RedShark.9548 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"RedShark.9548" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"RedShark.9548" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > > > > And there are lots of places where playing mele is only going to get you killed. Also it's in such a sad shape that longbow pew pews allot harder and its meant to be our condi weapon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd still like to know where these places are because I don't see any shortage of warriors being wanted in instanced content; they certainly aren't being excluded because they aren't good at ranged content. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As RedShark said rifle in the competitive scene is just plain horrible and will see you killed. I've literally seen people kicked out of a WvW guild for using rifle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So warriors get killing in the competitive scene because Rifle is so bad? I'm going to let you think about why that makes no sense. Hint: the warrior concept SUPPORTS melee ranged interactions. In otherwords, warriors aren't left high and dry when they go into melee range. Another hint ... warriors haven't exactly been bottom of the heap in the 'competitive scene', even WITH rifle in its current state. I'm going to counter that argument by saying ... you're just using the wrong part of your toolset for the 'competitive scene'. > > > > > > > > > > > > We're not saying the rest of our tool-set isn't competitive, we're saying that rifle isn't competitive, it needs a buff. You're saying we're ok in other stuff so this part that's under performing doesn't need a boost. > > > > > > > > > > Not being competitive is NOT a reason to buff something. There are lots of non-competitive gear in this game on every class. I AM saying we are OK in other stuff so this underperforming part doesn't need a boost because ... if you haven't noticed, that's how the game works for 6 years now. We DO have underperforming things. That's ... OK. There is nothing critically wrong with an underperforming anything in this game. It's the players choice to decide what weapon to use for whatever reason they want to use it. That's what makes rifle OK as is. > > > > > > > > in a well balanced game every weapon should be equally viable, ofc this will never happen, but it should be the aim of a balance team, you just try to talk that down > > > > > > Sure .. but I got 6 years of evidence to suggest GW2 has never been and likely will never be that. I'm more interested in seeing good gameplay and options with interesting skills/weapons/etc ... than having equal balance on them (because that's not a reasonable goal anyways). Sorry, I'm just realistic when most people are just dreaming about what they think should happen that won't. > > > > > > The buffs rifle should get are melee-range denial, because that's what it does. It's not a DPS weapon and there isn't a reason to change that flavour 'just because' it's not. > > > > if you actually read what ive wrote in this thread than you'd know that i never asked for a dps buff, i even said that id like a rework to a midrange shotgun type weapon...and ofc its a dreamworld but the goal should still be an equal balancing > > I don't get what that fixes. The OP certainly thinks the answer is more DPS. you answered to me, the op doesnt matter at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 > @"RedShark.9548" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"RedShark.9548" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"RedShark.9548" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > > > > > And there are lots of places where playing mele is only going to get you killed. Also it's in such a sad shape that longbow pew pews allot harder and its meant to be our condi weapon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd still like to know where these places are because I don't see any shortage of warriors being wanted in instanced content; they certainly aren't being excluded because they aren't good at ranged content. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As RedShark said rifle in the competitive scene is just plain horrible and will see you killed. I've literally seen people kicked out of a WvW guild for using rifle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So warriors get killing in the competitive scene because Rifle is so bad? I'm going to let you think about why that makes no sense. Hint: the warrior concept SUPPORTS melee ranged interactions. In otherwords, warriors aren't left high and dry when they go into melee range. Another hint ... warriors haven't exactly been bottom of the heap in the 'competitive scene', even WITH rifle in its current state. I'm going to counter that argument by saying ... you're just using the wrong part of your toolset for the 'competitive scene'. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We're not saying the rest of our tool-set isn't competitive, we're saying that rifle isn't competitive, it needs a buff. You're saying we're ok in other stuff so this part that's under performing doesn't need a boost. > > > > > > > > > > > > Not being competitive is NOT a reason to buff something. There are lots of non-competitive gear in this game on every class. I AM saying we are OK in other stuff so this underperforming part doesn't need a boost because ... if you haven't noticed, that's how the game works for 6 years now. We DO have underperforming things. That's ... OK. There is nothing critically wrong with an underperforming anything in this game. It's the players choice to decide what weapon to use for whatever reason they want to use it. That's what makes rifle OK as is. > > > > > > > > > > in a well balanced game every weapon should be equally viable, ofc this will never happen, but it should be the aim of a balance team, you just try to talk that down > > > > > > > > Sure .. but I got 6 years of evidence to suggest GW2 has never been and likely will never be that. I'm more interested in seeing good gameplay and options with interesting skills/weapons/etc ... than having equal balance on them (because that's not a reasonable goal anyways). Sorry, I'm just realistic when most people are just dreaming about what they think should happen that won't. > > > > > > > > The buffs rifle should get are melee-range denial, because that's what it does. It's not a DPS weapon and there isn't a reason to change that flavour 'just because' it's not. > > > > > > if you actually read what ive wrote in this thread than you'd know that i never asked for a dps buff, i even said that id like a rework to a midrange shotgun type weapon...and ofc its a dreamworld but the goal should still be an equal balancing > > > > I don't get what that fixes. The OP certainly thinks the answer is more DPS. > > you answered to me, the op doesnt matter at all That's a nice sentiment, but you idea isn't any better than the OP's ... no problem is fixed, especially the one about balance you keep referring to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedShark.9548 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"RedShark.9548" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"RedShark.9548" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"RedShark.9548" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > And there are lots of places where playing mele is only going to get you killed. Also it's in such a sad shape that longbow pew pews allot harder and its meant to be our condi weapon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd still like to know where these places are because I don't see any shortage of warriors being wanted in instanced content; they certainly aren't being excluded because they aren't good at ranged content. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As RedShark said rifle in the competitive scene is just plain horrible and will see you killed. I've literally seen people kicked out of a WvW guild for using rifle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So warriors get killing in the competitive scene because Rifle is so bad? I'm going to let you think about why that makes no sense. Hint: the warrior concept SUPPORTS melee ranged interactions. In otherwords, warriors aren't left high and dry when they go into melee range. Another hint ... warriors haven't exactly been bottom of the heap in the 'competitive scene', even WITH rifle in its current state. I'm going to counter that argument by saying ... you're just using the wrong part of your toolset for the 'competitive scene'. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We're not saying the rest of our tool-set isn't competitive, we're saying that rifle isn't competitive, it needs a buff. You're saying we're ok in other stuff so this part that's under performing doesn't need a boost. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not being competitive is NOT a reason to buff something. There are lots of non-competitive gear in this game on every class. I AM saying we are OK in other stuff so this underperforming part doesn't need a boost because ... if you haven't noticed, that's how the game works for 6 years now. We DO have underperforming things. That's ... OK. There is nothing critically wrong with an underperforming anything in this game. It's the players choice to decide what weapon to use for whatever reason they want to use it. That's what makes rifle OK as is. > > > > > > > > > > > > in a well balanced game every weapon should be equally viable, ofc this will never happen, but it should be the aim of a balance team, you just try to talk that down > > > > > > > > > > Sure .. but I got 6 years of evidence to suggest GW2 has never been and likely will never be that. I'm more interested in seeing good gameplay and options with interesting skills/weapons/etc ... than having equal balance on them (because that's not a reasonable goal anyways). Sorry, I'm just realistic when most people are just dreaming about what they think should happen that won't. > > > > > > > > > > The buffs rifle should get are melee-range denial, because that's what it does. It's not a DPS weapon and there isn't a reason to change that flavour 'just because' it's not. > > > > > > > > if you actually read what ive wrote in this thread than you'd know that i never asked for a dps buff, i even said that id like a rework to a midrange shotgun type weapon...and ofc its a dreamworld but the goal should still be an equal balancing > > > > > > I don't get what that fixes. The OP certainly thinks the answer is more DPS. > > > > you answered to me, the op doesnt matter at all > > That's a nice sentiment, but you idea isn't any better than the OP's ... no problem is fixed, especially the one about balance you keep referring to. what, i asked for a more melee bruiser type of weapon, which you said the warrior was, since you have no idea how to fix warrior rifle, because you seem to dont even want to see it in play, i dunno why you are even talking in this thread. and why wouldnt there a balanced way to make it a shotgun midranged type weapon?? you never rly point out actual problems, just talk shit about everyone else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 You're the one making suggestions to 'fix' rifle ... why would I be the one to describe the problem for the fix you're trying to convince everyone we need? That makes no sense. Frankly, I don't see rifle having a problem; it's concept is range enforcement. It does that well. What is there to fix? If you want to take a warrior, make a themed build around sticking ranged, you can. There isn't a problem here, other than people trying to suggest 'fixes' that don't address any particular problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talonblaze.3175 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Honestly, I just hope that they revert the change that only made 3 and Killshot pierce. It USED to be ALL the skills, which IMO made up for the rifle's overall underpowered state. That alone would give it a bit more of a role and buff without actually touching the numbers at all. A ranged cleave skill-shot weapon again. Sure, it likely wouldn't save it in terms of usability in PvP, but at least it'd be much more useful again in WvW and PvE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedShark.9548 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > You're the one making suggestions to 'fix' rifle ... why would I be the one to describe the problem for the fix you're trying to convince everyone we need? That makes no sense. > > Frankly, I don't see rifle having a problem; it's concept is range enforcement. It does that well. What is there to fix? If you want to take a warrior, make a themed build around sticking ranged, you can. There isn't a problem here, other than people trying to suggest 'fixes' that don't address any particular problem. yea sure, thats why every warrior says that rifle is trash, because obviously its perfectly fine the way it is, in pve the condi weapon (bow) has more dps than rifle and in pvp and wvw rifle is just a way to basically commit suicide. you only say its ok the way it is, ignoring everyone else and give no actual reasons. again. why are you in this thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blocki.4931 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 > @"Red Haired Savage.5430" said: > > @"Conscript.3657" said: > > I noticed the only difference between Warrior and Thief Rifle is Warrior doesn't have kneel but a knock back instead. > > > > Our 1 - 4 are all the same and F1 is as well with lower damage modifiers. > > Also Deadeye is getting a rifle re-work even though it outperforms warrior rifle hands down. To be fair you gotta bring up that it's an entire specialization weapon, not just one of many weapons you could already use since 2012. I'd love a rifle rework (or at least pretty significant number changes) to push a clear identity for it though. My personal issue with the weapon(s) is that basically every rifle is the same. Bows get different effects, shots or conditions.. rifle just feels like "deal damage + bleed" and "knockback" as their entire kit, leaving a lot to desire imo. Not saying we should shoot rainbows, but I wish there was more flavor to it than that. > Sure .. but I got 6 years of evidence to suggest GW2 has never been and likely will never be that. I'm more interested in seeing good gameplay and options with interesting skills/weapons/etc ... than having equal balance on them (because that's not a reasonable goal anyways). Sorry, I'm just realistic when most people are just dreaming about what they think should happen that won't. > > The buffs rifle should get are melee-range denial, because that's what it does. It's not a DPS weapon and there isn't a reason to change that flavour 'just because' it's not. It would honestly be very simple to make sure every weapon has a place. Increase their damage numbers on auto attack to a similar level, make them distinct enough to be usable in different situations. Longbow could be the condi prefered weapon, Rifle the power.. etc. You name it. It sounds very simple to me, I am surprised they haven't done anything like it so far. On that notion I'd also mention Mace Mainhand which is an absolute atrocity. That attack speed is comparable if not slower than Hammer and the 2 skill (Now I could be wrong on this and it's actually the 4 skill on offhand mace) being a melee parry type of ability that is never useful make this weapon extremely bad. Also something that could easily be changed and would add so much to the game imo. But I'm on a tangent here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stamper.2174 Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 Anyone that says no to a rifle buff doesn't play it. Everyone that says yes gets it. I play it often but not always. Bottom line: it needs piercing back. 974 mesmer clones can ruin the weapon. If you disagree, you're just argumentative and hate rifle warriors. It doesn't need a damage buff. just needs the piercing back. Especially through NPCs. They spawn from thin air. Meanwhile I get hit harder from a red circle than they do a one shot burst skill. Fucking fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZNICK.8537 Posted May 19, 2018 Share Posted May 19, 2018 Doesn't rifle 3 pierce? Or did more used to? Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485 Posted May 20, 2018 Share Posted May 20, 2018 > @"ZNICK.8537" said: > Doesn't rifle 3 pierce? Or did more used to? > > Z everything could with a trait Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fargas.6251 Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 > @"Hoodie.1045" said: > The warriors' rifle skill 3 Volley pierces targets, the F1 skill Kill Shot pierces targets and both of those skills deal more damage than the engineers' rifle auto attack, the only skill that pierces targets. The only profession with access to the rifle weapon that needs a buff is the engineer, not the warrior. > > Plus the warrior is meant to be a melee brawler, not a ranged profession like the engineer or ranger. You can still use the rifle if you want, as it deals a really good amount of damage, but in my opinion warriors benefit the most in melee combat. What’s wrong with having more viable builds though? No one is asking for rifle warrior to roflstomp gs warrior. I’m pretty sure the point of gw2 was originally to avoid pigeonholing classes into one role or play style. We were originally supposed to be able to have either the classic melee juggernaut warrior, alongside say the marksman ranger, but also have the option to field a sniping warrior or a ranger with a greatsword. And that still exists, it’s just that Anet forgot to balance everything to meet that sweet sweet original goal. Pigeonholing is for games like wow and Tera. Wonky business is the name of the game for gw2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuel.4812 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 Honestly gotta chime in here cause I love warrior rifle. The skills are useful and intuitive in a way that rifle engineer SHOULD be. I've been using a rifle build for about a month in response to the scourge/field meta in wvw and I find its really really fun. I traited for the harpoon/rifle dmg and recharge, I forget second tree and then I'm playing around with berserker. No its not God mode, you won't wreck people at range like Ranger or dead eye but for long fights it's pretty good at surviving the attrition and feeling like you're contributing. It'll never be meta, it's niche. But I love playing it. I kept bulls charge for situational use and kiting, have a run speed buff (forget the name), and still have my dual axes if I need em. I'm running berserkers gear with scholar runes. It also fits very nicely with my rocketeer fashion (gas mask + sorrows embrace set) and the beast slayer mini gun. Don't mess with my rifle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedShark.9548 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 > @"Samuel.4812" said: > Honestly gotta chime in here cause I love warrior rifle. The skills are useful and intuitive in a way that rifle engineer SHOULD be. > > I've been using a rifle build for about a month in response to the scourge/field meta in wvw and I find its really really fun. I traited for the harpoon/rifle dmg and recharge, I forget second tree and then I'm playing around with berserker. > > No its not God mode, you won't wreck people at range like Ranger or dead eye but for long fights it's pretty good at surviving the attrition and feeling like you're contributing. It'll never be meta, it's niche. But I love playing it. I kept bulls charge for situational use and kiting, have a run speed buff (forget the name), and still have my dual axes if I need em. I'm running berserkers gear with scholar runes. > > It also fits very nicely with my rocketeer fashion (gas mask + sorrows embrace set) and the beast slayer mini gun. Don't mess with my rifle! warriors sprint was the one you were looking for, i could never get myself to play rifle and dual wield axes, sounds horrible, but do what you gotta do, anyways you said it, it will never be meta...because its not good enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sneakytails.5629 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 Yes, Axe/Axe-Rifle is situational but it can work. Been running it for years in WvW, I like it better for point defense, and occasional zerg play, usually defense or anything that's not open field. I still roam with it though, even though its at a disadvantage to quite a few things I come across. I dont think you could run this in any sort of organized WvW stuff but for PUG play it can work. Was running with another Warrior last night and getting all the extra might letting my Kill Shots land for 19k, and Eviscerates for around 16k. I usually do not have that kind of buff up a lot because I tend to do a lot of solo work but it was nice to splurge like that for a change. I am to the point where I can 1v2 with it, the cleave damage can really surprise enemies ,and the Rifle can really help. But I still feel it has its bad match-ups(most kits do), the lack of a Shield can hurt at times as well. Match-up wise I Like: 1.Thief 2. Engineer 3. Warrior 4. Mesmer Do not like: 1. Ranger 2. Guardian 3. Revenant 4. Elementalist Gear wise I run full Zerker with Scrapper Runes and Damage Reduction food. I feel that offsets the lack of a Shield by at least a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Messor.9520 Posted July 21, 2018 Author Share Posted July 21, 2018 as this new patch came in i read through it again and with a support bers in pvp and wvw it works really well. ammo shouts ftw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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