Why PvP ranked mode allows players afk inside a game?

[Dreddo.9865]

Just had this case where we were about 60 pts behind and our thief decides that he 'won't be wasting his time with us' and sits down inside the safe zone. No wonder we lost soundly after that. I know this has been discussed a lot in the past and the present and will in the future but...

 

I am playing in a 'competitive mode' which means I put effort to go up the rank ladder. Unfortunately I have to do this with random people. Still why such a guy when the score is like 170 to 230 decides to go afk and ruins the game experience for all the rest of us? Why should we lose those rank points and put extra effort and time to get them back? Why is this thing allowed and go unpunished can someone give me one good reason?

 

While I love the mode a lot it's moments like this that drive me crazy and make me wanting to go away from it.

[Urejt.5648]

wasted time posting this. Aent is never banning ppl for afking. I also had two games with a nasty flamer two games in a raw and he afk right from the beging and he moved so i loast 50 rank points. Very annoying for top 10 eu player

[rank eleven monk.9502]

> @"Urejt.5648" said:

> Very annoying for top 10 eu player

Yea true, because it's totally not annoying for everyone else. How is this relevant

[Brother.1504]

Cause. When you gotta go, you gotta go.

[pah.4931]

It's 2018. There should be a smart way to detect AFKers and then dock them about 100 points per game. Solved.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

Competitive games very often cannot distinguish unwillingness to play from simple or low-action gameplay.

[CaldaRaric.6305]

This problem would decease dramatically if they just ranked you based on your own performance, not a win or loss. They already keep track of individual stats. It would at least hurt you way less because of your kitten team.

[jcbroe.4329]

1. Greatly reduce the amount of time it takes for the inactivity timer to start, and the amount of time of the inactivity countdown

2. Make "not leaving the respawn area" trigger inactivity regardless of whether the player is active within the respawn area

3. Make DCs immediately trigger dishonor, and immediately disable rating changes for ranked

4. Remove the ability to select logoff and character select from the UI once a PvP match starts

5. Automatically detect toxic communication in chat and apply dishonor, with increasing penalty per violation

[Dreddo.9865]

I tried searching how other competitive games deal with the issue and in Overwatch (no surprise tbh):

 

If you are totally inactive for 30 seconds you are kicked out of the game and if you don't participate in the game like dealing or taking damage for 3' you get kicked as well. So if they have implemented it that means it's technically possible.

[ZNICK.8537]

> @"Dreddo.9865" said:

> I tried searching how other competitive games deal with the issue and in Overwatch (no surprise tbh):

>

> If you are totally inactive for 30 seconds you are kicked out of the game and if you don't participate in the game like dealing or taking damage for 3' you get kicked as well. So if they have implemented it that means it's technically possible.

 

Ok, so they're kicked... now what? There needs to be punishment beyond that.

[Hoodie.1045]

> @"Dreddo.9865" said:

> Just had this case where we were about 60 pts behind and our thief decides that he 'won't be wasting his time with us' and sits down inside the safe zone. No wonder we lost soundly after that. I know this has been discussed a lot in the past and the present and will in the future but...

>

> I am playing in a 'competitive mode' which means I put effort to go up the rank ladder. Unfortunately I have to do this with random people. Still why such a guy when the score is like 170 to 230 decides to go afk and ruins the game experience for all the rest of us? Why should we lose those rank points and put extra effort and time to get them back? Why is this thing allowed and go unpunished can someone give me one good reason?

>

> While I love the mode a lot it's moments like this that drive me crazy and make me wanting to go away from it.

 

I've had the same experience, where we're doing good and out of nowhere, one of our teammates goes AFK. Not just AFK, but occasionally moving so that they don't get kicked from being AFK. It's infuriating because if the AFK player who's throwing the match doesn't get kicked by the end, everyone loses their skill rating.

 

The reason why this is allowed is because ArenaNet are a bunch of soft weaklings, people who don't want to hurt the little feelings of the noobs that ruin the experience for everyone. The noobs that bring non-viable builds like Deadeye in matches, or builds that are broken or cheap to fight against. These are the types of players that are ruining competitive PvP and ArenaNet doesn't want to do anything about them because they fear that this will reduce the number of players playing PvP.

 

I've said this many times in my life when it comes to competition: I'd much rather have a smaller, more dedicated and respectable community than a larger community that does nothing but messing around like a bunch of immature toddlers. It's the reason why condition builds haven't been nerfed at all and it's the reason why these types of players always use those builds because they can't be bothered to learn their profession and play it properly, but they would much rather BS their way to victory.

 

Here's a little coding sample on how to fix players going AFK on purpose since ArenaNet can't be bothered at all:

 

if (player.position == spawnRoom.position && timer >= 10 seconds)

{

player.kicked = true;

}

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

Be cool if there was a system that detected AFK (using whatever algorithm/rules such as time in safe zone (as afk can/will move an inch every 20ish seconds)) and boot them out of the match only to be replaced by someone who is waiting for a match.

 

That way the team is only gimped for the length = to the afker + new persons loading time, then its all even again. May not be optimal, however it helps prevent those teams who are gimped from thinking its a guaranteed loss and improve gameplay while potentially creating less toxicity in PvP.

[Dreddo.9865]

> @"ZNICK.8537" said:

> Ok, so they're kicked... now what? There needs to be punishment beyond that.

My point was that it is technically viable to detect the afk player.

 

[ButterPeanut.9746]

> @"Hoodie.1045" said:

> > @"Dreddo.9865" said:

> > Just had this case where we were about 60 pts behind and our thief decides that he 'won't be wasting his time with us' and sits down inside the safe zone. No wonder we lost soundly after that. I know this has been discussed a lot in the past and the present and will in the future but...

> >

> > I am playing in a 'competitive mode' which means I put effort to go up the rank ladder. Unfortunately I have to do this with random people. Still why such a guy when the score is like 170 to 230 decides to go afk and ruins the game experience for all the rest of us? Why should we lose those rank points and put extra effort and time to get them back? Why is this thing allowed and go unpunished can someone give me one good reason?

> >

> > While I love the mode a lot it's moments like this that drive me crazy and make me wanting to go away from it.

>

> I've had the same experience, where we're doing good and out of nowhere, one of our teammates goes AFK. Not just AFK, but occasionally moving so that they don't get kicked from being AFK. It's infuriating because if the AFK player who's throwing the match doesn't get kicked by the end, everyone loses their skill rating.

>

> The reason why this is allowed is because ArenaNet are a bunch of soft weaklings, people who don't want to hurt the little feelings of the noobs that ruin the experience for everyone. The noobs that bring non-viable builds like Deadeye in matches, or builds that are broken or cheap to fight against. These are the types of players that are ruining competitive PvP and ArenaNet doesn't want to do anything about them because they fear that this will reduce the number of players playing PvP.

>

> I've said this many times in my life when it comes to competition: I'd much rather have a smaller, more dedicated and respectable community than a larger community that does nothing but messing around like a bunch of immature toddlers. It's the reason why condition builds haven't been nerfed at all and it's the reason why these types of players always use those builds because they can't be bothered to learn their profession and play it properly, but they would much rather BS their way to victory.

>

> Here's a little coding sample on how to fix players going AFK on purpose since ArenaNet can't be bothered at all:

>

> if (player.position == spawnRoom.position && timer >= 10 seconds)

> {

> player.kicked = true;

> }

 

The issue is that number of possible scenarios that you are trying to detect is so large, that it really can't only come from a coding kick done by ANET. One crazy (probably not reasonable) idea that I had was to give each player a "toxicity" rating. This rating would be couple with the ability to create a poll in game for the entire map to see to determine if a particular player is match manipulating/afking/cheating. Imagine similar to kicking someone out of party, except for the 9 other people in the game.

 

The vote itself wouldn't necessarily instantly kick them out of the game per say, but rather influence their "toxicity" rating. However, to prevent abuse, the reverse scenario could also be that if you create the poll for another player, and others vote no (i.e. trying to screw over someone), then the person who created the poll gets negatively impacted on their "toxicity" rating. This would encourage the polling to only be used in real manipulation scenarios.

 

Maybe then over time as ratings fluctuate, you could impact temporary bans on people with a certain rating threshold.

 

I'm sure there are a bunch of loopholes there too, but just a thought. IMO it's actually a really hard problem to solve and honestly the most impactful solution is that we as the players just have to be better people...

[Hoodie.1045]

> @"ButterPeanut.9746" said:

> > @"Hoodie.1045" said:

> > > @"Dreddo.9865" said:

> > > Just had this case where we were about 60 pts behind and our thief decides that he 'won't be wasting his time with us' and sits down inside the safe zone. No wonder we lost soundly after that. I know this has been discussed a lot in the past and the present and will in the future but...

> > >

> > > I am playing in a 'competitive mode' which means I put effort to go up the rank ladder. Unfortunately I have to do this with random people. Still why such a guy when the score is like 170 to 230 decides to go afk and ruins the game experience for all the rest of us? Why should we lose those rank points and put extra effort and time to get them back? Why is this thing allowed and go unpunished can someone give me one good reason?

> > >

> > > While I love the mode a lot it's moments like this that drive me crazy and make me wanting to go away from it.

> >

> > I've had the same experience, where we're doing good and out of nowhere, one of our teammates goes AFK. Not just AFK, but occasionally moving so that they don't get kicked from being AFK. It's infuriating because if the AFK player who's throwing the match doesn't get kicked by the end, everyone loses their skill rating.

> >

> > The reason why this is allowed is because ArenaNet are a bunch of soft weaklings, people who don't want to hurt the little feelings of the noobs that ruin the experience for everyone. The noobs that bring non-viable builds like Deadeye in matches, or builds that are broken or cheap to fight against. These are the types of players that are ruining competitive PvP and ArenaNet doesn't want to do anything about them because they fear that this will reduce the number of players playing PvP.

> >

> > I've said this many times in my life when it comes to competition: I'd much rather have a smaller, more dedicated and respectable community than a larger community that does nothing but messing around like a bunch of immature toddlers. It's the reason why condition builds haven't been nerfed at all and it's the reason why these types of players always use those builds because they can't be bothered to learn their profession and play it properly, but they would much rather BS their way to victory.

> >

> > Here's a little coding sample on how to fix players going AFK on purpose since ArenaNet can't be bothered at all:

> >

> > if (player.position == spawnRoom.position && timer >= 10 seconds)

> > {

> > player.kicked = true;

> > }

>

> The issue is that number of possible scenarios that you are trying to detect is so large, that it really can't only come from a coding kick done by ANET. One crazy (probably not reasonable) idea that I had was to give each player a "toxicity" rating. This rating would be couple with the ability to create a poll in game for the entire map to see to determine if a particular player is match manipulating/afking/cheating. Imagine similar to kicking someone out of party, except for the 9 other people in the game.

>

> The vote itself wouldn't necessarily instantly kick them out of the game per say, but rather influence their "toxicity" rating. However, to prevent abuse, the reverse scenario could also be that if you create the poll for another player, and others vote no (i.e. trying to screw over someone), then the person who created the poll gets negatively impacted on their "toxicity" rating. This would encourage the polling to only be used in real manipulation scenarios.

>

> Maybe then over time as ratings fluctuate, you could impact temporary bans on people with a certain rating threshold.

>

> I'm sure there are a bunch of loopholes there too, but just a thought. IMO it's actually a really hard problem to solve and honestly the most impactful solution is that we as the players just have to be better people...

 

I discussed this topic with other players and I thought, why not implement some sort of kick system? The issue with that is: how do you implement a kick system without it being abused? For example if a player is doing slightly poorly like a thief not decapping far, then the team would vote to have them kicked from the match.

 

As far as your idea for a "toxicity" rating, it does sound like a neat idea. And you did provide proper punishments for those that would abuse the system, so good job for trying.

[Dreddo.9865]

IMHO there is no need for extra values you could just give the guy a greater rank penalty compared to the rest, like if the team gets -14 on average, give -30 to the afk player.

 

But still I would greatly appreciate to hear from an official voice their opinion on the subject. Because this is something we deal with every season, annoys many of us and still all we do is speculating.

[Sampson.2403]

Lol people love to justify their losses based on everyone else but themselves and will go as far as to convince themselves that their teammates are self sabotaging.

 

Even IF there are dudes purposely throwing matches often enough to cause people to post about it aren't they going to eventually end up in low gold / silver / bronze tier anyway?

 

I joined last season, i have now played over 1,000 ranked games and I have worked my way up to plat from silver and i float in the plat 1 & 2 range now. So obviously i qualify as a candidate for worthy observation across the entire skill spectrum and ive seen like 1 or 2 people legitmatelty throw games and that was when i was in low gold.

 

Just play to win, improve and when you get into the higher tier games you won't run into this stuff anymore.

 

What most of you are talking about by the way is people rage quitting, not win trading and not game throwing. Ragers always sink and dissolve naturally, no need to code anything here.

[AllNightPlayer.1286]

There is always a good reason to go AFK in a PvP match in this game.

Like…

* …profession stacking.

* …bad team mates, who seem to have been carried into silver/gold ect.

* …flaming team mates you don’t want to work with anymore.

* …no way choose a premade team for ranked.

* …bad overall balance.

* …no option to restart a match up, if you have blocked players for example in your team.

* …no option to give up.

[Crab Fear.1624]

Im tellzinyah...teems mayne...teems

[Dreddo.9865]

> @"Sampson.2403" said:

> Lol people love to justify their losses based on everyone else but themselves and will go as far as to convince themselves that their teammates are self sabotaging.

I think you got it all wrong. It's not the loss itself but the unsportsmanlike behaviour against the competitive and teamwork nature of the mode. This is something plaguing a lot of team based online games and of course only a few (like Overwatch) treat this behaviour in an efficient manner. We should always look for ways to improve things and not just pretend they ...don't exist.

 

> @"AllNightPlayer.1286" said:

> There is always a good reason to go AFK in a PvP match in this game.

There is a better reason to **not do ranked at all** if you have that mentality when playing competitively. Go do some unranked and have all the fun in the world. No need to throw games deliberately, making your teammates wasting their precious time and effort.

 

[Math.5123]

> @"rank eleven monk.9502" said:

> > @"Urejt.5648" said:

> > Very annoying for top 10 eu player

> Yea true, because it's totally not annoying for everyone else. How is this relevant

 

Because everyone else doesn't get +4 -20 matches.

[BMW.2951]

> @"AllNightPlayer.1286" said:

> There is always a good reason to go AFK in a PvP match in this game.

> Like…

> * …profession stacking.

> * …bad team mates, who seem to have been carried into silver/gold ect.

> * …flaming team mates you don’t want to work with anymore.

> * …no way choose a premade team for ranked.

> * …bad overall balance.

> * …no option to restart a match up, if you have blocked players for example in your team.

> * …no option to give up.

 

No hope for ranked sPvP!

[Sampson.2403]

> @"Dreddo.9865" said:

> > @"Sampson.2403" said:

> > Lol people love to justify their losses based on everyone else but themselves and will go as far as to convince themselves that their teammates are self sabotaging.

> I think you got it all wrong.

 

Nah man, i maybe new here but i aint new to competitive online gaming. Same tune, different song.

 

Almost every game the losing team starts spewing conspiracy theories about win traders, throwers, cheaters, speculation of their teammates ratings being far below theirs etc.

 

Rarely do people come to the conclusion that their team simply got outplayed by the other.

 

The amount of BS on these forums is just GLORIOUS :)

 

Edit:

 

Back to the point of the post, if people choose to rage quit and go afk in a match, thats life. You act like "only pugs do this" - you and your friends are just as susceptible to the rage.

 

Just like anything else in life, People who continue to play with this mindet will sink while those who don't will climb. No need for government regulation here.

[Nath Forge Tempete.1645]

> @"AllNightPlayer.1286" said:

> There is always a good reason to go AFK in a PvP match in this game.

> Like…

> * …profession stacking.

> * …bad team mates, who seem to have been carried into silver/gold ect.

> * …flaming team mates you don’t want to work with anymore.

> * …no way choose a premade team for ranked.

> * …bad overall balance.

> * …no option to restart a match up, if you have blocked players for example in your team.

> * …no option to give up.

 

None of these justify the fact someone's AFK . I'll still keep reporting idle players (useless I know)

[CaldaRaric.6305]

> @"Sampson.2403" said:

> > @"Dreddo.9865" said:

> > > @"Sampson.2403" said:

> > > Lol people love to justify their losses based on everyone else but themselves and will go as far as to convince themselves that their teammates are self sabotaging.

> > I think you got it all wrong.

>

> Nah man, i maybe new here but i aint new to competitive online gaming. Same tune, different song.

>

> Almost every game the losing team starts spewing conspiracy theories about win traders, throwers, cheaters, speculation of their teammates ratings being far below theirs etc.

>

> Rarely do people come to the conclusion that their team simply got outplayed by the other.

>

> The amount of BS on these forums is just GLORIOUS :)

>

> Edit:

>

> Back to the point of the post, if people choose to rage quit and go afk in a match, thats life. You act like "only pugs do this" - you and your friends are just as susceptible to the rage.

>

> Just like anything else in life, People who continue to play with this mindet will sink while those who don't will climb. No need for government regulation here.

 

People in this game match manipulate. It’s not just people spewing conspiracies theories. Stay long enough and you will see. Hackers, afkers, match throwers are very, very common.