Arbiter.1794 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 I think I should not be forced to buy Heart of Thorns to gain access to a Core Tyria Mastery, it should be available to people even if they only have Path of Fire. For gliding I can understand the choice as it is a HoT mastery, but Auto Loot is not. just disable the last stage of the ability line. Change my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetoII.3782 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 I agree and found it annoying in a recently made alt as well. That being said, the whole point of it was to make me buy HoT, and it was successful. <,< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DemonSeed.3528 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 I've brought this up many times in older posts before, not just about provisions master (and portable provisioner) but also the use of shield gens and also being able to use guild enhancements. I mean what is the point of joining a guild and not being able to use something like that and lock it behind an expansion? They really need to change these things and make it available to all. Locking certain things which should be available by default is weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetoII.3782 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"DemonSeed.3528" said: > I mean what is the point of joining a guild and not being able to use something like that and lock it behind an expansion? The point is to make you buy an expansion you otherwise wouldn't I mean, a dedicated WvW'er would be playing for free without annoying little incentives. The alternative being subscriptions or more coercive forms of revenue generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Pj.2193 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Arbiter.1794" said: > I think I should not be forced to buy Heart of Thorns to gain access to a Core Tyria Mastery, it should be available to people even if they only have Path of Fire. > For gliding I can understand the choice as it is a HoT mastery, but Auto Loot is not. just disable the last stage of the ability line. > > ***Change my mind.*** Pssst: we don’t have to.... we have the provisioner... Oh., and the whole ‘masteries are a HoT thing’. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetoII.3782 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 We don't need mounts as of yet, dont even have them. This being the wvw forum. PoF was to us, a $30 trait line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbiter.1794 Posted November 2, 2018 Author Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. but they aren't HoT masteries, else you would not get Core Tyria Masteries from buying PoF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Pj.2193 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Arbiter.1794" said: > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. > > but they aren't HoT masteries, else you would not get Core Tyria Masteries from buying PoF. Access to the ability to unlock These masteries is available only via HoT. (Edited as my first answer was incorrect) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illconceived Was Na.9781 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. Core masteries also came with HoT and people only need PoF to access them. In my opinion, true auto-looting, whether in WvW or in PvE, should be available to all paying customers. I'm okay with guild enhancements being restricted, since that's consistent with HoT elite specs being restricted. But I also wouldn't mind if ANet treated these as "core for WvW," too. (I suspect the limitation is technical, not intended. The WvW version of masteries probably wasn't designed with multiple sets of unlocks in mind, so maybe they have to make that happen first, before being able to change which expac unlocks what. Worth doing, probably, especially with a third expac on the way. Some day.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetoII.3782 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said: > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. > > Core masteries also came with HoT and people only need PoF to access them. In my opinion, true auto-looting, whether in WvW or in PvE, should be available to all paying customers. > Incorrect, autoloot is exclusively HoT prerequisite. I literally butted my head against this a month ago. PoF only accounts need to keybind a pick-up-loot button. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Arbiter.1794" said: > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. > > but they aren't HoT masteries, else you would not get Core Tyria Masteries from buying PoF. That doesn’t matter for reasons I already gave in my post. Expansions commonly come with QoL features that can only be accessed by acquiring that particular expansion. This isn’t anything new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said: > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. > > Core masteries also came with HoT and people only need PoF to access them. In my opinion, true auto-looting, whether in WvW or in PvE, should be available to all paying customers. > > I'm okay with guild enhancements being restricted, since that's consistent with HoT elite specs being restricted. But I also wouldn't mind if ANet treated these as "core for WvW," too. > > (I suspect the limitation is technical, not intended. The WvW version of masteries probably wasn't designed with multiple sets of unlocks in mind, so maybe they have to make that happen first, before being able to change which expac unlocks what. Worth doing, probably, especially with a third expac on the way. Some day.) ~~If core masteries were made available to those with any expansion then I don’t understand what the OP is complaining about. ~~ _Edit: I see that it’s for the permanent WvW vendor consumable and not an actual mastery. I don’t see why that couldn’t be made available to those with either expansion so long as the final unlock only makes the recipes available based on the expansions you own._ What I was disagreeing with the OP about is the assumption that a feature from an expansion _should_ be made available to others without it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbiter.1794 Posted November 2, 2018 Author Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said: > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. > > > > Core masteries also came with HoT and people only need PoF to access them. In my opinion, true auto-looting, whether in WvW or in PvE, should be available to all paying customers. > > > > I'm okay with guild enhancements being restricted, since that's consistent with HoT elite specs being restricted. But I also wouldn't mind if ANet treated these as "core for WvW," too. > > > > (I suspect the limitation is technical, not intended. The WvW version of masteries probably wasn't designed with multiple sets of unlocks in mind, so maybe they have to make that happen first, before being able to change which expac unlocks what. Worth doing, probably, especially with a third expac on the way. Some day.) > > If core masteries were made available to those with any expansion then I don’t understand what the OP is complaining about. > > What I was disagreeing with the OP about is the assumption that a feature from an expansion _should_ be made available to others without it. Core Masteries are available to people with PoF, however the ability to Auto loot in WvW is only for people with HoT. I find it irritating that i get Auto loot in PvE without HoT, but then in WvW i do not get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Arbiter.1794" said: > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said: > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. > > > > > > Core masteries also came with HoT and people only need PoF to access them. In my opinion, true auto-looting, whether in WvW or in PvE, should be available to all paying customers. > > > > > > I'm okay with guild enhancements being restricted, since that's consistent with HoT elite specs being restricted. But I also wouldn't mind if ANet treated these as "core for WvW," too. > > > > > > (I suspect the limitation is technical, not intended. The WvW version of masteries probably wasn't designed with multiple sets of unlocks in mind, so maybe they have to make that happen first, before being able to change which expac unlocks what. Worth doing, probably, especially with a third expac on the way. Some day.) > > > > If core masteries were made available to those with any expansion then I don’t understand what the OP is complaining about. > > > > What I was disagreeing with the OP about is the assumption that a feature from an expansion _should_ be made available to others without it. > > Core Masteries are available to people with PoF, however the ability to Auto loot in WvW is only for people with HoT. I find it irritating that i get Auto loot in PvE without HoT, but then in WvW i do not get it. I edited my post as the OP wasn’t describing their issue well as the world ability line isn’t a core Tyria mastery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illconceived Was Na.9781 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"LetoII.3782" said: > > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said: > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > > > They’re masteries that came with HoT so you must have HoT to access them. This is no different than needing HoT to access gliding and PoF to access mounts. > > > > Core masteries also came with HoT and people only need PoF to access them. In my opinion, true auto-looting, whether in WvW or in PvE, should be available to all paying customers. > > > Incorrect, autoloot is exclusively HoT prerequisite. > I literally butted my head against this a month ago. PoF only accounts need to keybind a pick-up-loot button. > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Advanced_Logistics > This is different from auto-loot. You do not need to hit any buttons to loot with this active. > Auto-loot by default doesn't work in World vs World. [1]. However, players who own Heart of Thorns can invest World Experience ability points into rank 4 of the Provisions Master line, which has the same loot effect. So auto-looting _in PvE_ is a _core mastery_. It's just not available in WvW, because those "masteries" use a different system and its version of auto-looting is gated behind HoT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetoII.3782 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said: > So auto-looting _in PvE_ is a _core mastery_. It's just not available in WvW As my Grandfather would say; That, and fifty cents will get you a cup of coffee. Are you lost? This is the WvW section. Autoloot is tied to HoT purchase because they want WvW'rs to purchase HoT. Otherwise, we have little incentive to buy HoT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illconceived Was Na.9781 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 > @"LetoII.3782" said: > > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said: > > > So auto-looting _in PvE_ is a _core mastery_. It's just not available in WvW > > As my Grandfather would say; That, and fifty cents will get you a cup of coffee. > Are you lost? This is the WvW section. My point, which you seem to have forgotten in your haste to prove something wrong is: The _PvE_ autolooting feature is available with _any_ expansion and therefore, I (that is, me/myself) believe it would be fair to also have the WvW feature unlocked with PoF. I did not say or even imply that the feature was currently available in WvW to PoF owners. I offered my opinion about what I would like to see. > Autoloot is tied to HoT purchase because they want WvW'rs to purchase HoT. Otherwise, we have little incentive to buy HoT. There's plenty of incentive. There are already 10 important WvW features gated by HoT, none of which are available to Core-only accounts: Gliding and 9 elite specializations (not to mention various aspects of guilds/guild halls). Plus, this isn't an easily noticed gate (not as visible as the elites or gliding): as you point out, you butted your head against this trying to figure it out. It's ineffective as an incentive if people don't realize what's gating it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phs.6089 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 HoT is the Anet first baby, whatev it is to rest of the world doesn't matter, it will always be the best for them. Anet could make tons of moneys selling elit.spec only for $11.99 to people that don't care of story and pve maps, yet they chose to lock little things behind HoT. Making people to don't want to get that expac at all. Etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpapasmurf.5623 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 In a business world...its called "Incentive to buy their product". Regardless of feelings towards it, this is a really common practice thats been around for many many years. Buy a product and get this with it. It sucks sometimes as it can be a harsh reality, however thats how it works as it makes the companies money and if a company didnt make money, their product would show for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DemonSeed.3528 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 Yeah, but this implementation is weird since they had future plans for other expansions - they could have just stuck with elites/gliding/story. This just means that after every subsequent expac there will be more weirder inconsistent splits, especially since newer expac don't get to share some of the things from previous that should be at least default. I get the incentive to buy product, everyone knows that, but I find it hard to believe something like autoloot and other stuff we've mentioned is primary incentive for that. Who is going to buy expac just to use shield gens? :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpapasmurf.5623 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 > @"DemonSeed.3528" said: > Yeah, but this implementation is weird since they had future plans for other expansions - they could have just stuck with elites/gliding/story. This just means that after every subsequent expac there will be more weirder inconsistent splits, especially since newer expac don't get to share some of the things from previous that should be at least default. I get the incentive to buy product, everyone knows that, but I find it hard to believe something like autoloot and other stuff we've mentioned is primary incentive for that. Who is going to buy expac just to use shield gens? :P In all fairness I bought HoT purely for Gliding...and all I do is WvW for the most part (and I dont main any HoT classes). Something that doesnt make sense for you may make sense for others. Everyone has their own reasonings ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DemonSeed.3528 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 > @"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said: > > @"DemonSeed.3528" said: > > Yeah, but this implementation is weird since they had future plans for other expansions - they could have just stuck with elites/gliding/story. This just means that after every subsequent expac there will be more weirder inconsistent splits, especially since newer expac don't get to share some of the things from previous that should be at least default. I get the incentive to buy product, everyone knows that, but I find it hard to believe something like autoloot and other stuff we've mentioned is primary incentive for that. Who is going to buy expac just to use shield gens? :P > > In all fairness I bought HoT purely for Gliding...and all I do is WvW for the most part (and I dont main any HoT classes). Something that doesnt make sense for you may make sense for others. Everyone has their own reasonings ;) Yes but see, for HoT, gliding/elites/story was the major selling point, not like the stuff we've mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpapasmurf.5623 Posted November 4, 2018 Share Posted November 4, 2018 > @"DemonSeed.3528" said: > > @"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said: > > > @"DemonSeed.3528" said: > > > Yeah, but this implementation is weird since they had future plans for other expansions - they could have just stuck with elites/gliding/story. This just means that after every subsequent expac there will be more weirder inconsistent splits, especially since newer expac don't get to share some of the things from previous that should be at least default. I get the incentive to buy product, everyone knows that, but I find it hard to believe something like autoloot and other stuff we've mentioned is primary incentive for that. Who is going to buy expac just to use shield gens? :P > > > > In all fairness I bought HoT purely for Gliding...and all I do is WvW for the most part (and I dont main any HoT classes). Something that doesnt make sense for you may make sense for others. Everyone has their own reasonings ;) > Yes but see, for HoT, gliding/elites/story was the major selling point, not like the stuff we've mentioned. > You miss my point is appears. I rarely glide in WvW...only time really is when I leave spawn. It serves no use to me really, however I bought the expac anyway. OP would get more use out of the expac due to what it brings that they want, thus they would get more of their money's "worth" than I did, however gliding (while not overly useful to me) is something I wanted, so I bought the expac regardless of anything else. Im not saying the initial complaint has no merit. What I am saying is that its a normal business practice and its up to the people to see if its worth it or not. If it is...great...if not, then there no reason to complain because if you have a reason to complain, then its obviously worth getting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephiroth.4217 Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 > @"DemonSeed.3528" said: > > @"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said: > > > @"DemonSeed.3528" said: > > > Yeah, but this implementation is weird since they had future plans for other expansions - they could have just stuck with elites/gliding/story. This just means that after every subsequent expac there will be more weirder inconsistent splits, especially since newer expac don't get to share some of the things from previous that should be at least default. I get the incentive to buy product, everyone knows that, but I find it hard to believe something like autoloot and other stuff we've mentioned is primary incentive for that. Who is going to buy expac just to use shield gens? :P > > > > In all fairness I bought HoT purely for Gliding...and all I do is WvW for the most part (and I dont main any HoT classes). Something that doesnt make sense for you may make sense for others. Everyone has their own reasonings ;) > Yes but see, for HoT, gliding/elites/story was the major selling point, not like the stuff we've mentioned. > I only bought HoT to keep up with power creep in PvP, same thing with PoF... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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