Deadeye are even more obnoxious than Scourges

[Aodlop.1907]

> Its either they're good at +1 and nothing else, good at dueling and bad at team (somehow), or useless for pvp.

 

Useless for PvP is the way to go for deadeye. There are plenty of other thief builds that are all viable.

[VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.]

the problem is stealth. Remove stealth from the game, problem solved.

[Alatar.7364]

> @"Aodlop.1907" said:

> > Its either they're good at +1 and nothing else, good at dueling and bad at team (somehow), or useless for pvp.

>

> Useless for PvP is the way to go for deadeye. There are plenty of other thief builds that are all viable.

 

Define _"plenty"_.

[Burnfall.9573]

> @"VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618" said:

> the problem is stealth. Remove stealth from the game, problem solved.

 

 

[Psycoprophet.8107]

> @"Aodlop.1907" said:

> "t's really annoying for every one to think it's some godlike spec that can never die and one shot."

> "Have you, sir, tried to exhaust all of your options vs DEs before you jump with a post?"

>

> I didn't say it was op or that deadeye were impossible to kill. I said getting killed by one was frustrating and poor design. You don't feel like this idiot deserved his kill, cause he just appears out of nowhere and one shots you during a fight. Even if you do spot him during your fight, you may no longer have the tools to dodge his stupid one shot skill. No class should be able to deal that much damage with ONE spell.

>

> > Or maybe you want a flat power nerf so that zerker ammy and such don't pack as much a punch? Have fun being in the bunker meta from a few years ago where literally no one died in an entire match.

>

> You do enjoy your strawman. I don't want to nerf every glass cannon build, I don't mind set up and one shots if there is a big tell or if there is counter to it.

> What I don't like is an idiotic spec that can one shot you FROM STEALTH. You managed to dodge ? Good, now the thief is at the other side of the map & in stealth he didn't suffer any consequences.

> I don't want all high damage specs nerfed, I don't want a bunker meta, I just want poorly designed specs gutted. It used to be the case in WoW that such specs with braindead easy rotations had next to no damage in PvP (think BM hunters). The same should be applied here.

 

This is why thief /DE has been ruined over the last few yrs. if thief wasn’t annoying to fit against it wouldn’t be a thief/rouge character lol they have such low hp/sustain that they need to use mobility and burst to take some one out and that’s how it should be considering it’s thief architecture.backstabs,stealth and quick burst are thiefs gimmicks and it has large weaknesses to compensate. We all talk about these powercrept Zerg builds that can one shot being so annoying but thing is is a non zerk build might as well be a zerk when fighting thief lol.thiefs are downed very fast if they get hit hense resetting etc, which again annoys players further.without their burst DE would be low mobility,low hp/sustain and mediocre damage,doesn’t sound like I’d be very effective lol,for the record I hate DE too.just sucks that core and DD are so weak now,mediocre damage cuz burst nurfs,mobility nurfs thru unhindered,no hp/sustain buffs to compensate. It’s like people want thief buried just for being thief like haha

[zoopop.5630]

Dodge on stealth with Shadow Art is the most dumbest cheese spec a class can have to stomp a shitload of noobs in rank.

 

Remove the stealth on dodge and i'll be happy.

[kodesh.2851]

Lol please. If the DE specs DA or CS for burst, they will have no sustain or mobility. If they spec SA for perma stealth and the sustain, they give up tons of damage. It's fine, lern2play issue.

[ParanoidKami.2867]

> @"TorQ.7041" said:

> > @"ParanoidKami.2867" said:

> > > @"Lahmia.2193" said:

> > > Death's Judgement has a pretty big tell, visual and audio, and is now blockable/reflectable.

> >

> > Problem is quickness.

>

> Problem is. U see mark on u. U dodge. The problem with dying to a bad deadeye is also quickness. If u hear the sound and the dodge you have a whole second to dodge. Since it's about 4 skills they press. U dodge that shot the deadeye has already spent everything trying to put that one burst and now must wait to redo it. Now u just port to him and he will use his only shadowstep and will likely run.

 

Death's Judgement is a .5 second skill not 1. My post was about having quickness and using Deaths Judgement since it speeds up the attack and it's too fast to dodge on reaction. There are other ways to get quickness besides the trait for Mark. I know how to deal with Deadeyes and don't have any problem closing in on them or defending. Quickness on DoJ just takes out some counterplay.

[Aodlop.1907]

> @"kodesh.2851" said:

> Lol please. If the DE specs DA or CS for burst, they will have no sustain or mobility. If they spec SA for perma stealth and the sustain, they give up tons of damage. It's fine, lern2play issue.

 

It's fine if they're bad. Not every single spec or build NEEDS to be viable in PvP. Some specs are low effort/high reward and should belong in PvE only.

[syszery.1592]

> @"Aodlop.1907" said:

> > Its either they're good at +1 and nothing else, good at dueling and bad at team (somehow), or useless for pvp.

>

> Useless for PvP is the way to go for deadeye. There are plenty of other thief builds that are all viable.

 

Interesting. How can someone who plays many games on deadeye be in top ten EU if deadeye is so useless?

 

> @"Aodlop.1907" said:

> > @"kodesh.2851" said:

> > Lol please. If the DE specs DA or CS for burst, they will have no sustain or mobility. If they spec SA for perma stealth and the sustain, they give up tons of damage. It's fine, lern2play issue.

>

> It's fine if they're bad. Not every single spec or build NEEDS to be viable in PvP. Some specs are low effort/high reward and should belong in PvE only.

 

This is just your personal opinion. What class/build do you play? Would it be ok for you if this is nerf'ed to the ground with the next balance patch?

[Aodlop.1907]

> grow the hell up and learn counterplay and avoidance. There's plenty of counterplay against a D

 

https://bit.ly/2SynFaY

Right. This guy totally had it comming and really needs to L2P.

To think specs like deadeye & scourge exist in the same game as weavers is mindblowing to me.

And yes, this video is pre-nerf, but my screenshot on this thread is not, they still deal absurd damage and neef further gutting.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

I like thief a lot. not a fan of DE,just don’t find it very fun personally but I love that it creates soo much salt and whining haha I hope more thief players get tired of their gutted core/dd specs( again ruined by whiner cry babies) and jump onto DE and produce more even more salt, community deserves it lol

[Psycoprophet.8107]

I don’t like this class whaaaa,I just got bursted by a class that’s dead in two hits whaaaa nurf nurf it’s to op lol man I die constantly yet I’d never want another class gutted basically ruining a class that’s fun for others,asking for small adjustments or buff in ur own class is one thing but to want a class ruined is another. DE arnt that big an issue lol

[XECOR.2814]

Why Passive aggressive on scourge tho

[TorQ.7041]

> @"ParanoidKami.2867" said:

> > @"TorQ.7041" said:

> > > @"ParanoidKami.2867" said:

> > > > @"Lahmia.2193" said:

> > > > Death's Judgement has a pretty big tell, visual and audio, and is now blockable/reflectable.

> > >

> > > Problem is quickness.

> >

> > Problem is. U see mark on u. U dodge. The problem with dying to a bad deadeye is also quickness. If u hear the sound and the dodge you have a whole second to dodge. Since it's about 4 skills they press. U dodge that shot the deadeye has already spent everything trying to put that one burst and now must wait to redo it. Now u just port to him and he will use his only shadowstep and will likely run.

>

> Death's Judgement is a .5 second skill not 1. My post was about having quickness and using Deaths Judgement since it speeds up the attack and it's too fast to dodge on reaction. There are other ways to get quickness besides the trait for Mark. I know how to deal with Deadeyes and don't have any problem closing in on them or defending. Quickness on DoJ just takes out some counterplay.

 

You act as if a DE can instantly 1 shot thru 1 deaths judgement. A deaths judgement with no might stack is not all that high. It becomes massive after spamming skill 3 to stack 25 might.u need spotter shot, 2-3 3 round burst for malice and the f2 skill to stealth then deaths judgement.

 

The 5 buttons u have to press even with quickness does not take .5 seconds, it's more like 1.5 I know because I play alot of DE. Only players who arent aware n don't react die to it. And that barely happens at or above gold.

 

Most of the time I save the burst n just shoot till all cool downs r gone before I actually use it. Which is how the game is suppose to be played.

 

So no it does not take .5 seconds to down some one with quickness because 1 skill does not do 25k dmg instantly.

[sephiroth.4217]

> @"Aodlop.1907" said:

> > grow the hell up and learn counterplay and avoidance. There's plenty of counterplay against a D

>

> https://bit.ly/2SynFaY

> Right. This guy totally had it comming and really needs to L2P.

> To think specs like deadeye & scourge exist in the same game as weavers is mindblowing to me.

> And yes, this video is pre-nerf, but my screenshot on this thread is not, they still deal absurd damage and neef further gutting.

 

So we need to buff those 2 classes?

?

[Marxx.5021]

> @"zoopop.5630" said:

> Dodge on stealth with Shadow Art is the most dumbest cheese spec a class can have to stomp a kitten of noobs in rank.

>

> Remove the stealth on dodge and i'll be happy.

 

Silent scope makes you wonder if competitive game modes are considered at all when designing specs.

[Dahkeus.8243]

Stealth on dodge is just bad design, but I agree with others that the spec isn't all that bad in terms of overall power. It currently keeps some builds in check in lower rankings, but there's probably better ways for that to happen.

 

Personally, I go D/P DrD anytime I see a deadeye on the other team and have fun farming them.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

> @"Marxx.5021" said:

> > @"zoopop.5630" said:

> > Dodge on stealth with Shadow Art is the most dumbest cheese spec a class can have to stomp a kitten of noobs in rank.

> >

> > Remove the stealth on dodge and i'll be happy.

>

> Silent scope makes you wonder if competitive game modes are considered at all when designing specs.

 

They are not,pve is what the specs are balanced towards

[Vagrant.7206]

The problem with Deadeye is not 1v1s. In 1v1, the fight is generally pretty fair if you know what you're doing. Sure, the stealth is annoying, but w/e. Every class has their gimmick.

 

The problem is their +1 potential. They face virtually no risk in a +1 scenario unless their target has perfect reaction times. Their tells are significantly subtler in +1 scenarios than a power shatter one-shot mesmer.

[vesica tempestas.1563]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> The problem with Deadeye is not 1v1s. In 1v1, the fight is generally pretty fair if you know what you're doing. Sure, the stealth is annoying, but w/e. Every class has their gimmick.

>

> The problem is their +1 potential. They face virtually no risk in a +1 scenario unless their target has perfect reaction times. Their tells are significantly subtler in +1 scenarios than a power shatter one-shot mesmer.

 

Exactly. This is why you should never be able to stack stats such that you can kill in a second, it's terrible gameplay. The argument that a 1 shot build is ok because the opponent HAS to dodge it or die instantly makes no sense in arena 5 man pvp. Imaging an attack that was described as '_1 shot opponent if they don't avoid it'_ that's what we have here.

[Vagrant.7206]

> @"vesica tempestas.1563" said:

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > The problem with Deadeye is not 1v1s. In 1v1, the fight is generally pretty fair if you know what you're doing. Sure, the stealth is annoying, but w/e. Every class has their gimmick.

> >

> > The problem is their +1 potential. They face virtually no risk in a +1 scenario unless their target has perfect reaction times. Their tells are significantly subtler in +1 scenarios than a power shatter one-shot mesmer.

>

> Exactly. This is why you should never be able to stack stats such that you can kill in a second, it's terrible gameplay. The argument that a 1 shot build is ok because the opponent HAS to dodge it or die instantly makes no sense in arena 5 man pvp. Imaging an attack that was described as '_1 shot opponent if they don't avoid it'_ that's what we have here.

 

Yep. I don't think I've ever seen an MMO where one-shot builds were considered "ok" unless their drawbacks were incredibly severe. Power-shatter mesmer fits this bill -- once it shoots its load, it's extremely vulnerable. Deadeye does not fit this bill. The stealth and teleports leave the user well-defended even after they blow their load, and they often still have plenty of damage output to boot after their primary strike.

 

They are balanced in a duel, but in a team battle this can be utterly devastating unless your team is prepared to counter it, which rarely occurs in the random matches.

[ferbz.6987]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said:

> > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > The problem with Deadeye is not 1v1s. In 1v1, the fight is generally pretty fair if you know what you're doing. Sure, the stealth is annoying, but w/e. Every class has their gimmick.

> > >

> > > The problem is their +1 potential. They face virtually no risk in a +1 scenario unless their target has perfect reaction times. Their tells are significantly subtler in +1 scenarios than a power shatter one-shot mesmer.

> >

> > Exactly. This is why you should never be able to stack stats such that you can kill in a second, it's terrible gameplay. The argument that a 1 shot build is ok because the opponent HAS to dodge it or die instantly makes no sense in arena 5 man pvp. Imaging an attack that was described as '_1 shot opponent if they don't avoid it'_ that's what we have here.

>

> Yep. I don't think I've ever seen an MMO where one-shot builds were considered "ok" unless their drawbacks were incredibly severe. Power-shatter mesmer fits this bill -- once it shoots its load, it's extremely vulnerable. Deadeye does not fit this bill. The stealth and teleports leave the user well-defended even after they blow their load, and they often still have plenty of damage output to boot after their primary strike.

>

> They are balanced in a duel, but in a team battle this can be utterly devastating unless your team is prepared to counter it, which rarely occurs in the random matches.

 

Yes, Mesmer after one shotting you needs their defenses... Makes sense. DE one shots in spvp are non existent at least not semi average ranking. But going back to Mesmer, yeah they def don't have enough stealth, invuls, dodges, teleports, 5+ clones, reflects, crystals (provides mirage cloak) burst and sustain (all stackable too!) like thief does. Want to talk about the New chronobunker, or soulbeast? No? That's what I thought. What are you playing WOW or FFXIV because gw2 is not one.

[sephiroth.4217]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said:

> > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > The problem with Deadeye is not 1v1s. In 1v1, the fight is generally pretty fair if you know what you're doing. Sure, the stealth is annoying, but w/e. Every class has their gimmick.

> > >

> > > The problem is their +1 potential. They face virtually no risk in a +1 scenario unless their target has perfect reaction times. Their tells are significantly subtler in +1 scenarios than a power shatter one-shot mesmer.

> >

> > Exactly. This is why you should never be able to stack stats such that you can kill in a second, it's terrible gameplay. The argument that a 1 shot build is ok because the opponent HAS to dodge it or die instantly makes no sense in arena 5 man pvp. Imaging an attack that was described as '_1 shot opponent if they don't avoid it'_ that's what we have here.

>

> Yep. I don't think I've ever seen an MMO where one-shot builds were considered "ok" unless their drawbacks were incredibly severe. Power-shatter mesmer fits this bill -- once it shoots its load, it's extremely vulnerable. Deadeye does not fit this bill. The stealth and teleports leave the user well-defended even after they blow their load, and they often still have plenty of damage output to boot after their primary strike.

>

> They are balanced in a duel, but in a team battle this can be utterly devastating unless your team is prepared to counter it, which rarely occurs in the random matches.

 

Mesmer was the worst example... especially since your argument on thief is "protected by stealth and ports"...

 

One shot builds with huge drawbacks go to elementalists, holo (the build I use anyway) and DH...

On those builds you either burst someone into downstate or kill yourself in the process of trying.

[vesica tempestas.1563]

> @"ferbz.6987" said:

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > @"vesica tempestas.1563" said:

> > > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > The problem with Deadeye is not 1v1s. In 1v1, the fight is generally pretty fair if you know what you're doing. Sure, the stealth is annoying, but w/e. Every class has their gimmick.

> > > >

> > > > The problem is their +1 potential. They face virtually no risk in a +1 scenario unless their target has perfect reaction times. Their tells are significantly subtler in +1 scenarios than a power shatter one-shot mesmer.

> > >

> > > Exactly. This is why you should never be able to stack stats such that you can kill in a second, it's terrible gameplay. The argument that a 1 shot build is ok because the opponent HAS to dodge it or die instantly makes no sense in arena 5 man pvp. Imaging an attack that was described as '_1 shot opponent if they don't avoid it'_ that's what we have here.

> >

> > Yep. I don't think I've ever seen an MMO where one-shot builds were considered "ok" unless their drawbacks were incredibly severe. Power-shatter mesmer fits this bill -- once it shoots its load, it's extremely vulnerable. Deadeye does not fit this bill. The stealth and teleports leave the user well-defended even after they blow their load, and they often still have plenty of damage output to boot after their primary strike.

> >

> > They are balanced in a duel, but in a team battle this can be utterly devastating unless your team is prepared to counter it, which rarely occurs in the random matches.

>

> Yes, Mesmer after one shotting you needs their defenses... Makes sense. DE one shots in spvp are non existent at least not semi average ranking. But going back to Mesmer, yeah they def don't have enough stealth, invuls, dodges, teleports, 5+ clones, reflects, crystals (provides mirage cloak) burst and sustain (all stackable too!) like thief does. Want to talk about the New chronobunker, or soulbeast? No? That's what I thought. What are you playing WOW or FFXIV because gw2 is not one.

 

Applies to all professions and rank, from a design perspective the ability for any player to take 100% of a another players health in a second or so is poor gameplay and design for pvp.