BlaqueFyre.5678 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"GreyWolf.8670" said: > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > @"Asltok.4327" said: > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > @"RoseofGilead.8907" said: > > > > > > > If a Commander is running a squad, they do have the right to tell people to switch to a different class; it's their tag and their squad, so they get to make the rules, as long as they're not verbally harassing anyone. However, the other players also have a right to not play in that Commander's squad and either join a new squad or just run along with the squad, without actually being IN the squad. No "technical solution" is needed here. > > > > > > > > > > > > But where do you draw the line, your saying they have the right to not let certain classes in, can also exclude people they don't like? Can also exclude people of certain religions or ethnicity too? Oh now it's against tos. Hard to know how or why people are excluded. I think that in wvw if your tagged up, anyone from your server can join,unless it's a guild group comprised 100% of guild members. > > > > > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > @"RoseofGilead.8907" said: > > > > > > > If a Commander is running a squad, they do have the right to tell people to switch to a different class; it's their tag and their squad, so they get to make the rules, as long as they're not verbally harassing anyone. However, the other players also have a right to not play in that Commander's squad and either join a new squad or just run along with the squad, without actually being IN the squad. No "technical solution" is needed here. > > > > > > > > > > > > But where do you draw the line, your saying they have the right to not let certain classes in, can also exclude people they don't like? Can also exclude people of certain religions or ethnicity too? Oh now it's against tos. Hard to know how or why people are excluded. I think that in wvw if your tagged up, anyone from your server can join,unless it's a guild group comprised 100% of guild members. > > > > > > > > > > Why are people attempting to join a squad in wvw bringing up their ethnicity and religion? > > > > > > > > They aren't, he just had to use an outrageous and extreme example to make his point look better. > > > > > > > > Here's what it is. If I don't want to play a video game with you, I won't. If I'm a leader of a group, I will reserve my right to pick who I want in my group. If I don't want certain classes, then I'm not taking them. This isn't some kindergarten inclusion zone. It's not my problem you chose to play the game in a way I deem ineffective, and I won't hamper my own time and enjoyment just to cater to you. And if it ever comes to extremes like that? It's still a video game that I use my time and money to enjoy, and if I don't want to play with you for whatever reason, I will make my own group with it's own requirements, because my time is mine alone, and I choose how to spend it. > > > > > > I feel like you should only be able to scrutinize if you have a 100% guild squad, as soon as you take in a pug, I don't feel like you should be able to exclude for any reason. > > > > Player 1 should never be able to force player 2 to play with him. > > > > If we are going to use outrageous examples here: > > > > Forcing someone else to play with you, when they do not wish to do so, is slavery. > > > > Slavery is bad. > > Slavery? You've just blown up any argument you may have. > > Isn't WvW open-join? If so, no player has the right to tell another how or what to play, 300g commander tag or not. Nope. My point is accurate. Feel free to believe that attempting to force others to work for you against their will is not just as I claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyWolf.8670 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > @"GreyWolf.8670" said: > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > @"Asltok.4327" said: > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > > @"RoseofGilead.8907" said: > > > > > > > > If a Commander is running a squad, they do have the right to tell people to switch to a different class; it's their tag and their squad, so they get to make the rules, as long as they're not verbally harassing anyone. However, the other players also have a right to not play in that Commander's squad and either join a new squad or just run along with the squad, without actually being IN the squad. No "technical solution" is needed here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But where do you draw the line, your saying they have the right to not let certain classes in, can also exclude people they don't like? Can also exclude people of certain religions or ethnicity too? Oh now it's against tos. Hard to know how or why people are excluded. I think that in wvw if your tagged up, anyone from your server can join,unless it's a guild group comprised 100% of guild members. > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > > @"RoseofGilead.8907" said: > > > > > > > > If a Commander is running a squad, they do have the right to tell people to switch to a different class; it's their tag and their squad, so they get to make the rules, as long as they're not verbally harassing anyone. However, the other players also have a right to not play in that Commander's squad and either join a new squad or just run along with the squad, without actually being IN the squad. No "technical solution" is needed here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But where do you draw the line, your saying they have the right to not let certain classes in, can also exclude people they don't like? Can also exclude people of certain religions or ethnicity too? Oh now it's against tos. Hard to know how or why people are excluded. I think that in wvw if your tagged up, anyone from your server can join,unless it's a guild group comprised 100% of guild members. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why are people attempting to join a squad in wvw bringing up their ethnicity and religion? > > > > > > > > > > They aren't, he just had to use an outrageous and extreme example to make his point look better. > > > > > > > > > > Here's what it is. If I don't want to play a video game with you, I won't. If I'm a leader of a group, I will reserve my right to pick who I want in my group. If I don't want certain classes, then I'm not taking them. This isn't some kindergarten inclusion zone. It's not my problem you chose to play the game in a way I deem ineffective, and I won't hamper my own time and enjoyment just to cater to you. And if it ever comes to extremes like that? It's still a video game that I use my time and money to enjoy, and if I don't want to play with you for whatever reason, I will make my own group with it's own requirements, because my time is mine alone, and I choose how to spend it. > > > > > > > > I feel like you should only be able to scrutinize if you have a 100% guild squad, as soon as you take in a pug, I don't feel like you should be able to exclude for any reason. > > > > > > Player 1 should never be able to force player 2 to play with him. > > > > > > If we are going to use outrageous examples here: > > > > > > Forcing someone else to play with you, when they do not wish to do so, is slavery. > > > > > > Slavery is bad. > > > > Slavery? You've just blown up any argument you may have. > > > > Isn't WvW open-join? If so, no player has the right to tell another how or what to play, 300g commander tag or not. > > Nope. My point is accurate. Feel free to believe that attempting to force others to work for you against their will is not just as I claim. Does this only work one way? It's bad to expect a commander to take anyone in but it's ok for a commander to force someone to play a profession they don't want to? And just to be clear, what you're describing is just a normal part of being an adult and having to cooperate with someone you don't really want to. Players do not own commanders and both are free to leave whenever they want. It is _not_ slavery. IMO if a commander doesn't like the selection of players they have to make a squad they should bow out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyWolf.8670 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. See my post above. Why is it ok for a commander to force a player to do what they want but not the other way around? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqueFyre.5678 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"GreyWolf.8670" said: > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > See my post above. Why is it ok for a commander to force a player to do what they want but not the other way around? The commanders aren’t forcing anyone to do anything, they don’t force players to join their squad, they don’t force a player to play a specific class or build, they only who they will allow in *THEIR* squad, the players choose if they want to run asked for builds or not not forced to run them, there is a huge difference there, again certain players are stating that they should be able to Force a Commander to have to play with them even if that Commander doesn’t want to, I wonder what that sounds like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperadordf.2687 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"GreyWolf.8670" said: > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > @"GreyWolf.8670" said: > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > @"Asltok.4327" said: > > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > > > @"RoseofGilead.8907" said: > > > > > > > > > If a Commander is running a squad, they do have the right to tell people to switch to a different class; it's their tag and their squad, so they get to make the rules, as long as they're not verbally harassing anyone. However, the other players also have a right to not play in that Commander's squad and either join a new squad or just run along with the squad, without actually being IN the squad. No "technical solution" is needed here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But where do you draw the line, your saying they have the right to not let certain classes in, can also exclude people they don't like? Can also exclude people of certain religions or ethnicity too? Oh now it's against tos. Hard to know how or why people are excluded. I think that in wvw if your tagged up, anyone from your server can join,unless it's a guild group comprised 100% of guild members. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > > > @"RoseofGilead.8907" said: > > > > > > > > > If a Commander is running a squad, they do have the right to tell people to switch to a different class; it's their tag and their squad, so they get to make the rules, as long as they're not verbally harassing anyone. However, the other players also have a right to not play in that Commander's squad and either join a new squad or just run along with the squad, without actually being IN the squad. No "technical solution" is needed here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But where do you draw the line, your saying they have the right to not let certain classes in, can also exclude people they don't like? Can also exclude people of certain religions or ethnicity too? Oh now it's against tos. Hard to know how or why people are excluded. I think that in wvw if your tagged up, anyone from your server can join,unless it's a guild group comprised 100% of guild members. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why are people attempting to join a squad in wvw bringing up their ethnicity and religion? > > > > > > > > > > > > They aren't, he just had to use an outrageous and extreme example to make his point look better. > > > > > > > > > > > > Here's what it is. If I don't want to play a video game with you, I won't. If I'm a leader of a group, I will reserve my right to pick who I want in my group. If I don't want certain classes, then I'm not taking them. This isn't some kindergarten inclusion zone. It's not my problem you chose to play the game in a way I deem ineffective, and I won't hamper my own time and enjoyment just to cater to you. And if it ever comes to extremes like that? It's still a video game that I use my time and money to enjoy, and if I don't want to play with you for whatever reason, I will make my own group with it's own requirements, because my time is mine alone, and I choose how to spend it. > > > > > > > > > > I feel like you should only be able to scrutinize if you have a 100% guild squad, as soon as you take in a pug, I don't feel like you should be able to exclude for any reason. > > > > > > > > Player 1 should never be able to force player 2 to play with him. > > > > > > > > If we are going to use outrageous examples here: > > > > > > > > Forcing someone else to play with you, when they do not wish to do so, is slavery. > > > > > > > > Slavery is bad. > > > > > > Slavery? You've just blown up any argument you may have. > > > > > > Isn't WvW open-join? If so, no player has the right to tell another how or what to play, 300g commander tag or not. > > > > Nope. My point is accurate. Feel free to believe that attempting to force others to work for you against their will is not just as I claim. > > Does this only work one way? It's bad to expect a commander to take anyone in but it's ok for a commander to force someone to play a profession they don't want to? > > And just to be clear, what you're describing is just a normal part of being an adult and having to cooperate with someone you don't really want to. Players do not own commanders and both are free to leave whenever they want. It is _not_ slavery. IMO if a commander doesn't like the selection of players they have to make a squad they should bow out. - Commander is the owner of the squad. - Nobody's **forcing** anybody to play anything. - Commander's don't cooperate, not the way that you are implying. Commanders **lead**. - Players don't own commanders and commanders **own** the squad. - "Slavery" was a hyperbole @"Ashen.2907" used against the troll guy's hyperbole. - So if I am a commander and I have a 30 man squad, but if a guy's playing a **non-zerg build that doesn't give any benefits to the squad** I can't kick him? What kind of an argument is that? I have the commander tag for a reason y'know. Let's take a 31-man squad for example. 1 Commander, 29 people wanting to win and 1 snowflake who thinks he/she can do whatever he/she wants. 29 people don't want to play with the snowflake because snowflake constantly rallies the enemies and doesn't do anything that can benefit the squad. But the commander can't kick him/her because what reason? Because he/she can get offended? Commander can kick anybody he/she wants and take anybody he/she wants to **him/her** squad. _As long as the Commander isn't violating any rules of ToS (like harrassing people verbally) he/she can do whatever he/she wants._ End of discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rashagar.8349 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Imperadordf.2687" said: > > @"GreyWolf.8670" said: > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > @"GreyWolf.8670" said: > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > @"Asltok.4327" said: > > > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"RoseofGilead.8907" said: > > > > > > > > > > If a Commander is running a squad, they do have the right to tell people to switch to a different class; it's their tag and their squad, so they get to make the rules, as long as they're not verbally harassing anyone. However, the other players also have a right to not play in that Commander's squad and either join a new squad or just run along with the squad, without actually being IN the squad. No "technical solution" is needed here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But where do you draw the line, your saying they have the right to not let certain classes in, can also exclude people they don't like? Can also exclude people of certain religions or ethnicity too? Oh now it's against tos. Hard to know how or why people are excluded. I think that in wvw if your tagged up, anyone from your server can join,unless it's a guild group comprised 100% of guild members. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"RoseofGilead.8907" said: > > > > > > > > > > If a Commander is running a squad, they do have the right to tell people to switch to a different class; it's their tag and their squad, so they get to make the rules, as long as they're not verbally harassing anyone. However, the other players also have a right to not play in that Commander's squad and either join a new squad or just run along with the squad, without actually being IN the squad. No "technical solution" is needed here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But where do you draw the line, your saying they have the right to not let certain classes in, can also exclude people they don't like? Can also exclude people of certain religions or ethnicity too? Oh now it's against tos. Hard to know how or why people are excluded. I think that in wvw if your tagged up, anyone from your server can join,unless it's a guild group comprised 100% of guild members. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why are people attempting to join a squad in wvw bringing up their ethnicity and religion? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > They aren't, he just had to use an outrageous and extreme example to make his point look better. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Here's what it is. If I don't want to play a video game with you, I won't. If I'm a leader of a group, I will reserve my right to pick who I want in my group. If I don't want certain classes, then I'm not taking them. This isn't some kindergarten inclusion zone. It's not my problem you chose to play the game in a way I deem ineffective, and I won't hamper my own time and enjoyment just to cater to you. And if it ever comes to extremes like that? It's still a video game that I use my time and money to enjoy, and if I don't want to play with you for whatever reason, I will make my own group with it's own requirements, because my time is mine alone, and I choose how to spend it. > > > > > > > > > > > > I feel like you should only be able to scrutinize if you have a 100% guild squad, as soon as you take in a pug, I don't feel like you should be able to exclude for any reason. > > > > > > > > > > Player 1 should never be able to force player 2 to play with him. > > > > > > > > > > If we are going to use outrageous examples here: > > > > > > > > > > Forcing someone else to play with you, when they do not wish to do so, is slavery. > > > > > > > > > > Slavery is bad. > > > > > > > > Slavery? You've just blown up any argument you may have. > > > > > > > > Isn't WvW open-join? If so, no player has the right to tell another how or what to play, 300g commander tag or not. > > > > > > Nope. My point is accurate. Feel free to believe that attempting to force others to work for you against their will is not just as I claim. > > > > Does this only work one way? It's bad to expect a commander to take anyone in but it's ok for a commander to force someone to play a profession they don't want to? > > > > And just to be clear, what you're describing is just a normal part of being an adult and having to cooperate with someone you don't really want to. Players do not own commanders and both are free to leave whenever they want. It is _not_ slavery. IMO if a commander doesn't like the selection of players they have to make a squad they should bow out. > > - Commander is the owner of the squad. > - Nobody's **forcing** anybody to play anything. > > - Commander's don't cooperate, not the way that you are implying. Commanders **lead**. > - Players don't own commanders and commanders **own** the squad. > - "Slavery" was a hyperbole @"Ashen.2907" used against the troll guy's hyperbole. > - So if I am a commander and I have a 30 man squad, but if a guy's playing a **non-zerg build that doesn't give any benefits to the squad** I can't kick him? What kind of an argument is that? I have the commander tag for a reason y'know. > > Let's take a 31-man squad for example. 1 Commander, 29 people wanting to win and 1 snowflake who thinks he/she can do whatever he/she wants. 29 people don't want to play with the snowflake because snowflake constantly rallies the enemies and doesn't do anything that can benefit the squad. But the commander can't kick him/her because what reason? Because he/she can get offended? > > Commander can kick anybody he/she wants and take anybody he/she wants to **him/her** squad. > > _As long as the Commander isn't violating any rules of ToS (like harrassing people verbally) he/she can do whatever he/she wants._ End of discussion. And people use the word entitled to describe the *other* side... =P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Odinens.5920" said: > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" > > I don't know why I even respond to you anymore, as you clearly make posts just to stir up arguments. I also don't know how many different ways I can explain to you that you are wrong. > > GW2 open world - If you want to hang out in Crystal Desert (example), but the max number of people allowed on the map has been reached, the game creates a new map to allow you to hang out there. Nobody is ever shut out of a map. > > GW2 instanced map - PvP; 10 people allowed, that's it, no new map. Dungeons; 5 people allowed, that's it, no new map. PvE raids; 10 people allowed, that's it, no new map. WvW; 80-100 people allowed (don't know the exact number) per server, that's it, no new map. > > Limited number of people allowed on the map means instanced, which means a queue if it's full, which also means a commander, who also has a limit of 50 people for his/her squad, has the right to form the type of squad he/she wants. This also means that if you don't have the class/build or voice comms he/she requests you don't HAVE to be in their squad. Find a commander that will take you, follow the tag while not being in the squad, roam solo or with other people, or switch classes/builds to accommodate the one commander you seem intent on joining. a game imposed player cap on a zone has nothing to do with whether it is open or closed world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. That includes excluding people for inappropriate social issues, which they are not allowed to do, no matter how entitled you think they might be to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqueFyre.5678 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. And they are 100% abiding by Anets Rules, Show me where Anet States that’s Commander’s have to allow everyone and Anyone into their Squads and that said commanders cant kick players that they don’t want in their Squads from their Squads, I’ll wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > > > yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. > > And they are 100% abiding by Anets Rules, Show me where Anet States that’s Commander’s have to allow everyone and Anyone into their Squads and that said commanders cant kick players that they don’t want in their Squads from their Squads, I’ll wait. yah and if they kick someone from a squad for being disabeled, they would get a ban, so right there they are not entitled to "do whatever they want" with their squads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqueFyre.5678 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > > > > > yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. > > > > And they are 100% abiding by Anets Rules, Show me where Anet States that’s Commander’s have to allow everyone and Anyone into their Squads and that said commanders cant kick players that they don’t want in their Squads from their Squads, I’ll wait. > > yah and if they kick someone from a squad for being disabeled, they would get a ban, so right there they are not entitled to "do whatever they want" with their squads. And does that have any bearing on this thread? No? Please stop trying to derail the thread and can you prove that’s the reason they were kicked? No? So please show me where it’s stated that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone in their Squads and that they can’t kick anyone they want from their Squads. Again I’ll wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > > > > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > > > > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > > > > > > > yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. > > > > > > And they are 100% abiding by Anets Rules, Show me where Anet States that’s Commander’s have to allow everyone and Anyone into their Squads and that said commanders cant kick players that they don’t want in their Squads from their Squads, I’ll wait. > > > > yah and if they kick someone from a squad for being disabeled, they would get a ban, so right there they are not entitled to "do whatever they want" with their squads. > > And does that have any bearing on this thread? No? Please stop trying to derail the thread and can you prove that’s the reason they were kicked? No? So please show me where it’s stated that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone in their Squads and that they can’t kick anyone they want from their Squads. Again I’ll wait. Oh im just showing you that commanders cant do whatever they want, even though you say they can. There is a clear line that they cant, so maybe the entitlement attitude should be curbed a little. Im well aware of the mechanics of squads and commanders, but like I said its not so black and white. Yes commanders can mechanically do whatever they want in a squad, and im showing an example of how even if they do what they want it can still get them in trouble. If i want to show you proof of it, all I have to do is show you the ToS. So in the future be a little more reserved in talking about commanders in the sense that they are not gods, and they do not have the right to do as they please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqueFyre.5678 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > > > > > > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > > > > > > > > > yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. > > > > > > > > And they are 100% abiding by Anets Rules, Show me where Anet States that’s Commander’s have to allow everyone and Anyone into their Squads and that said commanders cant kick players that they don’t want in their Squads from their Squads, I’ll wait. > > > > > > yah and if they kick someone from a squad for being disabeled, they would get a ban, so right there they are not entitled to "do whatever they want" with their squads. > > > > And does that have any bearing on this thread? No? Please stop trying to derail the thread and can you prove that’s the reason they were kicked? No? So please show me where it’s stated that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone in their Squads and that they can’t kick anyone they want from their Squads. Again I’ll wait. > > Oh im just showing you that commanders cant do whatever they want, even though you say they can. There is a clear line that they cant, so maybe the entitlement attitude should be curbed a little. Im well aware of the mechanics of squads and commanders, but like I said its not so black and white. Yes commanders can mechanically do whatever they want in a squad, and im showing an example of how even if they do what they want it can still get them in trouble. If i want to show you proof of it, all I have to do is show you the ToS. So in the future be a little more reserved in talking about commanders in the sense that they are not gods, and they do not have the right to do as they please. Did I ever say they could do whatever they want? No? Did I say Commanders we’re gods or had the authority of gods? No? Oh wow funny. Again show me where they are breaking ToS by picking and choosing who they allow in their squad, show me where Anet states that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone into their squad, again I will wait. And again please try to keep the discussion on track which is about Commanders picking and choosing who they allow in their Squad based on class/spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seinka.4823 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Rashagar.8349" said: > > @"Imperadordf.2687" said: > > > > - Commander is the owner of the squad. > > - Nobody's **forcing** anybody to play anything. > > > > - Commander's don't cooperate, not the way that you are implying. Commanders **lead**. > > - Players don't own commanders and commanders **own** the squad. > > - "Slavery" was a hyperbole @"Ashen.2907" used against the troll guy's hyperbole. > > - So if I am a commander and I have a 30 man squad, but if a guy's playing a **non-zerg build that doesn't give any benefits to the squad** I can't kick him? What kind of an argument is that? I have the commander tag for a reason y'know. > > > > Let's take a 31-man squad for example. 1 Commander, 29 people wanting to win and 1 snowflake who thinks he/she can do whatever he/she wants. 29 people don't want to play with the snowflake because snowflake constantly rallies the enemies and doesn't do anything that can benefit the squad. But the commander can't kick him/her because what reason? Because he/she can get offended? > > > > Commander can kick anybody he/she wants and take anybody he/she wants to **him/her** squad. > > > > _As long as the Commander isn't violating any rules of ToS (like harrassing people verbally) he/she can do whatever he/she wants._ End of discussion. > > And people use the word entitled to describe the *other* side... > > =P Care to elaborate? :) And I really mean it, I don't understand how Imperadordf's post is "entitled" and since your previous post made sense, I'd like to ask you to explain to me your point of view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > > > > > > > > > > > yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. > > > > > > > > > > And they are 100% abiding by Anets Rules, Show me where Anet States that’s Commander’s have to allow everyone and Anyone into their Squads and that said commanders cant kick players that they don’t want in their Squads from their Squads, I’ll wait. > > > > > > > > yah and if they kick someone from a squad for being disabeled, they would get a ban, so right there they are not entitled to "do whatever they want" with their squads. > > > > > > And does that have any bearing on this thread? No? Please stop trying to derail the thread and can you prove that’s the reason they were kicked? No? So please show me where it’s stated that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone in their Squads and that they can’t kick anyone they want from their Squads. Again I’ll wait. > > > > Oh im just showing you that commanders cant do whatever they want, even though you say they can. There is a clear line that they cant, so maybe the entitlement attitude should be curbed a little. Im well aware of the mechanics of squads and commanders, but like I said its not so black and white. Yes commanders can mechanically do whatever they want in a squad, and im showing an example of how even if they do what they want it can still get them in trouble. If i want to show you proof of it, all I have to do is show you the ToS. So in the future be a little more reserved in talking about commanders in the sense that they are not gods, and they do not have the right to do as they please. > > Did I ever say they could do whatever they want? No? Did I say Commanders we’re gods or had the authority of gods? No? Oh wow funny. > > Again show me where they are breaking ToS by picking and choosing who they allow in their squad, show me where Anet states that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone into their squad, again I will wait. > > And again please try to keep the discussion on track which is about Commanders picking and choosing who they allow in their Squad based on class/spec. exclusion of any kind is what kills game modes, you would think they would want to stop that. Sadly anet is hands off with social issues to an extent, and so they leave it open for everyone to chose what to do in social issues. Its a grey area when anet says things like, this is an mmo for everyone and then leave game modes almost solely dependent on commanders and zergs (like wvw) in order to even enjoy it. Then allows commanders to exclude for basically any reason as long as they are quiet socially about it. The point of the thread is talking about how players don't like being excluded for these reasons and that perhaps anet should think of a way to fix/change it, especially in these game modes where squads/commanders are necessary in order to enjoy the game mode to its fullest. Again there is nothing talking about what commanders cant do aside from the ToS, which can be circumnavigated by simply not talking. Sadly the real reason commanders exclude could be anything, including not liking someones build or the person themselves. I firmly believe that in an open world setting like wvw which is dependent on zergs and commanders, that the responsibility to command should be put onto the commanders and not individual players. I don't think individual players should have to conform to what a commander wants. I think commanders should adapt/lead/and guide players using whatever builds/specs those players have (since those players bought the game too and they want to play their way, and by telling them how to play you are infringing on their rights, and their money, and their playtime, in order to be part of something as necessary as a squad in a setting that is publicly open like wvw). I feel like squads should be forced open, in the wvw setting and that commanders should be the one to remain flexible, not the individual players. It even makes more sense as most squads are comprised of pugs who are random individuals enjoying the game, does it make more sense to tell every single person who joins in to curb their build/specs so one person (the commander) gets what he wants? Or does it make sense to tell the commander, no the responsibility is on you to lead (which is an optional activity) and to lead everyone, because their play time is JUST AS IMPORTANT as yours. To that end if commanders don't like it or they don't want to adapt, I feel like they should not tag up (since they are refusing to be flexible and lead with what they have anyways, and someone else who can do this should be leading, and by tagging down on that map they are giving someone else who is more flexible and adaptive to command). Or if commanders like they can simply run a closed squad comprised ENTIRELY of guild members, where they are all in agreement to conforming to what the commander wants anyways. I'm sorry but pugs should have more rights and say in wvw and in all game modes, I don't understand the constant denigration towards people who don't want to join guilds or conform to some imaginary leader (who isnt being much of a leader at all). All anyone on here ever preaches is that everyone should just conform or get out, what about those peoples play time and the money they spent on the game (which is the majority since commanders are minority)? All i see is that commanders payed a lousy 300g and they set the tag up so we should really be concerned with their playtime and their playtime only and what they want to do and how is their play session going, if you dont like it then just dont follow them is the only solution? What about everyone elses playtime? why does it all revolve around one guy? How is this ok in a game mode like wvw which is dependent on a commander to enjoy (for the most part) who now also has the ability to exclude anyone for almost any reason, thus effectively excluding them from the enjoyment of the game mode itself? Shouldn't the commanders lead the community and be flexible so everyone can enjoy the game mode? What is the purpose of excluding someone from squad in wvw anyways? they still run along side the zerg and participate but now they get low priority for buffs and wipe more, which in turn raises enemies, why impose this on players? It also affects their ability to tag enemies and get credit (less rewards/less enjoyment). Why put this power in the hands of the commander anyways, in this style of game mode? Would make more sense to just eliminate squads entirely in wvw and just have a tag that everyone follows, because were all here anyways, and we all just want to enjoy the game mode. After all its a game? why exclude people, its supposed to be for fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperadordf.2687 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" There are a lot of exclusion in high-end PvE stuff. I've yet to see Raids getting "killed". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Imperadordf.2687" said: > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" > > There are a lot of exclusion in high-end PvE stuff. I've yet to see Raids getting "killed". > raids are closed instances, not open world like wvw is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqueFyre.5678 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > > > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. > > > > > > > > > > > > And they are 100% abiding by Anets Rules, Show me where Anet States that’s Commander’s have to allow everyone and Anyone into their Squads and that said commanders cant kick players that they don’t want in their Squads from their Squads, I’ll wait. > > > > > > > > > > yah and if they kick someone from a squad for being disabeled, they would get a ban, so right there they are not entitled to "do whatever they want" with their squads. > > > > > > > > And does that have any bearing on this thread? No? Please stop trying to derail the thread and can you prove that’s the reason they were kicked? No? So please show me where it’s stated that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone in their Squads and that they can’t kick anyone they want from their Squads. Again I’ll wait. > > > > > > Oh im just showing you that commanders cant do whatever they want, even though you say they can. There is a clear line that they cant, so maybe the entitlement attitude should be curbed a little. Im well aware of the mechanics of squads and commanders, but like I said its not so black and white. Yes commanders can mechanically do whatever they want in a squad, and im showing an example of how even if they do what they want it can still get them in trouble. If i want to show you proof of it, all I have to do is show you the ToS. So in the future be a little more reserved in talking about commanders in the sense that they are not gods, and they do not have the right to do as they please. > > > > Did I ever say they could do whatever they want? No? Did I say Commanders we’re gods or had the authority of gods? No? Oh wow funny. > > > > Again show me where they are breaking ToS by picking and choosing who they allow in their squad, show me where Anet states that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone into their squad, again I will wait. > > > > And again please try to keep the discussion on track which is about Commanders picking and choosing who they allow in their Squad based on class/spec. > > exclusion of any kind is what kills game modes, you would think they would want to stop that. Sadly anet is hands off with social issues to an extent, and so they leave it open for everyone to chose what to do in social issues. Its a grey area when anet says things like, this is an mmo for everyone and then leave game modes almost solely dependent on commanders and zergs (like wvw) in order to even enjoy it. Then allows commanders to exclude for basically any reason as long as they are quiet socially about it. The point of the thread is talking about how players don't like being excluded for these reasons and that perhaps anet should think of a way to fix/change it, especially in these game modes where squads/commanders are necessary in order to enjoy the game mode to its fullest. Again there is nothing talking about what commanders cant do aside from the ToS, which can be circumnavigated by simply not talking. > > Sadly the real reason commanders exclude could be anything, including not liking someones build or the person themselves. I firmly believe that in an open world setting like wvw which is dependent on zergs and commanders, that the responsibility to command should be put onto the commanders and not individual players. I don't think individual players should have to conform to what a commander wants. I think commanders should adapt/lead/and guide players using whatever builds/specs those players have (since those players bought the game too and they want to play their way, and by telling them how to play you are infringing on their rights, and their money, and their playtime, in order to be part of something as necessary as a squad in a setting that is publicly open like wvw). > > I feel like squads should be forced open, in the wvw setting and that commanders should be the one to remain flexible, not the individual players. It even makes more sense as most squads are comprised of pugs who are random individuals enjoying the game, does it make more sense to tell every single person who joins in to curb their build/specs so one person (the commander) gets what he wants? Or does it make sense to tell the commander, no the responsibility is on you to lead (which is an optional activity) and to lead everyone, because their play time is JUST AS IMPORTANT as yours. To that end if commanders don't like it or they don't want to adapt, I feel like they should not tag up (since they are refusing to be flexible and lead with what they have anyways, and someone else who can do this should be leading, and by tagging down on that map they are giving someone else who is more flexible and adaptive to command). Or if commanders like they can simply run a closed squad comprised ENTIRELY of guild members, where they are all in agreement to conforming to what the commander wants anyways. > > I'm sorry but pugs should have more rights and say in wvw and in all game modes, I don't understand the constant denigration towards people who don't want to join guilds or conform to some imaginary leader (who isnt being much of a leader at all). All anyone on here ever preaches is that everyone should just conform or get out, what about those peoples play time and the money they spent on the game (which is the majority since commanders are minority)? All i see is that commanders payed a lousy 300g and they set the tag up so we should really be concerned with their playtime and their playtime only and what they want to do and how is their play session going, if you dont like it then just dont follow them is the only solution? What about everyone elses playtime? why does it all revolve around one guy? How is this ok in a game mode like wvw which is dependent on a commander to enjoy (for the most part) who now also has the ability to exclude anyone for almost any reason, thus effectively excluding them from the enjoyment of the game mode itself? Shouldn't the commanders lead the community and be flexible so everyone can enjoy the game mode? > > What is the purpose of excluding someone from squad in wvw anyways? they still run along side the zerg and participate but now they get low priority for buffs and wipe more, which in turn raises enemies, why impose this on players? It also affects their ability to tag enemies and get credi (less rewards/less enjoyment). Why put this in the hands of the commander anyways, in this style of game mode? Would make more sense to just eliminate squads entirely in wvw and just have a tag that everyone follows, because were all here anyways, and we all just want to enjoy the game mode. After all its a game? why exclude people, its supposed to be for fun. > Commanders aren’t excluding anyone from a Gamemode, since anyone can participate and join in the WvW Gamemode, Commanders can pick and choose who they want in their Squads though againa Squad isn’t a Gamemode, and they do this based on that’s Commanders needs/wants for his squad to perform in a way he wants the Squad to perform with all those players consent otherwise they wouldn’t be in that squad working towards the common goal of that squad for the Squads needs/wants. Again what gives players with this mindset to Force yourself onto a Commanders playtime/effort without their consent, what entitled a player to Force another player to do something that they don’t want to do? Weird I wonder what that sounds like? And WvW doesn’t require a Commander at all to play the Gamemode, it doesn’t require that players be in Squads, it doesn’t require anything. Again it’s a game why Force Someone to do something that isn’t fun for them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperadordf.2687 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"Imperadordf.2687" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" > > > > There are a lot of exclusion in high-end PvE stuff. I've yet to see Raids getting "killed". > > > > raids are closed instances, not open world like wvw is @"Odinens.5920" explained to you how WvW is instanced content. I'm not going to bother explaining again. You're simply too stubborn to accept facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coso.9173 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 sometimes i feel like this is a valuable discussion, then someone compares accepting a class they don't want to their squad to slavery and i realize it's not XD if someone doesn't want you in their squad, you can still tag along, at least until someone else accepts you in theirs. what's the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Imperadordf.2687" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"Imperadordf.2687" said: > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" > > > > > > There are a lot of exclusion in high-end PvE stuff. I've yet to see Raids getting "killed". > > > > > > > raids are closed instances, not open world like wvw is > > @"Odinens.5920" explained to you how WvW is instanced content. I'm not going to bother explaining again. You're simply too stubborn to accept facts. Its not instanced, its open world, just because it has a cap dosent mean its instanced or closed. Players have no control over who can and cannot go into the world, so it is open world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eater of Peeps.9062 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Henry.5713" said: > > You are basically asking the devs to stop others from ever excluding you from anything as it may hurt your feelings or upset you personally while at the same time wanting to be allowed to enforce your presence on others no matter how uncomfortable it makes THEM feel? Sounds pretty selfish and rather wrong to me. Why should anyone be allowed to exclude anyone from squad for any reason other than afk? Your other point is absurd. The players are already on the same map playing together already. His/her presence is already being forced on others because he/she purchased the game just like you and is in wvw playing, just like you. If someone makes you uncomfortable you can always block. Nothing selfish about joining open squad and playing with others in squad to win. Very selfish to exclude people from squad, especially if its not full. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > > > > @"BlaqueFyre.5678" said: > > > > > > > > > The audacity of players that feel they are entitled to another players time/effort just because that other player decided to put in the time/effort purchase their own Commander Tag, and that they think they should be able to force themselves into another player just to make themselves feel good, is just ridiculous. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > News flash no one in this game is entitled to another players time and should never be able to force themselves into/into that player/player’s time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember they bought *THEIR* Tag with *THEIR* gold and *THEIR* time, they can use *THEIR* time and *THEIR* Tag how ever they please, and they aren’t forcing players to play a certain way, they are just selecting the players they want to play with and not forcing them to do something that they don’t want to do, unlike the players complaining in this thread wanting to force others to have to play with them and change their play style. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > yes they bought the game with their own money, but they still have to follow anets rules, even when it comes to social issues. SO i dont get it, its their money, and their tag, but they still have to adhere to anets rules. So much for what a person is or isnt entitled to do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And they are 100% abiding by Anets Rules, Show me where Anet States that’s Commander’s have to allow everyone and Anyone into their Squads and that said commanders cant kick players that they don’t want in their Squads from their Squads, I’ll wait. > > > > > > > > > > > > yah and if they kick someone from a squad for being disabeled, they would get a ban, so right there they are not entitled to "do whatever they want" with their squads. > > > > > > > > > > And does that have any bearing on this thread? No? Please stop trying to derail the thread and can you prove that’s the reason they were kicked? No? So please show me where it’s stated that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone in their Squads and that they can’t kick anyone they want from their Squads. Again I’ll wait. > > > > > > > > Oh im just showing you that commanders cant do whatever they want, even though you say they can. There is a clear line that they cant, so maybe the entitlement attitude should be curbed a little. Im well aware of the mechanics of squads and commanders, but like I said its not so black and white. Yes commanders can mechanically do whatever they want in a squad, and im showing an example of how even if they do what they want it can still get them in trouble. If i want to show you proof of it, all I have to do is show you the ToS. So in the future be a little more reserved in talking about commanders in the sense that they are not gods, and they do not have the right to do as they please. > > > > > > Did I ever say they could do whatever they want? No? Did I say Commanders we’re gods or had the authority of gods? No? Oh wow funny. > > > > > > Again show me where they are breaking ToS by picking and choosing who they allow in their squad, show me where Anet states that Commanders have to allow everyone and anyone into their squad, again I will wait. > > > > > > And again please try to keep the discussion on track which is about Commanders picking and choosing who they allow in their Squad based on class/spec. > > > > exclusion of any kind is what kills game modes, you would think they would want to stop that. Sadly anet is hands off with social issues to an extent, and so they leave it open for everyone to chose what to do in social issues. Its a grey area when anet says things like, this is an mmo for everyone and then leave game modes almost solely dependent on commanders and zergs (like wvw) in order to even enjoy it. Then allows commanders to exclude for basically any reason as long as they are quiet socially about it. The point of the thread is talking about how players don't like being excluded for these reasons and that perhaps anet should think of a way to fix/change it, especially in these game modes where squads/commanders are necessary in order to enjoy the game mode to its fullest. Again there is nothing talking about what commanders cant do aside from the ToS, which can be circumnavigated by simply not talking. > > > > Sadly the real reason commanders exclude could be anything, including not liking someones build or the person themselves. I firmly believe that in an open world setting like wvw which is dependent on zergs and commanders, that the responsibility to command should be put onto the commanders and not individual players. I don't think individual players should have to conform to what a commander wants. I think commanders should adapt/lead/and guide players using whatever builds/specs those players have (since those players bought the game too and they want to play their way, and by telling them how to play you are infringing on their rights, and their money, and their playtime, in order to be part of something as necessary as a squad in a setting that is publicly open like wvw). > > > > I feel like squads should be forced open, in the wvw setting and that commanders should be the one to remain flexible, not the individual players. It even makes more sense as most squads are comprised of pugs who are random individuals enjoying the game, does it make more sense to tell every single person who joins in to curb their build/specs so one person (the commander) gets what he wants? Or does it make sense to tell the commander, no the responsibility is on you to lead (which is an optional activity) and to lead everyone, because their play time is JUST AS IMPORTANT as yours. To that end if commanders don't like it or they don't want to adapt, I feel like they should not tag up (since they are refusing to be flexible and lead with what they have anyways, and someone else who can do this should be leading, and by tagging down on that map they are giving someone else who is more flexible and adaptive to command). Or if commanders like they can simply run a closed squad comprised ENTIRELY of guild members, where they are all in agreement to conforming to what the commander wants anyways. > > > > I'm sorry but pugs should have more rights and say in wvw and in all game modes, I don't understand the constant denigration towards people who don't want to join guilds or conform to some imaginary leader (who isnt being much of a leader at all). All anyone on here ever preaches is that everyone should just conform or get out, what about those peoples play time and the money they spent on the game (which is the majority since commanders are minority)? All i see is that commanders payed a lousy 300g and they set the tag up so we should really be concerned with their playtime and their playtime only and what they want to do and how is their play session going, if you dont like it then just dont follow them is the only solution? What about everyone elses playtime? why does it all revolve around one guy? How is this ok in a game mode like wvw which is dependent on a commander to enjoy (for the most part) who now also has the ability to exclude anyone for almost any reason, thus effectively excluding them from the enjoyment of the game mode itself? Shouldn't the commanders lead the community and be flexible so everyone can enjoy the game mode? > > > > What is the purpose of excluding someone from squad in wvw anyways? they still run along side the zerg and participate but now they get low priority for buffs and wipe more, which in turn raises enemies, why impose this on players? It also affects their ability to tag enemies and get credi (less rewards/less enjoyment). Why put this in the hands of the commander anyways, in this style of game mode? Would make more sense to just eliminate squads entirely in wvw and just have a tag that everyone follows, because were all here anyways, and we all just want to enjoy the game mode. After all its a game? why exclude people, its supposed to be for fun. > > > > Commanders aren’t excluding anyone from a Gamemode, since anyone can participate and join in the WvW Gamemode, Commanders can pick and choose who they want in their Squads though againa Squad isn’t a Gamemode, and they do this based on that’s Commanders needs/wants for his squad to perform in a way he wants the Squad to perform with all those players consent otherwise they wouldn’t be in that squad working towards the common goal of that squad for the Squads needs/wants. > > > Again what gives players with this mindset to Force yourself onto a Commanders playtime/effort without their consent, what entitled a player to Force another player to do something that they don’t want to do? Weird I wonder what that sounds like? > > And WvW doesn’t require a Commander at all to play the Gamemode, it doesn’t require that players be in Squads, it doesn’t require anything. > > Again it’s a game why Force Someone to do something that isn’t fun for them? If you want to play in a squad, and the enemy zerg is only on one map out of all 4 wvw maps. And there is one commander on that said map, who is excluding. You ask them to tag down because they are excluding and they will say no, and they take all of the members into their zerg because they tagged up first. Yet you want to play zvz since you bought the game like everyone else, and wvw is an open game mode and its essentially the main component of wvw, however, you are now excluded from doing that, because you aren't in the squad and you're not able to play how you want. If you tag up they tell you to tag down, because they were there first. If you go to another map and tag up, there is no enemy zerg anywhere else so you can't zvz and play the game mode as was intended. So you're only option is to play outside the squad and be excluded, essentially from the game mode that you want to play because you dont get the benefits of the squad. So like I said why should commanders have the power to exclude people essentially from a game mode, why not get rid of squads or open them all up, and force commanders to adapt so everyone can play? Anet has mechanically given commanders the power to be the custodians of wvw, and through them, everyones enjoyment of the gamemode is reliant upon, for the most part, so if commanders exclude (which happens a lot), why should anet give them the powers to be the custodians if they dont act like it, and allow them that power over other players experience? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eater of Peeps.9062 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 > @"Brigand.9502" said: > Is this any different than being cut from a football team? If you don't have the skills necessary to play the game/mode/sport, then you can't expect to make the team. > > Literally entitlement. No fat kids allowed. No "participation" award. Yah, cept we paid to play advertised content just like you. You get to play for your money, we don't, unless we retool/reclass/conform/adhere to the whims of every commander every time we play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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