Egorum.9506 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. It doesn't really matter how people want to argue about it, <1s on 2.5k armor and 21k hp from stealth and range with a knockdown and immob is busted. Unless you have a passive invuln you're a free kill. Since I know there will be more people who won't scroll up, but would love to educate me on how I'm such a noob despite never getting out of silver/gold themselves: Didn't know it was a deadeye didn't know he was on this side of the map we just lost mid and I wasn't going to feed on respawn core guard went to feed instead of capping home Even if I had gotten off the stunbreak, Im still immobilized Even if I had gotten off a perfectly timed plague signet and sent the immob back I'd have no cds, no hp, and be off point Thief still has up shadowstep and meld. The only change would be dying off point vs on point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > Problem with the video is not really that they were unprepared, but how fast the damage was delivered in such a way that required not much build up. Kind of defeats the point of malice if they can open up with so much damage in the first place while also being able to CC their opponent without much thought. Could other classes counter it? Sure. If they have defensive invulns that auto themselves, which this game should move away from. > > > > > > Doesnt really change how poorly designed the class is for PvP in terms of balance. But guess thats the direction the community would rather keep pushing the game. Burst damage with little need for might or thought, let the build play for ya and abuse the powercreep. > > > > He couldn't react because he was knocked down with binding shadow and did not have a stun break on his bar. He tried to put flesh wurm up on the point itself, which would not have helped him in that situation anyway. A stunbreak followed by a dodge would have mitigated most of that burst and opened the thief up to counterpressure, which by now should be something most low mob specs should be twitchy to do if they're expecting to live against surprise shatter mesmers. > > . > > This isn't a matter of not having enough time to respond, though again, I'm fine with talking adjustments to numbers if there's sufficient proof. But this situation is is similar to encountering a shatter mesmer, with the difference being shatter mesmers unload on you faster, and this reaper was not prepared for any surprise case. either way. He was sleepwalking and thought that DE was miles away. His kit was not ready for any setup that began with a hard cc. > > To me it seems to have happened instantly, from being marked to knocked down to receiving the 10k initial burst. Even with a stunbreak into a dodge they would have still taken that damage since just pressing V doesnt always make you invuln on the press, damage still flows through depending on how the server is registering the information. Lets not even mention that dodging is impossible when your immobilized =/ Only chance they would have had is if they were running soul reaping and popped f1, then that that would be deleted with the excessive low risk burst thats being pushed out. Then into the stealth reset and repeat. > > Its both not having enough time to respond and skills that are just doing to much interms of condition application that eliminates a lot of counterplay from something that doesn't have passive sustain traits, that this game needs to do away with. Power mesmer would have been a better encounter, just from not being heavily CCed with burst and more tells. > > But your right about the kit not being useful for the encounter. A few spectrals maybe could have bought more time. See edit. I looked more closely: pressing the only button on that bar the reaper **didn't** press would have put weakness and immob on the thief, leaving him free to dodge AND mitigating most of that damage. So the reaper had a kit that could have resolved this, but chose instead to not use it and blame the thief for doing a lotta damage. > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > Doesnt really change how poorly designed the class is for PvP in terms of balance. But guess thats the direction the community would rather keep pushing the game. Burst damage with little need for might or thought, let the build play for ya and abuse the powercreep. I also want you to look at how many vuln stacks the reaper has. Vuln is technically might in 1v1. This encounter was quick, but there are several core failings that made that down possible that you can react to on instinct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"Egorum.9506" said: > Didn't know it was a deadeye Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > didn't know he was on this side of the map I believe that. But Thief is Thief. > we just lost mid and I wasn't going to feed on respawn Okay, but you still should be considering that you're gonna get stalked on any point alone. > core guard went to feed instead of capping home sorry guard is bad. That doesn't mean you should do it though, tell the guard to. > Even if I had gotten off the stunbreak, Im still immobilized. plague signet transfers immob > Even if I had gotten off a perfectly timed plague signet and sent the immob back I'd have no cds, no hp, and be off point You'd be alive if you made it behind a wall. > Thief still has up shadowstep and meld. You're not gonna win vs thief as necro. > The only change would be dying off point vs on point. There's a lot of factors that made that happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iKeostuKen.2738 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > > Problem with the video is not really that they were unprepared, but how fast the damage was delivered in such a way that required not much build up. Kind of defeats the point of malice if they can open up with so much damage in the first place while also being able to CC their opponent without much thought. Could other classes counter it? Sure. If they have defensive invulns that auto themselves, which this game should move away from. > > > > > > > > Doesnt really change how poorly designed the class is for PvP in terms of balance. But guess thats the direction the community would rather keep pushing the game. Burst damage with little need for might or thought, let the build play for ya and abuse the powercreep. > > > > > > He couldn't react because he was knocked down with binding shadow and did not have a stun break on his bar. He tried to put flesh wurm up on the point itself, which would not have helped him in that situation anyway. A stunbreak followed by a dodge would have mitigated most of that burst and opened the thief up to counterpressure, which by now should be something most low mob specs should be twitchy to do if they're expecting to live against surprise shatter mesmers. > > > . > > > This isn't a matter of not having enough time to respond, though again, I'm fine with talking adjustments to numbers if there's sufficient proof. But this situation is is similar to encountering a shatter mesmer, with the difference being shatter mesmers unload on you faster, and this reaper was not prepared for any surprise case. either way. He was sleepwalking and thought that DE was miles away. His kit was not ready for any setup that began with a hard cc. > > > > To me it seems to have happened instantly, from being marked to knocked down to receiving the 10k initial burst. Even with a stunbreak into a dodge they would have still taken that damage since just pressing V doesnt always make you invuln on the press, damage still flows through depending on how the server is registering the information. Lets not even mention that dodging is impossible when your immobilized =/ Only chance they would have had is if they were running soul reaping and popped f1, then that that would be deleted with the excessive low risk burst thats being pushed out. Then into the stealth reset and repeat. > > > > Its both not having enough time to respond and skills that are just doing to much interms of condition application that eliminates a lot of counterplay from something that doesn't have passive sustain traits, that this game needs to do away with. Power mesmer would have been a better encounter, just from not being heavily CCed with burst and more tells. > > > > But your right about the kit not being useful for the encounter. A few spectrals maybe could have bought more time. > > See edit. I looked more closely: pressing the only button on that bar the reaper **didn't** press would have put weakness and immob on the thief, leaving him free to dodge AND mitigating most of that damage. So the reaper had a kit that could have resolved this, but chose instead to not use it and blame the thief for doing a lotta damage. > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > Doesnt really change how poorly designed the class is for PvP in terms of balance. But guess thats the direction the community would rather keep pushing the game. Burst damage with little need for might or thought, let the build play for ya and abuse the powercreep. > > I also want you to look at how many vuln stacks the reaper has. > > This encounter was quick, but there are several core failings that made that down possible that you can react to on instinct. > > Yeah I noticed it as well, in that short amount of time. Which is why Im unsure if even having protection would have helped when you throw in the might and damage % increase the deadeye has gained in this situation from traits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iKeostuKen.2738 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 Was expecting it to just say miss. But thats what I'm more used to seeing on anything when I'm blinded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egorum.9506 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > Oh fuck me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > > > > Oh kitten me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > > > > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. It would have still mattered. you would have transferred weakness as well. That being said, it was still a bad MU for you to go solo. If the guard didn't want to do his job and you knew there was a DE, you should have explicitly told him to cap home to deal with the DE or gone with him to mid to push it instead of feeding the DE 5 points, or at the very least put wurm up behind a building so you could have run away in the event you got nuked. All of that could have been potentially ignored with spectral armor. > @"Egorum.9506" said: > You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. The video clearly shows you not actually trying to use it until you are a few milliseconds from death. It has no activation blink until immediately before you down. This isn't a "Thief is OP" issue. This is a "I made poor choices for my role and kit" issue. We all make bad plays here and there, but that's not a pass to claim DE is op. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iKeostuKen.2738 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 I think its a case of both. Not overpowered per se, but the class having overtuned abilities. Not just a thief problem though but something thats a issue with every class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucius.2140 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 DE isnt OP, you hit one and melt fast, the problem its that if it gets you unaware, you are dead or lost a lot of hp and has enough stealth to do it. Basically its not a good design, however nerfing its damage burst will meant to upgrade other parts or nerf all the meta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > I think its a case of both. Not overpowered per se, but the class having overtuned abilities. Not just a thief problem though but something thats a issue with every class. See, now I can easily agree with that. If an ability does too much or too little, I'm all for nerfs/buffs where they may be needed. It bothers me that people go "oh. I got 100-0d by thief so clearly stealth must be removed and damage shaved by 30% across the board, even though I didnt press my buttons." The problem is running the numbers and explaining why x is busted in most situations takes a knowledge of the abilities themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egorum.9506 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > > > > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > > > > > > > Oh kitten me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > > > > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > > > > > > > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. > > It would have still mattered. you would have transferred weakness as well. > That being said, it was still a bad MU for you to go solo. If the guard didn't want to do his job and you knew there was a DE, you should have explicitly told him to cap home to deal with the DE or gone with him to mid to push it instead of feeding the DE 5 points, or at the very least put wurm up behind a building so you could have run away in the event you got nuked. > All of that could have been potentially ignored with spectral armor. > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. > > The video clearly shows you not actually trying to use it until you are a few milliseconds from death. It has no activation blink until immediately before you down. > > This isn't a "Thief is OP" issue. This is a "I made poor choices for my role and kit" issue. > We all make bad plays here and there, but that's not a pass to claim DE is op. > > Have you ever tried telling someone the correct rotation for their class? How well received is it in general? It's not, at best they'll listen and do what they should, but that isn't generally how it plays out. Usually it just leads to someone screaming REEEEE in /t or rage quitting. Going mid wasn't an option, the Rev was the first to die and ran back to mid on respawn so his cds were burned/he'd be down by the time I got back. The core guard had no idea what he was doing and I'm not going to push mid 4v2 with someone unreliable. I definitely wasn't expecting to get dropped in under 1s on a bruiser, because who in the fuck would expect that? Putting up flesh wurm at spawn is a bad move because you don't know where it's going to take you when you trigger it. Might take you to safety, might get caught on uneven ground and teleport you 2 feet into a wall. I could've and should've put it up on the side of the house next to the point as I was running up to it, but ideally wanted it in the pillars for better kiting use down the road. Sa would have been the difference of dying right then vs dying 1s later when the second 3rb landed. Even combining it with shroud would've made no difference, each hit of 3rb is 3-3.5k damage, Sa would only restore 1.5k lf. So I'd still be immobilized and then downed. I made the clip and posted it in response to a comment about how dying to a DE means you're an incompetent noob, when that really isn't the case. Sometimes you get caught with your pants down. But that much damage and control from range and stealth in that time frame is not conducive to a healthy competition. Should you assume every second of every game you will be deleted with no real chance to fight back in <1s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > > > > > > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > > > > > > > > > > Oh kitten me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > > > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > > > > > > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > > > > > > > > > > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. > > > > It would have still mattered. you would have transferred weakness as well. > > That being said, it was still a bad MU for you to go solo. If the guard didn't want to do his job and you knew there was a DE, you should have explicitly told him to cap home to deal with the DE or gone with him to mid to push it instead of feeding the DE 5 points, or at the very least put wurm up behind a building so you could have run away in the event you got nuked. > > All of that could have been potentially ignored with spectral armor. > > > > > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. > > > > The video clearly shows you not actually trying to use it until you are a few milliseconds from death. It has no activation blink until immediately before you down. > > > > This isn't a "Thief is OP" issue. This is a "I made poor choices for my role and kit" issue. > > We all make bad plays here and there, but that's not a pass to claim DE is op. > > > > > > Have you ever tried telling someone the correct rotation for their class? How well received is it in general? It's not, at best they'll listen and do what they should, but that isn't generally how it plays out. Usually it just leads to someone screaming REEEEE in /t or rage quitting. > > Going mid wasn't an option, the Rev was the first to die and ran back to mid on respawn so his cds were burned/he'd be down by the time I got back. The core guard had no idea what he was doing and I'm not going to push mid 4v2 with someone unreliable. I definitely wasn't expecting to get dropped in under 1s on a bruiser, because who in the kitten would expect that? > > Putting up flesh wurm at spawn is a bad move because you don't know where it's going to take you when you trigger it. Might take you to safety, might get caught on uneven ground and teleport you 2 feet into a wall. I could've and should've put it up on the side of the house next to the point as I was running up to it, but ideally wanted it in the pillars for better kiting use down the road. > > Sa would have been the difference of dying right then vs dying 1s later when the second 3rb landed. Even combining it with shroud would've made no difference, each hit of 3rb is 3-3.5k damage, Sa would only restore 1.5k lf. So I'd still be immobilized and then downed. > > I made the clip and posted it in response to a comment about how dying to a DE means you're an incompetent noob, when that really isn't the case. Sometimes you get caught with your pants down. But that much damage and control from range and stealth in that time frame is not conducive to a healthy competition. Should you assume every second of every game you will be deleted with no real chance to fight back in <1s? Agreed on most of this, including that rifle needs a second look because of its damage output. That motive was lost to me initially. As long as we are talking about the parts of the synergy that make that possible (for example, the debuffs on binding shadow) and go from there. I'm fine with adjustment as long as they affect mostly the core issue. however: >Should you assume every second of every game you will be deleted with no real chance to fight back in <1s? The answer to that is **yes**. In pvp you should expect that at any point a roamer is going to unload on you and down you in less than two seconds unless you have a passive stopgap, with that potential increasing the closer you get to a point and exponentially if you are unaccompanied. Sucks that telling people that they should go do X because X usually leads to velociraptor noises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonFury.6243 Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 > @"Isle of Stars.3049" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > @"MUDse.7623" said: > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > ~Balanced as kitten~ > > > do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with? > > > > <1s kill from stealth and range on 2.5k armor and 21k hp is not even remotely balanced =D > > - Gets killed by a class specializing at taking out lone targets not true de can be very powerful in team fight too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > > > > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > > > > > > > Oh kitten me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > > > > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > > > > > > > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. > > It would have still mattered. you would have transferred weakness as well. > That being said, it was still a bad MU for you to go solo. If the guard didn't want to do his job and you knew there was a DE, you should have explicitly told him to cap home to deal with the DE or gone with him to mid to push it instead of feeding the DE 5 points, or at the very least put wurm up behind a building so you could have run away in the event you got nuked. > All of that could have been potentially ignored with spectral armor. > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. > > The video clearly shows you not actually trying to use it until you are a few milliseconds from death. It has no activation blink until immediately before you down. > > This isn't a "Thief is OP" issue. This is a "I made poor choices for my role and kit" issue. > We all make bad plays here and there, but that's not a pass to claim DE is op. > > DE is sort of OP in another area but unlike a certain reaper, other reapers have no issue using LF or stun breaks to counterplay... The broken part is described in the picture. There is literally nothing this guy can do other than move on, I spent all game sitting there sniping anyone who came for the point and not once did it get capped by me or them that whole game.  I started using DE thanks to this recent outcry but unfortunately not everyone just stands there and eats my burst so I had to position myself in a good spot... I think this comes down to map abuse and not the actual thief though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterkill.4375 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 As a necro main there inst anything i can do against deadeye. Other burst classes like guard or mes, although its hard, can be beaten. The reason is that they dont have perma stealth. And even worse is new players getting into pvp. Unranked/stronghold is full of deadeyes looking to get easy kills. They are extremely overpowered, they need to be reworked as soon as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isle of Stars.3049 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"hunterkill.4375" said: > As a necro main there inst anything i can do against deadeye. Other burst classes like guard or mes, although its hard, can be beaten. The reason is that they dont have perma stealth. And even worse is new players getting into pvp. Unranked/stronghold is full of deadeyes looking to get easy kills. They are extremely overpowered, they need to be reworked as soon as possible. Because as a necro main you are intended to help your team through teamfights and not 1v1 a Thief. Thieves are hard counters to your class which explains why you are having a hard time. The same case can be said on how Guardians can defeat Thieves with ease. It's like a game of rock paper and scissors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Math.5123 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > > > > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > > > > > > > Oh kitten me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > > > > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > > > > > > > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. > > It would have still mattered. you would have transferred weakness as well. > That being said, it was still a bad MU for you to go solo. If the guard didn't want to do his job and you knew there was a DE, you should have explicitly told him to cap home to deal with the DE or gone with him to mid to push it instead of feeding the DE 5 points, or at the very least put wurm up behind a building so you could have run away in the event you got nuked. > All of that could have been potentially ignored with spectral armor. > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. > > The video clearly shows you not actually trying to use it until you are a few milliseconds from death. It has no activation blink until immediately before you down. > > This isn't a "Thief is OP" issue. This is a "I made poor choices for my role and kit" issue. > We all make bad plays here and there, but that's not a pass to claim DE is op. > > Core guard also loses to DE 1v1 though. But whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egorum.9506 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > > > > > > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > > > > > > > > > > Oh kitten me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > > > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > > > > > > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > > > > > > > > > > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. > > > > It would have still mattered. you would have transferred weakness as well. > > That being said, it was still a bad MU for you to go solo. If the guard didn't want to do his job and you knew there was a DE, you should have explicitly told him to cap home to deal with the DE or gone with him to mid to push it instead of feeding the DE 5 points, or at the very least put wurm up behind a building so you could have run away in the event you got nuked. > > All of that could have been potentially ignored with spectral armor. > > > > > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. > > > > The video clearly shows you not actually trying to use it until you are a few milliseconds from death. It has no activation blink until immediately before you down. > > > > This isn't a "Thief is OP" issue. This is a "I made poor choices for my role and kit" issue. > > We all make bad plays here and there, but that's not a pass to claim DE is op. > > > > > > DE is sort of OP in another area but unlike a certain reaper, other reapers have no issue using LF or stun breaks to counterplay... The broken part is described in the picture. > There is literally nothing this guy can do other than move on, I spent all game sitting there sniping anyone who came for the point and not once did it get capped by me or them that whole game. > >  > > I started using DE thanks to this recent outcry but unfortunately not everyone just stands there and eats my burst so I had to position myself in a good spot... I think this comes down to map abuse and not the actual thief though. You are literally the player archetype that causes people on your own team to rage quit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucius.2140 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > Shadowstep to his side, preferible in stealth. Problem solved xd. If she reacts, you are dead ofc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urejt.5648 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"Leafstorm.1349" said: > Firstly, I'll just say this isn't really a rage post. Obviously this will get pushback from people who like to play Deadeye as would anything that needs a rework on any class that people like to play. However, deaths judgement needs a serious rework or just to be taken out of PvP all together. That sounds like an opinion however, not only are there many people who would agree with me, quite a few of them play in the upper/top tiers of what this game has to offer for SPvP. > > > The real question is why? Why add something like an ICD (45s maybe?) or remove the skill? The main problem persist due to either you or your teammates being opened up on for 13-15k initial shot, then 3.5k double taps instantly after from _stealth. This either instantly downs a teammate or makes them/you blow every cooldown to keep alive which drastically puts the fight in the other team's favor. It actually wouldn't be as bad, but all the deadeye has to do is simply dodge to regain stealth, then hit for another 15k and some double taps. WHO thought this was an amazing idea? The access to stealth that deadeye has makes it almost impossible for it to die if they have any clue what they're doing. > > There are quite a few classes in the game that have access to amazing burst, but these have a longer cooldown and take setup for it to work. Power Mantra Mesmers can one shot things from stealth, but they must set their burst up again while in combat to do it again if it doesn't work which really doesn't work most of the time. Rangers have amazing burst with worldly impact and what not, but again, this has a ICD and they end up in mele range. Core Guardian also has great burst... nothing that can really hit for 15k unbuffed, but still good. However, once a core guard blows all their CDs, they are easy targets if they don't kite. So why can deadeye simply dodge to regain a 15k hit? Why is it they can double tap after for 3.5k in less than 5 seconds from considerable range? Why is it they have so much stealth? Other classes take precision and timing to burst something down. They need to watch for other class mechanics such as heals and blocks, but all a deadeye really has to do is dodge again. > > Please tell me... what have they done to deserve the 20k+ dmg burst in less than five seconds besides buy PoF? Why do they deserve that dmg? They literally do nothing but dodge or gain stealth through one click of a utility trait. > > Time to fire whoever made deadeye a thing and didn't test it in SPvP. Why wouldn't you have given them a sword for offhand instead? What a joke. Its so wrong on many levels. First of all even zerk can not hit 15k from stealth at the start of fight. U need at least a mark. Secondly zerk deadeye is not viable in top pvp, which means u play in max gold league. Thirdly mes destroys deadeye, also ranger has easy time vs it. Simple rock paper scissors mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > > > > > > > > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh kitten me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > > > > > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > > > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > > > > > > > > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. > > > > > > It would have still mattered. you would have transferred weakness as well. > > > That being said, it was still a bad MU for you to go solo. If the guard didn't want to do his job and you knew there was a DE, you should have explicitly told him to cap home to deal with the DE or gone with him to mid to push it instead of feeding the DE 5 points, or at the very least put wurm up behind a building so you could have run away in the event you got nuked. > > > All of that could have been potentially ignored with spectral armor. > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. > > > > > > The video clearly shows you not actually trying to use it until you are a few milliseconds from death. It has no activation blink until immediately before you down. > > > > > > This isn't a "Thief is OP" issue. This is a "I made poor choices for my role and kit" issue. > > > We all make bad plays here and there, but that's not a pass to claim DE is op. > > > > > > > > > > DE is sort of OP in another area but unlike a certain reaper, other reapers have no issue using LF or stun breaks to counterplay... The broken part is described in the picture. > > There is literally nothing this guy can do other than move on, I spent all game sitting there sniping anyone who came for the point and not once did it get capped by me or them that whole game. > > > >  > > > > I started using DE thanks to this recent outcry but unfortunately not everyone just stands there and eats my burst so I had to position myself in a good spot... I think this comes down to map abuse and not the actual thief though. > > You are literally the player archetype that causes people on your own team to rage quit not my fault anet bunches us all together, I play for fun as Ive told you several times across several threads. I imagine it must be frustrating knowing that no matter how hard you try to win theres that smart alic player who is playing but doesn't actually care about winning.. I tried several times to suggest to split us up and put PIPS in unranked since removal of team queues but most are against it so unfortunately your stuck with players like myself... You are welcome to add your opinion here https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/38164/can-we-put-pips-into-unranked/p1 You'll clearly see comments such as > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > As for me, I just want to farm with guildies and friends and not have to feel bad for playing casually. I also agree that people in ranked should be awarded more, I'd be happy with half the amount of PIPS, atleast it's something. perhaps now you understand why I chuckle at you everytime you crap on about my DD tempest gimping the platinum players and why I think its funny that without trying or caring I can still maintain platinum or leaderboards if I was to play actively again rather than a few games every so often Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > > > > Didn't know it was a deadeye > > > > > > > > > > > > Thats a lie. your chat says clearly you knew it was DE. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh kitten me, you're right lol. My bad, I guess I did know it was a DE. Still didn't know he was on this side of the map, still didn't have a better option than capping home. > > > > > > > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > > > @"iKeostuKen.2738" said: > > > > > > > Does plague signet or the f1 ability work when you are blinded though? =/ Never has for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > PS transfers blind and is itself not affected by blindness. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Wouldn't have mattered if I had managed to find and target the thief for PS, still has might, quickness, and teleport. You can see the 3rb in the air. You're talking about finding a target coming out of stealth at range, targeting it, and hitting PS in under half a second. Which again, wouldn't have mattered since the 3rb is already in the air. > > > > > > > > It would have still mattered. you would have transferred weakness as well. > > > > That being said, it was still a bad MU for you to go solo. If the guard didn't want to do his job and you knew there was a DE, you should have explicitly told him to cap home to deal with the DE or gone with him to mid to push it instead of feeding the DE 5 points, or at the very least put wurm up behind a building so you could have run away in the event you got nuked. > > > > All of that could have been potentially ignored with spectral armor. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Egorum.9506" said: > > > > > You can see me hitting plague signet, it doesn't fire until I'm on the ground. > > > > > > > > The video clearly shows you not actually trying to use it until you are a few milliseconds from death. It has no activation blink until immediately before you down. > > > > > > > > This isn't a "Thief is OP" issue. This is a "I made poor choices for my role and kit" issue. > > > > We all make bad plays here and there, but that's not a pass to claim DE is op. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > DE is sort of OP in another area but unlike a certain reaper, other reapers have no issue using LF or stun breaks to counterplay... The broken part is described in the picture. > > > There is literally nothing this guy can do other than move on, I spent all game sitting there sniping anyone who came for the point and not once did it get capped by me or them that whole game. > > > > > >  > > > > > > I started using DE thanks to this recent outcry but unfortunately not everyone just stands there and eats my burst so I had to position myself in a good spot... I think this comes down to map abuse and not the actual thief though. > > > > You are literally the player archetype that causes people on your own team to rage quit > > not my fault anet bunches us all together, I play for fun as Ive told you several times across several threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 woops double post was meant to be an edit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 > @"Lucius.2140" said: > > @"sephiroth.4217" said: > > > Shadowstep to his side, preferible in stealth. Problem solved xd. If she reacts, you are dead ofc. I was just camping the point... theres this necro posting videos on how he got obliterated by a DE so I thought I'd give it a shot but so far havent met any reapers that dropped as fast as the guy in the video... Most stun break and LoS me like in the picture, kind of annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now