Smiledyx.1678 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Absolutely OBJECT! that will only make fractal no difference with Raid. Harder the game is, crankier the people are, less flexibility of the builds are, and less fun you have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrubySzymek.1362 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? It's PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? The only contradiction that exists in your own little strawman. But just because some people are slaves to loot and rewards, does not mean everyone is, and just because some people like challenge does not mean they need a special trophy for their efforts, just because some other people do. So.. again.. please do not insult legit challenge seekers with equating them to (or lumping them in with) loot slaves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raizel.8175 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 That's a bad idea. We already have some very toxic behavior in t4 fractals. That (and the pseudo-elitism) would only increase in potential t5 or t6 fractals. At least currently, we don't need some meta-setups to clear stuff. Adding new tiers would make faceroll-meta-setups more mandatory and would further reduce the at least small diversity in dps-options. I'm all in for adding new instabilities (if they actually improve the gaming-experience instead of being downright unfair), but new tiers are nonsense. Especially further increasing AR-requirements is stupid. 150 AR just to be able to play the content are already expensive enough. If you really want a more challenging fractal-experience, just play without using faceroll-setups. Stop using any kind of heal-you-chan, druids and chronos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talindra.4958 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Well I play guildwars 2, I'm not playing for the virtual gold .. I play for entertainment.... I play all available content in gw2. If there is a new content coming out, I will be there. Farming is the least I do unless there's a reward ? and I like to get reward and achievement exclusive to a hard content. ANY update to fractal or any part of the game, I will be there to support it. Wvw n PvP are nice and something arena net made it such that players with all skill level can participate and continue to play. Unlike gw1 PvP.. if u are not good.. you stop there.. game play wise gw1 PvP is so much better, than gw2.. relic run, claiming objective with Lord, death match etc 3v3.. Our wvw in gw2 has the social element in it that kept players in there. With fractal daily these days .. I don't even get to do it everyday even if it has good reward.. some days a full run (without cm) gives around 30 gold due to asc mat drop and other loot... Reward in fractal can be better than doing raids sometimes. But I still do full clear raid weekly at monday reset. Yesterday fc was fun with bunch of ppl I randomly group up in pug and we gathered together weekly to play. The rest of the week..I log in for daily routine sometimes include T4 depending on how free and tired I'm ? .. if I hv extra time or when friends pm me to go, I will do full cm & T4. My best exp in fractal was actually in the early days. Where we do fractal lvl 40 or above with only 5ar with friends and these are good playing skills friends that I played with from gw1. Sadly many of these friends has long quit the game. So yes I support t4, t5 with good achievement and loot .. loot and tittle lock behind a challenging content usually hv my attention. ?? Ofc I'm not good enough for PvP god so I leave that achievement in peace :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talindra.4958 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Delete duplicate (Some goblins mess with my phone) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrubySzymek.1362 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? > > It's PvP. He started with 1:1 comparison so let's continue or finally agree that without rewards fractals and raids will be dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrubySzymek.1362 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? > > The only contradiction that exists in your own little strawman. > > But just because some people are slaves to loot and rewards, does not mean everyone is, and just because some people like challenge does not mean they need a special trophy for their efforts, just because some other people do. > > So.. again.. please do not insult legit challenge seekers with equating them to (or lumping them in with) loot slaves. How many times are those "challenge" seekers going to stay in a game without rewards? Full clear + CM? Few acheivements? GW2 is not a game that makes anyone famous or respected. It's popcorn game that is being kept alive by grind cycles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talindra.4958 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 Also.. I beg Ben pls leave solid ocean as it is.. I support any other fractal reconstruction but solid ocean pls :p well esp for the last boss fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talindra.4958 Posted April 30, 2018 Share Posted April 30, 2018 What I think good for T5 & T6 is similar to current tiering system, and lock SA in all of T5, lock SA and hamstring or one good one in T6. ? Also include good rewards / loot or some new achievements to complete. I find fractal leg back piece was quite easy and fun one to do.. also not bad for none fractal players to get (helped a few guildies to get it).. I would encourage making second set of pve leg armour through fractal collection.. so casual players who doesn't like PvP wvw and raid can still have stat change armour via pve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trae.2384 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Vinceman.4572" said: > Fractals already are very rewarding I doubt that they'll increase it in the near future. > And I disagree about the other stuff: You get around 800 relics per day once you reached the pristine relic cap. Additionally it's not 2 matrices per day but 3 because you definitely get 10+ stabilizing matrices as well which you should convert for a very low relic price. That means 100 days (roundabout 3 months) for the final Mist Attunement 4. I don't see a problem with that. If they lower the barrier you'll get the thingy way too fast and again have nothing to do within fractals! > Once you're done with the Attunements you'll net 1 +9 +5 within several days (3-4) due to the integrated drops, infusions and gold (1 stack infusions per day = 3 days for 3 +9s, 6 integrated matrices and around 60 g from frac loot to buy the missing 14 via conversion.) I meant and clearly said "from drops" see it? If you want to get theoretical and start adding conversions of other items then you could theoretically say "additionally it's not 2 matrices per day but 20 because you definitely get 10+ stabilizing matrices, and then that 60 gold you get so you can convert that to matrixes too". Also 800 a day off daily and cm's may be accurate for champions when you get almost double relics off attunment bags from each run completion, what percent of the population is champion rank today, based on how many i see on a daily basis Id say maybe 5%. Im lucky to get 700 from a full t4-cm-rec run at mist attunment 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > > > > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? > > > > The only contradiction that exists in your own little strawman. > > > > But just because some people are slaves to loot and rewards, does not mean everyone is, and just because some people like challenge does not mean they need a special trophy for their efforts, just because some other people do. > > > > So.. again.. please do not insult legit challenge seekers with equating them to (or lumping them in with) loot slaves. > > How many times are those "challenge" seekers going to stay in a game without rewards? Full clear + CM? Few acheivements? GW2 is not a game that makes anyone famous or respected. It's popcorn game that is being kept alive by grind cycles. Humm so much for any truth behind all the cries that people made about wanting Challenging Content.. which resulted in Raids being put in. Finally the truth comes out.. Humm? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > > > > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? > > > > It's PvP. > > He started with 1:1 comparison so let's continue or finally agree that without rewards fractals and raids will be dead. I'd best more people are out playing WvW then doing Raids, and yet WvW is one of the hardest modes of play as not only does it require PvP level skill, it takes PvE level gear grind. And yet here it is.. still being played. So sure.. you might be right, that maybe raids and fractals would die if they did not dolt loot upon anyone that can do them, but all that proves is that they are mostly populated by Loot Slaves.. not Challenge Seekers. Reality check, a lot of WvW players do Raids and Fractals, but they do them to fund their WvW. But that might be because the PvE in GW2 is.. what did you call it.. a "Popcorn game kept alive by grind" well.. if that is what it is you.. then you are not a challenge seeker, and please stop thinking everyone shares your motives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyson.5160 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > > > > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > > > > > > > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? > > > > > > The only contradiction that exists in your own little strawman. > > > > > > But just because some people are slaves to loot and rewards, does not mean everyone is, and just because some people like challenge does not mean they need a special trophy for their efforts, just because some other people do. > > > > > > So.. again.. please do not insult legit challenge seekers with equating them to (or lumping them in with) loot slaves. > > > > How many times are those "challenge" seekers going to stay in a game without rewards? Full clear + CM? Few acheivements? GW2 is not a game that makes anyone famous or respected. It's popcorn game that is being kept alive by grind cycles. > > Humm so much for any truth behind all the cries that people made about wanting Challenging Content.. which resulted in Raids being put in. Finally the truth comes out.. Humm? I think sometimes people just like the fact that they “raid” or that they are “raiders” and romanticize the idea,when maybe at the end of the day it’s just another farm for loot... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Tyson.5160" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? > > > > > > > > The only contradiction that exists in your own little strawman. > > > > > > > > But just because some people are slaves to loot and rewards, does not mean everyone is, and just because some people like challenge does not mean they need a special trophy for their efforts, just because some other people do. > > > > > > > > So.. again.. please do not insult legit challenge seekers with equating them to (or lumping them in with) loot slaves. > > > > > > How many times are those "challenge" seekers going to stay in a game without rewards? Full clear + CM? Few acheivements? GW2 is not a game that makes anyone famous or respected. It's popcorn game that is being kept alive by grind cycles. > > > > Humm so much for any truth behind all the cries that people made about wanting Challenging Content.. which resulted in Raids being put in. Finally the truth comes out.. Humm? > > I think sometimes people just like the fact that they “raid” or that they are “raiders” and romanticize the idea,when maybe at the end of the day it’s just another farm for loot... Of course it's a loot farm, and lacks any challenge for anyone that knows the routine. That is what **All PvE is**. That is why they can sell raid clears, that is why they have all kinds of requirements to join pugs, etc. So that it can be a remain a routine boring grind. Which brings us back to the OP's Idea, of having the instabilities randomly change during the instance, that kind of random chaotic event in the fractal run adds an actual element of challenge, it forces players to adapt to the new instabilities as it comes up and pay attention to which one is active. Perhaps have anywhere from 1 to 3 instabilities happen, that rotate on randomly set timers, say.. the instability can last anywhere from 30 seconds to 2 min before it changes again, and it can be anything on the list.. and stacks.. IE: If all 3 are _last laugh_, then the explosion does 3 times the damage, if say 2 are Hamstrung then your movement speed is reduced twice as much, etc, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrag.9740 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > T5 fractals: 4 instabilities that change every minute you spend inside the fractal, 151-200 AR required > > > T6 fractals: 5 instabilities that change every time someone in the group receives experience from any source and every minute you spend inside the fractal, 201-250 AR required. Dead people cannot be rezzed and if the whole party is dead you have to start the fractal over. Fractal potions stopped working. > > > > I don't have an opinion on t5/t6 because I don't really play fractals anymore. But I will point out, if your going to have fractal instabilities change this rapidly, why not just have all the instabilities for the whole fractal? > > Because that is predictable.. what makes it hard, is not being able to plan for it. Having random instabilities hit, makes it so you can't simply forum a routine to beat the fractal, you need to think on the fly and respond to the situations as they change. If the instabilities swap every minute, your going to be planning for every instability anyways. There are only 10 instabilities and he proposes having 5 swapping every minute. You might as well just assume they are all active when you start a fight anyways. The proposed plan already has 50% uptime of all instabilities, that is high enough that people will already plan for all of them at all times. Its just somtimes they might get lucky and not need to (for example) boon strip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"thrag.9740" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > T5 fractals: 4 instabilities that change every minute you spend inside the fractal, 151-200 AR required > > > > T6 fractals: 5 instabilities that change every time someone in the group receives experience from any source and every minute you spend inside the fractal, 201-250 AR required. Dead people cannot be rezzed and if the whole party is dead you have to start the fractal over. Fractal potions stopped working. > > > > > > I don't have an opinion on t5/t6 because I don't really play fractals anymore. But I will point out, if your going to have fractal instabilities change this rapidly, why not just have all the instabilities for the whole fractal? > > > > Because that is predictable.. what makes it hard, is not being able to plan for it. Having random instabilities hit, makes it so you can't simply forum a routine to beat the fractal, you need to think on the fly and respond to the situations as they change. > > If the instabilities swap every minute, your going to be planning for every instability anyways. There are only 10 instabilities and he proposes having 5 swapping every minute. You might as well just assume they are all active when you start a fight anyways. The proposed plan already has 50% uptime of all instabilities, that is high enough that people will already plan for all of them at all times. Its just somtimes they might get lucky and not need to (for example) boon strip. But with my idea, which is a slight variant, the Instabilities can (rarely) double and even triple stack, which would add a whole new dimension to the encounter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > > > > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? > > > > It's PvP. > > He started with 1:1 comparison so let's continue or finally agree that without rewards fractals and raids will be dead. Any non-pvp content will be dead without rewards. Particularly group content, which needs to have a lot of players interested so that forming or finding a group takes reasonable time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feanor.2358 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > T5 fractals: 4 instabilities that change every minute you spend inside the fractal, 151-200 AR required > > > > > T6 fractals: 5 instabilities that change every time someone in the group receives experience from any source and every minute you spend inside the fractal, 201-250 AR required. Dead people cannot be rezzed and if the whole party is dead you have to start the fractal over. Fractal potions stopped working. > > > > > > > > I don't have an opinion on t5/t6 because I don't really play fractals anymore. But I will point out, if your going to have fractal instabilities change this rapidly, why not just have all the instabilities for the whole fractal? > > > > > > Because that is predictable.. what makes it hard, is not being able to plan for it. Having random instabilities hit, makes it so you can't simply forum a routine to beat the fractal, you need to think on the fly and respond to the situations as they change. > > > > If the instabilities swap every minute, your going to be planning for every instability anyways. There are only 10 instabilities and he proposes having 5 swapping every minute. You might as well just assume they are all active when you start a fight anyways. The proposed plan already has 50% uptime of all instabilities, that is high enough that people will already plan for all of them at all times. Its just somtimes they might get lucky and not need to (for example) boon strip. > > But with my idea, which is a slight variant, the Instabilities can (rarely) double and even triple stack, which would add a whole new dimension to the encounter. The instabilities do not add all that much in any case. Mostly they add a mild annoyance in forcing you to slightly change your way of play. They don't *really* change the encounters though. All they do is make you change your positioning a bit, make you change your timing a bit. You could just assume uptime of every one of them and roll with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrubySzymek.1362 Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said: > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > > > > > > anyone but me find it hilarious that the Pro-Raid crowed is the one against harder/higher tier fractals? > > > > > > > > > > Different people like different stuff I guess. I am from the "pro raid crowd" and started this topic. But a lot of people just play fractals to farm easy rewards every day and not because they like fractals. If you join those people on TS and hear complaints about flux bomb, last laugh and social awkwardness like every minute because it ruins their efficiency. It is hilarious. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well at least those are consistent about just wanting the loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some people actually like challenge for the sake of it, and this topic is showing who is who. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remove rewards from raids and even those looking for challenge will leave. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Eh? Nahh man, they didn't even put rewards in WvW and people still played that content daily for years. Reward Seekers are just that, they follow the rewards, nothing else... they don't care about challenge, they just want loot. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Those that enjoy challenge will do it, no matter what the rewards. So, in the future, I am going to ask you not to insult challenge seekers by equating them to loot seekers. > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's make a test. Anet adds new raid wing with no rewards. Nothing but bosses and mechanics . No items, no skins, no tokens. Nothing. Let's see how popular it's going to be. > > > > > > > > > > This is not a popularity contest, loot slaves out number legit challenge seekers.. but, it's still an insult to think they are both the same or share any common ground. > > > > > > > > > > > > > What you say contradicts your WvW reference. Pretty big audience for no-reward mode. So how is it really? > > > > > > It's PvP. > > > > He started with 1:1 comparison so let's continue or finally agree that without rewards fractals and raids will be dead. > > Any non-pvp content will be dead without rewards. Particularly group content, which needs to have a lot of players interested so that forming or finding a group takes reasonable time. Yes, that's my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malediktus.9250 Posted May 1, 2018 Author Share Posted May 1, 2018 > @"thrag.9740" said: > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > @"thrag.9740" said: > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > > > > T5 fractals: 4 instabilities that change every minute you spend inside the fractal, 151-200 AR required > > > > T6 fractals: 5 instabilities that change every time someone in the group receives experience from any source and every minute you spend inside the fractal, 201-250 AR required. Dead people cannot be rezzed and if the whole party is dead you have to start the fractal over. Fractal potions stopped working. > > > > > > I don't have an opinion on t5/t6 because I don't really play fractals anymore. But I will point out, if your going to have fractal instabilities change this rapidly, why not just have all the instabilities for the whole fractal? > > > > Because that is predictable.. what makes it hard, is not being able to plan for it. Having random instabilities hit, makes it so you can't simply forum a routine to beat the fractal, you need to think on the fly and respond to the situations as they change. > > If the instabilities swap every minute, your going to be planning for every instability anyways. There are only 10 instabilities and he proposes having 5 swapping every minute. You might as well just assume they are all active when you start a fight anyways. The proposed plan already has 50% uptime of all instabilities, that is high enough that people will already plan for all of them at all times. Its just somtimes they might get lucky and not need to (for example) boon strip. The point would be to reactivate all the old instabilities Anet deleted or were data mined and never activated (+ maybe some new ones, people made plenty of suggestions for new instabilities on reddit/forums over time). 10 instabilities are obviously not nearly enough For reference: http://dulfy.net/2013/11/26/gw2-mistlock-instabilities/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malediktus.9250 Posted May 20, 2018 Author Share Posted May 20, 2018 A good illustration why we need t5+ fractals and cms do not cut it: Current difficulty does not even need a dedicated healer anymore for good players (while still playing squishy weavers) and bosses die before it can even casting a single skill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrubySzymek.1362 Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 > @"Malediktus.9250" said: > A good illustration why we need t5+ fractals and cms do not cut it: > > > > Current difficulty does not even need a dedicated healer anymore for good players (while still playing squishy weavers) and bosses die before it can even casting a single skill I don't see why an above average exception is an argument for new tiers. Such gameplay is far beyond reach for most groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sokeenoppa.5384 Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 > @"Warcry.1596" said: > I have more trouble in T4s than in raid content. One requires mechanics (with slight emphasis on DPS), one requires DPS (and some mechanics). > > Mechanics are skill based, dealing a certain amount of DPS is gear based. Ummm.. you think dps comes from gear More than skill? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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