Upcomming balance changes for Necromancer

[Black Storm.6974]

> @"Shadowmoon.7986" said:

> > @"Black Storm.6974" said:

> > > @"Nephalem.8921" said:

> > > > @"Black Storm.6974" said:

> > > > Blood Fiend often dies, it is a fact. Maybe it can survive in very good groups, but most people can’t rely on that.

> > >

> > > Maybe if you do bosses that are not vg and do some mechanics you will notice that it almost never dies. It only dies if its attacked directly which just doesnt really happen.

> > > Old signet trait had some uses in pve, new one just wont get picked in instanced content. No dps buff for necro means another 4months without dps necro in any half decent group. I guess we have to wait for new elite specs. Weaver will get its place back into raid meta and becomes even stronger in fractals.

> >

> > Hi. There are also several Fractals where it often dies, and some Strike Missions.

>

> Fights where blood fiend tends to die:

> Raids: vg and sab, at dhuum at 10%

> Fractals: none unless you group does so low dps that mobs dont die so they end up killing the fiend, which if you are using a signet build, you probably are doing low dps

> Strikes: whisper because all minions die at 75 and 25%, still a better pick than vamp signet because you have to range boss at 25% . Cold war and polar bears are more optimal not to run fiend because it tends to pull agro from the group, but they do not die. The polar bear hammer smash it once, and stare at it in confusion. All other strikes, no issues.

> As someone who does all the raid t4 fractals and strikes on necro because I enjoy the class flavor, and have the logs to prove it, this is pretty much the experience i have.

>

 

You show your ignorance on the subject by thinking (and writing) that someone could be doing low DPS cause he is using a “signet build”. A “signet build” can have less than 5% less potential DPS (compared to the Close to Death build), and even higher “initial burst” (higher DPS when the enemy is above 50% Health Points).

 

Anyway, I don’t use a signet build. I change things in the build based on the encounter and the group I’m playing with, and my DPS is always very high.

 

I don’t have to stay range for the last phase of Whisper of Jormag, I put my Flesh Wurm to block the white globes.

 

If you want to play Reaper at Boneskinner, a “signet build” is the most optimal build there (for both DPS and survivability), and I have yet to see someone doing more DPS than me there (cause the “average level” is “quite low”, even in 250+ LI groups, obviously not because Reaper DPS is higher, it is not).

[Anchoku.8142]

Edited to delete anything good about this patch because that is exactly what Arenanet did.

[Josiah.2967]

Do we know the following about the new Signet of Vampirism.

1.) Base Damage/Healing

2.) Power Coefficient

3.) Healing Coefficient

 

I would appreciate it if anyone has an answer.

[LucianDK.8615]

So good with shade effects back on the necromancer. Made Scourge not very fun to play.

[Ashantara.8731]

I wish I could adjust my skills! But since my game crashes again everytime I attempt to open Build Templates...

[Shadowmoon.7986]

> @"Josiah.2967" said:

> Do we know the following about the new Signet of Vampirism.

> 1.) Base Damage/Healing

> 2.) Power Coefficient

> 3.) Healing Coefficient

>

> I would appreciate it if anyone has an answer.

 

Add radius and cd per tick. If someone on a power reaper can hop to the golem to tell what is damage with 25 might.

[LucianDK.8615]

Was too good to be true. The new build just replaced it with the preview version. Bummer.

[Josiah.2967]

> @"LucianDK.8615" said:

> Was too good to be true. The new build just replaced it with the preview version. Bummer.

 

Would you mind explaining? Thanks.

[Anchoku.8142]

> @"LucianDK.8615" said:

> Was too good to be true. The new build just replaced it with the preview version. Bummer.

 

Bug? Patch notes say...

"Dread: This trait has been moved to the grandmaster slot previously occupied by Signets of Suffering, and it has been reworked. It now grants 5 seconds of quickness and 10 seconds of fury whenever the necromancer applies fear to an enemy, with a 3-second internal cooldown. Additionally, it reduces the recharge of Shroud skill 3 by 50% whenever an enemy is killed in PvE and PvP, and by 5% in WvW."

 

Edit: Nevermind. Sounds like they fixed it.

[LucianDK.8615]

> @"Josiah.2967" said:

> > @"LucianDK.8615" said:

> > Was too good to be true. The new build just replaced it with the preview version. Bummer.

>

> Would you mind explaining? Thanks.

 

Inflicting fear on foes added 10 vulnerability, as well 33% increased damage to feared foes.

We had this version of dread for barely 30 minutes before it was removed in a new build.

[Sigmoid.7082]

> @"Shadowmoon.7986" said:

> > @"Josiah.2967" said:

> > Do we know the following about the new Signet of Vampirism.

> > 1.) Base Damage/Healing

> > 2.) Power Coefficient

> > 3.) Healing Coefficient

> >

> > I would appreciate it if anyone has an answer.

>

> Add radius and cd per tick. If someone on a power reaper can hop to the golem to tell what is damage with 25 might.

 

With ~4100 power it does 219/s. With base power it does 151 so looks like just over 1% of your power.

With 0 healing power is heals for 195 and looks to scale with 2% of your healing power.

Radius of 180.

 

So it has more damage than the minion but less healing.

 

Well of darkness has a power coeff of 4.3. Makes it 60% stronger than WoC and 20% weaker than WoS. In short its real strong.

 

Bloodbank is also real strong in certain circumstances. As long as your full hp in shroud it still generate barrier. Blighters boon lets you get a ton of barrier in shroud.

 

Signet of the locust extra healing is 645 **per boon** and looks like 10% hp scaling. So max of 2790 per target if they have all have at least two boons.

 

Dread is going to make people complain about lichform **A LOT**

 

I feel the change of WoD is going to have people complaining about chill quite a bit too.

[LucianDK.8615]

> @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said:

> > > @"Josiah.2967" said:

> > > Do we know the following about the new Signet of Vampirism.

> > > 1.) Base Damage/Healing

> > > 2.) Power Coefficient

> > > 3.) Healing Coefficient

> > >

> > > I would appreciate it if anyone has an answer.

> >

> > Add radius and cd per tick. If someone on a power reaper can hop to the golem to tell what is damage with 25 might.

>

> With ~4100 power it does 219/s. With base power it does 151 so looks like just over 1% of your power.

> With 0 healing power is heals for 195 and looks to scale with 2% of your healing power.

> Radius of 180.

>

> So it has more damage than the minion but less healing.

>

> Well of darkness has a power coeff of 4.3. Makes it 60% stronger than WoC and 20% weaker than WoS. In short its real strong.

>

> Bloodbank is also real strong in certain circumstances. As long as your full hp in shroud it still generate barrier. Blighters boon lets you get a ton of barrier in shroud.

>

> Signet of the locust extra healing is 645 **per boon** and looks like 10% hp scaling. So max of 2790 per target if they have all have at least two boons.

>

> Dread is going to make people complain about lichform **A LOT**

 

-removed.

[Sigmoid.7082]

> @"LucianDK.8615" said:

> > @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said:

> > > > @"Josiah.2967" said:

> > > > Do we know the following about the new Signet of Vampirism.

> > > > 1.) Base Damage/Healing

> > > > 2.) Power Coefficient

> > > > 3.) Healing Coefficient

> > > >

> > > > I would appreciate it if anyone has an answer.

> > >

> > > Add radius and cd per tick. If someone on a power reaper can hop to the golem to tell what is damage with 25 might.

> >

> > With ~4100 power it does 219/s. With base power it does 151 so looks like just over 1% of your power.

> > With 0 healing power is heals for 195 and looks to scale with 2% of your healing power.

> > Radius of 180.

> >

> > So it has more damage than the minion but less healing.

> >

> > Well of darkness has a power coeff of 4.3. Makes it 60% stronger than WoC and 20% weaker than WoS. In short its real strong.

> >

> > Bloodbank is also real strong in certain circumstances. As long as your full hp in shroud it still generate barrier. Blighters boon lets you get a ton of barrier in shroud.

> >

> > Signet of the locust extra healing is 645 **per boon** and looks like 10% hp scaling. So max of 2790 per target if they have all have at least two boons.

> >

> > Dread is going to make people complain about lichform **A LOT**

>

> WoC is still noticeable stronger than WoD. Did you look at the older build with skill errors?

 

I'm in game.

[LucianDK.8615]

> @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > @"LucianDK.8615" said:

> > > @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > > > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said:

> > > > > @"Josiah.2967" said:

> > > > > Do we know the following about the new Signet of Vampirism.

> > > > > 1.) Base Damage/Healing

> > > > > 2.) Power Coefficient

> > > > > 3.) Healing Coefficient

> > > > >

> > > > > I would appreciate it if anyone has an answer.

> > > >

> > > > Add radius and cd per tick. If someone on a power reaper can hop to the golem to tell what is damage with 25 might.

> > >

> > > With ~4100 power it does 219/s. With base power it does 151 so looks like just over 1% of your power.

> > > With 0 healing power is heals for 195 and looks to scale with 2% of your healing power.

> > > Radius of 180.

> > >

> > > So it has more damage than the minion but less healing.

> > >

> > > Well of darkness has a power coeff of 4.3. Makes it 60% stronger than WoC and 20% weaker than WoS. In short its real strong.

> > >

> > > Bloodbank is also real strong in certain circumstances. As long as your full hp in shroud it still generate barrier. Blighters boon lets you get a ton of barrier in shroud.

> > >

> > > Signet of the locust extra healing is 645 **per boon** and looks like 10% hp scaling. So max of 2790 per target if they have all have at least two boons.

> > >

> > > Dread is going to make people complain about lichform **A LOT**

> >

> > WoC is still noticeable stronger than WoD. Did you look at the older build with skill errors?

>

> I'm in game.

 

Was my error, looked at the wrong skill.

[Anchoku.8142]

> @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said:

> > > @"Josiah.2967" said:

> > > Do we know the following about the new Signet of Vampirism.

> > > 1.) Base Damage/Healing

> > > 2.) Power Coefficient

> > > 3.) Healing Coefficient

> > >

> > > I would appreciate it if anyone has an answer.

> >

> > Add radius and cd per tick. If someone on a power reaper can hop to the golem to tell what is damage with 25 might.

>

> With ~4100 power it does 219/s. With base power it does 151 so looks like just over 1% of your power.

> With 0 healing power is heals for 195 and looks to scale with 2% of your healing power.

> Radius of 180.

>

> So it has more damage than the minion but less healing.

>

> Well of darkness has a power coeff of 4.3. Makes it 60% stronger than WoC and 20% weaker than WoS. In short its real strong.

>

> Bloodbank is also real strong in certain circumstances. As long as your full hp in shroud it still generate barrier. Blighters boon lets you get a ton of barrier in shroud.

>

> Signet of the locust extra healing is 645 **per boon** and looks like 10% hp scaling. So max of 2790 per target if they have all have at least two boons.

>

> Dread is going to make people complain about lichform **A LOT**

>

> I feel the change of WoD is going to have people complaining about chill quite a bit too.

 

Without Close to Death, Lich should hit less hard but the chasing potential of Dread will make it a PvP and WvW roaming favorite.

 

Feels like Arenanet wants less bunkering and more activity from Necro players.

[Sigmoid.7082]

> @"Anchoku.8142" said:

> > @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said:

> > > > @"Josiah.2967" said:

> > > > Do we know the following about the new Signet of Vampirism.

> > > > 1.) Base Damage/Healing

> > > > 2.) Power Coefficient

> > > > 3.) Healing Coefficient

> > > >

> > > > I would appreciate it if anyone has an answer.

> > >

> > > Add radius and cd per tick. If someone on a power reaper can hop to the golem to tell what is damage with 25 might.

> >

> > With ~4100 power it does 219/s. With base power it does 151 so looks like just over 1% of your power.

> > With 0 healing power is heals for 195 and looks to scale with 2% of your healing power.

> > Radius of 180.

> >

> > So it has more damage than the minion but less healing.

> >

> > Well of darkness has a power coeff of 4.3. Makes it 60% stronger than WoC and 20% weaker than WoS. In short its real strong.

> >

> > Bloodbank is also real strong in certain circumstances. As long as your full hp in shroud it still generate barrier. Blighters boon lets you get a ton of barrier in shroud.

> >

> > Signet of the locust extra healing is 645 **per boon** and looks like 10% hp scaling. So max of 2790 per target if they have all have at least two boons.

> >

> > Dread is going to make people complain about lichform **A LOT**

> >

> > I feel the change of WoD is going to have people complaining about chill quite a bit too.

>

> Without Close to Death, Lich should hit less hard but the chasing potential of Dread will make it a PvP and WvW roaming favorite.

>

> Feels like Arenanet wants less bunkering and more activity from Necro players.

 

Well people aren't always under 50% for the 20% damage boost. Sure they will do less damage but they will come out under quickness so you'll better make use of the 10s. You'll get in an extra 3~4 #1s so the overall damage is higher. Plus less damage isnt all that bad since lich auto is still real strong.

[Black Storm.6974]

I think Signets of Suffering could win even DPS wise against Awaken the Pain (also thanks to Signet of Vampirism stealing Health while in Shroud).

[Sigmoid.7082]

> @"Black Storm.6974" said:

> I think Signets of Sufferings could win even DPS wise against Awaken the Pain (also thanks to Signet of Vampirism stealing Health while in Shroud).

 

Mathematically and realistically is very difficult for this to happen and unlikely this will be the case in general. Sure the 270 > 250 inside shroud but outside 250 >> 0. The 2000 damage you lose from signet inside shroud wont really make up for it.

 

[Black Storm.6974]

> @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > @"Black Storm.6974" said:

> > I think Signets of Sufferings could win even DPS wise against Awaken the Pain (also thanks to Signet of Vampirism stealing Health while in Shroud).

>

> Mathematically and realistically is very difficult for this to happen and unlikely this will be the case in general.

>

>

It seems to be higher from the first testings, but it could be because of RNG.

 

It provides 270 extra Power while in Shroud, with Signet of Spite (20 more than Awaken the Pain). Outside of Shroud we would have 250 less power at 25 Might stacks, but most of our damage (both burst and sustained) comes from Shroud, thanks to the additional Ferocity. Also, now there is also Well of Darkness increasing our damage in Shroud, in addition to Nightfall and Well of Suffering.

 

Then, there is Signet of Vampirism that deals damage every second while in Shroud, thanks to Signets of Sufferings.

 

It could really be the best choice DPS wise, even sustained. It will probably be better in Fractal where damage bursts are more effective.

 

Edit: after more testing I think the DPS is very similar anyway.

[Drarnor Kunoram.5180]

Radius of 180 for the signet passive means Signet of Vampirism basically doesn't have a passive anymore if you're not a melee build. I would say bumping it to 600 range is probably good.

 

I need to test out Blood Bank + Abrasive Grit, though. We may hit the old Diamond Skin ele in practice that was just totally immune to condition builds.

[realviizz.4982]

Is it just me or did they reduce the number of targets for Manifest Sand Shade and Nefarious Favor? I thought it was 5 targets for those two skills. It's now 3. Atleast for WvW/PvP it now seems to be 3. I don't see any mention of this in the patch notes either.

Could obviously be that I missed this in some other patch before :)

[Anchoku.8142]

> @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said:

> Radius of 180 for the signet passive means Signet of Vampirism basically doesn't have a passive anymore if you're not a melee build. I would say bumping it to 600 range is probably good.

>

> I need to test out Blood Bank + Abrasive Grit, though. We may hit the old Diamond Skin ele in practice that was just totally immune to condition builds.

 

That may not be a terrible loss. SoV only used to proc when hit, anyway, so ranging or kiting was not rewarded with passive heals well. Also, it is good that it does not compete with Blood Fiend.

[Sigmoid.7082]

> @"realviizz.4982" said:

> Is it just me or did they reduce the number of targets for Manifest Sand Shade and Nefarious Favor? I thought it was 5 targets for those two skills. It's now 3. Atleast for WvW/PvP it now seems to be 3. I don't see any mention of this in the patch notes either.

 

CMC said this was going to happen so its probably missing and will be in some late notes.

[Josiah.2967]

Anyone else surprised that the signet does less healing than the minion? With the added range, I am actually surprised.

[Drarnor Kunoram.5180]

> @"Anchoku.8142" said:

> > @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said:

> > Radius of 180 for the signet passive means Signet of Vampirism basically doesn't have a passive anymore if you're not a melee build. I would say bumping it to 600 range is probably good.

> >

> > I need to test out Blood Bank + Abrasive Grit, though. We may hit the old Diamond Skin ele in practice that was just totally immune to condition builds.

>

> That may not be a terrible loss. SoV only used to proc when hit, anyway, so ranging or kiting was not rewarded with passive heals well. Also, it is good that it does not compete with Blood Fiend.

 

> @"Anchoku.8142" said:

> > @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said:

> > Radius of 180 for the signet passive means Signet of Vampirism basically doesn't have a passive anymore if you're not a melee build. I would say bumping it to 600 range is probably good.

> >

> > I need to test out Blood Bank + Abrasive Grit, though. We may hit the old Diamond Skin ele in practice that was just totally immune to condition builds.

>

> That may not be a terrible loss. SoV only used to proc when hit, anyway, so ranging or kiting was not rewarded with passive heals well. Also, it is good that it does not compete with Blood Fiend.

 

Difference is, it actually did something when you were engaging a ranged opponent. Now it does nothing unless you're in melee range.

 

On another note, Blood Bank does not trigger Abrasive Grit at all. While this is probably fair, it should have a note, as just by reading trait descriptions, it absolutely should.