LucianTheAngelic.7054

> @"Aeolus.3615" said:

> if its focus will be heavy on blint/teleports and stealth, wich imo rev doesnt need much.

>

There’s not a single focus in the game that has a blink/teleport or stealth as one of its skills, so not sure why you assume a revenant getting focus would have to have a teleport or stealth attached to it

Deadeye is one of those matchups in WvW where they really shouldn’t lose to any class 1v1 unless they let themselves lose/are bad. The insane amount of stealth and mobility that class has, including the ability to nullify reveal, makes it one of the best 1v1 specs when played well since it can just nope the fuck out of pretty much any bad situation provided the deadeye doesn’t overcommit. If you can get them to overcommit though you can win these fights as a power rev, but that to me just means they’re a bad deadeye. The good ones won’t ever die, even if they can’t kill you.

> @"Chaos.7614" said:

> > @"Fueki.4753" said:

> > If we were channel the Mists' memories of a ruling monarch, wouldn't make Sceptre more sense than Greatchunk?

> >

> > It's more in depth than most other Revenant Greatchunk threads (that I've read), but it still feels like nothing more than _a spec for the sake of the Greatchunk._

>

> Maybe, but the idea of a scepter holding royal authority is too passive for a figure like Usoku. I'm also not the biggest fan of giving a class starved for skills a weapon that would only give 3 compared to 5. The only way I can see scepter working is if they introduce legend-specific effects on a scepter mainhand skills and retroactively apply that to offhands, since we only have 2 offhand weapons.

Solution here is easy: give it scepter + focus. Spellbreaker already got mainhand and offhand dagger, which are technically different weapons, so it’s been done before

>

> The way I see it, greatsword is really the most favorable weapon to add not only in terms of practicality but in terms of popularity. From what I've seen, everyone who wants scepter for our next spec also wants a Ritualist spec, which is already done with Kalla.

There are other aspects to Ritualist than just spirits. If Rev gets a Rit themed spec with Scepter + Focus I would hope that they dive into the Channeling magic/weapon spell aspect of Rit.

Also there are other Non-Ritualist Legends that could use Scepter Focus that would be way more interesting. **Vizier Khilbron** immediately comes to mind

> @"jpsssss.7530" said:

> They haven't tied the legend stance to an expac's region yet.

Glint is fairly strongly tied to the Maguuma Region with the Exalted/Tarir/Heart of Thorns story. It definitely has stronger expansion ties than some of the other HoT elite specs, like chronomancer. Definitely moreso than Kalla with PoF as well, where the only real tie in for her is some vague themes regarding rebellion and overthrowing tyrannical figured heads/governments.

> @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> The stat prefixes worthy of note for Revenant are:

>

> **-Diviners-** Meta for playing "Alacrigade" Boon support+ Power DPS. Highly in demand in end game PvE content so if you want easy invites to raid groups go for this and learn to use the build associated with it ( TL;DR You spam F4 for alacrity while doing a DPS rotation ).

Piggybacking off this it’s also worth noting here that the Alacrigade rotation, while seeming simple, is also generally expected to do a lot of other shit, particularly in Fractals. For example, knowing when to take Jalis for stability or Mallyx for boon strip (and people WILL yell at you if you don’t take the right legend when it’s necessary) and major CC is always expected of Alacrigade as well as a bunch of other things that are also encounter specific. I would recommend for newer Alacrigades to do their research and also not to be afraid to ask questions. Good Alacrigade vs bad Alacrigade is like night and day, and it has little to do with its damage output

I definitely want a scepter + focus elite spec in order to add more flexibility to the weapon sets. They’re a bit too rigid at the moment

> @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said:

> > Yes they should be moved. You shouldn’t be forced to spend 100+ gold to unlock the meta achievement reward for a chapter. Currently, No Quarter requires this.

>

> Why not?

It goes against how they’ve structured the game previously and is a heavier burden on casual players, *which is the target demographic for living world story.* Casual players should not be forced to complete expensive collections, particularly cosmetic collections (which is what the weapons collections in No Quarter are), to achieve story mastery since they’re likely lacking in mass amounts of funds to begin with and are also more likely to need to spend that gold on *actual gameplay upgrades like ascended armor or high tier mounts* which actually have function.

Previous content has always kept expensive collections separate from the meta achievement or has allowed for expensive collections to count in lieu of doing something else, but it’s always been possible to achieve mastery through gameplay alone. For example, the Drooburt collections (some of which are expensive) during festivals are always optional and never required to complete the annual achievements, but can be done if you don’t want to do one of the gameplay achievements. Heart of Koda is perhaps the best example here as well, since it was initially placed in the story journal tab but then later removed and put into collections due to its high cost being out of reach for the majority of the playerbase, but even it wasn’t *required* before its change of location.

Also, they’ve never done this before at all in the past 8 years. I went through literally every episode since LS2 just to be sure, too.

Living world season 2: all gameplay achievements, mawdrey not required

Heart of Thorns: all gameplay achievements

Living world season 3: all gameplay achievements

Path of Fire: all gameplay achievements

Living World Season 4: gameplay achievements only OR a mix, no expensive collections like elegy armor or skyscale *required* to complete the meta achievement, but some of them can contribute

Living World Icebrood Saga: bare minimum you have to do the Tengu Weapon Collection (over 100g) to complete the meta achievement for No Quarter.

I’m fine with gold sinks for cosmetics, collections, titles, etc. but *they should not be required for story mastery and instead kept as separate goals.* Story mastery should be kept accessible for casual players.

Yes they should be moved. You shouldn’t be forced to spend 100+ gold to unlock the meta achievement reward for a chapter. Currently, No Quarter requires this.

> @"BnooMaGoo.5690" said:

> I am not asking for easy content.

> But this instance you have to whittle ole Balthy down to 20% first.

> Then you face the spongemonster that sucks your soul.

> You can't access your inventory to do anything either.

> From a design perspective it could be better for those of us who maybe don't have all the madskills or ascended gear or minions or pets or stealth or

> whatever may help out.

> I could ask for help if I fail again or I could rage quit.

> To me, that is the kind of design that needs to be looked at more closely in the future?

> Or not.

>

> just my noob after many years but still playing opinion

If you want to access your inventory midfight You need to break combat or die. Then you can make necessary changes and go back in with weapons/utilities/traits more suited for the encounter. You’re not locked permanently into combat once it begins in the vast majority of situations and death is always a way to get out of combat.

Also warrior has insane amounts of possible CC. Bulls charge, Stomp, Rampage, Kick, Throw Bolas, Fear Me! are all core utilities that CC. Try building for it and using it at the appropriate time and you shouldn’t have an issue. Also you absolutely don’t need ascended gear for this (it’s only a 5%ish stat increase over exotic anyway), but having decent gear (rare or higher, preferably exotics for expansion content with a sensible set of 6 runes) with damage stats and damage traits will get you a lot farther in the game than running some sort of bad gear/trait set built entirely for survivability

It’s an MMO designed around build variety and the ability to change and overcome situations based on your many available tools. Encounters shouldn’t be face roll easy and if they’re challenging you to rethink how you’re playing/what your build is doing then the encounter is doing the right thing

No to both commenters. Vindication is fine and is a nice way to sustain 25 stacks of might without an outside source or feeling like you have to press F2 off CD. It’s useful for open world and potentially useful for WvW/pvp builds.

Renegade is fine overall. A few traits are lackluster, but the line isn’t so messed up it requires a full rework. Most traits have their uses somewhere. The spec overall adds a different gameplay style as well as provides multiple builds for PvE. It’s effective in PvP when built properly and can be used in small group/roaming WvW if you know what you’re doing with it. As to Thornwolf’s suggestion to turn them into effects on the revenant in a radius, big no from me. Pretty much all of revenant already does that to some extent and it sounds considerably less interesting than the current more tactical spirit gameplay.

It’s been 10 months and I’ve been reporting several times a week usually once per play session when it happens to me. So they’re likely aware, but ofc no communication about it (as far as I know) and just sweeping it under the rug like most other problems

> @"Xca.9721" said:

> There are many other classes that are only "meta" in certain game modes, balancing each spec to be good everywhere is almost impossible.

Depends on how you define "good," but I do think each elite spec should be "acceptable." Also it's easier to achieve this in PvE than it is in PvP or WvW, since all you have to do is just increase a spec's dps to whatever a large portion of the community deems to be "acceptable." Nowadays in the current meta that's somewhere between 33 and 35k damage, at least in my experience through my conversations with people. Problem is Herald pulls around 31k as far as I'm aware (haven't tested it myself recently and I can't find anyone else who has), so it's still a little bit off this mark

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said:

> > Also worth noting there are plenty of classes that are taken even though they’re not top tier dps for an encounter.

>

> Exactly ... and these are things that 'have-not' classes need to bring to a team so they are desirable. No one is going to take Herald doing more DPS ... but they will take Herald if it brings something that the team wants EVEN if it's not good DPS.

That's not what I mean. I'm not talking about meta speed clears, I'm talking about being able to pump out enough damage that you're not immediately laughed out of any random raid for even picking the class. That cut off point in todays' meta is around 33-34k, unless you bring other stuff. Vast majority of raids happening aren't using 100% speedclear meta compositions on all fights, even among higher tier groups. Most raids I've been a part of don't care if you're playing Holo on a fight that prefers Deadeye if you can still do good damage on Holo. But the

>

> > Since Reaper has hit 34k it ISN’T meta, but it’s being more accepted by the community.

>

> I won't debate this vague and anecdotal observation.

Nearly all of the forums have this same issue then since 99% of the forums are vague anecdotes, including your opinions and "what you've seen in other parts of the forums" as well. I consistently see more reaper dps in pug raids and CM fractals than I ever have in the past since Reaper started to be able to pull mid tier dps. Obviously that's an anecdote, but no one's conducting rigorous scientific polling of "how accepted is reaper in raids" so I'm afraid all we have at that point is Snowcrow's tier list (obviously biased towards optimization) and vague anecdotes from people like me. And just because it's not on top of Snowcrow's tier list doesn't mean it's not being played by the vast majority of raiders that don't adhere strictly to the meta.

> It depends on the context of the teams we are talking about here. I could as easily say Reaper is still not welcome in a meta PUG team because offering 34K DPS and nothing else isn't squat to these kinds of teams. Whatever 'community' you are referring to ... it's certainly not the community that we are talking about here since it is NOT the 'accepting' community that give the players the idea that 'falling behind' is a reason to buff DPS in the first place.

That does get down to the crux of the issue in "how do you define community" when there are multiple facets and sub-communities within the community as a whole. There are lots of "shades of gray" in terms of the raiding community so trying to define it as "accepting" vs "non-accepting" is just as vague and nebulous as you say I'm being. A perhaps better way to define aspects of the raiding community would be to group them by what their goals are, because that does have an effect on what types of players they'll accept or they won't. Maybe something like:

1) Snowcrows & Speedclear groups

2) Raid Sellers

3) Full Meta Tryhard Full Clear Statics

4) Full Meta Tryhard Full Clear Pugs

5) Semi-Tryhard Full Clear Statics

6) Semi-Tryhard Full Clear Pugs

7) More Casual Exp Statics

8) More Casual Exp Pugs

9) Low Exp Guilds/Pugs

10) Raid Trainings (various)

The exact qualities of the list can be debated, but I'm not really interested in trying to refine the definition of community down much further, since it's mostly just to illustrate the point that the community is multifaceted and made up of dozens of groups with different standards. The farther down the list you go *generally* the more accepting the groups become, but obviously there can be some variance from group to group. If a class isn't pulling enough DPS to even be vaguely accepted by numbers 5 through 10, then there's definitely an issue with the class. As a class's dps rises, so does its acceptability within larger portions of the community. Complaints about Reaper and Herald generally come from people that aren't even being accepted in groups 1 through 6, maybe even 7, 8, 9 or 10. You know it's bad when some Raid Trainings don't want the class strictly from its low performance.

Imo, if a class can pull enough dps (or provide enough support) to be generally acceptable within groups 5 through 10 then it's in a fine place. Anet should strive for "generally accepted" for each elite spec (I don't think core should necessarily be always acceptable since it's tied directly with elite spec balance). Not every class needs to be meta, but having all classes have a general level of acceptance (5 to 10) goes a long way towards people feeling accepted by the nebulous "community at large." Having a dps benchmark that the majority find acceptable goes a long way towards improving people's opinions of those classes.

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said:

> > If Herald pulled 42k like Power mesmer you’d see it played regardless ...

>

> yes ... it would have to be TOP DPS for anyone to take it but that's not really relevant and goes without saying. The question here is if it's realistic for Herald to get 42K DPS. I mean ... if you THINK that it's even possible that Anet would buff Herald to give it 42K DPS ... sure I will eat my hat .... but I'm pretty sure I won't have to.

Didn’t say they would have to buff it to 42k to make it relevant or taken, just saying that IF it had 42k dps that it WOULD be taken. The reason I pointed this out is that I’m debunking your first claim that “ DPS is not going to get you a team. It's not why Herald is not wanted in teams.” Its overall dps is absolutely part of its lack of desirability.

Also worth noting there are plenty of classes that are taken even though they’re not top tier dps for an encounter. The thing is that a class needs to fall within an “acceptable” range of dps AND/OR provide something major/unique for it to be though of as valuable by the community. Currently I wouldn’t say Herald falls into either of those; it needs a 2-3k dps increase to be able to compete for a dps slot and would need to be able to provide at least 25 might 10 man to compete for a support/healer slot.

>

> So where are now? Oh yeah ... the same thing I said before .. DPS increase isn't why you aren't getting teamed with Herald because DPS is only desirable to a team when a class can deliver TOP DPS. I love the irony of how this is LITERALLY the same discussion in the necro forums ... they have had plenty of DPS increases ... do they get teams? Believe what you like ... but the evidence that you won't get teams with a DPS increase already exists from other class experiences ... INCLUDING HERALD!!!!!

No this is straight wrong and misinformation. Since Reaper has hit 34k it ISN’T meta, but it’s being more accepted by the community. While still not the most desirable, it went from “we don’t want necro at all (or only for epi)” to “a lot of groups will accept necro.” Obviously still not being used in speedclears, but just the fact that it can do acceptable dps now means that the community perception on it is changing and non-speedclear oriented groups aren’t going care to exclude it as much.

> Maybe you don't know but Heralds used to be desirable in teams and now they are not ... and that has NOTHING to do with what their DPS was or is now.

I’ve been raiding and maining rev since HoT beta, so definitely aware of why they were desired, and actually dps had a lot to do with it *in addition to its support capabilities.* Back then Berserker Herald + 1 Support Chrono was higher dps than taking two support chronos. Herald’s dps was also decent for a while until it got butchered by repeated pvp targeted nerfs as well. Nerfing of Chrono SoI + FoN on Herald caused Herald and Rev to fall out of favor entirely for about a year. That began to change when it got condi dps increases, which caused core rev to be vaguely viable. While certainly not meta until Renegade was created during PoF, condi core rev was acceptable to some (not all) groups since its dps crossed the threshold of “acceptable” (back then it was 30-32k generally to be seen as acceptable). As mentioned before even today feelings are the same roughly; classes need to meet certain vague minimum dps checks for groups to feel they’re worth taking (even if not best in slot), or they need to provide something major to the group.

> @"Buran.3796" said:

> > @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said:

> > At the moment there just isn’t really any reason to play Herald over Renegade.

>

> Playing solo. Herald can endure figths that Renegade can't. Herald can win figths that even Mirage (before the evade and cc damage nerf) couldn't.

>

> People just play hurry, like the game were they job. Playing alone and seing so many bots one becomes aware that the time to kill isn't everything...

Even in solo open world Soulcleave is insane sustain. A well played viper or Berserker renegade is easily on par with Herald in terms of ability to solo things (and brings higher damage), even if you have to be more careful in certain situations. The only thing Herald has over it for solo play is Infuse Light, but there are almost no situations where you actually need an invuln. Pretty much the only time I play Herald in solo situations is when I need swiftness for myself or someone else.

But yes as butter peanut said the post is about high end dps so solo and PvP/WvW are irrelevant. Obviously Herald performs better in PvP and WvW than renegade does.

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"DzT.8127" said:

> > When will Herald Dps get some attention from the Dev's. Its lacking far behind all other Classes thats Power Dps and we barely see them in raids etc. Please Anet Buff the Damage abilites/traits of herald. Thanks.

>

> DPS is not going to get you a team. It's not why Herald is not wanted in teams.

It’s definitely one of the reasons it’s not wanted. If Herald pulled 42k like Power mesmer you’d see it played regardless of what it brings to the table in terms of buffs and supports. But the fact is it’s worse than Renegade for power damage and even worse than Reaper now, sooo that’s certainly a major factor in its playability.

At the moment there just isn’t really any reason to play Herald over Renegade. Renegade is better support and better dps (both power and condi). In Addition it languishes behind most other power dps builds that have strong utility and cleave abilities; Herald barely has any of that even going so far as to lose damage on two of its DPS skills when cleaving. Herald absolutely could use some sort of buff that makes it more worth taking.

I think a buff on the damaging consume skills on Glint (Specifically burst of strength and elemental blast) would be a strong start in order to solidify her as part of the dps rotation. Followed by a buff on Reinforced Potency to 1.5% instead of 1% if the buff to the consume skills isn’t enough.

> @"ledernierrempart.6871" said:

> > @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said:

> > As a mostly Roamer I love downstate. The best part of downstate is other players making the dumb mistake of trying to Rez their friends. Once they’re grouped up just cc em and cleave em. Ez 1v2/3/4/5 victories. Also timing your cleave so that you go down and then a downed body immediately dies for that 50% rally heal is the best. No down state doesn’t allow that kind of gameplay and removes mechanics and strategies from the game.

> >

> > So no thank you, don’t remove downstate. If anything just take a look at Rez healing and maybe reduce it slightly so that cleave is more effective than it is currently.

>

> again with this not very intelligent argument of "easy to kill while outnumbered when allies group upon the downed to help him".

> have you only played against noobs so far? 1v2 is hard enough and nearly impossible without very specific builds to take care of the downed. and you say it is easy?

>

> balancing the game around noobs isn't the best thing to do.

Overwhelming majority of WvW players are bad. And yes I frequently 1v2 against good players

> @"Thornwolf.9721" said:

> > @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said:

> > It’s unfortunate that Glint has the fewest lines given her importance to the overall story since GW1. She definitely needs more. Kalla by contrast has so many it’s crazy. Would be nice to have more interactions, though right now I’d just settle with them fixing kitten revenant build templates that have been bugged for 10 months :/

> >

> >

>

> I 100% agree, I think Revenant needs a lot of QoL changes and fixes. Seems like there are a lot of bugs (For example sword 3 not firing as it should, you'll activate it but it wont actually attack the target.)

Yeah that ones been in for almost two years now or longer. Seems to have gotten worse lately too. I’ve reported it probably 50+ times at this point but they clearly don’t care ??‍♂️ the lack of dev attention to class bugs is really bothersome. Especially when they keep breaking shit like the Coalescence of Ruin changes 11 months ago ?

As a mostly Roamer I love downstate. The best part of downstate is other players making the dumb mistake of trying to Rez their friends. Once they’re grouped up just cc em and cleave em. Ez 1v2/3/4/5 victories. Also timing your cleave so that you go down and then a downed body immediately dies for that 50% rally heal is the best. No down state doesn’t allow that kind of gameplay and removes mechanics and strategies from the game.

So no thank you, don’t remove downstate. If anything just take a look at Rez healing and maybe reduce it slightly so that cleave is more effective than it is currently.

Was he using skills or was he literally just standing there? That’s a really important distinction, because if he’s just standing there doing nothing then sounds like a hacker or bug, but if he’s using skills then likely a renegade bunker. If you have more info than just “we couldn’t kill him” (like what skills was he using (besides just Tablet)) could definitely help you figure it out

It’s unfortunate that Glint has the fewest lines given her importance to the overall story since GW1. She definitely needs more. Kalla by contrast has so many it’s crazy. Would be nice to have more interactions, though right now I’d just settle with them fixing goddamn revenant build templates that have been bugged for 10 months :/

Legendary Armor was never even meant to be obtainable outside of raids. You should be thankful Anet even added another way to get it.

> @"Cynz.9437" said:

> So i came back to game after nearly 3 years break. Many things changed, just one didn't: everyone still hates thieves, everyone still doesn't want one on their team (neither in pvp, nor pve).

I don’t want to get too into this since it’s the PvP side of the forums, but thief is most certainly fine in PvE. It’s speedclear meta for several boss fights and even when not meta still pulls strong damage on most other fights and in fractals. Its condi build does need a buff in PvE though.

As someone who wasn't at rank 2k yet, but has been working on it every day for awhile now and on track to get it in a few months, I feel completely gutted. I enjoy WvW, but not having any real goal for the mode anymore is killing my desire to play it. Cool that I have the Sublime chest now I guess?? It really doesn't feel like an accomplishment now and more of some weird consolation prize. Guess I can spend more time focused on Fractal God now instead :/

> @"Kuma.1503" said:

> Idk when Anet will deal with Herald. It would be nice if Anet had reduced Crev's sustain, damage reduction, torment application, resistance uptime, and energy pool, but alas.

>

>

They’ve literally done all of those things over the past 3 balance updates for Rev