Astralporing.1957 Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 > @"Psientist.6437" said: > The similarity to precursors is in how it is market-gated using the MF and rare drops. I was making the case that the studio has been using similar market gating tactics since release. And yet here we are now with precursor crafting (and randomly obtainable precursors no longer used for new legendaries). So, at least in this instance, they moved away from this type of market-gating. Why it seems they have already forgotten lessons they've learned before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrus.2174 Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 People need to finally realize that this is not (exactly) about the price. If the achievement required some kind of item that was only obtainable through spending an amount of time "equivalent to the cost of the sigils" or straightaway required an item that cost the same as the sigils cost now, there would be no problem. Well, people might be a bit miffed about how the achievements for that episode are so much more expensive, but the main - actual - problem we have here, currently, would not exist. The problem here is not directly the gold cost. The problem lies in how this item is acquired. We got an item of very limited supply, something that can not, reliably, be acquired, something that is only by name tangently connected to this episode, made into a ressource. And it's not even a very small amount that is needed. Even the precursors can nowadays be acquired reliably through crafting them. And the Mischief Sigil/Snowfall Rune also aren't fitting example - they can at least be crafted as well (although at quite a high price). What causes me the most annoyance about this whole thing is, though, that this "new ressource" was useless beforehand. And its sudden usefulness, coupled with the lack of reliable supply, caused its market to crash - the main problem that arises from this, is how a few players , who were able to be around at the time of release and who rushed through the content, were able to pretty much instantaneously buy up all the "supply" that was available, subsequently making an astronomical profit from it. I do not see how this is good design for an episode, from neither our perspective - but also from Anets perspective: if people rush the content, if they are coerced into doing so, because that could gain them a massive advantage and huge proft (and I'm talking about a potential thousands of Dollars/Euros in gold here, as I calculated in an earlier post) from it, they will put less time in the game. They get annoyed about not having time to enjoy the content, frustrated about unfairness for those who can't be there at release, and bored for those who already saw everything else. I don't even see any gain for Anet in this mess. It's a loss for everyone but the few who crashed the market. (And no, leveling characters, even through tomes, is seriously not a good way to acquire a ressource. That's just a poor excuse for bad design.) There are many better ways of making an achievement harder to acquire, Anet knows this, they must know it, after such a long time. But making it based on an item that cannot reliably acquired ... I really do feel like they made a mistake there. They saw the low price, missed that there is no supply for this item and did not anticipate the consequences this would have on the market and the cost of the achievement. But the damage was done by that point and they must have decided that it would be either too hard to fix (for some reason) or "unfair for those who already got the achievement by that point". In my opinion, to be honest, I don't see why they would suddenly be concerned about fairness when it was unfair from the beginning though. I don't understand how they could stand by the decision of keeping the achievement like this, why they would not at least drop a short post in to end the discussion, even if it were a "Was a bad decision, hopefully won't happen again, but will stay like this." or such. As it is, it will stay a thorn in my side and a bad taste in regard for future episodes and content. Such a small "thing" ... but implications are sadly a bit more far reaching on the second look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 > @"Syrus.2174" said: > I don't understand how they could stand by the decision of keeping the achievement like this, why they would not at least drop a short post in to end the discussion, even if it were a "Was a bad decision, hopefully won't happen again, but will stay like this." or such. As it is, it will stay a thorn in my side and a bad taste in regard for future episodes and content. Maybe it hasn't occured to you that they don't think it's a bad decision. Why does everyone assume Anet didn't intend for this? Anyone could see it a mile away. Indicates to me it was intended. This isn't new; Anet has done it before, they will do it again. What we have here is not exceptional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > Why does everyone assume Anet didn't intend for this? Anyone could see it a mile away. What, that they'll decide to build an achievement around a previously uninteresting sigil suffering from severe supply problems? On the contrary, that seems to have caught everyone by surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > Why does everyone assume Anet didn't intend for this? Anyone could see it a mile away. > What, that they'll decide to build an achievement around a previously uninteresting sigil suffering from severe supply problems? > On the contrary, that seems to have caught everyone by surprise. > > What I said still stands ... it's easy to anticipate this would happen, so it's more likely it was intended than not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dante.1763 Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > Why does everyone assume Anet didn't intend for this? Anyone could see it a mile away. > > What, that they'll decide to build an achievement around a previously uninteresting sigil suffering from severe supply problems? > > On the contrary, that seems to have caught everyone by surprise. > > > > > > What I said still stands ... it's easy to anticipate this would happen, so it's more likely it was intended than not. See i get what you are saying i really do. But, this is just a way to garner alot of negativity among players, and..thats what it did, even if they changed it, i think for some people the damage is done. Taking your time and enjoying the content is going to hurt you is what this collection just *screamed* to me when i found out what it required, a terrible idea IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Hey, I feel the same way about Legendary Armor ... regardless of what the actual mechanics are, there are simply things in this game that not everyone is suited to do, for whatever reason that is. There isn't a thing Anet does that doesn't garner negativity so that should never stop them from implementing their ideas. I can see why they did this and if people were being honest, they would see it to. The problem is that SOME people think being dishonest (especially to themselves) makes it appear like it was done for no good reason. That's just not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kindeller.3072 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 Has there been an official word on this and whats being done, if anything. I instantly stopped the achieve when i realised what had been done here.. I cant believe its taken this long for some sort of official word. It doesn't take a genius to see why asking for this sigil was a horrible idea without implementing a solid source of retrieval. Its times like this i prefer the old policy of communication. Its obvious the community and the general enjoyment of the game is ruined by this issue. I don't give a fuck if its intentional for some economic reason. The bottom line is it is sapped the fun of the game and this particular aspect of this release for a lot of players. If you want economic balance tell that to the few who completely bought up the only supply of sigils and now sit on them making a fortune. The real question is what happens when the 22k supply is depleted... then what? Has anyone double checked to see if they didnt actually slip in a recipe or something for MF or discovery? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper Cutter.9376 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 It's kind of hilarious how easily Anet could have prevented this just by adding a source of nullification sigils to Jahai itself (a once-per-day reward, hero's choice chest style, from the shatterer?). > @"Mewcifer.5198" said: > Comparing an item like this to precursors isn't really fair. Those are meant for *legendary* items. Things that were always intended to be a big deal and a symbol of hard work and dedication (or a big wallet). Also they (mostly) fixed the precursor issue in the end by providing a guaranteed way to get one without praying to Zommoros. I mean, the fix was haphazard and tied the amounts of materials required to the individual precursors' TP prices for... reasons, but they tried. > These armour skins were presented to us as a major draw for the new episode. They gave no indication that they were supposed to be super special and/or rare. It's tied to a collection that mostly required doing events and renown hearts on the new map. The collection design seems, at least to me, like it was meant to encourage people to experience all the map had to offer, including sun's refuge since the collection requires upgrading that place. It seemed more like it was meant to be an *experience* for people, not as a money sink. If it was meant as a money sink they would probably have done what they did with the griffon and had many pricey items you had to buy straight from npcs. Also this, yeah. If you remove the sigil from the equation (or assume it still costs a couple silver, like they presumably did when designing the collection), you've basically got the same sort of collection as the druid backpack, or the golem backpack, or the beetle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > @"Gop.8713" said: > > > @"Psientist.6437" said: > > > The studio has been managing a monetized economy for 6 years, they will recognize market-gating when they see it. Over those 6 years, the studio has repeatedly used RNG to market-gate materials and recipes. This instance isn't significantly different than precursors before collections were introduced. If you hated this instance of market-gating, you will likely hate the next instance. If you hate the studio's approach to market-gating, it would be rational to assume it will continue and to include that in your decision to invest in the game. > > > > > > The market increases the rate at which players can produce rewards, the market increases GDP. Even if we removed the gem exchange, expensive items would increase GDP because they convince players to liquidate. That being said, a market, at its core, is a competitive arena. The more rare an item, the greater the competition for that item. Should a studio that has monetized its game's economy have a clearly articulated market-gating philosophy? Imo, you are kittening right it should. Market-gating will always be too similar to PvP-gating. > > > > This position doesn't seem to make much sense. 'A tool exists. If you accept one use for the tool, you must accept all uses for the tool. If you object to any one use, you must object to all uses'. It just doesn't follow . . . > > How many tools in your life require you to balance the cost, risk and benefits of using that tool? In my experience, most, if not every tool. A market has game wide benefits and game wide costs and all we can do as players is describe, understand and respond to how the studio balances them. I figured I misunderstood you the first time bc how I read it it just didn't make any sense. But the idea that funneling something through the tp has both costs and benefits -- which means that sometimes the costs will outweigh the benefits and sometimes the benefits will outweigh the costs -- makes a lot more sense than how I read your first post when you said that 'if you hate this instance, you'll likely hate the next one' . . . I agree it makes a lot more sense to take each potential use individually and decide whether it's a good idea or not. Using the sigil of nullification in this collection, for example, was not . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > Hey, I feel the same way about Legendary Armor ... regardless of what the actual mechanics are, there are simply things in this game that not everyone is suited to do, for whatever reason that is. Legendary armor collection doesn't penalize you for taking your time though. Quite the opposite, doing it now will be much easier than doing it the moment the collection became available (due to the average experience level of raid groups for old wings going way up). Requiem armor, on the other hand, is something that screams to you "blow through the content within first hour after release, or you will be sorry". And that is exactly opposite of what Anet should want to happen. If anything, people doing achieves over an extended period of time should be more advantageous to the devs, as it increases longterm staying power of the LS chapter. Basically, one would think Anet would want people to stay engaged for a longer time, rather than finishing very fast and then having nothing to do. And yet this collection seems to try to persuade players to do the latter, not the former. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristalyan.5728 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > Why does everyone assume Anet didn't intend for this? Anyone could see it a mile away. > > What, that they'll decide to build an achievement around a previously uninteresting sigil suffering from severe supply problems? > > On the contrary, that seems to have caught everyone by surprise. > > > > > > What I said still stands ... it's easy to anticipate this would happen, so it's more likely it was intended than not. I agree, it is easy to calculate what will happen with such a change. So, you concluded that this was ANet's intention. In my opinion, even if it's easy to calculate the effects, ANet did not make the calculation. So, in my opinion the result is NOT what ANet expected. And this is the reason of the deep silence regarding this subject - a clear statement assuming the mistake is NOT ANet stile. And a statement that this is what they really intended .... this is also improbable because of the implication - the first thing the players will ask **what** they intended. So, in this moment ANet has no option but to endure the wave of criticism. Do you think that calculating the effects ANet choose this outcome by will? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambent.6375 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Kindeller.3072" said: > Has there been an official word on this and whats being done, if anything. I instantly stopped the achieve when i realised what had been done here.. I cant believe its taken this long for some sort of official word. It doesn't take a genius to see why asking for this sigil was a horrible idea without implementing a solid source of retrieval. > > Its times like this i prefer the old policy of communication. Its obvious the community and the general enjoyment of the game is ruined by this issue. I don't give a kitten if its intentional for some economic reason. The bottom line is it is sapped the fun of the game and this particular aspect of this release for a lot of players. If you want economic balance tell that to the few who completely bought up the only supply of sigils and now sit on them making a fortune. **The real question is what happens when the 22k supply is depleted... then what? ** > > Has anyone double checked to see if they didnt actually slip in a recipe or something for MF or discovery? Nothing, that happened a long time ago. Edit: omg why doesn't my bold work responding to this part if that quote The real question is what happens when the 22k supply is depleted... then what? ** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Lambent.6375" said: > Edit: omg why doesn't my bold work responding to this part if that quote Try not to use spaces between bold markers and end/beginning of text, thus: > **The real question is what happens when the 22k supply is depleted... then what?** (two stars marker right behind ?, with no space in between) (and the answer to that question is - the supply won't deplete, because most players already gave up on that collection, or moved to out-of-TP means of obtaining sigils - those that were willing to buy them have done this long ago) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Cristalyan.5728" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > Why does everyone assume Anet didn't intend for this? Anyone could see it a mile away. > > > What, that they'll decide to build an achievement around a previously uninteresting sigil suffering from severe supply problems? > > > On the contrary, that seems to have caught everyone by surprise. > > > > > > > > > > What I said still stands ... it's easy to anticipate this would happen, so it's more likely it was intended than not. > > I agree, it is easy to calculate what will happen with such a change. So, you concluded that this was ANet's intention. > In my opinion, even if it's easy to calculate the effects, ANet did not make the calculation. So, in my opinion the result is NOT what ANet expected. And this is the reason of the deep silence regarding this subject - a clear statement assuming the mistake is NOT ANet stile. > And a statement that this is what they really intended .... this is also improbable because of the implication - the first thing the players will ask **what** they intended. > > So, in this moment ANet has no option but to endure the wave of criticism. Do you think that calculating the effects ANet choose this outcome by will? Whether a calculation or not was completed isn't the question here. The fact is that a Rhesus Monkey could anticipate the effect this implementation would have. Therefore, your opinion that Anet didn't see this result happening when the game is DESIGNED to work this way and has done so for 6 years is not an informed one. Anet doesn't need to tell us why they did this, though as I said, objectively, there are some reasons they might have done it. Do not assume that people being unhappy would be a critical factor in how Anet decides to implement the game. If that were the case, nothing would ever get changed; people are unhappy for all kinds of reasons for any change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > Whether a calculation or not was completed isn't the question here. The fact is that a Rhesus Monkey could anticipate the effect this implementation would have. Therefore, your opinion that Anet didn't see this result happening when the game is DESIGNED to work this way and has done so for 6 years is not an informed one. You are saying it as if they haven't done bigger miscalculations in the past. > Anet doesn't need to tell us why they did this, though as I said, objectively, there are some reasons they might have done it. Sure. Not all of those reasons require them wanting and/or predicting the outcome, though. In fact, in some of the most probable ones they _haven't_ predicted it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarrs.4831 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 I don't have a problem with Sup Sigils of Nullification being highly-valued items now. The problem I have with this in particular is that tome levelling is a pain to click through and I'd like it if it were streamlined. It's been an issue since tome levelling was really a thing and this just really points it out. Would also like it if the level-up rewards were salvageable. I actually really like that there are collections which add value to Sup Sigil of Null and Sup Rune of Scavenging. These are dead-end items when I don't think there should really be any in the economy. It's a massive effort to actually _fix_ but these collections are a start, and that's a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > Whether a calculation or not was completed isn't the question here. The fact is that a Rhesus Monkey could anticipate the effect this implementation would have. Therefore, your opinion that Anet didn't see this result happening when the game is DESIGNED to work this way and has done so for 6 years is not an informed one. > You are saying it as if they haven't done bigger miscalculations in the past. > > > Anet doesn't need to tell us why they did this, though as I said, objectively, there are some reasons they might have done it. > Sure. Not all of those reasons require them wanting and/or predicting the outcome, though. In fact, in some of the most probable ones they _haven't_ predicted it. > > I'm saying it has nothing to do with a calculation or prediction at all. It's **obvious** what happens to a mat on the TP when it's included in a thing people want, especially when it's as worthless as this mat was. Yet, Anet implemented it this way regardless. There is a reason for that, even if we don't know what it is. It's not just some random content generator they have cranking out content in their storage closet and they have no idea how it will work. That's silly. You know the best part; as much as you and other continue to paint this like some sort of tragedy where Anet need to intervene and fix everything, everything we predicted is happening, which is basically status quo, nothing to see here, working as intended. Believe what you want, this isn't some accident of content design and implementation. It's pretty amusing actually; to see people skirt around and dismiss ideas that neutralize their arguments. The truth is that the second anyone acknowledges this was done intentionally with obvious consequence, the only logical conclusion is that there isn't a valid complaint. Even if the effect is disastrous and implemented for malicious reasons, it was implemented with intent and obvious impact to the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyson.5160 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > Whether a calculation or not was completed isn't the question here. The fact is that a Rhesus Monkey could anticipate the effect this implementation would have. Therefore, your opinion that Anet didn't see this result happening when the game is DESIGNED to work this way and has done so for 6 years is not an informed one. > > You are saying it as if they haven't done bigger miscalculations in the past. > > > > > Anet doesn't need to tell us why they did this, though as I said, objectively, there are some reasons they might have done it. > > Sure. Not all of those reasons require them wanting and/or predicting the outcome, though. In fact, in some of the most probable ones they _haven't_ predicted it. > > > > > > I'm saying it has nothing to do with a calculation or prediction at all. It's **obvious** what happens to a mat on the TP when it's included in a thing people want, especially when it's as worthless as this mat was. Yet, Anet implemented it this way regardless. There is a reason for that, even if we don't know what it is. It's not just some random content generator they have cranking out content in their storage closet and they have no idea how it will work. That's silly. > > You know the best part; as much as you and other continue to paint this like some sort of tragedy where Anet need to intervene and fix everything, everything we predicted is happening, which is basically status quo, nothing to see here, working as intended. Believe what you want, this isn't some accident of content design and implementation. It's pretty amusing actually; to see people skirt around and dismiss ideas that neutralize their arguments. The truth is that the second anyone acknowledges this was done intentionally with obvious consequence, the only logical conclusion is that there isn't a valid complaint. Even if the effect is disastrous and implemented for malicious reasons, it was implemented with intent and obvious impact to the game. I get what your saying and have no real argument with it. It’s just bad design in my opinion, with the item in question. People should have every right to be upset and voice their frustrations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 Maybe it is bad taste, but how else does Anet test these things? They have to implement them and see the result. There isn't some theory of MMO encyclopedia to check before you do something. They just have to do it. It's happening all the time, no exception here either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyson.5160 Posted October 31, 2018 Share Posted October 31, 2018 I suppose they test it by looking back at history and previous items. Precursor weapons come to mind, because it is a similar acquisition that these sigils have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > I'm saying it has nothing to do with a calculation or prediction at all. It's **obvious** what happens to a mat on the TP when it's included in a thing people want, especially when it's as worthless as this mat was. The problem with the Sigil doesn't lie with the more obvious part - increased demand impacting the price. It lies with the fact that the _supply_ is heavily restricted, which multiplied that increase by hundredfold. And that one might not be so obvious for someone that didn't bother to _check_ that supply for this specific item. The item was worthless not because of big supply (as is generally the case) but because it was so useless that even a small supply was still much greater than demand. The most likely case is that the Sigil has been picked for mostly narrative reasons (and because it _was_ cheap), and noone actually did any calculations for potential price spikes at all, and thus noone noticed the possible problem caused by a supply choke. And after it has happened, the usual policy of not admitting to any mistakes took over. > Yet, Anet implemented it this way regardless. So? As i said, it's not like they didn't make such mistakes before. Or even ones much bigger and much more obvious. > You know the best part; as much as you and other continue to paint this like some sort of tragedy where Anet need to intervene and fix everything, everything we predicted is happening, which is basically status quo Status quo is because players seem to have abandoned that achievement due to the debacle. Thus, _demand_ went down. This is hardly good, as it leaves many players that might have otherwise gotten engaged in the game no longer interested in that part of it. > The truth is that the second anyone acknowledges this was done intentionally with obvious consequence, the only logical conclusion is that there isn't a valid complaint. Even if the effect is disastrous and implemented for malicious reasons, it was implemented with intent and obvious impact to the game. And that's an argument against your belief, actually. The end effect is not really beneficial for Anet, so if it was really expected and intentional, it would mean they were actively and intentionally hurting their own business. And _that_ is silly. Therefore, the only logical conclusion to me is that they did in fact made a mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illconceived Was Na.9781 Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 > The problem with the Sigil doesn't lie with the more obvious part - increased demand impacting the price. It lies with the fact that the supply is heavily restricted, which multiplied that increase by hundredfold. And that one might not be so obvious for someone that didn't bother to check that supply for this specific item. The item was worthless not because of big supply (as is generally the case) but because it was so useless that even a small supply was still much greater than demand. That's incorrect. The supply on the TP was 25k _despite_ the fact it was vendor fodder. It was increasing by about 1-2k sigils per month without any demand, and with people selling to NPCs directly. For example, 6 August, supply was 20k. 6 Sep, supply was 22k. I'm sure ANet looked at potential demand versus the actual amount entering the system every day. That ratio probably made it seem to ANet as if there were plenty, more than enough coming in by the time most people would have enough mistonium. It's not possible to inutit whether they also took into account how many would rush the AP or for the new skins, or the amount of panic that would inevitably ensure. Those are less predictable, although I'm sure ANet has metrics on how it's worked in the past. So I don't think it's fair to draw the conclusion that they weren't prepared or that the high price is entirely unexpected. That's definitely possible; it's not certain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop.8713 Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said: > > The problem with the Sigil doesn't lie with the more obvious part - increased demand impacting the price. It lies with the fact that the supply is heavily restricted, which multiplied that increase by hundredfold. And that one might not be so obvious for someone that didn't bother to check that supply for this specific item. The item was worthless not because of big supply (as is generally the case) but because it was so useless that even a small supply was still much greater than demand. > > That's incorrect. The supply on the TP was 25k _despite_ the fact it was vendor fodder. It was increasing by about 1-2k sigils per month without any demand, and with people selling to NPCs directly. For example, 6 August, supply was 20k. 6 Sep, supply was 22k. We're over six weeks in and there is evidence that supply has still not caught up with demand. Recall that 350 sigils were listed at 9.2g last weekend. If the theory is that sigils trickling in from drops and leveling were going to be enough to meet demand, those 350 should have created a ceiling as no one with only a handful to sell would have listed over that bulk listing. That the supply of sigils will eventually meet demand is inevitable, but it has not happened yet . . . Ofc there are alternate possibilities. Those 350 sigils only represent 14 players completing the entire collection so it is possible that random chance saw those sigils disappear during a time that few ppl happened to be listing their drops. Also, there are typically only around 1300 sigils listed on the tp at any one time and the 9.2g listing was below market so it is also possible that someone gambled that the price would get back up towards 11g and they decided to take the risk at buying the 9.2g sigils to push the price back up. That seems a foolish risk but maybe worth it if they were still holding sigils and needed the price to rise to break even, and a week later there are fewer than ten sigils listed at 10.4g so it could still pay off. Regardless, that upward pressure continues to exist on price is undeniable, and that does not happen when supply is adequate . . . > I'm sure ANet looked at potential demand versus the actual amount entering the system every day. That ratio probably made it seem to ANet as if there were plenty, more than enough coming in by the time most people would have enough mistonium. It's not possible to inutit whether they also took into account how many would rush the AP or for the new skins, or the amount of panic that would inevitably ensure. Those are less predictable, although I'm sure ANet has metrics on how it's worked in the past. I would hope they did, but as you note below we cannot be certain. Though you failed to mention the most important factor which was that initial 22k disappearing when the episode dropped. Again we can't actually know but it is safe to assume that a large portion of that initial supply went to players hoping to resell at a profit rather than players completing the collection, but from the outside looking in ppl just see 22k one day and zero the next, which screams shortage. One of the myriad problems associated with tying the collection to an item with its only reliable source being the tp is that ppl could only buy the sigils others were willing to sell. Sigils being held to inflate the price may as well have not existed at all . . . > So I don't think it's fair to draw the conclusion that they weren't prepared or that the high price is entirely unexpected. That's definitely possible; it's not certain. I agree anyone who claims they know what happened or understands anet's motives is fooling themselves. But it is extremely probable that anet was unprepared for the results of their decision to include the sigil in this collection, which is evidenced by the lack of communication. I agree there could be valid reasons that they would not communicate at this point if the outcome was unexpected, but it is not likely that they would create such a situation intentionally. The idea that they anticipated this outcome but did not prepare any response, which they would have known would have created the impression that they were at the very least negligent in creating the collection AND apathetic to how it affected their players strains credulity . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phs.6089 Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 Just go on strike already, don't chase those skins, deny the map achievements and see what would happened Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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