No more fractals, it's time for the dungeons

[Obtena.7952]

> @"Kapax.3801" said:

> > @Mourningcry.9428 said:

> > This has already been addressed by Anet.

> Assuming that creating a fractal is almost the same as making a dungeon, you could focus on creating a dungeon with the Lore related to the expansion.

 

how about we don't assume things ... I'm suspecting there are technical reasons why fractals is the preferred approach; the primary one being that it's the system (and the rewards) they have focused on developing.

[zealex.9410]

> @"Kapax.3801" said:

> > @Mourningcry.9428 said:

> > This has already been addressed by Anet.

> Assuming that creating a fractal is almost the same as making a dungeon, you could focus on creating a dungeon with the Lore related to the expansion.

 

Its not. A dungeon usually has multiple paths which all last as long as some of the longer fractals in not more and come with a full weapon and armor set. Alot more work.

[ADTempys.6382]

Honestly I don't want Anet to touch anything in the current dungeons, they will make it worse.

 

You can already see that reworked fotm are terrible, like Mossman used to be one of the nicest boss in the game, now swamp is beyond boring...

[Attuned To Love.6579]

> @"ADTempys.6382" said:

> Honestly I don't want Anet to touch anything in the current dungeons, they will make it worse.

 

I agree totally. Please never touch old dungeons ( it is already annoying that you have to stealth yourself past the useless risen illusionist in any arah path nowadays )

 

But i also doubt that they are able to create dungeons which have the same flavor as the old ones...

The old ones were more about tactical stuff ( stealth skipping , using reflect mecahanics, portals and so on ). Thats a thing i really miss in the most recent fractals which are menat to be the successor of the old dungeons.

 

Twilight Oasis was a good try to bring back this special flavor, because you are able to stealth skip quite a huge part of that fractal. But it failed horribly because of the GG mechanic to reset cooldowns( stealth is just a joke then ). And then this horrible designed endboss. This last boss is just a huge clusterfuck and not a real fun to play ( it's not even that hard just annoying ) .

 

The CM's are good as they are but they are more raid like content for 5 man. But at least created in a nice way, so it is real fun to play them, even if i think Artsariiv and Arkk are a bit overloaded but... yeah ok it's aight.

 

So if Anet ever want to recreate dungeons can they even fullfill our expectations? Probably not. But please Anet prove me wrong and bring new (probably expansion tied ) dungeons with the old special flavor the old ones had.

 

 

[mazut.4296]

Its time for both!!!

PoF is missing dungeons so much, its like born without hands. So sad. Would be so much better if we had 1 dungeon per map at least.

[Chris McSwag.4683]

> @"Lunateric.3708" said:

> No, fractals is what they'll focus on and that's fine, game evolved past dungeons. I'd like it if a legendary trinket was tied to the Dungeoneer collection though, would make sense that a legendary accessory is tied to collecting all dungeon accesories.

 

This is actually a brilliant way of getting population back into dungeons

[BlaqueFyre.5678]

> @"Kapax.3801" said:

> > @Mourningcry.9428 said:

> > This has already been addressed by Anet.

> Assuming that creating a fractal is almost the same as making a dungeon, you could focus on creating a dungeon with the Lore related to the expansion.

 

Anet Devs have explicitly stated in the past that making dungeons is not the same as making Fractals, due to Dungeons being tied to in world locations, tie in Lore, and a plethora of other reasons, again they Have been pretty consistent in the past 5 years on their reasoning and stance in regards to dungeons, they are dead.

[Lunateric.3708]

> @"Chris McSwag.4683" said:

> > @"Lunateric.3708" said:

> > No, fractals is what they'll focus on and that's fine, game evolved past dungeons. I'd like it if a legendary trinket was tied to the Dungeoneer collection though, would make sense that a legendary accessory is tied to collecting all dungeon accesories.

>

> This is actually a brilliant way of getting population back into dungeons

 

It also makes use of the collections they have had in place for years and rewards those people who already did them. It also gives a somewhat long term goal to those just starting and doesn't need any tampering beyond making something like 4 dungeon accesories combine in the Mystic Forge into a gift and the other 4 doing the same (8 dungeons total I believe). Will it happen?, I am thinking not.

[Durzlla.6295]

I wouldn’t cut fractals for dungeons, if anything I’d cut raids for “Elite Dungeons” aka raid level of difficulty balanced for 5 people instead of 10.

[MadLass.3821]

I understand dungeons have stopped production, but maybe instead of fractals we get more raids?

[npmis.7860]

The latest four fractals we got aren't too hard imo. This excludes the CMs obviously, which should be hard. Only Oasis seems to be a bit too annoying with all the CC and visual clutter.

 

As much as I'd like to have dungeons reworked and maybe some new, I don't want them to work on those, if it means that fractals are cut.

[ReaverKane.7598]

> @"Kapax.3801" said:

> > @Mourningcry.9428 said:

> > This has already been addressed by Anet.

> Assuming that creating a fractal is almost the same as making a dungeon, you could focus on creating a dungeon with the Lore related to the expansion.

 

It isn't.

[ReaverKane.7598]

> @"ADTempys.6382" said:

> Honestly I don't want Anet to touch anything in the current dungeons, they will make it worse.

>

> You can already see that reworked fotm are terrible, like Mossman used to be one of the nicest boss in the game, now swamp is beyond boring...

Wait, what? You're saying that old tank and spank Mossman and bloomhunger were more exciting than current bloomhunger?

Or just that you don't care about it being boring or exciting, just that you can farm it quicker. At least be honest.

 

> @"npmis.7860" said:

> The latest four fractals we got aren't too hard imo. This excludes the CMs obviously, which should be hard. Only Oasis seems to be a bit too annoying with all the CC and visual clutter.

>

> As much as I'd like to have dungeons reworked and maybe some new, I don't want them to work on those, if it means that fractals are cut.

 

Bah, i tried TO at T4 the day it came out, wiped like 10 times, never had a wipe since that i can remember. After you get it down, it's one of the easiest fractals in the game. It does have a lot of visual clutter, that to the less experienced might distract them from the actual objectives and threats. But it's a easy, easy fractal.

 

I agree, Fractals are well, and while i would like a come-back of dungeons, i entirely disagree with OP's motives and arguments.

[Walhalla.5473]

Well to be honest. Anet missed a mark when they didn't advertise fractals as another form of dungeons because fractals ARE dungeons, a bit different than the classic dungeons but still dungeons. With the focus on the Fractal-Dungeons Anet should advertize them correctly. Everyone and their grandma knows what a dungeon is but a fractal? People wouldn'T be able to imagine what a fractal is for an MMO. If they said " Our form of dungeons is doing ( insert everything fractals are doing here ), and it allows both casual and harcore players to enjoy 5 man content." it would create much more interest than saying. " We don't support dungeons, only fractals".

 

And the classic dungeons.... they are just bad quality content.

[ADTempys.6382]

> @"ReaverKane.7598" said:

> > @"ADTempys.6382" said:

> > Honestly I don't want Anet to touch anything in the current dungeons, they will make it worse.

> >

> > You can already see that reworked fotm are terrible, like Mossman used to be one of the nicest boss in the game, now swamp is beyond boring...

> Wait, what? You're saying that old tank and spank Mossman and bloomhunger were more exciting than current bloomhunger?

> Or just that you don't care about it being boring or exciting, just that you can farm it quicker. At least be honest.

>

> > @"npmis.7860" said:

> > The latest four fractals we got aren't too hard imo. This excludes the CMs obviously, which should be hard. Only Oasis seems to be a bit too annoying with all the CC and visual clutter.

> >

> > As much as I'd like to have dungeons reworked and maybe some new, I don't want them to work on those, if it means that fractals are cut.

>

> Bah, i tried TO at T4 the day it came out, wiped like 10 times, never had a wipe since that i can remember. After you get it down, it's one of the easiest fractals in the game. It does have a lot of visual clutter, that to the less experienced might distract them from the actual objectives and threats. But it's a easy, easy fractal.

>

> I agree, Fractals are well, and while i would like a come-back of dungeons, i entirely disagree with OP's motives and arguments.

 

Current bloomhunger doesn't even fight back in a decent group, the whole duration of the fight is killing the adds, and yes old mossman was way better, i remember that people used to die there, and it was the best boss to solo in the game, while being one of the hardest.

I mean anything in fractals is a joke nowadays, everything die to breakbar with a decent group, and I remember when you had to predict Imbued Shaman's storm on scale 50 to not get oneshoted as ele, now you can even fish casting your meteor shower in it and still be at 50% hp :^).

 

Don't call me a farmer without even knowing any sides of me, you probably farmed way more things than I did in this game, I only play for pleasure and I can tell you that farming something isn't fun to me at all, and enjoy solo to duo format the most in this game, not exactly how you farm things.

 

And I'm obviously talking about people playing the game without those terrible safe spots, as i always ragequited when I saw people doing those retarded things.

 

You can ask anyone in the """"hardcore"""" community of this game, if pre Hot fotm were better than the current ones, pretty sure everyone will have the same answer.

 

[ReaverKane.7598]

> @"ADTempys.6382" said:

> > @"ReaverKane.7598" said:

> > > @"ADTempys.6382" said:

> > > Honestly I don't want Anet to touch anything in the current dungeons, they will make it worse.

> > >

> > > You can already see that reworked fotm are terrible, like Mossman used to be one of the nicest boss in the game, now swamp is beyond boring...

> > Wait, what? You're saying that old tank and spank Mossman and bloomhunger were more exciting than current bloomhunger?

> > Or just that you don't care about it being boring or exciting, just that you can farm it quicker. At least be honest.

> >

> > > @"npmis.7860" said:

> > > The latest four fractals we got aren't too hard imo. This excludes the CMs obviously, which should be hard. Only Oasis seems to be a bit too annoying with all the CC and visual clutter.

> > >

> > > As much as I'd like to have dungeons reworked and maybe some new, I don't want them to work on those, if it means that fractals are cut.

> >

> > Bah, i tried TO at T4 the day it came out, wiped like 10 times, never had a wipe since that i can remember. After you get it down, it's one of the easiest fractals in the game. It does have a lot of visual clutter, that to the less experienced might distract them from the actual objectives and threats. But it's a easy, easy fractal.

> >

> > I agree, Fractals are well, and while i would like a come-back of dungeons, i entirely disagree with OP's motives and arguments.

>

> Current bloomhunger doesn't even fight back in a decent group, the whole duration of the fight is killing the adds, and yes old mossman was way better, i remember that people used to die there, and it was the best boss to solo in the game, while being one of the hardest.

> I mean anything in fractals is a joke nowadays, everything die to breakbar with a decent group, and I remember when you had to predict Imbued Shaman's storm on scale 50 to not get oneshoted as ele, now you can even fish casting your meteor shower in it and still be at 50% hp :^).

>

> Don't call me a farmer without even knowing any sides of me, you probably farmed way more things than I did in this game, I only play for pleasure and I can tell you that farming something isn't fun to me at all, and enjoy solo to duo format the most in this game, not exactly how you farm things.

>

> And I'm obviously talking about people playing the game without those terrible safe spots, as i always ragequited when I saw people doing those kitten things.

>

> You can ask anyone in the """"hardcore"""" community of this game, if pre Hot fotm were better than the current ones, pretty sure everyone will have the same answer.

>

 

YES? Because all the hardcore fractal runners that i know do find fractals much better and engaging. And comparing bloomhunger, phasing him in seconds to killing Mossman while he was stealthed, i prefer the new bloomhunger.

I remember people dying in bloomhunger too.

[GrubySzymek.1362]

Anet already has tools to create new, modern, better dungeons. How? Well, what are raids if not 10-man, buffed dungeons. Now what they need to do is actually remember who funded this whole raiding whim and give us some sweet, oldschool in atmosphere, yet modern in mechanics dungeons. Medium difficulty for 5 man, relaxed groups with cool story connected to present events, not yet another fractal being somewhere in time and space that by definition of mists is never a representation of what happened 100%.

[ADTempys.6382]

Last time I saw people dead at bloomhunger in a guild run was 2 weeks after release.

 

Idk who your hardcore fractals runner are because they doesn't exist anymore, they all left with HoT or stopped caring about it, when I'm talking fotm tryhards it's about people who used to do records on it or at least were engaged enough to solo or duo scale 50.

 

I don't know how you can find any fotm engaging, you have potion giving perma dodge, higher toughness while bosses doing a third of their old damage, and even if you manage to go low you now have a druid to carry you, healing druid for most of the pugs I saw, that's like next level easy. And now you even have the new fractal god that gives up to 300hp/S And +7% damages to be sure nothing survives to breakbar burst, I have no idea how this can be more challenging.

 

[Einlanzer.1627]

> @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> This has already been addressed by Anet.

 

That means nothing. If demand for real world dungeons is high and continues to grow, Anet will at some point change their tune and start doing them again.

 

Fractals were a great idea as a type of dungeon, but they are not sufficient to replace all other 5 man content. World dungeons with setting-specific lore need to be brought back. PoF would have been much better if it had a few dungeons scattered around the new zones for players to immerse themselves in. The open world simply can't simulate that level of immersion and camaraderie building as well.

 

The decision to cut dungeons was made long ago, presumably by Colin, and he was wrong, much like how he was wrong about a lot of other things that the game suffered for. It's time to reverse that decision.

[flog.3485]

Personally I wouldn't advocate for more of some content that they barely revamped/updated in the first four years of GW2 development.

 

[Mourningcry.9428]

> @"Einlanzer.1627" said:

> > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > This has already been addressed by Anet.

>

> That means nothing. If demand for real world dungeons is high and continues to grow, Anet will at some point change their tune and start doing them again.

 

Actually, it's really the only thing that matters. Whether you choose to accept this or not is entirely up to you - but it doesn't change the reality of the situation.

 

Presuming to know what will actually change the situation based on opinion shares the same level of delusion.

 

 

[Einlanzer.1627]

> @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > @"Einlanzer.1627" said:

> > > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > > This has already been addressed by Anet.

> >

> > That means nothing. If demand for real world dungeons is high and continues to grow, Anet will at some point change their tune and start doing them again.

>

> Actually, it's really the only thing that matters. Whether you choose to accept this or not is entirely up to you - but it doesn't change the reality of the situation.

>

> Presuming to know what will actually change the situation based on opinion shares the same level of delusion.

>

>

 

That is an asinine comment not worthy of true rebuttal.

[Mourningcry.9428]

> @"Einlanzer.1627" said:

> > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > > @"Einlanzer.1627" said:

> > > > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > > > This has already been addressed by Anet.

> > >

> > > That means nothing. If demand for real world dungeons is high and continues to grow, Anet will at some point change their tune and start doing them again.

> >

> > Actually, it's really the only thing that matters. Whether you choose to accept this or not is entirely up to you - but it doesn't change the reality of the situation.

> >

> > Presuming to know what will actually change the situation based on opinion shares the same level of delusion.

> >

> >

>

> That is an asinine comment not worthy of true rebuttal.

 

Ok, would you please link the source where Anet announced that if they got enough feedback and high demand existed they'd recant their stance and re-open dungeon development?

 

No? How about anything official from Anet indicating that they have the slightest interest in restarting dungeon content?

 

No? But I bet you can find such a statement stating that Fractals is their intended 5 man content.

 

As far as high demand goes, if this thread can be taken as any indication of such interest, that'd be a whopping 76 people in favor of them at the time of this post - 2 months after the origination of the poll. 76 people had the smallest inclination to bother to click yes out of 1.3k views - this constitutes a trend towards high demand to you?

 

It's been years since ANet made their decision. This isn't the first discussion on it, just when is this high demand and about-face from Anet gonna happen? Or even any indication from ANet that they're even considering it?

 

You're entitled to your opinion... but stating such conjecture as fact, as you did, is simply disingenuous.

 

[GrubySzymek.1362]

> @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > @"Einlanzer.1627" said:

> > > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > > > @"Einlanzer.1627" said:

> > > > > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > > > > This has already been addressed by Anet.

> > > >

> > > > That means nothing. If demand for real world dungeons is high and continues to grow, Anet will at some point change their tune and start doing them again.

> > >

> > > Actually, it's really the only thing that matters. Whether you choose to accept this or not is entirely up to you - but it doesn't change the reality of the situation.

> > >

> > > Presuming to know what will actually change the situation based on opinion shares the same level of delusion.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > That is an asinine comment not worthy of true rebuttal.

>

> Ok, would you please link the source where Anet announced that if they got enough feedback and high demand existed they'd recant their stance and re-open dungeon development?

>

> No? How about anything official from Anet indicating that they have the slightest interest in restarting dungeon content?

>

> No? But I bet you can find such a statement stating that Fractals is their intended 5 man content.

>

> As far as high demand goes, if this thread can be taken as any indication of such interest, that'd be a whopping 76 people in favor of them at the time of this post - 2 months after the origination of the poll. 76 people had the smallest inclination to bother to click yes out of 1.3k views - this constitutes a trend towards high demand to you?

>

> It's been years since ANet made their decision. This isn't the first discussion on it, just when is this high demand and about-face from Anet gonna happen? Or even any indication from ANet that they're even considering it?

>

> You're entitled to your opinion... but stating such conjecture as fact, as you did, is simply disingenuous.

>

 

There is high demand for build templates and anet doesn't care for 6 years already. I'm pretty sure the demand argument is not what they consider relevant.

[Mourningcry.9428]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > > @"Einlanzer.1627" said:

> > > > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > > > > @"Einlanzer.1627" said:

> > > > > > @"Mourningcry.9428" said:

> > > > > > This has already been addressed by Anet.

> > > > >

> > > > > That means nothing. If demand for real world dungeons is high and continues to grow, Anet will at some point change their tune and start doing them again.

> > > >

> > > > Actually, it's really the only thing that matters. Whether you choose to accept this or not is entirely up to you - but it doesn't change the reality of the situation.

> > > >

> > > > Presuming to know what will actually change the situation based on opinion shares the same level of delusion.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > That is an asinine comment not worthy of true rebuttal.

> >

> > Ok, would you please link the source where Anet announced that if they got enough feedback and high demand existed they'd recant their stance and re-open dungeon development?

> >

> > No? How about anything official from Anet indicating that they have the slightest interest in restarting dungeon content?

> >

> > No? But I bet you can find such a statement stating that Fractals is their intended 5 man content.

> >

> > As far as high demand goes, if this thread can be taken as any indication of such interest, that'd be a whopping 76 people in favor of them at the time of this post - 2 months after the origination of the poll. 76 people had the smallest inclination to bother to click yes out of 1.3k views - this constitutes a trend towards high demand to you?

> >

> > It's been years since ANet made their decision. This isn't the first discussion on it, just when is this high demand and about-face from Anet gonna happen? Or even any indication from ANet that they're even considering it?

> >

> > You're entitled to your opinion... but stating such conjecture as fact, as you did, is simply disingenuous.

> >

>

> There is high demand for build templates and anet doesn't care for 6 years already. I'm pretty sure the demand argument is not what they consider relevant.

 

No kidding... tell that to @"Einlanzer.1627" :)