Show server population with links. (Just curious)

[neven.3785]

I see no issues with mag being locked. If you unlock it, all you will get is more NA prime players, which mag does not need. Their only ocx guild left recently for SoS aswell. As much as imbalanced timezones suck, timezones are always going to have people stacking one way or another. If mag ended up staying in tier 3 this week, the result would be the same, them leading the weekend, followed losing almost everything in OCX through to SEA on sunday night, then xushin logging in and breaking the enemy objectives to speed up his ktrain. Once xushin logs, often there is no commander, or mag goes back to defend EBG only mode. Mag is exactly where it belongs, tier 3.5, the days where people put in ppt over time are long gone for that server, especially when alliances are on the horizon sometime in the next couple years.

[XenesisII.1540]

Mag wants to be competitive? in a ppt game? since when? this isn't year one.

 

> @"shiri.4257" said:

> We initiated a "Wood League Blackout" when Mag rolled down. Inspired by the Obama Cabinet from JQ. Hopefully Anet comes to our terms and makes us all a link.

 

Then after mag gets the link they'll initiate the "No PPT! No Queues! Get out of wvw! You useless fools!" program against their link for 2 months until they unlink mag again thus completing the cycle of mag life.

[Optimator.3589]

Playtime has to be factored in, though. Raw population doesn't mean much if a server is only stacked during one time zone. For example(and don't make it into an argument about specific servers, please), Mag has a powerhouse NA, but can't remotely compete with even YB during OCX. So while it's considered a full server, Mag's coverage as a whole is not very competitive. And I know there are other servers with the same problem of being strong in one timezone but weak in all others. They shouldn't be classed the same as other servers with more spread-out coverage.

 

While metrics certainly are very flawed, they are superior to simply using raw population.

 

In any event, whenever the restructure happens, this will all be a moot point.

[Chaba.5410]

> @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> why should they be rewarded for playing less hours than another player?

 

Because winning the Conquest style game mode is based on play hours. Players who play less are not being rewarded. They don't get as much loot/reward track progression/etc as players who are playing longer.

 

ArenaNet learned this lesson about play hours well when they saw a permanent drop in the number of WvW players who burned out trying to play long hours to be competitive during the Tournaments. Everything Anet has done population-wise since then is a direct result of that, from the new population algorithm to server links to the upcoming alliance system. Complain all you want about it, but it is what it is exactly because it is the right thing to do for the way the game is structured.

 

Look, if you want BG to open up, just stop playing for awhile.

 

 

[Strider Pj.2193]

> @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > > @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > > > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > > > A person from Maguuma shouldn't have to play 3-4 times more than players from other servers just to be competitive.

> > >

> > > You are correct. That's why population is based on play hours; so that the person on Maguuma who may have a job and a real life can continue to play how they want and not feel pressured into playing longer hours just to be competitive against players who have no life outside of the game.

> >

> > But yet, Mag is locked and no link?

>

> Does server really matter? Replace the name as you see fit.

 

No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

 

They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

 

I don't know about some of the others.

[ChronosCosmos.9450]

> @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > why should they be rewarded for playing less hours than another player?

>

> Because winning the Conquest style game mode is based on play hours. Players who play less are not being rewarded. They don't get as much loot/reward track progression/etc as players who are playing longer.

>

> ArenaNet learned this lesson about play hours well when they saw a permanent drop in the number of WvW players who burned out trying to play long hours to be competitive during the Tournaments.

>

> Look, if you want BG to open up, just stop playing for awhile.

>

>

 

Lol someone had to single out either Mag or BG. I'm talking about every server. I was using MAG as an example too. Also your comment from earlier still makes to sense. Also you're contradicting yourself. You say that the player is not being punished but then you mention that in order to fight, you have to not play which is a punishment. This guy. If you hate full servers (MAG/JQ/FA/BG) just say so.

 

[Chaba.5410]

> @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

>

> They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

>

> I don't know about some of the others.

 

Because Mag has a lot of NA players who play long hours starting sometime during early EU time and going until late NA. Their EBG is almost always queued, not only during NA Prime. I'm sure they will open up soonish, especially if they just had an off-hours guild leave recently.

 

Edit: If Xushin has started up his daytime ktrains again, that could also contribute to higher playhours.

[Strider Pj.2193]

> @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

> >

> > They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

> >

> > I don't know about some of the others.

>

> Because Mag has a lot of NA players who play long hours starting sometime during early EU time and going until late NA. Their EBG is almost always queued, not only during NA Prime. I'm sure they will open up soonish, especially if they just had an off-hours guild leave recently.

 

Makes sense then.

[Blocki.4931]

GalaxyBrain.jpg

 

Sure, let's lock servers based on people who have never played a single minute of WvW in their life

[ChronosCosmos.9450]

> @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

> >

> > They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

> >

> > I don't know about some of the others.

>

> Because Mag has a lot of NA players who play long hours starting sometime during early EU time and going until late NA. Their EBG is almost always queued, not only during NA Prime. I'm sure they will open up soonish, especially if they just had an off-hours guild leave recently.

 

MAG will open up once alliances drop. That's what's going to happen with the system that Anet has in place. Remember don't talk about a single server. We're talking about the system. If you like or hate other servers, post that somewhere else. Also no one at this point cares about PPT. All I care about are fights and when I come home from work, there are no fights in SEA/EU on my server. It's either lobsided on our side or their side.

 

[Chaba.5410]

> @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > > No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

> > >

> > > They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

> > >

> > > I don't know about some of the others.

> >

> > Because Mag has a lot of NA players who play long hours starting sometime during early EU time and going until late NA. Their EBG is almost always queued, not only during NA Prime. I'm sure they will open up soonish, especially if they just had an off-hours guild leave recently.

>

> Makes sense then.

 

Having that EU presence actually helps a lot to support them during NA Prime. The only other reason Mag doesn't perform as you may expect given their play hours is due to their style of not PPTing or defending their home bl.

[Lord Trejgon.2809]

did he just opened second practially identical thread?

 

> @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> Don't punish players for playing the game.

explain this because with system as it is now it makes no sense to me >.>

 

> @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > > No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

> > >

> > > They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

> > >

> > > I don't know about some of the others.

> >

> > Because Mag has a lot of NA players who play long hours starting sometime during early EU time and going until late NA. Their EBG is almost always queued, not only during NA Prime. I'm sure they will open up soonish, especially if they just had an off-hours guild leave recently.

>

> MAG will open up once alliances drop. That's what's going to happen with the system that Anet has in place. Remember don't talk about a single server. We're talking about the system. If you like or hate other servers, post that somewhere else. Also no one at this point cares about PPT. All I care about are fights and when I come home from work, there are no fights in SEA/EU on my server. It's either lobsided on our side or their side.

>

 

that's untrue - MAG will not "open up" when alliances drop, (based on all info we have received from AN on world restructuring so far) because MAG will no longer exist after alliances drop - system will be generating new worlds by mashing up few alliances some guilds and lotta pugs in attempt to make a matchups with balanced wvw coverage so everyone can enjoy fun fights on equal footing

[ChronosCosmos.9450]

> @"Lord Trejgon.2809" said:

> did he just opened second practially identical thread?

>

> > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > Don't punish players for playing the game.

> explain this because with system as it is now it makes no sense to me >.>

>

> > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > > @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > > > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > > > No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

> > > >

> > > > They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

> > > >

> > > > I don't know about some of the others.

> > >

> > > Because Mag has a lot of NA players who play long hours starting sometime during early EU time and going until late NA. Their EBG is almost always queued, not only during NA Prime. I'm sure they will open up soonish, especially if they just had an off-hours guild leave recently.

> >

> > MAG will open up once alliances drop. That's what's going to happen with the system that Anet has in place. Remember don't talk about a single server. We're talking about the system. If you like or hate other servers, post that somewhere else. Also no one at this point cares about PPT. All I care about are fights and when I come home from work, there are no fights in SEA/EU on my server. It's either lobsided on our side or their side.

> >

>

> that's untrue - MAG will not "open up" when alliances drop, (based on all info we have received from AN on world restructuring so far) because MAG will no longer exist after alliances drop - system will be generating new worlds by mashing up few alliances some guilds and lotta pugs in attempt to make a matchups with balanced wvw coverage so everyone can enjoy fun fights on equal footing

 

That's the point lol. For example, MAG isn't going to open because of how the current system monitors playing hours for population instead of the population itself.

 

[Lord Trejgon.2809]

> @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > @"Lord Trejgon.2809" said:

> > did he just opened second practially identical thread?

> >

> > > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > > Don't punish players for playing the game.

> > explain this because with system as it is now it makes no sense to me >.>

> >

> > > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > > > @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > > > > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > > > > No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

> > > > >

> > > > > They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

> > > > >

> > > > > I don't know about some of the others.

> > > >

> > > > Because Mag has a lot of NA players who play long hours starting sometime during early EU time and going until late NA. Their EBG is almost always queued, not only during NA Prime. I'm sure they will open up soonish, especially if they just had an off-hours guild leave recently.

> > >

> > > MAG will open up once alliances drop. That's what's going to happen with the system that Anet has in place. Remember don't talk about a single server. We're talking about the system. If you like or hate other servers, post that somewhere else. Also no one at this point cares about PPT. All I care about are fights and when I come home from work, there are no fights in SEA/EU on my server. It's either lobsided on our side or their side.

> > >

> >

> > that's untrue - MAG will not "open up" when alliances drop, (based on all info we have received from AN on world restructuring so far) because MAG will no longer exist after alliances drop - system will be generating new worlds by mashing up few alliances some guilds and lotta pugs in attempt to make a matchups with balanced wvw coverage so everyone can enjoy fun fights on equal footing

>

> That's the point lol. For example, MAG isn't going to open because of how the current system monitors playing hours for population instead of the population itself.

>

 

and if it's locked due to huge amounts of player-hours consistently up maybe that's a sign it has already very good coveragefor wvw and in order to ensure balanced fights this specific server cannot accept more of active players?

 

and then considering how much it usually takesto get server full I'd not be surprised if it was still locked even if AN returned to old BAD system of balancing it purely by playercount.

 

PS. considering no linked server and every other server on NA above in ratings having linked allies I'd personally be taking it as a pride point to still be squashing my matchup despite them being bundled with others....

 

PPS. again your suggestion of using raw global population in all it's argumentation for is missing up on a point where you have server with bigoveral population but only a tiny fracture of it paying any attention to WvW, which is somewhat stingy point at least for me because my server used to be that very much so before whole linking got introduced - we were always high/full and always struggled against medium/low population servers that just had more wvw oriented guilds. and this is how the system worked in the times when it worked exacly like you want it to work. changes came to it because many people didn;t like that and AN agreed.

[Ubi.4136]

I honestly wish they would just post the following per server:

1. total population

2. active population

3. number of accounts who log in to wvw each week with a breakdown of number of hours played

 

Example:

1. Tarnished Coast has 100,000 accounts on it

2. 5,000 accounts logged on last week

3. 1,000 accounts logged in to wvw for more than 5 minutes (no need to include tactics trolls I guess)

 

For number 3, break down play time by hours per day

- less than an hour

- 1-2 hours

- 3-6 hours,

- 6+ hours

 

We could get a lot more info, like ranks, etc, but ktrain is gonna look different than scouting for that metric. Right now, population disparity is what we are trying to ascertain.

[ChronosCosmos.9450]

> @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> Is there any way that A-net can show server population with links? Don't punish players for playing the game. Server status shouldn't be based on playtime

 

> @"Lord Trejgon.2809" said:

> > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > > @"Lord Trejgon.2809" said:

> > > did he just opened second practially identical thread?

> > >

> > > > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > > > Don't punish players for playing the game.

> > > explain this because with system as it is now it makes no sense to me >.>

> > >

> > > > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > > > > @"Chaba.5410" said:

> > > > > > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > > > > > No. Server name doesn't matter. I guess the question I was getting to, is I don't get why Mag is locked and with no link.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > They queue one map during NA prime. It doesn't make sense why they are locked. The only other two servers I know about pop that are not linked should stay locked, because of play hours. (Which is why I think play hours need to stay, not population)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I don't know about some of the others.

> > > > >

> > > > > Because Mag has a lot of NA players who play long hours starting sometime during early EU time and going until late NA. Their EBG is almost always queued, not only during NA Prime. I'm sure they will open up soonish, especially if they just had an off-hours guild leave recently.

> > > >

> > > > MAG will open up once alliances drop. That's what's going to happen with the system that Anet has in place. Remember don't talk about a single server. We're talking about the system. If you like or hate other servers, post that somewhere else. Also no one at this point cares about PPT. All I care about are fights and when I come home from work, there are no fights in SEA/EU on my server. It's either lobsided on our side or their side.

> > > >

> > >

> > > that's untrue - MAG will not "open up" when alliances drop, (based on all info we have received from AN on world restructuring so far) because MAG will no longer exist after alliances drop - system will be generating new worlds by mashing up few alliances some guilds and lotta pugs in attempt to make a matchups with balanced wvw coverage so everyone can enjoy fun fights on equal footing

> >

> > That's the point lol. For example, MAG isn't going to open because of how the current system monitors playing hours for population instead of the population itself.

> >

>

> and if it's locked due to huge amounts of player-hours consistently up maybe that's a sign it has already very good coveragefor wvw and in order to ensure balanced fights this specific server cannot accept more of active players?

>

> and then considering how much it usually takesto get server full I'd not be surprised if it was still locked even if AN returned to old BAD system of balancing it purely by playercount.

>

> PS. considering no linked server and every other server on NA above in ratings having linked allies I'd personally be taking it as a pride point to still be squashing my matchup despite them being bundled with others....

>

> PPS. again your suggestion of using raw global population in all it's argumentation for is missing up on a point where you have server with bigoveral population but only a tiny fracture of it paying any attention to WvW, which is somewhat stingy point at least for me because my server used to be that very much so before whole linking got introduced - we were always high/full and always struggled against medium/low population servers that just had more wvw oriented guilds. and this is how the system worked in the times when it worked exacly like you want it to work. changes came to it because many people didn;t like that and AN agreed.

 

Then they should just measure it based off of WvW population.

 

 

[XenesisII.1540]

And how do you calculate wvw population? by someone that logs in for 1s or 1h in wvw for the week? Oh boy could we use free accounts to log into every server and inflate their numbers?

[morrolan.9608]

> @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> Also why is Maguuma and FA still locked? JQ without a link shouldn't be locked and BG the same. Base population on population. Not playtime. A person from Maguuma shouldn't have to play 3-4 times more than players from other servers just to be competitive.

 

FA was open before this week and I would say Mag fall into the same trap as JQ was in. They have a lot of players on the weekend who don;t play at all during the week. Plus there's the whole thing that Mag don't ppt at all so you cannot judge it by its ppt score.

[ChronosCosmos.9450]

> @"XenesisII.1540" said:

> And how do you calculate wvw population? by someone that logs in for 1s or 1h in wvw for the week? Oh boy could we use free accounts to log into every server and inflate their numbers?

Base it off WvW population and count players with a cap of 2-3 hours per day , but don't go any further. Most guilds only raid for 2-3 hours. Still use population as a base to see which server should open. Not overall playtime. Population is more important than playtime.

 

 

[SlippyCheeze.5483]

> @"XenesisII.1540" said:

> And how do you calculate wvw population? by someone that logs in for 1s or 1h in wvw for the week? Oh boy could we use free accounts to log into every server and inflate their numbers?

 

Well, the obvious answer is "the same way that ANet do", which is based on the amount of time spent playing WvW.

[ChronosCosmos.9450]

> @"SlippyCheeze.5483" said:

> > @"XenesisII.1540" said:

> > And how do you calculate wvw population? by someone that logs in for 1s or 1h in wvw for the week? Oh boy could we use free accounts to log into every server and inflate their numbers?

>

> Well, the obvious answer is "the same way that ANet do", which is based on the amount of time spent playing WvW.

 

wrong Anet disregards WvW population as a whole and only focuses on playtime. Bring back the old model that made WvW competitive in 2012-2014. Ever since this change nobody plays WvW anymore. There is no incentive to play other than Pips. Once Pips are finished, time to logoff.

 

 

[morrolan.9608]

> @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > @"SlippyCheeze.5483" said:

> > > @"XenesisII.1540" said:

> > > And how do you calculate wvw population? by someone that logs in for 1s or 1h in wvw for the week? Oh boy could we use free accounts to log into every server and inflate their numbers?

> >

> > Well, the obvious answer is "the same way that ANet do", which is based on the amount of time spent playing WvW.

>

> wrong Anet disregards WvW population as a whole and only focuses on playtime. Bring back the old model that made WvW competitive in 2012-2014.

 

You mean the model where servers were stuck in tiers. No thanks.The issues now compared to then are mainly around the reduction in overall population not the model itself. The main issues I have with the current model is setting the highest server full no matter what the population and comparing all other servers to it, this just leads to reducing the overall population.

 

[ChronosCosmos.9450]

> @"morrolan.9608" said:

> > @"ChronosCosmos.9450" said:

> > > @"SlippyCheeze.5483" said:

> > > > @"XenesisII.1540" said:

> > > > And how do you calculate wvw population? by someone that logs in for 1s or 1h in wvw for the week? Oh boy could we use free accounts to log into every server and inflate their numbers?

> > >

> > > Well, the obvious answer is "the same way that ANet do", which is based on the amount of time spent playing WvW.

> >

> > wrong Anet disregards WvW population as a whole and only focuses on playtime. Bring back the old model that made WvW competitive in 2012-2014.

>

> You mean the model where servers were stuck in tiers. No thanks.The issues now compared to then are mainly around the reduction in overall population not the model itself. The main issues I have with the current model is setting the highest server full no matter what the population and comparing all other servers to it, this just leads to reducing the overall population.

>

Thank you finally someone understands. Just bring Allainces vs Allainces or GvG already. For a gamed named Guild Wars, it shouldn't take 10 years to implement GvG. Bring back Guild Wars 1 PvP and GvG. At this point A-net is ignoring PvP in all forms and only focusing on PvE or they focus 90% on PvE and 10% on PvP. Please balance it out a little. For 6 years there has been 0 change in terms of Mechanic and gameplay for PvP of all forms. Poor sPvP players who can only play capture the point for 6 years straight. No wonder the PvP population of this game is 1/100 of the PvE population.

 

 

[Kovu.7560]

While I haven't played the first Guild Wars, I understand the name of the franchise is based off of lore in the first game.

Not to say there isn't plenty of guild-oriented functionality in this game, but the old "what kind of game called Guild Wars doesn't have guild vs. guild combat" is an old and tiring sentiment. It's right up there with people whining that they keep making new Final Fantasy games even though each one is called _Final_ Fantasy. People actually do that.

 

Anywho, people are right when they say population =/= coverage. Sports players/teams don't get to win their games by continuing to play long after their opponent(s) have stopped. You have to balance the hours played, not the total players.

 

~ Kovu

[SkyShroud.2865]

Obviously, they don't balance players hours alongside coverage, not like it is possible to do so with current stacked servers. Blow up is necessary thus it is important for them to speed up their development pace on that instead of doing unnecessary short term changes to current wvw.