early warning

[Hevoskuuri.3891]

After a while you start noticing a pattern with stealthing enemies (such as thiefs and mesmers) and eventually learn to dodge/counter them at the right moment. Of course, all players are different, but most seem to use similar tactics you can get used to. In open field it's easy to spot a stealthing enemy, and then gain some distance or wait for the attack with aegis/reflects/dodge ready. If they stealth up mid-fight, again gain some distance and get yourself ready for the attack, or alternatively try to hurt them if you know their general location.

 

If they come from behind or hide behind buildings and such waiting for you, I've learned that there's always a tell when someone in stealth is going to attack you. It can be a fraction of a second, a tiny flicker, before the damage comes in. As a mesmer player, I've learned to hit F4 super fast everytime I see even a tiny movement near my character. I can usually evade most of the mesmer/thief burst damage this way and it gives me a chance to counter it. But keep in mind, this takes a lot of practice and your attention has to be in the right place, or you're dead. You should always be on guard when entering places like that with potentially stealthed roamers hiding somewhere.

 

Other classes have tells as well, such as Scrapper with his tiny gyro floating behind him when he's in stealth. Deadeyes can be impossible to notice since they can pretty much permastealth, but as soon as a target icon pops up above your head, use every movement skill you have to get as far away as possible.

 

TL;DR, stealth is a huge pain in the butt, but most of the frustration can be eased with practice, practice, practice.

[Kayowin.9217]

There is a tell with the silent scope dodge stealth but it is hard to detect as it is a brief shadow flash animation where the DE does the dodge while in stealth. (This might only show with eye candy turned up) I see it on occasion and can usually anticipate the attack as a result. As said many times before, permastealth can be fixed by removing stealth stacking.

 

If you really want to fix DE, you can swap silent scope with fire for effect making it a grandmaster trait which it probably should be. This would be a very heavy nerf all considered with the 3 rounds of DE changes over the last 2 years.

 

A second would be to limit the use of backstab to the first attack outside of stealth as this would also force DE's to use BV (and not have shadow meld) and would also give the victim a chance to cleanse and dodge, CC, invul, etc. This would fix all the thief classes in one change but Mirage/SoulBeast burst would need to be nerfed as well. (Mirage is as much an issue as DE as far as burst goes) I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting but Mirage and SB come to mind.

 

Either way DE would have to be buffed in several other ways as these are fairly heavy handed nerfs that would probably kill the spec in its current state. The spec is all about stealth. That is the point and that is what is fun about it. As it has been said to the point of ad nauseam, try the spec if you want to understand it better as it is not a swiss army knife of trait benefits as some make it out to be. Please post your build that "does it all" if you have found the DE holy grail that checks off all the boxes for every capability in the game.

 

And yes, I do play DE.

[SoV.5139]

> @"Widmo.3186" said:

> The reason why GW2 stealth is not WoW stealth is that most skills are free-target casts. Especially 1 that has no cd (except stealth abilities) and on most characters is free-targetable. In WoW you either need to have targeted sth or use AoE that has cast time/big cooldown/low range (or youre just DH). So please, dont compare those 2 mechanics because if you wanted to have WoW stealth in GW2 you would need to rebuild whole game.

>

No need to rebuild the whole game. All they would need to do is make stealth not stack-able, and get rid of the counter to the counter - the ability to remove revealed. This would allow DE to still get the drop, same as a WOW rogue can, but doing so means they have to still outplay the ambush victim the rest of the way. They no longer get to ambush and eliminate counterplay if they begin to lose the fight after the ambush.

 

 

[Sanity Obscure.6054]

Just make it where we can't crit immediately out of stealth with a ranged weapon... We already get a free shot with the enemy not seeing our location. Stack up stealths our build allows and we are free to repeatedly have large hits from a distance and then vanishing again before ever taking any direct enemy response.

[Kovu.7560]

> @"Turk.5460" said:

> > @"geist.4126" said:

> > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said:

> > > > @"Optimator.3589" said:

> > > > Shouldn't be able to enter stealth while in combat. It's that simple. Whatever its other failings, WoW handled stealth far better than this game.

> > >

> > > How many classes run stealth in wow?

> >

> > Same number as in GW2. Mesmer/Thief vs. Rogue/Feral. An engineer or ranger isn't exactly running stealth just because they have one skill that stealthes them for a short time.

>

> Do you even play GW2? ~~Rangers~~ Druids have more stealth than mesmers.

Fixed. (And I'd take any Mesmer spec over Druid for roaming, these days.)

 

~ Kovu

[crepuscular.9047]

> @"Hesacon.8735" said:

> Stealth doesn't bother me. Stealthing for the fourth time in 10 seconds is a little much.

 

anet should implement diminishing return for stealth while in combat, each subsequent stealth during combat the duration get 50% -> 25% -> 13%

 

also, while in combat if they move with run they will reveal their outline but will not be targetable, they need to stay still or use walk to not reveal anything, just like how mobs in Korna story is able to detect us if we are running right in front of them while stealthed.

[Dami.5046]

Be thankful then that A-net never brought out 'alarm' mini pets to detect enemies like Aion did. But then again most of the world you could be attacked, not just a couple of maps.

[sephiroth.4217]

> @"Optimator.3589" said:

> Shouldn't be able to enter stealth while in combat. It's that simple. Whatever its other failings, WoW handled stealth far better than this game.

 

You'll have to redesign the entire Thief spec for this suggestion..

 

As for stealth is concerned, stealth is fine in this game once you learn how to counter it or handle it, can be an extremely unfair mechanic for newer players or less experienced players to deal with but otherwise fine and almost mundane.

[Odokuro.5049]

These kind of threads, are like a nightmare you never wake up from. Honestly instead of asking for mechanics to be removed or for them to be nerf'd, work on ways to overcome them. There are many ways to reveal a stealthed target, such as skills, traits, and traps. I feel it would be best to overcome challenges by using strategy and smarts, then asking for an already easy/casual-friendly game to be watered down in favor of making it more faceroll-to-victory.

[Dawdler.8521]

> @"Odokuro.5049" said:

> These kind of threads, are like a nightmare you never wake up from. Honestly instead of asking for mechanics to be removed or for them to be nerf'd, work on ways to overcome them. There are many ways to reveal a stealthed target, such as skills, traits, and traps. I feel it would be best to overcome challenges by using strategy and smarts, then asking for an already easy/casual-friendly game to be watered down in favor of making it more faceroll-to-victory.

Buh memser OP!?

[Nate.3927]

If this is another complaint about deadeye stealth DJ attack. The deadeye is actually revealed for a short while before they attack. That gives you a chance to dodge or break LoS. Now if the deadeye is attacking you from behind and you cannot see that brief moment of revealed, the exact same thing will happen to you against any class that can do a big burst from a reasonable range. The stealth doesn't actually factor into it. A bursty ranger/mesmer/warrior/necro/revenant/engineer/elementalist/guardian surprising you from behind will kill you just as quickly as the deadeye and all of them except maybe mesmer requires significantly less setup.

 

The only real advantage that a thief/mesmer has is that IF they fail their burst, it is easier for them to disengage and run away. But at that point you should have your guard up and have no more excuses for losing beyond "they are better than you".

[Zephyron.7081]

> @"Optimator.3589" said:

> Shouldn't be able to enter stealth while in combat. It's that simple. Whatever its other failings, WoW handled stealth far better than this game.

 

I vehemently disagree, friend. WoW has done nothing better than GW2. I've played both games extensively, and in my humble opinion, GW2 is far superior in every way - especially when stealth is concerned.

[Hitman.5829]

Stealth along with high mobility is what makes this game so broken. Usually, other games that introduce stealth mechanics have the following:

* Reduce running speed while in stealth

* Cannot re-stealth while in combat

* Stealth classes do not have high mobility.

 

 

[spartan.9421]

> @"SoV.5139" said:

> > @"Optimator.3589" said:

> > Shouldn't be able to enter stealth while in combat. It's that simple. Whatever its other failings, WoW handled stealth far better than this game.

>

> Agreed.

> Once the ambush happens the player is now committed to the fight. They dont get to escape and reset every time they begin to lose.

 

Yeah let's just destroy the core fundamentals of thief. While were at it, mesmers are limited to only being able to summon one clone per battle. No more of this continuous summoning.

 

As for rangers, if their pet dies in combat, they have to go and tame a new one. None of this regeneration out of combat bullkitten.

 

For warriors they can only use burst skills once. Totally unfair for them to constantly be building adrenaline when no other class can.

 

Guardians shouldn't even be able to fight. If they are so virtuous they wouldn't kill people.

 

Revenants shouldn't be able to call on a legend without first performing a ritual of some sort and should not be able to that in combat.

 

Engineers have to go school for 4+ years before they can even think about entering combat.

 

Elementalists can only attune to one element during a fight. They should have to commit to an element before hand. They shouldn't get to swap.

 

Necromancers should just be removed altogether. Completely amoral to use the dead as minions.

 

 

Oh! And while we're busy gutting the game, let's remove the dodge mechanic! It's an unfair mechanic because *I* don't understand it, therefore no one should be allowed to have it!

 

Also, if someone is wearing heavy armor, they move much slower and attack slower than someone in light armor. It's unfair that they should move just as fast while having more defense!