DeWolfe.2174 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 a whole 28% Raid and Raid sometimes. GJ Dev's for putting some much into them and gating so many rewards behind something 72% of your customers do not participate in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CptAurellian.9537 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"DeWolfe.2174" said: > a whole 28% Raid and Raid sometimes. GJ Dev's for putting some much into them and gating so many rewards behind something 72% of your customers do not participate in. In the time raiders got their five wings, the rest got 17 open world maps, four new fractals and a bunch of reworks, two addons worth of story etc., 7 living story episodes, more than a dozen weapon and armor sets and a bunch of other things I'm too lazy to think about. Yes, horribly imbalanced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JVJD.4912 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 Eek i voted wrong I did try to raid right at the beginning in Hot with my guild. We just lost interest, the bosses were easy and most of us weren't even bothered of meta. It obvious to us the fight weren't toughly tuned around 10 despite the asked number The legendary gear peaked my interest when they first announced then i actually saw the armor and was like mehhhhh. I liked the cloth but i don't main one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"CptAurellian.9537" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > I agree with you, it's a small sampling. But keep in mind, this is the community that raised a ruckus that the game needed "more challenge" so for me, to see that only 20% of this community do Raids regularly, really marginalizes the content. > 20% regular participation maginalises the content? Remember that LotRO quote from long ago? In a game where only 10% of the players even tried raiding, they still managed to be a majority on the forums. These proportions are not unusual at all in other games either - in games with raids/other hardcore content, people playing that content will always be heavily overrepresented in forums and other media. So, on a forum that's already skewed towards more hardcore/invested players, in a subforum which most of the non-raiding players do not even look into? Yes, 20% **is** a terrible result. Still, the numbers of votes are actually too low to treat this poll seriously. Especially considering _when_ it was posted and how many active players weren't even paying attention to the forums at that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CptAurellian.9537 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > Remember that LotRO quote from long ago? In a game where only 10% of the players even tried raiding, they still managed to be a majority on the forums. These proportions are not unusual at all in other games either - in games with raids/other hardcore content, people playing that content will always be heavily overrepresented in forums and other media. > > So, on a forum that's already skewed towards more hardcore/invested players, in a subforum which most of the non-raiding players do not even look into? Yes, 20% **is** a terrible result. > > Still, the numbers of votes are actually too low to treat this poll seriously. Especially considering _when_ it was posted and how many active players weren't even paying attention to the forums at that time. That's old news and, of course, there's no reason to take this poll very seriously. Just like almost any other forum poll, by the way. When someone states that 20% participation (not just poll participation) is a poor result for niche content, that's hilarious. However, how do you get to the conclusion that "most of the non-raiding players do not even look into" the general forum? This post is not in the raids section. As for the forum-users vs. non-users thing, GW2 has substantial other (semi-)organised game areas and rather little focus on raids, so it is rather unlikely that raiders are massively over-represented here. A slight over-representation? Possible, only ANet knows. But the only reliable data we have also points in the direction of 10-20% halfway regular raiders. Among the forum population, I'd almost argue that this location skews the results against raids, as a good bunch of raiders will probably never look into the general forum, since there's little more than pointless whining around here with regard to raids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxwelgm.4315 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 Raiding is the outdated mode elephant in the room. Regardless if you think this is a good thing or not, most players are not willing to spend time and effort into a game like they used to (at least not in the same grindy and organized way). First we had games with long sprawling worlds where you had to find your way carefully, read quest text in order to know where to go, and not go out of roads, no fast travel, etc. Then we slowly made our way up into travelling from A to B with a click and killing X mobs with X clicks for loot. Again, doesn't matter if you want to argue what kind of playstyle is better, raids do not fit the current overall playstyle of both single player games and MMOs. Of course, there are still people willing and wanting of modes that allow for them to dedicate and organize as a community in order to clear the content. But as with everything statistical, they're such a small group that they basically amount to "noise" and will slowly be parsed out. Even among modern raiders there are many who would rather have LFR and just be done with the group aspect. Not by coincidence the most popular games nowadays are MOBAs. There's always going to be the ones concerned about people's lack of commitment ("I have spent 2 weeks training VG and rehearsing with my guild mates, why don't you find a guild and spend some time training?"), and there's nothing wrong with that, but bear in mind it's something neither Anet is going to seriously demand of players, and neither will players listen to such rebuttals (many of them I'd say are probably fed up with this discourse from outside the game as well). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torolan.5816 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"Turin.6921" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > They were loud enough to be listened to in favor of those that were against it.. so.. no matter what you may remember, they had the louder voice. > > > > Now, with that put out.. I stand and repeat what I said. **even among the community that asked for it** it's sad that less then half of them even tried. > > > > It was not that it was louder. It is just that most reasonable PvEers or PvPers that did not care about raids did not react at all since it is amazingly entitled and childish to object to sth that will affect nothing that has to do with your gaming habbits. If you do not care for them you can ignore them in-game and only takes a miniscule amount of personel to develop compared to the total number of Anet devs. Why would you object for something that does not affect you. > > The few people that were against it were just unreasonable. The only real objection was that raids would breed elitism. But that argument is self-defeating, as you are basically complaining about breeding elitism in a game mode that does not exist and you would not play anyway if it existed. So why would you care about it. > My main concern at the time was not elitism, that some people who raid would be a piece of skritt was prety clear from the get go and easily observable in dungeons. It was that I thought and still think that it is an unfitting addition for GW2. It is the only game mode that forces you to come in a certain combination if you want to succeed and are not the Chuck Norris of gaming, and success means in this case all or nothing, there is no compensation for your time when you fail. I also means that you have to stay until the bitter end to earn something. Both but especially the first reason were unprecented in GW2 and in no way wanted by people like me. The bitter cherry on the cake was the legendary armor then, but luckily this matter has been solved. Sadly we did not scream loud enough on the matter and now were screwed. And yes, there was content where you had to stay until the bitter end to gain anything but from the top of my head I can only remember the champions of queens gauntlet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahroots.6791 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 I made a couple serious attempts at raiding before concluding that it just wasn't for me. The first guild was made of up people who were interested but lacked heart and were generally clueless, and it fell apart after about a week of wipes. Second guild was made up of experienced raiders who put time aside to train newcomers. We fared much better, but I simply couldn't adhere to a tight schedule and roster for training. I have had real life jobs with less structure. They were good folks but I wasn't enjoying it. Felt too much like work. They eventually kicked me after I hadn't signed in for a while. Also had a brief stint in a raid guild that was essentially an LFG, but with ranks assigned according to kill proof. It was okay but I was too burned out after the 2+ hour long wipefests that made up each training run, and I quit raiding after my first Cairn and MO kills. I have about 30 LI in the bank to show for my efforts. I might consider having a go at things again now that I've built a new gaming rig, and no longer have to contend with the lag and frame rate issues that hindered me in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"CptAurellian.9537" said: > However, how do you get to the conclusion that "most of the non-raiding players do not even look into" the general forum? This post is not in the raids section. Doh, for some reason i when i was writing i really thought this was posted in the dungeons subforum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuddy.6247 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 I raided when they first came out and stayed with it for a while. I returned for Bastion of the Penitent and worked very hard for Saul's staff because, well, Saul is my spirit character. If there was ever a better person in the Guild Wars lore I could relate to - I haven't found him. A disgraced drunkard and a thief that just wanted what was best for everybody in his life. I loved the exposition and the finale to his plot in BotP. Have yet to get into Hall of Chains. My old raid connections have disappeared since then. An ex-friend and I who don't get along for personal reasons. A guild that let me go because I was offline for like 6 months. Seems every year my life gets better but I become less and less able to do GW2's newest high-end content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"IndigoSundown.5419" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > What you seem to be deliberately ignoring is that the forum population was that **vocal minority** and even among them.. raids are a minority. > > > > > > > > > > > Kinda sad. I really did expect higher numbers. I was kinda expecting around 50% to at least tried raids.. > > > > > > > > > > Add, "Yes regularly." and "Yes, sometimes." 29% > > > > > Now, add, "No, tried it but it didn't work out." and the total is 41% of survey takers who've at least tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > As to those who don't want to raid: > > > > > > > > > > 39% "Not interested." > > > > > > > > > > It's not fair to assign, "No, no group and don't want to PuG." or, "Other." to either side. Too many questions are unanswered to determine whether they tried it or didn't, or would if something changed -- unless someone wants to read every post. Drop those numbers and you've got. > > > > > > > > > > Tried raids: 42 + 27 + 28 = 97; 97/188 = 51.5% > > > > > Not interested: 91; 91/188 = 48.4% > > > > > > > > > > In this microcosm of a microcosm, the tried and not tried groups are similar. That's a far cry from your, "minority of a minority." > > > > > > > > > > You also seem to be presuming that a majority of forum regulars asked for raids. That's not how I remember it. > > > > > > > > They were loud enough to be listened to in favor of those that were against it.. so.. no matter what you may remember, they had the louder voice. > > > > > > > > Now, with that put out.. I stand and repeat what I said. **even among the community that asked for it** it's sad that less then half of them even tried. > > > > > > > > P.S. No.. the other groups matter, you don't get to delete peoples votes because they don't suit your agenda. > > > > > > > > > As far as we know fully 100% of the people who asked for it have tried raids. > > > > I said community.. and this community.. the forum community.. asked for this. > > > > and.. given the ruckus that was raised for the need for challenging content.. I expected more. > > > > Pitiful really. > > A fraction of this community asked for raids. That's my whole point, and a lot smaller fraction then I expected given how vocal they were about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrimm.5624 Posted January 2, 2018 Author Share Posted January 2, 2018 Created multiple options to and get a finer level of detail and was curious from the sampling we could collect on the forums. Not trying to prove any points, just wanted to see how they are perceived. Do appreciate the insight from people and thanks for taking the time to vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xDudisx.5914 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 The forums are not representative of the community. The forum user normally is more hardcore than average player. If the poll says 20% care about raids I would bet that the real numbers are about 5% or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"IndigoSundown.5419" said: > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > What you seem to be deliberately ignoring is that the forum population was that **vocal minority** and even among them.. raids are a minority. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kinda sad. I really did expect higher numbers. I was kinda expecting around 50% to at least tried raids.. > > > > > > > > > > > > Add, "Yes regularly." and "Yes, sometimes." 29% > > > > > > Now, add, "No, tried it but it didn't work out." and the total is 41% of survey takers who've at least tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > As to those who don't want to raid: > > > > > > > > > > > > 39% "Not interested." > > > > > > > > > > > > It's not fair to assign, "No, no group and don't want to PuG." or, "Other." to either side. Too many questions are unanswered to determine whether they tried it or didn't, or would if something changed -- unless someone wants to read every post. Drop those numbers and you've got. > > > > > > > > > > > > Tried raids: 42 + 27 + 28 = 97; 97/188 = 51.5% > > > > > > Not interested: 91; 91/188 = 48.4% > > > > > > > > > > > > In this microcosm of a microcosm, the tried and not tried groups are similar. That's a far cry from your, "minority of a minority." > > > > > > > > > > > > You also seem to be presuming that a majority of forum regulars asked for raids. That's not how I remember it. > > > > > > > > > > They were loud enough to be listened to in favor of those that were against it.. so.. no matter what you may remember, they had the louder voice. > > > > > > > > > > Now, with that put out.. I stand and repeat what I said. **even among the community that asked for it** it's sad that less then half of them even tried. > > > > > > > > > > P.S. No.. the other groups matter, you don't get to delete peoples votes because they don't suit your agenda. > > > > > > > > > > > > As far as we know fully 100% of the people who asked for it have tried raids. > > > > > > I said community.. and this community.. the forum community.. asked for this. > > > > > > and.. given the ruckus that was raised for the need for challenging content.. I expected more. > > > > > > Pitiful really. > > > > A fraction of this community asked for raids. > > That's my whole point, and a lot smaller fraction then I expected given how vocal they were about it. A relatively small portion of tbe community asked for raids and a relatively small portiin say they participate in raids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"IndigoSundown.5419" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > What you seem to be deliberately ignoring is that the forum population was that **vocal minority** and even among them.. raids are a minority. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kinda sad. I really did expect higher numbers. I was kinda expecting around 50% to at least tried raids.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Add, "Yes regularly." and "Yes, sometimes." 29% > > > > > > > Now, add, "No, tried it but it didn't work out." and the total is 41% of survey takers who've at least tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As to those who don't want to raid: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 39% "Not interested." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's not fair to assign, "No, no group and don't want to PuG." or, "Other." to either side. Too many questions are unanswered to determine whether they tried it or didn't, or would if something changed -- unless someone wants to read every post. Drop those numbers and you've got. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tried raids: 42 + 27 + 28 = 97; 97/188 = 51.5% > > > > > > > Not interested: 91; 91/188 = 48.4% > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In this microcosm of a microcosm, the tried and not tried groups are similar. That's a far cry from your, "minority of a minority." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You also seem to be presuming that a majority of forum regulars asked for raids. That's not how I remember it. > > > > > > > > > > > > They were loud enough to be listened to in favor of those that were against it.. so.. no matter what you may remember, they had the louder voice. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, with that put out.. I stand and repeat what I said. **even among the community that asked for it** it's sad that less then half of them even tried. > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. No.. the other groups matter, you don't get to delete peoples votes because they don't suit your agenda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far as we know fully 100% of the people who asked for it have tried raids. > > > > > > > > I said community.. and this community.. the forum community.. asked for this. > > > > > > > > and.. given the ruckus that was raised for the need for challenging content.. I expected more. > > > > > > > > Pitiful really. > > > > > > A fraction of this community asked for raids. > > > > That's my whole point, and a lot smaller fraction then I expected given how vocal they were about it. > > A relatively small portion of tbe community asked for raids and a relatively small portiin say they participate in raids. You would never have thought that from the ruckus they rose. Enlightening how small the numbers rally are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ithilwen.1529 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 The raiders in general seem way too difficult to deal with. Maybe in a couple of years things will calm down as they did with dungeons after the rewards were nerfed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > @"IndigoSundown.5419" said: > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > What you seem to be deliberately ignoring is that the forum population was that **vocal minority** and even among them.. raids are a minority. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kinda sad. I really did expect higher numbers. I was kinda expecting around 50% to at least tried raids.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Add, "Yes regularly." and "Yes, sometimes." 29% > > > > > > > > Now, add, "No, tried it but it didn't work out." and the total is 41% of survey takers who've at least tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As to those who don't want to raid: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 39% "Not interested." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's not fair to assign, "No, no group and don't want to PuG." or, "Other." to either side. Too many questions are unanswered to determine whether they tried it or didn't, or would if something changed -- unless someone wants to read every post. Drop those numbers and you've got. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tried raids: 42 + 27 + 28 = 97; 97/188 = 51.5% > > > > > > > > Not interested: 91; 91/188 = 48.4% > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In this microcosm of a microcosm, the tried and not tried groups are similar. That's a far cry from your, "minority of a minority." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You also seem to be presuming that a majority of forum regulars asked for raids. That's not how I remember it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > They were loud enough to be listened to in favor of those that were against it.. so.. no matter what you may remember, they had the louder voice. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, with that put out.. I stand and repeat what I said. **even among the community that asked for it** it's sad that less then half of them even tried. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. No.. the other groups matter, you don't get to delete peoples votes because they don't suit your agenda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far as we know fully 100% of the people who asked for it have tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > I said community.. and this community.. the forum community.. asked for this. > > > > > > > > > > and.. given the ruckus that was raised for the need for challenging content.. I expected more. > > > > > > > > > > Pitiful really. > > > > > > > > A fraction of this community asked for raids. > > > > > > That's my whole point, and a lot smaller fraction then I expected given how vocal they were about it. > > > > A relatively small portion of tbe community asked for raids and a relatively small portiin say they participate in raids. > > You would never have thought that from the ruckus they rose. Enlightening how small the numbers rally are. A (relatively) few people asked for raids. Repeatedly. I think that It was obvious that they did not represent some majority of the forum community. However, Anet stated before launch that they intended for the explorable dungeon paths to serve as this game's equivalent of raids. To be this game's hard, group oriented, instanced content. This did not work out so they made an effort to engage the community on these forums to discuss the topic. Based on Anet comments and the like I believe that raids were added, not because some small fraction of a fraction of the player base asked for them, but because they always intended for the game to have difficult instanced, team based content and the content they designed to fill that niche failed miserably. I really do wish that they had stuck to five character party size for raids. I think that it would make the organization of a party less time intensive...although it might make it more difficult to carry a less skilled or experienced player for training purposes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Hayes.6890 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I accept that I don't have the time or skill. What burns me is that there isn't an option to play the raids on an easy setting with zero rewards so I can at least experience the story. I'm stuck reading a wiki for that :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > @"IndigoSundown.5419" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > What you seem to be deliberately ignoring is that the forum population was that **vocal minority** and even among them.. raids are a minority. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kinda sad. I really did expect higher numbers. I was kinda expecting around 50% to at least tried raids.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Add, "Yes regularly." and "Yes, sometimes." 29% > > > > > > > > > Now, add, "No, tried it but it didn't work out." and the total is 41% of survey takers who've at least tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As to those who don't want to raid: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 39% "Not interested." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's not fair to assign, "No, no group and don't want to PuG." or, "Other." to either side. Too many questions are unanswered to determine whether they tried it or didn't, or would if something changed -- unless someone wants to read every post. Drop those numbers and you've got. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tried raids: 42 + 27 + 28 = 97; 97/188 = 51.5% > > > > > > > > > Not interested: 91; 91/188 = 48.4% > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In this microcosm of a microcosm, the tried and not tried groups are similar. That's a far cry from your, "minority of a minority." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You also seem to be presuming that a majority of forum regulars asked for raids. That's not how I remember it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > They were loud enough to be listened to in favor of those that were against it.. so.. no matter what you may remember, they had the louder voice. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, with that put out.. I stand and repeat what I said. **even among the community that asked for it** it's sad that less then half of them even tried. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. No.. the other groups matter, you don't get to delete peoples votes because they don't suit your agenda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far as we know fully 100% of the people who asked for it have tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > I said community.. and this community.. the forum community.. asked for this. > > > > > > > > > > > > and.. given the ruckus that was raised for the need for challenging content.. I expected more. > > > > > > > > > > > > Pitiful really. > > > > > > > > > > A fraction of this community asked for raids. > > > > > > > > That's my whole point, and a lot smaller fraction then I expected given how vocal they were about it. > > > > > > A relatively small portion of tbe community asked for raids and a relatively small portiin say they participate in raids. > > > > You would never have thought that from the ruckus they rose. Enlightening how small the numbers rally are. > > A (relatively) few people asked for raids. Repeatedly. I think that It was obvious that they did not represent some majority of the forum community. However, Anet stated before launch that they intended for the explorable dungeon paths to serve as this game's equivalent of raids. To be this game's hard instanced content. This did not work out so they made an effort to engage the community on these forums to discuss the topic. Based on Anet comments and the like I believe that raids were added, not because some small fraction of a fraction of the player base asked for them, but because they always intended for the game to have difficult instanced, team based content and the content they designed to fill that niche failed miserably. > > I really do wish that they had stuck to five character party size for raids. I think that it would make the organization of a party less time intensive...although it might make it more difficult to carry a less skilled or experienced player for training purposes. No.. they distinctly said "Because you asked for it" not "we planned this all along" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"IndigoSundown.5419" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > > What you seem to be deliberately ignoring is that the forum population was that **vocal minority** and even among them.. raids are a minority. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kinda sad. I really did expect higher numbers. I was kinda expecting around 50% to at least tried raids.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Add, "Yes regularly." and "Yes, sometimes." 29% > > > > > > > > > > Now, add, "No, tried it but it didn't work out." and the total is 41% of survey takers who've at least tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As to those who don't want to raid: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 39% "Not interested." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's not fair to assign, "No, no group and don't want to PuG." or, "Other." to either side. Too many questions are unanswered to determine whether they tried it or didn't, or would if something changed -- unless someone wants to read every post. Drop those numbers and you've got. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tried raids: 42 + 27 + 28 = 97; 97/188 = 51.5% > > > > > > > > > > Not interested: 91; 91/188 = 48.4% > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In this microcosm of a microcosm, the tried and not tried groups are similar. That's a far cry from your, "minority of a minority." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You also seem to be presuming that a majority of forum regulars asked for raids. That's not how I remember it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > They were loud enough to be listened to in favor of those that were against it.. so.. no matter what you may remember, they had the louder voice. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, with that put out.. I stand and repeat what I said. **even among the community that asked for it** it's sad that less then half of them even tried. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. No.. the other groups matter, you don't get to delete peoples votes because they don't suit your agenda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far as we know fully 100% of the people who asked for it have tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I said community.. and this community.. the forum community.. asked for this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and.. given the ruckus that was raised for the need for challenging content.. I expected more. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pitiful really. > > > > > > > > > > > > A fraction of this community asked for raids. > > > > > > > > > > That's my whole point, and a lot smaller fraction then I expected given how vocal they were about it. > > > > > > > > A relatively small portion of tbe community asked for raids and a relatively small portiin say they participate in raids. > > > > > > You would never have thought that from the ruckus they rose. Enlightening how small the numbers rally are. > > > > A (relatively) few people asked for raids. Repeatedly. I think that It was obvious that they did not represent some majority of the forum community. However, Anet stated before launch that they intended for the explorable dungeon paths to serve as this game's equivalent of raids. To be this game's hard instanced content. This did not work out so they made an effort to engage the community on these forums to discuss the topic. Based on Anet comments and the like I believe that raids were added, not because some small fraction of a fraction of the player base asked for them, but because they always intended for the game to have difficult instanced, team based content and the content they designed to fill that niche failed miserably. > > > > I really do wish that they had stuck to five character party size for raids. I think that it would make the organization of a party less time intensive...although it might make it more difficult to carry a less skilled or experienced player for training purposes. > > No.. they distinctly said "Because you asked for it" not "we planned this all along" I will take your word for it on the, "because you asked for it," quote, but they said they intended GW 2 to have its own version of raids before the game launched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"IndigoSundown.5419" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > What you seem to be deliberately ignoring is that the forum population was that **vocal minority** and even among them.. raids are a minority. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kinda sad. I really did expect higher numbers. I was kinda expecting around 50% to at least tried raids.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Add, "Yes regularly." and "Yes, sometimes." 29% > > > > > > > > > > > Now, add, "No, tried it but it didn't work out." and the total is 41% of survey takers who've at least tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As to those who don't want to raid: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 39% "Not interested." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's not fair to assign, "No, no group and don't want to PuG." or, "Other." to either side. Too many questions are unanswered to determine whether they tried it or didn't, or would if something changed -- unless someone wants to read every post. Drop those numbers and you've got. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tried raids: 42 + 27 + 28 = 97; 97/188 = 51.5% > > > > > > > > > > > Not interested: 91; 91/188 = 48.4% > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In this microcosm of a microcosm, the tried and not tried groups are similar. That's a far cry from your, "minority of a minority." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You also seem to be presuming that a majority of forum regulars asked for raids. That's not how I remember it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > They were loud enough to be listened to in favor of those that were against it.. so.. no matter what you may remember, they had the louder voice. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, with that put out.. I stand and repeat what I said. **even among the community that asked for it** it's sad that less then half of them even tried. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. No.. the other groups matter, you don't get to delete peoples votes because they don't suit your agenda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far as we know fully 100% of the people who asked for it have tried raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I said community.. and this community.. the forum community.. asked for this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and.. given the ruckus that was raised for the need for challenging content.. I expected more. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pitiful really. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A fraction of this community asked for raids. > > > > > > > > > > > > That's my whole point, and a lot smaller fraction then I expected given how vocal they were about it. > > > > > > > > > > A relatively small portion of tbe community asked for raids and a relatively small portiin say they participate in raids. > > > > > > > > You would never have thought that from the ruckus they rose. Enlightening how small the numbers rally are. > > > > > > A (relatively) few people asked for raids. Repeatedly. I think that It was obvious that they did not represent some majority of the forum community. However, Anet stated before launch that they intended for the explorable dungeon paths to serve as this game's equivalent of raids. To be this game's hard instanced content. This did not work out so they made an effort to engage the community on these forums to discuss the topic. Based on Anet comments and the like I believe that raids were added, not because some small fraction of a fraction of the player base asked for them, but because they always intended for the game to have difficult instanced, team based content and the content they designed to fill that niche failed miserably. > > > > > > I really do wish that they had stuck to five character party size for raids. I think that it would make the organization of a party less time intensive...although it might make it more difficult to carry a less skilled or experienced player for training purposes. > > > > No.. they distinctly said "Because you asked for it" not "we planned this all along" > > I will take your word for it on the, "because you asked for it," quote, but they said they intended GW 2 to have its own version of raids before the game launched. No.. they said Dungeons were their Hard Content, not that the game would ever have raids. And [never take someone's word for it](https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/raids-in-guild-wars-2/ "never take someone's word for it"). >You asked for the ultimate challenging content in Guild Wars 2—challenges that would put your skills to the test and push you and your friends to the edge to achieve victory. Now the answer is here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaladinVII.1647 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Me and my small guild tried it. Our biggest problem was fielding 10 people. We got the Vale Guardian to about 50% life before he enraged. That was the third try. We have not tried to field 10 again. Our problem was numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeWolfe.2174 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 > @"CptAurellian.9537" said: > > @"DeWolfe.2174" said: > > a whole 28% Raid and Raid sometimes. GJ Dev's for putting some much into them and gating so many rewards behind something 72% of your customers do not participate in. > > In the time raiders got their five wings, the rest got 17 open world maps, four new fractals and a bunch of reworks, two addons worth of story etc., 7 living story episodes, more than a dozen weapon and armor sets and a bunch of other things I'm too lazy to think about. Yes, horribly imbalanced. And, as a WvW player.... what did we get?????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiza.4392 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I dont understand how people are saying getting in to raiding is hard and getting gear is hard. GW2 is as casual as game can get, I have played 160 hours this game (never played gw2 before)and I got 2 characters geared with ascended (chrono, dh) and I have completed raidwings 1-3 so far (63li atm) and 100/99cm. People are blaming that they cant play 2 hours without being interrupted, well neither can I but it doesnt matter since raids are so easy that you can talk to the phone or with your gf/kids without getting killed. Ooh and it doesnt take even 2 hours, I mostly play 40 min-1h and complete one raidboss in that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esquilax.3491 Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I really wish we could get a dumbed down, scaled system of raids like Wow. Think fractals, you can easily scale rewards and make some exclusive to the high tier raiders. For the life of me, I can't understand why this isn't already a thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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