Dantheman.3589 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > Jumping mid Pistol Whip cast will still pop out the stun, but it also consumes ini and doesn't give you the evade afterward. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dunno why anyone would ever use it that way. > > > > > > > > > > > > Same as the staff bug. The difference this is a dps build while staff was more or less a bunker. You can use this anytime you know they will dodge for a free pulm. Ofc it’s usable and it’s an exploitable bug > > > > > > > > > > Jump casting staff 3 had it do everything the skill tooltip said it was, evade included. Trying to use pistol whip this way ONLY gives you the stun and 300-400 damage attached to it. It does nothing else if you jump. It's objectively worse than just letting the skill cast w/out jump. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That’s where your wrong. > > > > 1.) No where on the tooltip does pistol whip say there is ever an evade > > > > 2.) It is exactly the same- it starts the animation. The difference is the animation it’s self, staff 3 is an evade at very start of the animation where as pistol whip is not. > > > > Jumping at the start of pistol whip does everything the tooltip says except for the multiple hit boxes. Doing a free stun and canceling the rest of the animation is totally exploitable even when it cost initiative which is already a really low amount imo. > > > > > > > > > > Holy kitten you mean anet still hasn't fixed Pistol Whip's tooltip? Good god. > > > > > > I'm still not sure where you're pulling this 'free' part from. It still costs 5 ini just like if you'd used the rest of the cast. Anet can def fix it but it's not going to change anything. > > If every skill allowed you to just jump during it to prevent you from making a bad play than every build would be broken. But at the moment the build that stops you from using an unnecessary pistol whip that roots you for 1.25 secs is this one. You can do this at zero risk and it’ll still use pulmonary impact if it interrupted which is unblockable 1.5-2.5k damage. It should be fixed tbh even if it’s not as annoying or useful as the staff 3 bug > > > > Clarification - not here to argue about whether or not it should be 'fixed'. Just pointing out that your perception of how good using Pistol Whip that way is totally wrong. > > You admitted you barely seeing anyone do it - why do you think that is? I haven't seen any other player give it a go, either. Except myself because I wanted to give it a try, but I stopped and never went back. Because using the skill that way sucks. > I am not wrong even Sindrener points out that part of outplaying opponents is timing your pistol whips, repositioning them and stowing/canceling them. This is one of the tools in your arsenal for outplaying opponents and if you don’t ever use it you are missing out. The fact you claimed it’s useless doesn’t mean much, I don’t see it much because I’m not stupid enough to sit in range of pistol whip. Also when you claimed it was useless you also got 75% of the facts wrong so who’s perception here is really wrong???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 This thread is kinda a perfect example of dumbing the game down even further, Not just the devs that are at fault. On one hand players complain about the games dumbed down state and than any time a player can due a extra step like jumping at the right time to cancel a skill, stow at proper times to only do a portion of a skill or things like the ranger great sword evade chain players want it nerfed or dumbed down so there's little more involved other than pressing a button on each skill. No surprise this game gets spammier and spammier lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curennos.9307 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > Jumping mid Pistol Whip cast will still pop out the stun, but it also consumes ini and doesn't give you the evade afterward. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dunno why anyone would ever use it that way. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Same as the staff bug. The difference this is a dps build while staff was more or less a bunker. You can use this anytime you know they will dodge for a free pulm. Ofc it’s usable and it’s an exploitable bug > > > > > > > > > > > > Jump casting staff 3 had it do everything the skill tooltip said it was, evade included. Trying to use pistol whip this way ONLY gives you the stun and 300-400 damage attached to it. It does nothing else if you jump. It's objectively worse than just letting the skill cast w/out jump. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That’s where your wrong. > > > > > 1.) No where on the tooltip does pistol whip say there is ever an evade > > > > > 2.) It is exactly the same- it starts the animation. The difference is the animation it’s self, staff 3 is an evade at very start of the animation where as pistol whip is not. > > > > > Jumping at the start of pistol whip does everything the tooltip says except for the multiple hit boxes. Doing a free stun and canceling the rest of the animation is totally exploitable even when it cost initiative which is already a really low amount imo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Holy kitten you mean anet still hasn't fixed Pistol Whip's tooltip? Good god. > > > > > > > > I'm still not sure where you're pulling this 'free' part from. It still costs 5 ini just like if you'd used the rest of the cast. Anet can def fix it but it's not going to change anything. > > > If every skill allowed you to just jump during it to prevent you from making a bad play than every build would be broken. But at the moment the build that stops you from using an unnecessary pistol whip that roots you for 1.25 secs is this one. You can do this at zero risk and it’ll still use pulmonary impact if it interrupted which is unblockable 1.5-2.5k damage. It should be fixed tbh even if it’s not as annoying or useful as the staff 3 bug > > > > > > > Clarification - not here to argue about whether or not it should be 'fixed'. Just pointing out that your perception of how good using Pistol Whip that way is totally wrong. > > > > You admitted you barely seeing anyone do it - why do you think that is? I haven't seen any other player give it a go, either. Except myself because I wanted to give it a try, but I stopped and never went back. Because using the skill that way sucks. > > > > I am not wrong even Sindrener points out that part of outplaying opponents is timing your pistol whips, repositioning them and stowing/canceling them. This is one of the tools in your arsenal for outplaying opponents and if you don’t ever use it you are missing out. The fact you claimed it’s useless doesn’t mean much, I don’t see it much because I’m not stupid enough to sit in range of pistol whip. Also when you claimed it was useless you also got 75% of the facts wrong so who’s perception here is really wrong???? IIRC, Sind means stowing/canceling before you complete the skill cast or after the evade starts so people have a harder time punishing the vulnerability frames. Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy tho, but that's another story. :) Also, don't misrepresent what I said. I said it sucks. I said it's objectively worse to jump-cast it than it is to complete the cast and get the evade + damage. I literally tested it right before I replied - twice, the second time with the guard NPC to see if it still gave the evade. Also, about that standard of my supposed claims of it being useless vs yours that it's toxic and exploitable :O Huh. Interesting, uh, way of thinking you have there. Edit: Cntrl+F indicates there is no use of 'useless' in my posts anywhere. It's all in yours and some other poster's reply a little less than halfway up. Do ask if you want clarification on something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > Jumping mid Pistol Whip cast will still pop out the stun, but it also consumes ini and doesn't give you the evade afterward. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dunno why anyone would ever use it that way. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Same as the staff bug. The difference this is a dps build while staff was more or less a bunker. You can use this anytime you know they will dodge for a free pulm. Ofc it’s usable and it’s an exploitable bug > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jump casting staff 3 had it do everything the skill tooltip said it was, evade included. Trying to use pistol whip this way ONLY gives you the stun and 300-400 damage attached to it. It does nothing else if you jump. It's objectively worse than just letting the skill cast w/out jump. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That’s where your wrong. > > > > > > 1.) No where on the tooltip does pistol whip say there is ever an evade > > > > > > 2.) It is exactly the same- it starts the animation. The difference is the animation it’s self, staff 3 is an evade at very start of the animation where as pistol whip is not. > > > > > > Jumping at the start of pistol whip does everything the tooltip says except for the multiple hit boxes. Doing a free stun and canceling the rest of the animation is totally exploitable even when it cost initiative which is already a really low amount imo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Holy kitten you mean anet still hasn't fixed Pistol Whip's tooltip? Good god. > > > > > > > > > > I'm still not sure where you're pulling this 'free' part from. It still costs 5 ini just like if you'd used the rest of the cast. Anet can def fix it but it's not going to change anything. > > > > If every skill allowed you to just jump during it to prevent you from making a bad play than every build would be broken. But at the moment the build that stops you from using an unnecessary pistol whip that roots you for 1.25 secs is this one. You can do this at zero risk and it’ll still use pulmonary impact if it interrupted which is unblockable 1.5-2.5k damage. It should be fixed tbh even if it’s not as annoying or useful as the staff 3 bug > > > > > > > > > > Clarification - not here to argue about whether or not it should be 'fixed'. Just pointing out that your perception of how good using Pistol Whip that way is totally wrong. > > > > > > You admitted you barely seeing anyone do it - why do you think that is? I haven't seen any other player give it a go, either. Except myself because I wanted to give it a try, but I stopped and never went back. Because using the skill that way sucks. > > > > > > > I am not wrong even Sindrener points out that part of outplaying opponents is timing your pistol whips, repositioning them and stowing/canceling them. This is one of the tools in your arsenal for outplaying opponents and if you don’t ever use it you are missing out. The fact you claimed it’s useless doesn’t mean much, I don’t see it much because I’m not stupid enough to sit in range of pistol whip. Also when you claimed it was useless you also got 75% of the facts wrong so who’s perception here is really wrong???? > > IIRC, Sind means stowing/canceling before you complete the skill cast or after the evade starts so people have a harder time punishing the vulnerability frames. Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy tho, but that's another story. :) > > Also, don't misrepresent what I said. I said it sucks. I said it's objectively worse to jump-cast it than it is to complete the cast and get the evade + damage. > > I literally tested it right before I replied - twice, the second time with the guard NPC to see if it still gave the evade. > > Also, about that standard of my supposed claims of it being useless vs yours that it's toxic and exploitable :O Huh. Interesting, uh, way of thinking you have there. > > Edit: Cntrl+F indicates there is no use of 'useless' in my posts anywhere. It's all in yours and some other poster's reply a little less than halfway up. Do ask if you want clarification on something. Dude why are u posting this useless stuff. The conversation was on this topic after Sindrener mentioned it multiple times. You said this skill sucks and got every fact about it incorrect. I don’t need clarification from the authority that is you when I already know you got your facts wrong. You can just look in my post above never did anyone say that this skill dodges on jump and the fact your testing that to prove your point is Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curennos.9307 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > > Jumping mid Pistol Whip cast will still pop out the stun, but it also consumes ini and doesn't give you the evade afterward. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dunno why anyone would ever use it that way. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Same as the staff bug. The difference this is a dps build while staff was more or less a bunker. You can use this anytime you know they will dodge for a free pulm. Ofc it’s usable and it’s an exploitable bug > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jump casting staff 3 had it do everything the skill tooltip said it was, evade included. Trying to use pistol whip this way ONLY gives you the stun and 300-400 damage attached to it. It does nothing else if you jump. It's objectively worse than just letting the skill cast w/out jump. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That’s where your wrong. > > > > > > > 1.) No where on the tooltip does pistol whip say there is ever an evade > > > > > > > 2.) It is exactly the same- it starts the animation. The difference is the animation it’s self, staff 3 is an evade at very start of the animation where as pistol whip is not. > > > > > > > Jumping at the start of pistol whip does everything the tooltip says except for the multiple hit boxes. Doing a free stun and canceling the rest of the animation is totally exploitable even when it cost initiative which is already a really low amount imo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Holy kitten you mean anet still hasn't fixed Pistol Whip's tooltip? Good god. > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm still not sure where you're pulling this 'free' part from. It still costs 5 ini just like if you'd used the rest of the cast. Anet can def fix it but it's not going to change anything. > > > > > If every skill allowed you to just jump during it to prevent you from making a bad play than every build would be broken. But at the moment the build that stops you from using an unnecessary pistol whip that roots you for 1.25 secs is this one. You can do this at zero risk and it’ll still use pulmonary impact if it interrupted which is unblockable 1.5-2.5k damage. It should be fixed tbh even if it’s not as annoying or useful as the staff 3 bug > > > > > > > > > > > > > Clarification - not here to argue about whether or not it should be 'fixed'. Just pointing out that your perception of how good using Pistol Whip that way is totally wrong. > > > > > > > > You admitted you barely seeing anyone do it - why do you think that is? I haven't seen any other player give it a go, either. Except myself because I wanted to give it a try, but I stopped and never went back. Because using the skill that way sucks. > > > > > > > > > > I am not wrong even Sindrener points out that part of outplaying opponents is timing your pistol whips, repositioning them and stowing/canceling them. This is one of the tools in your arsenal for outplaying opponents and if you don’t ever use it you are missing out. The fact you claimed it’s useless doesn’t mean much, I don’t see it much because I’m not stupid enough to sit in range of pistol whip. Also when you claimed it was useless you also got 75% of the facts wrong so who’s perception here is really wrong???? > > > > IIRC, Sind means stowing/canceling before you complete the skill cast or after the evade starts so people have a harder time punishing the vulnerability frames. Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy tho, but that's another story. :) > > > > Also, don't misrepresent what I said. I said it sucks. I said it's objectively worse to jump-cast it than it is to complete the cast and get the evade + damage. > > > > I literally tested it right before I replied - twice, the second time with the guard NPC to see if it still gave the evade. > > > > Also, about that standard of my supposed claims of it being useless vs yours that it's toxic and exploitable :O Huh. Interesting, uh, way of thinking you have there. > > > > Edit: Cntrl+F indicates there is no use of 'useless' in my posts anywhere. It's all in yours and some other poster's reply a little less than halfway up. Do ask if you want clarification on something. > > Dude why are u posting this useless stuff. The conversation was on this topic after Sindrener mentioned it multiple times. You said this skill sucks and got every fact about it incorrect. I don’t need clarification from the authority that is you when I already know you got your facts wrong. You can just look in my post above never did anyone say that this skill dodges on jump and the fact your testing that to prove your point is Lol. > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"ArthurDent.9538" said: > > > @"xardan.2874" said: > > > Also Anet should make pistolwhip cost initiative at the start of the cast. This stowing is dishonest gameplay. > > > Remember stowing sword2 on mesmer and how quickly it got fixed after Helseth made guide showing it? But thiefs skills abusing same things are totally fine and balanced :) > > > Ok, i see, i see. > > > > Mesmer stowing sword 2 was different because it was the only skill that could be stowed for reduced cd while still actually giving an effect (in that case an evade frame). Stowing pistol whip only costs 0 initiative if canceled before the stun part finishes casting. There could be an argument for giving their initiative skills the same reduced cd that cd gated skills get if cancel casted. > > Actually I’d like to point u can jump right when animation starts hence canceling but it does first strike which is a stun and **probably an evade also** Still waiting on hearing about those facts I got wrong. Also, again with the strawman. No, I said jump-casting sucks in comparison to just using the skill. Pistol Whip is a good skill. Jump casting it sucks in comparison to normal use. It's getting kinda hard to keep track of all these things you're making up. 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Dantheman.3589 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > > > Jumping mid Pistol Whip cast will still pop out the stun, but it also consumes ini and doesn't give you the evade afterward. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dunno why anyone would ever use it that way. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Same as the staff bug. The difference this is a dps build while staff was more or less a bunker. You can use this anytime you know they will dodge for a free pulm. Ofc it’s usable and it’s an exploitable bug > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jump casting staff 3 had it do everything the skill tooltip said it was, evade included. Trying to use pistol whip this way ONLY gives you the stun and 300-400 damage attached to it. It does nothing else if you jump. It's objectively worse than just letting the skill cast w/out jump. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That’s where your wrong. > > > > > > > > 1.) No where on the tooltip does pistol whip say there is ever an evade > > > > > > > > 2.) It is exactly the same- it starts the animation. The difference is the animation it’s self, staff 3 is an evade at very start of the animation where as pistol whip is not. > > > > > > > > Jumping at the start of pistol whip does everything the tooltip says except for the multiple hit boxes. Doing a free stun and canceling the rest of the animation is totally exploitable even when it cost initiative which is already a really low amount imo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Holy kitten you mean anet still hasn't fixed Pistol Whip's tooltip? Good god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm still not sure where you're pulling this 'free' part from. It still costs 5 ini just like if you'd used the rest of the cast. Anet can def fix it but it's not going to change anything. > > > > > > If every skill allowed you to just jump during it to prevent you from making a bad play than every build would be broken. But at the moment the build that stops you from using an unnecessary pistol whip that roots you for 1.25 secs is this one. You can do this at zero risk and it’ll still use pulmonary impact if it interrupted which is unblockable 1.5-2.5k damage. It should be fixed tbh even if it’s not as annoying or useful as the staff 3 bug > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Clarification - not here to argue about whether or not it should be 'fixed'. Just pointing out that your perception of how good using Pistol Whip that way is totally wrong. > > > > > > > > > > You admitted you barely seeing anyone do it - why do you think that is? I haven't seen any other player give it a go, either. Except myself because I wanted to give it a try, but I stopped and never went back. Because using the skill that way sucks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not wrong even Sindrener points out that part of outplaying opponents is timing your pistol whips, repositioning them and stowing/canceling them. This is one of the tools in your arsenal for outplaying opponents and if you don’t ever use it you are missing out. The fact you claimed it’s useless doesn’t mean much, I don’t see it much because I’m not stupid enough to sit in range of pistol whip. Also when you claimed it was useless you also got 75% of the facts wrong so who’s perception here is really wrong???? > > > > > > IIRC, Sind means stowing/canceling before you complete the skill cast or after the evade starts so people have a harder time punishing the vulnerability frames. Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy tho, but that's another story. :) > > > > > > Also, don't misrepresent what I said. I said it sucks. I said it's objectively worse to jump-cast it than it is to complete the cast and get the evade + damage. > > > > > > I literally tested it right before I replied - twice, the second time with the guard NPC to see if it still gave the evade. > > > > > > Also, about that standard of my supposed claims of it being useless vs yours that it's toxic and exploitable :O Huh. Interesting, uh, way of thinking you have there. > > > > > > Edit: Cntrl+F indicates there is no use of 'useless' in my posts anywhere. It's all in yours and some other poster's reply a little less than halfway up. Do ask if you want clarification on something. > > > > Dude why are u posting this useless stuff. The conversation was on this topic after Sindrener mentioned it multiple times. You said this skill sucks and got every fact about it incorrect. I don’t need clarification from the authority that is you when I already know you got your facts wrong. You can just look in my post above never did anyone say that this skill dodges on jump and the fact your testing that to prove your point is Lol. > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"ArthurDent.9538" said: > > > > @"xardan.2874" said: > > > > Also Anet should make pistolwhip cost initiative at the start of the cast. This stowing is dishonest gameplay. > > > > Remember stowing sword2 on mesmer and how quickly it got fixed after Helseth made guide showing it? But thiefs skills abusing same things are totally fine and balanced :) > > > > Ok, i see, i see. > > > > > > Mesmer stowing sword 2 was different because it was the only skill that could be stowed for reduced cd while still actually giving an effect (in that case an evade frame). Stowing pistol whip only costs 0 initiative if canceled before the stun part finishes casting. There could be an argument for giving their initiative skills the same reduced cd that cd gated skills get if cancel casted. > > > > Actually I’d like to point u can jump right when animation starts hence canceling but it does first strike which is a stun and **probably an evade also** > > Still waiting on hearing about those facts I got wrong. > > Also, again with the strawman. No, I said jump-casting sucks in comparison to just using the skill. Pistol Whip is a good skill. Jump casting it sucks in comparison to normal use. > > It's getting kinda hard to keep track of all these things you're making up. O let’s see you claimed pistol whip tooltip says there’s an evade and based literally half your arguement off that and are now here sperging. And yet I’m making stuff up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curennos.9307 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > Jumping mid Pistol Whip cast will still pop out the stun, but it also consumes ini and doesn't give you the evade afterward. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dunno why anyone would ever use it that way. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Same as the staff bug. The difference this is a dps build while staff was more or less a bunker. You can use this anytime you know they will dodge for a free pulm. Ofc it’s usable and it’s an exploitable bug > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jump casting staff 3 had it do everything the skill tooltip said it was, evade included. Trying to use pistol whip this way ONLY gives you the stun and 300-400 damage attached to it. It does nothing else if you jump. It's objectively worse than just letting the skill cast w/out jump. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That’s where your wrong. > > > > > > > > > 1.) No where on the tooltip does pistol whip say there is ever an evade > > > > > > > > > 2.) It is exactly the same- it starts the animation. The difference is the animation it’s self, staff 3 is an evade at very start of the animation where as pistol whip is not. > > > > > > > > > Jumping at the start of pistol whip does everything the tooltip says except for the multiple hit boxes. Doing a free stun and canceling the rest of the animation is totally exploitable even when it cost initiative which is already a really low amount imo. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Holy kitten you mean anet still hasn't fixed Pistol Whip's tooltip? Good god. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm still not sure where you're pulling this 'free' part from. It still costs 5 ini just like if you'd used the rest of the cast. Anet can def fix it but it's not going to change anything. > > > > > > > If every skill allowed you to just jump during it to prevent you from making a bad play than every build would be broken. But at the moment the build that stops you from using an unnecessary pistol whip that roots you for 1.25 secs is this one. You can do this at zero risk and it’ll still use pulmonary impact if it interrupted which is unblockable 1.5-2.5k damage. It should be fixed tbh even if it’s not as annoying or useful as the staff 3 bug > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Clarification - not here to argue about whether or not it should be 'fixed'. Just pointing out that your perception of how good using Pistol Whip that way is totally wrong. > > > > > > > > > > > > You admitted you barely seeing anyone do it - why do you think that is? I haven't seen any other player give it a go, either. Except myself because I wanted to give it a try, but I stopped and never went back. Because using the skill that way sucks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not wrong even Sindrener points out that part of outplaying opponents is timing your pistol whips, repositioning them and stowing/canceling them. This is one of the tools in your arsenal for outplaying opponents and if you don’t ever use it you are missing out. The fact you claimed it’s useless doesn’t mean much, I don’t see it much because I’m not stupid enough to sit in range of pistol whip. Also when you claimed it was useless you also got 75% of the facts wrong so who’s perception here is really wrong???? > > > > > > > > IIRC, Sind means stowing/canceling before you complete the skill cast or after the evade starts so people have a harder time punishing the vulnerability frames. Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy tho, but that's another story. :) > > > > > > > > Also, don't misrepresent what I said. I said it sucks. I said it's objectively worse to jump-cast it than it is to complete the cast and get the evade + damage. > > > > > > > > I literally tested it right before I replied - twice, the second time with the guard NPC to see if it still gave the evade. > > > > > > > > Also, about that standard of my supposed claims of it being useless vs yours that it's toxic and exploitable :O Huh. Interesting, uh, way of thinking you have there. > > > > > > > > Edit: Cntrl+F indicates there is no use of 'useless' in my posts anywhere. It's all in yours and some other poster's reply a little less than halfway up. Do ask if you want clarification on something. > > > > > > Dude why are u posting this useless stuff. The conversation was on this topic after Sindrener mentioned it multiple times. You said this skill sucks and got every fact about it incorrect. I don’t need clarification from the authority that is you when I already know you got your facts wrong. You can just look in my post above never did anyone say that this skill dodges on jump and the fact your testing that to prove your point is Lol. > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"ArthurDent.9538" said: > > > > > @"xardan.2874" said: > > > > > Also Anet should make pistolwhip cost initiative at the start of the cast. This stowing is dishonest gameplay. > > > > > Remember stowing sword2 on mesmer and how quickly it got fixed after Helseth made guide showing it? But thiefs skills abusing same things are totally fine and balanced :) > > > > > Ok, i see, i see. > > > > > > > > Mesmer stowing sword 2 was different because it was the only skill that could be stowed for reduced cd while still actually giving an effect (in that case an evade frame). Stowing pistol whip only costs 0 initiative if canceled before the stun part finishes casting. There could be an argument for giving their initiative skills the same reduced cd that cd gated skills get if cancel casted. > > > > > > Actually I’d like to point u can jump right when animation starts hence canceling but it does first strike which is a stun and **probably an evade also** > > > > Still waiting on hearing about those facts I got wrong. > > > > Also, again with the strawman. No, I said jump-casting sucks in comparison to just using the skill. Pistol Whip is a good skill. Jump casting it sucks in comparison to normal use. > > > > It's getting kinda hard to keep track of all these things you're making up. > O let’s see you claimed pistol whip tooltip says there’s an evade and based literally half your arguement off that and are now here sperging. > And yet I’m making stuff up > And then admitted my surprise that anet has yet to update the tooltip. Taking the thing in context, however - it was a comparison between staff#3, which performs the entire skill despite the jump cancel, compared to pistol#3, which has opportunity cost. Staff#3 has (had, rather) no drawbacks to jump canceling. You got the full effect of the skill. Pistol#3 loses out on the evade and damage. You don't really gain anything, either - except if you count 'losing' the vulnerability frames after the evade, but you can stow/walk/dodge cancel out of it anyway. Who can fathom anet's plans for the world. But pistol whip does indeed have an evade if you fully cast sword/pistol3. Your cherrypicking aside, of course. Glad I could clear that up for you :) Asking for clarification is good. Anything else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stand The Wall.6987 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 the only thing that should be nerfed is sindrener and people like him that make these builds - builds that have existed forever but I guess the sheep will flock. if I was him I would be dead already from asphyxiation due to laughing overload. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"NorthernRedStar.3054" said: > I still don't get how all the revenant and FB threads were suddenly replaced by PW. Because people don't wanna learn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Stand The Wall.6987" said: > the only thing that should be nerfed is sindrener and people like him that make these builds - builds that have existed forever but I guess the sheep will flock. > > if I was him I would be dead already from asphyxiation due to laughing overload. Literally nothing in this game has existed unchanged since launch. Even things that might be technically unchanged are impacted heavily by changes to classes around them and changes to the class itself. For example nerfing stability from a boon that negates all CC's while it is up throughout it's duration to a boon that protects against one CC and is then consumed. Maybe Pistol Whip has been around for a while but Dagger Strom that evades hasn't. Or individual changes to specific classes, such as Mesmer's Bountiful Disillusionment being nerfed from 5s of Stability on shatter down to 1s of stability on shatter making repeated CC much more disruptive. Or Warriors struggling to fit Balanced Stance and Lesser Balanced Stance in their builds and remain competitive side noders. Or Holosmith seeing Elixir U go down to 1s of stab and at the same time seeing the bug fixed that was giving them 10 stacks of Stability on Corona Burst. Builds become problems as they become problems. Right now the two most omnipresent builds I'm seeing in ranked are Core Chaos Power Mesmer and Pistol Whip Daredevil and by a huge margin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 One shot shatter mesmers did always exist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagrant.7206 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"Stand The Wall.6987" said: > > the only thing that should be nerfed is sindrener and people like him that make these builds - builds that have existed forever but I guess the sheep will flock. > > > > if I was him I would be dead already from asphyxiation due to laughing overload. > > Literally nothing in this game has existed unchanged since launch. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gear_Shield > **October 18, 2016** - The block duration of this ability has been reduced from 3 seconds to 2 seconds. > **November 15, 2012** - This skill now blocks for an extra second. > **August 28, 2012** Game release - Gear Shield has been added to the game. I suppose technically it's been changed. In the sense that it was returned to its original form. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Smoke_Vent > **October 15, 2013** - This skill now has a range indicator. > **August 28, 2012** Game release - Smoke Vent has been added to the game (And yes, I am messing with you. I get your point. Core engi just has a lot of outdated shit in its kits) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Avatar.3568" said: > One shot shatter mesmers did always exist > > True but for example the trait that turns F3 into a full stun didn't exist. 9 second Mass Invisiblity didn't always exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"Avatar.3568" said: > > One shot shatter mesmers did always exist > > > > > > True but for example the trait that turns F3 into a full stun didn't exist. 9 second Mass Invisiblity didn't always exist. True but back than everyone has less utility too, so it doesn't matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"Avatar.3568" said: > > One shot shatter mesmers did always exist > > > > > > True but for example the trait that turns F3 into a full stun didn't exist. 9 second Mass Invisiblity didn't always exist. Daze into stun was so much better than one stun at 38s cd. Shorter cd on MI is pretty big, dont think anyone sit the entire 9s at stealth to burst, lol. The huge difference is auto death save procs that didnt let you die and mesmer was left with no cds left and unable to do anything. Every mesmer coseplayed le portal bot, so no 3rd utility (mantras were horrible garbage too btw) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhemize.8649 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 If Anet would simply remove the added evade functions from pistol whip it would be enough to get rid of the cheese meme matches we've unfortunately been plagued with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 And the complete skill would be useless > @"Dhemize.8649" said: > If Anet would simply remove the added evade functions from pistol whip it would be enough to get rid of the cheese meme matches we've unfortunately been plagued with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhemize.8649 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Avatar.3568" said: > > And the complete skill would be useless > @"Dhemize.8649" said: > > If Anet would simply remove the added evade functions from pistol whip it would be enough to get rid of the cheese meme matches we've unfortunately been plagued with. > > It would still do damage and stun. I'd even be ok with it doing more damage in exchange for being able to fight a person using meme builds. Never even made sense that a person standing there swinging somehow counts as evade frames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 Imagine, a thief using this skill without evade, he would instantly die Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhemize.8649 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 Imagine, having to potentially pay for not landing an attack on an enemy like any other class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Dhemize.8649" said: > Imagine, having to potentially pay for not landing an attack on an enemy like any other class. Maybe you did not get it, but he can not walk while he is doing this skill If you make a backstep, he will not hit you, but if he has no evade he dies in less than 1 sec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhemize.8649 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Avatar.3568" said: > > @"Dhemize.8649" said: > > Imagine, having to potentially pay for not landing an attack on an enemy like any other class. > > Maybe you did not get it, but he can not walk while he is doing this skill > > If you make a backstep, he will not hit you, but if he has no evade he dies in less than 1 sec I do get it. I do know how it works. Thank you for taking the time to break it down for me though. No thief in platinum league is going to die in one second. Quit with the hyperbole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 Than we are in different Plat league's, this video would show you how useful thief without the evade on pw would be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhemize.8649 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 All you did was provide an example of somebody who got carried to a league (or class) they are not good in. Ok...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odik.4587 Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 > @"Avatar.3568" said: > > @"Dhemize.8649" said: > > Imagine, having to potentially pay for not landing an attack on an enemy like any other class. > > Maybe you did not get it, but he can not walk while he is doing this skill > If you make a backstep, he will not hit you, but if he has no evade he dies in less than 1 sec So, remove the stun and make this skill lasts 1 second and do way less damage on the Blurred Frenzy level. This skill doesnt need to have stun/evade/high damage at once. (Dont take it srs but this might happen in the future) As @"Daishi.6027" said the problem is infiltrator's strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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