LordMadman.5812 Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 The game is not designed well for JPs. The camera angles rotate and dead. A Charr's larger body size and jump mechanics obscures the visibility to jump; dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 > @"kharmin.7683" said: > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > @"kharmin.7683" said: > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > > > @"kharmin.7683" said: > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > > > > > @"kharmin.7683" said: > > > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheating and whether it breaks any rules are two entirely different things. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What?? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Dictionary.com - Cheat](https://www.dictionary.com/browse/cheating "Dictionary.com - Cheat") > > > > > > > verb (used without object) to violate rules or regulations: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rules as in the ToS. > > > > > > > > > > > > It’s cheating as jumping puzzles are each designed to be completed a specific way but the player is bypassing some parts, or the entire JP, by using something that was not originally accounted for in its initial design. It’s even more apparent if mounts are prohibited around the JP but people still find a way around it. > > > > > > > > > > Please show me in the ToS where this is so. > > > > > > > > I never said that it was against the ToS hence the *“Cheating and whether it breaks any rules are two entirely different things“* statement. > > > > > > But yet, you seem to maintain that the use of mounts in jumping puzzles is cheating. Unless I'm reading this wrong? > > > > Because it is as the jumping puzzles were not designed with them in mind and you can bypass some or all of the jumping puzzle. > > Ok, and how does other players bypassing optional content adversely affect anyone else? Why should it matter? Use of mounts to complete jumping puzzles in no way prevents others from accomplishing the same without using them. Whether it’s optional or not doesn’t matter. Whether it adversely affects someone else or not doesn’t matter. I never said that mounts prevented others from completing JP’s without them so I don’t even know why you brought that up. The jumping puzzles were designed to be completed a certain way. Most involve traversing a specific path overcoming obstacles. Using a mount to bypass some, or all, of these is cheating. Whether or not it’s again the ToS doesn’t matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kharmin.7683 Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > Whether it’s optional or not doesn’t matter. Whether it adversely affects someone else or not doesn’t matter. I never said that mounts prevented others from completing JP’s without them so I don’t even know why you brought that up. > > The jumping puzzles were designed to be completed a certain way. Most involve traversing a specific path overcoming obstacles. Using a mount to bypass some, or all, of these is cheating. Whether or not it’s again the ToS doesn’t matter. Thanks for the mature, flame-less conversation. :) This is where we differ. You see it as cheating whereas I see it as using available resources. At one time, the forward pass in American football wasn't against the rules, but no one did it because it just wasn't done. Once it became successful, I don't believe anyone considered it cheating. Perhaps not a good metaphor. /shrug Regardless, ANet has limited the ability of mounts to traverse jumping puzzles, so my points are probably moot at best. Still, I don't define it as cheating. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROMANG.1903 Posted July 31, 2018 Author Share Posted July 31, 2018 > @"ReaverKane.7598" said: > > @"starlinvf.1358" said: > > > @"Blude.6812" said: > > > > @"ROMANG.1903" said: > > > > Since Living World 3.6 came out there hasn't been any new jumping puzzle of what I know of, in PoF or in Living World 4... Was the idea abandoned completely? Is it too hard to prevent cheating with mounts? > > > > > > Using mounts IS NOT cheating. Mounts are part of the game that people paid for with expansion purchases. And BTW, Mounts have been disabled in many JP which also tend to ruin/stop their use outside of JP when they are not being used in the JP itself. IMHO mounts should never be disabled anywhere on a map since they are one of the main reasons people bought the EXPs. It should be a players choice to use them or not if doesn't hurt you or the game. I am going to assume that you want mesmers disabled too. > > > > But then that means you have to design JPs around Mounts, which automatically renders it unplayable by people with out POF. Soon as next expansion hits, thats now forcing players to buy POF just to do the jumpping puzzles. > > That would be a valid argument, **IF** you didn't need PoF to access the new maps anyway. That just makes it a poor argument. And i'll tell you it took me a lot of willpower to be that polite. You know PoF won't be the last expansion right? There will be new ones with new zones that don't require PoF to access. If you design jumping puzzles in these areas with mounts in mind, then you have to buy PoF to do them. > @"kharmin.7683" said: > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > @"kharmin.7683" said: > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > > > @"kharmin.7683" said: > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > > > > > @"kharmin.7683" said: > > > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheating and whether it breaks any rules are two entirely different things. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What?? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Dictionary.com - Cheat](https://www.dictionary.com/browse/cheating "Dictionary.com - Cheat") > > > > > > > verb (used without object) to violate rules or regulations: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rules as in the ToS. > > > > > > > > > > > > It’s cheating as jumping puzzles are each designed to be completed a specific way but the player is bypassing some parts, or the entire JP, by using something that was not originally accounted for in its initial design. It’s even more apparent if mounts are prohibited around the JP but people still find a way around it. > > > > > > > > > > Please show me in the ToS where this is so. > > > > > > > > I never said that it was against the ToS hence the *“Cheating and whether it breaks any rules are two entirely different things“* statement. > > > > > > But yet, you seem to maintain that the use of mounts in jumping puzzles is cheating. Unless I'm reading this wrong? > > > > Because it is as the jumping puzzles were not designed with them in mind and you can bypass some or all of the jumping puzzle. > > Ok, and how does other players bypassing optional content adversely affect anyone else? Why should it matter? Use of mounts to complete jumping puzzles in no way prevents others from accomplishing the same without using them. I'm repeating myself, but why do you want to bypass it? If you don't care? For the end reward? Sorry, but no, you don't do the content, you don't get the reward. No one is asking for raid rewards without having to do the related raid. Jumping puzzles are no different. Especially since you don't need the reward to progress anywhere in the game anyway. Also I love jumping puzzles but as I already said, letting people use mounts would remove all the interest I have for them. The joy of having jumping skills, just like some people have the joy of having fighting skills. It's just another kind of content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardid.7203 Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 All the JPs should allow mounts, gliding and mesmer portaling. JPs should also give somewhat better rewards if you complete them without using mounts, gliding or portals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kharmin.7683 Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 > @"ROMANG.1903" said: > I'm repeating myself, but why do you want to bypass it? If you don't care? For the end reward? Sorry, but no, you don't do the content, you don't get the reward. No one is asking for raid rewards without having to do the related raid. Jumping puzzles are no different. Especially since you don't need the reward to progress anywhere in the game anyway. What does it matter to you if someone else gets a reward or not regardless of how it is obtained? The reward in no way impacts your ability to play or enjoy the game as you like. Again, though, my point of view is moot as ANet has set up parameters in the way that they have to dissuade this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNecrosanct.4028 Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 > @"starlinvf.1358" said: > > @"Danikat.8537" said: > > > @"starlinvf.1358" said: > > > But then that means you have to design JPs around Mounts, which automatically renders it unplayable by people with out POF. Soon as next expansion hits, thats now forcing players to buy POF just to do the jumpping puzzles. > > > > Well if they put them in the new maps that's irrelevant because you have to have PoF to access them, so everyone going there either has mounts already or is able to unlock them. > > Wait... so saying they need to have POF before they can play the next expansion as well? People who don't have HOT don't have access to Gliders. Think about that statement for a second. Each of these abilities are tied to their expansion. As soon as the next expansion comes out, the level designers have to assume they exist, and have to design a challenge around what players have access to..... otherwise whats the point of making them achievements in the first place. Which is basically why ~~HOT~~ POF has so few of them, as the mobility offered by mounts (especially griffon) breaks the most common forms of obstacles used in designing JPs. > > Theres one thing in letting back-catalog content atrophy with age.... but its another to ignore these problems for ones moving forward. Why do you think mounts are disabled in Raids? Mounts are enabled in Raids, the one that was released with PoF. The others are tied to HoT so that's why they don't have mounts enabled. Those are instances not designed with mounts in mind, just like Dungeons, Fractals and the home instance, to name a few. Allowing mounts means having to redesign those instances and that's not worth it, nor at all necessary. Expansions also aren't released with content that requires you have a previous expansion. Nothing from HoT is needed to play PoF. A 3rd expansion will not capitalize on PoF but introduce its own new features, so that if it's the first and only expansion you buy, you won't miss out because you don't own any previous expansions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abelisk.4527 Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 They're all busy working on world 3 :sunglasses: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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