Why Soulbeast is not wanted in squads (WvW)

[Revolution.5409]

> @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> > @"Revolution.5409" said:

> > Simple because it can't do anything that other professions don't do better.

> > Druid is a joke compared to FB.

> > Slb (back line) has excellent damage but most (if not all) of its damage is absorbed or reflected and has little Aoe damage, this puts Ele in a much better position.

> > Ranger has the problem of having pets that are constantly dead.

> > Warrior offers more CC, has more stability and skills that allow him to survive on the front line and Winds of Disenchantment is one of the best Elite.

> > Necro needs no introduction.

> > Then there are exceptions, Tempest and Scrapper have better healings than Druid, the mesmer portal or the veil are unique abilities.

> >

> > There is no reason to put a Ranger in a Zerg, we can follow and try to bring down someone with Build Oneshot hoping that he will not be resurrected instantly

>

> The main difference is that a druid can survive on his own outside the zerg if caught off guard...while a tempest/scrappers won't be as lucky, I'd argue that they can heal better , but to each his own

 

 

To the classes in question just change in Weaver and Holo and they can survive without problems outside Zerg, Bunker Weaver is almost immortal if played well, obviously there are no Builds capable of covering every role but other professions have alternatives instead Ranger has 3 Builds that they do the same thing, Druid which should be our support specialization cannot be used in groups and this is still a problem without considering pets etc.

[Kodama.6453]

> @"Revolution.5409" said:

> > @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> > > @"Revolution.5409" said:

> > > Simple because it can't do anything that other professions don't do better.

> > > Druid is a joke compared to FB.

> > > Slb (back line) has excellent damage but most (if not all) of its damage is absorbed or reflected and has little Aoe damage, this puts Ele in a much better position.

> > > Ranger has the problem of having pets that are constantly dead.

> > > Warrior offers more CC, has more stability and skills that allow him to survive on the front line and Winds of Disenchantment is one of the best Elite.

> > > Necro needs no introduction.

> > > Then there are exceptions, Tempest and Scrapper have better healings than Druid, the mesmer portal or the veil are unique abilities.

> > >

> > > There is no reason to put a Ranger in a Zerg, we can follow and try to bring down someone with Build Oneshot hoping that he will not be resurrected instantly

> >

> > The main difference is that a druid can survive on his own outside the zerg if caught off guard...while a tempest/scrappers won't be as lucky, I'd argue that they can heal better , but to each his own

>

>

> To the classes in question just change in Weaver and Holo and they can survive without problems outside Zerg, Bunker Weaver is almost immortal if played well, obviously there are no Builds capable of covering every role but other professions have alternatives instead Ranger has 3 Builds that they do the same thing, Druid which should be our support specialization cannot be used in groups and this is still a problem without considering pets etc.

 

Are tempest and scrapper really outhealing druid, tho?

I thought that scrapper is mostly represented in WvW squads, because it offers the best condi clean in the entire game for groups. But I can't imagine that a scrapper will outheal a druid, who has the celestial avatar form completely dedicated to healing on top of having a healing focused weapon with staff.

[Revolution.5409]

> @"Kodama.6453" said:

> Are tempest and scrapper really outhealing druid, tho?

> I thought that scrapper is mostly represented in WvW squads, because it offers the best condi clean in the entire game for groups. But I can't imagine that a scrapper will outheal a druid, who has the celestial avatar form completely dedicated to healing on top of having a healing focused weapon with staff.

 

No need to imagine, you can create a Druid and try it for yourself.

[Arheundel.6451]

> @"Revolution.5409" said:

> > @"Kodama.6453" said:

> > Are tempest and scrapper really outhealing druid, tho?

> > I thought that scrapper is mostly represented in WvW squads, because it offers the best condi clean in the entire game for groups. But I can't imagine that a scrapper will outheal a druid, who has the celestial avatar form completely dedicated to healing on top of having a healing focused weapon with staff.

>

> No need to imagine, you can create a Druid and try it for yourself.

 

I will have to disagree with you..

-we use a full minstrel scrapper like metabattle http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PeQAIlNwcYesH2JeyTnNAA-zVJYjRBfJ47A-w

-the we use a full minstrel druid using same stats http://gw2skills.net/editor/?POQAYhNsFYSthC-zVJYjRBfJ47A-w

-finally let's use a full minstrel tempest http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PGgAg2eASItfA-zVJYjRDfJ47A-w

 

In terms of raw healing numbers, the druid is far ahead tempest and scrapper , the problem with druid is certainly not the healing output but rather the utility they bring and how they are held back by the pet dying all the times during zerg fight, if only anet could solve these issues...oh my ...druid would be magnificent

[Infusion.7149]

Unless you can camp Celestial Avatar with zero downtime then there's really no comparison to heal scrapper , especially when you have boon output from heralds.

Keep in mind med blaster pulses 3 times , the tooltip is for a single pulse.

Also any tempest going for raw heals runs staff.

[Leo.5829]

In WvW Ranger is literally hurting your own team in multiple ways. It has been this way for almost 8 years now. Don't expect things to change, please reroll meta class.

[Swagger.1459]

> @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> > @"Revolution.5409" said:

> > > @"Kodama.6453" said:

> > > Are tempest and scrapper really outhealing druid, tho?

> > > I thought that scrapper is mostly represented in WvW squads, because it offers the best condi clean in the entire game for groups. But I can't imagine that a scrapper will outheal a druid, who has the celestial avatar form completely dedicated to healing on top of having a healing focused weapon with staff.

> >

> > No need to imagine, you can create a Druid and try it for yourself.

>

> I will have to disagree with you..

> -we use a full minstrel scrapper like metabattle http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PeQAIlNwcYesH2JeyTnNAA-zVJYjRBfJ47A-w

> -the we use a full minstrel druid using same stats http://gw2skills.net/editor/?POQAYhNsFYSthC-zVJYjRBfJ47A-w

> -finally let's use a full minstrel tempest http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PGgAg2eASItfA-zVJYjRDfJ47A-w

>

> In terms of raw healing numbers, the druid is far ahead tempest and scrapper , the problem with druid is certainly not the healing output but rather the utility they bring and how they are held back by the pet dying all the times during zerg fight, if only anet could solve these issues...oh my ...druid would be magnificent

 

In terms of healing, Druid sucks compared. I have 7 Rangers and run heal Tempest for reasons.

 

Not sure why you linked a Tempest build with Dagger/Focus, but you're doing it wrong. And that must be why you think Druid is good at healing...

[KeyOrion.9506]

You people have never experimented with finding ways of making a ranger useful in WvW, and after 7 years, most of your "ranger are useless" mentality has gotten so old, it just flows off like oil and water. Longbow Barrage with Superior Sigil of Fire. Triggers a flameblast on critical hit. Did you know if you wanted to know if there's stealthed enemy in a certain area all you have to do is fire barrage with this sigil, and if you critical, even though the enemy is not revealed...the flameblast still can occur, which tells you there is stealthed. The more flamebursts that occur, the more damage that overlaps, and the more stealthed enemy you know to be in the area. But no, you people never figured that out. You never bothered. Sword/dagger ranger's that also use shortbow #3 coupled with their two dodges, makes them one of the greasiest pigs to catch. With a total of up to 5+ dodges. No, even rangers that are 7 years old never figured out the tactics for sword/dagger on ranger. To them it was too clunky. You start off heading towards the enemy by steering left (to the enemy's right side) when you activate the dodge skill, which actually will cause you to spin and strike the enemy, while dodging. After that it's another dodge skill, and your stabbing them in the back on a twirl. And then you can dodge out three different ways. Sword, regular dodge, or switch to shortbow and hit#3. But no....most commanders never figured this out because, it's all about "HITTING the enemy" with as much massed DPS.

 

Traited properly, A mass of rangers are killers in corridor combat. Traited properly they hit up to 5 targets, and with no way for the enemy to dodge left or right, it's like spearing multiple fish in a barrel. Entry to camps narrow sides, corridors, halls, and ramps....we can tear through most enemy at range before they come up hand to hand. Unfortunately with all this shield, reflects, makes it all pretty much useless, but that works on any ranged...which sadly puts ranger in a very bad predicament, when your running shield engies, and warrior domes, and Mesmer reflects...

 

There's 5 more things that ranger can bring to group play, but i'm too tired to list them all, and the majority of you don't really care, because your mind is already made up, so I don't feel the need to waste time. Everything I listed above has a pro and a con. The other 5 things also have pro's, but also have cons. Rapid fire, is both a blessing and a curse. Rapid fire is our only bow burst skill, but the damage is spread between all arrows. Which means the enemy has enough time to hit any skill to deflect, or dodge, which causes our damage to drop exponentially. Hell, we don't even do any real additional damage for shooting enemy in the back, much like thieves can with backstabbing. Which sucks. An enemy running away should be hit for more damage, just for showing their backs. I hit an enemy forward arc it hits. But if the enemy is outside my forward arc and I hit that activate skill button....my skill is auto-fail and on cooldown, and i'm taking that as a punishment. So all an enemy has to know is get behind a ranger...and their bow is completely useless. I turn, enemy keeps turning to stay on my rear arc. I can't spin fast enough to bring the target to bear.

 

I've found some really cool commanders who, when they don't have a full group, will add me, when i'm on my ranger. And I get a lot of leeway on some to scout, and move about keeping eyes on enemy. I got some commanders that don't complain about it, and I get a LOT of commanders that "grumble", but don't want to appear as jerks or part and parcel of the "exclusive classes" only club. For Rangers, it's not your fault. It's the fault of those that built the class that even admitted that they don't know what to do with the class. At the same time, if your not wanted in a group, it's still not your fault, because the Commanders have made no effort, absolutely NO effort to come up with builds to integrate our class into the bigger tapestry of WvW forward combat. Hell most commanders havn't even learned that 3 Rangers with barrage can melt enemy siege pretty damn fast, and acts even more powerful than a single Superior AC...which is sad in itself.

 

If you don't play the class, then you don't experiment. If you don't experiment, you don't know what combat tactics you can add to your repertoire. And if the enemy knows all you have is the head smash routine, then your going to continue smacking into a brick wall 15 times. And when you smash your head against the brick wall for a 16th time...do you believe it's going to be any different than the first 15 times? I highly doubt it.

 

Anet called Ranger's the Jack-of-all-trades. But we're really master's of none. But we'll be something most classes will never be. Open to possibilities. Something many commanders lack after 7 years in WvW.

[Deax.1572]

Ranged, Rogue play style has always been my thing. Gw2 is really meh atm, but when i do occasionally log on to play WvW i'll roam like i always have. I'm not interested in hugging the commander, never have really. Tried some support Boon beast, but scrapper is simply superior in a group setting. Instead i'll pick off targets i can pick off (mostly yummy squishy necros and other rangers/thieves), annoy the enemy squad, deny camp caps, cause small scale mayhem and scout if needed. I want to do my own thing, i want to kill people that doesn't involve a large scale Condi-Tank-Heal f*ck fest.

That and my CPU is outdated and it's not fun playing this poorly optimized game at large scale fights with 15 fps.

[anduriell.6280]

> @"KeyOrion.9506" said:

> Anet called Ranger's the Jack-of-all-trades. But we're really master's of none. But we'll be something most classes will never be. Open to possibilities. Something many commanders lack after 7 years in WvW.

The thing is rangers need very few touches here and there to make the class viable in squad comps. With soulbeast i think it would be enough with the changes pointed out in the OP post which aren't that many.

 

> @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> In terms of raw healing numbers, the druid is far ahead tempest and scrapper , the problem with druid is certainly not the healing output but rather the utility they bring and how they are held back by the pet dying all the times during zerg fight, if only anet could solve these issues...oh my ...druid would be magnificent

In WvW druid is not gatekeep by the Astral force generation, just with regeneration ticks it would fill up before the 10s CD expires. It is by the rest of the class, staff is awful, traits are awful, glyphs are awful and the weird mechanic with the dual effects for glyphs makes it even more awful

Pets bring nothing to the druid kit, they could be removed as well. The pets being dead do change nothing to the general perfomance of Druid in one squad.

 

[Kodama.6453]

> @"anduriell.6280" said:

 

Genuine question: If staff, traits, and glyphs of druid are so terrible, why is it taken so often as a healer in strike missions? When I did strike missions, druid were taken for the healing role fairly often, alongside the scourge or firebrand.

 

[Revolution.5409]

> @"Kodama.6453" said:

> Genuine question: If staff, traits, and glyphs of druid are so terrible, why is it taken so often as a healer in strike missions? When I did strike missions, druid were taken for the healing role fairly often, alongside the scourge or firebrand.

>

 

Spirits, that's the reason.

Although they are useless outside of any instanced content.

[anduriell.6280]

> @"Revolution.5409" said:

> > @"Kodama.6453" said:

> > Genuine question: If staff, traits, and glyphs of druid are so terrible, why is it taken so often as a healer in strike missions? When I did strike missions, druid were taken for the healing role fairly often, alongside the scourge or firebrand.

> >

>

> Spirits, that's the reason.

> Although they are useless outside of any instanced content.

Revolution is correct, as i said somewhere else druid is now a buff bot and nothing else. If at any point the exclusive buffs from spirits are removed druid will disappear from the game.

Druid is an mediocre PvE healer compared to FB, Tempest or Ventari ren.

 

[Sobx.1758]

> @"anduriell.6280" said:

> > @"Revolution.5409" said:

> > > @"Kodama.6453" said:

> > > Genuine question: If staff, traits, and glyphs of druid are so terrible, why is it taken so often as a healer in strike missions? When I did strike missions, druid were taken for the healing role fairly often, alongside the scourge or firebrand.

> > >

> >

> > Spirits, that's the reason.

> > Although they are useless outside of any instanced content.

> Revolution is correct, as i said somewhere else druid is now a buff bot and nothing else. If at any point the exclusive buffs from spirits are removed druid will disappear from the game.

> Druid is an mediocre PvE healer compared to FB, Tempest or Ventari ren.

 

Nah, druid is fine, it does what is supposed to do.

 

And slb/lb by far don't need buffs, that's just an unreasonable request.

[God.2708]

Probably a delineation to be made between 'Soulbeasts are not wanted in squads' and 'Squads do not need soulbeasts'.

 

Would I be happy to see a soulbeast that knows which enemies to target, watch for reflects, and won't let a banner get within 1.5k range of my group without dying? Slap that invite down. I'll even give you stab and free might n fury from a rev so you can do your job effectively.

 

Do I want a hoard of soulbeasts who think barrage is somehow a replacement for a well bomb? No. That will be a terrible time.

 

There is, generally, room for just about every spec in a squad assuming every single one of them knows their exact role and how to play. That is never the case, and so the tag is left figuring out how to heard a bunch of cats who think they know better. The easiest way to do that is narrow the scope in which the commander themselves need knowledge in IE. 3-4 classes that play really well together and require little discipline.

 

As for your opening post, if you cannot beat scourges on ARCdps in a 2 minute fight you are probably not the best person to consult on soulbeast usage in a squad. It has very little difficulty maintaining a higher total damage output (though it's damage should be 60% pick damage and so isn't the most useful metric).

 

 

[Revolution.5409]

> @"Sobx.1758" said:

> Nah, druid is fine, it does what is supposed to do.

>

 

So what should it do?

 

 

[Melian.5368]

It is really easy to give soulbeasts a place in squad if these changes are made.

Make commands affect 10 allies instead of 5.

Make stanceshare affect 10 allies instead of 5,

Make stanceshare share the 75 or 100% of its duration instead of 50%

Make greatsword cleave 4 targets instead of 3.

I regularly run with public tags on my soulbeast. It's on a sic'em build (just signet of stone instead of sick'em) and regularly I become the top dps when going into melee. I run marauder armor and the rest is zerker. If played with a brain, it's very hard to get killed. Giving more cleave to GS would make soulbeast OP and would be a choice just because of the damage option. Pets are a thing of choice, dps vs cc etc, but I can see how electric wyvern could be used in GvG style small zerg fights. Easy to learn & hard to master, the perfect class to go for experienced players. Come on ANet, make it so!

[God.2708]

> @"Melian.5368" said:

> It is really easy to give soulbeasts a place in squad if these changes are made.

> Make commands affect 10 allies instead of 5.

> Make stanceshare affect 10 allies instead of 5,

> Make stanceshare share the 75 or 100% of its duration instead of 50%

> Make greatsword cleave 4 targets instead of 3.

> I regularly run with public tags on my soulbeast. It's on a sic'em build (just signet of stone instead of sick'em) and regularly I become the top dps when going into melee. I run marauder armor and the rest is zerker. If played with a brain, it's very hard to get killed. Giving more cleave to GS would make soulbeast OP and would be a choice just because of the damage option. Pets are a thing of choice, dps vs cc etc, but I can see how electric wyvern could be used in GvG style small zerg fights. Easy to learn & hard to master, the perfect class to go for experienced players. Come on ANet, make it so!

 

That would utterly break soulbeasts in unfathomable ways. 10 person stance share with duration increase would mean permanent dolyak, moa, and OWP on the entire zerg. Making them OP is not necessary. They have a comfortable niche it's just very few soulbeasts want to spend the effort to get good at it and then be on friendly communication terms with a commander to show that they're worth it.

 

If your go to suggestion to get soulbeasts a 'place in squads' is to fundamentally break what Anets most recent patch is try to cut down on and then turn the entire zerg into absolutely nothing but soulbeasts, your suggestion needs work.

[Revolution.5409]

> @"God.2708" said:

> That would utterly break soulbeasts in unfathomable ways. 10 person stance share with duration increase would mean permanent dolyak, moa, and OWP on the entire zerg. Making them OP is not necessary. They have a comfortable niche it's just very few soulbeasts want to spend the effort to get good at it and then be on friendly communication terms with a commander to show that they're worth it.

>

> If your go to suggestion to get soulbeasts a 'place in squads' is to fundamentally break what Anets most recent patch is try to cut down on and then turn the entire zerg into absolutely nothing but soulbeasts, your suggestion needs work.

 

So even the Fbs stackings that can perma Boon, Bubbles, Cures etc ... are bad right?

 

If stances could be applied to 10 people without modification, support Slb could really be taken into consideration, it would be at least a step forward.

 

Regarding the last part, I don't know what game you've played so far but Ranger and Thief are the only two professions that have never had a Build Zergs, no decent WvW team would bring a Ranger in their group, Ranger brings nothing to the group that other professions don't do better, we can only Roaming.

 

> @"Revolution.5409" said:

> Simple because it can't do anything that other professions don't do better.

> Druid is a joke compared to FB.

> Slb (back line) has excellent damage but most (if not all) of its damage is absorbed or reflected and has little Aoe damage, this puts Ele in a much better position.

> Ranger has the problem of having pets that are constantly dead.

> Warrior offers more CC, has more stability and skills that allow him to survive on the front line and Winds of Disenchantment is one of the best Elite.

> Necro needs no introduction.

> Then there are exceptions, Tempest and Scrapper have better healings than Druid, the mesmer portal or the veil are unique abilities.

>

> There is no reason to put a Ranger in a Zerg, we can follow and try to bring down someone with Build Oneshot hoping that he will not be resurrected instantly

 

 

[God.2708]

> @"Revolution.5409" said:

>

> So even the Fbs stackings that can perma Boon, Bubbles, Cures etc ... are bad right?

>

> If stances could be applied to 10 people without modification, support Slb could really be taken into consideration, it would be at least a step forward.

>

> Regarding the last part, I don't know what game you've played so far but Ranger and Thief are the only two professions that have never had a Build Zergs, no decent WvW team would bring a Ranger in their group, Ranger brings nothing to the group that other professions don't do better, we can only Roaming.

 

Playing a game where I command and take rangers or thieves into squad given they communicate and I'm familiar with what they do and can trust them to do that job well.

 

10 target stances would immediately turn every squad into 3 soulbeast 2 spellbreaker squads because soulbeasts could maintain infinite stability, damage reduction, extra damage, and boon duration in a way firebrands only dream of, and spellbreakers will do the boonstrip you need.

 

I don't need soulbeasts to do a firebrands job. I need soulbeasts to recognize that you can OWP, Sic'em, with a signet of hunt rapid fire and down anything in the game in less than a second, and to know who you should be doing that to since it has a 25s CD. And to recognize you need maybe 1 of those per 20-25 people, not 1 per 5. Because there are 9 classes and 27 specs and it's an impossibility for every class to have a 1 per 5 spec.

 

[Revolution.5409]

> @"God.2708" said:

> > @"Revolution.5409" said:

> >

> > So even the Fbs stackings that can perma Boon, Bubbles, Cures etc ... are bad right?

> >

> > If stances could be applied to 10 people without modification, support Slb could really be taken into consideration, it would be at least a step forward.

> >

> > Regarding the last part, I don't know what game you've played so far but Ranger and Thief are the only two professions that have never had a Build Zergs, no decent WvW team would bring a Ranger in their group, Ranger brings nothing to the group that other professions don't do better, we can only Roaming.

>

> Playing a game where I command and take rangers or thieves into squad given they communicate and I'm familiar with what they do and can trust them to do that job well.

>

> 10 target stances would immediately turn every squad into 3 soulbeast 2 spellbreaker squads because soulbeasts could maintain infinite stability, damage reduction, extra damage, and boon duration in a way firebrands only dream of, and spellbreakers will do the boonstrip you need.

>

> I don't need soulbeasts to do a firebrands job. I need soulbeasts to recognize that you can OWP, Sic'em, with a signet of hunt rapid fire and down anything in the game in less than a second, and to know who you should be doing that to since it has a 25s CD. And to recognize you need maybe 1 of those per 20-25 people, not 1 per 5. Because there are 9 classes and 27 specs and it's an impossibility for every class to have a 1 per 5 spec.

>

 

 

Anything that would change the Meta slightly would be fine, and if that something is brought by Ranger or Thief it would be even better.

Currently FB covers most of the roles.

 

In any case, that combination of Slb can only be used against those who do not follow their commander, with all the Absorption and Reflect Projectile abilities, it is almost impossible one shots players in the zergs and if even if I were to succeed I should hope that they will not be revived instantly , only pugs can be killed like this.

[KeyOrion.9506]

> @"anduriell.6280" said:

> > @"KeyOrion.9506" said:

> > Anet called Ranger's the Jack-of-all-trades. But we're really master's of none. But we'll be something most classes will never be. Open to possibilities. Something many commanders lack after 7 years in WvW.

> The thing is rangers need very few touches here and there to make the class viable in squad comps. With soulbeast i think it would be enough with the changes pointed out in the OP post which aren't that many.

>

> > @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> > In terms of raw healing numbers, the druid is far ahead tempest and scrapper , the problem with druid is certainly not the healing output but rather the utility they bring and how they are held back by the pet dying all the times during zerg fight, if only anet could solve these issues...oh my ...druid would be magnificent

> In WvW druid is not gatekeep by the Astral force generation, just with regeneration ticks it would fill up before the 10s CD expires. It is by the rest of the class, staff is awful, traits are awful, glyphs are awful and the weird mechanic with the dual effects for glyphs makes it even more awful

> Pets bring nothing to the druid kit, they could be removed as well. The pets being dead do change nothing to the general perfomance of Druid in one squad.

>

 

Reason why when running with group, the ranger will run Bonded Jacarda, for the healing boost.

[anduriell.6280]

> @"God.2708" said:

> Playing a game where I command and take rangers or thieves into squad given they communicate and I'm familiar with what they do and can trust them to do that job well.

>

> 10 target stances would immediately turn every squad into 3 soulbeast 2 spellbreaker squads because soulbeasts could maintain infinite stability, damage reduction, extra damage, and boon duration in a way firebrands only dream of, and spellbreakers will do the boonstrip you need.

>

> I don't need soulbeasts to do a firebrands job. I need soulbeasts to recognize that you can OWP, Sic'em, with a signet of hunt rapid fire and down anything in the game in less than a second, and to know who you should be doing that to since it has a 25s CD. And to recognize you need maybe 1 of those per 20-25 people, not 1 per 5. Because there are 9 classes and 27 specs and it's an impossibility for every class to have a 1 per 5 spec.

>

That's not going to work chief. Soulbeast has the potential to become an off-support being able to replace a FB if there isn't one and it should take that place. Stacking in not an issue as meta classes also stack and i don't heard complains. Sometimes there aren't enough FBs and Soulbeast could fill in for it.

 

Extending to 10 targets would be a next step if after extending the Leader of the Pack allies duration to 100% is not enough to make Soulbeast desirable in squads. Also the weapons need small improvements:

* projectiles with the unblockable from Lead of the Wind should be fine.

* Sword and GS are fine

* Dagger MH needs to have increased target cap to 3. Range extended to 150 and all attacks work in a 180º front of the ranger. Right now the angle and range seems to small to be effective.

 

 

[Strider.7849]

I can tell you one major reason while soulbeast isn't wanted in squads (assuming the player is using it optimally and not a bad one).

 

Projectile reflect/destruction.

 

Against a competent zerg, they will have scrappers/spellbreakers/firebrands/tempests. All of which can lead to near complete negation of the damage you can do on soulbeast. At best you hit people on the outskirts. Dagger mainhand/sword/greatsword.. all bad weapons for zerging, greatsword can cleave but again you're not doing much for the zerg. The shared boons don't last long as the reduction to allies in the trait is really big. Dolyak stance has too long of a cooldown and is just one skill, one Wolf pack is decent DPS but again, will only be used once, and the heal can cleanse but not continually like.. well any other support except druid.

 

I've used my soulbeast with success against zergs that don't have optimal groups and it's quite strong there, but literally anything group can wipe them, there's nothing unique or strong that it brings to group fights. Ranger as a whole is just better suited to roaming.

[God.2708]

> @"anduriell.6280" said:

> > @"God.2708" said:

> > Playing a game where I command and take rangers or thieves into squad given they communicate and I'm familiar with what they do and can trust them to do that job well.

> >

> > 10 target stances would immediately turn every squad into 3 soulbeast 2 spellbreaker squads because soulbeasts could maintain infinite stability, damage reduction, extra damage, and boon duration in a way firebrands only dream of, and spellbreakers will do the boonstrip you need.

> >

> > I don't need soulbeasts to do a firebrands job. I need soulbeasts to recognize that you can OWP, Sic'em, with a signet of hunt rapid fire and down anything in the game in less than a second, and to know who you should be doing that to since it has a 25s CD. And to recognize you need maybe 1 of those per 20-25 people, not 1 per 5. Because there are 9 classes and 27 specs and it's an impossibility for every class to have a 1 per 5 spec.

> >

> That's not going to work chief. Soulbeast has the potential to become an off-support being able to replace a FB if there isn't one and it should take that place. Stacking in not an issue as meta classes also stack and i don't heard complains. Sometimes there aren't enough FBs and Soulbeast could fill in for it.

>

> Extending to 10 targets would be a next step if after extending the Leader of the Pack allies duration to 100% is not enough to make Soulbeast desirable in squads. Also the weapons need small improvements:

> * projectiles with the unblockable from Lead of the Wind should be fine.

> * Sword and GS are fine

> * Dagger MH needs to have increased target cap to 3. Range extended to 150 and all attacks work in a 180º front of the ranger. Right now the angle and range seems to small to be effective.

>

>

 

I... don't think you understand why FB is support. It isn't because of SYG, or core and DH would be interchangeable with it. The goal is to minimize stacking, and people do complain about it quite a bit. Your suggestions don't encourage stacking SB, they encourage running absolutely nothing fucking else because they are so over the top.

 

10 target casts are not on the table. Drop it.

 

Make dagger work unlike every other dagger in the game (aside from ele, I guess)? What?