Rodzynald.5897

I wish that mirages were more resilient to damage, that their invulnerabilities and dodges gave them like... 80% damage reduction. Let them retain the mobility, but don't let them feel untouchable.

Well that should apply to any invulnerability or damage immunities to prevent silly "5% hp left a passive/active saves my bum, I am so good" situations. PvP should be more punishing with mistakes and don't give anyone any feeling of safety even behind damage mitigation walls.

Well... if you can't duo up and discord-queue'ing is not worth anymore, what else do they have to do? If we could at least come back to the state from vanilla GW2 pvp. Just smack out all those elite specs for at least one season and see how it goes. It's not the matchmaking, it's the people that the matchmaking has to work with.

Besides, only ATs hold any glimpse of worth if it comes to ranks and prestige (which is not much as well). In ranked if you roll into wins with blowout matches, then it doesn't prove that you are good, it just means that your enemies were incompetent and you turned out to be not as bad as them. Many high ranks got to such point, but mostly due to players that were in all these matches played. It's just 1 out of 10 players, the concept of "carrying" is kind of invalid in ranked. Even when I feel that I somehow "carried", I do not feel like it even if I get 4 top stats and a won match with a more than 250 or 300 point gap. What did I carry? Against some scrubs? That is hardly carrying. If my team wins by a slight chance, did I carry? No, the whole team made efforts and we all might have made mistakes, bad or worse, but everyone did their best. Long story short, there is no glory or prestige in stomping scrubs and this is one of many reasons that people leave or lose interest in PvP.

> @"BeepBoopBop.5403" said:

> And while they're at it give shade skills cast times. Core necro and reaper would also be OP if you could use all their skills at the same time.

Actually that is not a bad idea. I would rather let scourges have their crazy condi application, that is a strong trait that they need. But if we had a nice follow-up animation to know when to dodge or drop blind. That wouldn't be a direct nerf but would give a reasonable counterplay to condispam.

On the other hand, maybe it's just my latency, but I think that necro staff animations are kind of weird. It feels like the moment a character starts to raise their hand, the symbol is already on the ground, triggered if someone is already on the same spot as the mark. By the time an enemy player gets hit by the mark, necro ends the animation.

Sometimes it's hard to react and dodge the marks if they take effect in the very instant a hand movement begins (it should once it ends). But I would also say that it's just a minor thing that doesn't have to be changed.

A slight improvement, but as long as goldies or lesser ranks get into plat with just knowledge of fighting on a flavor of the season class then it gets rather wonky.

> @"vorpal.1497" said:

> I've been going afk for 4+ years, when I see That Guy go try to solo far and die at the start. Yes I could put in the effort to recover from his loss and the inevitable 4v3 mid loss, but I don't feel like That Guy deserves my effort. And no, ANet does not check pvp reports.

Woah there boy, watch out not to fall off of your high horse :D

> @"Jinks.2057" said:

> > @"Caro.2730" said:

> > > @"Jinks.2057" said:

> > > you are losing b/c you aren't good enough to win

> > >

> > > the people beating you aren't winning because they are good it's because you are not good enough

> > >

> > > 1v1 vs a mirage isn't about how skilled both opponents are but how competent the mirage player is. The non mirage players skill is irrelevant in this situation

> >

> > I don't think that's what I said. I win a lot, but I also lose a lot. I basically meant, that it all depends on the skill of the players and not the class. Of course I'll easily win against worse players and lose harder against better ones. I don't think that a good Mirage can defeat any good player playing any other profession. Someone is just worse and someone is better, always.

> >

> > > @"OriOri.8724" said:

> > > Mirage is easily one of the top, if not the best, duelist in the game right now when played well. It has a few things that **need** to be toned down. It has some things that **ARE** overpowered.

> >

> > You realize that someone has to be one of the top? It's not that I fully disagree with you, it's just if Mirage won't be one of the top, other classes will. It's like people can't handle a mesmer being actually good in something.

> >

> > > @"takatsu.9416" said:

> > > Of course there are things that need to be tuned for all classes but none need a complete 180

> >

> > I fully agree and yet people demand removing EM, removing clones, removing detargeting. You may remove mirage as a whole with it.

> >

> >

>

> IDC what you said. I'm telling you how it is. You are losing b/c you aren't good enough. A mirage has the advantage vs everything. It's not even close.

>

> So for you to lose on a mirage is about how well you play not your opponent. Your opponent can play lights out vs you and still lose if you are semi-competent.

>

> That's the reality of mirage atm.

Harsh truth but truth. Mirage plays the song and you have to dance to it. You won't escape, you can only hope for bunkering a point and if you manage to kill a mirage, it was just a bad mirage that let himself get caught.

However, the only funny thing I love to do to mirages is doing the core hammer combo while they are traversing between points. There is no way for them to survive that if all the burst goes down in less than half a second. But other than that it is challenging to get to them, especially with lots of dazes and blinds, damage with disruption at the same time is kind of too much, not to mention the mobility and the aspect of being untouchable.

I believe it would have been so much better if mistakes were punished on their own. Nowadays you can do a lot and pop something or something pops for you to run away/keep on fighting.

Yesterday I tried to play a bunker druid and It just confirmed it further for me that you can easily roll into higher ranks with whatever is gimmick-powered or is just simply capable of more things at once. Everytime I was about to die cause I screwed something up, I had an easy way out of almost every tight situation, something I could not do with a, let's say, core hammer. So healing, kiting for days, dealing decent damage at that, I felt kind of bad for some of my opponents because I didn't even try that hard to keep alive in 1v2's and they didn't seem to be some random PvE newbs.. I wish we got back to pre-HoT pvp where there were no "legendary" players running builds that *allowed* to be so incredibly efficient, and baddies had to git gud.

> @"ReaverKane.7598" said:

> > @"Rodzynald.5897" said:

> > But what about bad players who play strong builds and get carried to the skill rating they do not belong to? There are still bad players with high skill rating and this is pretty much another issue that creates one-sided matches. Yes, I know, every game has those, but based on my years of pvp experience in MMORPG's I can say that in GW2 there is a particulary high ammount of such examples, especially with a rising tendency after HoT launch.

>

> Well, with enough games their skill rating should drop?

Yeah, but before they do so, they drag a lot of people with them. They shouldn't get into high ranks in the first place. I've already met with at least two people who managed to get to high plat (almost lege) and in a week fall to medium gold. This just proves that MMR does the job to take'em down, but how do they get so high up is wondering. With just knowledge of how to play a class and a little to no logcial thinking about rotation or kiting to get into such high tiers? I do not think it should be like that.

Now on the other hand I don't play strict best meta builds or whatever is the flavor of the month, I do not find them suitable for me and I like to be creative. Everytime I used some other build be it A-tier or something of my own. Throughout 3 to 4 seasons I've seen a rising tendency in my rating from medium gold up to tiers 2-3 in platinum, staying there in a win-loss-win-loss-win... fashion.

Even though I very much dislike the idea of constant evasion, blind and invulnerability + lots of CC, mesmer is a piece of paper in the wind that can be blown away... but you have to touch it first.

I would rather prefer for them to have many % of damage reduction isntead of complete mitigation. I don't mind the clone spam, but it's hard to dodge all shatters with just two dodges right now. Blocks do not work out, they can be randomly taken out by some fart, following a shatter burst. On top of that there are lots of blinds and hard CC. Mirages should be evasive alright, I can go with that. Let them be mobile and let them evade damage, but I would be less concerned if there wasn't a daze every shatter and so many blind spams. Not only we have to try to dodge and defend ourselves, there is hardly any chance to land a significant attack.

The idea of mirage is good, but there is too much of it at once. Either defensive evasion and mobility, or huge peeling and damage. That would be kinda nice if mirages were invulnerable 99% of the time but had mosquito bites, working more like disruptors of the flow of combat instead of melting down everything while being invulnerable at the same time.

You don't need sustain or healing if you don't get damaged in the first place, at least PvE devs got that right. If mirages had the healing, we would be back to chronobunker kind of meta.

But what about bad players who play strong builds and get carried to the skill rating they do not belong to? There are still bad players with high skill rating and this is pretty much another issue that creates one-sided matches. Yes, I know, every game has those, but based on my years of pvp experience in MMORPG's I can say that in GW2 there is a particulary high ammount of such examples, especially with a rising tendency after HoT launch.

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > @"Rodzynald.5897" said:

> > > @"OGDeadHead.8326" said:

> > > > @"Rodzynald.5897" said:

> > > > This is what we get for not following the good ol' dps/tank/heal route.

> > >

> > > If that's what you want, you're playing the wrong game.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > And you are right! This is why I play Tera pvp more now.

> > The reason I posted here was that before HoT people told me that pvp here is good. I was fed up with WoW pvp so I came here and for those 3-4 short months pre-HoT I was dangity dang amazed. Even though there wasn't a clear dps/tank/heal scheme, it kind of felt close to it and every class had a distinct role. Currently it's just dps-blob or hybrid-blob

> > Like dang, why are hybrid builds so strong and reliable in this game? It is not supposed to work like that.

>

> Even in MOBAs, the strongest builds are the ones that can do a lot of damage while maintaining high survivability. That's actually the goal for most games... achieving a well-balanced build. It's not like every game except GW2 only has options between completely glass and full support with barely any damage. You're deluding yourself here.

Funny thing, today I had a nice fight with a spellbreaker today. Damage? Yeah. Sustain? Well sure, no problem. There is no issue with being good at two things, they synergise well so why not? So we fight, its good and it's cool. But now it seems that he did a mistake, I take an advantage to go for the kill, what happens? Snap! Mobility adds to the pool, he runs away and keep running that sustain kiting around, waiting for CD's to pop again. Well okay, I do the combo to get at him. SNAP 2X, blocks and immunities. See what I mean now?

What classes are played the most by top players? The ones that offer lots of good stuff so that it is possible to pull out such shenanigans. Of course I do not mean that they have to stop, let 'em have the fun. But in the end it shouldn't be like that, especially when it has so much passive play involved. There should be things to sacrifice one way or another instead of giving out best stuff like candy for pretty much free. Mirage is a funny example, it is strong, very strong, but if you smack'em well enough and in a good way, they won't POP to full health in an instant for some reason. They may run away, sure, they are mesmers, they are gimmick incarnate, but I am sure of it that if I bait them out of evades and whatnot and if I damage them well enough, I'll get that sweet kill.

Another one is Firebrand. It may seem as an OP bunker, but just separate them from their pocket scourge (or scourge from their pocket fb) and they are sitting ducks. Zero mobility, just sheer healing and defense. To be good, they have to either fight with a teammate or (or team) or defend a point 1v1 if belongs to fb's team. Otherwise you can focus them to oblivion and you are 100% sure they won't suddenly go invisible or use some mobility skill, because they are not supposed to do so.

As for MOBAs I also play those from time to time and boy is it nice. I am aware what characters are capable of and I know that if they hit hard, they won't pull out a random passive invulnerability when I happen to open them up and drop a burst or if they are tanky as nails, they won't suddenly turn invisible or drop a healing so good it melts your eyes. If mistakes are made = lost fight. Gimmicks my friends, there are little to none of them in many GOOD pvp focused games.

> @"OGDeadHead.8326" said:

> > @"Rodzynald.5897" said:

> > This is what we get for not following the good ol' dps/tank/heal route.

>

> If that's what you want, you're playing the wrong game.

>

>

And you are right! This is why I play Tera pvp more now.

The reason I posted here was that before HoT people told me that pvp here is good. I was fed up with WoW pvp so I came here and for those 3-4 short months pre-HoT I was dangity dang amazed. Even though there wasn't a clear dps/tank/heal scheme, it kind of felt close to it and every class had a distinct role. Currently it's just dps-blob or hybrid-blob

Like dang, why are hybrid builds so strong and reliable in this game? It is not supposed to work like that.

P.S.

If someone tries to explain that this is still good, then try looking at both salt and overall balance in other games' pvp aspect and compare it to this one. I played all sorts of PvP for over a decade and I can safely say that the saltiest community is this one so far, the second is LoL and the third one is WoW in my book. Another thing Anet tries to balance out game mechanics but also dodging the reliable and well known dps/tank/heal pattern. So now every class is somehow overtuned but some overtuned elements are more overtuned than the others leading to build combos that carry bad players and make good ones close to unkillable and mistake forgiving. Not to mention being focused on keeping the whole game casual friendly (ranked PvP =/= casual friendly - there is nothing casual in ranked). They are doing it for years now, see where that went? Exactly.

I just wish they blocked elite specs for ranked pvp so we could get back to some normal gameplay.

> @"Faux Play.6104" said:

> > @Rezzet.3614 said:

> > Ranger pets should be killable in 1 v1 s if focused right now this is impossible why should ranger be the only profession with unkillable ai units? Engineer turrets got nerfed because they were tanky despite not doing damage and those took utility slots

>

> They are. Should a bunker build really be able to kill them easily? If so warriors/cronos would one shot them. Name one other profession where its entire secondary mechanic can be put on extended cool down?

>

> Pets can easily be kited. Their DPS is significantly reduced by just moving. Throw in moving around obstacles and they produce virtually no damage.> @Nix.3152 said:

> > druids tilt me more than anything else in the game. stupid healbots who tank eveything and heal to full after that. run around shoot stupid beam while pet is eating you. basicly pet is more usefull than ranger himself.

> > ps ranger is not a real class.

>

> You have problems if you can't deal with a ranger on a holosmith. You should hard counter them with your hard cc and burst. Not to mention you have the tools to disengage and heal to full just as easily as a ranger without having to spec at all in healing power.

And while you are amazing at kiting the pet, druid takes care of you from the distance in the meantime. Sucks if you are pure melee without gimmicks e.g. guard hammer or power shiro and even if you have ways of ranged combat the druid has stupid sustain and escape mechanics.

Holo might try to burst it down and the initial burst might land but do not forget about that stupid stone sig maybe let's add to that elite shout and no CC no damage, pet tanks and druid kites around, running away, going invisible or whatnot.

There is always a tendency of players picking up whatever runs the most gimmicks and is a jack of all trades. In this game hybrids are stronger than builds which are focused on one, max 2 things at the same time. This is what we get for not following the good ol' dps/tank/heal route.

Well I always get amused and mad both at how scourge can easily get to me. I have to sweat my head off to bait shades and kite around something to force mistakes on the scourge. But as a core hammer which is 100% melee, a scourge only has to do one medium condi bomb on me to force most of my utilities to cleanse, and a second after I get another condi bomb to the face despite earlier baits.

The gap between how hard I have to try to down them and how easy it is for scourge to completely deny me in melee is truly a bit too much.

Or to be true I wouldn't mind that power level that much if there were more indication and slow cast times on scourge skills. It is weird, maybe that's my clunky framerate and wonky latency but I always anticipate that characteristic hand movement animation of scourges and most of the time I get struck with most of those skills in the same second the animation STARTS. I don't really have that much problem with evading attacks, but shouldn't it be like, the attack comes after animation and not at the beginning of it? Not to mention that a lot of it is unblockable :T

If so then I want mighty blow to deal AoE in the moment my character starts to leap into the air :D

There was a mention of creating a website for PvP related stuff, but I think this shouldn't be out of the game. As I stated many times before in different topics, there are many elements that have to be looked at if we want a better PvP experience. One of them is an access to information for players, especially those who are new to the game mode.

PvE takes care of balance but I think that what I am about to suggest is what PvP devs could do. To create an npc or an additonal fold in PvP interface, like a compendium of PvP related terminology (maybe tips and basic tactics). We can all cooperate on creating such a database that would be easy and quick to use in a blink of an eye. We know that new players don't want to or don't know how to look for PvP stuff out of the game. If we had such an option to have a, let's call it "PvP dictionary" it might be easier for all of us to see on what principles and terminology PvP rolls around. Things such as: rotation, focus, node, close(home), mid, far.... maybe some shortcuts as "inc" (incoming). Encouraging to use the team chat for planning strategies, sharing tips during loading screens. If new players had access to such information, they would be more likely to get better at the game more efficiently.

I do believe that the dedicated part of PvP playerbase could also add some information to it through this forum for devs to revise. Perhaps to see if some new tips or tactics could be added to the new compendium.

> @SloRules.3560 said:

> I have to agree with people that said that the amount of different conditions that are being puked out has to adressed too. Some classes just have to many (ehm necro).

>

> Also please take a look at hammer rev vs staff ele. Hammer rev just shouldn't be able to do as much damage as ele, when they are both full zerk, because it's a whole lot more survivable.

>

> Warrior elite and enchantment collapse need to be adressed a bit, they are just to powerfull together. I like warrior rips a whole lot more than necro corrupts, but not if they are all packed in 1 skill.

>

> Firebrand support is too much, no other class can compete to it, unless you want to rely on special mechanics, like jalis elite. Even ele auras aren't enough to warant using it over guardian.(guardian = stab, resistane, healing, condi cleanse, ... you just can't have all of that together)

First of all, Firebrand needs a decent team that knows how to fight so it is worth for them to keep the team alive. Second, Firebrand is strong because it has to be strong due to how many condis and power damage can be done in a short duration of time. Thirdly, Firebrand has no mobility or gimmicky shenanigans to keep it alive, it's all about how you react and what skills you use, so if you burst it well, it will go down and you are sure it won't do something weird that will keep it alive like random invulnerability or something. They won't go invisible or run away like a druid, or kite around like good ol' ele.

There never should have been any passive mechanics that give so much potential in the first place. I would rather go with 90% damage reduction than a full immunity for endure pain because too many times a kiting warrior gets passively saved with this crap, but that is just one example. To counter power spikes there should be some more ways to lower the damage beside weakness and protection. Prot is 33% reduction to damage which is alright, but with so much power damage flying around we could use some more reduction boons to both condition and power. This would prevent those situations when someone gets invulnerable for days to all sources of damage on top of being able to heal or kite with mobility. Sometimes it's really tricky to kill, let's say, a druid. Other dps builds are countered with decent damage both from a pet and the druid. Healing, mobility, invisibility, way too much. I have to do so many tricks and mind games to lure a druid into corner just to find them pop that annoying stone signet right before getting rekt with the last few % of their life left. If the damage reduction was applied there, it wouldn't change much then. This is just another example, but a lower cooldown on stone signet and a significant % damage reduction is what I'd like to see. I am just tired of seeing everyone go invulnerable or untouchable with some weird shenanigans right before getting killed by their own mistakes. I know that stone sig is not passive, but that doesn't change the fact that it is a cheap life saver.

But in the end of the day none of these things will happen. PvE balances this game and they won't rework or block passive traits because that would also include doing that on PvE for some reason.

EDIT:

Also I think that nerfing skill abilities to do just one thing at a time. There are too many skills that do multiple things, for one example Lunar impact on druid.

Along with the healing and mobility that druid has access to, a heal blast with a daze every 8 second? Hoh! That's too much I say. Either heal or daze, not two things at the same time.

Rocket charge on scrap's hammer has an evade built to it. Mobility + damage + damage evasion, that's just lazy design to create skill that make you feel "I am safe for now but I can still kick your butt".

The same goes to whirlwind on warrior's GS. The list goes on and on, but the thing is to make players suffer for mistakes, let them die if they screw up, no second chances. You either git gud or go farm mobs, this is how it should be and should have been when GW2 tried ESL.

I think it is > @JayAction.9056 said:

> > @Razor.6392 said:

> > > @JayAction.9056 said:

> > > Ranked pvp should have access to mats and complete legendarys from HOT and POF, linked behind a combination of rating and reward tracks or something like that.

> > >

> > > If not something that extreme, at least make available some of all these new skins being released in the Pve portion of the game in Pvp also.

> >

> > yessss more pveers ruining matches, just what everyone wants :D

>

> That's only an issue if you are rated low.

>

> Otherwise should be no problem.

>

> Especially if items are gated behind rating/tier

>

> I mean, I'm not expecting legendarys or legendary mats to be accessible to gold rank.

>

I think it might be a good idea, however, it is a double edged sword. If the best rewards were exclusive only for platinum/legendary ranks the casual wave of players would just leave PvP instead of gitting gud. That's because you can get lege armour out of PvE and that is why it might happen. However, if there were more fancy and good stuff ONLY obtainable in medium/high rank PvP it might tease some players to try harder to get it.

Still, I can't understand how can you keep the game casual friendly and have a good PvP scene at that. PvP is not for casuals if they want to be good. In PvE, the "hardcore content" works even for casuals, all you have to do is learn the scripted behaviour, get a decent gear and farm it with a team that doesn't have potatoes for brains. Here you have to be cunning and efficient, react to the most unexpected things in a fight, which scares off most of the PvE playerbase.

There is more boon corruption than condi convert, little quaggan :C

> @Morwath.9817 said:

> > @Rodzynald.5897 said:

> > You can always stack a bunch of lads on discord and press que at the same time. This is how you party que in this game :D

>

> Foooo, thats how you que against your frands and one of you becomes sad, sad Quaggan.

But this is how top tier games look like :U

You can always stack a bunch of lads on discord and press que at the same time. This is how you party que in this game :D

It's hard to tell if it will ever return to its former glory. It all went down after introduction of elite specs and ESL. Once ESL dropped gw2 they started to focus on doing living world seasons. But isn't this game PvE oriented to begin with? We won't have good competitive pvp if the main motto is "casual friendly" because what is happening now is the best example of casual friendly PvP, which is more or less trash.

But in the long run, if there is any faint will to fix this mess, then I would also suggest adding a better tutorial to the HoTM. Let's be honest here, new players who want to have fun won't check out every nook and cranny on the internet to look for builds, rotations and stuff like that. It all has to be in the game, easy access. Maybe an NPC or an extra interface window where you can check out terms such as: rotation, focus, lord, trebuchet, node and so on and so forth. Perhaps some tactics and tips such as: "Don't go on a point that is already being contested by a team of enemy players if you are sure that you won't win the fight or keep the point contested for a long time", or something that regards a problem that is pretty frequent: "Don't go one by one after respawn into a lost teamfight, consider rotating to other location".

Knowledge is the key and if it is easy to get in touch with all these informations, then it would be much easier for new players to get better at the game.

As much as we might not like it, this is the lesser evil. I don't think anyone want to come back to bunker chrono kind of games.

Uhm... at least with core there wouldn't be so many situations when everyone is dope and buffed. Currently we have a lot of stuff flying around where most classes are capable of doing multiple things at once, or are full of shenanigans.

For example, notice that hammer guard is not mobile and doesn't have sustained healing or any gimmicky mechanics like passive invulnerability (2k heal from medi is burst healing, not sustained healing FYI). Not to mention a lack of strong defenses apart from 2 seconds of protection from hammer, ring of warding and shield of wrath.

I strongly believe that introducing elite specs was practially the main reason why it all went down and ESL dropped GW2. It was just too much of everything at once.

Why I think that? Because I've never really encountered that much salt and toxicity before HoT. I enjoyed PvP back then.

P.S.

Now that I think about it, if meditations weren't burst heal but minor litanny of wrath, let's say 10% damage to health (stacking up to 40%) for 5 seconds (stacking duration) with every meditation you pop if traited. That would make for an even better high risk/high reward.

> @Mogar.9216 said:

> Because the mirage have to be in melee to land the bomb. Fair or not most people feel better to be killed by someone they could hit back at rather than by someone from far away.

You do realise that mirage has tons of ways to not get hit? In fact I prefer fighting a deadeye because once they show up I can mighty blow + JI them ez pz lmn sqz style.

With mirage you won't do that and if you manage, they will just run away and come back once they can go with another combo.