Dantheman.3589 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > People arguing here dont even realise that you dont even want thief nerfed but removed some niche edge case mechanic abuse kitten that 99% of the players wont even see let alone be capable of doing themselves > Spaming F1 on DE to heal off clones and generate gigaboons is stupid. > Stealing into beasts/pets to get 10k dmg nuke that was supposed to be in pve is stupid if not even exploiting. > etc etc. Idk about the stealing onto beast becuz the actual intended purpose of steal is mobility mostly and the steal item so it’s the same.. 10k damage nuke is kind of broken lol and should be hot fixed immediately. As far as Mesmer clones- that’s not really even the point and I’m pretty every de has marked onto to something like a downed player to cleave and heal + get boons which can make mark damage go immediately up like x2 damage wise which they will mark another target right after or even just do it to get swiftness and vigor so they can rotate. It’s way more common than u think plus it doesn’t really just have to do with Mesmer clones... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > People arguing here dont even realise that you dont even want thief nerfed but removed some niche edge case mechanic abuse kitten that 99% of the players wont even see let alone be capable of doing themselves > > > Spaming F1 on DE to heal off clones and generate gigaboons is stupid. > > > Stealing into beasts/pets to get 10k dmg nuke that was supposed to be in pve is stupid if not even exploiting. > > > etc etc. > > > > There is no toothbstab in pvp > > You clearly haven’t tested this... tooth stab is possible to get off pets, clones, minions, beast and npcs in for fire... > I’ll tell you this for like for 40th time YOU ARE 100% WRONG On This Golems can probably drop alot, but toothstab is only possible from pve NPCs. Unless black bear pet or lash tail pet is bugged it is impossible in game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > People arguing here dont even realise that you dont even want thief nerfed but removed some niche edge case mechanic abuse kitten that 99% of the players wont even see let alone be capable of doing themselves > > > > Spaming F1 on DE to heal off clones and generate gigaboons is stupid. > > > > Stealing into beasts/pets to get 10k dmg nuke that was supposed to be in pve is stupid if not even exploiting. > > > > etc etc. > > > > > > There is no toothbstab in pvp > > > > You clearly haven’t tested this... tooth stab is possible to get off pets, clones, minions, beast and npcs in for fire... > > I’ll tell you this for like for 40th time YOU ARE 100% WRONG On This > > Golems can probably drop alot, but toothstab is only possible from pve NPCs. > > Unless black bear pet or lash tail pet is bugged it is impossible in game. > > It’s possible on beast and clones and well actually I think there’s something slightly different about drops from foefire npcs so no sure. Again ur wrong on this just go into matches and test it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > > People arguing here dont even realise that you dont even want thief nerfed but removed some niche edge case mechanic abuse kitten that 99% of the players wont even see let alone be capable of doing themselves > > > > > Spaming F1 on DE to heal off clones and generate gigaboons is stupid. > > > > > Stealing into beasts/pets to get 10k dmg nuke that was supposed to be in pve is stupid if not even exploiting. > > > > > etc etc. > > > > > > > > There is no toothbstab in pvp > > > > > > You clearly haven’t tested this... tooth stab is possible to get off pets, clones, minions, beast and npcs in for fire... > > > I’ll tell you this for like for 40th time YOU ARE 100% WRONG On This > > > > Golems can probably drop alot, but toothstab is only possible from pve NPCs. > > > > Unless black bear pet or lash tail pet is bugged it is impossible in game. > > > > > > It’s possible on beast and clones and well actually I think there’s something slightly different about drops from foefire npcs so no sure. Again ur wrong on this just go into matches and test it... There is already a list compiled man. One screen from in match (regular match) will be the only way you prove you are right..but you ain't. If you can do it, I'll give you 300 gold. Even if you get it from NPCs in foefire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > > > People arguing here dont even realise that you dont even want thief nerfed but removed some niche edge case mechanic abuse kitten that 99% of the players wont even see let alone be capable of doing themselves > > > > > > Spaming F1 on DE to heal off clones and generate gigaboons is stupid. > > > > > > Stealing into beasts/pets to get 10k dmg nuke that was supposed to be in pve is stupid if not even exploiting. > > > > > > etc etc. > > > > > > > > > > There is no toothbstab in pvp > > > > > > > > You clearly haven’t tested this... tooth stab is possible to get off pets, clones, minions, beast and npcs in for fire... > > > > I’ll tell you this for like for 40th time YOU ARE 100% WRONG On This > > > > > > Golems can probably drop alot, but toothstab is only possible from pve NPCs. > > > > > > Unless black bear pet or lash tail pet is bugged it is impossible in game. > > > > > > > > > > It’s possible on beast and clones and well actually I think there’s something slightly different about drops from foefire npcs so no sure. Again ur wrong on this just go into matches and test it... > > There is already a list compiled man. > > One screen from in match (regular match) will be the only way you prove you are right..but you ain't. > > If you can do it, I'll give you 300 gold. > > Even if you get it from NPCs in foefire Weird becuz you already provided a list where it is and posted here and now it claim it isn’t? Your clearly approaching delusional , why are u even here tbh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > > > > People arguing here dont even realise that you dont even want thief nerfed but removed some niche edge case mechanic abuse kitten that 99% of the players wont even see let alone be capable of doing themselves > > > > > > > Spaming F1 on DE to heal off clones and generate gigaboons is stupid. > > > > > > > Stealing into beasts/pets to get 10k dmg nuke that was supposed to be in pve is stupid if not even exploiting. > > > > > > > etc etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > There is no toothbstab in pvp > > > > > > > > > > You clearly haven’t tested this... tooth stab is possible to get off pets, clones, minions, beast and npcs in for fire... > > > > > I’ll tell you this for like for 40th time YOU ARE 100% WRONG On This > > > > > > > > Golems can probably drop alot, but toothstab is only possible from pve NPCs. > > > > > > > > Unless black bear pet or lash tail pet is bugged it is impossible in game. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It’s possible on beast and clones and well actually I think there’s something slightly different about drops from foefire npcs so no sure. Again ur wrong on this just go into matches and test it... > > > > There is already a list compiled man. > > > > One screen from in match (regular match) will be the only way you prove you are right..but you ain't. > > > > If you can do it, I'll give you 300 gold. > > > > Even if you get it from NPCs in foefire > > Weird becuz you already provided a list where it is and posted here and now it claim it isn’t? Your clearly approaching delusional , why are u even here tbh Look at the list, you are wrong. Why not just wreck me and get 300 gold? Out of curiosity is your alt reda..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 ~~Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to.~~ prize claimed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > > > > > People arguing here dont even realise that you dont even want thief nerfed but removed some niche edge case mechanic abuse kitten that 99% of the players wont even see let alone be capable of doing themselves > > > > > > > > Spaming F1 on DE to heal off clones and generate gigaboons is stupid. > > > > > > > > Stealing into beasts/pets to get 10k dmg nuke that was supposed to be in pve is stupid if not even exploiting. > > > > > > > > etc etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is no toothbstab in pvp > > > > > > > > > > > > You clearly haven’t tested this... tooth stab is possible to get off pets, clones, minions, beast and npcs in for fire... > > > > > > I’ll tell you this for like for 40th time YOU ARE 100% WRONG On This > > > > > > > > > > Golems can probably drop alot, but toothstab is only possible from pve NPCs. > > > > > > > > > > Unless black bear pet or lash tail pet is bugged it is impossible in game. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It’s possible on beast and clones and well actually I think there’s something slightly different about drops from foefire npcs so no sure. Again ur wrong on this just go into matches and test it... > > > > > > There is already a list compiled man. > > > > > > One screen from in match (regular match) will be the only way you prove you are right..but you ain't. > > > > > > If you can do it, I'll give you 300 gold. > > > > > > Even if you get it from NPCs in foefire > > > > Weird becuz you already provided a list where it is and posted here and now it claim it isn’t? Your clearly approaching delusional , why are u even here tbh > > Look at the list, you are wrong. > > Why not just wreck me and get 300 gold? > > Out of curiosity is your alt reda..? Weird are u claiming ur own post is wrong? > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > > > > Mug can't be spammed even if someone decided to waste it on a clone or a pet. > > > > > > > > > > Ice Shard Stab was already hotfixed. > > > > > > > > > > CnD won't be abused because it's slow, clunky, relatively buggy and 5 ini just ain't worth it to spam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not true at all let me break it down- > > > > > > > > > using mark on a clone will most likely kill it and refresh mark immediately, this is 100% risk free spammable and can give an insane amount of boons. > > > > > > > > > Ice shard was hot fixed but guess what tooth stab wasn’t and it deals the same damage ice shard did. > > > > > > > > > Sword burst was basically untouched besides autos so now u can just use w.e u have- tactical strike sword 3 or 5 and u get away with it > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You don't nerf a skill that may be abused as a result of other skill usage. Fix mark, don't nerf core. _(also my mark never oneshoted a clone, but I guess it can happen)_ > > > > > > > > Tooth stab is inaccessible in PvP even on pets, clones and beasts it's a random roll item _(at least I think it's not guaranteed)_, so even if you really happened to get it as stolen item its somewhat of a good reward for wasting your steal in a RNG attempt to get it. > > > > > > > > Sword burst was never big to begin with, it's not even a burst set, the fact you can use CnD which happens to have higher dmg than its other skills doesn't magically make it bursty, almost all other professions have about two skills on most weapon sets that hit harder than other weapon skills on the same weapon, it's their purpose. It's simply intended to have some weapon skills hit harder than other skills on that weapon, that's why they cost more to use _(or have higher CD, etc.)_. > > > > > > > > CnD simply never was a dangerous nor spammable skill, I don't deny that you might have a different experience, but in my time I've never seen it be useful for anything than very very very occasional combo with steal and even then it randomly didn't land, anytime some Thief attempted to spam it I just undamaged him without even having to dodge. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tooth stab is not inaccessible in pvp and 2 hits from that would ko most targets and that’s obviously busted. > > > > > > > My suggestion to add an icd wouldnt affect core builds at all- just put a 5 sec icd on mug etc. to make sure mark doesn’t abuse it and because 5 secs isn’t enough for daredevil or core to get steal back it wouldn’t impact them. > > > > > > > And yeah with de ur goona have to spam something with initiative and having a random skill busted is no bueno, but you can disagree it’s w.e > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you access tooth stab in PvP? > > > > > > > > > > I think he must mean ice shard stab, and it was already fixed. > > > > > > > > > > **Ice Shard Stab: Fixed an issue in which the damage increase for this skill was applied in all game modes instead of only PvE.** > > > > > > > > No I don’t mean ice shard. Tooth stab also has this bug and was not patched, it is a random roll item from beast etc and it can upper limit of 10k per which is busted and will 2 hit ko ppl. > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > All these resources are abusable! > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.) mug or mark require a rework or icd, as it can be used endlessly on clones downed targets or pets for insane boons or healing > > > > > > 2.) tactical strike needs a huge nerf to bring it inline, as it is a cc that can do up to 7k on DE > > > > > > 3.) tooth stab can do 10k per plz fix > > > > > > Other stuff of lower but still very high priority > > > > > > 4.) feline grace needs a real icd, in addition to icds for bountiful theft and possibly be quick or be killed, becuz why is there an option that may be permanent boons/stat boost > > > > > > 5.) M7 probably gives too much initiative and when combined with mercy I can give permanent full initiative > > > > > > 6.) same problem with mark and mug- thrill of the crime needs icd reason already stated > > > > > > 7.) many weapon skills damage not touched like cloak and dagger and this will be taken advantage of. where as the change to sw/d 3 is logical because at least flanking strike was nerfed, but maybe do something to prevent larcenous strike spam also Becuz that will also be taken advantage/spammed which isn’t skillful. > > > > > > 8.) besides Deadeye builds that are busted with mark spam crit strikes dps and for some builds even the utility is starting to be very busted > > > > > > > > > > > > I think I can go on and on actually but these things especially the first 3 should be hot fixed immediately. Also hopefully the comment section will be full of things that are just busted on thief atm as I’m sure there’s plenty > > > > > > > > > > Ill go through the list. > > > > > > > > > > 1. if anything needs a cooldown, it would be mark. > > > > > 2. tactical strike is soft cc, and 7k is very unlikely without plenty of qualifiers, meaning it will never happen in normal play alone even on zerk. > > > > > 3. Tooth stab is not in pvp, you must mean ice shard stab, and it has already been patched. > > > > > 4. feline grace got a competitive reduction already to 3 seconds, and acrobatics means less burst from a thief, so less burst should allow for more sustain..... > > > > > 5. fine nerf those > > > > > 6. if anything needs a cooldown, it's mark > > > > > 7. many weapons go untouched because (1) they only do slow well telegraphed damage, (2) they are only afffective under certain conditions and/or (3) they have high initiative cost unjustified to their effects. The idea was not to lower every damage skill across the board, because they WERE NOT...across the board. > > > > > 8. I don't think you have a real build in mind, but if you do lets see some game play with this eternal intiative busted utility, eternal dodging DE. > > > > > > > > > > I have heard that bunker staff is back, and I actually believe that one is possibly true. > > > > > > > > > > I would trust the claims of mortrialus, and shadowpass for broken thief stuff before this list above. > > > > > > > > > > That and the gameplay from sindrener > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.)If mark needs a cd to prevent 3 things on that list from being exploited than it’s very exploitable. > > > > 2.)doesn’t matter if it’s hard to get 7k on tactical strike it’s still about 2000% the damage of other ccs and no it’s not really that soft... > > > > 3.) yes it is > > > > 4.)feline graced nerfed and yet still 300% perma in combat uptime of vigor??? Make it 100% than claim it needs more burst... > > > > 5.)yes bunker staff/staff is a thing in 2v2s with crit strikes valk and daredevil rube or at least I’ve been running it and most ppl I talked to think it’s one of the better 2v2 builds > > > > 6.)just lol you didn’t name a single expert on thief mechanics and they are more trust worthy than my list of completely exploitable issues atm? Wow > > > > > > 1. You can nerf your mark all you want, but you will be back here asking for them to roll it back. I hope they do nerf it. > > > 2. Yes, it does matter. Also, this is a stealth attack, requires you to flank to get the bonus, and to get that high of damage or access to the attack requires and offensive investment. IT IS FINE. > > > 3. Where does it come from? Which pets, because they apparently all have certain rolls they can drop. > > > 4. If you use dodges or weapon evades or utilities to gain 3 seconds of vigor, I really don't see a problem. It does have a cost. Enhanced vigor from a defensive trait line is fine. > > > 5. I wouldn't be surprised. Staff is a poorly designed weapon. > > > 6. @"bluri.2653" is THE thief expert, I think the mention of him was enough. I say @"shadowpass.4236" because he was pointing out the problems with staff thief accurately, and @"mortrialus.3062" because he and his minions or alts can get thief nerfed like no other. > > > > Again wrong these things aren’t nerfs they are to prevent exploit tooth stab is accessible from every single npcs type in pvp and it can be like 8k base crit damage per that can scale even higher. > > U named 2 non thief mains and videos of Sindrener which mean nothing to me and no even if I did name Sindrener it is still absolute drivel to think that saying it makes these points, which are accurate, invalid. Like with feline grace u say it has a cost to dodge- this is true but has absolutely nothing to do with how the icd allows for perma vigor again it’s just an invalid arguement at least for disproving these points > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stolen_skill/Creature > > seems only "possible" and probably bugged to drop from black bear pet and lashtail > > Why is perma vigor on thief a problem? > > There is no cult of Dan, only one father of thieves. > > Apply for stepdad position, and get to making cool streams > I have an idea send me gold or admit you err wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > > > > > > People arguing here dont even realise that you dont even want thief nerfed but removed some niche edge case mechanic abuse kitten that 99% of the players wont even see let alone be capable of doing themselves > > > > > > > > > Spaming F1 on DE to heal off clones and generate gigaboons is stupid. > > > > > > > > > Stealing into beasts/pets to get 10k dmg nuke that was supposed to be in pve is stupid if not even exploiting. > > > > > > > > > etc etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is no toothbstab in pvp > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You clearly haven’t tested this... tooth stab is possible to get off pets, clones, minions, beast and npcs in for fire... > > > > > > > I’ll tell you this for like for 40th time YOU ARE 100% WRONG On This > > > > > > > > > > > > Golems can probably drop alot, but toothstab is only possible from pve NPCs. > > > > > > > > > > > > Unless black bear pet or lash tail pet is bugged it is impossible in game. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It’s possible on beast and clones and well actually I think there’s something slightly different about drops from foefire npcs so no sure. Again ur wrong on this just go into matches and test it... > > > > > > > > There is already a list compiled man. > > > > > > > > One screen from in match (regular match) will be the only way you prove you are right..but you ain't. > > > > > > > > If you can do it, I'll give you 300 gold. > > > > > > > > Even if you get it from NPCs in foefire > > > > > > Weird becuz you already provided a list where it is and posted here and now it claim it isn’t? Your clearly approaching delusional , why are u even here tbh > > > > Look at the list, you are wrong. > > > > Why not just wreck me and get 300 gold? > > > > Out of curiosity is your alt reda..? > > Weird are u claiming ur own post is wrong? > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > > > > > Mug can't be spammed even if someone decided to waste it on a clone or a pet. > > > > > > > > > > > Ice Shard Stab was already hotfixed. > > > > > > > > > > > CnD won't be abused because it's slow, clunky, relatively buggy and 5 ini just ain't worth it to spam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not true at all let me break it down- > > > > > > > > > > using mark on a clone will most likely kill it and refresh mark immediately, this is 100% risk free spammable and can give an insane amount of boons. > > > > > > > > > > Ice shard was hot fixed but guess what tooth stab wasn’t and it deals the same damage ice shard did. > > > > > > > > > > Sword burst was basically untouched besides autos so now u can just use w.e u have- tactical strike sword 3 or 5 and u get away with it > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You don't nerf a skill that may be abused as a result of other skill usage. Fix mark, don't nerf core. _(also my mark never oneshoted a clone, but I guess it can happen)_ > > > > > > > > > Tooth stab is inaccessible in PvP even on pets, clones and beasts it's a random roll item _(at least I think it's not guaranteed)_, so even if you really happened to get it as stolen item its somewhat of a good reward for wasting your steal in a RNG attempt to get it. > > > > > > > > > Sword burst was never big to begin with, it's not even a burst set, the fact you can use CnD which happens to have higher dmg than its other skills doesn't magically make it bursty, almost all other professions have about two skills on most weapon sets that hit harder than other weapon skills on the same weapon, it's their purpose. It's simply intended to have some weapon skills hit harder than other skills on that weapon, that's why they cost more to use _(or have higher CD, etc.)_. > > > > > > > > > CnD simply never was a dangerous nor spammable skill, I don't deny that you might have a different experience, but in my time I've never seen it be useful for anything than very very very occasional combo with steal and even then it randomly didn't land, anytime some Thief attempted to spam it I just undamaged him without even having to dodge. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tooth stab is not inaccessible in pvp and 2 hits from that would ko most targets and that’s obviously busted. > > > > > > > > My suggestion to add an icd wouldnt affect core builds at all- just put a 5 sec icd on mug etc. to make sure mark doesn’t abuse it and because 5 secs isn’t enough for daredevil or core to get steal back it wouldn’t impact them. > > > > > > > > And yeah with de ur goona have to spam something with initiative and having a random skill busted is no bueno, but you can disagree it’s w.e > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How do you access tooth stab in PvP? > > > > > > > > > > > > I think he must mean ice shard stab, and it was already fixed. > > > > > > > > > > > > **Ice Shard Stab: Fixed an issue in which the damage increase for this skill was applied in all game modes instead of only PvE.** > > > > > > > > > > No I don’t mean ice shard. Tooth stab also has this bug and was not patched, it is a random roll item from beast etc and it can upper limit of 10k per which is busted and will 2 hit ko ppl. > > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > All these resources are abusable! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.) mug or mark require a rework or icd, as it can be used endlessly on clones downed targets or pets for insane boons or healing > > > > > > > 2.) tactical strike needs a huge nerf to bring it inline, as it is a cc that can do up to 7k on DE > > > > > > > 3.) tooth stab can do 10k per plz fix > > > > > > > Other stuff of lower but still very high priority > > > > > > > 4.) feline grace needs a real icd, in addition to icds for bountiful theft and possibly be quick or be killed, becuz why is there an option that may be permanent boons/stat boost > > > > > > > 5.) M7 probably gives too much initiative and when combined with mercy I can give permanent full initiative > > > > > > > 6.) same problem with mark and mug- thrill of the crime needs icd reason already stated > > > > > > > 7.) many weapon skills damage not touched like cloak and dagger and this will be taken advantage of. where as the change to sw/d 3 is logical because at least flanking strike was nerfed, but maybe do something to prevent larcenous strike spam also Becuz that will also be taken advantage/spammed which isn’t skillful. > > > > > > > 8.) besides Deadeye builds that are busted with mark spam crit strikes dps and for some builds even the utility is starting to be very busted > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think I can go on and on actually but these things especially the first 3 should be hot fixed immediately. Also hopefully the comment section will be full of things that are just busted on thief atm as I’m sure there’s plenty > > > > > > > > > > > > Ill go through the list. > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. if anything needs a cooldown, it would be mark. > > > > > > 2. tactical strike is soft cc, and 7k is very unlikely without plenty of qualifiers, meaning it will never happen in normal play alone even on zerk. > > > > > > 3. Tooth stab is not in pvp, you must mean ice shard stab, and it has already been patched. > > > > > > 4. feline grace got a competitive reduction already to 3 seconds, and acrobatics means less burst from a thief, so less burst should allow for more sustain..... > > > > > > 5. fine nerf those > > > > > > 6. if anything needs a cooldown, it's mark > > > > > > 7. many weapons go untouched because (1) they only do slow well telegraphed damage, (2) they are only afffective under certain conditions and/or (3) they have high initiative cost unjustified to their effects. The idea was not to lower every damage skill across the board, because they WERE NOT...across the board. > > > > > > 8. I don't think you have a real build in mind, but if you do lets see some game play with this eternal intiative busted utility, eternal dodging DE. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have heard that bunker staff is back, and I actually believe that one is possibly true. > > > > > > > > > > > > I would trust the claims of mortrialus, and shadowpass for broken thief stuff before this list above. > > > > > > > > > > > > That and the gameplay from sindrener > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.)If mark needs a cd to prevent 3 things on that list from being exploited than it’s very exploitable. > > > > > 2.)doesn’t matter if it’s hard to get 7k on tactical strike it’s still about 2000% the damage of other ccs and no it’s not really that soft... > > > > > 3.) yes it is > > > > > 4.)feline graced nerfed and yet still 300% perma in combat uptime of vigor??? Make it 100% than claim it needs more burst... > > > > > 5.)yes bunker staff/staff is a thing in 2v2s with crit strikes valk and daredevil rube or at least I’ve been running it and most ppl I talked to think it’s one of the better 2v2 builds > > > > > 6.)just lol you didn’t name a single expert on thief mechanics and they are more trust worthy than my list of completely exploitable issues atm? Wow > > > > > > > > 1. You can nerf your mark all you want, but you will be back here asking for them to roll it back. I hope they do nerf it. > > > > 2. Yes, it does matter. Also, this is a stealth attack, requires you to flank to get the bonus, and to get that high of damage or access to the attack requires and offensive investment. IT IS FINE. > > > > 3. Where does it come from? Which pets, because they apparently all have certain rolls they can drop. > > > > 4. If you use dodges or weapon evades or utilities to gain 3 seconds of vigor, I really don't see a problem. It does have a cost. Enhanced vigor from a defensive trait line is fine. > > > > 5. I wouldn't be surprised. Staff is a poorly designed weapon. > > > > 6. @"bluri.2653" is THE thief expert, I think the mention of him was enough. I say @"shadowpass.4236" because he was pointing out the problems with staff thief accurately, and @"mortrialus.3062" because he and his minions or alts can get thief nerfed like no other. > > > > > > Again wrong these things aren’t nerfs they are to prevent exploit tooth stab is accessible from every single npcs type in pvp and it can be like 8k base crit damage per that can scale even higher. > > > U named 2 non thief mains and videos of Sindrener which mean nothing to me and no even if I did name Sindrener it is still absolute drivel to think that saying it makes these points, which are accurate, invalid. Like with feline grace u say it has a cost to dodge- this is true but has absolutely nothing to do with how the icd allows for perma vigor again it’s just an invalid arguement at least for disproving these points > > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stolen_skill/Creature > > > > seems only "possible" and probably bugged to drop from black bear pet and lashtail > > > > Why is perma vigor on thief a problem? > > > > There is no cult of Dan, only one father of thieves. > > > > Apply for stepdad position, and get to making cool streams > > > > I have an idea send me gold or admit you err wrong Black bear and lashtail are separate from pets after "testing". Not surprising after the wiki also explains that. One screen and the loot is yours. I hope you are not getting mad at me, let's keep it civil. If I'm a bad player, it won't change if I am right or wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > > Mug can't be spammed even if someone decided to waste it on a clone or a pet. > > > > > > > > Ice Shard Stab was already hotfixed. > > > > > > > > CnD won't be abused because it's slow, clunky, relatively buggy and 5 ini just ain't worth it to spam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not true at all let me break it down- > > > > > > > using mark on a clone will most likely kill it and refresh mark immediately, this is 100% risk free spammable and can give an insane amount of boons. > > > > > > > Ice shard was hot fixed but guess what tooth stab wasn’t and it deals the same damage ice shard did. > > > > > > > Sword burst was basically untouched besides autos so now u can just use w.e u have- tactical strike sword 3 or 5 and u get away with it > > > > > > > > > > > > You don't nerf a skill that may be abused as a result of other skill usage. Fix mark, don't nerf core. _(also my mark never oneshoted a clone, but I guess it can happen)_ > > > > > > Tooth stab is inaccessible in PvP even on pets, clones and beasts it's a random roll item _(at least I think it's not guaranteed)_, so even if you really happened to get it as stolen item its somewhat of a good reward for wasting your steal in a RNG attempt to get it. > > > > > > Sword burst was never big to begin with, it's not even a burst set, the fact you can use CnD which happens to have higher dmg than its other skills doesn't magically make it bursty, almost all other professions have about two skills on most weapon sets that hit harder than other weapon skills on the same weapon, it's their purpose. It's simply intended to have some weapon skills hit harder than other skills on that weapon, that's why they cost more to use _(or have higher CD, etc.)_. > > > > > > CnD simply never was a dangerous nor spammable skill, I don't deny that you might have a different experience, but in my time I've never seen it be useful for anything than very very very occasional combo with steal and even then it randomly didn't land, anytime some Thief attempted to spam it I just undamaged him without even having to dodge. > > > > > > > > > > Tooth stab is not inaccessible in pvp and 2 hits from that would ko most targets and that’s obviously busted. > > > > > My suggestion to add an icd wouldnt affect core builds at all- just put a 5 sec icd on mug etc. to make sure mark doesn’t abuse it and because 5 secs isn’t enough for daredevil or core to get steal back it wouldn’t impact them. > > > > > And yeah with de ur goona have to spam something with initiative and having a random skill busted is no bueno, but you can disagree it’s w.e > > > > > > > > How do you access tooth stab in PvP? > > > > > > I think he must mean ice shard stab, and it was already fixed. > > > > > > **Ice Shard Stab: Fixed an issue in which the damage increase for this skill was applied in all game modes instead of only PvE.** > > > > No I don’t mean ice shard. Tooth stab also has this bug and was not patched, it is a random roll item from beast etc and it can upper limit of 10k per which is busted and will 2 hit ko ppl. > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > All these resources are abusable! > > > > > > > > 1.) mug or mark require a rework or icd, as it can be used endlessly on clones downed targets or pets for insane boons or healing > > > > 2.) tactical strike needs a huge nerf to bring it inline, as it is a cc that can do up to 7k on DE > > > > 3.) tooth stab can do 10k per plz fix > > > > Other stuff of lower but still very high priority > > > > 4.) feline grace needs a real icd, in addition to icds for bountiful theft and possibly be quick or be killed, becuz why is there an option that may be permanent boons/stat boost > > > > 5.) M7 probably gives too much initiative and when combined with mercy I can give permanent full initiative > > > > 6.) same problem with mark and mug- thrill of the crime needs icd reason already stated > > > > 7.) many weapon skills damage not touched like cloak and dagger and this will be taken advantage of. where as the change to sw/d 3 is logical because at least flanking strike was nerfed, but maybe do something to prevent larcenous strike spam also Becuz that will also be taken advantage/spammed which isn’t skillful. > > > > 8.) besides Deadeye builds that are busted with mark spam crit strikes dps and for some builds even the utility is starting to be very busted > > > > > > > > I think I can go on and on actually but these things especially the first 3 should be hot fixed immediately. Also hopefully the comment section will be full of things that are just busted on thief atm as I’m sure there’s plenty > > > > > > Ill go through the list. > > > > > > 1. if anything needs a cooldown, it would be mark. > > > 2. tactical strike is soft cc, and 7k is very unlikely without plenty of qualifiers, meaning it will never happen in normal play alone even on zerk. > > > 3. Tooth stab is not in pvp, you must mean ice shard stab, and it has already been patched. > > > 4. feline grace got a competitive reduction already to 3 seconds, and acrobatics means less burst from a thief, so less burst should allow for more sustain..... > > > 5. fine nerf those > > > 6. if anything needs a cooldown, it's mark > > > 7. many weapons go untouched because (1) they only do slow well telegraphed damage, (2) they are only afffective under certain conditions and/or (3) they have high initiative cost unjustified to their effects. The idea was not to lower every damage skill across the board, because they WERE NOT...across the board. > > > 8. I don't think you have a real build in mind, but if you do lets see some game play with this eternal intiative busted utility, eternal dodging DE. > > > > > > I have heard that bunker staff is back, and I actually believe that one is possibly true. > > > > > > I would trust the claims of mortrialus, and shadowpass for broken thief stuff before this list above. > > > > > > That and the gameplay from sindrener > > > > > > > > > > 1.)If mark needs a cd to prevent 3 things on that list from being exploited than it’s very exploitable. > > 2.)doesn’t matter if it’s hard to get 7k on tactical strike it’s still about 2000% the damage of other ccs and no it’s not really that soft... > > 3.) yes it is > > 4.)feline graced nerfed and yet still 300% perma in combat uptime of vigor??? Make it 100% than claim it needs more burst... > > 5.)yes bunker staff/staff is a thing in 2v2s with crit strikes valk and daredevil rube or at least I’ve been running it and most ppl I talked to think it’s one of the better 2v2 builds > > 6.)just lol you didn’t name a single expert on thief mechanics and they are more trust worthy than my list of completely exploitable issues atm? Wow > > 1. You can nerf your mark all you want, but you will be back here asking for them to roll it back. I hope they do nerf it. > 2. Yes, it does matter. Also, this is a stealth attack, requires you to flank to get the bonus, and to get that high of damage or access to the attack requires and offensive investment. IT IS FINE. > 3. Where does it come from? Which pets, because they apparently all have certain rolls they can drop. > 4. If you use dodges or weapon evades or utilities to gain 3 seconds of vigor, I really don't see a problem. It does have a cost. Enhanced vigor from a defensive trait line is fine. > 5. I wouldn't be surprised. Staff is a poorly designed weapon. > 6. @"bluri.2653" is THE thief expert, I think the mention of him was enough. I say @"shadowpass.4236" because he was pointing out the problems with staff thief accurately, and @"mortrialus.3062" because he and his minions or alts can get thief nerfed like no other. I don't have minions, I have clones and phantasms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArlAlt.1630 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > > > > Mug can't be spammed even if someone decided to waste it on a clone or a pet. > > > > > > > > > Ice Shard Stab was already hotfixed. > > > > > > > > > CnD won't be abused because it's slow, clunky, relatively buggy and 5 ini just ain't worth it to spam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not true at all let me break it down- > > > > > > > > using mark on a clone will most likely kill it and refresh mark immediately, this is 100% risk free spammable and can give an insane amount of boons. > > > > > > > > Ice shard was hot fixed but guess what tooth stab wasn’t and it deals the same damage ice shard did. > > > > > > > > Sword burst was basically untouched besides autos so now u can just use w.e u have- tactical strike sword 3 or 5 and u get away with it > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You don't nerf a skill that may be abused as a result of other skill usage. Fix mark, don't nerf core. _(also my mark never oneshoted a clone, but I guess it can happen)_ > > > > > > > Tooth stab is inaccessible in PvP even on pets, clones and beasts it's a random roll item _(at least I think it's not guaranteed)_, so even if you really happened to get it as stolen item its somewhat of a good reward for wasting your steal in a RNG attempt to get it. > > > > > > > Sword burst was never big to begin with, it's not even a burst set, the fact you can use CnD which happens to have higher dmg than its other skills doesn't magically make it bursty, almost all other professions have about two skills on most weapon sets that hit harder than other weapon skills on the same weapon, it's their purpose. It's simply intended to have some weapon skills hit harder than other skills on that weapon, that's why they cost more to use _(or have higher CD, etc.)_. > > > > > > > CnD simply never was a dangerous nor spammable skill, I don't deny that you might have a different experience, but in my time I've never seen it be useful for anything than very very very occasional combo with steal and even then it randomly didn't land, anytime some Thief attempted to spam it I just undamaged him without even having to dodge. > > > > > > > > > > > > Tooth stab is not inaccessible in pvp and 2 hits from that would ko most targets and that’s obviously busted. > > > > > > My suggestion to add an icd wouldnt affect core builds at all- just put a 5 sec icd on mug etc. to make sure mark doesn’t abuse it and because 5 secs isn’t enough for daredevil or core to get steal back it wouldn’t impact them. > > > > > > And yeah with de ur goona have to spam something with initiative and having a random skill busted is no bueno, but you can disagree it’s w.e > > > > > > > > > > How do you access tooth stab in PvP? > > > > > > > > I think he must mean ice shard stab, and it was already fixed. > > > > > > > > **Ice Shard Stab: Fixed an issue in which the damage increase for this skill was applied in all game modes instead of only PvE.** > > > > > > No I don’t mean ice shard. Tooth stab also has this bug and was not patched, it is a random roll item from beast etc and it can upper limit of 10k per which is busted and will 2 hit ko ppl. > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > All these resources are abusable! > > > > > > > > > > 1.) mug or mark require a rework or icd, as it can be used endlessly on clones downed targets or pets for insane boons or healing > > > > > 2.) tactical strike needs a huge nerf to bring it inline, as it is a cc that can do up to 7k on DE > > > > > 3.) tooth stab can do 10k per plz fix > > > > > Other stuff of lower but still very high priority > > > > > 4.) feline grace needs a real icd, in addition to icds for bountiful theft and possibly be quick or be killed, becuz why is there an option that may be permanent boons/stat boost > > > > > 5.) M7 probably gives too much initiative and when combined with mercy I can give permanent full initiative > > > > > 6.) same problem with mark and mug- thrill of the crime needs icd reason already stated > > > > > 7.) many weapon skills damage not touched like cloak and dagger and this will be taken advantage of. where as the change to sw/d 3 is logical because at least flanking strike was nerfed, but maybe do something to prevent larcenous strike spam also Becuz that will also be taken advantage/spammed which isn’t skillful. > > > > > 8.) besides Deadeye builds that are busted with mark spam crit strikes dps and for some builds even the utility is starting to be very busted > > > > > > > > > > I think I can go on and on actually but these things especially the first 3 should be hot fixed immediately. Also hopefully the comment section will be full of things that are just busted on thief atm as I’m sure there’s plenty > > > > > > > > Ill go through the list. > > > > > > > > 1. if anything needs a cooldown, it would be mark. > > > > 2. tactical strike is soft cc, and 7k is very unlikely without plenty of qualifiers, meaning it will never happen in normal play alone even on zerk. > > > > 3. Tooth stab is not in pvp, you must mean ice shard stab, and it has already been patched. > > > > 4. feline grace got a competitive reduction already to 3 seconds, and acrobatics means less burst from a thief, so less burst should allow for more sustain..... > > > > 5. fine nerf those > > > > 6. if anything needs a cooldown, it's mark > > > > 7. many weapons go untouched because (1) they only do slow well telegraphed damage, (2) they are only afffective under certain conditions and/or (3) they have high initiative cost unjustified to their effects. The idea was not to lower every damage skill across the board, because they WERE NOT...across the board. > > > > 8. I don't think you have a real build in mind, but if you do lets see some game play with this eternal intiative busted utility, eternal dodging DE. > > > > > > > > I have heard that bunker staff is back, and I actually believe that one is possibly true. > > > > > > > > I would trust the claims of mortrialus, and shadowpass for broken thief stuff before this list above. > > > > > > > > That and the gameplay from sindrener > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1.)If mark needs a cd to prevent 3 things on that list from being exploited than it’s very exploitable. > > > 2.)doesn’t matter if it’s hard to get 7k on tactical strike it’s still about 2000% the damage of other ccs and no it’s not really that soft... > > > 3.) yes it is > > > 4.)feline graced nerfed and yet still 300% perma in combat uptime of vigor??? Make it 100% than claim it needs more burst... > > > 5.)yes bunker staff/staff is a thing in 2v2s with crit strikes valk and daredevil rube or at least I’ve been running it and most ppl I talked to think it’s one of the better 2v2 builds > > > 6.)just lol you didn’t name a single expert on thief mechanics and they are more trust worthy than my list of completely exploitable issues atm? Wow > > > > 1. You can nerf your mark all you want, but you will be back here asking for them to roll it back. I hope they do nerf it. > > 2. Yes, it does matter. Also, this is a stealth attack, requires you to flank to get the bonus, and to get that high of damage or access to the attack requires and offensive investment. IT IS FINE. > > 3. Where does it come from? Which pets, because they apparently all have certain rolls they can drop. > > 4. If you use dodges or weapon evades or utilities to gain 3 seconds of vigor, I really don't see a problem. It does have a cost. Enhanced vigor from a defensive trait line is fine. > > 5. I wouldn't be surprised. Staff is a poorly designed weapon. > > 6. @"bluri.2653" is THE thief expert, I think the mention of him was enough. I say @"shadowpass.4236" because he was pointing out the problems with staff thief accurately, and @"mortrialus.3062" because he and his minions or alts can get thief nerfed like no other. > > I don't have minions, I have clones and phantasms. Oh snap, was I just relegated to phantasm? ANet rework me, please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. > > Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston Okah so thief can bit hard on a 33% chance roll if we steal beast in forest. That is 1 of 3 possible drops from only chief I'll send the gold but where are the pet and clone steals? (Give me 10 hours I'm out from pc) You are exaggerating 100% bro Edit...so I was right about yu being red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. > > > > Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp > > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston > > Okah so thief can bit hard on a 33% chance roll if we steal beast in forest. > > That is 1 of 3 possible drops from only chief > > I'll send the gold but where are the pet and clone steals? (Give me 10 hours I'm out from pc) > > You are exaggerating 100% bro > > > Edit...so I was right about yu being red Actually At least for staff/staff thief it appears to be an under exaggeration as I’m getting 11k minimum burst implying much more than 10k at max possibly 13 or 15 https://share.icloud.com/photos/0OfVto3rXESiIozgBGg4Ryqew#Houston Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. > > > > > > Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp > > > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston > > > > Okah so thief can bit hard on a 33% chance roll if we steal beast in forest. > > > > That is 1 of 3 possible drops from only chief > > > > I'll send the gold but where are the pet and clone steals? (Give me 10 hours I'm out from pc) > > > > You are exaggerating 100% bro > > > > > > Edit...so I was right about yu being red > > Actually At least for staff/staff thief it appears to be an under exaggeration as I’m getting 11k minimum burst implying much more than 10k at max possibly 13 or 15 > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0OfVto3rXESiIozgBGg4Ryqew#Houston No, meant whole post. I can do 14k on broke bundles Cant you do imgur..I'm on mobile lok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 So now staff thief is a issue lmao these players man are something else. U guys literally won't stop qqing until thief has zero viable builds. It's funny how top players played sd for a yr cuz was only competitive build, than a staff build came around that was good oh better nerf qq about and then came the nerfs to it lol so back to sd. Then came condi DD that was effective around same time oh better nerf qq about it then the nerfs came for it. Than dp recently oh oh again better nerf qq about it,than the nerfs came. Now top thief's are speculating sd will prob be meta agin lmao. But again a staff build may be decent so oh oh better nerf qq about it so it gets nerfed. No wonder this games population is dead, the team doesn't have to think of ways to mindlessly nerf classes and destroy build diversity as it's own players can direct them to do so and they just gotta follow suit lol. The ironic thing is all the qq's about poor build deversity lol. This community deserves this game lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nashada.9436 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You want to nerf thief more? kitten, some peeps are seriously so confused in the head lmao > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Where are nerfs the first 3 and most of the others are either - exploitable but not mechanically necessary, unintended or out of line with all the other changes... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is no confusion these are all things that just illogical and actually has nothing to with nerfs tbh, again either out of line, unintended or exploitable... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I doubt you play thief > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lol I main thief > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I’ve been playing thief for past 4 seasons every time in plat3+ solo Qing and before that in core. Did anything here talk about backstab needing a nerf? I want to avoid skills that are busted resource wise and I don’t think any of them would affect backstab besides crits, which is more a suggestion for the future not something really a concern yet.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And is anything I said on paper incorrect? No not really... what are u even trying to say- w.e it is you clearly aren’t even communicating with proper English lol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's ridiculous that you're advocating for Thief nerfs when you main the class, especially after recent balance patches and the fact we're outclassed by almost everything unless you put a lot more effort into what you're doing. Maybe what you're saying is true to some minuscule extent, but the fact you're complaining about Thief of all things when the glaring issues post-patch are the fact that everything revolves around bunker/condi and that Necro is so exceedingly broken that it's dominating 2v2s. So once again, I doubt you main Thief. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If u read anything in this discussion it isn’t about nerfing and it’s not a nerf thief thread as that implies I think it’s over performing in some way which is a separate matter and tbh I generally avoid those topic entirely. This is mostly about exploitable and unintended changes and balance in general which any thief main should think about before random classes you think are over performing. Basically a real thief main should be worried about unintended results of class mechanics as this will prevent non thief mains or other thief mains from being forced to play something that is unintendly overperforming in some categories for no logical reason. > > > > > > > > > > > Tbh why would I be goading over nerf necro thread if I’m a thief main and there’s clearly something I can do to provide accurate feedback on my classes interaction in pvp. To say otherwise seems more like random hate mail and completely unconstructive. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nothing you mentioned seemed remotely exploitable, otherwise, these things would be exploited..? Lol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yet on paper they all are and even some are completely unintended and can have huge impact. So you are proven wrong. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "on paper" this "on paper" that > > > > > > > > You really have no idea what you're talking about, huh? Show me a video of you 'abusing' said mechanics and I'll believe you play Thief lol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No I really don’t have to post a video this forum discussion has nothing to do with videos and mentioning so is where you are very very wrong. Facts don’t lie and I don’t have to post a video when u can look up the numbers and calculate these things on your own > > > > > > > > > > > > So basically you're pulling things out of thin air? Cool, good to know. > > > > > > > > > > Nah u just saying random stuff. I have an idea why don’t u post a video that proves I don’t play thief think about it is it possible to prove with a video becuz that’s u post rn... > > > > > > > > 1. That entire reply barely even made sense. > > > > 2. If you propose an argument for something then give ample evidence to prove your point, especially when multiple people already pointed out how what you were saying is wrong > > > > > > 1.)u never made arguement > > > 2.) as I recall most post on this thread were good and most ppl who said something was incorrect had completely invalid arguements- such as a short icd will mess up core mechanics when in reality even with swindlers equilibrium there will never be a time you get steal back in less than 5s, and therefore is invalid > > > Again most post were positive until like your random ones and ones with absolutely invalid arguements like saying tooth stab isn’t in pvp, which is wrong. > > > Ben himself said balance recommendations need to be logical. If some idiot comes here sperging and posting random stuff that means absolutely nothing to me... > > > > If you fail to see my argument in the last few replies then you’re dense. > > An arguement is your wrong because so and so. U came here and just said you are wrong. Hence why you don’t have an argument or I guess as you claim that you do than you just have an arguement which is invalid, which is pretty silly. In fact most of your post are clearly a joke as you think I need to prove that I play thief and post videos of it to prove that your already invalid arguement is no more than random trolling My argument is for you to back up your claims. Don't talk to me about " the facts being on paper" and show me solid evidence of you performing the aforementioned exploits. If you cannot abuse the listed mechanics then there is no reason to put effort into fixing something that doesn't need to be fixed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > So now staff thief is a issue lmao these players man are something else. U guys literally won't stop qqing until thief has zero viable builds. It's funny how top players played sd for a yr cuz was only competitive build, than a staff build came around that was good oh better nerf qq about and then came the nerfs to it lol so back to sd. Then came condi DD that was effective around same time oh better nerf qq about it then the nerfs came for it. Than dp recently oh oh again better nerf qq about it,than the nerfs came. Now top thief's are speculating sd will prob be meta agin lmao. But again a staff build may be decent so oh oh better nerf qq about it so it gets nerfed. No wonder this games population is dead, the team doesn't have to think of ways to mindlessly nerf classes and destroy build diversity as it's own players can direct them to do so and they just gotta follow suit lol. The ironic thing is all the qq's about poor build deversity lol. > This community deserves this game lol. Idk really know what to make of this post tbh > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. > > > > > > Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp > > > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston > > > > Okah so thief can bit hard on a 33% chance roll if we steal beast in forest. > > > > That is 1 of 3 possible drops from only chief > > > > I'll send the gold but where are the pet and clone steals? (Give me 10 hours I'm out from pc) > > > > You are exaggerating 100% bro > > > > > > Edit...so I was right about yu being red > > Actually At least for staff/staff thief it appears to be an under exaggeration as I’m getting 11k minimum burst implying much more than 10k at max possibly 13 or 15 > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0OfVto3rXESiIozgBGg4Ryqew#Houston The only thing really mentioned about staff thief was tooth stab which is available on every thief build with steal or swipe and it is unintentionally doing much more damage than it should as it wasn’t hot fixed with ice shard. It is a pretty solid build for 2v2s rn yeah but only reason it was mentioned is because it has different dmg coefficients that push tooth stab into a new zone of spike damage compared to other builds.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You want to nerf thief more? kitten, some peeps are seriously so confused in the head lmao > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Where are nerfs the first 3 and most of the others are either - exploitable but not mechanically necessary, unintended or out of line with all the other changes... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is no confusion these are all things that just illogical and actually has nothing to with nerfs tbh, again either out of line, unintended or exploitable... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I doubt you play thief > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lol I main thief > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I’ve been playing thief for past 4 seasons every time in plat3+ solo Qing and before that in core. Did anything here talk about backstab needing a nerf? I want to avoid skills that are busted resource wise and I don’t think any of them would affect backstab besides crits, which is more a suggestion for the future not something really a concern yet.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And is anything I said on paper incorrect? No not really... what are u even trying to say- w.e it is you clearly aren’t even communicating with proper English lol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's ridiculous that you're advocating for Thief nerfs when you main the class, especially after recent balance patches and the fact we're outclassed by almost everything unless you put a lot more effort into what you're doing. Maybe what you're saying is true to some minuscule extent, but the fact you're complaining about Thief of all things when the glaring issues post-patch are the fact that everything revolves around bunker/condi and that Necro is so exceedingly broken that it's dominating 2v2s. So once again, I doubt you main Thief. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If u read anything in this discussion it isn’t about nerfing and it’s not a nerf thief thread as that implies I think it’s over performing in some way which is a separate matter and tbh I generally avoid those topic entirely. This is mostly about exploitable and unintended changes and balance in general which any thief main should think about before random classes you think are over performing. Basically a real thief main should be worried about unintended results of class mechanics as this will prevent non thief mains or other thief mains from being forced to play something that is unintendly overperforming in some categories for no logical reason. > > > > > > > > > > > > Tbh why would I be goading over nerf necro thread if I’m a thief main and there’s clearly something I can do to provide accurate feedback on my classes interaction in pvp. To say otherwise seems more like random hate mail and completely unconstructive. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nothing you mentioned seemed remotely exploitable, otherwise, these things would be exploited..? Lol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yet on paper they all are and even some are completely unintended and can have huge impact. So you are proven wrong. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "on paper" this "on paper" that > > > > > > > > > You really have no idea what you're talking about, huh? Show me a video of you 'abusing' said mechanics and I'll believe you play Thief lol > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No I really don’t have to post a video this forum discussion has nothing to do with videos and mentioning so is where you are very very wrong. Facts don’t lie and I don’t have to post a video when u can look up the numbers and calculate these things on your own > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So basically you're pulling things out of thin air? Cool, good to know. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nah u just saying random stuff. I have an idea why don’t u post a video that proves I don’t play thief think about it is it possible to prove with a video becuz that’s u post rn... > > > > > > > > > > 1. That entire reply barely even made sense. > > > > > 2. If you propose an argument for something then give ample evidence to prove your point, especially when multiple people already pointed out how what you were saying is wrong > > > > > > > > 1.)u never made arguement > > > > 2.) as I recall most post on this thread were good and most ppl who said something was incorrect had completely invalid arguements- such as a short icd will mess up core mechanics when in reality even with swindlers equilibrium there will never be a time you get steal back in less than 5s, and therefore is invalid > > > > Again most post were positive until like your random ones and ones with absolutely invalid arguements like saying tooth stab isn’t in pvp, which is wrong. > > > > Ben himself said balance recommendations need to be logical. If some idiot comes here sperging and posting random stuff that means absolutely nothing to me... > > > > > > If you fail to see my argument in the last few replies then you’re dense. > > > > An arguement is your wrong because so and so. U came here and just said you are wrong. Hence why you don’t have an argument or I guess as you claim that you do than you just have an arguement which is invalid, which is pretty silly. In fact most of your post are clearly a joke as you think I need to prove that I play thief and post videos of it to prove that your already invalid arguement is no more than random trolling > > My argument is for you to back up your claims. Don't talk to me about " the facts being on paper" and show me solid evidence of you performing the aforementioned exploits. If you cannot abuse the listed mechanics then there is no reason to put effort into fixing something that doesn't need to be fixed That is no arguement I think you need to revisit 5th grade english Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 2, 2020 Author Share Posted March 2, 2020 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. > > > > Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp > > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston > > > > I'll send the gold > > You are exaggerating 100% bro > > > Edit...so I was right about yu being red I haven’t gotten the gold yet lol. As far as topic of this being an exaggeration- tbh thief isn’t even that busted rn except in my opinion that stuff like crit strikes builds can still basically just run around and depend on damage modifiers to just get off giant backstabs or say vaults if your staff thief, which is also like one of the only problems with ranger and that some pets are op cuz not touched and u see lots of calls for those to be fixed... So if it’s not that broken the only thing we need for balance is to get rid of things that if u look at numbers are out of line right? Not to nerf thief becuz then thief won’t be viable. So for thief balance just look at things like I have listed becuz any actual nerf will make thief too weak to play in the new meta. A lot aren’t new per say but they are still the only things that are abusable rn resource wise and no one should have infinite resources right? Like how core necro can live forever and randomly still do damage via lich form though obviously not on that level but still these seem to be the only things that need to be looked at immediately am I not correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotte in space.2158 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 > @"Nashada.9436" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > It's ridiculous that you're advocating for Thief nerfs when you main the class It deserves respect when somebody tries to have an objective opinion instead of a selfish egoistic self-defending one. And you call that ridiculous ? . . . you still have a lot to learn ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. > > > > > > Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp > > > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston > > > > > > > > I'll send the gold > > > > You are exaggerating 100% bro > > > > > > Edit...so I was right about yu being red > > I haven’t gotten the gold yet lol. > As far as topic of this being an exaggeration- tbh thief isn’t even that busted rn except in my opinion that stuff like crit strikes builds can still basically just run around and depend on damage modifiers to just get off giant backstabs or say vaults if your staff thief, which is also like one of the only problems with ranger and that some pets are op cuz not touched and u see lots of calls for those to be fixed... > So if it’s not that broken the only thing we need for balance is to get rid of things that if u look at numbers are out of line right? Not to nerf thief becuz then thief won’t be viable. So for thief balance just look at things like I have listed becuz any actual nerf will make thief too weak to play in the new meta. A lot aren’t new per say but they are still the only things that are abusable rn resource wise and no one should have infinite resources right? Like how core necro can live forever and randomly still do damage via lich form though obviously not on that level but still these seem to be the only things that need to be looked at immediately am I not correct? Forum account or red? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted March 2, 2020 Author Share Posted March 2, 2020 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. > > > > > > > > Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp > > > > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston > > > > > > > > > > > > I'll send the gold > > > > > > You are exaggerating 100% bro > > > > > > > > > Edit...so I was right about yu being red > > > > I haven’t gotten the gold yet lol. > > As far as topic of this being an exaggeration- tbh thief isn’t even that busted rn except in my opinion that stuff like crit strikes builds can still basically just run around and depend on damage modifiers to just get off giant backstabs or say vaults if your staff thief, which is also like one of the only problems with ranger and that some pets are op cuz not touched and u see lots of calls for those to be fixed... > > So if it’s not that broken the only thing we need for balance is to get rid of things that if u look at numbers are out of line right? Not to nerf thief becuz then thief won’t be viable. So for thief balance just look at things like I have listed becuz any actual nerf will make thief too weak to play in the new meta. A lot aren’t new per say but they are still the only things that are abusable rn resource wise and no one should have infinite resources right? Like how core necro can live forever and randomly still do damage via lich form though obviously not on that level but still these seem to be the only things that need to be looked at immediately am I not correct? > > Forum account or red? Either as they are both mine. I would probably transfer all my gold to one of my accounts Eventually once I decide which one need a new legendary or something like it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > > > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > > > Fine, first person to post a video in a real match getting toothstab as a stolen bundle I'll give 500 gold to. > > > > > > > > > > Look I went into a 5v5 server just to test and walked to chieftain and did 3 swipes and got it proving my point it is a random roll item on npcs in pvp > > > > > https://share.icloud.com/photos/0d9wyYVMmQxX3UivRWx4ueGwQ#Houston > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'll send the gold > > > > > > > > You are exaggerating 100% bro > > > > > > > > > > > > Edit...so I was right about yu being red > > > > > > I haven’t gotten the gold yet lol. > > > As far as topic of this being an exaggeration- tbh thief isn’t even that busted rn except in my opinion that stuff like crit strikes builds can still basically just run around and depend on damage modifiers to just get off giant backstabs or say vaults if your staff thief, which is also like one of the only problems with ranger and that some pets are op cuz not touched and u see lots of calls for those to be fixed... > > > So if it’s not that broken the only thing we need for balance is to get rid of things that if u look at numbers are out of line right? Not to nerf thief becuz then thief won’t be viable. So for thief balance just look at things like I have listed becuz any actual nerf will make thief too weak to play in the new meta. A lot aren’t new per say but they are still the only things that are abusable rn resource wise and no one should have infinite resources right? Like how core necro can live forever and randomly still do damage via lich form though obviously not on that level but still these seem to be the only things that need to be looked at immediately am I not correct? > > > > Forum account or red? > > Either as they are both mine. I would probably transfer all my gold to one of my accounts Eventually once I decide which one need a new legendary or something like it sent to this account Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exitus.3297 Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 It's funny you think Thieves are the problem in this patch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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