Ideas for T5 and T6 fractals

[Hyper Cutter.9376]

> @"Trae.2384" said:

>I hope a tier 5 is added with increased rewards and difficulty.

They wouldn't add more rewards, they'd just split the current rewards five ways instead of four. The result at the top would be the same and everyone beneath it would get screwed.

[TexZero.7910]

> @"Aktium.9506" said:

> > @"TexZero.7910" said:

> > > @"Aktium.9506" said:

> > > what if we could play fractals with all instabilities on at the same time?

> >

> > I'd rather play will it blend featuring my extremities than that...

> > Neither are challenging, they're both just sadistic.

>

> but it would be fun

 

You and I have very different definitions of the word 'Fun'.

 

[thrag.9740]

> @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> T5 fractals: 4 instabilities that change every minute you spend inside the fractal, 151-200 AR required

> T6 fractals: 5 instabilities that change every time someone in the group receives experience from any source and every minute you spend inside the fractal, 201-250 AR required. Dead people cannot be rezzed and if the whole party is dead you have to start the fractal over. Fractal potions stopped working.

 

I don't have an opinion on t5/t6 because I don't really play fractals anymore. But I will point out, if your going to have fractal instabilities change this rapidly, why not just have all the instabilities for the whole fractal?

[STIHL.2489]

> @"thrag.9740" said:

> > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > T5 fractals: 4 instabilities that change every minute you spend inside the fractal, 151-200 AR required

> > T6 fractals: 5 instabilities that change every time someone in the group receives experience from any source and every minute you spend inside the fractal, 201-250 AR required. Dead people cannot be rezzed and if the whole party is dead you have to start the fractal over. Fractal potions stopped working.

>

> I don't have an opinion on t5/t6 because I don't really play fractals anymore. But I will point out, if your going to have fractal instabilities change this rapidly, why not just have all the instabilities for the whole fractal?

 

Because that is predictable.. what makes it hard, is not being able to plan for it. Having random instabilities hit, makes it so you can't simply forum a routine to beat the fractal, you need to think on the fly and respond to the situations as they change.

[Vinceman.4572]

> @"STIHL.2489" said:

> Because that is predictable.. what makes it hard, is not being able to plan for it. Having random instabilities hit, makes it so you can't simply forum a routine to beat the fractal, you need to think on the fly and respond to the situations as they change.

 

People still believe this nonsense?

The actual instabilities don't make this content hard but only more annoying. Like the flux bomb: You want to channel your spells? NOPE! Dodge/step backwards and lay it behind you or drop it into the encounter to blind and damage your mates. This is not challenging, this is dumb. Last laugh? Well, not hard again, especially not after the nerf but you feel like you're in a battle in Syria but playing fractals.

Either bring in new and better instabilities or leave it. The actual change to random instabilities already is pure annoyance and nothing what is spicing up the gameplay or challenging or "fun fun fun". I doubt that all of them will increase the niveau of gameplay.

[Samnang.1879]

i'm keen for t5 and t6... but not keen on spending more money on agony infusions... resistance should just max out at 150... imagine the number of changes i have to make for all of my 21 characters... anet needs to consider ppl with multiple toons... not all of us are 1class player.

[Rodrick.1942]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > Alot of people are getting bored with how easy T4 fractals are, I believe we need to have t5 and possibly even t6 fractals implemented.

> How many do you think "a lot" is compared to how many people play T4? ANet seems to think that 99/cm and 100/cm plus raids are already there for those looking for greater challenges. Why should they also invest in T5 fracts, especially when the already have a full plate of changes they want to make to the existing fracts?

 

Because op and the ppl he knows getting bored

[Nash.2681]

I see no point in T5+ fractals. What would be the difference? Higher AR requirements? Plz no, as @Samnang.1879 mentioned, it would be a pain for everyone who made multiple characters fractal-ready. Higher difficulty? There's already raids and CM's for that, so adding more CM's to existing fractals seems to be a more reasonable and resources-saving way to go.

 

On a sidenote- I wonder if OP would still stick to his suggestion if A.Net would implement T5+6 fractals, but with 0 additional AP to gain from them...

[Feanor.2358]

T5 already exists. Sort of. It's the CMs. And frankly, that's as high as it needs to go. They're supposed to be played daily, so it makes no sense to overtune them, causing high fail rate and consequently high clear times.

[STIHL.2489]

anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

[Feanor.2358]

> @"STIHL.2489" said:

> anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

 

It's the same reasoning - harder instanced content exists, in both cms and raids. Overlapping doesn't really add anything to the game.

[Malediktus.9250]

> @"STIHL.2489" said:

> anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious.> @"thrag.9740" said:

> > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > T5 fractals: 4 instabilities that change every minute you spend inside the fractal, 151-200 AR required

> > T6 fractals: 5 instabilities that change every time someone in the group receives experience from any source and every minute you spend inside the fractal, 201-250 AR required. Dead people cannot be rezzed and if the whole party is dead you have to start the fractal over. Fractal potions stopped working.

>

> I don't have an opinion on t5/t6 because I don't really play fractals anymore. But I will point out, if your going to have fractal instabilities change this rapidly, why not just have all the instabilities for the whole fractal?

 

The problem is there are not that many different instabilities anymore. There were more in the past and also quite a few more data mined ones that were never activated. I wish there would be like 100 different instabilities, I think that would be a good amount if we were going for 5 random instabilities every minute.

 

> @"Vinceman.4572" said:

> > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > Because that is predictable.. what makes it hard, is not being able to plan for it. Having random instabilities hit, makes it so you can't simply forum a routine to beat the fractal, you need to think on the fly and respond to the situations as they change.

>

> People still believe this nonsense?

> The actual instabilities don't make this content hard but only more annoying. Like the flux bomb: You want to channel your spells? NOPE! Dodge/step backwards and lay it behind you or drop it into the encounter to blind and damage your mates. This is not challenging, this is dumb. Last laugh? Well, not hard again, especially not after the nerf but you feel like you're in a battle in Syria but playing fractals.

> Either bring in new and better instabilities or leave it. The actual change to random instabilities already is pure annoyance and nothing what is spicing up the gameplay or challenging or "fun fun fun". I doubt that all of them will increase the niveau of gameplay.

 

I like that instabilities are annoying and force changes in playstyles. Ever since instabilities change weekly (though as you can gather from my suggestion I wish instabilities would change way more often than weekly) I started to play fractals daily again instead of every other day.

Instabilities you can ignore or do nothing noticeable are bad. They should (if possible, I know it is not always doable since each instability has vastly different effects) be detrimental to good players and bad players alike.

 

> @"Feanor.2358" said:

> > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

>

> It's the same reasoning - harder instanced content exists, in both cms and raids. Overlapping doesn't really add anything to the game.

But CMs are just an extension to t4 since they require the same AR and have the same instabilities, still way too easy. Any half decent group burns bosses from phase to phase ignoring most mechanics that can happen.

[MithranArkanere.8957]

I am not fond of the Hellraiser franchise. And these changes would essentially turn players into Cenobites.

 

I can't say the idea inspires much enthusiasm for it in me.

[Vinceman.4572]

> @"Malediktus.9250" said:

 

> I like that instabilities are annoying and force changes in playstyles.

 

What change of playstyle? In case of flux bomb it's just a step side- or backwards - nobody even switches traits, weapons or gear for that. The same can be applied to every other instability. I haven't seen one of them which actually forces you to adapt. The only one is "No Pain, no gain" so you have to bring a spellbreaker (or necro in "I don't know groups") because chrono cannot afford disenchanter anymore. In the end this is reducing the class diversity which definitely is a **bad** thing and not a good change!

 

I'm glad that Anet is very pleased with fractals and that we are getting new ones while deleting/restructuring older ones like Aquatic Ruins or Molten Furnace.

[Warcry.1596]

I have more trouble in T4s than in raid content. One requires mechanics (with slight emphasis on DPS), one requires DPS (and some mechanics).

 

Mechanics are skill based, dealing a certain amount of DPS is gear based.

[GrubySzymek.1362]

Repeating same fractals all the time will always be boring, no matter how many tiers and pretend mechanics (aka instabilities) you introduce.

[STIHL.2489]

> @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

> Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious.

 

Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot.

 

Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who.

 

[Ze Dos Cavalos.6132]

> @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

> > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious.

>

> Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot.

>

> Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who.

>

 

I like the rewards lol, I need gold for many things in the game so I do fractals and raids mainly for the gold reward.

If there's no rewards in raids and fractals I won't touch them as much.

[Feanor.2358]

> @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > @"Feanor.2358" said:

> > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

> >

> > It's the same reasoning - harder instanced content exists, in both cms and raids. Overlapping doesn't really add anything to the game.

> But CMs are just an extension to t4 since they require the same AR and have the same instabilities, still way too easy. Any half decent group burns bosses from phase to phase ignoring most mechanics that can happen.

 

This is honestly fine. If you can make it work - good for you. It's kind of a "high risk - high reward" strategy and I think it's a good thing the game offers these.

As for the AR aspect, I am definitely *NOT* looking forward to rendering my considerable gold investment in +9/+5 infusions rendered obsolete. It would be practically gear treadmill, and I don't think the game needs that.

 

And let's get this straight - the decent groups will always breeze through the content, unless that content is new and their experience - not yet refined. Setting things up otherwise is just bad design in my opinion. Personally, I like to compare the high-end content to a racetrack. It's a challenge designed to push your limits, but ultimately one you can master. Being able to achieve perfection is rewarding in an unique way and I don't think you should seek to get rid of it.

[GrubySzymek.1362]

> @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

> > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious.

>

> Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot.

>

> Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who.

>

 

Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave.

[Sublimatio.6981]

> @"Vinceman.4572" said:

> The actual instabilities don't make this content hard but only more annoying. Like the flux bomb: You want to channel your spells? NOPE! Dodge/step backwards and lay it behind you or drop it into the encounter to blind and damage your mates. This is not challenging, this is dumb. Last laugh? Well, not hard again, especially not after the nerf but you feel like you're in a battle in Syria but playing fractals.

> Either bring in new and better instabilities or leave it. The actual change to random instabilities already is pure annoyance and nothing what is spicing up the gameplay or challenging or "fun fun fun". I doubt that all of them will increase the niveau of gameplay.

 

I agree wholeheartedly. I wish the difficulty in fractals rose from integrating the mobs and bosses with the fractal level. Applying some annoying conditions isn't making it feel harder. If a set of mobs and bosses get additional attacks/moves and mechanics - that's truly harder. In my opinion the only time instability is adding difficulty (without annoying the shit out of me) is when it spawns mobs like vindicators, rabbit, tentacle, mossman. It feels organic.

[STIHL.2489]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

> > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious.

> >

> > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot.

> >

> > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who.

> >

>

> Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave.

 

Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot.

 

Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers.

[GrubySzymek.1362]

> @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

> > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious.

> > >

> > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot.

> > >

> > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who.

> > >

> >

> > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave.

>

> Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot.

>

> Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers.

 

Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be.

[Imperadordf.2687]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

> > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious.

> > > >

> > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot.

> > > >

> > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave.

> >

> > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot.

> >

> > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers.

>

> Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be.

 

I'd play it if it was guaranteed that I'll have a lot of fun. But it won't be repeated.

[STIHL.2489]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said:

> > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals?

> > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious.

> > > >

> > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot.

> > > >

> > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave.

> >

> > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot.

> >

> > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers.

>

> Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be.

 

This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground.