Legatus.3608 Posted March 24, 2018 Share Posted March 24, 2018 > @"Egorum.9506" said: > Low skill floor=anyone can pick it up and perform well > High skill floor=it is difficult for a beginner to do well with > Low skill ceiling=even played well it is difficult to succeed with due to lacking mechanics or tools > High skill ceiling=difficult to use well, possessing a plethora of tools to use and abuse, s tier > > Currently mesmer has a low skill floor (see video) and a high skill ceiling. This means anyone can pick it up quickly, and in the hands of skilled users they are even more powerful. A bad combination I think you've got low and high skill floor backwards. The skill level goes From 1 to 100, and the floor is 50, you've got a really high floor, meaning you always play at least half decent even if you're afk. If the floor is 1 that means you're contributing nothing if you're bad though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daishi.6027 Posted March 24, 2018 Share Posted March 24, 2018 Has about the same skill floor as anything else, don’t pretend anything without a little game sense is hard to play. What matters to most people above gold is the ceiling, not the floor, and how to play around it. Phant spam is kind of overwhelming at first, but If you have decent mobility, or AoE you can counter these specs 1v1... At least if you as a player can actually play around enemy cooldowns, if not maybe it’s time to get off the skill floor. If you have a build that lacks both, or costs to many resources/cooldowns to be mobile, then it’s just not your matchup. Re-roll to counter, or be happy with the strengths you do have. If you want to argue that they lowered the floor? I guess yeah, fine, but any bad can spam a ton of tracking attacks and win against other bads. If we’re balancing by the lowest common denominator then I guess it’s OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aDemoNnDisguisE.8576 Posted March 24, 2018 Share Posted March 24, 2018 > @"Egorum.9506" said: > Because they pretty clearly don't. I've played about 300 games on mesmer over the last 5 years and i've been handling 2v1s like it's no problem all afternoon. The class has way too much access to blocks, evades, and invulns. It needs some time on the butcher block before the next season. Could not agree more... I really have to wonder how this class keeps evading some well deserved toning down patch after patch. Anet should start with a severe reduction to all blocks, evades and invulns and then move on to power and clone reductions if that is not enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted March 24, 2018 Share Posted March 24, 2018 > @"aDemoNnDisguisE.8576" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > Because they pretty clearly don't. I've played about 300 games on mesmer over the last 5 years and i've been handling 2v1s like it's no problem all afternoon. The class has way too much access to blocks, evades, and invulns. It needs some time on the butcher block before the next season. > > Could not agree more... I really have to wonder how this class keeps evading some well deserved toning down patch after patch. > Anet should start with a severe reduction to all blocks, evades and invulns and then move on to power and clone reductions if that is not enough. > You seriously should get over your beloved scourge nerf, so you cant faceroll over people that easly ... Because you dont contribute to a thread or whatever just by complainting they are have too much of everything.And read entire thread and its suggestions. Mesmer doesnt have any 'block' spams which is random from storm ,especially invul is f4 on 50s cd (unless suddenly everyone go domi signets!pogchamp!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oozo.7856 Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 Those kitten OP mesmers with their sword ambushes and shield blocks. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 > @"Oozo.7856" said: > Those kitten OP mesmers with their sword ambushes and shield blocks. :P :'( Nailed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oozo.7856 Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 > @"Legatus.3608" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > Low skill floor=anyone can pick it up and perform well > > High skill floor=it is difficult for a beginner to do well with > > Low skill ceiling=even played well it is difficult to succeed with due to lacking mechanics or tools > > High skill ceiling=difficult to use well, possessing a plethora of tools to use and abuse, s tier > > > > Currently mesmer has a low skill floor (see video) and a high skill ceiling. This means anyone can pick it up quickly, and in the hands of skilled users they are even more powerful. A bad combination > > I think you've got low and high skill floor backwards. The skill level goes From 1 to 100, and the floor is 50, you've got a really high floor, meaning you always play at least half decent even if you're afk. If the floor is 1 that means you're contributing nothing if you're bad though. Skill floor is the necessary skill for a person new to the class to learn the basics of the class. Skill ceiling is the potential the class has in the hands of an experienced player. A class that has many different tools that require quick thinking to react fast enough to apply the right tool for the right situation and/or difficult-to-execute tricks available to it is said to have a high skill ceiling. The best players don't usually end up playing low skill ceiling classes because they will be frustrated by the lack of tools/tricks to handle different situations. The best players obviously don't care about skill floors. They only care about skill ceiling. Side note: Maybe classes isn't the appropriate way to frame this, however, since in GW2 some weapon sets are much easier to play than others and some stat combinations/builds are much easier to play than others. For example, it's much easier to play a condition thief than a glass cannon power thief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteepledHat.1345 Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 Because it used to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeteCommander.4937 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"Odik.4587" said: > > @"Jace al Thor.6745" said: > You should just make a thread with solution how to make mesmer more balanced,i would add to it as well ;) > Instead of posting it everywhere.. > On that video i recognized only silver players ,much wow ;) It should be bronze,a platinum player to leave a message. Dodge and bolck did not mes strength,u know nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > @"Jace al Thor.6745" said: > > You should just make a thread with solution how to make mesmer more balanced,i would add to it as well ;) > > Instead of posting it everywhere.. > > On that video i recognized only silver players ,much wow ;) > > It should be bronze,a platinum player to leave a message. > Dodge and bolck did not mes strength,u know nothing You wot mate? I truly beleive its impossible to drop to bronze unless its decay :D you would be carried regardless... What dodge...what block... what i know... ? Are you even talking to me ?D: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeteCommander.4937 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"Odik.4587" said: > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > @"Jace al Thor.6745" said: > > > You should just make a thread with solution how to make mesmer more balanced,i would add to it as well ;) > > > Instead of posting it everywhere.. > > > On that video i recognized only silver players ,much wow ;) > > > > It should be bronze,a platinum player to leave a message. > > Dodge and bolck did not mes strength,u know nothing > You wot mate? I truly beleive its impossible to drop to bronze unless its decay :D you would be carried regardless... > What dodge...what block... what i know... ? Are you even talking to me ?D: yeah.Bm didt know the advantage of mes，shatter + others at same time is mes advantage rather not dodge and block Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeteCommander.4937 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 please show me 1v2 in platinum or defeat Druid by yourself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > @"Jace al Thor.6745" said: > > > > You should just make a thread with solution how to make mesmer more balanced,i would add to it as well ;) > > > > Instead of posting it everywhere.. > > > > On that video i recognized only silver players ,much wow ;) > > > > > > It should be bronze,a platinum player to leave a message. > > > Dodge and bolck did not mes strength,u know nothing > > You wot mate? I truly beleive its impossible to drop to bronze unless its decay :D you would be carried regardless... > > What dodge...what block... what i know... ? Are you even talking to me ?D: > > yeah.Bm didt know the advantage of mes，shatter + others at same time is mes advantage rather not dodge and block I'm sorry ,but im confused...Quotes doesnt help me to understand what exactly you mean ... :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeteCommander.4937 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"Odik.4587" said: > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > @"Jace al Thor.6745" said: > > > > > You should just make a thread with solution how to make mesmer more balanced,i would add to it as well ;) > > > > > Instead of posting it everywhere.. > > > > > On that video i recognized only silver players ,much wow ;) > > > > > > > > It should be bronze,a platinum player to leave a message. > > > > Dodge and bolck did not mes strength,u know nothing > > > You wot mate? I truly beleive its impossible to drop to bronze unless its decay :D you would be carried regardless... > > > What dodge...what block... what i know... ? Are you even talking to me ?D: > > > > yeah.Bm didt know the advantage of mes，shatter + others at same time is mes advantage rather not dodge and block > > I'm sorry ,but im confused...Quotes doesnt help me to understand what exactly you mean ... :D I want to reply to BM ，sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egorum.9506 Posted March 26, 2018 Author Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > please show me 1v2 in platinum or defeat Druid by yourself It's offseason? Lmao. Plenty of druid deaths I can show though. Wait for CA to drop and burst, gg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > > > > @"Odik.4587" said: > > > > > > > @"Jace al Thor.6745" said: > > > > > > You should just make a thread with solution how to make mesmer more balanced,i would add to it as well ;) > > > > > > Instead of posting it everywhere.. > > > > > > On that video i recognized only silver players ,much wow ;) > > > > > > > > > > It should be bronze,a platinum player to leave a message. > > > > > Dodge and bolck did not mes strength,u know nothing > > > > You wot mate? I truly beleive its impossible to drop to bronze unless its decay :D you would be carried regardless... > > > > What dodge...what block... what i know... ? Are you even talking to me ?D: > > > > > > yeah.Bm didt know the advantage of mes，shatter + others at same time is mes advantage rather not dodge and block > > > > I'm sorry ,but im confused...Quotes doesnt help me to understand what exactly you mean ... :D > > I want to reply to BM ，sorry Watch Frostball monthly ,he couldnt kill druid and wouldnt kill it regardless of rotations from enemy/allies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeteCommander.4937 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > please show me 1v2 in platinum or defeat Druid by yourself > > It's offseason? Lmao. Plenty of druid deaths I can show though. Wait for CA to drop and burst, gg Please defeat Druid by yourself in platinum match ，please show me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egorum.9506 Posted March 26, 2018 Author Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > please show me 1v2 in platinum or defeat Druid by yourself > > > > It's offseason? Lmao. Plenty of druid deaths I can show though. Wait for CA to drop and burst, gg > > Please defeat Druid by yourself in platinum match ，please show me Again, I have no way of knowing what rank they're at. It is offseason. You sure you know enough about pvp to join the conversation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeteCommander.4937 Posted March 26, 2018 Share Posted March 26, 2018 > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > @"ZeteCommander.4937" said: > > > > please show me 1v2 in platinum or defeat Druid by yourself > > > > > > It's offseason? Lmao. Plenty of druid deaths I can show though. Wait for CA to drop and burst, gg > > > > Please defeat Druid by yourself in platinum match ，please show me > > Again, I have no way of knowing what rank they're at. It is offseason. You sure you know enough about pvp to join the conversation? It is meaningless to bully the novice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatdarnkatz.7168 Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 So to answer your original question in the title, mesmer had a very high skill floor pre PoF as it did little damage, and to be at all useful to your team, you were required how to use the staff ports and portal very well in order to actually make a difference. Mesmer has a high skill floor, however mirage and the rework have definitely dropped it. Please go look at pre PoF tournaments, distorical world tournaments and see that very few mesmers actually were any good, and the only reason Lord Helseth is a name that anyone knows is because of that fact. That being said, while I do in fact think that the mesmer needs looked at (which was BOUND to happen after a major rework), Mirage itself is hard countered by S/D thief, which maintains a place in the meta partially thanks to the need of too much Mirage. People act like they are unbeatable when you either are playing a class that it counters well, or you just don't know how they work. Once again, they need some rebalance, and screen spam is pretty bad when using specific traits, however a lot of people complaining are lacking the skill or knowledge to beat them, and complain instead of learning because that's easier. Going to say it again. MESMER NEEDS LOOKED AT AND BALANCED, but isn't as bad as people say. Have to make it clear because someone is going to say that I think mesmer is balanced, and I don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace al Thor.6745 Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 > @"thatdarnkatz.7168" said: > So to answer your original question in the title, mesmer had a very high skill floor pre PoF as it did little damage, and to be at all useful to your team, you were required how to use the staff ports and portal very well in order to actually make a difference. Mesmer has a high skill floor, however mirage and the rework have definitely dropped it. Please go look at pre PoF tournaments, distorical world tournaments and see that very few mesmers actually were any good, and the only reason Lord Helseth is a name that anyone knows is because of that fact. That being said, while I do in fact think that the mesmer needs looked at (which was BOUND to happen after a major rework), Mirage itself is hard countered by S/D thief, which maintains a place in the meta partially thanks to the need of too much Mirage. People act like they are unbeatable when you either are playing a class that it counters well, or you just don't know how they work. Once again, they need some rebalance, and screen spam is pretty bad when using specific traits, however a lot of people complaining are lacking the skill or knowledge to beat them, and complain instead of learning because that's easier. Going to say it again. MESMER NEEDS LOOKED AT AND BALANCED, but isn't as bad as people say. Have to make it clear because someone is going to say that I think mesmer is balanced, and I don't. Most of us agree Mesmer needs nerfs. However, that’s where it ends. Mesmer mains want appropriate nerfs whereas everyone else wants to go full on tactical smiter boon from orbit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 > @"Jace al Thor.6745" said: > > @"thatdarnkatz.7168" said: > > So to answer your original question in the title, mesmer had a very high skill floor pre PoF as it did little damage, and to be at all useful to your team, you were required how to use the staff ports and portal very well in order to actually make a difference. Mesmer has a high skill floor, however mirage and the rework have definitely dropped it. Please go look at pre PoF tournaments, distorical world tournaments and see that very few mesmers actually were any good, and the only reason Lord Helseth is a name that anyone knows is because of that fact. That being said, while I do in fact think that the mesmer needs looked at (which was BOUND to happen after a major rework), Mirage itself is hard countered by S/D thief, which maintains a place in the meta partially thanks to the need of too much Mirage. People act like they are unbeatable when you either are playing a class that it counters well, or you just don't know how they work. Once again, they need some rebalance, and screen spam is pretty bad when using specific traits, however a lot of people complaining are lacking the skill or knowledge to beat them, and complain instead of learning because that's easier. Going to say it again. MESMER NEEDS LOOKED AT AND BALANCED, but isn't as bad as people say. Have to make it clear because someone is going to say that I think mesmer is balanced, and I don't. > > Most of us agree Mesmer needs nerfs. However, that’s where it ends. Mesmer mains want appropriate nerfs whereas everyone else wants to go full on tactical smiter boon from orbit I think it would also be appropriate to say that the Mesmer class has a low skill floor and a high skill ceiling as well. I'd also go on a limb and say that heavy nerfs **are** needed to bring Mesmer to a balanced state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serialkicker.5274 Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 Have you seen PvPers happy in any game at any point? Me neither. Of all PvP games I played, every single class or weapon was OP, often all of them at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FyzE.3472 Posted March 27, 2018 Share Posted March 27, 2018 > @"serialkicker.5274" said: > Have you seen PvPers happy in any game at any point? Me neither. Of all PvP games I played, every single class or weapon was OP, often all of them at the same time. The thing is, after the scrooge nerfs, everyone jumped n the next ~~OP~~ most balanced profession. Resulting in "Nurf X profession" threads. So, basically, X will change from patch to patch. Because balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egorum.9506 Posted March 27, 2018 Author Share Posted March 27, 2018 Scourge is getting all of their defenses (lol, what defenses!) gutted. I'd love the same to happen to mesmers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now