Zoria.1392 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 Does the incomplete stop progress of anything else? If not, leave it alone. If so, try this: 1. Watch videos of others doing it until a path appears doable to you. 2. Try out that EXACT path-- everything they skip, everything they double hop on etc... 3. Repeat it-- exactly the same way-- at least a few times a day, but STOP when you get super frustrated and start missing the easy stuff. In time you will see yourself getting further and further, as if you are in autopilot and you won't even have to think/stress. Also note: Once you get past the jump down part, you have more time to relax and take your time-- AND the jumps get a lot easier. The coolest thing is that once you start getting up there you will be able to repeat this year and get it done, easily, next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeandMyEgo.6587 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 I JUST WANNA KNOW WHY I HAVE TO WAIT FOR THE ACID TO CATCH UP IN THE BEGINNING WHEN I CAN OUT RUN IT FROM THE START AND MAKE IT A BIT EASIER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omar Aschi Popp.7496 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 Question. If you go to starbucks RIGHT NOW and ask for the Exclusice Black Apron 2009 3-region blend(only available in 1/2lb)... What do you think they will say? What will you say? "IM A CUSTOMER AND I DEMMAND SASSISFAXSHION!!!!!" NICE TRY NO BEANS FOR YOU YOU HAD TO BE THERE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deihnyx.6318 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > > @STIHL.2489 said: > > > > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > > > > @STIHL.2489 said: > > > > > > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > > > > > Wow... I find it easy and a matter of muscle memory (aka yeah, anyone can do it) so I'm a kid or I take drugs? > > > > > > > > > > Well, I can't say if you are child or not, but the dismissive "aka: yeah anyone can do it" is a very childish style of dismissive statement. No, just because you have good muscle memory, does not mean anyone can do it, it means nothing more then it was easy for you This has no bearing on how hard or easy it may be for anyone else. I used to farm, he work I thought was easy often broke city kids, their hands blistered, and because I was immature at the time, I would laugh at them and tell them that they just need to toughen up, it was easy work. > > > > > > > > > > Yah.. while I may noting about your physical age, there is nothing mature in your response. > > > > > > > > You aren't explaining how the statement is not true, you're just saying that some people will have a hard time. > > > > Yes, we agree on that. It's hard for some people. Here's the thing: It doesn't make the statement "anyone can do it" any less true. > > > > > > > > > > No.. I am saying, regardless if you believe this or not .. some people don't, nor will they ever have the manual dexterity and muscle memory to do these kinds of jump puzzles. > > > > > > I get the need to parade your feelings of being better then other people around in a game, egotism, vanity, and all that jazz, that is what raids are for, for you all to go do something none of us casuals care about, where you stroke your ego how good you are at it. But, no matter what you may think, you are very wrong about anyone being able to do something. > > > > Yes, you absolutely get it since it's the very reason you made this thread. Congrats you got the point of any MMO. > > Why did you make this thread if not for your own ego? > > Actually I just wanted to complete the book, because I thought it looked cool, and I thought I needed to do the JP to get it done. Since I don't.. it's not such an issue, > > Now answer me this, But, how does me getting something in game that will never affect you.. somehow affect you? An interesting question. To me directly? Absolutely nothing. To the game? A lot. Because if there'd be an easy way for everything, if all the skins could be "cheesed", then people who did it legit would lose the prestige value of their "work" (which you consider vanity), skins would lose their value (if everyone has it, it has no value), titles like no more heroes wouldn't mean anything anymore, etc. I personally HATE grinding, I hate things gated being timegates and goldsinks that forces me to redo the same events 250 times. But I understand that for some players (who don't like hard content) it's a good way of achieving something and getting recognition from it (through legendary weapons). I wouldn't want to nerf their obtention even though I hate it. You will kill an MMO if you keep giving away everything easily. Like I can guarantee you that if you ever ask for w1/2 trib mode of SAB to give out their skins "for free", you're gonna face the same resistance, because there are people who went through all of that, "worked" to that objective and like the recognition from the game that they finished it. It's not necessarily about bragging to other players, it's personal fulfillment. You seem to always think that everything we as players who like challenge to is to "show off", if that was the case solo games wouldn't have achievements. It is as much our right to enjoy that type of content as it that it is yours to enjoy the casual content. It's a balance, you can't have everything go casual just like we can't have everything be challenging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dondarrion.2748 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @DebraKadabra.5278 said: > Honestly, with how unused to Action Cam that I am it would make me fall more and get stuck in the green goo more. Most of us who were around for 1st year have done Clock Tower without Action Cam :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spurnshadow.3678 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 I think in 5 years I've finished it 3 times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightshade.5924 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > @Nightshade.5924 said: > > > @STIHL.2489 said: > > > > @troops.8276 said: > > > > > @Samnang.1879 said: > > > > > Can ppl pls stop complaining about the difficulty of things in this game??? > > > > > NOTHING in the game is that hard (save from getting god of pvp title). > > > > > 90% of guild wars 2 content is easy and made for casuals, hearts, map events, low level fractals, stories. this jp is something that comes once every year, let the ppl who enjoy the challenge have their enjoyment of the challenge instead of making anet dum down all the content cuz u can't do it. its not fair and unreasonable. > > > > > > > > I think OP was 'complaining' about their own inability and not asking for it too be 'dumbed down'. Rather just wanting a 'different' way to complete it. > > > > > > > > Something may be easy for you but that doesn't mean its easy for everyone. Just like how it was easy for me to understand what the OP actually meant. ;) > > > > > > > > Some things may be relatively easy for most people but may take time and time is a commodity that many don't have much of. Or as the 'no lifers' put it 'casual'. > > > > > > This was my point, it also stonewalls progress in many other activities, like the book, and the boots. If the clock tower was standalone, I'd be more then happy to avoid it and let people farm it for bags and whatever. But, since it's tied to a few other items, I don't think it's asking to much, to give a "You gave it your best" completion, after 100 tries. > > > > > > > @Loboling.5293 said: > > > > I'm fine with this. I can't remember how many tries it took me. I don't think I ever would've gotten it if not for watching other people beat it, as I tried to keep up with them. It was one of the best feelings I had when I finally beat it, and now every year I do it still just to help others get up. > > > > > > > > However, if someone wants to avoid that high you get when you finally beat it, and you've been trying 100 times. I say, why not give it to you. You're missing one fun feeling when you beat it on your own. > > > > > > > > Anyway, after 100 times if you haven't made any real progress, just give them the achievement. My opinion. > > > > > > I agree, there should be some kind of maybe checkpoint, that have to reach for it to count.. like say.. you need to at least jump onto the platform that comes off the tower wall at the start. I know I fail getting past that point a lot. But getting to it would remove the AFK players at least. > > > > This is the Winter's Presence scenario all over again. What really kills me is all the people who are "It's easy, anyone can do it". I wish I could take these people and subject them to a series of REAL world trials of skill. Say shooting, car racing, billiards, orienteering, baseball, basketball, and a math test. And then I wish I could GRADE them on their success or lack thereof in ALL of those skills TOGETHER, and then say... you LOST your completion of the Clock Tower and NEVER can have it because you're not good enough in all these skills. > > > > Because that is what ANet is doing by gating an armor piece behind this jumping puzzle. Jumping is a skill. Making it a timed event makes it DIFFICULT SKILL. VERY. Anyone who says otherwise is likely under 20 years old or possibly jumped up on illegal substances. > > Personally, after the FIRST TWO TRIES at the CT, I just walked away. That was three, four years ago. I think I accidentally went in one other time. That's it. I play games to have fun, blow up/maim/kill mobs, to decompress and enjoy myself. I don't enjoy JP's, never have, NEVER will, and to have ANY content whatsoever gated behind a JP, especially a JP that is CLEARLY designed for very good to superior hand to eye co-ordination and reflexes is TOTALLY INSULTING TO ME PERSONALLY. > > > > Anet needs to STOP insulting its customers in this fashion. I truly hope that THIS wintersday that Anet has come up with an ALTERNATE METHOD to gain the step currently covered by the WD JP. And I also hope that the next time that Anet considers gating something behind a uber crazy insane difficult JP, that they PROVIDE another pathway that is REASONALBE... and I also hope that they observe the stats on how many people AVOID the JP. Might give us some real numbers to talk about. > > Nuff said. > > Wow... I find it easy and a matter of muscle memory (aka yeah, anyone can do it) so I'm a kid or I take drugs? > I can't even imagine what you think of raids lol. > > I think you're the one insulting players who like trial and error challenges. Anet is just providing some very limited content that is based around that. The Clock Tower is one of them and so is trial and tribulations from SAB. There's still (Thanks gods) a playerbase for that kind of content, or games like Dark Souls, Binding of Isaac, Risk of Rain, whatever, would not be critical successes. > > > It was challenging for me at first, I tried for hours the first year and I finally got it, and I will confirm what everyone else said, it's more memory muscle than anything, it's absolutely FINE if you don't want to spend time on that but stop asking for nerf just because you don't want to do that. > I don't care what real skills you have irl, it doesn't matter, it's a video game, you're tested on the mechanics of that video game, and you're not automatically right or legitimate because you're having issues beating some content. This kind of behavior actually IS typical of this new generation of gamers that blame a game for offering challenge, something no older gamer who played during the golden age of video games would ever do. > > And that is why I was against the Eater of Soul nerf. The more you nerf a game, the more people want to keep nerfing it. "I tried for hours...." kinda says it all for me. I'll look into the armor thing, and I'll see just how easy or not it is to craft it. Given the trend displayed in Ascended crafting, I'm not exactly hopeful at this moment. And if you're insulted... that's too bad. Join the club, as I am insulted every time I contemplate having to do a JP for ANYTHING. A timed JP is NOT a trial and error puzzle. It is an exercise in high end reflexes, timing, and memory, both muscle and cognitive. Trial and error implies that you HAVE TIME to CONSIDER and ANALYZE the environment, and the TIME to form a STRATEGY and RESPONSE. And I AM not asking for a nerf... I want an ALTERNATE method, like say complete x pvp games, or spend x time in wvw, something like that.... OR a version of the puzzle that doesn't sink into the death goo. NON timed, NON sinking, NON insane, in other words. Take away any real rewards if you want, just give me credit for completion, that'd be fine. I've expressed a similar sentiment two years running in regards to the Winters Day JP, and still remain hopeful that the devs WILL eventually see reason. OH, and BTW.. the WD JP is WHY once I DID my two tries, I quit. I had tried the WD the previous December, and just about threw my laptop through a wall after about three hours of continually dying and getting nowhere. Two tries was all it took for me to see that the CT would be more of the same. The bottom line is... don't put ANYTHING, achievement points, gold, rewards, ANYTHING, behind something that CANNOT BE DONE BY EVERYONE. And I'd have to say that it's clear that TIMED JP's fall into that category. Last thing... I AM an older gamer and NO, I don't do raids, as a matter of fact. And that's part of my problem DOING this sort of puzzle. My reflexes simply are not up to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omar Aschi Popp.7496 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > @"Omar Aschi Popp.7496" said: > > > @STIHL.2489 said: > > > > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > > > > @STIHL.2489 said: > > > > > > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > > > > > > @STIHL.2489 said: > > > > > > > > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > > > > > > > Wow... I find it easy and a matter of muscle memory (aka yeah, anyone can do it) so I'm a kid or I take drugs? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, I can't say if you are child or not, but the dismissive "aka: yeah anyone can do it" is a very childish style of dismissive statement. No, just because you have good muscle memory, does not mean anyone can do it, it means nothing more then it was easy for you This has no bearing on how hard or easy it may be for anyone else. I used to farm, he work I thought was easy often broke city kids, their hands blistered, and because I was immature at the time, I would laugh at them and tell them that they just need to toughen up, it was easy work. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yah.. while I may noting about your physical age, there is nothing mature in your response. > > > > > > > > > > > > You aren't explaining how the statement is not true, you're just saying that some people will have a hard time. > > > > > > Yes, we agree on that. It's hard for some people. Here's the thing: It doesn't make the statement "anyone can do it" any less true. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No.. I am saying, regardless if you believe this or not .. some people don't, nor will they ever have the manual dexterity and muscle memory to do these kinds of jump puzzles. > > > > > > > > > > I get the need to parade your feelings of being better then other people around in a game, egotism, vanity, and all that jazz, that is what raids are for, for you all to go do something none of us casuals care about, where you stroke your ego how good you are at it. But, no matter what you may think, you are very wrong about anyone being able to do something. > > > > > > > > Yes, you absolutely get it since it's the very reason you made this thread. Congrats you got the point of any MMO. > > > > Why did you make this thread if not for your own ego? > > > > > > Actually I just wanted to complete the book, because I thought it looked cool, and I thought I needed to do the JP to get it done. Since I don't.. it's not such an issue, > > > > > > Now answer me this, But, how does me getting something in game that will never affect you.. somehow affect you? > > > > Ego ego ego > > Yes, you play a game for yourself, I hardly see why people use it as an argument... Im with you in this argument Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samnang.1879 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @troops.8276 said: > > ?? > > Requesting for a success reward after 100 failed attempts is asking for anet to kitten it down, since you don't have to successfully complete something to succeed in it. > > I never said this jp was easy, i said it was a challenge. I said hearts are easy, it's objective, not subjective, if anyone in this universe thinks gw2 hearts are hard, then idk what to say. I'ts the most braindead activity i know. > > > > I never been able to get gold in most HoT adventures, i'm not going to come on here to complain, "OMG i cna't get gold, plz give me pity gold reward"... kitten... that just invalidate other's efforts. It's like throwing a pie in their face. > > I see, I took 'dum down the content'' to mean making the content it self easier as opposed to making getting the reward, subjectively, easier. Doing it 100x is perseverance, which is a good thing that is often rewarded. For example in grind based games like, I don't know, most mmo's? I doubt I could persevere more than a couple of times to say, explain something to a kitten. > > Oh, you also said 90% of the game was easy not just hearts amongst other things but I'll say no more on it ;) Yeah, i stand by what i said, 90% of the game is easy, proceeded by examples, such as hearts, personal stories, world events, world bosses... literally i afk and press 1 while watching netflix when doing world bosses and never die. It don't get easier than that. And no, hard content isn't only just for no-lifers, when i was working full time, i managed to get raid w4 challenge mote title. i dedicated 5 hours each day for 7 days to get the title. do i expect others to have this dedication? no. but if u dont' put in the effort/dedication, then you dont deserve the reward. just like a group of people want easy content, there are groups that want hard content. there are only few hard content in the game (raids, 99cm 100cm fractals, the jp), yet everyday the forum gets complain about ppl wanting them to be easier. Why? Do i support anet making easier versions of those things? Yes. Do i want anet to modify the hard content, absolutely NO. hard content is what makes some ppl want to play the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deihnyx.6318 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @Nightshade.5924 said: > > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > > @Nightshade.5924 said: > > > > @STIHL.2489 said: > > > > > @troops.8276 said: > > > > > > @Samnang.1879 said: > > > > > > Can ppl pls stop complaining about the difficulty of things in this game??? > > > > > > NOTHING in the game is that hard (save from getting god of pvp title). > > > > > > 90% of guild wars 2 content is easy and made for casuals, hearts, map events, low level fractals, stories. this jp is something that comes once every year, let the ppl who enjoy the challenge have their enjoyment of the challenge instead of making anet dum down all the content cuz u can't do it. its not fair and unreasonable. > > > > > > > > > > I think OP was 'complaining' about their own inability and not asking for it too be 'dumbed down'. Rather just wanting a 'different' way to complete it. > > > > > > > > > > Something may be easy for you but that doesn't mean its easy for everyone. Just like how it was easy for me to understand what the OP actually meant. ;) > > > > > > > > > > Some things may be relatively easy for most people but may take time and time is a commodity that many don't have much of. Or as the 'no lifers' put it 'casual'. > > > > > > > > This was my point, it also stonewalls progress in many other activities, like the book, and the boots. If the clock tower was standalone, I'd be more then happy to avoid it and let people farm it for bags and whatever. But, since it's tied to a few other items, I don't think it's asking to much, to give a "You gave it your best" completion, after 100 tries. > > > > > > > > > @Loboling.5293 said: > > > > > I'm fine with this. I can't remember how many tries it took me. I don't think I ever would've gotten it if not for watching other people beat it, as I tried to keep up with them. It was one of the best feelings I had when I finally beat it, and now every year I do it still just to help others get up. > > > > > > > > > > However, if someone wants to avoid that high you get when you finally beat it, and you've been trying 100 times. I say, why not give it to you. You're missing one fun feeling when you beat it on your own. > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, after 100 times if you haven't made any real progress, just give them the achievement. My opinion. > > > > > > > > I agree, there should be some kind of maybe checkpoint, that have to reach for it to count.. like say.. you need to at least jump onto the platform that comes off the tower wall at the start. I know I fail getting past that point a lot. But getting to it would remove the AFK players at least. > > > > > > This is the Winter's Presence scenario all over again. What really kills me is all the people who are "It's easy, anyone can do it". I wish I could take these people and subject them to a series of REAL world trials of skill. Say shooting, car racing, billiards, orienteering, baseball, basketball, and a math test. And then I wish I could GRADE them on their success or lack thereof in ALL of those skills TOGETHER, and then say... you LOST your completion of the Clock Tower and NEVER can have it because you're not good enough in all these skills. > > > > > > Because that is what ANet is doing by gating an armor piece behind this jumping puzzle. Jumping is a skill. Making it a timed event makes it DIFFICULT SKILL. VERY. Anyone who says otherwise is likely under 20 years old or possibly jumped up on illegal substances. > > > Personally, after the FIRST TWO TRIES at the CT, I just walked away. That was three, four years ago. I think I accidentally went in one other time. That's it. I play games to have fun, blow up/maim/kill mobs, to decompress and enjoy myself. I don't enjoy JP's, never have, NEVER will, and to have ANY content whatsoever gated behind a JP, especially a JP that is CLEARLY designed for very good to superior hand to eye co-ordination and reflexes is TOTALLY INSULTING TO ME PERSONALLY. > > > > > > Anet needs to STOP insulting its customers in this fashion. I truly hope that THIS wintersday that Anet has come up with an ALTERNATE METHOD to gain the step currently covered by the WD JP. And I also hope that the next time that Anet considers gating something behind a uber crazy insane difficult JP, that they PROVIDE another pathway that is REASONALBE... and I also hope that they observe the stats on how many people AVOID the JP. Might give us some real numbers to talk about. > > > Nuff said. > > > > Wow... I find it easy and a matter of muscle memory (aka yeah, anyone can do it) so I'm a kid or I take drugs? > > I can't even imagine what you think of raids lol. > > > > I think you're the one insulting players who like trial and error challenges. Anet is just providing some very limited content that is based around that. The Clock Tower is one of them and so is trial and tribulations from SAB. There's still (Thanks gods) a playerbase for that kind of content, or games like Dark Souls, Binding of Isaac, Risk of Rain, whatever, would not be critical successes. > > > > > > It was challenging for me at first, I tried for hours the first year and I finally got it, and I will confirm what everyone else said, it's more memory muscle than anything, it's absolutely FINE if you don't want to spend time on that but stop asking for nerf just because you don't want to do that. > > I don't care what real skills you have irl, it doesn't matter, it's a video game, you're tested on the mechanics of that video game, and you're not automatically right or legitimate because you're having issues beating some content. This kind of behavior actually IS typical of this new generation of gamers that blame a game for offering challenge, something no older gamer who played during the golden age of video games would ever do. > > > > And that is why I was against the Eater of Soul nerf. The more you nerf a game, the more people want to keep nerfing it. > > "I tried for hours...." kinda says it all for me. I'll look into the armor thing, and I'll see just how easy or not it is to craft it. Given the trend displayed in Ascended crafting, I'm not exactly hopeful at this moment. And if you're insulted... that's too bad. Join the club, as I am insulted every time I contemplate having to do a JP for ANYTHING. A timed JP is NOT a trial and error puzzle. It is an exercise in high end reflexes, timing, and memory, both muscle and cognitive. Trial and error implies that you HAVE TIME to CONSIDER and ANALYZE the environment, and the TIME to form a STRATEGY and RESPONSE. > And I AM not asking for a nerf... I want an ALTERNATE method, like say complete x pvp games, or spend x time in wvw, something like that.... OR a version of the puzzle that doesn't sink into the death goo. NON timed, NON sinking, NON insane, in other words. Take away any real rewards if you want, just give me credit for completion, that'd be fine. > I've expressed a similar sentiment two years running in regards to the Winters Day JP, and still remain hopeful that the devs WILL eventually see reason. OH, and BTW.. the WD JP is WHY once I DID my two tries, I quit. I had tried the WD the previous December, and just about threw my laptop through a wall after about three hours of continually dying and getting nowhere. Two tries was all it took for me to see that the CT would be more of the same. The bottom line is... don't put ANYTHING, achievement points, gold, rewards, ANYTHING, behind something that CANNOT BE DONE BY EVERYONE. And I'd have to say that it's clear that TIMED JP's fall into that category. Last thing... I AM an older gamer and NO, I don't do raids, as a matter of fact. And that's part of my problem DOING this sort of puzzle. My reflexes simply are not up to it. There's a difference between feeling "frustrated" by content that you can't do and insulting players, like you did. One is taking a game too seriously, the other is attacking players not even because they were mean to you or anything but simply because they've done it, and are discussing how they're doing it with much more ease now that they assimilated how to do it. The clock tower is 100% trial and error. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind about that, and it's backed by a lot of people here who've actually done it more than 2 times. This is non sense to give you "completion" credit for something you haven't completed. Like... at all. I can discuss the argument that some stuff (like armor) is gated behind content that may seem challenging (but it's not gated since you can craft it), I don't have a problem with an easier version like SAB does, however if you haven't completed the "normal" tower, you haven't completed it. About your last paragraph... seriously if you want everything to be doable by everyone go play a telltale game that gives achievements for everyone. Seriously, this is a MMO, there is casual stuff, there is grind stuff, there is challenging stuff. Play what you like to play in this game and accept the fact that there's stuff in this game that isn't for you. AP, gold, rewards are gated behind everything and every mode. Unless you play WvW, PVP, PVE and Raids, you're gonna miss some of them, and that shows some self entitlement to want to remove some rewards just because you can't get rank 2000 in wvw, just because you can't win a pvp tournament, just because you can't finish all raids or just because you can't do a jumping puzzle! Oh and they should remove prenium skins I guess, since not everyone can farm the gold and not everyone has a heavy credit card? Like seriously please realize how you would be impacting others by getting things done your way. Nobody can get everything, half of the fun is the journey to get there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shard.4791 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 I completed the JP with keyboard turning as a challenge inspired by this thread. It can be done but it's slower and less forgiving. Learning a new control system probably helps in this JP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayakaru.6583 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 Im not trying to sound demeaning here, but you don't /have/ to beat the clocktower. If you want/need the lunatic armor piece, you can buy the recipe for 1 candy corn cob (2 fornthe chest piece recipe) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @UrMom.4205 said: > Curious, the JP is just 10 ap, does it really matter that much? Just skip it and do the other ones. There's also the repeatable achi that adds more ap on top of it. And the boots block a different collection. Additionally, there's the waiting for everyone that makes repeating it (to learn the path) really irritating. And for me it requires a _lot_ of repeats (i was never good with timed JPs, even with slower ones, and that one is definitely way too fast for me). Maybe it would have been better if i could practice it in a solo instance, at my own pace, not having to do it at a pace decided by several other people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @Nightshade.5924 said: > > @Deihnyx.6318 said: > > > @Nightshade.5924 said: > > > > @STIHL.2489 said: > > > > > @troops.8276 said: > > > > > > @Samnang.1879 said: > > > > > > Can ppl pls stop complaining about the difficulty of things in this game??? > > > > > > NOTHING in the game is that hard (save from getting god of pvp title). > > > > > > 90% of guild wars 2 content is easy and made for casuals, hearts, map events, low level fractals, stories. this jp is something that comes once every year, let the ppl who enjoy the challenge have their enjoyment of the challenge instead of making anet dum down all the content cuz u can't do it. its not fair and unreasonable. > > > > > > > > > > I think OP was 'complaining' about their own inability and not asking for it too be 'dumbed down'. Rather just wanting a 'different' way to complete it. > > > > > > > > > > Something may be easy for you but that doesn't mean its easy for everyone. Just like how it was easy for me to understand what the OP actually meant. ;) > > > > > > > > > > Some things may be relatively easy for most people but may take time and time is a commodity that many don't have much of. Or as the 'no lifers' put it 'casual'. > > > > > > > > This was my point, it also stonewalls progress in many other activities, like the book, and the boots. If the clock tower was standalone, I'd be more then happy to avoid it and let people farm it for bags and whatever. But, since it's tied to a few other items, I don't think it's asking to much, to give a "You gave it your best" completion, after 100 tries. > > > > > > > > > @Loboling.5293 said: > > > > > I'm fine with this. I can't remember how many tries it took me. I don't think I ever would've gotten it if not for watching other people beat it, as I tried to keep up with them. It was one of the best feelings I had when I finally beat it, and now every year I do it still just to help others get up. > > > > > > > > > > However, if someone wants to avoid that high you get when you finally beat it, and you've been trying 100 times. I say, why not give it to you. You're missing one fun feeling when you beat it on your own. > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, after 100 times if you haven't made any real progress, just give them the achievement. My opinion. > > > > > > > > I agree, there should be some kind of maybe checkpoint, that have to reach for it to count.. like say.. you need to at least jump onto the platform that comes off the tower wall at the start. I know I fail getting past that point a lot. But getting to it would remove the AFK players at least. > > > > > > This is the Winter's Presence scenario all over again. What really kills me is all the people who are "It's easy, anyone can do it". I wish I could take these people and subject them to a series of REAL world trials of skill. Say shooting, car racing, billiards, orienteering, baseball, basketball, and a math test. And then I wish I could GRADE them on their success or lack thereof in ALL of those skills TOGETHER, and then say... you LOST your completion of the Clock Tower and NEVER can have it because you're not good enough in all these skills. > > > > > > Because that is what ANet is doing by gating an armor piece behind this jumping puzzle. Jumping is a skill. Making it a timed event makes it DIFFICULT SKILL. VERY. Anyone who says otherwise is likely under 20 years old or possibly jumped up on illegal substances. > > > Personally, after the FIRST TWO TRIES at the CT, I just walked away. That was three, four years ago. I think I accidentally went in one other time. That's it. I play games to have fun, blow up/maim/kill mobs, to decompress and enjoy myself. I don't enjoy JP's, never have, NEVER will, and to have ANY content whatsoever gated behind a JP, especially a JP that is CLEARLY designed for very good to superior hand to eye co-ordination and reflexes is TOTALLY INSULTING TO ME PERSONALLY. > > > > > > Anet needs to STOP insulting its customers in this fashion. I truly hope that THIS wintersday that Anet has come up with an ALTERNATE METHOD to gain the step currently covered by the WD JP. And I also hope that the next time that Anet considers gating something behind a uber crazy insane difficult JP, that they PROVIDE another pathway that is REASONALBE... and I also hope that they observe the stats on how many people AVOID the JP. Might give us some real numbers to talk about. > > > Nuff said. > > > > Wow... I find it easy and a matter of muscle memory (aka yeah, anyone can do it) so I'm a kid or I take drugs? > > I can't even imagine what you think of raids lol. > > > > I think you're the one insulting players who like trial and error challenges. Anet is just providing some very limited content that is based around that. The Clock Tower is one of them and so is trial and tribulations from SAB. There's still (Thanks gods) a playerbase for that kind of content, or games like Dark Souls, Binding of Isaac, Risk of Rain, whatever, would not be critical successes. > > > > > > It was challenging for me at first, I tried for hours the first year and I finally got it, and I will confirm what everyone else said, it's more memory muscle than anything, it's absolutely FINE if you don't want to spend time on that but stop asking for nerf just because you don't want to do that. > > I don't care what real skills you have irl, it doesn't matter, it's a video game, you're tested on the mechanics of that video game, and you're not automatically right or legitimate because you're having issues beating some content. This kind of behavior actually IS typical of this new generation of gamers that blame a game for offering challenge, something no older gamer who played during the golden age of video games would ever do. > > > > And that is why I was against the Eater of Soul nerf. The more you nerf a game, the more people want to keep nerfing it. > > "I tried for hours...." kinda says it all for me. I'll look into the armor thing, and I'll see just how easy or not it is to craft it. Given the trend displayed in Ascended crafting, I'm not exactly hopeful at this moment. And if you're insulted... that's too bad. Join the club, as I am insulted every time I contemplate having to do a JP for ANYTHING. A timed JP is NOT a trial and error puzzle. It is an exercise in high end reflexes, timing, and memory, both muscle and cognitive. Trial and error implies that you HAVE TIME to CONSIDER and ANALYZE the environment, and the TIME to form a STRATEGY and RESPONSE. > And I AM not asking for a nerf... I want an ALTERNATE method, like say complete x pvp games, or spend x time in wvw, something like that.... OR a version of the puzzle that doesn't sink into the death goo. NON timed, NON sinking, NON insane, in other words. Take away any real rewards if you want, just give me credit for completion, that'd be fine. > I've expressed a similar sentiment two years running in regards to the Winters Day JP, and still remain hopeful that the devs WILL eventually see reason. OH, and BTW.. the WD JP is WHY once I DID my two tries, I quit. I had tried the WD the previous December, and just about threw my laptop through a wall after about three hours of continually dying and getting nowhere. Two tries was all it took for me to see that the CT would be more of the same. The bottom line is... don't put ANYTHING, achievement points, gold, rewards, ANYTHING, behind something that CANNOT BE DONE BY EVERYONE. And I'd have to say that it's clear that TIMED JP's fall into that category. Last thing... I AM an older gamer and NO, I don't do raids, as a matter of fact. And that's part of my problem DOING this sort of puzzle. My reflexes simply are not up to it. It's only 400 ranks (exotic) not ascended. So after work today, I'm gonna go get my tailoring done and make a set for my necro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlagueParade.7942 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 Yes, all the armor can be crafted if that's what you're looking for and if you craft the medium head and chest piece you get both the regular and bloody versions apparently. I do not believe this JP should get any more nerfs. I understood the nerf of having everyone but you as a wisp (the amount of grief norns and charr got for their huge toons...). This JP and the wintersday one though are fine as is. It takes muscle memory to learn it. A lot of the people that I know that had trouble doing this were thinking too far ahead in the jp. It's one jump at a time. One turn at. A. Time. And once you have learned that one you jump to the next spot and learn that then learn the next turn. It is hard but when you finally finish it. It is awesome. It just takes time. (eh? you see what I did there? that little bit of a terrible joke. Look at my avatar it's funny right?! Huehue.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troops.8276 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @Samnang.1879 said: > > @troops.8276 said: > > > ?? > > > Requesting for a success reward after 100 failed attempts is asking for anet to kitten it down, since you don't have to successfully complete something to succeed in it. > > > I never said this jp was easy, i said it was a challenge. I said hearts are easy, it's objective, not subjective, if anyone in this universe thinks gw2 hearts are hard, then idk what to say. I'ts the most braindead activity i know. > > > > > > I never been able to get gold in most HoT adventures, i'm not going to come on here to complain, "OMG i cna't get gold, plz give me pity gold reward"... kitten... that just invalidate other's efforts. It's like throwing a pie in their face. > > > > I see, I took 'dum down the content'' to mean making the content it self easier as opposed to making getting the reward, subjectively, easier. Doing it 100x is perseverance, which is a good thing that is often rewarded. For example in grind based games like, I don't know, most mmo's? I doubt I could persevere more than a couple of times to say, explain something to a kitten. > > > > Oh, you also said 90% of the game was easy not just hearts amongst other things but I'll say no more on it ;) > > Yeah, i stand by what i said, 90% of the game is easy, proceeded by examples, such as hearts, personal stories, world events, world bosses... literally i afk and press 1 while watching netflix when doing world bosses and never die. It don't get easier than that. > > And no, hard content isn't only just for no-lifers, when i was working full time, i managed to get raid w4 challenge mote title. i dedicated 5 hours each day for 7 days to get the title. do i expect others to have this dedication? no. but if u dont' put in the effort/dedication, then you dont deserve the reward. > > just like a group of people want easy content, there are groups that want hard content. there are only few hard content in the game (raids, 99cm 100cm fractals, the jp), yet everyday the forum gets complain about ppl wanting them to be easier. Why? > > Do i support anet making easier versions of those things? Yes. Do i want anet to modify the hard content, absolutely NO. hard content is what makes some ppl want to play the game. Uhuh, reworded like that then there's little we actually disagree on. 5 hours a day though. Far too busy for that. Casual4life. I'll not waste your time with my bleeding heart stories of why though. For arguments sake lets say I let my 6 year old kid play sometimes (which I don't if it's against any ToS) and I do. He can kill it in pvp, mid gold, and can sleep through the majority of pve content. My friends son has learning difficulties, its a bit harder for him, if he played on my account which he doesn't if it's against ToS. Some things people call hard I think are just tedious. You can train rats to run through complex puzzles. You might still give them a reward even if its beyond them, you know if they really, really tried hard enough. Just like you say :) Sorry OP. Edit: tl,dr if someone does it first time and another tries but fails 100 times then who put in more effort? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lunarminx.3624 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @Donari.5237 said: > > @"Ayumi Spender.1082" said: > > Wait. What's the twitch skill? Please tell me what this is. I've beaten it, but if it would make it easier I would actually try to beat it a 2nd time. > > What is a twitch skill? > > I'll take that as a serious question. "Twitch skill" refers to having very fast reflexes, being able to very quickly and accurately do fast-reaction motion and control in games. So OP wasn't saying some people or professions have an in-game skill on their bar that helps, s/he was saying some people are physically better at rapid keyboard/mouse action. > > (I am someone without high twitch skill, though happily it is not due to anything but being older). A skill i am very lacking in, which is why I suck at pvp!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cavalier.9064 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 I spent five years trying to finish the Clock Tower jumping puzzle, and FINALLY finished it a couple nights ago. I was so friggin' happy to finally have that monkey off my back that I continued to complete it twice more during the same match. Now it feels like muscle memory and I've gone on to "win" several matchups (using quotes because you don't actually win anything for coming in first place), and have even mastered picking up the additional three chests that appear along the route. While I'm certainly empathetic to the frustrations of those who have yet to finish it, I'm pleased that ANet has done little or nothing to change the difficulty on this JP. It gave me immense satisfaction once I finally conquered it, after so long failing spectacularly at it. Practice, persistence, and above all else, patience are all that this jumping puzzle really requires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashantara.8731 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @Menadena.7482 said: > Maybe for you but I would watch the word "never". I have been playing games with a keyboard for, what, about 40 years. That is some pretty strong muscle memory there! To me turning with a mouse is awkward because it goes against decades of how to react. I don't know, each game is different, and you get used to turning the cam with the mouse quickly (in GW1, I think it was the left mousebutton, so I had to get used to the right one in GW2). To me, muscle memory is different for each game (because, apart from muscle memory, it also requires mental memory, and my brain has seperate "save game folders" with different settings for each game :p ). I have been playing electronic games since 1981 myself, by the way. ;) > That is like those people saying not to hold the space bar down too long in JPs because you will not go further (even though that is precisely what you do with the raptor jump). Yes, that one is tricky, because in some JPs gliding has not been disabled, and then the spacebar can get in the way. I tend to press it for the duration of a whole jump as well. > @Svarty.8019 said: > I try the clocktower ONE time every year. It's still horrible after 5 years. Trust me, it is not. See other Clocktower thread for further details (I made a list in my response there about what you need to keep in mind in order to master this JP). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuon Alpinus.7645 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @PlagueParade.7942 said: > Yes, all the armor can be crafted if that's what you're looking for and if you craft the medium head and chest piece you get both the regular and bloody versions apparently. I do not believe this JP should get any more nerfs. I understood the nerf of having everyone but you as a wisp (the amount of grief norns and charr got for their huge toons...). This JP and the wintersday one though are fine as is. It takes muscle memory to learn it. A lot of the people that I know that had trouble doing this were thinking too far ahead in the jp. It's one jump at a time. One turn at. A. Time. And once you have learned that one you jump to the next spot and learn that then learn the next turn. It is hard but when you finally finish it. It is awesome. It just takes time. (eh? you see what I did there? that little bit of a terrible joke. Look at my avatar it's funny right?! Huehue.) Having not played since the first Halloween, I was severely disappointed that I couldn't run the JP with my max size/bulk, heavy-armored, embiggen-tonic'd charr :cry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddicus.6128 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 You are correct, although I have never heard it referred to as a "twitch skill". I like it. Regarding the JP, I don't even bother trying any more. My reflexes are far too slow to succeed; I'm just too old to react that quickly. (And, it has NOTHING to do with memorizing the path, folks. So stop saying that.) I would spend the time to fail 100 times if they then changed the difficulty so it could be completed once. But, 100 attempts wasn't nearly enough to "learn the path" (as others have depressingly stated). I'm pretty patient, and I tried it far more than 100 times. But, like the Wintersday one, I can't even make a dent in it. (To those who mentioned that the wait is long, the delay does provide a service: it tells you how much longer other people are able to stay without dying. So, not only is it impossible for me, I get the long delay telling me that lots of kids are able to do it just fine. Thanks for the encouragement, ANet. :() Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manasa Devi.7958 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 I don't think it's a twitch skill challenge at all. It's muscle memory. Twitch, to me, means reacting extremely fast and accurately to unpredictable circumstances. Maybe my definition is wrong though. The puzzle is wholly predictable, the same every run (desynch bugs and lag excluded of course). It's just a matter of getting a little farther each time and remembering what you did to get there. The wait can certainly be an annoyance. Especially if you're in with people going all the way. This year, my first run was an immediate success. I guess I'm blessed with good muscle memory. When it comes to twitch, I suck, definitely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaltys.7649 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 > @Daddicus.6128 said: > Regarding the JP, I don't even bother trying any more. My reflexes are far too slow to succeed; I'm just too old to react that quickly. (And, it has NOTHING to do with memorizing the path, folks. So stop saying that.) It's all about memorization. There's no moving parts, so nothing that needs reflexes. The route is always exactly the same. It can be completed with muscle memory alone, I don't even pay much attention to it anymore when running it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted October 20, 2017 Author Share Posted October 20, 2017 I gt some people are very sensitive for this, Maybe if they gave an alternate but equal reward, like, after after 50 failed tries you can chose to accept the "You tried your best", achievement which provides the gear box, and the AP, however, i locks The Clock Tower Itself, so you can never get that in the future, with the reverse also true, if you have completed the clock tower at any time, you can't get the You tried your best" Have this also apply to Wintrsday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mewcifer.5198 Posted October 20, 2017 Share Posted October 20, 2017 Maybe add a title to actually completing the jumping puzzle if there isn't one already. That way people who have done it will have their special reward that no one else can get as well as ap. Then there can be a pity chest with a chance at the boots box for every x-number of tries that also doesn't come with any ap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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