Thief Balance Patch Notes

[Kain Francois.4328]

Finally the Deadeye has been added to the game. Welcome, Deadeye!

[arenta.2953]

> @"Kain Francois.4328" said:

> Finally the Deadeye has been added to the game. Welcome, Deadeye!

 


 

 

[Arceno.8214]

Has P/P thief also benefited from this or mainly rifle?

[saerni.2584]

Deadeye generally gets the buffs to Deadeye Mark and Consume Plasma if running core.

 

Malice does improve base damage somewhat so P/P benefits from 100% uptime. In PvE the rifle buffs may outshine the ability of P/P to do DPS though—but that remains to be parsed.

[Arceno.8214]

> @"saerni.2584" said:

> Deadeye generally gets the buffs to Deadeye Mark and Consume Plasma if running core.

>

> Malice does improve base damage somewhat so P/P benefits from 100% uptime. In PvE the rifle buffs may outshine the ability of P/P to do DPS though—but that remains to be parsed.

 

Yea i am mainly interested in PVE. I guess will have to wait till someone test it out. Thnx for info :)

[Tails.9372]

> @"saerni.2584" said:

> In PvE the rifle buffs may outshine the ability of P/P to do DPS though

Not even close, +20% might sound like much but it really isn't. P/P does still more dmg overall and is more cost effective.

[saerni.2584]

I’m just waiting for some benchmarks. I agree that P/P is likely higher damage due to initiative refund on Unload.

[Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497]

> @"arenta.2953" said:

> > @"Kain Francois.4328" said:

> > Finally the Deadeye has been added to the game. Welcome, Deadeye!

>

> 

>

>

 

I demand the name of the artist!

[Aplier.7829]

> @"saerni.2584" said:

> I’m just waiting for some benchmarks. I agree that P/P is likely higher damage due to initiative refund on Unload.

 

My P/P sustained dps with deadeye pre-patch was topping out around 22k. Other people have been hitting around 30k dps with realistic buffs from kneeling rifle. I dont have a computer in front of me to test P/P now but I can state for a fact that its not gaining more than 25% dps just from the mark/malice changes (which accounts for roughly a 4-5% average dps increase for P/P).

 

On the other hand this is still a small net buff to P/P, and it sustains that damage regardless of positioning or movement, which is really the only reason for a thief to run a ranged build in raids, whereas Rifle really only does it's max damage while it can stay rooted in place.

[Sir Vincent III.1286]

> @"Aplier.7829" said:

> > @"saerni.2584" said:

> > I’m just waiting for some benchmarks. I agree that P/P is likely higher damage due to initiative refund on Unload.

>

> My P/P sustained dps with deadeye pre-patch was topping out around 22k. Other people have been hitting around 30k dps with realistic buffs from kneeling rifle. I dont have a computer in front of me to test P/P now but I can state for a fact that its not gaining more than 25% dps just from the mark/malice changes (which accounts for roughly a 4-5% average dps increase for P/P).

 

This is the reason;

Deadly Aim: Increased damage in PvE by 25%.

Spotter's Shot: Increased damage in PvE by 21%.

Three Round Burst: Increased damage in PvE by 15%.

Death's Judgment: Scaling per malice increased from 15% to 20% in PvE.

 

The auto-attack alone is a big bump to DPS.

[arenta.2953]

> @"Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497" said:

> > @"arenta.2953" said:

> > > @"Kain Francois.4328" said:

> > > Finally the Deadeye has been added to the game. Welcome, Deadeye!

> >

> > 

> >

> >

>

> I demand the name of the artist!

 

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/20119/gold-commissions-offering-sketch-busts

 

they freaking epic

[yiksing.9432]

Kinda sad they didn't directly buff traits like Maleficent Seven slightly to bring it up on par with BQoBK. But no nerfs for the first time after a patch is a win.

[Link.1049]

> @"omgdracula.6345" said:

> No nerfs! =D

 

It was a nerf by inaction.

 

[Cynz.9437]

From pvp stand point:

I agree with Sir Vincent, buffs/nerfs to other classes affect us too. Mes gonna be an issue. So do druids/sb.

Also i actually see alacrity on plasma as semi nerf to a thief because it does nothing for weapon skills (doesn't affect ini regen) and doesn't help you much if you run improv anyway. Surely it helps to get steal back faster but all honestly, who uses steal off-Cd every time?

On other hand it is another boon we gain that can be corrupted so, imo, it is indirect buff to necros and anything with boon corruption.

 

More so, yet another patch that dumps everything into steal. Is anyone else tired of relying on steal so heavily? You land steal -> you might win; you don't land steal -> might as well run. The spell is so overloaded and so important for the thief that it overshadows every other spell thief has. I personally don't find this dependency on steal so great.

[TiNG.3964]

No changes to cloak and dagger being made unblockable makes me sad.

[Despond.2174]

I appreciate the rifle buffs, but PP is still better from what I've read and tested plus it's smoother gameplay. I'll be sticking to PP if I am using DE for now, but maybe I've missed something, we'll see.

I have to leave, a power mesmer is after me! *flees*

[arenta.2953]

> @"Despond.2174" said:

> I appreciate the rifle buffs, but PP is still better from what I've read and tested plus it's smoother gameplay. I'll be sticking to PP if I am using DE for now, but maybe I've missed something, we'll see.

> I have to leave, a power mesmer is after me! *flees*

 

.....fking mesmer <.<

*goes back to whispering "Nerf Mesmer" to Anet employees in their sleep*

[saerni.2584]

So the changes to Malice make getting a max Malice Binding Shadow easier. In other words, 3 second knockdown with a 50–70% duration increase is more consistent. Saving BS for full Malice is no longer a short predictable window opening up more options.

 

The quality of life on Mark with 25 second cooldown and 30 second duration is nice in this regard. That said you do need to remark within the five seconds or you lose Malice like normal.

 

Not too many changes directly for us but a few observations.

 

Mesmer: need to play a very careful burst, hit and stealth. Power shatter hurts if they have time to react. Probably not a good team fighter if there is enough AoE pressure to kill those clones.

 

Scourge: easier now but how much easier is still wip.

 

Weaver: watch for the DBZ burst. Little animation where they build up then flash to you. Hits like a truck upwards of 40k if everything connects. Squishy, but can obliterate even bunkers in one burst. Have to be careful if they are running this build. Otherwise, wait out the evades and cut down their hp.

 

Holo: still strong and good damage. But not sure how well it will survive. Top billing also means getting focused and Holo isn’t that survivable.

 

Druid/SB: still nice sustain on Druid but it was never oppressive unless you had too many support and not enough DPS to focus them down. Same target for thief.

 

Warrior/SB: still strong if well played. Hard to say too much while meta works itself out and people decide whether SB is good for fighting power mes (which barring a post-patch nerf will be important for at least a few weeks).

 

Revenant: Not sure if the “nerf” to this matters. Anet will revert some of it after an outcry and the rest were buffs. No idea if this addresses the problems average players have but...a good Rev is strong and an average Rev is not great. So much comes down to skill that I won’t predict much for them at this point.

 

Guardian: saw a few DH and one FB so far. Really not sure if the sustain changes did enough but will need to see more to decide. I think we may see more DH just because the Scourge meta is less oppressive. Deadeye faces more trouble here because DH has good projectile denial and counter projectiles.

 

Still with the burst meta going strong I feel bunkers will be fighting an uphill battle the rest of the season.

 

 

[Turk.5460]

> @"saerni.2584" said:

 

> Scourge: easier now but how much easier is still wip.

 

If you're referring to solo, they continue to be a free bag for Rifle DE's, just as they were before the patch xD

[AikijinX.6258]

Am I missing something? Im in WvW and I just tried seeing if malice stacks would stay after both:

 

Using mercy at full stacks, on same target (Malice stack refreshed)

And

Marking target, and waiting for malice timer to run out. (Malice stacks refreshed)

 

Also on the Mark tool tip, it does not say anything about Malice remaining?, did they not update tool tip

[Turk.5460]

> @"AikijinX.6258" said:

> Am I missing something? Im in WvW and I just tried seeing if malice stacks would stay after both:

>

> Using mercy at full stacks, on same target (Malice stack refreshed)

> And

> Marking target, and waiting for malice timer to run out. (Malice stacks refreshed)

>

> Also on the Mark tool tip, it does not say anything about Malice remaining?, did they not update tool tip

 

I don't think it was intended for Malice stacks to remain after the mark is gone. Meaning if your target is not marked again *while they are still currently marked* then you will lose your stacks. And since Mercy removes the mark from your target completely, it functions the same as if you let the 30s mark timer run out on your target. It would be awesome if mercy/remark retained your stacks, but I don't think that's what they wanted from this.

[reddie.5861]

thief got nothing unless ur going into PvE mode, even a nerf would make me more happier then the "balance" patch i just saw..

 

thief is so beyond shit nowadays compare to other classes, yes we can still kill etc. but we have to be FAR FAR more aware of situation compare to most other toons out there that just go like yolo and run tru everything.

[Turk.5460]

> @"reddie.5861" said:

> thief got nothing unless ur going into PvE mode, even a nerf would make me more happier then the "balance" patch i just saw..

>

> thief is so beyond kitten nowadays compare to other classes, yes we can still kill etc. but we have to be FAR FAR more aware of situation compare to most other toons out there that just go like yolo and run tru everything.

 

Eh, maybe if you're D/P or P/D. But Thieves can YOLO pretty effectively as S/D, Rifle and Staff. Sure it's not as brainless as SpellBreaker, but I wouldn't say we need to be FAR more aware...

[arenta.2953]

> @"Turk.5460" said:

> > @"reddie.5861" said:

> > thief got nothing unless ur going into PvE mode, even a nerf would make me more happier then the "balance" patch i just saw..

> >

> > thief is so beyond kitten nowadays compare to other classes, yes we can still kill etc. but we have to be FAR FAR more aware of situation compare to most other toons out there that just go like yolo and run tru everything.

>

> Eh, maybe if you're D/P or P/D. But Thieves can YOLO pretty effectively as S/D, Rifle and Staff. Sure it's not as brainless as SpellBreaker, but I wouldn't say we need to be FAR more aware...

 

eh....i wouldn't say you can yolo with a rifle.

 

because you gotta kneel for the full dmg, and for that its best to have some distance.

 

 

then again....yolo doesn't imply success xD

[Turk.5460]

> @"arenta.2953" said:

> > @"Turk.5460" said:

> > > @"reddie.5861" said:

> > > thief got nothing unless ur going into PvE mode, even a nerf would make me more happier then the "balance" patch i just saw..

> > >

> > > thief is so beyond kitten nowadays compare to other classes, yes we can still kill etc. but we have to be FAR FAR more aware of situation compare to most other toons out there that just go like yolo and run tru everything.

> >

> > Eh, maybe if you're D/P or P/D. But Thieves can YOLO pretty effectively as S/D, Rifle and Staff. Sure it's not as brainless as SpellBreaker, but I wouldn't say we need to be FAR more aware...

>

> eh....i wouldn't say you can yolo with a rifle.

>

> because you gotta kneel for the full dmg, and for that its best to have some distance.

>

>

> then again....yolo doesn't imply success xD

 

With Rifle I mean just running and spamming mark/2/3. Not leaping into the fray like a holosmith. With SS, Withdraw, RFI, and Shadow Meld we've got some great avoidance when someone notices us pew pewing their beloved Firebrands and Scourges.