PvP/WvW Skill Split Release

[tiramisu.8706]

This may not be a favorable post.

 

**Coming from someone who just returned to WVW after a year, this is what makes me dislike the current meta:**

1. Winds of Disenchantment: This skill pollutes my screen. It's way too large and last way too long. Please change to be used more skillfully instead of braindead.

2. Zerker like condition damage on high vitality / toughness builds makes it such an easy choice for most guilds. Trailblazers and Celestial stats make the game too easy.

3. Dictated by the insane amount of damage scaling and boon corrupt, I have no choice but to run minstrels on my guardian and feel inadequate.

4. At over 3400 armor and 21k, a single rev has a chance to burst me instantly with a quick hammer rotation. Just make it so it takes 2 revs at least. I'd feel less inadequate.

 

**From the proposed changes listed:**

1. Scourges do need a nerf but 10 seconds to all the skills will either make the class too boring to play due to having no skills to use or blobs will just add more scourges to make up for it. Don't make their skill rotation even more boring as bricks and just change the armor stats that make this such an easy class. (trailblazers / celestials)

2. Winds of Disenchantment isn't on the list. SKILL IS TOO LARGE. 5 WARRIORS COVERS MY WHOLE SCREEN.

3. Don't change the tome CDs and heal scaling. You did good by making it so we don't need 2 guards per party. It's just enough to keep the squad alive.

4. Did I mention that winds of Disenchantment isn't on the list? At a radius of too large and a duration of 10 seconds, a black and gold bubbly haze pollutes my screen. Dumb elite. Braindead usage.

 

Much love ANET. When nerfing skills, please do slight tweaks instead of grinding a class into oblivion. Please cater to skill vs numbers. <3

[Ghos.1326]

> @"Taranis.7451" said:

> > @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > > @"Taranis.7451" said:

> > > I'm more concerned with the fluidity of gameplay and enjoying my chosen class than I am with damage output. Scourge Shade cast times (0.5s) in addition to the CD changes proposed here will mean that the class has virtually nothing to do but auto attack while it waits for skills to recharge. Inevitably this will make for some very slow, tedious gameplay. By all means, please telegraph our skills and reduce their efficacy, but please do not suck all the joy and fun out of playing.

> >

> > having basically an unlimited amount of barrier is "healthy" then, if I am not mistaking your words here. No. It is not. One of the skills getting a longer CD is needed to promote counterplay. Please consider this:

> > Barrier, now, lasts for 5 seconds, and does not slowly degenerate over time any longer, meaning that 3k barrier you can place on yourself is technically almost constant uptime, considering barriers last said 5 seconds and the CD is what, 6-8 seconds. Yeah. Not healthy at all. These changes are much needed.

>

> While barrier was not explicitly mentioned, I have no issue with changing it either in a way that does not disrupt the fluidity of gameplay. Could they simply not reduce the amount of barrier applied? Could they not move barrier application off Shroud and onto another skill? There are hundreds of ways to address the issues of Scourge without slowing everything down to a crawl. Sadly, all the whining and L2P issues on these forums have convinced ANet that Scourge should be completely gutted such that nobody will want to play it anymore.

 

There is also condi application aspect as well. Staff condis plus the shade skill condis can make for some pain train, fast, ramping up condis quickly rather than over time, as intended by devs. I think this is why they are going for the increased cd rather than anything else.

[Morvar.9864]

**WvW in general**

- Winds of Disenchantment needs more tuning down. It's still mandatory in every big fight and everything revolves around its usage.

- Like said multiple times before, long CD passives should get just replaced or at least get a GUI indicator whether they are available or not. It's no fun wondering if 90 seconds has passed already.

- All classes should have some valid big fight builds. We do have a player amount limit after all so forced roaming classes get discriminated.

 

**Thief** a.k.a free kill

- ..Still not accepted to WvW raids and even less reasons to after survivability nerfs. Could use some love. Venom sharing for 10 people maybe (WvW only)?

 

**Ranger**

- Still not accepted to WvW raids as they give nothing for the party. Quite many newbies seem to play these for the first time and they get rejected. Surely leaves a good impression of the game mode. Could use some love.

 

**Engineer**

- "Med Kit". This has been dead way too long.

 

**Revenant** - My main

- As long as the renegade kitties die to anything, they are useless. Make them CC immune, much more durable or even immortal. Compared to herald, renegade is not an option.

- Embrace the Darkness. Boost it even to 30% and it'll have no use. Maybe give it a duration with CD instead of upkeep.

- Soothing Bastion. No build uses this even before the coming nerf. Just replace it with something else.

- Generally continues as a resistance spammer. Not finding it fun. Glint condi removal buff is welcome but other stances could really use some cleansing buffs too.

[Anchoku.8142]

It is about time the game modes were split. Thank you.

 

p.s.

I would like to see a major reduction in boon and condition availability in WvW and PvP. The opportunity cost for both is generally too low. The split notes do not go far enough.

 

Scourge is part of your boon-counter strategy and deserves a nerf to corruption rate but boon generation is the root of the problem. Make it so boons, conditions, and control effects really cost something tangible versus direct damage.

[Americium.7182]

> @"Morvar.9864" said:

 

> **Thief** a.k.a free kill

> - ..Still not accepted to WvW raids and even less reasons to after survivability nerfs. Could use some love. Venom sharing for 10 people maybe (WvW only)?

 

At least Thief is still actively used by many WvW/GvG guilds unlike Rangers/Engis.

[eoz.1834]

please rework on unblockable cc/daze especially for wvw. kinda kitten getting cc'ed while blocking attacks with shield skill

[Fat Disgrace.4275]

Would make more sense to remove the +20% on LS and leave sword AA alone.

[Wondrouswall.7169]

Please, let's not increase the cooldown of Celestial Form yet **AGAIN** because of issues with certain traits. It hurts the actual intention of the elite spec _YOU [Anet]_ designed it for and are proposing an outright lazy and uncreative way to deal with it while it solving nothing. The same can be said about half of the Ranger main-hand Axe changes and no plans for Marksmanship's issues with the Opening Strike mechanic.

 

Be creative if you want to promote more active and less passive gameplay. My suggestions and feedback on this draft of proposals specifically for Ranger:

 

 

* Do not increase Celestial Avatar cooldown. You want to deal with DC & CS people bring up, then deal with it without further gating the mechanic access that is supposed to support allies.

* Alter Druidic Clarity to be more team-oriented, tying it into using a Celestial skill, while retaining some of its defensive aspects: _"Druidic Clarity: Stun break when you enter Celestial Form. Rejuvenating Tides also removes 1 condition from you and affected allies."_ Now, it has some team-support in a support spec while retaining its self-stun break for the player when they need it while having reduced self-condition cleanse in trade for ally cleansing with the use of a solid Celestial skill.

* Alter or reduce the effectiveness of Celestial Shadow. I recall Irenio specifically mentioning an example of using this trait for raids (of all things) for repositioning during the E-Spec Heart of Thorns reveal. A simple duration reduction from 3s to 2s can be an effective solution. Another is altering it to be heal-oriented, by having the player cast a Lesser Rejuvenating Tides (3 pulses instead of 5) when exiting Celestial Form. Think about this change with the above suggestion and how they would now feed into each other while being able to build onto them if Grace of the Land is taken. The traits would then be interesting, interactive, and synergize.

* The damage increases to main-hand Axe are fine as it pushes it further into being a better hybrid weapon, but the increase of Might duration on Ricochet does nothing while there is no need to increase the condition potency of Split Blade since Winter's Bite was given bleeds. There are some few tweaks that can be done to it that can make it slightly more interesting and effective as a whole without bogging it down with meaningless buffs.

* Winter's Bite AOE from Honed Axes trait becoming baseline is first and foremost. Having main-hand axe be well-rounded with all moves having the ability to cleave foes in 3 different ways without the GM trait is a better avenue to increase its potency than increasing the shotgun-oriented style of Split Blade - which, if you have to be reminded, was ill mentioned during the Renegade E-Spec reveal on their Short Bow skill.

* Add a damage % bonus for Ricochet when striking a foe inflicted with Weakness instead of increasing the Might duration. What's the use of increased Might duration if one of the main uses of it was to share it with the Pet, and in this draft, you proposed to reduce the Might duration shared with the Pet from 10s to 5s on Fortifying Bond and Heal as One? If you go through with that, they end up cancelling each other out. On the other hand, adding a damage % bonus against Weakened foes adds not only some self-synergy within the weapon through Winter's Bite but also within the Beastmastery line with Wilting Strike, since that is also where Honed Axes is placed. Synergy.

* The last bit is improving Opening Strike on Marksman. A core and defining trait line to Ranger. Currently, the largest flaw is depending on the GM Remorseless to get any mileage out of it in order to refresh it mid-combat, and the recent addition of Alpha Focus only interacts with Predator's Onslaught - yet another GM. So, why not tweak the traits so _every_ GM can interact with Opening Strike in some way while taming the refresh as a minor trait?

* Alpha Focus is altered to refresh Opening Strike when gaining Fury and swaps places with Precise Strike (for levelling purposes).

* Lead the Wind also refreshes Opening Strike when gaining Stealth. This limits the refresh to a single move for Longbow - Hunter's Shot - while being a bonus to those using smoke combo fields or gaining stealth by other means. It's thematically fitting and offers no additional bonuses other than ensuring the next strike is sure to make your target vulnerable to the base effects of Opening Strike.

* Predator's Onslaught alters Opening Strike to have it additionally inflict cripple. This will have it synergize well within itself while also taming it since it will have no additional refreshes and the damage modifier is more than enough.

* Remorseless also freshes Opening Strike when killing a foe. The burst potential of the trait is strong, and with the Fury refresh being a minor, it doesn't require any further boosts - be it damage or boons. However, thematically-speaking, being "Remorseless" by way of regaining Opening Strike after killing a foe (as the original version of Remorseless had) adds in that "Kill Combo"-esque bloodlust to keep things rolling. It would be a small addition, being interesting, thematic, and appropriately powered. That would be cool, right?

 

 

 

[Unknown.3976]

This is a great move. Maybe the PvE balance team can work on bringing back builds that were gutted due to PvP/WvW concerns, builds like minion-master necro.

[zalt.8937]

Everyone seems really focused on thier main class and how weak it will become. Reality, everyone gets the nerf hammer. This is a good thing. Finally on the path away from powercreep and getting rewarded for doing nothing.

 

Thank you Anet. These are welcome news!

[Vagrant.7206]

Ok, I slept on the changes in the notes and I realized that ArenaNet probably doesn't have somebody who plays engineer as a main on their balance team. I wanted to make a few suggestions to improve the **underperforming** aspects of the class. While I think the holosmith nerfs are excessive, I recognize that people have been having issues with it. I think the stability nerf to Corona Burst is probably the biggest nerf, whether it was realized or not.

 

Anyway, here goes:

 

-----------------------

 

#Scrapper

 

The barrier additions did a lot to make Scrapper potentially useful again. While the class is still painful to use in PvE, many of its woes in PvP/WvW can be resolved:

 

* First and foremost, fix the dang bug with [function gyro](https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/28400/scrapper-cant-stomp-bug/p1 "function gyro"). If the function gyro is meant to be Scrapper's unique mechanic, it can't be as buggy as it is now.

* Second, the barrier additions were nice, but didn't go far enough. The healing power coefficient on them is extremely low, to the point where a max healing power build and a no-healing power build have virtually no difference on barrier generation. This runs counter to the idea of strategically choosing your amulet and runes.

* Damage on all hammer skills needs to be tuned up a smidge. This could be accomplished by making Perfectly Weighted baseline.

* Rocket charge as it stands does not function particularly effectively as a gap closer. Please make the final leap on the chain go a longer distance. I'd also suggest making all three leaps combo finishers once again, especially since Final Salvo is less useful.

* Gyros overall need more health. They die too easily as it stands right now, severely reducing their effectiveness. Purge gyro should also be immune to conditions, or at least pulse resistance on itself.

 

------------------

 

#Core Engi

 

Ok, core engi is a doozy to approach because it's so far behind most of the core classes in PvP. Core engineer is already very clunky, and very simple number changes that have been proposed are not enough to address some of its woes. The underlying problem stems from core engineer's reliance on kits to do the job. But kits as a whole are slow and hard to rotate in real combat situations. To this end, I hope the following suggestions will highlight some ideas:

 

* Juggernaut functionality needs to be changed. Instead of granting stability and might with flamethrower equipped, it should grant +vit and +toughness per kit in your utility slots. This means if you're running 4 kits (or even 5, lul), you should get a fair amount of toughness and vit. This would give engineer some room to breathe as it swaps between kits, while also not unfairly overpowering scrapper or holo.

* There is currently no reason to ever take medkit as it stands. It's simply one of the worst team healing skills in the game. Please, please look into actually making it useful, as engineers cannot run a support role with it.

* Grenade kit and mortar kit should have their flight times reduced. Currently you can go make coffee while waiting for mortar kit and grenade kit skills to land at max distance.

* Short fuse should become baseline for bomb kit. The 1 second delay makes it impractical in PvP right now, especially considering the skill required to place the dang things properly.

* Tool kit should see double the condi application it sees now (box of nails and prybar are laughable currently), and roughly a 20% increase in power damage coefficient. This would make it closer to a usable melee skill set. I'd also recommend changing out the code for Magnet to something less glitchy -- IE Dragonhunter's "Hunter's Verdict." There's all sorts of weird glitchiness with Magnet.

* Flamethrower should have its power coefficients across the board increased by 20%. Flamethrower AA should deal 0.5s of burning per tick, so there's an actual reason to use the AA. The rest of the skills are pretty much fine.

* Mortar kit needs more damage overall. As it stands, it certainly does not feel like an elite skill. If flight times are reduced, a 50% increase in damage coefficient would be sufficient, although I'd recommend a 100% increase in damage coefficient.

* Grenade kit is actually in an ok position besides flight times. I might recommend adding some functionality that gives it a small chance to be unblockable, but maybe that's too much.

* Rifle, pistol, and shield should have heat interactions with holosmith. It's really bizarre that they don't.

* Pistol overall needs reduced casting times **OR** cover conditions. Engineer applies conditions very slowly when compared to other condi classes. It does not have the cover conditions of a necro, nor the frequent reapplication rates of a thief.

* Glue shot should apply slow to enemies and swiftness to allies.

* Shield needs reduced cooldowns or better utility to compete with offhand pistol.

* Rifle's not in a bad state right now. I would say make overcharged shot unblockable, and you pretty much have it where it should be.

* Consider adding condi damage buffs (ala [Potent Poison](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Potent_Poison "Potent Poison")) to core engineer's traitlines. Given our low condi application rate and lack of cover condis, we need something to make up the difference.

* One seemingly unrelated issue is actually retaliation. Engineers are exposed to serious health loss from retaliation in WvW. Because grenades can theoretically hit up to 9 targets per grenade throw, retaliation can annihilate us in WvW (9x200=1800 damage per grenade toss). I don't know if there is a way to fix this without seriously reworking retaliation, but it is an important consideration for WvW.

 

There's a lot of other little niggles, particularly with core engineer's traitlines, but I think these kinds of skill changes would go a massive way to opening up core engineer in PvP.

[Arete.7019]

From a WvW perspective I think these changes overnerf some classes (Druid/Engi) that already struggled in large scale fights while also not doing enough to bring up underpowered classes and builds. They also miss the mark on some general balance for WvW. These are my proposed changes to fix both of these problems, all changes should be considered WvW only. Almost all of the uncommented notes are buffs to increase general utility or increase build diversity.

 

# General

* Resistance now corrupts into Chill. Immobilize still converts into Resistance.

 

# Warrior

## Skills

>Break Enchantments: Reduced the power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.5 (-50%). Increased the number of boons removed from 2 to 3 in PvP and WvW

* Boons removed stay the same

 

AoE boon removal is already very high in WvW, this change would have Break Enchantments removing more boons over time than Winds of Disenchantment.

 

>Battle Standard: Reduced the cooldown from 240 seconds to 180 seconds in PvP and WvW

* Cooldown reduced to 90, cast time 1.5, revive % to 200% (ignore poison)

 

Battle Standard is too weak a skill compared to the overwhelming Winds of Disenchantment and even lacks in some areas compared to other resurrection utilities as well as abilities like Transfusion and Search and Rescue. These changes should help give build diversity to non-Spellbreaker builds by giving them a comparably powerful elite option.

* Winds of Disenchantment: Projectile Block removed.

 

## Traits

* Vigorous Shouts: Base healing up to 1500, ratio down to 1.0

 

# Revenant

## Skills

>Banish Enchantments: Increased the number of boons removed from 2 to 3 in PvP and WvW

* Boons removed stay the same

 

#Ranger

##Skills

 

>Rejuvenating Tides: Reduced the base healing per pulse from 650 to 550 (-15%) in PvP and WvW

* Removes 2 conditions at the end of the cast

* Natural Convergence: Now grants Stability at the end of cast (or remove stability)

 

These changes should help add some much needed condition clear to Druids in zergs while allowing counterplay in small scale fights.

 

>Celestial Avatar: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

* No change to cooldown.

* Troll Ungent, increased interval to 2s from 1s, overall healing remains unchanged

* Signet of Renewal, increased interval to 3s from 1s, overall healing remains unchanged

* Hunter's Call, reduced number of hits from 16 to 8, total damage remains unchanged

 

Changes to Troll Ungent, Signet of Renewal and Hunter's Call slow down Astral Force generation in small scale fights, letting Avatar cooldown stay unchanged in large scale.

* Search and Rescue, reduced cooldown to 30s in WvW only

 

##Traits

* Celestial Shadow: Reduce Stealth and Superspeed to 2s

 

>Grace of the Land: Reduced the number of Might stacks applied from 3 to 2 in PvP and WvW

* Duration up from 8 to 10

* Leader of the Pack: Radius increased to 600.

 

Increasing the radius on Stances would be a huge buff and go a long way to letting Soulbeast compete with Guardians for Stability slots in large scale fights.

 

#Engineer

##Skills

 

* Refraction Cutter: Increased power scaling on projectile blades from 0.26 to 0.36. Projectiles are now unblockable.

* Radiant Arc: Reduced CD from 14s to 10s

* Hard Light Arena: Reduced CD from 45s to 30s

 

##Traits

* Crystal Configuration: Storm: Projectiles from this trait are now unblockable.

 

I think engineer is the most difficult class to balance around multiple fight sizes, particularly with purely number changes. These changes attempt to readd some of the damage lost by Holoforge nerfs to sword, keeping it away from the Rifle/Holoforge combination that is problematic in small scale.

 

#Mesmer

##Skills

 

>Illusion of Life: Reduced the cooldown from 120 seconds to 75 seconds in PvP and WvW

* Increased cast time to 1.5s, CD to 90s instead of 75.

 

 

> Phantasmal Disenchanter – Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW

* Reduced removed boons from 5 to 2, no longer deals bonus damage to boonless foes.

 

Phantasmal Disenchanter brings an overwhelming amount of boonrip, especially paired with Chronophantasma, Continuum Split and Signet of the Ether. The bonus damage to boonless foes should also be tuned down considering its massive utility.

 

#Necromancer

##Skills

>Desert Shroud: Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

* Desert Shroud Reduce base damage to 710 (current 840) Reduce power scaling to 2.75 (currently 3.15), reduce barrier base to 4,555 (current 5016), reduce torment to 4s in WvW and PvP per pulse. Similar if not better impact than the CD nerf, but keeps the class fun and with a high APM that is indicative on Scourge. It is also the only skill to proc 'Activate on Shroud usage' traits and 'Death Perception' so nerfing cooldown SEVERELY reduces the effectiveness of some of the necros most interesting traits.

 

Copied from Blue Ranger's post (https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/410059/#Comment_410059).

[Shadowcat.2680]

> @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > @"liurencija.2684" said:

> > Okay so... After playing holosmith in wvw for quite a while now, I came to love this class very very much. Seeing the changes made to engi makes me wonder if anet even cares for this class at all and if they make ''balances'' to it based only on other people's complaints.

> > Holosmith is already an unviable class for zergs in the current wvw condi meta, having low damage, extremely low survivability and self sustain compared to other classes like scourge or spellbreaker. Why nerf it even more? Seriously, ruining the only skill that gives stability, not giving any proper condi cleanses and even reducing the main source of damage is not simply nerfing an already disadvantaged class, it's putting a final nail to its coffin.

> > Since I don't play pvp often, I really can't say much about the effect these changes have there, but if holosmiths are indeed so OP in pvp as many say, why include these nerfs in wvw?

>

> Not sure what kind of holosmith you are playing that has low damage, and extremely low survivability and self sustain, but any holosmith I have run into has a brontosaurus poop ton of damage and survivability, thanks to the heat mechanic/perma stab on corona burst. These changes are much needed. I myself play an Engineer, and if another Engineer agrees that corona burst's perma stab is a problem, then it's gotta be a problem. Holosmith is supposed to be a damage dealing spec, both bursting and sustained damage. Giving it perma stab would then put it in a position to fulfill both of these roles with the utmost expertise, with no counterplay or drawbacks. Just CC them you say? How? They have perma stab, remember? Causing the stab to be applied on hit is good, and if they did keep stab off hit, then reducing its uptime is essential, else, once a holosmith gets going (corona burst before jumping in), there is no stopping him before he bursts your poor body from full to pieces within 3 seconds.

 

Holosmith does not have permanent stability on Corona Burst with Eclipse (the only viable trait in that line for most encounters since holosmith has no other sources of stability). Eclipse offers 4 seconds of 2 stacks of stability on the use of a skill with a 6 second cooldown that generates a lot of heat on use. 36% boon duration (Alchemy traited plus Durability runes) will push the duration of the stability up to 5 1/2 seconds, but the claim "permanent stability" implies holosmith can stay in the forge and camp Corona Burst on cooldown. The heat mechanic prevents this.

 

If holosmith is thought to have too much stability because of Eclipse, then lowering the base duration or the number of stacks makes more sense over adding the stipulation of hitting a target. No support trait/skill should rely on hitting a target for its function to be achieved (looking at you Aqua Siphon). If this change to the trait goes live, then holosmith will have zero access to stability if Corona Burst is dodged or the enemy simply moves out of range, and the flashy tells for everything in the photon forge makes such a dodge/disengage almost a guarantee if this change is implemented.

[Vael Victus.2654]

**These changes really excite me and give me hope for SPvP.** I was already mostly pleased with WvW, but I am also more of a roamer than a zerger.

 

>Roll for Initiative: Increased the cooldown from 35 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW.

- Was this really necessary? Tricks are spotty enough as it is, I don't think anyone's "abusing" this on a meaningful scale.

 

LOVE the druid changes. The SPvP bunker druid build has been a main driver for my lost of interest in this season/pvp.

 

Great engi changes, but I'm disappointed you didn't tweak flamethrower. I think it should physically damage very weakly but cause significant AoE burning with its auto.

 

Do I see a little life leech build forming for necro? ;}

 

**One final thought:** build diversity will always suffer so long as certain buffs are required. Stability is required because so many skills CC, and CC is so powerful because we're all walking bazookas that can down each other in three seconds' time.

[Ghos.1326]

> @"Shadowcat.2680" said:

> > @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > > @"liurencija.2684" said:

> > > Okay so... After playing holosmith in wvw for quite a while now, I came to love this class very very much. Seeing the changes made to engi makes me wonder if anet even cares for this class at all and if they make ''balances'' to it based only on other people's complaints.

> > > Holosmith is already an unviable class for zergs in the current wvw condi meta, having low damage, extremely low survivability and self sustain compared to other classes like scourge or spellbreaker. Why nerf it even more? Seriously, ruining the only skill that gives stability, not giving any proper condi cleanses and even reducing the main source of damage is not simply nerfing an already disadvantaged class, it's putting a final nail to its coffin.

> > > Since I don't play pvp often, I really can't say much about the effect these changes have there, but if holosmiths are indeed so OP in pvp as many say, why include these nerfs in wvw?

> >

> > Not sure what kind of holosmith you are playing that has low damage, and extremely low survivability and self sustain, but any holosmith I have run into has a brontosaurus poop ton of damage and survivability, thanks to the heat mechanic/perma stab on corona burst. These changes are much needed. I myself play an Engineer, and if another Engineer agrees that corona burst's perma stab is a problem, then it's gotta be a problem. Holosmith is supposed to be a damage dealing spec, both bursting and sustained damage. Giving it perma stab would then put it in a position to fulfill both of these roles with the utmost expertise, with no counterplay or drawbacks. Just CC them you say? How? They have perma stab, remember? Causing the stab to be applied on hit is good, and if they did keep stab off hit, then reducing its uptime is essential, else, once a holosmith gets going (corona burst before jumping in), there is no stopping him before he bursts your poor body from full to pieces within 3 seconds.

>

> Holosmith does not have permanent stability on Corona Burst with Eclipse (the only viable trait in that line for most encounters since holosmith has no other sources of stability). Eclipse offers 4 seconds of 2 stacks of stability on the use of a skill with a 6 second cooldown that generates a lot of heat on use. 36% boon duration (Alchemy traited plus Durability runes) will push the duration of the stability up to 5 1/2 seconds, but the claim "permanent stability" implies holosmith can stay in the forge and camp Corona Burst on cooldown. The heat mechanic prevents this.

>

> If holosmith is thought to have too much stability because of Eclipse, then lowering the base duration or the number of stacks makes more sense over adding the stipulation of hitting a target. No support trait/skill should rely on hitting a target for its function to be achieved (looking at you Aqua Siphon). If this change to the trait goes live, then holosmith will have zero access to stability if Corona Burst is dodged or the enemy simply moves out of range, and the flashy tells for everything in the photon forge makes such a dodge/disengage almost a guarantee if this change is implemented.

 

you are also forgetting that, this stability pulses 2 times, one at the beginning, and one at the end. Also, dodging vents exhaust traited, so it's basically perma stab. On top of vigor uptime per swiftness gained and elixir that restores endurance, you can easily have perma stab by just spamming corona burst off cd, all while staying in forge a great deal of time. heat also does not take too long to dissipate when you only have 100 heat, so you have a lot of forge uptime, and when you don't, you're out of range from cc in the current meta build.

[Kako.1930]

> @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > Shatterstone Increased the power coefficient from 1.0 to 1.66 (+66%) in PvP and WvW

>

> The meme returns!

 

At least they didn't forget to buff Shatterstone!!! /Trollface

[arnitheking.8427]

I would love if they removed the invuln from signet of stone altogether (and added a different effect) and kept the cd of CA at 15 seconds. 20 seconds is too much imo. Staff 1 nerf is weird, but fine since brainless beam spam shouldnt really be rewarded. Staff 4 needs a buff though, it's a skillshot and has small width. If they nerf druid sustain but increase its power I wouldnt have any problems with it, and people wouldnt complain about druid being cancerous anymore with the invuln fully gone. I think some sustain has to stay though, it's kind of part of the elite spec.

[GDchiaScrub.3241]

# Can you re-look at the 1:1 boon->corrupt or condition->convert stuff?

 

_As a player it just feels like playing a poor game of RNG tug of war back and forth on top of the already intense combat system._

 

Especially in WvW where the boon/condi application is spammed, and far more random. Some of the skills where it *rips 1 boon and applies 1 specific condition* is much less RNG, and far more intuitive for the player doing or receiving. This is to avoid situations of converting stability into fear that is then converted back into stability and back to fear again (or the 1:1 conversion relationship with resistance and immobilize). This might be less of an issue in Spvp (granted less players involved).

 

Do you **feel** me, peeps? D:

[protox.6085]

> @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > @"protox.6085" said:

> > Defy Pain: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> > Last Stand: Increased the cooldown from 40 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> >

> > This will kill core warriors this is the only thing that keeps us alive now adays.

>

> they should not be able to live forever like a bunker while also being able to deal massive, consistent damages to opponents. This change is needed.

 

then you havent played gw in a while... defy pain and endure pain allready got nerfed half the time balance stands got nerfed as well a core warrior can't bunker as it used too. Last stands is the last remaining stability option for core warrior. Balanced stance and dolyak signet arent worth taking. And with the amount of knock downs/stuns in the game right now you cant keep dodging every single skill forever. Also warrior as a melee class should be able to tank a little bit of the range pressure else it will be useless.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

rev: please relook some cds and energy costs. ventari needs a stunbreak. possibly reduce energy costs of jalis+shiro elites, cast times, and reduce effectiveness to compensate.

druid: druidic clarity is OP. perhaps not now that CA is getting a cd increase, although I don't think that's the direction to go. imo it would be better to even reduce the cd on CA, reduce the self healing on CA skills while leaving the healing to other allies untouched.

teef: please don't nerf sword to the ground, and please don't buff d/p even more. 1.5sec immob at 50% is OP. shadow shot +36% dmg is really OP. I can now expect 12k shadow shots on a 3k armor build in wvw, and that's not close to a balanced skill. imo leave ini alone, remove blind, nerf dmg. its probably one of the most powerful skills in the game.

necro: all aa's need good lf gain. please relook death shroud cd's and cast time of life blast. give death magic a meaningful survival buff.

ele: sword weaver could use some weakness.

[Lich King.1524]

> @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

> > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > Just wondering...is this the AFC?

>

> Oh no, this is entirely independent of that. But it would make a great topic of conversation in the future, for sure!

 

Very interesting changes, smart move Arenanet!

I like your idea to have more skillful PvP, instead of war of passive traits.

 

*Just one remark:* if you *nerf* passive defense on Elementalist, please bear in mind: currently elem suffers from lack of active defense:

no block possibilityis, lowest health pool, light armor, forced to play in melee, barrierstill useles under crits from enemy 5-9k), etc

 

for Weaver defense like [Magnetic Wave] and [Obsidian Flesh] are useless because hidden under long attunement swap delay on right hand.

 

as a conclusion: please consider to add some active defense skills to Elementalist.

[Shadowcat.2680]

> @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > @"Shadowcat.2680" said:

> > > @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > > > @"liurencija.2684" said:

> > > > Okay so... After playing holosmith in wvw for quite a while now, I came to love this class very very much. Seeing the changes made to engi makes me wonder if anet even cares for this class at all and if they make ''balances'' to it based only on other people's complaints.

> > > > Holosmith is already an unviable class for zergs in the current wvw condi meta, having low damage, extremely low survivability and self sustain compared to other classes like scourge or spellbreaker. Why nerf it even more? Seriously, ruining the only skill that gives stability, not giving any proper condi cleanses and even reducing the main source of damage is not simply nerfing an already disadvantaged class, it's putting a final nail to its coffin.

> > > > Since I don't play pvp often, I really can't say much about the effect these changes have there, but if holosmiths are indeed so OP in pvp as many say, why include these nerfs in wvw?

> > >

> > > Not sure what kind of holosmith you are playing that has low damage, and extremely low survivability and self sustain, but any holosmith I have run into has a brontosaurus poop ton of damage and survivability, thanks to the heat mechanic/perma stab on corona burst. These changes are much needed. I myself play an Engineer, and if another Engineer agrees that corona burst's perma stab is a problem, then it's gotta be a problem. Holosmith is supposed to be a damage dealing spec, both bursting and sustained damage. Giving it perma stab would then put it in a position to fulfill both of these roles with the utmost expertise, with no counterplay or drawbacks. Just CC them you say? How? They have perma stab, remember? Causing the stab to be applied on hit is good, and if they did keep stab off hit, then reducing its uptime is essential, else, once a holosmith gets going (corona burst before jumping in), there is no stopping him before he bursts your poor body from full to pieces within 3 seconds.

> >

> > Holosmith does not have permanent stability on Corona Burst with Eclipse (the only viable trait in that line for most encounters since holosmith has no other sources of stability). Eclipse offers 4 seconds of 2 stacks of stability on the use of a skill with a 6 second cooldown that generates a lot of heat on use. 36% boon duration (Alchemy traited plus Durability runes) will push the duration of the stability up to 5 1/2 seconds, but the claim "permanent stability" implies holosmith can stay in the forge and camp Corona Burst on cooldown. The heat mechanic prevents this.

> >

> > If holosmith is thought to have too much stability because of Eclipse, then lowering the base duration or the number of stacks makes more sense over adding the stipulation of hitting a target. No support trait/skill should rely on hitting a target for its function to be achieved (looking at you Aqua Siphon). If this change to the trait goes live, then holosmith will have zero access to stability if Corona Burst is dodged or the enemy simply moves out of range, and the flashy tells for everything in the photon forge makes such a dodge/disengage almost a guarantee if this change is implemented.

>

> you are also forgetting that, this stability pulses 2 times, one at the beginning, and one at the end. Also, dodging vents exhaust traited, so it's basically perma stab. On top of vigor uptime per swiftness gained and elixir that restores endurance, you can easily have perma stab by just spamming corona burst off cd, all while staying in forge a great deal of time. heat also does not take too long to dissipate when you only have 100 heat, so you have a lot of forge uptime, and when you don't, you're out of range from cc in the current meta build.

 

Changing Eclipse to give both stacks of stability on the initial pulse (thus keeping the base duration to a true 4 secs) or lowering the base duration outright would be a more sensible change than adding an on hit stipulation to the stability. Holosmiths need the stability to have any hope of engaging with the backline of a zerg (where holosmith can shine in zerg vs zerg play), and requiring a target for the stability will kill any hope a holosmith has for engaging the enemy's backline without being cced to oblivion before they get close enough to do a Corona Burst that'll actually hit something.

 

Putting an on hit stipulation on something with a radius of 300 will make holosmiths easy kills for all those things that enjoy 900 and 1200 range ccs.

[OutOfOrder.3719]

Here is my question with the proposed changes to Mirage Elusive Mind.

 

If exhaustion only triggers when evading out of a stunned state occurs, then this change is fine.

 

However, if exhaustion occurs every time a dodge is used, this will ruin/destroy Mirage as a profession and should not be implemented.

 

Elusive Mind is the most reliable way for Mirage members to remove conditions. If exhaustion triggers every time a dodge occurrs , this is an unnecessary change and will effectively ruin Mirage as a profession.

 

If a developer or moderator could clarify this proposed change, that would be wonderful, thank you!

 

 

[Jski.6180]

The update to ele dmg mostly dagger and scepter seem good but nothing new for staff but i guess staff already dose a lot of dmg and should be one of the top dmg spike for power in wvw now. I cant talk about other classes but it seems like an ok buff to ele in wvw but it needs a lot of testing to see how this all works out.

 

Glyph use needs more boons on the player then just the base boons. It would be nice to see stab quickness alacrity and resistances on each atument (earth, fire, air, water in that order).

Barrier looks like its getting an ok buff on one skill the duel skill barrier still is a bit to after the fact as well as the barrier on dodge roll i would love to see weaver get more of a barrier like scraper has now as well as an added effect of taking less dmg when barrier is up. This would fit so well on dimon skin even with an hp% where it falls off.

[Carran.9158]

If u want people to use Spectrum Shield just remake the belt skill with some sort of optical camouflage so it can replace elixir S. It fits the spec and the fantasy to manipulate the light and go invisible for a few seconds... NO ONE uses any of the Holosmith utilities because they are simply bad compared to the core ones. You could also consider giving Holo a "manipulate the light and quickly move behind your target" shadowstep or something. Also rocket boots could be an area leap or make engi invul while he rolls, right now is pretty bad for what it does and we are almost forced to use it to go out of mele range.

 

Taking away so much damage of the class will make it really hard to play, as we get almost oneshoted by anyone and we are already forced to play rifle to kite and only go holoforge to finish or combo our targets. Taking off stability is HUGE, as being in mele range to get it wont save us from a d/p thief that spams #4 then steals in for the kill; neither wont versus a interrupt mesmer, ele, etc. I have been playing holosmith since the beta and you already took away the condi cleneanse with the last patch, if you now take away the damage and stability we wont have anything left.