boxes and gambling or that this is what game companies are attempting to do tactics like this. It is very very well documented. > > > > But you are not arguing the ethics of lootboxes, you are arguing the price of mount skin licenses. This is disingenuous. > having more than one point is "disingenuous" now? Besides, I only bought up because we talking about why this practice exists in the first place. > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > People who otherwise would be buying things not buying things and being unhappy with state of the game affects Anet. Of course I'm asking for them to "give me what I (and other who agree with me as I'm far from the only one who hates RNG) would want". The hell do you think customer feedback is? If they sold the skins individual at 800 gems I would buy some of them, as it is I'm not going to touch the licencees or any other RNG skin boxes again. > > Because giving you what you want has ramifications on others' purchases. Not that I feel it matters on this subject, but there are ways to convey what you want but compromise for something close. So a "Of course I'm asking for what I want" still seems like a short-sighted selfish response to what could be a reasoned discussion. How is me saying I don't like RNG mount skins affecting other purchases exactly? Did I say they had to remove that option even if is a rip off? Having resonantly priced non RNG ones (not overly extravagant 2000 gem ones, at that price I might as well buy another game) would be good enough for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larenc.1269 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 There is nothing wrong with RNG. Seems people who lose it all or those that havn't saved enough complain about it. No one is forcing anyone to buy anything. If the idiotic members of our population would understand this the world would be so much better. Addiction is an excuse that people come up with to justify their problems handling situations that are pretty freak-en obvious. RNG is a major part of EVERY game that has ever been made. Personally I consider gw2 a High end game that has no subscription. pc/ps/xbox games are roughly 70$ Each. Some with Subscriptions. People could invest in a game that will be around for years, Or buy a 70$ game that will last 3hours on average [from personal experience] Its up to the consumer to determine if they wish to invest in a game or buy a new one. No one is holding their hand and making them. Personally I don't mind Investing money into a wonderful game that i've played sense 2005.[ie. The original guild wars was released back then.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felipe.1807 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Abakk.9176" said: > A few moments ago i decided to spend some money on a mount skin and i quickly found out you have to drop cash in a slotmachine and hope to get something decent. > > I wasn't too thrilled about that idea but decided to go on with it anyway. I mean, how bad can it be right? > The cringe was real when the fugly pink bunny skin hit me right between the eyes. I may have even lost conciousness there for a sec... :astonished: > My own stupid fault for only looking and thinking about Raptors of course. :) > > So, i learned my lesson and suffice it to say that was the first and last mount skin i ever bought from the store. I would have bought a few nice skins over time but not now, not like this. > > Maybe i missed a better way to get a nice (choiced) mount skin for my Raptor... if so i'd really like to know and apologise for misunderstanding. I missed a few months so i guess its possible. > > If not...good luck with the Ugly Bunny ~~gambling system~~ Russian Roulette. Honestly, i refuse to spend 400gems on something that might give me just what should be unlocked on the first place(dye channels)...also, most of the RNG mounts dont look good anyway, dont get it what people see on that celestial or whatever is the name of that Griffon skin... I think they should introduce ways to get then like the 2000gems ones... The most common ones, that only offer you the dye channels could be like 200gems, other ones that just have a little rework done(honestly all these mounts looks like Anet spend like 30min on each lol) could be 400gems, the super flashy and cancerous like the celestial griffon could be 1000gems...not sure how this would affect Anet, but I guess most players would be more than happy with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigaseye.2047 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Leo G.4501" said: > If you really are grown-up, you'd know that growing up requires sacrifices and compromises. And just because you want something doesn't actually mean you want that thing. Having aimed for various goals and achieved them, it wasn't the goals that I actually wanted, but what came from attaining those goals. The same can be said for various prizes in games. Yes, I really am a grown-up. That is why I know that, unless you have infinite amounts of money, when you buy something (especially in a game!) it really ought to be something you find truly useful and/or beautiful (or attractive in some other way). I don't have too much of a problem with it being a random selection of mount skins, myself; but, that only works if the person likes, say, at least half of them. Otherwise, the odds of getting something you will use are going to be terrible. Simple as that, really. > @"Leo G.4501" said:But nice try with your immature jab at other people's maturity. It's backfired on you tremendously. I don't think it has, Leo. If you hadn't been so unnecessarily rude and condescending to the OP and so very young-sounding with your idea that his/her tastes will probably just change overnight, I would have had no reason to assume you probably weren't an adult (or were only just an adult, maybe), would I? If you are an adult, yourself (especially if you are over 25), you have even less excuse for talking to the OP in that way, by the way. At the end of the day, this is just a games forum and we are discussing a game. So, there is no need to be rude to people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobMonty.3719 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Should be outlawed per its a form of internet gambling, just like ecto gambling, its internet gambling... it should be illegal.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tekoneiric.6817 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 This is still a sore point with me and I haven't paid cash for a gem card since they started this. I have converted some gold to get a very few items. I bought one license when it was first released before it sank in that it was RNG and I ended up with the griffon skin that looks almost entirely like the default skin but with 4 dye channels. Basically I paid 400 gems to get 4 dye channels on one mount. One of the few items I bought was the Wintersday mount dye set which was a full set without any RNG. Aside from needing more bag space on a few characters and bank/crafting storage which I'm maxed out on; I really don't see much worth it. I thought about getting the home instance garden but didn't really see the point. If they bring out a player homestead or DW guild hall option I doubt the home instance items will transfer so I'd just rather save my gold. Selling the home instance garden to me is like how they sold mount like glider skins and travel toys knowing full well they had mounts in development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo G.4501 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > > Not ALL are victims no, and how much is personal responsibility is arguable but you can't deny the physiological effect of loot boxes and gambling or that this is what game companies are attempting to do tactics like this. It is very very well documented. > > > > > > > But you are not arguing the ethics of lootboxes, you are arguing the price of mount skin licenses. This is disingenuous. > > > having more than one point is "disingenuous" now? Besides, I only bought up because we talking about why this practice exists in the first place. > It's disingenuous because if you are speaking against the ethics of lootboxes, you must differentiate the differences between how Black Lion chests and Mount Adoption Licenses work to make a decisive and logical point. Conflating the two *IS* disingenuous. > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > > People who otherwise would be buying things not buying things and being unhappy with state of the game affects Anet. Of course I'm asking for them to "give me what I (and other who agree with me as I'm far from the only one who hates RNG) would want". The hell do you think customer feedback is? If they sold the skins individual at 800 gems I would buy some of them, as it is I'm not going to touch the licencees or any other RNG skin boxes again. > > > > Because giving you what you want has ramifications on others' purchases. Not that I feel it matters on this subject, but there are ways to convey what you want but compromise for something close. So a "Of course I'm asking for what I want" still seems like a short-sighted selfish response to what could be a reasoned discussion. > How is me saying I don't like RNG mount skins affecting other purchases exactly? Did I say they had to remove that option even if is a rip off? Having resonantly priced non RNG ones (not overly extravagant 2000 gem ones, at that price I might as well buy another game) would be good enough for me. > > I have no issue suggesting the release of a standard multi-color channel mount skins available to choose or even earn in-game. If that is what you're suggesting, I'm in agreement. That's different from asking to just draw the skins you want from the License pool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirPuddlesworth.6783 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Abakk.9176" said: > A few moments ago i decided to spend some money on a mount skin and i quickly found out you have to drop cash in a slotmachine and hope to get something decent. > > I wasn't too thrilled about that idea but decided to go on with it anyway. I mean, how bad can it be right? > The cringe was real when the fugly pink bunny skin hit me right between the eyes. I may have even lost conciousness there for a sec... :astonished: > My own stupid fault for only looking and thinking about Raptors of course. :) > > So, i learned my lesson and suffice it to say that was the first and last mount skin i ever bought from the store. I would have bought a few nice skins over time but not now, not like this. > > Maybe i missed a better way to get a nice (choiced) mount skin for my Raptor... if so i'd really like to know and apologise for misunderstanding. I missed a few months so i guess its possible. > > If not...good luck with the Ugly Bunny ~~gambling system~~ Russian Roulette. I love this post. Thumbs up simply for the title "random slap in the face" got me good. Gl, really hope this becomes a thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigaseye.2047 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Leo G.4501" said: For one, the options you don't want =/= looking bad. I totally agree. You are totally right there. Different people like different things. Which is probably, at least partly, why many people would prefer to just be able to buy the thing(s) they really want. Because we are all different. These random skins suit very visually open-minded people, with varied tastes. For them, this gambling approach is a bargain, quite frankly and so, I can understand how they would not want this option taken away and replaced with a choice of (higher priced) skins. On the other hand, random skins clearly don't suit people who have a far more defined sense of what they like/don't like. Just as a skin you don't like isn't, necessarily, a bad skin, not wanting to pay to end up owning all/most random skins is not, necessarily, better or worse than wanting (or being happy) to pay to own all/most of them. Just different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigaseye.2047 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 The issue is not the dissent, Leo. Although, quite why you feel the need to spend your time on here (rudely!) fielding Anet's customer complaints/suggestions is anyone's guess, quite frankly... I really hope you don't work for them?! The issue is using terms like "clutching your pearls" and twisting someone's words into "mah faverite mount", rather than just being polite and quoting them directly. Fortunately, the OP appears to have taken it all in his stride; but, it is not behaviour normally conducive to civilised discussions. ...and it's really not the way to make already unhappy people feel more favourably about either the game, or the game makers and their decisions. But, then you already know that, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abakk.9176 Posted February 18, 2018 Author Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Leo G.4501" said: > ...but an RNG skin that you can be guaranteed to get after 29 tries (that don't amount to nothing) is somehow unfair. :tongue: First of all, you are comparing normal gameplay to gambling, which is totally beside my point.... again. Secondly, 29 tries of which 28 amount to nothing because they are 28 results i don't want. The fact that YOU see value in them doesn't make them less worthless to me. It also makes them earn less cash from people like me that don't go for the random aspect. People that want them all will get them either way anyway. Thirdly, unfair? Im sure i was talking about a dumb business model. So, beside the point again. :tongue: When we cut away all the BS it boils down to you enjoying gambling and i don't. Plus i think its a mistake to take away choice and chase away some of your customers that can't throw money at a computer game willy nilly OR that like to see what they buy and like to buy what they see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo G.4501 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Tigaseye.2047" said: > The issue is not the dissent, Leo. > > Although, quite why you feel the need to spend your time on here (rudely!) fielding Anet's customer complaints/suggestions is anyone's guess, quite frankly... > > I really hope you don't work for them?! > > The issue is using terms like "clutching your pearls" and twisting someone's words into "mah faverite mount", rather than just being polite and quoting them directly. > > Fortunately, the OP appears to have taken it all in his stride; but, it is not behaviour normally conducive to civilised discussions. > > ...and it's really not the way to make already unhappy people feel more favourably about either the game, or the game makers and their decisions. > > But, then you already know that, right? "clutching your pearls" is simply a turn of phrase. At best, it's an exaggeration which isn't, in any way, impolite. If you understand what the phrase means, it's the act of being shocked by something that's common place. In an MMO, RNG is common place and in microtransactions, it is also common place. And on top of that, mount licenses are *extremely* tame when it comes to microtransaction RNG. It is an accurate turn of phrase. "mah faverite mount" is a pre-emptive counter argument. Considering the quoted individual did not make that argument (yet), the phrase was proposed to include the argument in my reply, not twist anyone's words. I shouldn't have to be nice to every poster I come across with an opinion I don't agree with but at the very least, I am civil. Being civil does not equate to being "nice", however. So long as I don't insult my dissenter's intelligence (thanks for that one, btw. Living too long with spell check makes me too reliant on it), name call, attack an individual's character, any attacks on their argument *IS* civil. And so long as I do not break any forum rules, I do not have to abide by your definition of "niceness" to have a civil conversation. And no, I do not work for Anet. Going from a signal tower in Korea with nothing to do but browse the internet (no video or music allowed) to flying back home, there's often little to do but browse reddit or game forums. If you want to know, I've only been logging into GW2 for the login rewards since I got back a couple days ago and getting back into Tera, which I haven't played in a long time. I've got no affiliation or even admiration for Anet. They are simply a company that dispenses virtual entertainement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo G.4501 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > ...but an RNG skin that you can be guaranteed to get after 29 tries (that don't amount to nothing) is somehow unfair. :tongue: > > First of all, you are comparing normal gameplay to gambling, which is totally beside my point.... again. > > Secondly, 29 tries of which 28 amount to nothing because they are 28 results i don't want. The fact that YOU see value in them doesn't make them less worthless to me. It also makes them earn less cash from people like me that don't go for the random aspect. People that want them all will get them either way anyway. > > Thirdly, unfair? Im sure i was talking about a dumb business model. So, beside the point again. :tongue: > > When we cut away all the BS it boils down to you enjoying gambling and i don't. Plus i think its a mistake to take away choice and chase away some of your customers that can't throw money at a computer game willy nilly OR that like to see what they buy and like to buy what they see. > And I guess the aspect of not having to throw money at the computer game at all to earn the exact same chances is also beside the point. If gold>gems didn't exist, I wouldn't bother arguing at all. But it does, which changes the climate of this particular complaint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abakk.9176 Posted February 18, 2018 Author Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > ...but an RNG skin that you can be guaranteed to get after 29 tries (that don't amount to nothing) is somehow unfair. :tongue: > > > > First of all, you are comparing normal gameplay to gambling, which is totally beside my point.... again. > > > > Secondly, 29 tries of which 28 amount to nothing because they are 28 results i don't want. The fact that YOU see value in them doesn't make them less worthless to me. It also makes them earn less cash from people like me that don't go for the random aspect. People that want them all will get them either way anyway. > > > > Thirdly, unfair? Im sure i was talking about a dumb business model. So, beside the point again. :tongue: > > > > When we cut away all the BS it boils down to you enjoying gambling and i don't. Plus i think its a mistake to take away choice and chase away some of your customers that can't throw money at a computer game willy nilly OR that like to see what they buy and like to buy what they see. > > > > And I guess the aspect of not having to throw money at the computer game at all to earn the exact same chances is also beside the point. > If gold>gems didn't exist, I wouldn't bother arguing at all. But it does, which changes the climate of this particular complaint. It's irrelevant where the gems come from. Whether i spend time making cash IRL or gold ingame to get gems to buy an RNG skin lootbox is beside the point. The point is that It's a stupid business model to chase away potential customers from your store by hiding stuff behind forced RNG. They have already lost me as a skin buyer and looking at this thread there's at least a bunch more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyWolf.8670 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > > @"Kalibri.5861" said: > > > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > > > > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > > > > > > > After a third and partially successful atempt, ive now spent 1200G to get at least 1 generic raptor skin that i've decided to be content with and i'll never buy another again... at least not while this 'blind date' system is in place. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But you didn't spend 1200 gold for 1 generic raptor, you got several other skin options opened to you as well, none of which are copies of one another. > > > > > > > > > > > > Minor necropost, sorry, but this argument makes me mad. When will people who suggest this comprehend that buying something that you don't want does not constitute an 'option'? If you have paid money for a thing that has zero value to you and which you will not use, then you have thrown that money in the trash. You're not getting anything good or useful. It's not an option. You've wasted time and effort and money, and that is why people hate this system. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're wrong. It *IS* a new option. You may not want that option the instant you get it, but later on when you're not screaming to the heavens about being wronged or having your efforts thrown to the wind, you may legitimately enjoy an option you might have not considered before. Even if that option isn't the best-in-show option you wanted, it could very well be better than another option (i.e. the base model) you have and that is why the options are set as the cheapest alternative. > > > > > > > > A "new option" you don't want is worthless. Would you buy everything in a clothing store, including things you don't like at all, because you might conceivably change your mind and your sense of style one day? Of course you wouldn't, that would be a waste of money. > > > > > > If I could buy everything for $150 in a bundle even high priced brands, then yes, I probably would buy everything. > > > > > > The difference is, you're conflating actual fashion to GW2 fashion. You only make your point weaker by doing so. > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > > @"Kalibri.5861" said: > > > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > > > > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > > > > > > > After a third and partially successful atempt, ive now spent 1200G to get at least 1 generic raptor skin that i've decided to be content with and i'll never buy another again... at least not while this 'blind date' system is in place. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But you didn't spend 1200 gold for 1 generic raptor, you got several other skin options opened to you as well, none of which are copies of one another. > > > > > > > > > > > > Minor necropost, sorry, but this argument makes me mad. When will people who suggest this comprehend that buying something that you don't want does not constitute an 'option'? If you have paid money for a thing that has zero value to you and which you will not use, then you have thrown that money in the trash. You're not getting anything good or useful. It's not an option. You've wasted time and effort and money, and that is why people hate this system. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're wrong. It *IS* a new option. You may not want that option the instant you get it, but later on when you're not screaming to the heavens about being wronged or having your efforts thrown to the wind, you may legitimately enjoy an option you might have not considered before. Even if that option isn't the best-in-show option you wanted, it could very well be better than another option (i.e. the base model) you have and that is why the options are set as the cheapest alternative. > > > > > > > > A "new option" you don't want is worthless. Would you buy everything in a clothing store, including things you don't like at all, because you might conceivably change your mind and your sense of style one day? Of course you wouldn't, that would be a waste of money. > > > > > > If I could buy everything for $150 in a bundle even high priced brands, then yes, I probably would buy everything. > > > > > > The difference is, you're conflating actual fashion to GW2 fashion. You only make your point weaker by doing so. > > > > And that is different because? > > What is different? Buying all clothes in RNG boxes for $150 that will land me one of each article of clothing? Retailers don't sell clothes that way *because* they are different. Really? You just wear whatever someone hands you? What if it's a halter top or a skirt or a tutu? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manasa Devi.7958 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I'm really not on board with people having the gall to tell other people that they should attribute value to any random skin they get, regardless which one. You really have to lack even the most basic form of empathy to think everyone shares your views. It's embarrassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaklex.6308 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > ...but an RNG skin that you can be guaranteed to get after 29 tries (that don't amount to nothing) is somehow unfair. :tongue: > > First of all, you are comparing normal gameplay to gambling, which is totally beside my point.... again. > > Secondly, 29 tries of which 28 amount to nothing because they are 28 results i don't want. The fact that YOU see value in them doesn't make them less worthless to me. It also makes them earn less cash from people like me that don't go for the random aspect. People that want them all will get them either way anyway. > > Thirdly, unfair? Im sure i was talking about a dumb business model. So, beside the point again. :tongue: > > When we cut away all the BS it boils down to you enjoying gambling and i don't. Plus i think its a mistake to take away choice and chase away some of your customers that can't throw money at a computer game willy nilly OR that like to see what they buy and like to buy what they see. > Actually, you can see what you're going to potentially get...what you can't do is pick which skin from those 30 options you'll get, but you do see all of them in the mount selection panel. Is that quibbling over semantics, perhaps, but for anyone to say you can't see what you're getting is technically wrong...you're going to get one of those 30 mounts skins shown in the window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo G.4501 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"Tigaseye.2047" said: > I don't think it has, Leo. > > If you hadn't been so unnecessarily rude and condescending to the OP and so very young-sounding with your idea that his/her tastes will probably just change overnight, I would have had no reason to assume you probably weren't an adult (or were only just an adult, maybe), would I? > For one, go back to my 1st post. It isn't rude or condescending to the OP. It doesn't agree with the OP but is worded in a way to get my opinion accross. For two, just because someone doesn't coddle your sensibilities doesn't mean they are "young-sounding". Adults speak respectfully to adults. If you don't act like an adult, you don't get spoken to like an adult. If you cannot handle that, perhaps you should look whom is bringing age and maturity in the discussion in the 1st place. Adults do not bring age into discussions. > @"Tigaseye.2047" said: > If you are an adult, yourself (especially if you are over 25), you have even less excuse for talking to the OP in that way, by the way. > > At the end of the day, this is just a games forum and we are discussing a game. > > So, there is no need to be rude to people. In what way? I came into the discussion with a descenting opinion. If the tone escalated from civil, you cannot put that blame solely on 1 individual, especially if someone is facilitating that escalation of tone with jabs at people's age or maturity. If you cannot take it, do not dish it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo G.4501 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > ...but an RNG skin that you can be guaranteed to get after 29 tries (that don't amount to nothing) is somehow unfair. :tongue: > > > > > > First of all, you are comparing normal gameplay to gambling, which is totally beside my point.... again. > > > > > > Secondly, 29 tries of which 28 amount to nothing because they are 28 results i don't want. The fact that YOU see value in them doesn't make them less worthless to me. It also makes them earn less cash from people like me that don't go for the random aspect. People that want them all will get them either way anyway. > > > > > > Thirdly, unfair? Im sure i was talking about a dumb business model. So, beside the point again. :tongue: > > > > > > When we cut away all the BS it boils down to you enjoying gambling and i don't. Plus i think its a mistake to take away choice and chase away some of your customers that can't throw money at a computer game willy nilly OR that like to see what they buy and like to buy what they see. > > > > > > > And I guess the aspect of not having to throw money at the computer game at all to earn the exact same chances is also beside the point. > > If gold>gems didn't exist, I wouldn't bother arguing at all. But it does, which changes the climate of this particular complaint. > > It's irrelevant where the gems come from. Whether i spend time making cash IRL or gold ingame to get gems to buy an RNG skin lootbox is beside the point. > > The point is that It's a stupid business model to chase away potential customers from your store by hiding stuff behind forced RNG. > > They have already lost me as a skin buyer and looking at this thread there's at least a bunch more. > And I say where is your proof? Anecdotal evidence can only prove so much and what it cannot prove is that the business model is "stupid". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo G.4501 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"GreyWolf.8670" said: > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > > > @"Kalibri.5861" said: > > > > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > > > > > > > > After a third and partially successful atempt, ive now spent 1200G to get at least 1 generic raptor skin that i've decided to be content with and i'll never buy another again... at least not while this 'blind date' system is in place. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But you didn't spend 1200 gold for 1 generic raptor, you got several other skin options opened to you as well, none of which are copies of one another. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Minor necropost, sorry, but this argument makes me mad. When will people who suggest this comprehend that buying something that you don't want does not constitute an 'option'? If you have paid money for a thing that has zero value to you and which you will not use, then you have thrown that money in the trash. You're not getting anything good or useful. It's not an option. You've wasted time and effort and money, and that is why people hate this system. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're wrong. It *IS* a new option. You may not want that option the instant you get it, but later on when you're not screaming to the heavens about being wronged or having your efforts thrown to the wind, you may legitimately enjoy an option you might have not considered before. Even if that option isn't the best-in-show option you wanted, it could very well be better than another option (i.e. the base model) you have and that is why the options are set as the cheapest alternative. > > > > > > > > > > A "new option" you don't want is worthless. Would you buy everything in a clothing store, including things you don't like at all, because you might conceivably change your mind and your sense of style one day? Of course you wouldn't, that would be a waste of money. > > > > > > > > If I could buy everything for $150 in a bundle even high priced brands, then yes, I probably would buy everything. > > > > > > > > The difference is, you're conflating actual fashion to GW2 fashion. You only make your point weaker by doing so. > > > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > @"Demented Sheep.1642" said: > > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > > > @"Kalibri.5861" said: > > > > > > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > > > > > > > > After a third and partially successful atempt, ive now spent 1200G to get at least 1 generic raptor skin that i've decided to be content with and i'll never buy another again... at least not while this 'blind date' system is in place. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But you didn't spend 1200 gold for 1 generic raptor, you got several other skin options opened to you as well, none of which are copies of one another. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Minor necropost, sorry, but this argument makes me mad. When will people who suggest this comprehend that buying something that you don't want does not constitute an 'option'? If you have paid money for a thing that has zero value to you and which you will not use, then you have thrown that money in the trash. You're not getting anything good or useful. It's not an option. You've wasted time and effort and money, and that is why people hate this system. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're wrong. It *IS* a new option. You may not want that option the instant you get it, but later on when you're not screaming to the heavens about being wronged or having your efforts thrown to the wind, you may legitimately enjoy an option you might have not considered before. Even if that option isn't the best-in-show option you wanted, it could very well be better than another option (i.e. the base model) you have and that is why the options are set as the cheapest alternative. > > > > > > > > > > A "new option" you don't want is worthless. Would you buy everything in a clothing store, including things you don't like at all, because you might conceivably change your mind and your sense of style one day? Of course you wouldn't, that would be a waste of money. > > > > > > > > If I could buy everything for $150 in a bundle even high priced brands, then yes, I probably would buy everything. > > > > > > > > The difference is, you're conflating actual fashion to GW2 fashion. You only make your point weaker by doing so. > > > > > > And that is different because? > > > > What is different? Buying all clothes in RNG boxes for $150 that will land me one of each article of clothing? Retailers don't sell clothes that way *because* they are different. > > Really? You just wear whatever someone hands you? What if it's a halter top or a skirt or a tutu? If I don't want it, I can sell it to someone for more than I paid for it. That's why it is different from regular fashion. I'll remind you, you were trying to make a comparison between Real Life fashion and GW2 fashion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo G.4501 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"Zaklex.6308" said: > > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > > @"Leo G.4501" said: > > > ...but an RNG skin that you can be guaranteed to get after 29 tries (that don't amount to nothing) is somehow unfair. :tongue: > > > > First of all, you are comparing normal gameplay to gambling, which is totally beside my point.... again. > > > > Secondly, 29 tries of which 28 amount to nothing because they are 28 results i don't want. The fact that YOU see value in them doesn't make them less worthless to me. It also makes them earn less cash from people like me that don't go for the random aspect. People that want them all will get them either way anyway. > > > > Thirdly, unfair? Im sure i was talking about a dumb business model. So, beside the point again. :tongue: > > > > When we cut away all the BS it boils down to you enjoying gambling and i don't. Plus i think its a mistake to take away choice and chase away some of your customers that can't throw money at a computer game willy nilly OR that like to see what they buy and like to buy what they see. > > > > Actually, you can see what you're going to potentially get...what you can't do is pick which skin from those 30 options you'll get, but you do see all of them in the mount selection panel. Is that quibbling over semantics, perhaps, but for anyone to say you can't see what you're getting is technically wrong...you're going to get one of those 30 mounts skins shown in the window. Small correction, you will get one of the 30 options that you don't already own. The thing is, all we're doing in this thread is quibbling over semantics. The other thing is, when you give someone an inch, they take a mile so when you let individuals press and nudge definitions of words, soon you end up with words that mean completely different things (like how "options" now means "things that I want right now") or multiple things (like what constitutes "gambling" or "lootboxes"). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo G.4501 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said: > I'm really not on board with people having the gall to tell other people that they should attribute value to any random skin they get, regardless which one. You really have to lack even the most basic form of empathy to think everyone shares your views. It's embarrassing. It takes someone that foregoes empathy to state objective facts. Not saying that I speak pure objective fact, but I also am not blinded by bias and emotion. I still have biases and emotions, I just acknowledge where they and reality diverge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndigoSundown.5419 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"Abakk.9176" said: > > The point is that It's a stupid business model to chase away potential customers from your store by hiding stuff behind forced RNG. There's an assumption in this statement that you cannot back up with anything factual. I suppose it's natural for people to assume that a lot of other people think the way they do. That is what you are doing, though. I don't like the random-item-from-a-purchase model, either. However, ANet has decided that they need sufficient revenue from mount skins to continue supporting the production of GW2. They have therefore decided that mount skins are not for everyone. The _only_ reason I can see for them to make such a decision is that they believe they will get more revenue selling both "expensive" mount skins, mount skin bundles and the random licenses to fewer customers than they would by selling lower-priced skins to more people. Sure, ANet could be wrong, but they have data and we don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarshallLaw.9260 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"Abakk.9176" There are 3 main categories of mount skin acquisition. 1)The guaranteed unlock at 2k gems per skin. (5 skins currently released - 1 for each mount) Note: these come and go - only the springer and skimmer are currently purchasable. 2)The festival bundles (1.6-2k for a set of 5 themed skins covering all 5 mounts) - availability limited to certain time periods. 3)Mount Adoption License - get allocated 1 random skin from a pool of 30 total **[[[no repeats]]]**. 1 for 400gems, 10 for 3.4k gems. . Personally I would say there is little point in buying just 1 Mount Adoption License since it's a 1 in 30 chance to get something you like. The festive packages were not to my taste, but that's subjective obviously and I didn't consider the 2k skins were worth the investment for me. For my account I chose to buy a pack of 10 and was happy to get 2 decent Springers, 4 Skimmers, 1 Jackal and 3 Griffons (including Starbound). This was the right quantity for me to have enough variety across several chars. For the best results and to avoid disappointment I would recommend reading the description of anything you are buying. This does not have to be specific to GW2 products either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inculpatus cedo.9234 Posted February 19, 2018 Share Posted February 19, 2018 > @"MarshallLaw.9260" said: > > @"Abakk.9176" > > There are 3 main categories of mount skin acquisition. > 1)The guaranteed unlock at 2k gems per skin. (5 skins currently released - 1 for each mount) > Note: these come and go - only the springer and skimmer are currently purchasable. > > 2)The festival bundles (1.6-2k for a set of 5 themed skins covering all 5 mounts) - availability limited to certain time periods. > > 3)Mount Adoption License - get allocated 1 random skin from a pool of 30 total **[[[no repeats]]]**. 1 for 400gems, 10 for 3.4k gems. > . > > Personally I would say there is little point in buying just 1 Mount Adoption License since it's a 1 in 30 chance to get something you like. The festive packages were not to my taste, but that's subjective obviously and I didn't consider the 2k skins were worth the investment for me. > For my account I chose to buy a pack of 10 and was happy to get 2 decent Springers, 4 Skimmers, 1 Jackal and 3 Griffons (including Starbound). This was the right quantity for me to have enough variety across several chars. > > For the best results and to avoid disappointment I would recommend reading the description of anything you are buying. This does not have to be specific to GW2 products either. A 1 in 30 chance only happens if there is only 1 skin out of the 30 that is 'liked'. The odds increase in favor for anyone that likes more than 1 skin out of the 30. I'd say it's likely many players like at least 2 or 3 skins out of the 30, if not more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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