Upcoming Balance Notes

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

> @"DarkEagle.7381" said:

> So, they nerf Condi Renegade in Raids but leave Mirage alone? Mirage pulls over 40k DPS on Cairn and SH and is oppressively strong on Largos, Cairn, SH, Matthias but they nerf Renegade instead of nerfing Mirage? It's like Anet doesn't even play this game.

 

Given recent news, the irony is that no, they don't play the game anymore.

 

Seriously though, the changes to Revenants were head scratchers. I ran the[numbers](https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/782551/#Comment_782551 "https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/782551/#Comment_782551") awhile ago, and the majority of Renegade damage doesn't come from Searing Fissure or Rampant Vex. It comes from Unyielding Anguish and Citadel Bombardment. It looks like former balance team just looked at Renegade, decided that it did too much damage somehow, and started randomly hitting different skills to compensate.

 

They did it in the worst way, too. The condi renegade DPS rotation is a complicated monstrosity that is accident prone and uses nearly every single skill the Renegade has. But, the nerf to Searing Fissure specifically targets mace campers who use a much simpler and lower damaging rotation.

[Ariurotl.3718]

Oh well, the Guardian nerfs make it a much easier decision to make Necro my new main.

[Lithril Ashwalker.6230]

> @"DarkEagle.7381" said:

> So, they nerf Condi Renegade in Raids but leave Mirage alone? Mirage pulls over 40k DPS on Cairn and SH and is oppressively strong on Largos, Cairn, SH, Matthias but they nerf Renegade instead of nerfing Mirage? It's like Anet doesn't even play this game.

 

how nerfed...its adding MORE burn but slightly reducing torment.

 

" Rampant Vex: Reduced the duration of torment applied by this trait from 4 seconds to 3 seconds. "

"Call of the Demon: Increased the duration of torment that this skill applies from 6 seconds to 8 seconds."

"Call of the Renegade: The amount of bleeding that this skill can stack has been increased from 1 to 2 in PvP and WvW. It now always grants 1 fervor stack in addition to the stacks gained per each hit in all modes." < barely any change

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

> @"Lithril Ashwalker.6230" said:

> > @"DarkEagle.7381" said:

> > So, they nerf Condi Renegade in Raids but leave Mirage alone? Mirage pulls over 40k DPS on Cairn and SH and is oppressively strong on Largos, Cairn, SH, Matthias but they nerf Renegade instead of nerfing Mirage? It's like Anet doesn't even play this game.

>

> how nerfed...its addming MORE burn but slightly reducing torment.

 

They reduced the amount of burn. Searing Fissure used to do 4 stacks for 4 seconds, coming to a total of 16 ticks for anyone standing in it. Now it does 3 stacks for 3 seconds, and then 3 more stacks of one second, coming to 12 ticks. It is more front-loaded, but weaker overall.

[InsaneQR.7412]

Little side bote for the spirits on ranger.

Could you make the active ground targeted instead of PbAoE?

Ranger already lacks targeted AoE so this would be a welcome addition.

Otherwise this is a decent balance update, didnt expect so few nerfs and so many reworks.

[Lithril Ashwalker.6230]

> @"Blood Red Arachnid.2493" said:

> > @"Lithril Ashwalker.6230" said:

> > > @"DarkEagle.7381" said:

> > > So, they nerf Condi Renegade in Raids but leave Mirage alone? Mirage pulls over 40k DPS on Cairn and SH and is oppressively strong on Largos, Cairn, SH, Matthias but they nerf Renegade instead of nerfing Mirage? It's like Anet doesn't even play this game.

> >

> > how nerfed...its addming MORE burn but slightly reducing torment.

>

> They reduced the amount of burn. Searing Fissure used to do 4 stacks for 4 seconds, coming to a total of 16 ticks for anyone standing in it. Now it does 3 stacks for 3 seconds, and then 3 more stacks of one second, coming to 12 ticks. It is more front-loaded, but weaker overall.

 

"Searing Fissure: This skill now applies **3 stacks of burning for 3 seconds on its first hit**, and **1 stack of burning for 1 second** on the **next three hits**. The damage of the first hit has been increased by 100%. Increased the recharge time from 3 seconds to 6 seconds in PvP and WvW only." I think its added more stacks but not outright.

 

unless its not worded correctly. > first cast = 3 stacks, pulse 1 >1 burn, pulse 2> 1 burn, Pulse 3> 1 burn = 6 stacks.

initial cast is always a pulse despite the following last 3 pulses, even in current patch. but its not 4 outright at first anymore, looks more spread out.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Searing_Fissure

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

> @"Lithril Ashwalker.6230" said:

> > @"Blood Red Arachnid.2493" said:

> > > @"Lithril Ashwalker.6230" said:

> > > > @"DarkEagle.7381" said:

> > > > So, they nerf Condi Renegade in Raids but leave Mirage alone? Mirage pulls over 40k DPS on Cairn and SH and is oppressively strong on Largos, Cairn, SH, Matthias but they nerf Renegade instead of nerfing Mirage? It's like Anet doesn't even play this game.

> > >

> > > how nerfed...its addming MORE burn but slightly reducing torment.

> >

> > They reduced the amount of burn. Searing Fissure used to do 4 stacks for 4 seconds, coming to a total of 16 ticks for anyone standing in it. Now it does 3 stacks for 3 seconds, and then 3 more stacks of one second, coming to 12 ticks. It is more front-loaded, but weaker overall.

>

> "Searing Fissure: This skill now applies **3 stacks of burning for 3 seconds on its first hit**, and **1 stack of burning for 1 second** on the **next three hits**. The damage of the first hit has been increased by 100%. Increased the recharge time from 3 seconds to 6 seconds in PvP and WvW only." I think its added more stacks but not outright.

>

> unless its not worded correctly. > first cast = 3 stacks, pulse 1 >1 burn, pulse 2> 1 burn, Pulse 3> 1 burn = 6 stacks.

> initial cast is always a pulse despite the following last 3 pulses, even in current patch. but its not 4 outright at first anymore, looks more spread out.

> https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Searing_Fissure

 

I'm counting ticks, not stacks. The total number of ticks is the total amount of damage that the skill does.

[Lithril Ashwalker.6230]

> @"Blood Red Arachnid.2493" said:

> > @"Lithril Ashwalker.6230" said:

> > > @"Blood Red Arachnid.2493" said:

> > > > @"Lithril Ashwalker.6230" said:

> > > > > @"DarkEagle.7381" said:

> > > > > So, they nerf Condi Renegade in Raids but leave Mirage alone? Mirage pulls over 40k DPS on Cairn and SH and is oppressively strong on Largos, Cairn, SH, Matthias but they nerf Renegade instead of nerfing Mirage? It's like Anet doesn't even play this game.

> > > >

> > > > how nerfed...its addming MORE burn but slightly reducing torment.

> > >

> > > They reduced the amount of burn. Searing Fissure used to do 4 stacks for 4 seconds, coming to a total of 16 ticks for anyone standing in it. Now it does 3 stacks for 3 seconds, and then 3 more stacks of one second, coming to 12 ticks. It is more front-loaded, but weaker overall.

> >

> > "Searing Fissure: This skill now applies **3 stacks of burning for 3 seconds on its first hit**, and **1 stack of burning for 1 second** on the **next three hits**. The damage of the first hit has been increased by 100%. Increased the recharge time from 3 seconds to 6 seconds in PvP and WvW only." I think its added more stacks but not outright.

> >

> > unless its not worded correctly. > first cast = 3 stacks, pulse 1 >1 burn, pulse 2> 1 burn, Pulse 3> 1 burn = 6 stacks.

> > initial cast is always a pulse despite the following last 3 pulses, even in current patch. but its not 4 outright at first anymore, looks more spread out.

> > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Searing_Fissure

>

> I'm counting ticks, not stacks. The total number of ticks is the total amount of damage that the skill does.

 

were gonna have to wait to see, may need smoldering runes :/

[Ezaster.2498]

Yay... no meaningful changes to Warrior or Ranger (besides Soulbeast nerfs) for the next 1/4 of year.

 

How out of touch are you guys that you don't do anything about Rampage being unfun and having no real counter to this mechanic?

What's fun and interactive against facing Warrior that basically takes no damage while on this form, has pulsing stab, reduced movement impairing effect while having access to skills that either CC or deal 6k crits? You guys feel like it's a FAIR elite skill? Not overloaded at all?

[Xyonon.3987]

Chrono main here - I understand and like / support the changes, however can you help us out and finally

**increase the Quickness cap to 9 stacks instead of 5**?

We can't deal with ToT, WoA and TW anymore. Half of those skills won't do anything in CS anymore. :(

[Voltekka.2375]

Noone saw this? Oh wvw , poor wvw

• Winds of Disenchantment: This is now a channeled skill, and it will follow the warrior. Its pulse time has been reduced from 1 second to 0.5 seconds with the duration remaining at 5 seconds. Breaking the channel will now destroy the spell. The casting time has been reduced to 0.5 seconds.

[Borraian.2365]

But..

 

 

"" Silent Scope: The duration of stealth that this trait grants has been reduced from 3 seconds to 1 second in PvP and WvW."""

 

This dont will not solve the problem of disproportionate thief damage with stealth attacks.

 

Why reduced silent scope?. This is a good tool for a surviving and is funny. This perk no is de problem

The problem is some some builds allow hit in stealth and doing 15k damage. Nerfead that, no the silent scope. Reduce the scale of damage, or something, but dont nerf something that does not need it.

[inquisitor.3928]

:'( this blance is just a "why blance" nothing usefull , you changed agiain something that work . if u want player use something different that ordinary classes buff other builds ,give us an alternative .We don't need a chrono or druid nerf again , we need balance that buff classes that need this , look reverant or ele or necro ,no one want play that class in pve , we need a ranger nerf in wvw / pvp not druid nerf in pve . Maybe someone want a mirage nerf in wvw / pvp not a chrono nerf again in pve plus again Mirage Dodge ??? Really ? Dardevil have 3 Dodges! Not One ,not 2 but 3 . if u want help us pls look for things don't work and fix those. And i can't say thanks for that balance because i play this since two years now, i play all class in all content and i'm a little tired anytime to chance my build for nothing

[Derm.4932]

> @"Arcaedus.7290" said:

> I like the buff to trueshot's range but would have much preferred they made the knockback on LB3 baseline for DH. If there's a buff that LB needed it was that. The 1500 range TS will make wvw roaming a tad bit more fun I suppose but it won't really have any major impact on the balance.

 

Anet pls. TS buff is nice but is not going to be noticeable 90% of the time. Knockback on LB3 baseline is what DH LB needs, not extra range on TS.

[rank eleven monk.9502]

Boonbeast and Holo gets basically free passes (at least the stab uptime was nerfed).

Mirage nerfs will work but then again they target some random stuff stuff (scepter and evasive mirror untouched, for example). Chrono will also live on with OP scepter.

Mirage Cloak duration fix was something I have wanted for a long time, it should have been reverted a lot earlier, but happy about this.

The meta will remain highly unchanged (dominated by fb + scourge, boonbeast, holo)

[Alver Lyko.4693]

> @"Derm.4932" said:

> > @"Arcaedus.7290" said:

> > I like the buff to trueshot's range but would have much preferred they made the knockback on LB3 baseline for DH. If there's a buff that LB needed it was that. The 1500 range TS will make wvw roaming a tad bit more fun I suppose but it won't really have any major impact on the balance.

>

> Anet pls. TS buff is nice but is not going to be noticeable 90% of the time. Knockback on LB3 baseline is what DH LB needs, not extra range on TS.

 

**The 1500 range for True Shot is absolutely the right thing to add** specially since True Shots activation time is SUPER SLOW making the user an easy target from 1200. With the 1500 range, it gives extra allowance for the shot to actually fire. It is also more logical common sense wise to make the range of TRUE SHOT 1500 from since it doesnt make sense that it will have the same range as the other Longbow skills with such a long preparation time to shoot it.

Heck, I think 1500 is actually not enough range considering True Shot has the charge up animation but still has the same range as a Ranger's normal longbow range that don't have the charging animation of True Shot. But I will not complain as Anet is moving in the right direction!

 

Don't get me wrong, your knockback idea would be a great addition too, but please don't deny True Shot its **proper range** which they have finally decided to give it. I know you love your DH longbow as much as I do, so let's not give Anet any strange ideas of nerfing just when they are finally fixing what's been wrong with the Dragonhunter longbow. Let's hope they continue to improve the Longbow for Dragonhunters.

THANK YOU ANET for making the True Shot 1500. It was the proper thing to do. Right on point.

 

[felincyriac.5981]

> @"Crinn.7864" said:

> > @"Irenio CalmonHuang.2048" said:

> > **Necromancer**

> > We'll be pushing some of its damage higher through skill updates in PvE, but will be mostly leaving it alone in competitive modes, as all the necromancer specializations have a healthy representation in competitive game modes._

>

> So what you just told me is that necromancer is balanced based on popularity rather than effectiveness.

>

> Explains a lot about the class.

>

>

 

core necro seeing too much play in competitive to be buffed, I guess.

[Cherry.5712]

> @"Irenio CalmonHuang.2048" said:

> Banner skills have long been very passive in nature. Today we're releasing some changes to give them a bit more active gameplay...

 

The proposed changes keep banners pretty much the same in terms of gameplay. You throw them down, they give a buff. They only become more active in that you're theoretically able to move multiple banners yourself now in moving engagements, by picking up (destroying) the banners them throwing them down again somewhere else.

 

> @"Irenio CalmonHuang.2048" said:

> ... while also reducing their granted attributes to give greater role flexibility in group settings.

 

I don't understand how reducing their granted attributes does anything to give them greater flexibility.

 

> @"Irenio CalmonHuang.2048" said:

> However, we do think that the warrior gives up a lot in order to use them, so we're increasing the bonus stat gains when warriors equip traits that modify banners.

 

Current gains are 170, or 255 traited. Proposed gains are 100, or 200 traited. Increasing the bonus stat gain in this scenario is still literally giving the warrior less than what they had previously. So the statement, "we do think the warrior gives up a lot in order to use them" is backed up by the fact that nothing is being given in return. It is in fact the opposite.

 

> @"Irenio CalmonHuang.2048" said:

> As a larger change, we're also removing the bundle skills from banners and changing the pick-up action to now recharge the banner skill. Previously, the banner skills could be a trap for players, providing weaker skills in a bundle that anyone could interact with. We considered enhancing the banner skills, but we don't want banners to be alternate weapons that take away from a player's normal weapons.

 

This seems a fair enough, and an interesting change for banners. They become more mobile in a sense, at the cost of losing their bundle abilities. While the bundles had a niche role (granting swiftness to 10 players, stability with Battle Standard, potential blast finisher stacks with other players), they were most likely rarely ever used and more of a hindrance in the middle of some encounters, as mentioned. I'll miss being able to grant swiftness to NPCs at the very least, to make some escorts go faster. Also hitting stuff with a flag.

 

> @"Irenio CalmonHuang.2048" said:

>• Inspiring Battle Standard: This trait has been renamed Doubled Standards. It no longer causes banners to apply regeneration and instead causes the warrior to gain 5 seconds of swiftness when summoning or picking up a banner.

 

In my opinion a very overlooked and large change. The regen provided by banners was the Warrior's **only** means of applying the boon outside of Dogged March or runes. It may not seem like very much to most, but giving 10 players a constant source of 130 HP per second (with 0 healing power) is a lot of healing over time that has simply been removed from the Warrior's arsenal with no stated reason.

 

Assume a 5-man fractal group has a banner up for a full 80 seconds. Assume they get healed with 0 healing power, for only 50% of the duration due to players being at full HP the remainder of the time. That's 26,000 HP for that team over that span, which I don't count as being insignificant.

 

Also taking away the revive from Battle Standard makes it significantly less useful in PvE scenarios so that you can get a free kill once every 3 minutes in PvP. Could this be changed to be Game Mode dependent before it goes live? Because the only place I can think of where I'd want to execute an NPC with my elite is if you decide to bring back the final encounter with Scarlet from S1.

[felincyriac.5981]

Also very nice nerfs to boonbeasts guys, keep it up! Maybe in another 10 patches they might start feeling the nerfs!

[liurencija.2684]

It's sad to think that there are probably no wvw balance devs left working on these patches anymore. Some of the changes mentioned here will be detrimental towards the further future of wvw as a game mode.

[anduriell.6280]

I like the balance patch, actually the Scrapper seems like an interesting choice now.

 

I also have some doubts about the spirits:

* With a health pool of ~7K spirits will die with a random auto.. Will the get a boost in their HP or become no targetable?

* If they can be CC'ed or killed, Why the passive range reduction? The effects were not that great in PvP and WvW and it reduces greatly the usability of those skills.

 

As a sidenote i think the nerf to the actives from Sun and Storm were unnecesary.

 

[Haleydawn.3764]

The scrapper gyro changes look very interesting. They’ve always been a bit lacking and persnickety to use so this could be a good boost to Scrapper.

 

As a Reaper player, Nightfall and the shout damage increase for PvE is a nice surprise, but they are quite lacking in competitive modes compared to other utilities that other “combatant” Elite Specs have.

[kireniser.2408]

I really do like that you're adressing Banners, but honestly i dont think these changes make them less passive, perhaps even more so since now the utility banners only ever give people stats. What i *would* have liked to see for example would be stronger banner skills, that maybe haave greatly increased cooldown to stop players from just camping a banner.

On another note i also wanted to say thanks for this, patch notes are pretty much my favorite thing to read and im glad for the comms, so cheers and have a nice day

[Nightblade.7982]

Thanks for the heads up on the upcoming changes, I would like to offer what i hope will be constructive criticism and feedback. I'm looking forward to seeing how the changes for Scrappers Gyros, Scourges sand Shade and Necromancer changes in general and Ranger Spirits work out they seem to be pretty good for the most part hopefully the scourge Shade changes help out in wvw for sure.

 

The Perfect Inscriptions and Honorable staff changes look pretty nice for Guardian especially for some support Guard builds. As Someone who plays quite a few support builds on different classes the Guardian and Support Tempest changes, both look pretty good hopefully eroding away some of the perception among some players that Druid and Chronomancer are the only Support/healers worth having, so other support/Healer builds and classes can get some love.

 

Most of the changes for Thief and Revenant look pretty good to me, but I've got mixed feelings on the Banner changes on Warrior, I'm not sure how I feel about being able to finish people with Battle Standard in PvP could be over power or pretty good.

 

Sorry for rambling on about changes and builds, for my last few comments I want to offer some suggestion for potential Support Chronomancer changes. Mesmer in general is doing very well in most areas of the game, but I personally think since the Signet of Inspiration and Illusionary Inspiration trait changes Support Chronomancer builds have not been doing that well in Fractals especially AoE heavy ones and WvW due to not being able to get people to stand in the wells long enough to get the Quickness and Alacrity from them, often having to choose between standing in wells for boons and heals only to get jumped in a zerg or killed or badly damaged in fractals by AoEs that are also inside the wells AoE. On top of that many people are used to getting boons just from the Chronomancer getting them so they either don't stand in Wells, or don't know they have to stand in them in order to get the boons and heals the used to just get for being near a Chronomancer.

 

To help with this issue I have a few suggestions, since most Mesmer traits except one that I know of only give boons to the Mesmer and their Illusions, Chonomancers can now only reliably give out 2 boons Quickness and Alacrity, with a small amount of Aegis from Staff skills and Lesser Chaos storm and Inspiring Distortion. Mesmer can give Some Might, Fury and a hand full of other boons from staff and trident, but both of those are Condition Damage weapons and you cant give that much with them regardless and Chronomancer is mainly setup for Power DPS and Support builds so using Staff for a few boons is alot of sacrifice for little gain.

 

I would suggest maybe adding some boons to Wells and other utility Skills maybe weapon skills, and possibly reworking a few traits not to sure which ones add some to Illusionary Inspiration or Bountiful Disillusionment? or possibly rework Prismatic Understanding I've not seen that in alot of builds lately? I would also suggest spreading the Quickness and Alacrity you get from Well of Action and Recall through all of the pulses instead of just giving it at the end so if you cant stay in the well you at least got something out of it. Also for All's Well that Ends Well and Well of Eternity I would suggest splitting the heals between pulses for the same reason as above.

 

Thanks and keep up the good work sorry about all the rambling.

 

 

[NeroBoron.7285]

From my WvW perspective:

 

Exhaustion: This boon now stacks in duration up to 3 times

ouch, just remove exhaustion and change the traits that applies those

 

**Ele**

Tempest shout changes seem really useful

 

**Engineer**

Changes to the scrapper are awesome. But I hope you got the balance right. An indestructable sneak gyro that pulses invisibility can be too strong. maybe give only invisibility on initial deployment and then a smoke field pulsing blind. "Bulkward Gyro redirects some damage from nearby allies to the engineer." Uhm? I hope using this won't kill us instantly and you have some limiting on this.

On the holo side a nerf to Crystal Configuration: Eclipse... sorry but please no... 2 stacks and 2 seconds of stability is rather short. We already lack in stability and stunbreaks, 3 seconds (and maybe 3 stacks ) would be appreciated imo we still have to hit something to even get those stacks :( You could add a self stunbreak on Toss Elixir U as instead. A group stunbreak if i'm stunned myself is worthless.

 

**Guardian**

The changes Righteous Instincts are over the top. I have to agree that it is one of the best traits, but it was great to get vitality in to compensate the small lifepool. It's just another good example what I hate about your balance patches you go in and nerf skills by 50% and are often over the top with that. why don't you try to make multiple small steps and look how it works. I think 35% increased chance would have been still strong but fair.

 

**Ranger**

No nerf to sick them in soulbeast mode? oO

 

**Mesmer**

Expected a change/nerf to Evasive Mirror here, in my opinion it gives more survivalbility then that 1/4second longer dodge. Not sure on the SoI changes.

Most nerfs were expected there since mirage is to strong in roaming. But for group / zerg setups mesmer isn't that great. I hope we see changes there in the future.