[Discussion] PoF is a great "one time playing experience" but that's pretty much it

[Leo G.4501]

Likely the reason you have more posters complaining about nothing to do in PoF maps is because all the people enjoying the maps, across the entire game, including PoF, aren't on the forums complaining about it.

 

Just going to put it out there: You, OP, and a lot of those disapproving how things are designed are doing it wrong.

 

You'll go and complete something over and over, beat it into the ground, pulverize it until the content is dust and then wonder why it's dust. Rather than being a sensible player and chip away at things while doing a multitude of other things to supplement it and accomplishing things over time, you rush. You devour it all and now you have a tummy ache. Time and time again, people express that moderation will help you. But rather thank take advice, you just do what everyone else is doing, trying to get all the shinies to keep up with the Jones and now that you have the shinies, you're not happy. And all I can say is *OF COURSE YOU'RE NOT HAPPY!* Now you're just back to the same old grind you were at before!

 

It's always easy to blame others for lacking content or polish or non-rewards, but at the end of the day, even if you are truly entitled to more, your own personal enjoyment of something hinges on *YOU*. The devs can't artificially control how you consume the content, but *YOU* can. MMOs aren't a job where you must advance as quickly as possible, they're meant to be fun but all things fun *MUST* be controlled through moderation to enjoy them properly.

[Manasa Devi.7958]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> Likely the reason you have more posters complaining about nothing to do in PoF maps is because all the people enjoying the maps, across the entire game, including PoF, aren't on the forums complaining about it.

>

> Just going to put it out there: You, OP, and a lot of those disapproving how things are designed are doing it wrong.

>

> You'll go and complete something over and over, beat it into the ground, pulverize it until the content is dust and then wonder why it's dust. Rather than being a sensible player and chip away at things while doing a multitude of other things to supplement it and accomplishing things over time, you rush. You devour it all and now you have a tummy ache. Time and time again, people express that moderation will help you. But rather thank take advice, you just do what everyone else is doing, trying to get all the shinies to keep up with the Jones and now that you have the shinies, you're not happy. And all I can say is *OF COURSE YOU'RE NOT HAPPY!* Now you're just back to the same old grind you were at before!

>

> It's always easy to blame others for lacking content or polish or non-rewards, but at the end of the day, even if you are truly entitled to more, your own personal enjoyment of something hinges on *YOU*. The devs can't artificially control how you consume the content, but *YOU* can. MMOs aren't a job where you must advance as quickly as possible, they're meant to be fun but all things fun *MUST* be controlled through moderation to enjoy them properly.

 

So your solution to a lack of content is to not play. Got it.

[Leo G.4501]

> @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> So your solution to a lack of content is to not play. Got it.

 

Congratulations! You've won the "Entitled Player Award"!

 

But on a serious note, answer these questions:

 

1. Are you "done" with PoF?

2. If yes, are you still playing GW2 now?

3. If yes, What are you doing when you log in?

 

The temporary solution to your problem would have been to do #3 and sprinkle in the expansion into your playtime. At the very least, if you see the end of the tunnle of content on the horizon, put on the brakes. But the goal isn't to solve a "lack of content" problem but rather to improve your overall enjoyment of that content.

[zombyturtle.5980]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> Likely the reason you have more posters complaining about nothing to do in PoF maps is because all the people enjoying the maps, across the entire game, including PoF, aren't on the forums complaining about it.

>

> Just going to put it out there: You, OP, and a lot of those disapproving how things are designed are doing it wrong.

>

> You'll go and complete something over and over, beat it into the ground, pulverize it until the content is dust and then wonder why it's dust. Rather than being a sensible player and chip away at things while doing a multitude of other things to supplement it and accomplishing things over time, you rush. You devour it all and now you have a tummy ache. Time and time again, people express that moderation will help you. But rather thank take advice, you just do what everyone else is doing, trying to get all the shinies to keep up with the Jones and now that you have the shinies, you're not happy. And all I can say is *OF COURSE YOU'RE NOT HAPPY!* Now you're just back to the same old grind you were at before!

>

> It's always easy to blame others for lacking content or polish or non-rewards, but at the end of the day, even if you are truly entitled to more, your own personal enjoyment of something hinges on *YOU*. The devs can't artificially control how you consume the content, but *YOU* can. MMOs aren't a job where you must advance as quickly as possible, they're meant to be fun but all things fun *MUST* be controlled through moderation to enjoy them properly.

 

PLease dont tell me how i am playing the game is 'wrong'. I didnt rush through content, I played 1-2 hours per day with my bf and thats it and I finished pof over a week ago, the only thing I have left to do is complete the weapons collection and its too expensive to me to be worthwhile.

 

I hightly doubt 1-2 hours a day is 'pulverizing the content to dust' especially in the context of an MMO which is suppost to be able to sustain thousands of hours of playtime

[Manasa Devi.7958]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> > So your solution to a lack of content is to not play. Got it.

>

> Congratulations! You've won the "Entitled Player Award"!

>

> But on a serious note, answer these questions:

>

> 1. Are you "done" with PoF?

> 2. If yes, are you still playing GW2 now?

> 3. If yes, What are you doing when you log in?

>

> The temporary solution to your problem would have been to do #3 and sprinkle in the expansion into your playtime. At the very least, if you see the end of the tunnle of content on the horizon, put on the brakes. But the goal isn't to solve a "lack of content" problem but rather to improve your overall enjoyment of that content.

So, still, the way to deal with a lack of content is to not play it? The bigger problem is that what's there after you've gone over it once, is just not enjoyable. Map completion on my second character was just a matter of zipping across the lands at great speed and switching mounts once in a while to get to stuff. Everything is pedestrian and pathetically easy. Except the stuff meant for multiplayer, which has its own problems, being that it's not enjoyable to me at all.

 

When I'm playing since about a week, I'm playing what I would've been playing if I hadn't bought PoF.

[Leo G.4501]

> @zombyturtle.5980 said:

> > @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > Likely the reason you have more posters complaining about nothing to do in PoF maps is because all the people enjoying the maps, across the entire game, including PoF, aren't on the forums complaining about it.

> >

> > Just going to put it out there: You, OP, and a lot of those disapproving how things are designed are doing it wrong.

> >

> > You'll go and complete something over and over, beat it into the ground, pulverize it until the content is dust and then wonder why it's dust. Rather than being a sensible player and chip away at things while doing a multitude of other things to supplement it and accomplishing things over time, you rush. You devour it all and now you have a tummy ache. Time and time again, people express that moderation will help you. But rather thank take advice, you just do what everyone else is doing, trying to get all the shinies to keep up with the Jones and now that you have the shinies, you're not happy. And all I can say is *OF COURSE YOU'RE NOT HAPPY!* Now you're just back to the same old grind you were at before!

> >

> > It's always easy to blame others for lacking content or polish or non-rewards, but at the end of the day, even if you are truly entitled to more, your own personal enjoyment of something hinges on *YOU*. The devs can't artificially control how you consume the content, but *YOU* can. MMOs aren't a job where you must advance as quickly as possible, they're meant to be fun but all things fun *MUST* be controlled through moderation to enjoy them properly.

>

> PLease dont tell me how i am playing the game is 'wrong'. I didnt rush through content, I played 1-2 hours per day with my bf and thats it and I finished pof over a week ago, the only thing I have left to do is complete the weapons collection and its too expensive to me to be worthwhile.

>

> I hightly doubt 1-2 hours a day is 'pulverizing the content to dust' especially in the context of an MMO which is suppost to be able to sustain thousands of hours of playtime

 

With all due courtesy, I'm not talking to you.

 

If you only played 1-2 hours a day and exclusively PoF content, you still have content you can do. Those that I'm aiming my comment toward are those that got their griffon on the 3rd day of release or likely have +90% of all the achievements for PoF *AND* complain about lack of content. Because if those things are true and you are dissatisfied, then you are fundamentally playing the game wrong.

 

> @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> > @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said:

> > > So your solution to a lack of content is to not play. Got it.

> >

> > Congratulations! You've won the "Entitled Player Award"!

> >

> > But on a serious note, answer these questions:

> >

> > 1. Are you "done" with PoF?

> > 2. If yes, are you still playing GW2 now?

> > 3. If yes, What are you doing when you log in?

> >

> > The temporary solution to your problem would have been to do #3 and sprinkle in the expansion into your playtime. At the very least, if you see the end of the tunnle of content on the horizon, put on the brakes. But the goal isn't to solve a "lack of content" problem but rather to improve your overall enjoyment of that content.

> So, still, the way to deal with a lack of content is to not play it? The bigger problem is that what's there after you've gone over it once, is just not enjoyable. Map completion on my second character was just a matter of zipping across the lands at great speed and switching mounts once in a while to get to stuff. Everything is pedestrian and pathetically easy. Except the stuff meant for multiplayer, which has its own problems, being that it's not enjoyable to me at all.

>

> When I'm playing since about a week, I'm playing what I would've been playing if I hadn't bought PoF.

 

So is doing map completion more enjoyable in other maps? What you described with that is exactly what you'd do with any repeated map for the completion reward so that point is moot.

 

Regarding the other aspects you mention, this could be true if elaborated upon. One thought I considered as I read this thread is how people complained that HoT was much more group oriented and difficult to solo while PoF was, as you described, pedestrian and easy; my thought was perhaps that was by design. If you want an intense, group focused experience then play HoT and if you want a soloable, relaxing session then play PoF. The idea is that the choice doesn't have to be exclusive if you purchase the game, you can go to whatever map that fulfills your session's intended level of involvement.

 

But ultimately, this is ignoring the fact that more content will eventually roll out for PoF just like HoT did. PoF could still have the intense group-focused gameplay on the way.

 

That all aside, I still stand by my comment. You say "so the solution is to not play" which is exactly what is wrong with consumers of media in the current year. Like when a Youtube content creator expresses their goal of having consistent uploads but comes on tight schedules so cannot follow through, those consumers will express the same entitlement I see here even though the content creator never signed a binding contract for their media upload schedules and despite the vast quantities of other media at the consumers' fingertips in the meantime.

[Ashen.2907]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> Regarding the other aspects you mention, this could be true if elaborated upon. One thought I considered as I read this thread is how people complained that HoT was much more group oriented and difficult to solo while PoF was, as you described, pedestrian and easy; my thought was perhaps that was by design. If you want an intense, group focused experience then play HoT and if you want a soloable, relaxing session then play PoF. The idea is that the choice doesn't have to be exclusive

 

I think that this point might have more merit were the two pieces of content, with their varied styles, were released together. As it is, the HoT content is years old and may very well no longer serve as an entertaining option. There is a point at which repeating the same content over and over loses its entertainment value, in my opinion. That is neither unexpected nor inappropriate. It is an unavoidable reality. So, such old, played out, content may not serve well as an alternative to new content of a different style.

[TheRandomGuy.7246]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> That all aside, I still stand by my comment. You say "so the solution is to not play" which is exactly what is wrong with consumers of media in the current year.

 

Few posts ago on the same page.

 

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> You'll go and complete something over and over, beat it into the ground, pulverize it until the content is dust and then wonder why it's dust. Rather than being a sensible player and chip away at things while doing a multitude of other things to supplement it and accomplishing things over time, you rush.

 

Not playing brand new expansion is not sensible. You are blaming players for expecting more than a day worth of content from the content heavy expansion. And no. Achievements are not content.

[Leo G.4501]

> @Ashen.2907 said:

> > @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > Regarding the other aspects you mention, this could be true if elaborated upon. One thought I considered as I read this thread is how people complained that HoT was much more group oriented and difficult to solo while PoF was, as you described, pedestrian and easy; my thought was perhaps that was by design. If you want an intense, group focused experience then play HoT and if you want a soloable, relaxing session then play PoF. The idea is that the choice doesn't have to be exclusive

>

> I think that this point might have more merit were the two pieces of content, with their varied styles, were released together. As it is, the HoT content is years old and may very well no longer serve as an entertaining option. There is a point at which repeating the same content over and over loses its entertainment value, in my opinion. That is neither unexpected nor inappropriate. It is an unavoidable reality. So, such old, played out, content may not serve well as an alternative to new content of a different style.

 

It could be if content releases were made for each expansion rather than "finishing" one and then leaving it behind for the new. I never played GW1 but I was told that each expansion was a stand-alone game and I'm sure that once the story progressed through that area it wouldn't return but did they ever continue adding other content to them?

 

Speaking from a position I know personally, Cryptic Studios did a similar thing where their different games were stand-alones (City of Heroes and City of Villains) and they released content for each separately but they ultimately merged them together so content releases (Going Rogue) could bridge them together, meaning while each could still be played separately, they were all one game with content releases still being exclusive to heroes, villains and rouges but could be experienced by all. I bring that up because, I feel HoT, PoF and the core game will eventually just be merged anyway so the prospect that separate content releases being too exclusive would only be temporary.

 

tl;dr: HoT doesn't have to be considered "old" if content could still be aimed to directly address that notion but only temporarily until they simply merge the current expansions to make room for the next expansion.

 

> @TheRandomGuy.7246 said:

> > @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > That all aside, I still stand by my comment. You say "so the solution is to not play" which is exactly what is wrong with consumers of media in the current year.

>

> Few posts ago on the same page.

>

> > @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > You'll go and complete something over and over, beat it into the ground, pulverize it until the content is dust and then wonder why it's dust. Rather than being a sensible player and chip away at things while doing a multitude of other things to supplement it and accomplishing things over time, you rush.

>

> Not playing brand new expansion is not sensible. You are blaming players for expecting more than a day worth of content from the content heavy expansion. And no. Achievements are not content.

 

And you are blaming the content creator for your insatiable appetite for more while never acknowledging that you have an insatiable appetite. I can discuss about the criticism for the content itself (is it too easy? is it too tedius? is it too buggy? is it too short?) but that doesn't absolve the critic from criticism. I can critique your definition of easy and tedius, your expectations for quality or your frequency of content consumption as I discuss ideas or solutions to those issues.

[Ashen.2907]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > @Ashen.2907 said:

> > > @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > > Regarding the other aspects you mention, this could be true if elaborated upon. One thought I considered as I read this thread is how people complained that HoT was much more group oriented and difficult to solo while PoF was, as you described, pedestrian and easy; my thought was perhaps that was by design. If you want an intense, group focused experience then play HoT and if you want a soloable, relaxing session then play PoF. The idea is that the choice doesn't have to be exclusive

> >

> > I think that this point might have more merit were the two pieces of content, with their varied styles, were released together. As it is, the HoT content is years old and may very well no longer serve as an entertaining option. There is a point at which repeating the same content over and over loses its entertainment value, in my opinion. That is neither unexpected nor inappropriate. It is an unavoidable reality. So, such old, played out, content may not serve well as an alternative to new content of a different style.

>

> It could be if content releases were made for each expansion rather than "finishing" one and then leaving it behind for the new. I never played GW1 but I was told that each expansion was a stand-alone game and I'm sure that once the story progressed through that area it wouldn't return but did they ever continue adding other content to them?

>

> Speaking from a position I know personally, Cryptic Studios did a similar thing where their different games were stand-alones (City of Heroes and City of Villains) and they released content for each separately but they ultimately merged them together so content releases (Going Rogue) could bridge them together, meaning while each could still be played separately, they were all one game with content releases still being exclusive to heroes, villains and rouges but could be experienced by all. I bring that up because, I feel HoT, PoF and the core game will eventually just be merged anyway so the prospect that separate content releases being too exclusive would only be temporary.

>

> tl;dr: HoT doesn't have to be considered "old" if content could still be aimed to directly address that notion but only temporarily until they simply merge the current expansions to make room for the next expansion.

>

> > @TheRandomGuy.7246 said:

> > > @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > > That all aside, I still stand by my comment. You say "so the solution is to not play" which is exactly what is wrong with consumers of media in the current year.

> >

> > Few posts ago on the same page.

> >

> > > @"Leo G.4501" said:

> > > You'll go and complete something over and over, beat it into the ground, pulverize it until the content is dust and then wonder why it's dust. Rather than being a sensible player and chip away at things while doing a multitude of other things to supplement it and accomplishing things over time, you rush.

> >

> > Not playing brand new expansion is not sensible. You are blaming players for expecting more than a day worth of content from the content heavy expansion. And no. Achievements are not content.

>

> And you are blaming the content creator for your insatiable appetite for more while never acknowledging that you have an insatiable appetite. I can discuss about the criticism for the content itself (is it too easy? is it too tedius? is it too buggy? is it too short?) but that doesn't absolve the critic from criticism. I can critique your definition of easy and tedius, your expectations for quality or your frequency of content consumption as I discuss ideas or solutions to those issues.

 

Absolutely, continuing to develop and add to old maps could extend their entertainment value. I love the idea of telling new stories in a familiar setting. The superhero genre you reference with your comment ahout CoH is rife with examples. Sure the heroes venture off to exotic lands for the occasional adventure, but there is always a new threat to the hometown just around the corner. There is no reason, IMO, that this technique could not be applied to the fantasy genre.

[TheRandomGuy.7246]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> And you are blaming the content creator for your insatiable appetite for more while never acknowledging that you have an insatiable appetite.

 

If asking for more than 16 hours of gameplay from a content heavy expansion is too much then all I can do is press F.

[Manasa Devi.7958]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

 

> So is doing map completion more enjoyable in other maps? What you described with that is exactly what you'd do with any repeated map for the completion reward so that point is moot.

Yes, actually, map completion is more interesting in practically every map released since (and including) HoT. Just before the release of PoF, I redid all the season 3 maps on a character that hadn't done those, for the purpose of finishing the Aurora trinket. I kept running into interesting events and things to do. I had no such luck in PoF, because the maps are huge with events sparsely sprinkled across them and the vast majority of the few events I come across isn't worth stopping for because they're unrewarding in both loot and entertainment value.

[Stormcrow.7513]

There really needs to be more. After you do bounties, map completion and griffon there isnt really any content worth doing. Where are the meta events? I was so hopefull of a DOA type meta event or something cool like that but nothing. Not even any rare or cool items to try to get. I am starting to feel disappointed a find myself looking at other games :(

[Ashen.2907]

Map completion was more fun in PoF than in any map previously, for me. Then again, I freely admit, that the desert aesthetic is one of my favorites.

[zombyturtle.5980]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

 

>

> With all due courtesy, I'm not talking to you.

>

> If you only played 1-2 hours a day and exclusively PoF content, you still have content you can do. Those that I'm aiming my comment toward are those that got their griffon on the 3rd day of release or likely have +90% of all the achievements for PoF *AND* complain about lack of content. Because if those things are true and you are dissatisfied, then you are fundamentally playing the game wrong.

>

 

I dont have anything left to do other than 1 collection (exotic weapons). I am 100% sure of that.

[Obtena.7952]

> @Sodeni.6041 said:

> Now that **PoF is more than a month old**, the majority of players have already "finished" it.

>

> Most people (including me) have already unlocked all new elite specializations, explored every map, got all masteries and did most achievements of PoF.

> This leaves me with the impression that PoF's biggest flaw is that it's **not really repeatable**. It's not worth coming back to PoF maps once you've unlocked and discovered everything and there are no real profitable farms you can do.

>

> Don't get me wrong, PoF was a great **one time playing experience** but that's pretty much it. I hope that Anet will put more repeatable content like HoT meta maps into the next expansion **and** add maps for exploring. Because only having meta maps (HoT) and just having explorable maps (PoF) isn't the best formula in my opinion.

>

 

The "majority" ay? Damn, I wish I had access to the statistics that everyone else does.

[IndigoSundown.5419]

I've read through most if not all of the discussions on the subject of Path of Fire. I've also been running through the various maps since release. While PoF does have a lot to do, it seems that the following are issues with that content. PoF has a lot of events. However, at least half the time, most of these events get left undone. Time and again, I see collection events, escorts, herd the whatever, defeat the Forged raiding party and a lot of other events with no one doing them. So, why?

 

Conventional wisdom would say, it's the rewards. While the events in BSF, EB, BFF, etc. are no more compelling, these tend to be more frequently done. In my opinion, this is because most of the LS3 zone events can be accomplished in the process of gathering the map currency to get Ascended trinkets and other desirable things. Still, events that are too time consuming or don't contribute directly to the gaining of whatever rewards the zone offers are not done. Just in BFF, the event to protect the baby griffons, or the one to rescue the Quaggans from the Svanir remain undone, while the Defend the Kodan Shrines events get done because there is a daily task, and because doing so allows for looting the Icebound Chests.

 

So, my guess is that the rewards exclusive to PoF require too few reps to get done, are less desirable or a combination of the above.

[STIHL.2489]

In the middle of the Mad King Festival.. the other maps are kinda quiet.. who would have imagined.

[Ahlen.7591]

Lack of content aside, the lack of world bosses or larg> @STIHL.2489 said:

> In the middle of the Mad King Festival.. the other maps are kinda quiet.. who would have imagined.

 

This makes literally no sense, stop saying it.

 

The way the mapping system works is it only creates shards of maps as previous maps are filled. There's not 10 versions of Desert Highlands at one time making all 10 feel empty.