Sajuuk Khar.1509

> @"HotDelirium.7984" said:

>Ah so we can extrapolate that Bangar/Jormag/Shaman/The Spirits themselves/ SOMEONE (thankyou lore?) is giving these Dominion troops the spiritual essence.

Most likely Jormag itself. Bangar doesn't have that sort of control, and the Spirits don't appear to like being used like they are, so I doubt they are giving it out directly.

> @"HotDelirium.7984" said:

> Also, did we ever find out why Steel Warband recommited themselves to Bangar's cause? Nicabar was questioning the movement then SPLAT.

Steel followed Ryland, and Ryland followed Bangar. Nicabar may have questioned Bangar's actions, but he was loyal to his warband leader, and Ryland told him to follow Bangar, so he did. The capture of Cinder likely made it personal for the rest of the Steel Warband to fight against the United Legions.

> @"HotDelirium.7984" said:

> Was it ever explained why the Dominion Charr have the 3 corrupted spirit essences? In the timeline didn't we kill Drakkar and subjugate the corrupted spirits? If drakkar is no longer around are they then still influenced by Jormag and Bangar somehow is rerouting their spiritual power to his forces? I'm so lost.

It was Jormag who corrupted the spirits, and its to the dragon their power went too. Drakker was just tapping into it to make himself more powerful.

We also never "subjugated" the corrupted Spirits. We helped remind them who they were, so they would give their powers to Braham to defeat Drakker, but the spirits mention they don't believe they can ever be free of Jormag's corruption in Drizzlewood. So Jormag still has their powers, which is why Fallen and Aberrant creatures show up during the attack on the Frost Citadel

> @"Svennis.3852" said:

> The team that worked on S1 and Icebrood Saga are totally different, though. They’re basically a different studio now. The Saga started off very strong and it’s fairly obvious it was meant to be much longer at this point, but has been panned in favor of the expansion. Which is why we’re seeing the current uproar regarding Champions, because they’re massively cutting corners to push out EoDs.

>

> I mourn the potential Icebrood Saga had. It could’ve easily been 12+ episodes with multiple maps dedicated to exploring lore for multiple races and building up Primordus as the climax. I think Novera King (narrative lead that left in October) had done a great job and gave us some of the most compelling character development/storytelling in years.

Except this is completely inaccurate.

Even back on Feb 3rd, just after episode 2 "Shadow in the Ice" dropped, and before COVID became a problem, Anet stated that, after episode 4, they were going to go back to more LWS1 style content. And the number of Champions releases is equal to the number of releases we knew from episode 2 that we were going to get.

Icebrood Saga was never planned to be longer then this. Especially not 12+ episodes.

> @"battledrone.8315" said:

> i am playing another ncsoft title, champions online, and they have been hanging on the brink for years now.

Champions Online is developed by Cryptic Studios and published by Perfect World. It has nothing to do with NCSoft.

> @"radda.8920" said:

> **upcoming chapters feature** you must have missed the sentence (1 min08)

Nope, I saw it.

You seemed to have missed several things however

1. We know each release is going to get multiple new content updates in the weeks following its initial launch.

2. We know the Ebon Vanguard faction is part of this release, which would imply that the Ebonhawk DRM is coming this release also.

3. this means chapter 1 will have 4, probably 5, of the DRMs. Chapter 2 will likely have just as many, meaning all 10 are covered in the first two chapters alone. Leaving the last two chapters with other content

4. This would be consistent with GW2's, and game development in general. There is no way they would be far enough along with content for the last two chapters to put it in the trailer like they did.

> @"Hannelore.8153" said:

> What I don't get is how they're going to do DRMs in LS3 and LS4 maps, that's a bit unfair. Forcing players who play IceBrood Saga to buy both LS3 and LS4 to play all the DRMs, I don't think the devs have ever done anything like that before.

There is nothing suggesting you will have to buy LWS3 and 4 to play all the DRMs. The DRMs are instances one access from the EoTN. Only thing you will need is the Champions episode.

> @"PseudoNewb.5468" said:

>Aurene hasn't transformed or greatly empowered the commander with her domains of magic.

Both the Crystal Champion mastery line from LWS4, and the current Dragon Slayer mastery line, are her doing just that.

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> Oh my... Where did you read that information? I hope it's not accurate. 10?!? :cry:

There's supposedly going to be 10 total. Not 10 more after this one.

And thats largely based off of people finding the icons for the new mastery points in the current version of the game maps.

> @"Bast.7253" said:

> But I imagine it's pretty hectic as it all seems last minute and unplanned.

I mean, Anet stated back in February 3rd, just after episode 2 came out, that they were planning to do this. And that wasn't presented as a recent decision either. So we are looking at around late last year they had the idea for this.

So the allies we got in this release are

* Crystal Bloom: Primary

* Seraph and Watchknights in Brisban

* Asura and Golems in Metrica

* Norn shamans in Gendarran

Other notes

* Jhavi is still leading the Vigil, since Laranthir hasn't returned from the Grove.

* We got confirmation that the Pale Tree is better, but still healing from the attack by Mordremoth.

* The Asuran Counsel has accepted Jormag/Ryland's help.

* Braham has gained some ability to feel where the larger destroyers are going.

* Braham and Taimi have a fight over allying with Jormag.

* Aurene isn't taking an active role in the fighting, and The Commander wishes she would.

* Jormag says the "balance" is made up, and not real.

* The group leading the war effort consists of Logan, Crecia, Phlunt, Sigast, and a sylvari whose name i forgot right now

There is nothing indicating that the Elder Dragons are directly related to each other. Jormag's comment to Aurene is most likely just figurative due to the fact they are all Elder Dragons.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> This, I honestly don't know. I can only imagine that COVID, and possibly the green light for End of Dragons, forced them to re-evaluate their designs, which results in a very different gameplay result and they're highlighting this by calling it chapters of "Episode 5" rather than Episodes 5-8.

That dev comment you found for me, from all the way back on February 3rd, seems to indicate this was the plan all along. And that was made before COVID got serious, and shut down things like VA work.

> @"Stephen.6312" said:

>We know that some of the Elder Dragons are male

Actually, we know the exact opposite is true.

Anet themselves have stated the dragons have no actual gender. They just use whatever pronouns they want for the sake of conversation.

> @"Ogwom.7940" said:

> If I missed out on a few weeks of dialogue, like if I am only 5/8 complete, can I talk to him anytime and finish the achieve and get all the dialogue that I missed?

Ive heard that its one dialog per daily reset if you are behind. Can't confirm that though.

> @"Svennis.3852" said:

> I'm not sure how to feel about this one, mostly because I find the "little sister" comment confusing.

I honestly thinks its just metaphorical.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> I dunno, bringing Kuunavang and some other, unknown dragon at a point when replacements are needed feels like a decent hint.

Did we get actual confirmation that the other voice in the EoD trailer was a dragon?

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> I personally think that the title might have a small typo, and it is meant to be "upcoming chapter features". But if you think about the development process for games, then it makes sense.

I can only hope so.

>However, consider the fact that they established there will be additions to content in-between releases, and the fact that they have not ONCE in eight years showcased two releases' content in a single trailer. Why would they break one of the very, very few things they actually maintain consistency with now of all times?

Why change the naming convention from seasons into saga? Why change from giving up complete maps per release to split maps? Why switch from the style of content we got in LWS2, 3, and 4, and the first half of IBS, into that of LWS1? Why also change the naming convention of the saga chapters in the process also? To be honest, IBS has been Anet doing a lot of weird things.

But yes, I would agree it wouldn't have content from chapters 5-8, just 5/6 at the mos. MAYBE 7 if the Tengu/Koden are from there, since those Kodan are a vanilla assets, and its not difficult to slap some Tengu model on the fort walls and have the camera pan around it for a second.

> @"Teratus.2859" said:

> Yep.. and that is exactly why I am so sold on the idea that Primordus needs to do something so absurdly destructive to sell us on just how dangerous he really is.

Like launching dozens of attacks across Tyria?

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> That would require them ignoring the entire purpose of S3, PoF, and S4 and why we fought Balthazar. I really, really hope they don't pull that.

But Aurene is the one true dragon who can harness all the energies without them conflicting inside her!(I would hate that plot point but Anet has done nothing to suggest any sort of other Dragon replacement.)

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> The whole trailer's just for Chapter 1

If so, they did an extremely poor job of suggesting that.

The trailer says "upcoming chapters feature", which suggests its for a later chapter, and not a future update for this chapter. And that is how I've seen everyone take it as well. Especially since they do that mid trailer title card to suggest everything from the start to that point is chapter 1, and everything after that is later chapters. If it was all for just this one chapter wouldn't it say "upcoming chapter feature" to reference the singular chapter, or upcoming chapter's feature" to show a possessive instead of a plural?

> @"EdwinLi.1284" said:

> I expect that the Allied Factions in those response missions maybe based on locations as well. We know the Crystal Bloom and Ebon vanguard are going to be be the two first factions to join and later Dwarf and Tengu.

We also see Kodan and Exalted. So we may get two new allied factions for the first three chapters, then everyone comes together in chapter 4 to fight whoever.

> @"Svennis.3852" said:

> I expect allied factions will be the gimmick of the moment. While the factions might remain as the story dictates, as a mechanic I expect them to be sequestered to dragon response mission.

Pretty much, I doubt the Kodan, or Ebon Vanguard, or the Tengu, are suddenly going to go globe hoping with us or anything.(outside of Tengu going to Cantha)

> @"Tyson.5160" said:

> Definitely possible and could still leave Primordus as the first and final dragon, especially since we have been dealing with this dragon in some way shape or form since GW1, as well sprinkled in the personal story, lots of S3, little bit of PoF and IBS.

I also think this might be the case because we didn't see any new destroyer types in the trailer.

When we actually go to "fight" a dragon seriously, Anet has always expanded the enemy roster for the dragons in those arcs. The fact that we only see already existing destroyer types in the Chapter 1 trailer, and even in the "future releases" segment, suggests this whole Primrodus thing may be a distraction in the Icebrood Saga.

> @"Tyson.5160" said:

> I’m wondering if the outcome will be Jormag gets killed by Primordus, Primordus escapes underground again and Aurene absorbs the left over magic, however it makes her sick or causes other problems, which allows us to go to Cantha. Aurene could also give us a vision or use the eye of the north to show us Cantha as a spot where we can solve Aurene’s issue.

I'm wondering something else. The EoD logo shows two dragons, one under water, and another above the water. I know a lot of people speculated this was Bubbles, and perhaps Kuunavang, but what if its actually Bubbles and Primordus?

Jormag dies, either we kill it, or Primordus does. Primordus takes most of its power, then flies off to Cantha to kill Bubbles to take its power. So we have to go to Cantha to stop it.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> That's curious. Because with Bjora, I can end up in either western or eastern, but with Drizzlewood I'm 100% always in the main camp to the south.

Really? Now thats odd. Its supposed to be, according to testing, that if you got the scroll from episode 1(after it was retroactively added in), it puts you outside Jora's keep. If you got the scroll from episode 2(the Kodan village), it puts you on the western side of the mountains splitting the map.

After they added the portal tome in episode 2(thanks for the correction) I went and got the scroll from Jora's keep, and have never appeared anywhere but there.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> Except that it was about portal tome additions (and it was Episode 2, not 1), and Episodes 1 and 2 counted as separate slots both going to Bjora Marches (different places in the map) per that_shaman. ANet then added Eye of the North, but Drizzlewood only has 1 slot afaik. So that just accounts for 5/9 slots.

>

> Also, it has been 1 prologue and *six* releases, not eight. Prologue, 1, 2, VotP, 3, 4, Fractal.

Yes, I meant releases for the portal tome. Things like fractals are something else from what I meant.

The southern/northern parts of Drizzlewood have their own places the scroll with transport you, depending on which scroll you got. Southern takes you to the main camp. Northern takes you to the hidden camp IIRC. Though, like Bjora, you can only have on scroll in the tome. And the EoTN wasn't originally supposed to be part of the tome portal tome, it was only added after fan complaints.

So it was

0. Bound by Blood

1. Whisper in the Dark

2. Shadow in the Ice

3. No Quarter

4. Jormag Rising

5. Truce

6. Power

7. Balance

8. Judgement

A prologue and 8 releases for the portal tome, with the EoTN being jammed in there later. Other releases like the fractal, and Vision, not counting in what I originally meant. 11 releases total.

> @"Svennis.3852" said:

> There were some dev statements early on where they stated the back half of the Saga would be very different from the first half, and their intention to return to old maps to potentially expand or add content. Honestly I don't mind not having a new map, as the prospect of returning to old maps for new stories excites me. But I don't want to feel like the content is subpar or rushed. Hopefully Champions will have a robust story that continues some of the threads of the first half of the saga, but I can't imagine this was 100% their exact plan from the get go. I suspect Icebrood Saga was going to be longer, and that it would've eventually involved Primordus. Just not this quickly.

Well, from was was determined back when episode 1 came out, there was going to be 9 releases. A prologue and 8 chapters, and we got a prologue, and 8 other releases. so numerically it matches up from what we knew was going to happen since episode 1.

During the charity stream Anet did today one of the devs mentioned there was a, as far as they were aware, undiscovered hint/secret in the End of Dragons trailer.

Some guesses made on reddit include this flag, which is very briefly seen in the trailer


Which appears to be the exact same as the Aetherblade logo


Perhaps they are coming back?

Other possibilities noted are

'MMXXI' written on bell


'Eye' symbol on the top part of first gate at 0:09


The word 'Mercy' on the dragon pipe at 0:21