Templates Preview Guild Chat -- We want your questions!

[DietPepsi.4371]

It said in the blog post that the build templates will be key-bound on release. Does that mean it will override my custom key-binds?

I'd rather not have to go back and redo my key-binds.

 

Everything else sounds good though.

[Neutra.6857]

> @"Aaralyna.3104" said:

> > @"Dzjudz.9142" said:

> > > @"Aaralyna.3104" said:

> > > I feel that Anet is very generous to give us a free slot so we can have 1 setup for every game mode in game (which will make more players step into all modes since it saves the equipment in the template and not in your inventory bag, this is a big big plus). Having more than that is just a QoL thing that in my eyes they are entitled to ask money for and its not even p2w. Its a 1 on 1 on inventory bag slots for gems.

> > >

> >

> > I don't know, I don't think it's cool to start monetizing the use of legendary gear for the purpose for which it was made.

>

> Enlighten me to how this affects Legendary gear? Atm you have 1 build template and 1 equipment template. You can change the stats whenever you want, attributes whenever you want. In the new version this did not change as far as I read. You just get 1 equipment template extra and some build templates extra and storages (the storage is basically a bank where you can store some build templates you created in build templates and which you can see account wide instead of on 1 character only). A person with lets say exotic or ascended gear would still have to get new equipment slotted in to change stats (and accompanying build) or purchase an extra equipment slot and build slot). Or make use of the free extra equipment slot and build template and ignore some mode they don't play equipment/build slot wise (like they do currently already).

 

Most people with legendary armor use arc dps templates, which let you switch between an infinite variety of stats and upgrades. Since Arc templates are going the way of the dodo, that means those it legendary gear are limited where before they where not.

[Sublimatio.6981]

are the extra build/equipment slots you buy from gemstore unlocked on every character? (not the build storage)

 

would feel kinda scammy if i had to buy bonus slots for every character i play. people already have it all for free from arc templates

[Sharen Graves.1276]

> @"Setz.9675" said:

> > @"Sharen Graves.1276" said:

> > Ok sure....why monotize the #1 requested feature since launch that was free in GW1?

>

> because $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

I know this. Maybe they shouldnt have spent so much $$$$ on those side projects that made NCSoft step in... j/s. I would be fine with charging for the gear templates because it acts as a storage bag. But the having to pay for the build templates is just plan greedy. but at the end of the day what do I care. With the balance being what it is... only 1 or 2 viable builds anyway.

[morrolan.9608]

2 Equipment templates is not enough for characters running in multiple modes and running multiple specs. Would you consider increasing the number of free equipment templates? In my opinion it should be at least 4

[TGDM.5908]

**How will legendary gear work within these limitations? **

 

I saw a post by Anet's PaulS on the subreddit that equipment chat codes will not be available meaning there's no backup option for those who crafted legendary weapons/armor/trinkets/backs/runes/sigils for variety stat swapping. The character I invested so much into to obtain all of those legendary items feel fantastic with the current solution offered by ArcDPS with the ability to swap between as many builds as I create, but with what we know about this upcoming official feature it feels like I would be better off just stacking ascended gear for easier swapping once I pass the template limit. It also feels like it's not worth investing that much into a character as opposed to having 10 of the same class.

 

Will there be a way to get more than the shown 6 equipment templates to accommodate players who optimize their characters across different game modes and group compositions? I feel like 6 isn't enough just to cover the variations I go through for condi builds with rune/infusion/stat combinations .

[Obtena.7952]

> @"Crystal.8051" said:

> Do something for the people that have spent money, that have multitudes of characters, gear, etc. Your players that have played 5-6-7 YEARS. While im not personally bothered by the 'pay your way after 2', you will only cop extreme flak from your veteran players for this. Do something like adding it to the achieve total rewards and if your so high you unlock so many automatically. Or based on years of gameplay. Im sure theres someway you could make this better for the veterans and you wont hear so much whinging...

 

That doesn't make sense ... if anything, this caters to veteran players. These are the people more likely to have multiple builds for different content. Let vets give flak ... anyone that cries that they ONLY got two free template slots is not being reasonable in the first place. Anytime you make someone pay for something they were getting for free, you will here complaining ... it's got nothing to do with 'doing something' for them.

[draxynnic.3719]

Like a lot of people, I can't help but feel disappointed at build templates being monetised and ask why?

 

Equipment templates I can definitely understand. They're effectively extra storage space, which means more storage space on the data servers, which means increased costs, albeit with a convenience factor over simply getting another bag, bank, or character slot. That's the sort of thing that I can easily support monetisation for.

 

Build templates, though: I don't see why this can't just be something stored clientside, like Guild Wars 1 allowed. By the sound of it, in fact, that's probably exactly what's going to end up happening, except that people will do so through copy/pasting from an external text file rather than through the game. So the main distinction is likely to be swapping in situations where seconds might matter, such as changing a build at the start of a sPvP match.

 

> @"Xynxycs.6718" said:

> This is one of the reasons people don't feel hype about living world over expansions. Expansions are a fair trade of mass content. Living world and live services produce arbitrary money making limitation money traps like these. It stretches the goodwill the community has.

 

Pretty much. Can't help but feel that if this had been part of an expansion, build templates would be stored clientside and we wouldn't ~~have to~~ _be expected to_ pay for additional slots.

[Kanok.3027]

> @"c space cowboy.2764" said:

> Let's monetize something that **very few people use** and is already free...

FTFY.

 

When my guild was super active, we had about 250+ members and only a tiny fraction of that even knew what build templates were. Don't try to make it sound like every single person in the game uses them, because they don't or even know about them.

[Obtena.7952]

> @"Kanok.3027" said:

> > @"c space cowboy.2764" said:

> > Let's monetize something that **very few people use** and is already free...

> FTFY.

>

> When my guild was super active, we had about 250+ members and only a tiny fraction of that even knew what build templates were. Don't try to make it sound like every single person in the game uses them, because they don't or even know about them.

 

Why do you think they didn't know? Probably because it wasn't an INGAME feature.

 

Here is what I think ... some people that want templates don't want to run 3rd party software to get them. Very few people use? *IF* that's true, not knowing about it isn't the only reason for that. I've rolled 3 or 4 of the same class JUST to avoid using Arc templates. There is DEFINITELY a group of users that want templates and not through Arc either.

 

[JasonLucas.4981]

Will we have in the future a account-wide equipment storage? Maybe only for legendaries since they are supposed to be the top tier of endgame gear, but every time I swap to an alt I have to move all my legendary around using my bank to the other character.

[Neutra.6857]

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"Kanok.3027" said:

> > > @"c space cowboy.2764" said:

> > > Let's monetize something that **very few people use** and is already free...

> > FTFY.

> >

> > When my guild was super active, we had about 250+ members and only a tiny fraction of that even knew what build templates were. Don't try to make it sound like every single person in the game uses them, because they don't or even know about them.

>

> Why do you think they didn't know? Probably because it wasn't an INGAME feature.

>

> Here is what I think ... some people that want templates don't want to run 3rd party software to get them. Very few people use? *IF* that's true, not knowing about it isn't the only reason for that. I've rolled 3 or 4 of the same class JUST to avoid using Arc templates. There is DEFINITELY a group of users that want templates and not through Arc either.

>

 

Indeed, so why didn't they port over the functionality of arc? There are ways they can even monetize it.

[Obtena.7952]

> @"Neutra.6857" said:

> > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > @"Kanok.3027" said:

> > > > @"c space cowboy.2764" said:

> > > > Let's monetize something that **very few people use** and is already free...

> > > FTFY.

> > >

> > > When my guild was super active, we had about 250+ members and only a tiny fraction of that even knew what build templates were. Don't try to make it sound like every single person in the game uses them, because they don't or even know about them.

> >

> > Why do you think they didn't know? Probably because it wasn't an INGAME feature.

> >

> > Here is what I think ... some people that want templates don't want to run 3rd party software to get them. Very few people use? *IF* that's true, not knowing about it isn't the only reason for that. I've rolled 3 or 4 of the same class JUST to avoid using Arc templates. There is DEFINITELY a group of users that want templates and not through Arc either.

> >

>

> Indeed, so why didn't they port over the functionality of arc? There are ways they can even monetize it.

 

I wouldn't know. Probably lots of reasons. I mean, arc is someone's software who isn't Anet ... seems to me there is some relevant legal thing behind that.

[Kanok.3027]

Do you two know how many people would still not care about build templates? There were plenty of people that I offered to help with that and their response to me: "No thanks. I don't really care too much about that."

 

This game is more about the casual player than the more hardcore players and the casual players really don't give a single flying pig about build templates. It means they won't really care much about using the templates and even if they did, they'd probably only use the ones freely available or buy what they need if need be. Also, simply saying "port over the functionality" is not as black and white as you may think. The way arcdps works is vastly different from how their game engine works, thus you can't simply "port it over". Different programming methods and ideologies. This new system is also more robust and won't break every time a new build comes in, something which affected arcdps.

 

At the end of the day, this is an **optional** feature. You are not forced to buy, you are not forced to use it, you are not being held at gunpoint. If you don't want to support it, then you're going to have to go back to the archaic ways of stuffing your inventory with gear and manually switching, but hey, at least you don't have to pay!

[Neutra.6857]

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"Neutra.6857" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > @"Kanok.3027" said:

> > > > > @"c space cowboy.2764" said:

> > > > > Let's monetize something that **very few people use** and is already free...

> > > > FTFY.

> > > >

> > > > When my guild was super active, we had about 250+ members and only a tiny fraction of that even knew what build templates were. Don't try to make it sound like every single person in the game uses them, because they don't or even know about them.

> > >

> > > Why do you think they didn't know? Probably because it wasn't an INGAME feature.

> > >

> > > Here is what I think ... some people that want templates don't want to run 3rd party software to get them. Very few people use? *IF* that's true, not knowing about it isn't the only reason for that. I've rolled 3 or 4 of the same class JUST to avoid using Arc templates. There is DEFINITELY a group of users that want templates and not through Arc either.

> > >

> >

> > Indeed, so why didn't they port over the functionality of arc? There are ways they can even monetize it.

>

> I wouldn't know. Probably lots of reasons. I mean, arc is someone's software who isn't Anet ... seems to me there is some relevant legal thing behind that.

 

So they make a program with the same functionality. Considering a 3rd party can do so, why didn't Anet. They are making the QOL for the people who actually spent te time and gold to get legendary worse.

[blambidy.3216]

> @"Aaralyna.3104" said:

> I have no question nor do I wanna be all pink glasses supporting Anet but I still feel I have to say this to the community. And I do feel some folks would rather downvote what I am going to say.

>

> We are given:

>

> - 3 Build Template tabs for each character (1 build for pve, 1 for pvp and 1 for wvw)

> - 3 Build Storage Spaces for free (in gemstore for a limited time). (Again 1 for pve, 1 for pvp and 1 for wvw)

> - 2 Equipment Template tabs per character. (1 for pve and 1 for wvw)

>

> Pvp has another equipment system (it basically has no gear to save, only stats and attributes, runes and sigils)

>

> If you do not play a certain mode, you can use those tabs/spaces solely for a mode you do play). As a player you have the freedom in that.

>

> When we started the game we were all aware that 3rd party addons were never supported (even against game rules). Some grey area ones were given a temporary greenlight by Anet which they could have red lighted from the start. They also made the agreement to greenlight Arc build templates (for the community) with the comment that when they do manage to insert build templates themselves Arc will be red lighted. This is also confirmed by the developer of Arc build templates (ahead of today's post). Players that played the game as supposed without addons always only had 1 build template tab, no storage space and 1 equipment template per character.

>

> Some players also refer to gw1 that has this feature for free.... Guild wars 2 is another game and is simply not Guild Wars and times change, market changes as well.

>

> I feel that Anet is very generous to give us a free slot so we can have 1 setup for every game mode in game (which will make more players step into all modes since it saves the equipment in the template and not in your inventory bag, this is a big big plus). Having more than that is just a QoL thing that in my eyes they are entitled to ask money for and its not even p2w. Its a 1 on 1 on inventory bag slots for gems.

>

> The devs put a significant amount of time and resources to make this long requested feature and it seems to be created just as we (players without addons) had hoped for. Give them some credit for their work...

>

 

 

We do give arenanet credit when they derserve however this game is b2p. Games first of all shouldn’t even have a gemstore in the first place since games were first created as, buy this game you get all the features. Arenanet shoots themselves in the foot by saying “we’re doing this for free” which is great. But players would’ve been more happy if an expansion was released instead and the price would be included for build templates. But instead since arenanets “because it’s free” excuse has been said, they choose to charge for more build slots when gw1 templates was free.

 

Sure things cost more for time. However since it was an old feature, and they

Have it in their database, a quick open up file and polish would’ve been easy work. However it took 7 years to release and again it’s a bad decision for the veterans. once again the veterans are getting more of a hit then new players. New players think 3 builds for 1 class is enough, but it’s not when you play this game in multiple game modes.

 

To charge for equipment storage is ok I guess. But to charge for build template tabs added per toon is just greed. Specially since it is content they already had since gw1.

[Donari.5237]

> @"Blood Red Arachnid.2493" said:

> I don't like that it consumes the gear when it makes the template. See, what I have is a series of invisible boxes on each of my toons, holding the different gear for the different builds. In these boxes, there is a lot of universal equipment. That is, I have gear that is swapped between characters, as well as gear that is not part of the build, but that I will occasionally swap to as needed.

>

> For example, on my Rev I have the power set (berserkers), the buff set (diviners), the condi set (vipers), and on another toon I have the harrier set that I can send over. Now, for fractals I don't need to wear the full buff set. I can swap out pieces in order to make a higher damaging hybrid set that accomplishes the same thing. The way it works now is this: I just right-click on the piece I want to swap, and then swap it out. How it would work with templates is I would have to destroy the template to get all of the gear back, move all of that gear into the sitting vacant invisible box, re-equip myself for that particular scenario, and then after it was done I would have to re-build the template again. That is more trouble than it is worth.

 

I can't be sure, since templates aren't released and we haven't seen tomorrow's live stream demo yet, but I think this bit answers that and strongly suggests your gear is not consumed and can be swapped back to inventory when you wish.

> You can copy and paste an Equipment Template from one tab to another, rename it, or empty it of all items (including attributes and upgrades). The latter will return any items not used in other templates to your normal inventory.

If you can empty it of all items, you can probably swap just some in and out as well. I think this will be more like extra equipment panels you can tab between and interact with your inventory just like how it works right now. You don't destroy the template, you update it with the new gear, then when you swap back to your bags *just like you are doing right now* it returns to the previous setting.

 

> @"Vegeta.2563" said:

> Also I'm confused on how equipment templates will work with Legendary Gear since it uses it for 1 tab.. so can you still access it for another tab or do you need another full set?

 

They wrote

> You can equip a single legendary item to multiple Equipment Templates with different attributes and upgrade choices for each.

 

 

[Sister Saxifrage.7361]

I'm hoping gear slots will cost less than bag slots, because they have less functionality than a bag slot.

 

Also, if you intend to make templates hotkey-able, why 3 build slots but only 2 gear slots?

[EagleDelta.4726]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > @"Bloodstealer.5978" said:

> > > @"maultasche.4082" said:

> > > So we crafted legendary armor to be restricted to 2 stat combinations now? Raiders had perfect build templates for the past years thanks to arcdps. Now we get a downgrade provided from Anet. I don't see the advantage of this.

> >

> > Then don't purchase them carry on using Arc templates

> There won't be Arc templates. They will be shut down as soon as ingame templates appear - that was the deal between delta and GW2 devs.

>

> > @"shadow.6174" said:

> > For those complaining about additional ones being charged or too few slots... that's why we hardly get nice stuff, whenever something is made, there are always some whining :tongue: Impossible to please everyone.

> Nah, the reason why we nardly get nice stuff is that, like in this case, whenever Anet decides to do something nice, they always add something to make us sorry we ever asked for it.

 

Because you want everything for free and continually ignore what it costs to actually make this stuff. Comparing it to GW1 doesn't make sense as most of that game's development was over 12 years ago...... I've been in tech for 10 years and things have changed ALOT in 10 years. For one, pay for everyone has gone up and devs have gone up in cost. A single team of 10ish devs can cost anywhere between $1/2 million to more than $1 million a year depending on skill level, especially once you factor in the benefits for those employees. And this is one team of just developers, I'm not counting the managers, designers, writers, artists, etc. Then factor in datacenter costs, costs for engineers to manage those datacenters (separate from the devs), support personnel (which tends to have more people in the company than the dev teams), etc.

 

Compare to GW1 all you want, but the ongoing development of that game was short-lived when compared to GW2. With GW1 I had 3 $50 purchases to make and 1 $40 purchase to make for everything. With GW2, I've paid $60, $50, and $30 to get the base content and expansions. I've paid nothing for LW content. So already they make less on the physical copies of GW2 than GW1, especially when you factor in the fact that costs to make this stuff increased, not decreased, over time.

[C Cspace Cowboy.5903]

> @"EagleDelta.4726" said:

> > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > > @"Bloodstealer.5978" said:

> > > > @"maultasche.4082" said:

> > > > So we crafted legendary armor to be restricted to 2 stat combinations now? Raiders had perfect build templates for the past years thanks to arcdps. Now we get a downgrade provided from Anet. I don't see the advantage of this.

> > >

> > > Then don't purchase them carry on using Arc templates

> > There won't be Arc templates. They will be shut down as soon as ingame templates appear - that was the deal between delta and GW2 devs.

> >

> > > @"shadow.6174" said:

> > > For those complaining about additional ones being charged or too few slots... that's why we hardly get nice stuff, whenever something is made, there are always some whining :tongue: Impossible to please everyone.

> > Nah, the reason why we nardly get nice stuff is that, like in this case, whenever Anet decides to do something nice, they always add something to make us sorry we ever asked for it.

>

> Because you want everything for free and continually ignore what it costs to actually make this stuff.

 

Every content update PvE has gotten since PoF has been free. Everything.

 

WvW hasn't had a content update in years. Most of the players use build templates. Monetized, and ban the free version.

 

Yea...

 

 

[Asum.4960]

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > @"Wakani.1829" said:

> > The feature itself looks solid, but the implementation through monetization, is EA, Activision-Blizzard, Bioware and Bethesda like in the level of scummyness.

>

> Not if you want to get more free content in the future. There won't be an expansion anytime soon, so they need to make money.

 

I take free build templates over free (or any) Living World any day of the week.

[fewfield.7802]

> @"GloomxWar.8793" said:

> Why do you force players to pay for something that they already got for free with a third party program?

> I think making players pay for this is one of the worst things Anet could do.

 

No it's not. I personally dont want to play but I think this way is fine for all of us and good for them to get money.

It's better than paying for cosmetics and rng chest anyway. And even you need money, dont you think the studio also needs some as well ?

[Tekoneiric.6817]

Please make keybinds per character and store them with the build templates.

[Shena Fu.5792]

what a waste of time and effort.

so 90% of players don't care ; but for the 10%, it won't satisfy their needs at all.

[EagleDelta.4726]

> @"C Cspace Cowboy.5903" said:

> > @"EagleDelta.4726" said:

> > > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > > > @"Bloodstealer.5978" said:

> > > > > @"maultasche.4082" said:

> > > > > So we crafted legendary armor to be restricted to 2 stat combinations now? Raiders had perfect build templates for the past years thanks to arcdps. Now we get a downgrade provided from Anet. I don't see the advantage of this.

> > > >

> > > > Then don't purchase them carry on using Arc templates

> > > There won't be Arc templates. They will be shut down as soon as ingame templates appear - that was the deal between delta and GW2 devs.

> > >

> > > > @"shadow.6174" said:

> > > > For those complaining about additional ones being charged or too few slots... that's why we hardly get nice stuff, whenever something is made, there are always some whining :tongue: Impossible to please everyone.

> > > Nah, the reason why we nardly get nice stuff is that, like in this case, whenever Anet decides to do something nice, they always add something to make us sorry we ever asked for it.

> >

> > Because you want everything for free and continually ignore what it costs to actually make this stuff.

>

> Every content update PvE has gotten since PoF has been free. Everything.

>

> WvW hasn't had a content update in years. Most of the players use build templates. Monetized, and ban the free version.

>

> Yea...

>

>

 

You completely ignored the points I made in there, nice.

 

1. We knew when Arc templates came out that if ANet ever decided to make their own templating system, that ArcTemplates would end.

2. ANet has to make money.... they don't make money, they can't pay bills or employees, and both GW1 and GW2 die completely.

3. You can't make money on the same things all the time. Any business that has tried to make money simply on the same exact product forever has failed. There's a reason Windows has changed so much over the years, why Google sells phones and chromebooks now, and why the Gem Store cycles through their skins/mounts/gliders and add things like this to it. People won't buy the same things forever. Without diversification, there is no cash flow, without cash flow there is no business.