Obsidian Flesh (Ele) and Facet of Light (Rev)

[Razor.6392]

I'm sure lots of Herald players will hate my guts for stating this but, if you're going to send out a rushed patch into the game, at least make sure to remain consistent in your whack-a-mole balance changes.

 

**Obsidian Flesh:** [50 seconds cd, only available in off-hand focus] Become invulnerable to physical and condition damage for 4 seconds (3 seconds in pvp)

 

**Changed after patch: Your skill and utility bars gets completely locked out, just like Mist Form or Engi's Elixir S.**

 

So, I'm thinking, clearly ANet is aiming to get rid of abilities that allow you to become immune to everything while still being able to dish DPS. That must have been broken (???) and clearly everyone was complaining about that. So then we have next...

 

**Infuse Light:** [30 seconds cd, Legendary Dragon Stance only in Herald] Heal yourself and convert ALL incoming damage into bonus healing for 3s.

 

**Changed after patch: Nothing. You can still do mad DPS while not only being invulnerable, but also regenerating health! on a 30s CD!**

 

Anyone else notice something going on? Shouldn't all design philosophy extend to every class, just like other clueless concepts have done so in the same manner? (I seriously laughed out loud seeing reaper's executioner scythe with a 0.01 coeff).

 

So arenanet I really hope you lock out Revenants skill and utility bars after activating Infuse Light. It's only fair right?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Julius Seizure.4985]

Infuse Light is analogous with Defiant Stance, not Obsidian Flesh. Both of these have extremely easy counter play as well— stop attacking and kite. It’s actually easier with Infuse Light, as some core builds trait for Defiant Stance at 5 seconds of duration, and 3 seconds on Infuse Light is very manageable in comparison to that.

 

Compare Obsidian Flesh to Elixer S, Endure Pain, or other such invuln skills. I could see Obsidian Flesh getting a 60+ seconds recharge and being reduced to 2 seconds duration, like Endure Pain. I could also see it staying as is, and being a longer invulnerable window than Elixer S, but missing the stun break.

[Razor.6392]

Dude, all those abilities grant INVULNERABILITY. They should get the same treatment or simply revert obsi flesh :)

[Julius Seizure.4985]

Invulnerability is a specific mechanic, and they don’t grant it.

 

Damage->heal may be too powerful of a mechanic, but that is not what you are saying. It is definitely interesting that this type of heal is only available to heavy classes (and 2 of them at that).

[Razor.6392]

> @"Julius Seizure.4985" said:

> Invulnerability is a specific mechanic, and they don’t grant it.

>

> Damage->heal may be too powerful of a mechanic, but that is not what you are saying. It is definitely interesting that this type of heal is only available to heavy classes (and 2 of them at that).

 

You right. It's not invuln on paper and it allows them to be cc'd but, the tradeoff is that they recover health at 1:1, both heavy classes while the light one with the lowest health was stripped of stability in weaver, and also had its invuln nerfed to irrelevance.

 

Balance is sad af.

 

 

 

 

[AnodicShadow.3647]

> @"Razor.6392" said:

> > @"Julius Seizure.4985" said:

> > Invulnerability is a specific mechanic, and they don’t grant it.

> >

> > Damage->heal may be too powerful of a mechanic, but that is not what you are saying. It is definitely interesting that this type of heal is only available to heavy classes (and 2 of them at that).

>

> You right. It's not invuln on paper and it allows them to be cc'd but, the tradeoff is that they recover health at 1:1, both heavy classes while the light one with the lowest health was stripped of stability in weaver, and also had its invuln nerfed to irrelevance.

>

> Balance is sad af.

>

>

>

>

 

But at the same time, if you stop attacking them and run away, they get literally no value out of the heal. They're still at low health. Or if they used it offensively at high health, they're still out of a heal skill, and are pretty much forced to be defensive or switch to whatever other Legend they have, which may or may not even be available to swap to at the time.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

With 0.01 cc coefficients you can now cc revs through infuse light without healing them. Revs are usually trying to get hit right as they pop IL, so If you play it right they get very little healing, and you can set them up into a very bad position.

[bravan.3876]

Compared to Engis elixir s and Guards elite invuln, Obsidian had no skill lock out for good reasons. Anet messing with core balance without even having half the competence of the old/origin balance team it seems. It makes in particular more skilled and squishy Ele builds (FA) clunky and unplayable for the sake of nerfing braindead bunker builds you can nerf in so many other ways. There is no need to butcher the few active defense skills the more squishy builds have only access to.

 

> @"Razor.6392" said:

> Dude, all those abilities grant INVULNERABILITY. They should get the same treatment or simply revert obsi flesh :)

 

That is the only thing they have in common, but aside from providing invuln they are completely different and also build around completely different classes with different mechanics and different strengths. So no, they should not get the same treatment. You never should treat stuff the same, that is per se different. This is the nonsense logic Anet based the Obsidian change on, because Engi elixir s and Guard RF lock out of skills while invuln, Anet had the stupid idea to do the same to Obsidian. But these are completely different skills on completely different classes need completely different treatment. Obsidian is way to weak now compared to other classes invuln skills, considering all differences. Obsidian is now unfair treated by treating it the same as elixir s or RF while being completely different. This change is stupid and needs to be reverted.

 

Otherwise as said the balance team can just shorten the process of making the game unfun, unskilled and clunky by just removing jumpdodges, the ability to cast while moving and weapons stowing casts instead slowly making one elite or class after another clunkly and unfun and lower skill ceiling with such unlogical nonsense changes showing insane lack of game- and classknowledge and balance experience. I get so mad when i see such stupid changes holy cow...

 

Btw the Rev heal is not an invuln and for that also not in need for any "same treatment".

[ProverbsofHell.2307]

> @"AnodicShadow.3647" said:

> > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > > @"Julius Seizure.4985" said:

> > > Invulnerability is a specific mechanic, and they don’t grant it.

> > >

> > > Damage->heal may be too powerful of a mechanic, but that is not what you are saying. It is definitely interesting that this type of heal is only available to heavy classes (and 2 of them at that).

> >

> > You right. It's not invuln on paper and it allows them to be cc'd but, the tradeoff is that they recover health at 1:1, both heavy classes while the light one with the lowest health was stripped of stability in weaver, and also had its invuln nerfed to irrelevance.

> >

> > Balance is sad af.

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

> But at the same time, if you stop attacking them and run away, they get literally no value out of the heal. They're still at low health. Or if they used it offensively at high health, they're still out of a heal skill, and are pretty much forced to be defensive or switch to whatever other Legend they have, which may or may not even be available to swap to at the time.

 

Bingo. There’s a reason not every Warrior is rushing to use Defiant Stance in PvP. It’s really more of a WvW skill imo, where the disadvantage is mitigated somewhat by the abundance of damage around you. It’s best usage to cover a burst imo or Bubble.

[apharma.3741]

Invulnerability is god mode:

Nothing can hurt you.

Nothing can be applied to you.

You cannot be stopped from what you are doing.

 

Defiant stance/infuse light.

You can't be hurt.

Conditions can be applied to you.

You can be crowd controlled.

Your actions can be interrupted.

 

Reading is hard.

[Master Ketsu.4569]

Tl;DR of it is that Facet of light and defiant stance are interactive while obsidian flesh is not.

 

If I see a warrior pop defiant stance, I don't see an irritating invuln. I see a free kill. These skills are HEALING skills, which means that if you bait them into using it then immediately stow weapons and do some JP or whatever until it ends you can actually punish their misuse because then they will have zero sustain. If you can understand why every decent warrior either takes healing signet or situationally takes mending, you can understand why this is changes everything.

 

Same thing with Rev. Facet of light is slightly better because it generates regen, but again same principle. If you bait a rev into popping infused, then stow weapons/kite/etc, well now you just shut down that revs sustain for the next 30 seconds afterward. That's 30 seconds for you to launch a counter attack on a target that now has very limited healing.

 

Defiant stance/Infused light can be punished and outplayed. Straight up utility invulns on the other hand have very little counterplay to them. You aren't sacrificing any sustain / gambling away a more reliable healing skill to use them. You are not severely gimped for half a minute if you blow it. You can't be interrupted. Very big difference.

[Tycura.1982]

*Defiant stance noises*