The utility of the warclaw in the PvE environnement.

[Zaxares.5419]

I'm rather partial to the idea of making the Warclaw the "tanky" mount. At just under 11k HP, the Warclaw is the mount with the most HP, so if it were to have higher innate armor than the other mounts (it is the only default mount that's wearing armor), it could be the mount you want to use when you're running through areas with a ton of enemies that condi-bomb you or hurl undodgeable projectiles (looking at you, White Mantle).

[Zenith.7301]

> @"Danikat.8537" said:

> I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

 

We PvE players will take our gliders back from you WvW people. And let's remove pve gear/food and stick you with the amulets an stat caps from spvp. I mean, what's wrong with gear/food being only a thing in PvE? You are a pvp format after all, you should follow pvp rules.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

Except WvW is a combination of PvE and PvP. At least, according to the Devs.

[Astralporing.1957]

> @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

>

> We PvE players will take our gliders back from you WvW people. And let's remove pve gear/food and stick you with the amulets an stat caps from spvp. I mean, what's wrong with gear/food being only a thing in PvE? You are a pvp format after all, you should follow pvp rules.

You do realize that quite a number of WvW players would actually like that... Especially the bit about the gliders.

 

 

[Stalkingwolf.6035]

> @"Danikat.8537" said:

> I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

 

One word : Diversity

 

The jump nerf for WvW makes it laughable useless in PvE.

Its now an afk idle mount.

[casualkenny.9817]

Has anyone offered a reason why it would be independently bad to make the warclaw decent in pve? As in, moves at a decent but lower speed, so ppl who opt to will receive a slight speed penalty (vs raptor/jackal)

 

I am referring to a direct negative effect that other ppl having such a choice would have on you.

 

I dun wvw, so I'm not likely to get it, but I don't see how it's any of my biz if the kitten gets a decent but lesser speed for those who like the skin. Like, what's the big deal that some ppl seem to making out of this.

 

(this is separate from ideas for giving the warclaw a pve utility niche)

[Kal Spiro.9745]

> @"Erasculio.2914" said:

 

> **Q: "But the Warclaw would need to have different speeds in PvE and in WvW, this is technically impossible!"**

>

> False. The Warclaw already has two different speeds, one in owned WvW territories and another in enemy WvW territories.

>

> Also, the day after ArenaNet introduced the Warclaw, they have already split it between a PvE mode and a WvW mode.

>

Actually, all they had to do was define PvE as owned WvW territory. So as long as it's in PvE it's using its top speed. They would have to add a third speed definition and and define PvE as something else again in order to accommodate this. The difficulty there is unknown.

 

[hugo.4705]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

>

> So I'll ask again - why should Warclaw get a better treatment than Skimmer? Because so far the only reason i can see is because kitties are more popular than manta rays.

>

 

Whereas it can be true for some players, I personally love both Manta Rays and Cats.

 

I can't count how many time I asked to add "Diving" on manta ray instead of levitating 2 cm. For the kitty it's kinda the same thing I'm asking a thing tied to endurance bars.

Diving for ray, sprinting for kitty.

 

The disgust can be explained by how bad is the underwater system / water. So many just prefer to swim with infuz or bypassing water with gryphon.

[Zenith.7301]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > > I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

> >

> > We PvE players will take our gliders back from you WvW people. And let's remove pve gear/food and stick you with the amulets an stat caps from spvp. I mean, what's wrong with gear/food being only a thing in PvE? You are a pvp format after all, you should follow pvp rules.

> You do realize that quite a number of WvW players would actually like that... Especially the bit about the gliders.

>

>

 

Seriously doubt it, especially the deadeye abusers who love their format without crit damage caps and no points to contest which allow for abusing the thief's stealth and mobility kit in roam gangs.

[Voltekka.2375]

> @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

>

> We PvE players will take our gliders back from you WvW people. And let's remove pve gear/food and stick you with the amulets an stat caps from spvp. I mean, what's wrong with gear/food being only a thing in PvE? You are a pvp format after all, you should follow pvp rules.

 

Killing guards is pve. Wvw is pve. Devs themselves said it.

[Astralporing.1957]

> @"Zenith.7301" said:

> Seriously doubt it, especially the deadeye abusers who love their format without crit damage caps and no points to contest which allow for abusing the thief's stealth and mobility kit in roam gangs.

Trust me, roamers also dislike their prey to be able to just glide away from them instead of falling to death or not being able to escape. And if we add a ton of glitches gliding added to wvw (many of which still aren't fixed)...

 

Don't assume removing gliding would be some sort of punishment to WvWers. You might end up surprised.

 

 

[Drecien.4508]

> @"Erasculio.2914" said:

> > @"Drecien.4508" said:

> > Not sure if that can be done easily. They specifically made this mount for wvw so they could tweak it all on its own. Once you start separately tweeking the mount in different game modes you can run into bugs.

>

> The day after they introduced the Warclaw, they split how much damage it does in PvE and in WvW. In other words, they are already "separately tweeking the mount in different game modes".

>

>

 

Well then I'm not sure. I thought it would be like all in one tweek.

[eBeco.7612]

Since it’s a WvW mount that can be used in PvE, I think there could be some sort of “charge up” mechanic that depletes over time in PvE. For example, uncharged Warclaw in PvE would just walk instead of running and have its stats lowered. In order to “charge” it and bring its stats to normal, people would actually need to participate in WvW.

 

[FrizzFreston.5290]

> @"Stalkingwolf.6035" said:

> > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

>

> One word : Diversity

>

> The jump nerf for WvW makes it laughable useless in PvE.

> Its now an afk idle mount.

 

You know whats useless? Walking or running on foot! You young whippersnappers with your fancy mounts arent used to anything anymore. Back in the day we used to go everywhere on foot! Bah, kids these days.

 

:p

[FrizzFreston.5290]

> @"Voltekka.2375" said:

> > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > > I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

> >

> > We PvE players will take our gliders back from you WvW people. And let's remove pve gear/food and stick you with the amulets an stat caps from spvp. I mean, what's wrong with gear/food being only a thing in PvE? You are a pvp format after all, you should follow pvp rules.

>

> Killing guards is pve. Wvw is pve. Devs themselves said it.

 

Its hilarious how dev validation was needed there.

[Ashantara.8731]

> @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> Why can't the Warclaw (in PvE) just be for fun?

> The Devs _could_ have made it WvW-only. Why look a gift horse (Warclaw) in the mouth?

 

If only it was a horse! :'(

[Voltekka.2375]

> @"FrizzFreston.5290" said:

> > @"Voltekka.2375" said:

> > > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > > > I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

> > >

> > > We PvE players will take our gliders back from you WvW people. And let's remove pve gear/food and stick you with the amulets an stat caps from spvp. I mean, what's wrong with gear/food being only a thing in PvE? You are a pvp format after all, you should follow pvp rules.

> >

> > Killing guards is pve. Wvw is pve. Devs themselves said it.

>

> Its hilarious how dev validation was needed there.

 

Let the hilarity commence

 

[FrizzFreston.5290]

> @"Voltekka.2375" said:

> > @"FrizzFreston.5290" said:

> > > @"Voltekka.2375" said:

> > > > @"Zenith.7301" said:

> > > > > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > > > > I don't understand why it needs any utility in PvE. What's wrong with having something that's only useful in WvW?

> > > >

> > > > We PvE players will take our gliders back from you WvW people. And let's remove pve gear/food and stick you with the amulets an stat caps from spvp. I mean, what's wrong with gear/food being only a thing in PvE? You are a pvp format after all, you should follow pvp rules.

> > >

> > > Killing guards is pve. Wvw is pve. Devs themselves said it.

> >

> > Its hilarious how dev validation was needed there.

>

> Let the hilarity commence

>

>

 

I know that one, its also half a decade old, and its MO talking about the players, not the gamemode.

 

It more hilarious that 'WvW players'vthemselves dont seem to realise how their game mode is always partially PvE, with no dev validation needed. Labelling 'unwanted things' as PvE is just funny to me.

[Cristalyan.5728]

> @"killfil.3472" said:

> Before I get slaughtered by a tsunami of "It ain't meant for PvE BOI", let me suggest this :

>

> Dont increase it's speed, or anything other than the following : its health. Let's say by 100%.

>

> Its utility wouldn't be speed or its attack, but rather, its tankyness and the safety it would so provide while traveling.

>

>**I perfectly understand that it is an absolutly unnecessary change, I just thought I could suggest a thing...**

 

I totally agree with you here - It is an absolutely unnecessary change. If any change will be taken into consideration I suggest **reducing** the HP pool for the mount. Somewhere around 3-4 K in WvW. And of course, the same amount of HP will be available in PvE too. Useless mount now? Well, you already knew that this is a WvW mount. Without any utility in PvE - you already have 5 mounts covering every aspect - speed / jump / gliding / breaking doors/ "swimming". This is a non necessary addition for PvE. And you acknowledged this by doing the effort to acquire it. Let it be a WvW mount, as you agreed.

[Warobaz.9543]

You know what would be fun ? Even if totally game breaking and unnecessary ? Since it's a cat in substance, I'd love to be able to make it climb walls, trees, posts, banners, cliffs and slopes.

There could be a limit, like being unable to climb stone or other hard walls.

 

Also, to mitigate that kind of advantage when we're on the wrong side, we could have a consumable that looks like a giant mechanized mouse, that the enemy's warclaws feel compelled to follow, with the player unable to dismount for a few seconds.

And even a new blueprint to build a siege Red Dot Projector, with the same effect. :lol:

[Sarpan.9074]

> @"IndigoSundown.5419" said:

> > @"Sarpan.9074" said:

> > If it's modified to be viable, as good as or better than any of the original mounts in PVE, then there needs to be a comparable PVE path to obtaining it.

>

> And this attitude is why ANet will not make this change.

 

Yep. And I hope it has that effect.

 

> @"Yamazuki.6073" said:

> > @"Sarpan.9074" said:

> > If it's modified to be viable, as good as or better than any of the original mounts in PVE, then there needs to be a comparable PVE path to obtaining it.

>

> I imagine the point in the mount being earned in WvW and being useful in PvE would be so it sells skins and to encourage people who aren't crafting legendaries to try out WvW for a few hours. As it is now, if you don't make legendary weapons and don't WvW, there's zero reason to ever try it at all. Unless there was content designed around using this mount only on the PvE maps, there would be zero reason for it to be earned in PvE, it would simply be an alternative to Raptor.

 

What about those who have tried WvW and do not like it? Should they be denied something that has unique abilities in PVE? If it's just a Raptor replacement, fine, then it's effectively a skin. I'm OK with that. But to give a unique ability to a mount that is usable in PVE without a PVE track for obtaining it would be wrong.

[Adul.1520]

If the Warclaw was modified to be _as effective_ (or _nearly as effective_) as the raptor or the jackal in PvE, it wouldn't need a PvE obtain path. It would just be a third mount you could use for mobility _in addition_ to the raptor and the jackal, and it would still be fully superfluous, and you'd lose nothing of any gameplay value if you as a PvE player chose not to get it.

[Erasculio.2914]

It's likely that what will decide if the Warclaw will be modified in PvE or not will be the sales of the Frontline Warclaw Mount Pack. If a lot of people buy it and ArenaNet feels satisfied with the resulting profit, the Warclaw will probably be left as it is. If not enough people buy the mount skin pack, and ArenaNet feels like increasing their target audience, they would probably make the Warclaw more useful in PvE.

 

> @"Adul.1520" said:

> If the Warclaw was modified to be _as effective_ (or _nearly as effective_) as the raptor or the jackal in PvE, it wouldn't need a PvE obtain path. It would just be a third mount you could use for mobility _in addition_ to the raptor and the jackal, and it would still be fully superfluous, and you'd lose nothing of any gameplay value if you as a PvE player chose not to get it.

 

Exactly, I agree 100% with you.

[Hesione.9412]

> @"Dreamy Lu.3865" said:

> I have to say honestly that I don't get it why PvE players (I am myself one) are close to obsessed with the warclaw. There are 6 PvE mounts. Why is it such a problem that one unique mount does exist, that is not matching for PvE? Sorry, I really mean no offense in any way, but I really don't see the issue. The other 6 are not enough?

 

Could they be going for the AP associated with the mount?

[Hesione.9412]

> @"Cyninja.2954" said:

> > @"Erasculio.2914" said:

> > > @"Cyninja.2954" said:

> > > The Warclaw also is available way earlier than the Jackal or any other PoF mount for that matter. We are going in circles.

> >

> > And? The Raptor is also available way earlier than any other PoF mount for that matter. Does that mean the Raptor makes the other mounts redundant?

> >

>

> The raptor requires:

> - completion of a story step which new player might not want to do out of order or risk getting spoiled story wise

> - requires significant mastery investment to achieve decent vertical movement (rank 3)

> - requires enough mastery points to gain access to these abilities. Mastery points which are not as easily available when entering PoF as new player

>

> The Warclaw circumvents all of this with basically 1 skill point in WvW which is attained multiple time over while gaining the short collection achievements.

 

This ignores the fact that a lot more than one rank point is required to unlock all the warclaw abilities in wvw. 126 rank points are needed to unlock all warclaw masteries: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warclaw

 

126 rank points is an investment at least on par with the mastery investment you mention above for the raptor. The last mastery level on the warclaw isn't fantastic. Ignoring that one, a person still needs 91 rank points for the warclaw. That presents hours of investment by the (new) wvw player.