Path of Fire Material Storage

[Nova.3817]

> @typographie.1742 said:

> To make a simple set of exotic armor using oiled components, you need 1200 Piles of Flax Seeds. Assuming no material storage upgrades, that's 1 material storage slot + 4 bank tabs gone already. How many flax does one have to have in storage before Arenanet terms it "warehousing," instead of just saving up the mats the game actually asks for?

 

i agree that every resource in recipes needs to be dialed WAY back and the rate of which they can be obtained also dialed way back....

[crashburntoo.7431]

It's an interesting, socio-economic study, but the inconvenience is tangible for many. I admit to being one of the "Deposit All" players that cleaned house much later or only began selling with overflow. My game pace is typically so slow that I have absolutely no impact on this dynamic, nor do I have much of an inconvenience in inventory stacking.

 

It will be interesting to see what materials are being targeted and what uses they have. This announcement will have an impact on the mindset of many players. Knowing that selling of some materials early on is being encouraged to balance pricing as quickly as possible (or reduce the peak severity) may actually have the opposite effect... more people will intentionally hang onto it. Many have indicated that they save early on until they've had a chance to understand the potential uses and make a personal plan accordingly, but the difference will be felt based on intentional action/inaction.

 

This will "succeed" if most or all of those that unintentionally deposited, instead intentionally sell. If they switch to intentionally depositing (stacking) along with those that were going to save material anyway, we'll have a low supply, high demand situation with associated price increases. Of course, the definition of success may be a reduced peak price relative to unrelated material events from HoT that have multiple demand variables anyway.

 

I hope they will share the results of this experiment and compare it to some HoT experiences to provide context.

[Healix.5819]

> @"Phoebe Ascension.8437" said:

> Last week i required over 100 mystic coins to simply finish stuff like style guide, fine dining, fine whining etc. If i didnt heart mystic coins, i would not have enough. Hoarding is a natural process when you hide important recipes behind a launch item.

 

If everyone was forced to sell the coins from their login rewards from now on, the price of them would crash. That's why John Smith didn't want to change them, because more are coming in than being used. The problem is, the vast majority of players simply deposit and forget with no intention of using them and it takes about a year to acquire a stack, at which point they may begin to sell them. That's what they're trying to prevent with the new materials and anyone complaining simply isn't the target. The target is the average players, most of which will never hear about this, and will be casually playing through the expansion solo without ever having a use for those materials. The game was designed around the idea that you weren't supposed to farm your own stuff, but rather play whatever you want, sell what you don't need and buy what you do.

 

They need a proper solution of course, but how do you get the vast majority, a lazy person that doesn't care either way, to sell their materials?

 

> @CETheLucid.3964 said:

> John Smith left us? When?

 

April 2017

[Sylvyn.4750]

This would only help if you drop the insane amount of materials required to craft anything worthwhile. I will save everything at least until we know for sure which materials will be needed in quantity and/or which ones will be more abundant vs. rare.

 

On another note, will Freshwater Pearls and Maguuma Lilies drop more frequently, or at least come down in price, now that we're moving on to new stat sets? :)

[Ashen.2907]

> @Healix.5819 said:

> > @"Phoebe Ascension.8437" said:

> > Last week i required over 100 mystic coins to simply finish stuff like style guide, fine dining, fine whining etc. If i didnt heart mystic coins, i would not have enough. Hoarding is a natural process when you hide important recipes behind a launch item.

>

> If everyone was forced to sell the coins from their login rewards from now on, the price of them would crash. That's why John Smith didn't want to change them, because more are coming in than being used. The problem is, the vast majority of players simply deposit and forget with no intention of using them and it takes about a year to acquire a stack, at which point they may begin to sell them. That's what they're trying to prevent with the new materials and anyone complaining simply isn't the target. The target is the average players, most of which will never hear about this, and will be casually playing through the expansion solo without ever having a use for those materials. The game was designed around the idea that you weren't supposed to farm your own stuff, but rather play whatever you want, sell what you don't need and buy what you do.

>

> They need a proper solution of course, but how do you get the vast majority, a lazy person that doesn't care either way, to sell their materials?

>

> > @CETheLucid.3964 said:

> > John Smith left us? When?

>

> April 2017

 

If you are going to be hit by the blast of a grenade tossed indiscriminately into a room, it doesn't really matter that you were not the target.

[Excellent Name.9574]

I guess, that solves the dilemma of what to do with my unused character slots. Mules it is!

[Shirlias.8104]

is it known the number of materials which could not be put into the storage?

We are going to save way more space through unidentified items, so probably won't be a big deal.

[Ceesa.1350]

> @Ohoni.6057 said:

> I think the easiest way to do this, btw, is to just have massive material dumps tied into simple Achievements, the sorts of things that players are likely to clear easily enough as they normally progress through the new content. This way, they get these things once, and only once per account.

 

That's absolutely brilliant and clearly the optimal way to go about doing this.

[Razor.9872]

I don't mind. At the very least, I think it will be an interesting experiment.

[Hitman.5829]

I don't buy it, you make this to force players to purchase bank tabs and bag slots. $$$$$$$$$$$$ is behind!

[wetwillyhip.7254]

I agree with many here. The problem with your examples Gaile is that flax is needed in high quantities in MANY basic/high-demand recipes. That is why the supply/demand went haywire. This was not due to having material storage upon release. Recipes need to be dialed back with how much new materials are needed.

[Xernth.8561]

It all makes sense now.

 

I'm supposed to sell crafting materials I will need later, paying a15% transaction tax in the process.

 

So I can do a heart quest I don't care about and have enough liquid cash available to pay to identify loot that I got which is supposed to be a reward.

 

How could anyone think this isn't a great idea?

[Malthurius.6870]

Sure, flax was pretty common, but that didn't really matter when it takes anywhere from 10-20 flax nodes to get enough for 1 linseed oil... which you need 10 of for 1 piece of armor... so, 200 flax nodes for a single piece of armor? You're nuts if you think the high price of flax was due to people hoarding it... it was due to the amount required to make anything with it.

 

If the materials are common enough, people will reach their material storage limit quickly... but if they need an enormous amount of it for crafting, they're going to hold onto those materials long past the time it takes to fill up 250 slots of storage.

 

This kind of action feels like a band-aid for a bigger problem to me, and I can't see this solving much because the players that offer the most supply are the ones more likely to hold onto it if it's needed in excess amounts.

[Ahkaskar.3906]

> @Ohoni.6057 said:

> > @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

> >During the early period of Heart of Thorns, this significantly contributed to the early expense of flax, which was abundantly available but, for the most part, was "warehoused" in the banks of players.

>

> No. The thing that made it heavily "warehoused" is that it was a currency that was highly in demand for a great many things that people needed early on. This demand reduced over time once most players had all the things Flax was good for. Players who did put their flax on the TP would likely have regretted it when the time came that they wanted to use it for their Guild Hall or something.

>

> All this change will do is waste more inventory space and encourage people to buy more inventory slots.

Yes, thank you. The reason we, as players, hoarded things like flax, is because it had a great amount of value due to so much being required to craft anything new. 20 flax seeds to craft a single vial and you need multiple vials to do anything, you bet we're gonna hoard it. Hoarding it until your storage overflows is the only way you know you have enough to craft anything with it.

 

This is like when they switched silk to 3 scraps per bolt and 100 bolts per silk thread. That's what drove the price way way way up, not because of the amount that was being stored in peoples' banks. Likewise with the leather. In those cases the fix was to then make more supply available to drive the cost back down, and now we have an economy that is based on people spending their entire day running farm mode in a specific map.

 

And now we're going back to having more stuff that is essentially going to take up permanent residence in our inventories because there's no point in clearing the slot, since it's just going to be taken up again after the next fight. The way this thinking should work is that if you have 10 items that drop regularly during the normal player experience that can't be cleared easily, that means the player has 10 fewer inventory slots for more uncommon/special drops. Those 10 slots are now permanently consumed during the course of running that content.

[reapex.8546]

I understand part of this decision however, some players will continue to the do same. For example, I finally have room in my bank now that blade shards can be deposited. However, due to this decision I have that added room again. Why have I lost it? Because, I'm going to put the new materials in bank storage since I can't put them in material storage. However, I guess most people would wind up selling the mats in their inventory with this change.

[reapex.8546]

> @Ahkaskar.3906 said:

> > @Ohoni.6057 said:

> > > @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

> > >During the early period of Heart of Thorns, this significantly contributed to the early expense of flax, which was abundantly available but, for the most part, was "warehoused" in the banks of players.

> >

> > No. The thing that made it heavily "warehoused" is that it was a currency that was highly in demand for a great many things that people needed early on. This demand reduced over time once most players had all the things Flax was good for. Players who did put their flax on the TP would likely have regretted it when the time came that they wanted to use it for their Guild Hall or something.

> >

> > All this change will do is waste more inventory space and encourage people to buy more inventory slots.

>

> This is like when they switched silk to 3 scraps per bolt and 100 bolts per silk thread. That's what drove the price way way way up, not because of the amount that was being stored in peoples' banks. Likewise with the leather. In those cases the fix was to then make more supply available to drive the cost back down, and now we have an economy that is based on people spending their entire day running farm mode in a specific map.

I still hoard silk scraps on my characters xD.

[PookieDaWombat.6209]

> @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

> With the arrival of Path of Fire, many new materials and components will be added to Material Storage. But for a handful of items, we've specifically decided not to start with them in Material Storage, and instead to add them to the storage system later. Why? Well, at the launch of Heart of Thorns, we noticed a peculiar behavior: most players will deposit first when clearing their inventory, and then proceed to take actions like salvaging, opening chests, or, crucially, putting items on the Trading Post. This tended to mean that before a player will post an item on the Trading Post, they'll wait to accrue a full stack in their Material Storage. During the early period of Heart of Thorns, this significantly contributed to the early expense of flax, which was abundantly available but, for the most part, was "warehoused" in the banks of players.

>

> In an experiment to see if we can combat the early steep price of a handful of materials, we will launch Path of Fire without those items being depositable. Once we are comfortable with the supply and price—which we believe should become apparent in weeks, not months—we will add them to material storage.

>

> We know how important inventory space is to players, and we take seriously how much of your time is spent playing versus managing your play. Hopefully, this decision will help ensure a steady supply of materials to the market, without unduly burdening your bags.

>

 

HA!, ok, wow I just saw this thread. I mean sure, I can sorta see where you're coming from, but wasn't the whole point of the economy that you would let it work itself out for the most part? Also, whats to stop someone from using a mule to act as the storage to "warehouse" the materials anyway? Instead you're just inconveniencing a new player more than a vet player here.

 

This is going to be hilarious to watch on the forums. I'm sure it'll all be shaken out of the system once i decide if I'm purchasing or not, but still, wow.

[PookieDaWombat.6209]

***Also, for everyone trying to make the argument that the IDing items thing was to help us with managing our inventory: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Oh man, my sides.

[Sir Vincent III.1286]

To be honest, this will not stop me from banking my materials and transferring them to my Alts. The reason I'm hoarding the materials is that gold is very important and I don't really want to spend them if I already have the materials in stock. This is a typical human behavior -- fill up the barn first then sell the excess -- you will never change that. The market will remain the same and all you would have accomplished is annoy the players. Nevertheless, thanks for the heads up.

[Bunter.3795]

lol, this thread comes out, huge negative feedback, lot's of down votes and what happens.......

 

No comment from Anet, no response to our feedback other than "let's remove the down vote system" Gotta save your own kitten.

 

All I can say is that this decision has cost you $120-$200 as I have 2 accts of the 4 I have that I haven't upgraded yet to PoF and this decision combined with the unid loot system has made me hesitate to upgrade them. I realize that you'll make that up in the bank tab and character slot sales this decision will create but then again we all know that was the goal of this decision.

 

 

[TPMN.1483]

Okay- so why are a bunch of materials which are 'account' bound - like the following: Granite, Tamarisk Reed not depoistable?

- You need 10 before you can make the next material level.

 

This does not help.

[Ashamir.9574]

Just for this won't sell anything.

 

I'm one of the people that keeps their stuff on the bank, so in case **I** need it, **I** can use it. When I wanted to make Astralaria it cost me 3 days to finish the collection. Everything else I had on hand. That's what I was stacking for.

 

I'm not selling stuff just because you can't handle your economy. There are _still_ trading post flippers and people hording 100+ stacks of mystic coins, and there's _still_ nothing done about that. But people actually storing newly dropped crafting materials that they might need into the bank is bad?

 

This is bullkitten.

[Seaunicorn.9317]

I am not a vet player.. I am a noob, playing for last 2 months.. All material when I get, I deposit. Because I don't know when to use them later, or for what.. Now, Anet has put all the players in this bind.. Not knowing what the new mats are worth, and making it more difficult to save up these unknown mats.

 

Me? I am gonna create a mule with my spare slot and hoard it anyway. Though Anet has made it so difficult for me to transfer mats..

 

I don't care if I am the first one to craft a special item in PoF. All I care is if I can play the game long term. So the players who do want to craft something fast for bragging rights (nothing wrong with it), are gonna get so annoyed and mad because of mat shortage. So no one is happy??

[sorudo.9054]

well Anet, i can already say that some of them are already worthless within the 24 hours the game is released, that's the result.

now get it in to storage, it is cluttering my inventory.

[Nikal.4921]

I'm going to hang onto mats at least until I know what they are for. If I decide I don't need them, I'll let them accumulate to a stack, whether in my bank or bags, before I sell. The experiment is wasted on me, only serving as an annoyance at mats taking up bag space.