How to improve Herald (PvE only)

[Virdo.1540]

We know, heralds arent really good in PvE. Only very Few people plays them. Many hate them. Their Damage is terrible. Their support through boons is bad.

_Their healing_.... orbs are an different topic.

 

They are counted as a joke. A bad one. Many people kick them out of raids, strikes, fractals even normal dungeon-groups - or simply insult them. This is not healthy for anyone ,especially not for those players who actually like heralds.

So i wanted to create a thread ,where people can bring up some ideas, talk about them & hopefully achieve that some of them actually make it into the game. Please, before giving any improvement-ideas , ask yourself "Could this be too strong?" ,if yes, then maybe weaken it yourself before writing it.

 

**_Reminder:_** **THIS IS FOR PVE ONLY.**

 

Im gonna start with some ideas:

 

[Facet of Strength](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Facet_of_Strength)

- instead of pulsing 1might(12secs) every 3 seconds => Pulse 2might(12secs) every 3secs

-it still wouldnt be able to max out might 25 ,but it would be an tiny improvement.

(+ its active could make a bit more damage)

 

[burst of Strength](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Burst_of_Strength)

- Change the After-Use-Effect of +25% damage from 5seconds to 6seconds

 

[Reinforced Potency](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Reinforced_Potency)

- Change "+1% damage per boon" into "+2% damage per boon"

 

[Forceful Persistence](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Forceful_Persistence)

- Upkeep-Skill from +13% => +15%

- Herald-Upkeep from +4% => +5%

 

[Facet of Nature - Assassine](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Facet_of_Nature%E2%80%94Assassin)

- Lower their Power & Heal modifier , & buff their standard value.

 

[Facet of Nature - Centaur](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Facet_of_Nature%E2%80%94Centaur)

- Change their Standard-Value from 471 to 500

 

[Elevated Compassion](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elevated_Compassion)

- lower the healing from 389( *0.175) to 225( *0.125)

- lower the cooldown from 3 seconds to 1 , so it lines up with ["Shared Empowerment"](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shared_Empowerment)

 

 

Feel free to leave some thoughts, ideas or constructive critics.

[Buran.3796]

Power Herald can easily solo almost every hero point in the game and tons of OW champions; condi Herald can do the same but also solo almost the entire roster of bosses and sub bosses in fractals, and tons of OW events. The only reason Herald is depised in PvE content is because has comparatively low dps, it's insane sustain isn't "shareable" and the huge buff to boon duration that Herald provided at the HoT release was butchered to nothingness.

 

Want to improve their popularity in PvE? Is as easy as buffing the dps of the auto attacks. And as meaningless: fractals, raids and strikes are becoming so niche that they are fading into "abandoned content" as happened with dungeons. Used to think that most of players in GW2 were PvErs, which is a broad term: now I'm sure that most of players are just farmers, and moving from Octovine to the Gerent to Dragon Stand and Istan Domain and lately Dragonfall to grind and farm is what most people do, so if ANet want's to improve the quality of life for Heralds they could make changes that are impactful for OW content with tons of pugs around. But, is not that important, because core, herald and renegade already do well in those events.

[Virdo.1540]

> @"Buran.3796" said:

> Power Herald can easily solo almost every hero point in the game and tons of OW champions; condi Herald can do the same but also solo almost the entire roster of bosses and sub bosses in fractals, and tons of OW events. The only reason Herald is depised in PvE content is because has comparatively low dps, it's insane sustain isn't "shareable" and the huge buff to boon duration that Herald provided at the HoT release was butchered to nothingness.

>

> Want to improve their popularity in PvE? Is as easy as buffing the dps of the auto attacks. And as meaningless: fractals, raids and strikes are becoming so niche that they are fading into "abandoned content" as happened with dungeons. Used to think that most of players in GW2 were PvErs, which is a broad term: now I'm sure that most of players are just farmers, and moving from Octovine to the Gerent to Dragon Stand and Istan Domain and lately Dragonfall to grind and farm is what most people do, so if ANet want's to improve the quality of life for Heralds they could make changes that are impactful for OW content with tons of pugs around. But, is not that important, because core, herald and renegade already do well in those events.

 

almost every class is able to easily solo anything in this game, but this is due to very weak NPCs. But not every Herald wants to go for sustain. If ,for example, going for max damage, their sustain isnt anymore is it could be. If going for sustain then it might be very high.

 

i doubt that fracs raids and strikes a becoming abandoned, unlike older maps like istan & dragon stand.

Renegade does very well in OW content, thats right. But they also have unique buffs like hardcore liferip, 10man alac and still have an free 2. legend slot.

Herald can just give boons to everyone, that already can give them to themselve. So they can overstack boons, but this isnt really useful.

This makes herald just like core revs: an one-man(ego-)-army

 

Buffing the auto attacks would result in Renegade being even more overpowered than it is now... again.

 

Condi revs can have immense sustain ,but thats it. Their damage is extremely low ,even compared to Power heralds. But Sustain isnt needed if there is any healer nearby.

 

As long as other classes have enormous damage, great group-buffs, cc, sustain and boons, Heralds probably wont be accepted. Ive heard people saying "in guildwars 2 u can be everything", it was true (even heal warriors are accepted). Herald dont

[Kulvar.1239]

> @"Virdo.1540" said:

> Herald can just give boons to everyone, that already can give them to themselve. So they can overstack boons, but this isnt really useful.

 

Have a trait that convert overcap boon into something else ?

Face of Light => 500 barrier

Facet of Darkness => Retaliation (1.5s)

Facet of Elements => Vigor (1.5s)

Facet of Strength => 1 stack of Battle Scar

Facet of Chaos => Stability (1.5s)

[ArthurDent.9538]

Power herald benches about 32k for me with "realistic" buffs which I haven't seen any higher benches though I'm sure someone can beat my numbers. It would need about a 20% damage increase to be on par with the current top tier power DPS builds because anet has had this stupid idea that holos soulbeasts and weavers benching 35k sustained damage with front loaded burst builds is too low and buffed them up to 38k+. Instead of helping out low tier DPS specs like herald, reaper, and scourge, they just buff the mid tier to reach the top tier leaving the low tier further in the dust, it's quite annoying. Herald is setup to be potentially a good DPS spec, it's got 3 pretty strong damage modifiers exclusive to it and 3 glint skills deal good enough damage to be used in DPS rotations but it's just getting out power creeped hard and being generally ignored. As for the power rotation itself it has a nice feel to it being more active than most people suspect and has a surprisingly high skill cap for squeezing out the most value from forceful persistence, I would only really add about 50% more damage to chaotic release and perhaps a bit more damage on elemental blast but keep the rest of skills at the same damage relative to eachother just boosting up a few general damage modifiers like forcefull persistence and burst of strength buff. Or just nerf the power creeped DPS specs back to a more reasonable 35k benchmark and make guardian have to sacrifice more personal DPS to share high group quickness uptime.

[zaswer.5246]

I think the herald does bad triing to be a jack of all trades , it skills are suport like , its weapon is a bad mixture of tank and condi cleanser and should focus either on the blocks or heals i think , and the traits are a mess , you have 2 dmg traits that are useless completely because the dmg you get with them is too low , the suport traits are good and the best is the drac echoe but the boons herald give are all better covered by other classes and the heal traits are a joke .

If i had to fix it i think there are 2 options .

1 focus herald on one roll and renegade on another , as an example , take herald make its ult a -8upkeep and make it pulse alacrity or quickness as those are the most desired boons on pve and are also valuable on pvp and wvw , let the other facets as they are and if anithing i think making the actual power racet give a 100 power unique buff , as if it were a banner , so it has something unique , then take shield and make it so it focuses on blocking and sup like a chrono but diferent shield 4 gives stab and cleanses for examp and sh5 blocks everithing , vg blue tps and similar , but is a cast that you cant cancel,then make f2 so instead of changing with legends , as glin is suposed to have given you that power herself , make it so you can "save " a skill there , for example you have glint and jalis , then you can save one glint facet on f2 and use it on jalis and on the contrary save jalis hammers and use them on glint ( then make it so its a skill limited to utilityes and cant be the ultimate skills or maybe make it so you can save the ulti of one legend on that skill and use it even if you dont have that legend , for ex use jade wind having glint and jalis , it might be broken but you could make a toned down version of the said jade wind or the other ults.

2 other think i thought could be done is giving revenant a more common use , i mean revs skills go with legends and so we cantvuse racial nor we have a common skill line , what i mean is instead of using a legend it would be good having a pure unformed mist power, skills that take power from the mist itself and not some legend and we can choose to replace the skills we dont want, and it can be done , really, when we change legends the order ofvthe skills is the order we choose (if its not buged) so just asigning a space to one skill and ordering the other skills would make us have more freedom and not being stuck with so many skills that we dont use.

[otto.5684]

In PvE, easy solution for power herald is to buff sword AA. Maybe buff some shiro traits a bit in PvE. Yet, Anet seems against the idea power herald being able to be competitive dps in group setting, not sure why.

 

@"Buran.3796" If someone asks me why you play GW2, I most definitely say open world. It is the appeal of the game. It has other content, which is necessary, but no one plays GW2 as a raid MMO. And no one primarily play MMOs for PvP. Of course this is my opinion, but it is not far off from what most people do. power herald is very strong in OW. Condi renegade is too. Condi herald can be more survivable than either.

[Virdo.1540]

> @"otto.5684" said:

> In PvE, easy solution for power herald is to buff sword AA. Maybe buff some shiro traits a bit in PvE. Yet, Anet seems against the idea power herald being able to be competitive dps in group setting, not sure why.

>

> @"Buran.3796" If someone asks me why you play GW2, I most definitely say open world. It is the appeal of the game. It has other content, which is necessary, but no one plays GW2 as a raid MMO. And no one primarily play MMOs for PvP. Of course this is my opinion, but it is not far off from what most people do. power herald is very strong in OW. Condi renegade is too. Condi herald can be more survivable than either.

 

u also have to think, if they would buff Shiro or Sword auto attack, they would buff renegade too. And renegade is already top notch for dmg.

 

Power Rene is already able to hit 35k dps with ease, probably even more. So the buffs would need to be in the Herald traitline or the herald skills.

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

I'm not okai to buff the DPS. Herald is already a strong dualist and powerful in OW, power renegade is also okai with the same weapons ; on contrary even if it doesn't share quickness/alacrity it should get back its primary role at the Hot release: give fury/mights/protection, increase boon duration; avoid FB, Ren, Chrono, druid etc, to run with BD/concentration, and so improve this aspect. (edit, well, it can share alacrity to 5 allies with ventari)

 

Make Facet of nature great again. Revert the change. It was the only skill that made herald viable. (+50% BD to allies, then +33%, then now only 20% BD for you ... )

Give the +20% BD to 10 allies. (5+5 with draconic echo) same for the +3sec to boons.

Shield skills could act like the tempest "heat sync" or "sandsquall", or "Pyromancer's Puissance", or the old "signet of inspiration" : copy to allies all boons on you (2sec) or increase duration +2 sec, consume 2 boons on yourself per pulse and increase +½sec BD and heal for each boons consumed.

Herald could share too its "reinforced potency". For exemple "Shared empowerment " is boring, make it "herald presence" bonus damage +½% per boons, assuming we have at least 6 boons minimum it will be+3% up to +6% to the group ... Or share +150 concentration/10% BD but it's not as cool.

 

Herald would be a great support/niche.

Chrono, ren could gear with more berserker pieces, without Inspiration traitline, without Assassin's presence; you would help DH to loop retaliation, fury, same for Fb with the recent nerf to the elite shout, you're sure to cap 25 might 100% uptime.

 

 

[Zuras.5394]

I had struggled with power herald and I ended up mostly using Shiro and Jalis. HoT was brutal to go through in which I was saved often by necros mostly. Then I decided to try condition glint/Mallyx and although a "clunky" build I did noticed an improvement to survivability and damage out put. I have stuck with it since. Anet needs to stop nerfing professions, and instead revamp some skills to give players more options to viable builds. Right now they are really limiting the build possibilities of all professions lately.

[Azurrath.9031]

I don't think those are enough to make herald to become a viable endgame content dps.

 

The biggest problem for herald right now is that it lacks of the burst. Fotm is all about burst race, raid's phase is getting shorter as dps inflate.

Most of the current viable power class have some meaning of burst(including reaper) while herald has almost nothing at all. It does have the potential to do burst but it just lack of the damaging abilities to make it work.

 

When you compare power class with similar burst mechanics such as daredevil (assassin signet: 5sec with 540power), daredevil can:

* press it

* dodge for extra 10%(Bounding dodger)+15%damage(Havoc Specialist)

* then spam 2 for at least 4times and fist flurry

Which can result a nice burst

 

But when it comes to herald, what you can do is:

* Burst of strength(5sec with 25%dmg)

* Elemental Blast(that deals low power damage)

* Chaotic Release(decent damage but long casting animation)

* Sword 2>4>5

* then you have nothing left other than just spaming 1

 

And you will have to hold sword 4/5 until burst of strength available,which will most likely result a dps loss

 

Also, unlike renegade, herald does not have a efficient way to utilize battle scar, as they does not have many ways to apply vulnerability.

 

The other problem(imo) is that, herald itself lacks of it's class identity, Facet of nature's effect is kinda useless in pve (assuming most of the people are using shiro/glint for pve dps)

* Shiro's lifesteal effect is weak, true nature deals little damage which is not really helpful

* Glint's increase boon duration is not useful for an organized group, as the boon uptime is always good enough.

 

And the class itself has no unique mechanics(like dh spear or spb counter), toggling should not be counted as it's part of the core revenant thing.

 

__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

**So here's my thought:**

 

 

**Forceful Persistence** : No longer separate herald's skill from other toggle ability, as long as you have a toggle ability on, it gives you a13% damage modifier.

>As a dps, you'll always have 3 out of 6 abilities(as mentioned above in the burst part) to be instantly used, so you'll always have only 3 abilities available and it's not helping at all, a bit of a QoL change.

 

 

**Burst of Strength** : Instead of gaining 25% damage by just pressing it, it marks the hitted targets and deal increased damage to them for 8s instead of 5s

>So it can fit more ability like an extra sword 2, also it's easier to balance for other game mode(as now you have to actually hit your target for the modifier).

 

 

**Element Blast** : Increase the coefficient per pulse to somewhere around 1.5 and pulse for 5 times instead of 3. Also makes it generate a fire field.

>so it synergize better with the burst of strength(like the concept of sic'em+arrow barrage for slb), fire field can synergize with sword2's finisher and provide a bit of group utility (such as area might blast)

 

 

**A new F3 ability that either deals big damage**(somewhat like citadel bombardment) or** deals a small amount of damage and provide a damage modifier**(something like a dh f1).

>My idea is that since herald is mainly about glint, it should at least have some way to show some strength of the crystal dragon. For example:

>* **Big damage F3:** shoot a crystalline laser in a straight line, dealing damage (somewhat like the Icebrood saga laser) with a bit of dot after the intial hit

>* **Damage Modifier F3**: Crystalline your target, deals damage with a small amount of cc(like 1sec daze) and mark it with a debuff, causing it takes 10% more damage from your abilities for 8s.

 

 

An extra F4 for some more utility for healing or tanking will be great too, but i afraid i'm asking for too much.

 

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

These should help herald to get a better burst while maintaining a decent overall dps. Herald (or revenant overall) isn't easy to use as you have to manage your energy and legend swap in the correct timing to maximizing your damage. I'm not hoping it to do crazy 50k dps but i hope it'll at least be viable in raid or fotms.

 

Btw after all of these, i think revenant overall needs a rework. It always bother me that revenant, as a vessel for different spirits, using the weapon in the same fashion no matter which spirit he's currently fused with. I hope each time you swap a legend, you'll have different weapon skill set with a separate cooldown, since core revenant has very few weapon choice. Otherwise when they release a new elite spec, we can only hope the spec weapon is good enough (like shortbow for kalla making condi build viable), otherwise it'll most likely dies like herald right now.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

> @"Azurrath.9031" said:

> The other problem(imo) is that, herald itself lacks of it's class identity, Facet of nature's effect is kinda useless in pve (assuming most of the people are using shiro/glint for pve dps)

> * Shiro's lifesteal effect is weak, true nature deals little damage which is not really helpful

> * Glint's increase boon duration is not useful for an organized group, as the boon uptime is always good enough.

>

> And the class itself has no unique mechanics(like dh spear or spb counter), toggling should not be counted as it's part of the core revenant thing.

 

That's my thinking of well. To make Herald desirable in a group, they need to target Facet of Nature and give players a reason to want it in their group.

 

Power Reaper + Condi Scourge also lag behind on DPS, but both bring more to the table to justify their place in a Fractal vs just adding another DH, with things like barrier, condi cleanse, boon strip/corrupt, etc.

 

But if your fractal party has an Alacrigade and you join as a Herald, everything you bring to the table is already supplied by either the Alacrigade (Might, Protection) or the Healbrand (Might, Fury, Swiftness).

 

If Facet of Nature was changed to just be a perma +20% boon duration increase, that would be something unique to Herald, but I don't know if that is enough of a change. We also don't want to give something so good and so unique that all of a sudden you MUST have a Herald in the group. But I think changes to F2 are the way to go.

 

[Virdo.1540]

> @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> If Facet of Nature was changed to just be a perma +20% boon duration increase, that would be something unique to Herald, but I don't know if that is enough of a change. We also don't want to give something so good and so unique that all of a sudden you MUST have a Herald in the group. But I think changes to F2 are the way to go.

>

 

maybe they need to make f2 into pulsing both legends utilities at the same time, instead of Switching "F2-Legend1" to "f2-Legend2" and back.

^^

Perma +20% boonduration & perma (active)-vampiric rev aura at the same time wouldnt be that bad.

But defintely better than 50% liferip 50%boonduration, which results into having boonduration while not applying boons.

 

also ,Facet of Nature-Shiro should use Heralds Power/healing-power ,instead of allied ones. could use a buff anyway

 

 

 

[Turkeyspit.3965]

> @"Virdo.1540" said:

> > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> > If Facet of Nature was changed to just be a perma +20% boon duration increase, that would be something unique to Herald, but I don't know if that is enough of a change. We also don't want to give something so good and so unique that all of a sudden you MUST have a Herald in the group. But I think changes to F2 are the way to go.

> >

>

> maybe they need to make f2 into pulsing both legends utilities at the same time, instead of Switching F2-Legend1 to f2-Legend2 and back.

> ^^

 

Tying your F2 to match your legend is a cool thing, but like many things Rev, it's a double edged blade. If your group wants you to maintain the boon duration of Glint, it prevents you from legend swapping at all, which drastically cuts your effectiveness. Same holds true for Mallyx, Jallis, etc.

 

Compare that to Renegade though, where your F2-F4 remains the same regardless of what legend you're channelling.

 

I think they need to unify the Facet of Nature across all Legends, and then keep the True Nature effect unique to each legend. The question is, what should the Facet of Nature be? Is +20 boon duration sufficient to make Herald attractive to a group that has Might, Fury and Protection covered?

 

I also wonder if the -2 upkeep of Facet of Nature isn't also an problem.

 

Lately I've been joining many a Fractal group doing Recs only, that already had an Alacrigade, so it gave me a chance to play Power Herald in T3-T1s with a typical group running Firebrigade, and juggling the F2 became questionable to me. In OW I'll usually only activate it while in Shiro if I need the extra sustain, otherwise I just ignore it.

 

The only place I actually use F2 is in WvW, but never as an upkeep.

 

 

[Virdo.1540]

> @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> > @"Virdo.1540" said:

> > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> > > If Facet of Nature was changed to just be a perma +20% boon duration increase, that would be something unique to Herald, but I don't know if that is enough of a change. We also don't want to give something so good and so unique that all of a sudden you MUST have a Herald in the group. But I think changes to F2 are the way to go.

> > >

> >

> > maybe they need to make f2 into pulsing both legends utilities at the same time, instead of Switching F2-Legend1 to f2-Legend2 and back.

> > ^^

>

> Tying your F2 to match your legend is a cool thing, but like many things Rev, it's a double edged blade. If your group wants you to maintain the boon duration of Glint, it prevents you from legend swapping at all, which drastically cuts your effectiveness. Same holds true for Mallyx, Jallis, etc.

>

> Compare that to Renegade though, where your F2-F4 remains the same regardless of what legend you're channelling.

>

> I think they need to unify the Facet of Nature across all Legends, and then keep the True Nature effect unique to each legend. The question is, what should the Facet of Nature be? Is +20 boon duration sufficient to make Herald attractive to a group that has Might, Fury and Protection covered?

>

> I also wonder if the -2 upkeep of Facet of Nature isn't also an problem.

>

> Lately I've been joining many a Fractal group doing Recs only, that already had an Alacrigade, so it gave me a chance to play Power Herald in T3-T1s with a typical group running Firebrigade, and juggling the F2 became questionable to me. In OW I'll usually only activate it while in Shiro if I need the extra sustain, otherwise I just ignore it.

>

> The only place I actually use F2 is in WvW, but never as an upkeep.

>

>

 

would u say combining the FoN-passive of both legends at the same time would be op? I think none of the FoN-passives are too strong to be coupled with another & then the +2 upkeep would be worth it.

 

So Boonduration+Liferip as Glint/shiro or Shiro/glint

healing+dmg-reduction as ventari/dwarf or Dw/Ve

and so on

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

Facet of nature, assassin's form is not thad bad compared to Vampiric Presence.

But I agree both effects would be a great improvement without being OP in others mods ; may be make it -3 point upkeep to balance it. WIth Charged Mists it won't be an issue, then you use the active effect in Glint sometimes for example after ren F4, or chrono CS.

 

Plus, obviously, at least, give back the +20% BD to allies; Without this, it will never be viable anywhere in pve.

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

> @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> > @"Virdo.1540" said:

> > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> [...]

> Lately I've been joining many a Fractal group doing Recs only, that already had an Alacrigade, so it gave me a chance to play Power Herald in T3-T1s with a typical group running Firebrigade, and juggling the F2 became questionable to me. In OW I'll usually only activate it while in Shiro if I need the extra sustain, otherwise I just ignore it.

>

> The only place I actually use F2 is in WvW, but never as an upkeep.

 

 

In fractal the +3sec is a bit useless, as you earn BD from agony resistance + the pre-buff from mistlock ... And also because Ren build to have perma alacrity without you.

But in raids it could be more useful :

As FB should need BD now for perma quickness, same for chrono who play with ~70% BD and with inspiration traitline.

Herald in subgroup 2 with a +20% BD for 10 players (if they change it) + the +3sec of True Nature : your chrono could play with ~50%BD (runes of pack + sigil + food already 40%) and Duel over Inspiration.

Condi druid could play with less seraph accessories (may be even without, as you would also grant fury/mights). Etc, ren fb, heal druid, the "boon thief", etc.

 

[Turkeyspit.3965]

> @"Zhaid Zhem.6508" said:

> > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> > > @"Virdo.1540" said:

> > > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> > [...]

> > Lately I've been joining many a Fractal group doing Recs only, that already had an Alacrigade, so it gave me a chance to play Power Herald in T3-T1s with a typical group running Firebrigade, and juggling the F2 became questionable to me. In OW I'll usually only activate it while in Shiro if I need the extra sustain, otherwise I just ignore it.

> >

> > The only place I actually use F2 is in WvW, but never as an upkeep.

>

>

> In fractal the +3sec is a bit useless, as you earn BD from agony resistance + the pre-buff from mistlock ... And also because Ren build to have perma alacrity without you.

> But in raids it could be more useful :

> As FB should need BD now for perma quickness, same for chrono who play with ~70% BD and with inspiration traitline.

> Herald in subgroup 2 with a +20% BD for 10 players + the +3sec of True Nature : your chrono could play with ~50%BD (runes of pack + sigil + food already 40%) and Duel over Inspiration.

> Condi druid could play with less seraph accessories (may be even without, as you would also grant fury/mights). Etc etc.

>

 

I agree, but at the same time, in more optimized fractal statics, it would allow the Alacrigade and QFB to swap out some Diviner's for Berserkers as they won't need as much boon duration on their gear. A marginal change, to be sure...but again, just trying to figure out a way to make Herald attractive to a group without just piling on more damage.

 

I mean, just look at how Snowcrows describes it: https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/revenant/herald/boon/

 

The text alone is actually rather complimentary, but then have a look at all the boss fights they recommend it for: Sloth and Sam are listed as "mediocre", while everything else is Unsubstantial or Inefficient. Yikes.

 

And that is in a 10-person squad, where something like Draconic Echo actually matters.

 

Part of me feels we need be realistic though, and recognize that Alacrigade is meta for Raids and Fractals, and that Herald is meta for WvW and PvP, both Power and Condi. Maybe it just isn't reasonable to have an Elite be meta for all 3 game modes (unless your name is Firebrand ofc) and just be happy we have a seat at the table at all.

 

When I played WoW, some specs were optimal for PvE content, others for PvP. Perhaps we're just be unrealistic to demand that all elites be optimum in all game modes. (and that goes for other proffs too)

[Virdo.1540]

> @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> The text alone is actually rather complimentary, but then have a look at all the boss fights they recommend it for: Sloth and Sam are listed as "mediocre", while everything else is Unsubstantial or Inefficient. Yikes.

 

sidenote: its only mediocre there because it has decent CC for samarog, or can quickly teleport out of poison-aoe from sloth.

Besides that, theres nothing

 

> @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> Maybe it just isn't reasonable to have an Elite be meta for all 3 game modes (unless your name is Firebrand ofc)

dont forget warrior^^

[Xervite.5493]

Herald facets should pulse a unique category of buffs instead of common boons that any class can generate.

These buffs should be exclusive to herald, say the might facet instead of pulsing might now pulses 2-5% increased damage.

This will easily push herald into the pve meta and allow it to truly become an walking buff bot.

[zaswer.5246]

> @"Xervite.5493" said:

> Herald facets should pulse a unique category of buffs instead of common boons that any class can generate.

> These buffs should be exclusive to herald, say the might facet instead of pulsing might now pulses 2-5% increased damage.

> This will easily push herald into the pve meta and allow it to truly become an walking buff bot.

 

I like that idea , it would make herald unique and desireable , only thing i would add is taking out the herald dmg traits as they are "inferior" if we talk about a suport build , at least drac echoe is better than any self dmg trait in a sup build i think

[Turkeyspit.3965]

> @"Xervite.5493" said:

> Herald facets should pulse a unique category of buffs instead of common boons that any class can generate.

> These buffs should be exclusive to herald, say the might facet instead of pulsing might now pulses 2-5% increased damage.

> This will easily push herald into the pve meta and allow it to truly become an walking buff bot.

 

How many exclusives do we want to give the Rev though? They already have Assassins Presence, which is a unique boon similar to Warrior Banners, though its worth mentioning that before Chrono was gutted and Diviner Gear / Alacrigade emerged, groups didn't insist on a Rev in their groups, while Warriors have long been a staple of the meta.

 

You would also create a situation where a meta group MUST have a Herald in the party, and that just isn't good game design. Fractal groups are already pigeonholed as it is because Firebrand is the only spec that can reliably pump out group Quickness, and this forces the use of an Alacrigade as the 2nd support, because a Boon Chrono can't upkeep Might and Protection the way a Renegade can. So now a meta group would end up being: Power QB, Diviner Renegade, Diviner/Zerk Herald, Power Berserker + 1 DPS (Dragonhunter, maybe Weaver or Holo). And that isn't even mentioning the power creep you'd see with adding another layer of unique boons.

 

 

[zaswer.5246]

The difference between the bs and the reve with AP is that bs has much more dmg than rev , if rev had reached 33k dps with AP im sure there would have been more revs in raid , now we have alacgade and the full power rene wich gets to 31~32k dps , but still bs is a scuad buff ans AP is 5 group buff so bs still wins by a huge margin ( and gets buffed a lot while we are still triing to get rid of bugs )

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

Unique category of buffs ? And then (power) Rev is dead for every others mods if you can't maintain swiftness, fury etc.

 

I agree Herald could share more buffs, but not to replace facets. Herald was the class which grant boons and boon duration ... Herald should refill again this role.

Facet of Nature : 20% BD to herald ? But other form are shared ? It's nonsense. Please bring back BD for the group. Just this skill it could help a 10men group to build with less diviner/harrier, to always maintain the 25 mights, alacrity etc.

The suggestion to merg the facet of nature effects of both legends is a nice idea, it could be added to Core Value trait and give a point of upkeep for balance.

Shared Empowerment is useless : this trait could bring an unique buff. Herald presence, it gives damage bonus per boons; 150 concentration or healing power or +1sec to boons every 10sec; something like this.

Shield, this weapons is bullshit, it should have effects on boons, like the warhorn on tempest.

[Virdo.1540]

> @"Zhaid Zhem.6508" said:

> Unique category of buffs ? And then (power) Rev is dead for every others mods if you can't maintain swiftness, fury etc.

>

> I agree Herald could share more buffs, but not to replace facets. Herald was the class which grant boons and boon duration ... Herald should refill again this role.

> Facet of Nature : 20% BD to herald ? But other form are shared ? It's nonsense. Please bring back BD for the group. Just this skill it could help a 10men group to build with less diviner/harrier, to always maintain the 25 mights, alacrity etc.

> The suggestion to merg the facet of nature effects of both legends is a nice idea, it could be added to Core Value trait and give a point of upkeep for balance.

> Shared Empowerment is useless : this trait could bring an unique buff. Herald presence, it gives damage bonus per boons; 150 concentration or healing power or +1sec to boons every 10sec; something like this.

> Shield, this weapons is kitten, it should have effects on boons, like the warhorn on tempest.

 

could be an grandmaster trait to replace facet-boons with unique buffs ^^