Idea: Universal skills or New Skills with future living content

[Gundam Style.8495]

Introduce new skills that can be earned without a new specialization. Maybe they can be unique to profession or universal. I guess similar to the traits and skills introduced with eye of the north from gw1.

Make a new elite, or just a specialization based on the living story that everyone can choose to equip. It doesn't necessarily have to extend to pvp.

if they could be learned through the story I think it would be a nice achievement.

 

[https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_PvE-only_skills](https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_PvE-only_skills "https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_PvE-only_skills")

 

I think the skills enhanced everyone and made them more effective at certain roles in the old game, maybe it could do the same in this game for those who feel left out, and if it's universal no one will think tommy got a better present.

 

It presents an opportunity in the unexplored areas on Tyria, and for the devs to introduce some truly wacky instructors, I mean who didn't have the crazy "math" teacher or cool school counselor.

 

For example, this guy was fun

 

[Kilroy Stonekin](https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Kilroy_Stonekin "https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Kilroy_Stonekin")

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

Well, they did do that once; it didn't turn out to be very popular, and was subsequently removed.

I suppose it would depend on the skill, though then, if it's really useful/universal, then everyone will carry it.

If more of that type were introduced, soon everyone would be using the same skills, I guess. Might make balancing easier, but gameplay more boring? I don't know.

[Airdive.2613]

I still feel it would be great to have more (meaningful) bundles and transformations in the game; these give you a set of somewhat universal new skills, and the tech is already in the game.

It seems the majority of players wasn't happy about bundles and transformations, though, seeing as ANet keeps weakening and removing them.

[Gundam Style.8495]

> @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> Well, they did do that once; it didn't turn out to be very popular, and was subsequently removed.

> I suppose it would depend on the skill, though then, if it's really useful/universal, then everyone will carry it.

> If more of that type were introduced, soon everyone would be using the same skills, I guess. Might make balancing easier, but gameplay more boring? I don't know.

 

> @"Airdive.2613" said:

> I still feel it would be great to have more (meaningful) bundles and transformations in the game; these give you a set of somewhat universal new skills, and the tech is already in the game.

> It seems the majority of players wasn't happy about bundles and transformations, though, seeing as ANet keeps weakening and removing them.

 

I'm not talking about putting on the armors in maguma or picking up bundles.

I mean a skill on your bar that can be mixed with the rest, or a full trait line. Very similar to the previous game, nothing like we have now, at all.

Those were actually very popular. Because earning them and learning them were also a task and they could compliment build types better.

I used to use norn skills as a runner to the forge and beyond. or 3 diffrent skills when i was leading my team of necro/rit heroes through HM content

 

the traited skill for pve only were strengthened with rank instead of points though.

 

But, if it is unpopular...oh well. They can work on more important stuff

 

 

 

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

> @"Gundam Style.8495" said:

> > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > Well, they did do that once; it didn't turn out to be very popular, and was subsequently removed.

> > I suppose it would depend on the skill, though then, if it's really useful/universal, then everyone will carry it.

> > If more of that type were introduced, soon everyone would be using the same skills, I guess. Might make balancing easier, but gameplay more boring? I don't know.

>

> > @"Airdive.2613" said:

> > I still feel it would be great to have more (meaningful) bundles and transformations in the game; these give you a set of somewhat universal new skills, and the tech is already in the game.

> > It seems the majority of players wasn't happy about bundles and transformations, though, seeing as ANet keeps weakening and removing them.

>

> I'm not talking about putting on the armors in maguma or picking up bundles.

> I mean a skill on your bar that can be mixed with the rest, or a full trait line. Very similar to the previous game, nothing like we have now, at all.

> Those were actually very popular. Because earning them and learning them were also a task and they could compliment build types better.

> I used to use norn skills as a runner to the forge and beyond. or 3 diffrent skills when i was leading my team of necro/rit heroes through HM content

>

> the traited skill for pve only were strengthened with rank instead of points though.

>

> But, if it is unpopular...oh well. They can work on more important stuff

>

>

>

 

I wasn't referring to bundles, or whatever armor thing you mentioned. Perhaps, you've not been here since launch? Not familiar with the skills introduced, then removed (as no one much used them)? It was during (the now-referred-to) Season One (and then removed a year or two later).

 

Here you go: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Antitoxin_Spray (Universal and in-game from 2013 to 2015)

A bit more on this skill: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/tower-of-nightmares-guide/

[Gundam Style.8495]

> @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > @"Gundam Style.8495" said:

> > > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > > Well, they did do that once; it didn't turn out to be very popular, and was subsequently removed.

> > > I suppose it would depend on the skill, though then, if it's really useful/universal, then everyone will carry it.

> > > If more of that type were introduced, soon everyone would be using the same skills, I guess. Might make balancing easier, but gameplay more boring? I don't know.

> >

> > > @"Airdive.2613" said:

> > > I still feel it would be great to have more (meaningful) bundles and transformations in the game; these give you a set of somewhat universal new skills, and the tech is already in the game.

> > > It seems the majority of players wasn't happy about bundles and transformations, though, seeing as ANet keeps weakening and removing them.

> >

> > I'm not talking about putting on the armors in maguma or picking up bundles.

> > I mean a skill on your bar that can be mixed with the rest, or a full trait line. Very similar to the previous game, nothing like we have now, at all.

> > Those were actually very popular. Because earning them and learning them were also a task and they could compliment build types better.

> > I used to use norn skills as a runner to the forge and beyond. or 3 diffrent skills when i was leading my team of necro/rit heroes through HM content

> >

> > the traited skill for pve only were strengthened with rank instead of points though.

> >

> > But, if it is unpopular...oh well. They can work on more important stuff

> >

> >

> >

>

> I wasn't referring to bundles, or whatever armor thing you mentioned. Perhaps, you've not been here since launch? Not familiar with the skills introduced, then removed (as no one much used them)? It was during (the now-referred-to) Season One (and then removed a year or two later).

>

> Here you go: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Antitoxin_Spray (Universal and in-game from 2013 to 2015)

 

Ah, i see. I saw that one. Well, i guess it is a dumb idea haha. Have a good night.

[Klipso.8653]

I didn't even realize that the healing skill I unlocked but never used was stolen from me.

 

Now I can be angry about it.

[MoriMoriMori.5349]

1. Adds even more chaos to current questionable balance

2. Makes it even harder to balance, from now on

3. Will be either useless, with nobody using it, or too useful with most of players using it - that combined with the fact for any professions you already have much more useful skills you can ever carry on your utility panel than slots on this panel

 

In the end it will change little, while contributing to balancing chaos.

[Gundam Style.8495]

> @"MoriMoriMori.5349" said:

> 1. Adds even more chaos to current questionable balance

> 2. Makes it even harder to balance, from now on

> 3. Will be either useless, with nobody using it, or too useful with most of players using it - that combined with the fact for any professions you already have much more useful skills you can ever carry on your utility panel than slots on this panel

>

> In the end it will change little, while contributing to balancing chaos.

 

so, can i assume your are against new elite specializations?

 

maybe implementation was bad, because universal skill and pve skills in the last game were used, and not everyone had the same build except that norn skill series before the nerf

[MoriMoriMori.5349]

> @"Gundam Style.8495" said:

> so, can i assume your are against new elite specializations?

With passion. I honestly believe there are **tons** of work to be done on current atrocious power-creep issues and core professions made effectively obsolete due to this (mostly played only until you reach lv 80, or for fun) before anything new should even be considered. And even if they'll will fix all this (keep dreaming), I still would be against it, as it would most surely break balance again, and make it even less manageable in the future. After all, we have currently tons of possible stiles of play. Instead of adding even more crappy and not-that-different ones, they should work on the existing set, improving them and making **all of them** (including core professions and all weapons for each professions/e-spec) **equally viable**.

 

**tl;dr**

If they will make core professions equal to current e-specs in terms of effectivness, and all weapons useful in some or another setup, you would get those new ways to play without adding more unbalanced crap to game.

 

 

[Linken.6345]

> @"MoriMoriMori.5349" said:

> > @"Gundam Style.8495" said:

> > so, can i assume your are against new elite specializations?

> With passion. I honestly believe there are **tons** of work to be done on current atrocious power-creep issues and core professions made effectively obsolete due to this (mostly played only until you reach lv 80, or for fun) before anything new should even be considered. And even if they'll will fix all this (keep dreaming), I still would be against it, as it would most surely break balance again, and make it even less manageable in the future. After all, we have currently tons of possible stiles of play. Instead of adding even more crappy and not-that-different ones, they should work on the existing set, improving them and making **all of them** (including core professions and all weapons for each professions/e-spec) **equally viable**.

>

> **tl;dr**

> If they will make core professions equal to current e-specs in terms of effectivness, and all weapons useful in some or another setup, you would get those new ways to play without adding more unbalanced kitten to game.

>

>

Never going to happen unless they trim it down to 3 trait lines and 2 weapon combos then cut the core classes by -8.

 

[kharmin.7683]

It's easier and more exciting to release more specializations with expansions -- it's what helps them sell.

[MoriMoriMori.5349]

> @"Linken.6345" said:

> Never going to happen unless they trim it down to 3 trait lines and 2 weapon combos then cut the core classes by -8.

Never going to happen what? I was merely saying that instead of increasing number of variables in this equation making it even more hard to balance, they instead should stick to complexity they already have, and work to make it better. Yes, it's pretty much an endless process, but this is work which must be done (buffs/nerfs/reworks), on regular basis, until the project lives. Adding even more crappy, unbalanced especs doesn't solve anything, yet makes the whole situation worse by a great margin. You need to add some fresh way to play - rework core professions in such way that their DPS and sustain would become on par with especs, their neglected skills/builds would become interesting gameplay-wise (core engineer's kits, anyone?) and add some more eye-candy animations to them - and people will start playing them, as if they were new. Problem solved.

 

50-90% of utility skills coming with core professions are never used these days when players reach 80lv. That's totally insane, huge waste of game mechanics material somebody spent countless hours to develop.

 

[MoriMoriMori.5349]

> @"kharmin.7683" said:

> It's easier and more exciting to release more specializations with expansions -- it's what helps them sell.

 

At that point, people will buy any DLC which comes with a great deal of new content. Would somebody resufe to buy PoF if there wouldn't be new line of e-specs, but still would be mounts? I very much doubt they would :) You put a meaningful content in there - and people will throw money at you, that's all. A bunch of new maps of the same quality as the ones in PoF / HoT, plus some new legendaries which only can be built with resources from those maps, some new features for guilds, build templates (I want to believe..), some new cultural armors and weapons - and they've pretty much sold it already.

[Klowdy.3126]

This idea sounds too much like ESOs system, which is very boring. All classes use the same skills, save three or four skills. It has gotten a bit better, but there isn't a whole lot that differentiates each class, other than DPS output. It's all weapon skills, guild skills, and PvP skills, with a couple class skills, mostly utility.

[Gundam Style.8495]

> @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> This idea sounds too much like ESOs system, which is very boring. All classes use the same skills, save three or four skills. It has gotten a bit better, but there isn't a whole lot that differentiates each class, other than DPS output. It's all weapon skills, guild skills, and PvP skills, with a couple class skills, mostly utility.

 

I know about ESO. But I was more thinking the way GW1 did it, like in the links to the official wiki I posted.

[Klowdy.3126]

> @"Gundam Style.8495" said:

> > @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> > This idea sounds too much like ESOs system, which is very boring. All classes use the same skills, save three or four skills. It has gotten a bit better, but there isn't a whole lot that differentiates each class, other than DPS output. It's all weapon skills, guild skills, and PvP skills, with a couple class skills, mostly utility.

>

> I know about ESO. But I was more thinking the way GW1 did it, like in the links to the official wiki I posted.

 

Yes, what I'm saying is, if these skills are worth it, they will be mandatory, like weapon skills that are on everyone's bars, or completely ignored, like most of the PvP skills, or the world skills. It doesn't matter the implementation, they will be a nightmare to balance in terms of all classes in the game, not just for a single class, and they will either be overly useful, or completely ignored. There is no way to make skills that encompass everyone in the game on a 1:1 ratio.

[zityz.6089]

Just bring back Elite Skill capping from GW1.

 

The elite skill can only be capped from world bosses, and major bosses found in metas.

[Mathias.9657]

Need ursan runs.

@"zityz.6089"

they tried that once already with traits and it was absolute garbage , skill capping just doesn't work in GW2. Fully persistent means the map you're in stuff just respawns and events have to be on timers on top of needing correct amount of players. That is a bad combo with acquiring skills like we did in GW1, where the boss is always there and once you clear the map it's cleared for good until you exit.

[Cyninja.2954]

> @"Gundam Style.8495" said:

> > @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> > This idea sounds too much like ESOs system, which is very boring. All classes use the same skills, save three or four skills. It has gotten a bit better, but there isn't a whole lot that differentiates each class, other than DPS output. It's all weapon skills, guild skills, and PvP skills, with a couple class skills, mostly utility.

>

> I know about ESO. But I was more thinking the way GW1 did it, like in the links to the official wiki I posted.

 

GW1 had the same issue ESO has.

 

Ursan Blessing for example was way overpowered leading to Ursanway farms which made classes irrelevant. Eventually Ursan was nerfed, removing it from the meta.

 

It basically boils down to: if the skills are to good, they become mandatory. If they aren't good enough, they become useless flavor. See Unbound Magic skills in GW2 (https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gliding#List_of_gliding_skills). The idea is nice, but the implementation is near impossible. The best and most realistic approach is having 1-2 skills temporarily available to easy content. We already have that in the form of special action skills for certain content and even that poses issues for some players.

[Etria.3642]

I love the unbound magic skills. Wish we had those in every map.

 

Then again I also wish we could use the turrets in every map as well.

[kharmin.7683]

> @"zityz.6089" said:

> Just bring back Elite Skill capping from GW1.

>

> The elite skill can only be capped from world bosses, and major bosses found in metas.

 

Used to have to buy skills from vendors in GW2. Glad they did away with that. As for capping elites from bosses, what would that accomplish?