Barrier overhaul suggestion

[Agrippa Oculus.3726]

I don't know if anyone has suggested this before, but I think it would make barrier so much more useful:

Change the pool of barrier to act to the situation, be it improving outgoing damage OR mitigating incoming damage, whatever (incoming or outgoing) 'package' comes first, until it's depleted.

 

The exact details are debatable of course, but it could be something like:

Outgoing damage packages (ALL damage incl. condi damage, siphon damage, etc.) are multiplied by 1.5, and double that (extra dmg) amount is retracted from your barrier pool.

Incoming damage packages are retracted the same way as it does now.

A small example: if you apply a 5000 pts. barrier to yourself; directly followed by a 2000 bleeding tick on your enemy, the enemy will receive a total of 3000 damage, and your barrier is down to 3000 pts. remaining (1000*2). A 10th of a second later you _receive_ 4000 damage, then 3000 is retracted from your remaining barrier (depleting it completely) and the other 1000 is going off your life pool (ignoring toughness, armor, protection, etc. completely in this example).

 

Now about the application of barrier:

It should still be heavily influenced by your Healing Power, for imo barrier should still be more useful for defence than offence purposes (just not completely useless if you don't receive any damage). But Power and Condition Damage should also influence the amount of barrier application though by a much lower coefficient (e.g. a 10th of .... ?!).

Furthermore, I think the cap should be much higher as well now, instead of the 50% maximum health which it's capped on right now. 75% maybe? But what might be even more interesting is a cap implied by the one who _applies_ the barrier, instead of the one receiving it! Making Vitality a thing again in this DPS oriented game. But I'm not too sure about this suggestion though :)

All in all, I think for the application of barrier it's important that we should have bigger amounts possible, to be even worth mentioning the suggested changes above. _Maybe_ also more sources of application?!? (also not entirely sure about this suggestion either, but hey, I'm sure you all have an opinion on that).

 

What do you guys think?

 

TLDR: Suggestion barrier change to both affect incoming as well as outgoing damage. Depleting your barrier on whatever 'damage package' comes/goes first.

 

(Sorry if I put it in the wrong (sub)forum, feel free to move it!)

Edit: before anyone starts, I think such a change can only come with a nerf to Epidemic, I'm afraid. Otherwise balance (mainly for some PvE endgame content) would be far off.

[Knox.8962]

Barrier is incredibly strong as a defensive tool already. I don't think it needs even more power than it already has.

[Agrippa Oculus.3726]

> @"Knox.8962" said:

> Barrier is incredibly strong as a defensive tool already. I don't think it needs even more power than it already has.

 

Ah, that's why it's a mandatory pick in _ALL_ raids and T4 fractals atm! Because it's so incredibly strong! To remind you, Druid doesnt have any access to Barrier. Chrono doesnt either, even the other mandatory support pick: BS .... guess what: not the case either!

And before anyone begins about epi-bounce: read the last sentence of my opening post.

 

Furthermore, if it's so incredibly strong as a defensive tool, this change will only tone it down a bit, cause the offensive capabilities will overwrite the defensive if applicable.

 

 

[KrHome.1920]

> @"Agrippa Oculus.3726" said:

> > @"Knox.8962" said:

> > Barrier is incredibly strong as a defensive tool already. I don't think it needs even more power than it already has.

>

> Ah, that's why it's a mandatory pick in _ALL_ raids and T4 fractals atm! Because it's so incredibly strong! To remind you, Druid doesnt have any access to Barrier. Chrono doesnt either, even the other mandatory support pick: BS .... guess what: not the case either!

> And before anyone begins about epi-bounce: read the last sentence of my opening post.

>

> Furthermore, if it's so incredibly strong as a defensive tool, this change will only tone it down a bit, cause the offensive capabilities will overwrite the defensive if applicable.

So you seem to talk about PvE. No one cares about anything than raw damage output (incl. team damage increasing buffs and boons) and some healing in this game mode. PvE is trivial. Why should ANet rework barriers there? They could just buff necro damage or heal as this would be much easier without creating new problems in other game modes.

 

In PvP barriers are already close to overpowered and don't need any improvements at all.

 

>Making Vitality a thing again in this DPS oriented game.

No PvP player cares about dps.

[DeceiverX.8361]

Barrier is one of the most overpowered things to ever touch this game's PvP.

 

I'm really sick of PvE people demanding senseless damage boosts to specs/builds which are not meant to deal damage.

 

If your complaint is to buff necro's damage, ask for an improvement to core necro/reaper's sustained DPS; scourge is supposed to be a support spec and is already topping the charts for necro and is outright breaking the PvP and WvW formats with how completely overpowered it is.

[Nimon.7840]

> @"DeceiverX.8361" said:

> Barrier is one of the most overpowered things to ever touch this game's PvP.

>

> I'm really sick of PvE people demanding senseless damage boosts to specs/builds which are not meant to deal damage.

 

So necro in general isnt allowed to so dmg? Sure. Reaper and core have some amazing support or survivability that justifies the Lack of dmg. - NOT

And im sick of stupid PvP Players that facetank scourges and say its OP.

 

Sure pve Players ask for more dmg because necro always gets the short end of the stick there. But you know. There is something called Skill-Split.

 

>

> If your complaint is to buff necro's damage, ask for an improvement to core necro/reaper's sustained DPS; scourge is supposed to be a support spec and is already topping the charts for necro and is outright breaking the PvP and WvW formats with how completely overpowered it is.

 

Talking about overpowered.... Then you need to heavily nerf ele for pve and firebrand for wvw.

 

I think, that scourge isnt that bad or good either. Cause without support it looses to any other class.

So maybe just nerfing the healing and boonspam of other classes would fix the Problem.

 

But still. There is always op stuff. Lets take thief die example. It has pretty good condi clears and can even jump inside a zerg with His perma evades.

Or Warrior, that still has a way too long invuln-time. And,and,and...

 

 

 

 

[Agrippa Oculus.3726]

Hmmmm, was really thinking of putting a BIG disclaimer in my opening post: _suggested change for PvE only!_ Not because I think it would hurt PvP or WvW that much, but really to avoid all the toxicity you normally get from such players.

But I thought about it, and I really still think it's a good idea for all game modes: PvE, PvP and WvW! Like some PvP-ers/WvW-ers already commented above (and I agree): barrier is there very valuable as it is right now, some argue even: Over Powered! So why not tone it down a bit in the defensive way. Like I mentioned in my OP, the offensive abilities would eat away the barrier, leaving less (to no) room for the defensive abilities. And because you primarily always do damage (when you're near enemies at least), in all gamemodes for that matter (hence my DPS game remark), my suggestion would actually be a nerf to the very strong defensive capabilities (as some argue) of barrier! Again, the exact details as in the damage coefficients, and how it scales, is really very debatable. Maybe it also needs a lesser duration: like 2 seconds instead of 5. But in the end it's the idea of a barrier that's both improving your outgoing damage as well as preventing the incoming damage, whatever comes first!

 

Also, I really believe it's time for ANet to put some love into PvE balance, cause lately it's a LOT of PvP/WvW only. It's not just the PvP/WvW player base that asks for balance, it looks like it because they are mostly the **loudest** voice in here, and they definitely _do_ need balance, but to ignore PvE balance completely, like you did with your last balance patch is just rude. You normally would at least throw them a _small_ bone: like +5% Axe damage, but not even that!

[DeceiverX.8361]

> @"Agrippa Oculus.3726" said:

> Hmmmm, was really thinking of putting a BIG disclaimer in my opening post: _suggested change for PvE only!_ Not because I think it would hurt PvP or WvW that much, but really to avoid all the toxicity you normally get from such players.

 

This is not toxicity. This is people disagreeing with you because your proposal is not a good one.

 

There has never in the history of the game been a class as overpowered in WvW as scourge is even right this moment despite even all of the nerfs. Scourge is so overpowered that fights are decided almost strictly by the number of scourges in play, not even really the number of overall number of players.

 

The loudest voice is always PvE demanding more buffs to classes for better DPS numbers when perfect numeric balance + concept balance is literally impossible by the fundamentals of game design. There are skills and entire classes that will never even be close to viable in the competitive modes and never have been because their kit design is poor despite being high or optimal DPS in PvE. ANet has even come out on occasions to say they don't intend to make changes to these classes (addressing the problem of no viability) because their PvE benchmarks are good. This is why there is also no meta in the PvP formats; there's no room to adapt because everything that could is strictly too weak conceptually. In PvE there is no meta; it's just running numbers after every patch for what's optimal.

 

The backlash to the suggestion was also founded in the ludicrousness of the numbers mentioned (50%?!) and how it only addresses one problem while completely dismisses the more severe problems in the other formats which bring a quantity of other professions and build to be borderline unusable.

 

And again, 5% Axe damage isn't necessary, either. It already deletes people in the PvP/WvW formats having been buffed almost every patch since HoT. It's not potent in PvE because it has a low AA coefficient akin to thief's MH pistol with unload. Neither is a PvE set, and that's totally fine. This is conceptually supposed to be offset by reaper and core necro via shroud overriding the burst to combo to swap back to a DPS weapon. While of course core necro and reaper fail to do that properly, that is how it's **supposed** to work. Scourge lacks this capability because it's designed not to be a DPS spec for these kinds of rotations.

 

If ele is a problem and outlier, maybe that needs changing for raid-specific interactions more than a problem everywhere else in the game needing buffs for that one context.

 

 

> @"Nimon.7840" said:

> > @"DeceiverX.8361" said:

> > Barrier is one of the most overpowered things to ever touch this game's PvP.

> >

> > I'm really sick of PvE people demanding senseless damage boosts to specs/builds which are not meant to deal damage.

>

> So necro in general isnt allowed to so dmg? Sure. Reaper and core have some amazing support or survivability that justifies the Lack of dmg. - NOT

> And im sick of stupid PvP Players that facetank scourges and say its OP.

>

> Sure pve Players ask for more dmg because necro always gets the short end of the stick there. But you know. There is something called Skill-Split.

>

> >

> > If your complaint is to buff necro's damage, ask for an improvement to core necro/reaper's sustained DPS; scourge is supposed to be a support spec and is already topping the charts for necro and is outright breaking the PvP and WvW formats with how completely overpowered it is.

>

> Talking about overpowered.... Then you need to heavily nerf ele for pve and firebrand for wvw.

>

> I think, that scourge isnt that bad or good either. Cause without support it looses to any other class.

> So maybe just nerfing the healing and boonspam of other classes would fix the Problem.

>

> But still. There is always op stuff. Lets take thief die example. It has pretty good condi clears and can even jump inside a zerg with His perma evades.

> Or Warrior, that still has a way too long invuln-time. And,and,and...

>

>

>

>

 

I literally just said if your complaint is that necro doesn't do enough damage in PvE, make suggestions to improve the numbers for core and reaper's sustained DPS because those are both under-performers at those roles and are supposed to be the DPS roles. Making scourge a DPS and support and boon corrupt and tank isn't going to help the other two and anything to make it stronger in WvW and sPvP will continue to break the game because the spec is busted OP.

 

What you're complaining about right now is basically a water ele complaining water doesn't do enough DPS. Scourge's DPS is low because you're in the wrong spec. Scourge is supposed to be a support So ask for buffs to reaper and core necro!

 

If Ele is OP then maybe they need to address its large-hitbox cleaving issue like they did on ice bow on a number of its other skills and summoned weapons. Ele only really has high numbers from gimmicks and is very clearly much squishier than necro - even its class description literally talks about unparalleled damage so...

 

Scourge is easily capable in solo play if played by someone with a slightly below-average or above level of skill. It's very easy and deals amazing damage with some of the highest sustain in the game. The only thing it's countered by are mobility longbow soulbeasts and deadeyes in 1v1. Otherwise, it can pretty much stomp anything if played well. In all seriousness, most of the complaints about lack of viability of scourge come from people who are just not good players.

 

Healing and boon spam is a problem that also needs to be addressed but that alone can't fix scourge. Scourge counters everything except projectiles. Too bad projectiles is not a feasible meta in WvW due to how common reflects can be.

 

And thief OP in zergs? Are you serious? A thief jumping into a zerg is a dead thief unless that zerg is outright bad. A thief can be CC'ed during his dodges with a number of skills heavily-utilized by zergs which is why people in WvW put so much emphasis on stability for engages. Stealth is the much bigger culprit than evasion, and yet, multiple classes are problematic in both, which I've also suggested they nerf, so it's not exactly like I'm biased here.

[Agrippa Oculus.3726]

> @"DeceiverX.8361" said:

> This is not toxicity.

Hmm, if somebody starts its sentence with: "I'm really sick of PvE people ...". Can you imagine it's hard for me (and a lot of other people) to still put effort in reading your criticism (how constructive it _may_ be)?

 

Anyway, OT:

Please don't look at the (opening post) numbers, to be honest, I really just used those as an easy calculating example.

The suggestion itself still stands: **Barrier to both prevent incoming dmg as well as improving outgoing dmg _sequentially_.**

 

Furthermore: please see this suggestion as one needing to be accompanied by many, to really make a difference. It's **not** a suggestion that _saves_ balance as is! It would imo only contribute a small part towards mainly PvE balance. I also still believe it would not hurt PvP and WvW, cause it would actually (slightly) _nerf_ the (in those game modes) very strong defensive capabilities of barrier.

And there is always the splitting options! I.e. the coefficients/multipliers could differ per game mode.

[Kaiser.9873]

> @"DeceiverX.8361" said:

> > @"Agrippa Oculus.3726" said:

> > Hmmmm, was really thinking of putting a BIG disclaimer in my opening post: _suggested change for PvE only!_ Not because I think it would hurt PvP or WvW that much, but really to avoid all the toxicity you normally get from such players.

>

> This is not toxicity. This is people disagreeing with you because your proposal is not a good one.

>

> **There has never in the history of the game been a class as overpowered in WvW as scourge is even right this moment despite even all of the nerfs. Scourge is so overpowered that fights are decided almost strictly by the number of scourges in play, not even really the number of overall number of players.**

>

> The loudest voice is always PvE demanding more buffs to classes for better DPS numbers when perfect numeric balance + concept balance is literally impossible by the fundamentals of game design. There are skills and entire classes that will never even be close to viable in the competitive modes and never have been because their kit design is poor despite being high or optimal DPS in PvE. ANet has even come out on occasions to say they don't intend to make changes to these classes (addressing the problem of no viability) because their PvE benchmarks are good. This is why there is also no meta in the PvP formats; there's no room to adapt because everything that could is strictly too weak conceptually. In PvE there is no meta; it's just running numbers after every patch for what's optimal.

>

> The backlash to the suggestion was also founded in the ludicrousness of the numbers mentioned (50%?!) and how it only addresses one problem while completely dismisses the more severe problems in the other formats which bring a quantity of other professions and build to be borderline unusable.

>

> And again, 5% Axe damage isn't necessary, either. It already deletes people in the PvP/WvW formats having been buffed almost every patch since HoT. It's not potent in PvE because it has a low AA coefficient akin to thief's MH pistol with unload. Neither is a PvE set, and that's totally fine. This is conceptually supposed to be offset by reaper and core necro via shroud overriding the burst to combo to swap back to a DPS weapon. While of course core necro and reaper fail to do that properly, that is how it's **supposed** to work. Scourge lacks this capability because it's designed not to be a DPS spec for these kinds of rotations.

>

> If ele is a problem and outlier, maybe that needs changing for raid-specific interactions more than a problem everywhere else in the game needing buffs for that one context.

>

>

> > @"Nimon.7840" said:

> > > @"DeceiverX.8361" said:

> > > Barrier is one of the most overpowered things to ever touch this game's PvP.

> > >

> > > I'm really sick of PvE people demanding senseless damage boosts to specs/builds which are not meant to deal damage.

> >

> > So necro in general isnt allowed to so dmg? Sure. Reaper and core have some amazing support or survivability that justifies the Lack of dmg. - NOT

> > And im sick of stupid PvP Players that facetank scourges and say its OP.

> >

> > Sure pve Players ask for more dmg because necro always gets the short end of the stick there. But you know. There is something called Skill-Split.

> >

> > >

> > > If your complaint is to buff necro's damage, ask for an improvement to core necro/reaper's sustained DPS; scourge is supposed to be a support spec and is already topping the charts for necro and is outright breaking the PvP and WvW formats with how completely overpowered it is.

> >

> > Talking about overpowered.... Then you need to heavily nerf ele for pve and firebrand for wvw.

> >

> > I think, that scourge isnt that bad or good either. Cause without support it looses to any other class.

> > So maybe just nerfing the healing and boonspam of other classes would fix the Problem.

> >

> > But still. There is always op stuff. Lets take thief die example. It has pretty good condi clears and can even jump inside a zerg with His perma evades.

> > Or Warrior, that still has a way too long invuln-time. And,and,and...

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

> I literally just said if your complaint is that necro doesn't do enough damage in PvE, make suggestions to improve the numbers for core and reaper's sustained DPS because those are both under-performers at those roles and are supposed to be the DPS roles. Making scourge a DPS and support and boon corrupt and tank isn't going to help the other two and anything to make it stronger in WvW and sPvP will continue to break the game because the spec is busted OP.

>

> What you're complaining about right now is basically a water ele complaining water doesn't do enough DPS. Scourge's DPS is low because you're in the wrong spec. Scourge is supposed to be a support So ask for buffs to reaper and core necro!

>

> If Ele is OP then maybe they need to address its large-hitbox cleaving issue like they did on ice bow on a number of its other skills and summoned weapons. Ele only really has high numbers from gimmicks and is very clearly much squishier than necro - even its class description literally talks about unparalleled damage so...

>

> Scourge is easily capable in solo play if played by someone with a slightly below-average or above level of skill. It's very easy and deals amazing damage with some of the highest sustain in the game. The only thing it's countered by are mobility longbow soulbeasts and deadeyes in 1v1. Otherwise, it can pretty much stomp anything if played well. In all seriousness, most of the complaints about lack of viability of scourge come from people who are just not good players.

>

> Healing and boon spam is a problem that also needs to be addressed but that alone can't fix scourge. Scourge counters everything except projectiles. Too bad projectiles is not a feasible meta in WvW due to how common reflects can be.

>

> And thief OP in zergs? Are you serious? A thief jumping into a zerg is a dead thief unless that zerg is outright bad. A thief can be CC'ed during his dodges with a number of skills heavily-utilized by zergs which is why people in WvW put so much emphasis on stability for engages. Stealth is the much bigger culprit than evasion, and yet, multiple classes are problematic in both, which I've also suggested they nerf, so it's not exactly like I'm biased here.

 

Bolded the important part. This is absolute BULL! Hammer trains for the first two years of the game were purely predicated by how many guardians you could stack. Two guards per party required pumping out stab. It could be argued that Guardians in the Firebrand iteration are just as important right now as the Scourge train, because without the FBs pumping out support the Scourges would be wiped out.

[Obtena.7952]

The idea isn't sound. There are few things wrong with it:

 

1. It takes away thoughtful play; right now, I use barrier skills to mitigate damage. It's not something I spam. Under the suggestion, it's just a braindead spammer skill because you would always benefit from a barrier being up.

2. Its unpredictable; I don't see in the suggestion how I know when my barrier will give me a known amount of damage mitigation. I cast it ... maybe some of it goes into offensive, maybe defensive? how much of each? maybe none of one or too much of the other?

[Dadnir.5038]

I disagree with the suggestion because simple is always better than complex. Life siphon is a complex mechanism which is almost useless due to the devs fear of seeing it strong. Boon corruption is a complex mechanism which make every other professions cry rivers. Necromancers skills pile up effects over effects leading usually to either condi bombs or underperforming mechanisms that feel good on the paper yet are just simply bad because they stay in their state of not being user friendly.

 

Do scourge or other specs that use barrier need to have a bothersome additionnal effect added to barrier? No. Barrier is a defensive mechanism and should stay a defensive mechanism, we don't need it to make coffee or whatever else.

 

You want to overhaul something? Overhaul the core professions they are in dire need of an overhaul and what awesome is that it would benefit all specs. The scourge or the reaper lack damage and wanted support? The issue lie and always lied in the core profession being bad at dealing damage and at granting wanted support. Even the most beautiful house fall down easily without a solid fondation, the necromancer's fondation is so shacky that nothing can shine out of it if it's not designed op from the beginning.

 

The mesmer used to have a bad fondation for damage, it wasn't horrendous in PvP due to it's ability to burst but it sucked in PvE. They had their changes and their fondation was strengthened. Now, we realise that it's e-spec were op for damage to counter act a bad fondation and mesmers damage end up being difficult to handle. The necromancer (core/reaper/scourge) don't need extra mechanisms on barrier, the necromancer need an overhaul of the core profession and then a clean up of all the things that have been piled up over the year to try to put him at a decent level without achieving this simple task.

 

I am against anything that would make thing more complex to raise a bit the necromancer. I want the necromancer to not have skills with stupidly high number of effects piled up upon each other over the year when the only thing that the devs should have done was a shave of a stupidly long cast time to make these skills "viable". I don't care that the hundred of effects piled up make the cast time worthwhile when my issue is that my skill don't land on my target(s). The necromancer have always been in need of QoLs due to the extremly cluncky skill he got, the necromancer didn't need more effects and scourge certainly don't need to shot himself in the knee when it come to it's survivability.

[Agrippa Oculus.3726]

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> The idea isn't sound. There are few things wrong with it:

>

> 1. It takes away thoughtful play; right now, I use barrier skills to mitigate damage. It's not something I spam. Under the suggestion, it's just a braindead spammer skill because you would always benefit from a barrier being up.

> 2. Its unpredictable; I don't see in the suggestion how I know when my barrier will give me a known amount of damage mitigation. I cast it ... maybe some of it goes into offensive, maybe defensive? how much of each? maybe none of one or too much of the other?

 

You've got a point there, but first of all, I read both of your points as one (correct me if I'm wrong, tho), it's more a cause and effect, imo. Read: because #2, it will become #1.

Anyway, I am a little bit torn if I/we should think of ways to solve _that_ or if _that_ really doesn't matter too much?! There are enough examples of skills/buffs/boons in the game that already have a FAR more 'fire and forget' principle than this new barrier would have. I mean, take for example: Might. There used to be a might timing principle (20 now, 10 later, etc.), but with certain classes out there, that principle is far gone now. And there are more boons like that, as well as banners, spirits, etc. So, it's not like this would be new to the game, or something.

But I also can't help to think that the classes that have these are very unhealthy to the game right now, adding a new class (mainly Necro) to that equation, is not the worst, but it's also not the best solution. I agree there! But because nerfing those other 'fire and forget' boons and class specific skills/mechanics, is probably not going to be an option for ANet (we've seen that for many years now), I'd rather like to see it like this!

 

Although you still triggered me: maybe a max. 1 or 2 second barrier application instead of the 5 right now, might make it a little bit more timing sensitive?!? Let me know what you think.

[Markus.9162]

With 1800 healing power, sand flare gives you a barrier of 6941, without any healing power it's 4208.

2733 more barrier but much less dps, at least for pve I have to agree with op that healing power could increase the barrier a bit more

but not in pvp or wvw, it is already strong enough.

[Obtena.7952]

> @"Agrippa Oculus.3726" said:

> > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > The idea isn't sound. There are few things wrong with it:

> >

> > 1. It takes away thoughtful play; right now, I use barrier skills to mitigate damage. It's not something I spam. Under the suggestion, it's just a braindead spammer skill because you would always benefit from a barrier being up.

> > 2. Its unpredictable; I don't see in the suggestion how I know when my barrier will give me a known amount of damage mitigation. I cast it ... maybe some of it goes into offensive, maybe defensive? how much of each? maybe none of one or too much of the other?

>

> You've got a point there, but first of all, I read both of your points as one (correct me if I'm wrong, tho), it's more a cause and effect, imo. Read: because #2, it will become #1.

> Anyway, I am a little bit torn if I/we should think of ways to solve _that_ or if _that_ really doesn't matter too much?! There are enough examples of skills/buffs/boons in the game that already have a FAR more 'fire and forget' principle than this new barrier would have. I mean, take for example: Might. There used to be a might timing principle (20 now, 10 later, etc.), but with certain classes out there, that principle is far gone now. And there are more boons like that, as well as banners, spirits, etc. So, it's not like this would be new to the game, or something.

> But I also can't help to think that the classes that have these are very unhealthy to the game right now, adding a new class (mainly Necro) to that equation, is not the worst, but it's also not the best solution. I agree there! But because nerfing those other 'fire and forget' boons and class specific skills/mechanics, is probably not going to be an option for ANet (we've seen that for many years now), I'd rather like to see it like this!

>

> Although you still triggered me: maybe a max. 1 or 2 second barrier application instead of the 5 right now, might make it a little bit more timing sensitive?!? Let me know what you think.

 

I dunno ... even if your idea is completely predictable (50% of barrier is is defensive, 50% is offensive for example) it's still spamming to get those offensive advantages with the chance you get the timing correct on the defensive. As a general rule, I don't like skills that are 'some chance of' when I get to choose how or when they trigger. It's kind of like how people don't like AI .. it's just not reliable. Barrier right now, is reliable.