Why are guns used in Tyria?

[mauried.5608]

Its an interesting question because some of the best guns in the game are not available to the players other than by using them in situ.

eg the sniper rifles you see scattered around Tyria.

5000 range and basically one shots anything they hit.

There are some pretty nasty looking gatling type guns also that the Charr seem to have , but players cant use them either.

 

[alcopaul.2156]

import from cantha

[Castigator.3470]

In one heart the charr also have autoloading machine guns. They are, however not a machine gun in the 5.56 mm, 600-900 RPM kind, they are more along the line of 5 cm, 60 RPM.

This means those guns are likely designed to destroy Flame Legion Effigies, rather than infantry, but back when I tried to do the event, it seemed bugged. Legionnaire Sleekfur has some more info.

Then there's Iron Legion turret technology. Which is pretty advanced, the ones constructed by the charr look like the late 19. century designs from our world.

Then there's engineers like Smolt Copperscald, who work to integrate turrets into the currently casemate tanks of the legion. That's fast. It was in 1325, did his field tests succeed? If so, the Humans should be thankful they made peace.

 

And yet, of our classes, only a total of three can use a rifle. Warriors, Engineers and Deadeye Thieves.

And can I say I adore the Idea behind the Deadeye? Using cover, kneeling/laying down to get a more stable shooting position, having a target priority list.

Pistols are a also limited to three classes. Engineer, Thief and Mesmer.

Why are warriors incapable of using a sidearm pistol? Rytlock Brimstone and Ember Doomforge are confirmed pistol users. Okay, they are both charr, so it might be a racial thing, but why are the other classes so uninterested in the new weapons?

[Trise.2865]

Early firearms lacked the penetrating power to pierce heavy steel armor. Only a close-range shot from a blunderbuss, basically a portable cannon, could do enough damage to actually injure an armored knight... and only if it hit specific points in the armor. But, pierce it did, and as guns evolved to become more focused, more accurate, and more powerful, steel plate armor became less and less effective as a defense. Tyria is not quite at that stage yet.

 

Consider also: the primary enemy of most of Tyria is the undead, or enemies as relentless as undead. In a zombie apocalypse scenario, guns are usually the preferred weapon, but guns have severe limitations. Guns require ammunition. Guns can jam. Guns are less effective at closer range. Bullets sometimes penetrate too well, leaving the zombie unimpeded. That's when the plucky hero turns to their trusty baseball bat or chainsaw or army knife. The same is true here. A sword can't run out of ammo; a knife can't randomly not stab or cut... you get the idea.

 

As far as bows vs guns: There's a reason Native American warriors were able to battle and defeat United States soldiers in the early days of continental expansion. In the absence of heavy armor, bows and guns are equally effective killing implements. But, bows have some powerful advantages over guns in guerrilla style warfare: Bows are silent, guns are not. Bows can fire over and around cover, guns need line of sight. Arrows can be re-used, and replenished using sticks and rocks; bullets must be manufactured... etc.

 

Outdated weaponry may be outclassed by firearms (eventually), but they are far from useless (especially when the enemy doesn't have guns). I'm reminded of that scene from Starship Troopers...

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

All weapons in this game have a magic component. It's misleading to think of them as analogues of Earth-bound counterparts with similar names. I like to think of them as being magical tools to focus energies appropriately. That's why a mesmer GS is more like a laser beam, a guardian can "spin to win" causing projectile damage, a warrior will cause more damage to low-health foes and hit 5 targets, and a ranger hits 3 targets and evades... all using the same weapon.

 

I realize some will quibble about what is magic and what is a "focus for magical energies" — the main idea is that this is reasonably consistent with how the game works, how the NPCs describe magic and professions, and allows us as players to not worry about how a shield can sometimes block pistol shots and sometimes not.

 

Similarly, some metal objects can suffer from Burning, but some wood objects don't. The same plant in Tyria can drop Vanilla, Mint, Clove, Dill, Coriander, etc. And well, there is literally life after death in the game.

 

tl;dr don't get too caught up in comparing our earthly ideas to Tyria's — sometimes they'll align nicely; sometimes they won't

[Dadnir.5038]

> @"cyhadam.3082" said:

> Ok but still guns vs swords, guns would win. There was no need for anet to add guns for gameplay.

 

I think the way you look at things is a bit to narrow here. You look at things based on our "reality" where there is no "magic". GW2 is a world with magic which mean that guns may not be the most effective way to deal damage against magic imbued defense. Whereas a sword imbue with magic might have devastating effects. The complexity of a gun might make a difference in the flow of magic that pass throught while the simplicity of a sword might be the perfect catalyst.

[starhunter.6015]

> @"Dadnir.5038" said:

> > @"cyhadam.3082" said:

> > Ok but still guns vs swords, guns would win. There was no need for anet to add guns for gameplay.

>

> I think the way you look at things is a bit to narrow here. You look at things based on our "reality" where there is no "magic". GW2 is a world with magic which mean that guns may not be the most effective way to deal damage against magic imbued defense. Whereas a sword imbue with magic might have devastating effects. The complexity of a gun might make a difference in the flow of magic that pass throught while the simplicity of a sword might be the perfect catalyst.

 

Agreed, can even look at guns as a tool to help channel magic for those who tend to lack. Bullets could be nothing more then magic infused shells that discharge the magic bullet/shot. Just picture a low level castor gun from Outlaw Star.

[Dustfinger.9510]

> @"Cuddy.6247" said:

> > @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> > Might as well be asking "In a world with magic, why does anyone bother with swords and bandages?"

> >

> > There is no simple answer beyond "flavor of the gameplay" really. But if you want a lore explanation there's a wide variety of possibilities: accessibility and manuefacturing (a sword will always be easier to buy or make than a gun), reliability (in our history, early guns were really slow to reload, with a single shot and not that great accuracy), and the nature of foes being fought (a piercing gunshot does less damage to a crystalline monster than being able to chop off limbs) are all pretty likely candidates.

> >

> > Then there's also the fact that you might as well ask that very question of why we still have swords and knives in our modern military. Even going into history, officers having swords were common practice in the American Revolution and American Civil War. Even in modern times, guns are not reliable enough to rely solely on them for combative purposes. You may not bring a knife to a gun fight if you had a gun handy, but if that gun is no longer handy you'll want that knife over bare fists.

>

> Knives are given to modern personnel because knives are an extremely useful tool. Nobody's issuing a knife for combat purposes.

 

Konig's Right. Knives are issued for combat purposes. As well as the training to be used in combat.

 

 

[Elva.6372]

In real world history, firearms, cannons, swords, calvary and armor were used together in battles for centuries this ended after the **World War I** when technology finally surpassed the far older methods of butchery. (Both Douglas MacArthur and George S. Patton had calvary experience for example.)

 

In Tyria, magic allows all the different methods to work by equalizing their efficacy. It's a steampunk world, after all.

[ZDragon.3046]

> @"cyhadam.3082" said:

> If guns exist in Tyria, why does it make sense to use swords or shields? Are the guns and pistols not as powerful as I think? Thanks.

 

Because warriors use magic too. Everyone uses magic and in a world with magic a gun is by far one of the weakest weapons. A magic infused shield that can reflect projectiles makes a gun pretty weak dont you think ;)

 

Yes its confirmed warriors do use magic how else would they move around like a thief with all that heavy armor, hit so hard, and continuously use adrenaline over and over again far beyond mortal limits.

 

Heck most professions have skills that make them immune to bullets in a sort one way or another.

 

In short guns are still useful in the word for those who do not have as strong of inner magic as others but they are far from being the best weapons of destruction in the game.

 

[Klypto.1703]

This reminds me an issue I had where I liked the arcane sniper rifle better than any of the black lion or legendary skins but with deadeye I sort of needed stat swapping to go along with the legendary armor so I just made a hms divinity and reskinned it with the arcane rifle. Since one looks like a toy and one that doesn't seem to fit with tyria imo. Although it looks asuran with arcane properties which made me like it more since it made sense over the others.

[mauried.5608]

In the world of Tyria weapons dont work the same way as in the real world.

eg in the real world if I swung a huge sword at you and it hit you, you would instantly be dead.

Likewise if I shoot you in the head with a gun you would instantly be dead.

In this game though, all that happens is that you lose a tiny bit of health, but dont die .

If you do die , you just get ressed.

Its a world of fantasy where there is no relationship to the real world at all.

There isnt even any real physics at work.

Players can run forever and dont get tired.

Players can carry around huge bags of stuff and it doesnt slow them down.

Players can run uphill and downhill at exactly the same speed as they run along the flat.

Gravity as it exists in the real world does not exist, as if you jump off a cliff you fall at a constant speed.

Ive often wondered whether any MMO game company would ever make a really hardcore MMO where if your character got killed, it would instantly be deleted along with

all its possessions.

That would make for some really challenging content.

 

[norbes.3620]

> @"mauried.5608" said:

 

> Gravity as it exists in the real world does not exist, as if you jump off a cliff you fall at a constant speed.

 

just thats in the real world ur Speed wont increase after u reached a certain Maximum and objects of different weight will travell with the same Speed