Scar.1793 Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said: > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > This sums up my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’ve played Rogue and every assassin/stealth classes in a lot of MMO. It’s just easy mode in GW2. If it was only stealth... but no. They need to have tons of teleports and way to disengage and engage from miles and doing 25k+ backstabs from the shadows. Bonus if you’re deadeye for perma stealth. > > > > > > This is 2015... > > > > Yes, funny it did not changed much since then, right? > > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. Gear has what..? Barely 15-20% difference between ascended and exotic gear. I mean even with -20% difference it wouldn’t make much of a difference, the damage is clearly overkill and it’s not something uncommon. Don’t even need Deadeye spec to pull off nasty numbers like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeolus.3615 Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 > @"Safandula.8723" said: > Im thief main but i think good solution would be to not completly reveal upon taking dmg but to give some visual effect for a little time, some shade or some sparks i dont know. This way you wouldnt be able to target the stealthed guy, but it would be more fair. But if devs do that i demand more dmg for non DE thiefs Like a shadow or a semi transparent shadow, i know mmo that do this when u get to close to the stealthed unit. Pretty kewl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said: > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > This sums up my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’ve played Rogue and every assassin/stealth classes in a lot of MMO. It’s just easy mode in GW2. If it was only stealth... but no. They need to have tons of teleports and way to disengage and engage from miles and doing 25k+ backstabs from the shadows. Bonus if you’re deadeye for perma stealth. > > > > > > This is 2015... > > > > Yes, funny it did not changed much since then, right? > > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said: > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > This sums up my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’ve played Rogue and every assassin/stealth classes in a lot of MMO. It’s just easy mode in GW2. If it was only stealth... but no. They need to have tons of teleports and way to disengage and engage from miles and doing 25k+ backstabs from the shadows. Bonus if you’re deadeye for perma stealth. > > > > > > > > This is 2015... > > > > > > Yes, funny it did not changed much since then, right? > > > > > > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. > > Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. Prove 1 malice oneshot builds are a problem in sPvP specifically and I will listen to that. Crinn mentioned it before, but was not able to produce results that approached 15-16k on light armor classes without build impracticality. I'm not for guaranteed oneshots without telegraph from stealth, but I am for heavy damage from stealth. if a thief has to mark you and you have at least 5 seconds to respond to the subsequent engage without being downed, I'd consider that playable. WvW as a balance sphere, or as an example of how broken thief is doesn't fly as proof because anyone can just trot in with fine armor/poor defense and get slammed by someone in full ascended/on food buffs for big damage. In the prior video, that thief had what looks like max stacks of bloodlust. If he was mostly dps and had damage increasing food and damage increasing utilities running as well, in addition to scholar runes, getting instadowned is definitely a possibility. That's not a problem with the mechanics of thief, thats a problem with damage synergies. In SPvP there are restrictions to prevent it from getting to that point. In WVW, solo roaming while not thief or mesmer is a bad idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said: > > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > This sums up my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’ve played Rogue and every assassin/stealth classes in a lot of MMO. It’s just easy mode in GW2. If it was only stealth... but no. They need to have tons of teleports and way to disengage and engage from miles and doing 25k+ backstabs from the shadows. Bonus if you’re deadeye for perma stealth. > > > > > > > > > > This is 2015... > > > > > > > > Yes, funny it did not changed much since then, right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. > > > > Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. > > Prove 1 malice oneshot builds are a problem in sPvP specifically and I will listen to that. Crinn mentioned it before, but was not able to produce results that approached 15-16k on light armor classes without build impracticality. > I'm not for guaranteed oneshots without telegraph from stealth, but I am for heavy damage from stealth. Okay, malice is just an added benefit on a class that can stay at a safe distance while passively building up to their one shot while having access to stealth via dodge trait(nice balance btw), making it the perfect Xv1 + because no one wants go deal with the deadeye who is just safe jumping everywhere while we sit on a mode getting freecasted. Wvw is a similar issue only more excessive on movement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > Okay, malice is just an added benefit on a class that can stay at a safe distance while passively building up to their one shot while having access to stealth via dodge trait(nice balance btw), making it the perfect Xv1 + because no one wants go deal with the deadeye who is just safe jumping everywhere while we sit on a mode getting freecasted. > > Wvw is a similar issue only more excessive on movement. I agree with you on stealth on dodge while holding rifle. that could have been handled better. However. That sounds like a problem with your team if you have two+ people sitting on a node while a deadeye takes potshots at you, and neither of you is doing anything. Malice has also been reworked. Death's Judgement now requires initiative skills to hit to build malice. It's an empty argument to equate unwillingness to pressure a thief sitting at a distance with the thief itself being broken. if either one of you chases him the other person can cap the point and then come help (assuming a thief will 1vX at all. No good thief will put themselves in a situation where they are outnumbered.) I don't care about WvW balance, or thieves being a problem in WvW. You can enter WvW untraited with fine armor and poor amulets and meet a thief armed to the teeth with damage buffs. I used to think diferently, but the playing field can become far too uneven for me to consider anything in that zone to be justification for balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > Okay, malice is just an added benefit on a class that can stay at a safe distance while passively building up to their one shot while having access to stealth via dodge trait(nice balance btw), making it the perfect Xv1 + because no one wants go deal with the deadeye who is just safe jumping everywhere while we sit on a mode getting freecasted. > > > > Wvw is a similar issue only more excessive on movement. > > I agree with you on stealth on dodge while holding rifle. that could have been handled better. However. > That sounds like a problem with your team if you have two+ people sitting on a node while a deadeye takes potshots at you, and neither of you is doing anything. > Malice has also been reworked. Death's Judgement now requires initiative skills to hit to build malice. > > It's an empty argument to equate unwillingness to pressure a thief sitting at a distance with the thief itself being broken. if either one of you chases him the other person can cap the point and then come help. > > You can recast shadowstep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > You can recast shadowstep. So? Why would you chase a thief to a point where he can shadowstep back to your friend on the node and engage him without you being on his tail? Getting kited so far off the point that you or your teammate cant come help you when one of you gets pressured is bad strategy. Again, this is assuming a thief will humor a 1vx without knowing he can bait one of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > You can recast shadowstep. > > So? > Why would you chase a thief to a point where he can shadowstep back to your friend on the node and engage him without you being on his tail? Getting kited so far off the point that you or your teammate cant come help you when one of you gets pressured is bad strategy. > Again, this is assuming a thief will humor a 1vx. > > Because hes still kneeling and forecasting and if I chase him he will dodge via trait and I have to guess if he recanted, or if hes still kneeling there, or if hes already halfway across the map. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 Freecasting* I'm on my phone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > Because hes still kneeling and forecasting and if I chase him he will dodge via trait and I have to guess if he recanted, or if hes still kneeling there, or if hes already halfway across the map. No you don't, lol. Go back to the point. He's either there or he's wasting his teams time. You only need to check the areas the thief can perch and cover the point until you cap it. Again, this is assuming a thief will humor a 1vX. Any thief that humors a 1vX either knows he can take both of you or is an idiot. This also has nothing to do with oneshot malice builds. This is seeming to me to be more venting at general thief annoyance. Thief being annoying doesn't mean it is busted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > Because hes still kneeling and forecasting and if I chase him he will dodge via trait and I have to guess if he recanted, or if hes still kneeling there, or if hes already halfway across the map. > > No you don't, lol. > Go back to the point. He's either there or he's wasting his teams time. You only need to check the areas the thief can perch and cover the point until you cap it. > Again, this is assuming a thief will humor a 1vX. Any thief that humors a 1vX either knows he can take both of you or is an idiot. > This also has nothing to do with oneshot malice builds. This is seeming to me to be more venting at general thief annoyance. > Thief being annoying doesn't mean it is busted. > > This topic was about the mechanical flaw behind stealth builds so you're the one off topic get out my thread please POLICE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said: > > > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > > This sums up my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’ve played Rogue and every assassin/stealth classes in a lot of MMO. It’s just easy mode in GW2. If it was only stealth... but no. They need to have tons of teleports and way to disengage and engage from miles and doing 25k+ backstabs from the shadows. Bonus if you’re deadeye for perma stealth. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is 2015... > > > > > > > > > > Yes, funny it did not changed much since then, right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. > > > > > > Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. > > > > Prove 1 malice oneshot builds are a problem in sPvP specifically and I will listen to that. Crinn mentioned it before, but was not able to produce results that approached 15-16k on light armor classes without build impracticality. > > I'm not for guaranteed oneshots without telegraph from stealth, but I am for heavy damage from stealth. > > Okay, malice is just an added benefit on a class that can stay at a safe distance while passively building up to their one shot while having access to stealth via dodge trait(nice balance btw), making it the perfect Xv1 + because no one wants go deal with the deadeye who is just safe jumping everywhere while we sit on a mode getting freecasted. > > Wvw is a similar issue only more excessive on movement. it's not passive. they have to shoot you with initiative attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said: > > > > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > > > This sums up my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’ve played Rogue and every assassin/stealth classes in a lot of MMO. It’s just easy mode in GW2. If it was only stealth... but no. They need to have tons of teleports and way to disengage and engage from miles and doing 25k+ backstabs from the shadows. Bonus if you’re deadeye for perma stealth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is 2015... > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, funny it did not changed much since then, right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. > > > > > > > > Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. > > > > > > Prove 1 malice oneshot builds are a problem in sPvP specifically and I will listen to that. Crinn mentioned it before, but was not able to produce results that approached 15-16k on light armor classes without build impracticality. > > > I'm not for guaranteed oneshots without telegraph from stealth, but I am for heavy damage from stealth. > > > > Okay, malice is just an added benefit on a class that can stay at a safe distance while passively building up to their one shot while having access to stealth via dodge trait(nice balance btw), making it the perfect Xv1 + because no one wants go deal with the deadeye who is just safe jumping everywhere while we sit on a mode getting freecasted. > > > > Wvw is a similar issue only more excessive on movement. > > it's not passive. they have to shoot you with initiative attacks. > > > > Stay on topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > This topic was about the mechanical flaw behind stealth builds so you're the one off topic get out my thread please POLICE. > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. > > > > > > Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. > > > > Prove 1 malice oneshot builds are a problem in sPvP specifically and I will listen to that. > > Okay It's okay to lose arguments. Stealth isn't busted either. If 1-shot from stealth builds don't exist in spvp, you can react to a thief engaging on you, even more so if they are deadeye. Apart from that, they still take full damage in stealth, so just cleaving or standing in AoEs is often enough to stall them into resetting or into the open. Go play a thief for a bit, learn what they tend to do when stealthed, and then when you're playing your main class you will have an easier time predicting what they will do to you, based on the weapons they have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > This topic was about the mechanical flaw behind stealth builds so you're the one off topic get out my thread please POLICE. > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. > > > > > > > > Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. > > > > > > Prove 1 malice oneshot builds are a problem in sPvP specifically and I will listen to that. > > > > Okay > > Stealth isn't busted either, If 1-shot from stealth builds don't exist in spvp, you can react to a thief engaging on you, even more so if they are deadeye. > Apart from that, they still take full damage in stealth, so just cleaving or standing in AoEs is often enough to stall them into resetting or into the open. > Let me cast my 9 to 20 second cooldowns to just hope hes stupid enough to be standing still. Do you know how much freedom stealth gives you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > > > > This sums up my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’ve played Rogue and every assassin/stealth classes in a lot of MMO. It’s just easy mode in GW2. If it was only stealth... but no. They need to have tons of teleports and way to disengage and engage from miles and doing 25k+ backstabs from the shadows. Bonus if you’re deadeye for perma stealth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is 2015... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, funny it did not changed much since then, right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. > > > > > > > > > > Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. > > > > > > > > Prove 1 malice oneshot builds are a problem in sPvP specifically and I will listen to that. Crinn mentioned it before, but was not able to produce results that approached 15-16k on light armor classes without build impracticality. > > > > I'm not for guaranteed oneshots without telegraph from stealth, but I am for heavy damage from stealth. > > > > > > Okay, malice is just an added benefit on a class that can stay at a safe distance while passively building up to their one shot while having access to stealth via dodge trait(nice balance btw), making it the perfect Xv1 + because no one wants go deal with the deadeye who is just safe jumping everywhere while we sit on a mode getting freecasted. > > > > > > Wvw is a similar issue only more excessive on movement. > > > > it's not passive. they have to shoot you with initiative attacks. > > > > > > > > > > Stay on topic you went off topic "passively building up to their one shot" and no they are not gonna make stealth go away upon taking damage no matter how many alts you log into and create threads on. reasons?: 1. Mesmer has stealth 2. stealth =/= invulnerable 3. deadeye is supposed to be stealthy. they have to build up to a 1-shot. if you cant take the heat, you are not playing on a roaming class 4. if this is about pvp, its the way a thief can do point control or side node. they cant take the punishment so they have to bide their time to kill you off the point. that whole time you should have had node control. 5. if you get 1 v 2 by deadeye, have fun in bronze and no one cares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > Let me cast my 9 to 20 second cooldowns to just hope hes stupid enough to be standing still. > Do you know how much freedom stealth gives you? Why would you cast your 9 to 20 second cooldowns on where you think he might be? This isn't rocket science. Damaging AoEs like marks and traps go under your feet if the thief is backstab/shortbow. if the thief is ranged, pocket them and only use them when hes visible, or on the path he needs to take to continue firing at you if you move away. if he stealths and loses the point because hes busy waiting for you to burn cooldowns tuck yourself behind objects so he has to move into a specific position to continue firing at you, then be ready to attack there when he destealths. you can also just bunker the point, lmao. if he's chain linking stealth he cannot cap. finish capping and sit behind a box/rock. If its 1v2, the thief is being useless to his team and you can both kill him once one of you finishes capping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scar.1793 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 Pointless to argue OP, not only with thieves white knights but also with Anet not knowing how to handle pvp balance properly since forever. Do as many did before you : play gw2 for its pve as it’s not bad but for pvp just pass. There’s a reason why the pvp community isn’t big, it just sucks and it’s not just a thief stealth issue it’s many things stacking together. ESL got shut down and a lot of people stopped playing GW2 for its pvp right at release. Plenty of games for all tastes that do the job way better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malediktus.9250 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 Stealth is a redicilous mechanic anyway, any nerfs to it are welcome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Fat Disgrace.4275" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Scar.1793" said: > > > > > > > > > > This sums up my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’ve played Rogue and every assassin/stealth classes in a lot of MMO. It’s just easy mode in GW2. If it was only stealth... but no. They need to have tons of teleports and way to disengage and engage from miles and doing 25k+ backstabs from the shadows. Bonus if you’re deadeye for perma stealth. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is 2015... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, funny it did not changed much since then, right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These aren't the WvW forums. Food, armor rarity, trinkets, amulets and other factors all influence balance in that game mode. If that build is possible in spvp vs an armored opponent, then we can talk about adjustment. > > > > > > > > > > > > Believe me, it's a problem in both pvp and wvw. > > > > > > > > > > Prove 1 malice oneshot builds are a problem in sPvP specifically and I will listen to that. Crinn mentioned it before, but was not able to produce results that approached 15-16k on light armor classes without build impracticality. > > > > > I'm not for guaranteed oneshots without telegraph from stealth, but I am for heavy damage from stealth. > > > > > > > > Okay, malice is just an added benefit on a class that can stay at a safe distance while passively building up to their one shot while having access to stealth via dodge trait(nice balance btw), making it the perfect Xv1 + because no one wants go deal with the deadeye who is just safe jumping everywhere while we sit on a mode getting freecasted. > > > > > > > > Wvw is a similar issue only more excessive on movement. > > > > > > it's not passive. they have to shoot you with initiative attacks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stay on topic > > you went off topic "passively building up to their one shot" > > and no they are not gonna make stealth go away upon taking damage no matter how many alts you log into and create threads on. > > reasons?: > > 1. Mesmer has stealth How did this even make the list in your stupid brain? > 2. stealth =/= invulnerable You dont know how to effectively use it then. > 5. if you get 1 v 2 by deadeye, have fun in bronze and no one cares. Anything below plat 2 is bronze. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > Let me cast my 9 to 20 second cooldowns to just hope hes stupid enough to be standing still. > > Do you know how much freedom stealth gives you? > > Why would you cast your 9 to 20 second cooldowns on where you think he might be? > Sugondese > This isn't rocket science. Damaging AoEs like marks and traps go under your feet if the thief is backstab/shortbow. if the thief is ranged, pocket them and only use them when hes visible, or on the path he needs to take to continue firing at you if you move away. if he stealths and loses the point because hes busy waiting for you to burn cooldowns tuck yourself behind objects so he has to move into a specific position to continue firing at you, then be ready to attack there when he destealths. > Okay so how do I do that as a greatsword warrior, a firebrand support, or s/sh holo, or power reaper or even any ele build. > you can also just bunker the point, lmao. if he's chain linking stealth he cannot cap. finish capping and sit behind a box/rock. If its 1v2, the thief is being useless to his team and you can both kill him once one of you finishes capping. > This is EXACTLY EHAT THIEVES WANT YOU TO DO. Go ahead and cap the node while I freecast from a ledge and kill you when you only tick the nose for say, what. 6 seconds. And then I'll just decap you candy recap it and rinse and repeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > This is EXACTLY EHAT THIEVES WANT YOU TO DO. > Go ahead and cap the node while I freecast from a ledge and kill you when you only tick the nose for say, what. 6 seconds. And then I'll just decap you candy recap it and rinse and repeat. so they are taking away your ability to hold a point indefinitely? sounds like a good thing to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyraxy.1902 Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > @"Pyraxy.1902" said: > > > > This is EXACTLY EHAT THIEVES WANT YOU TO DO. > > Go ahead and cap the node while I freecast from a ledge and kill you when you only tick the nose for say, what. 6 seconds. And then I'll just decap you candy recap it and rinse and repeat. > > so they are taking away your ability to hold a point indefinitely? > > sounds like a good thing to me. > Okay so you just dont yey what this entire discussion is about, no one cares about the node. It's what happens after the nose cap with the stealth in play. Key word being freecast. Go back to sucking your thumb on your main account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkyshaAdbinderMoonshard.70 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 A few other points to consider beyond whether stealth is balanced (I consider it imbalanced) or not is: Does it provide good gameplay while playing with/while playing against it? The answer to this would be no, its a mechanic with a focus on preventing counterplay. Does it provide interesting decisions for either player? Once again no, playing against is basically comes down to playing roulette with trying to find them, playing with it is the same but you're "the house" in this scenario. Does it have good counters? No, there are a few reveals, most of them are targeted (which is a bit ironic), the rest range from terrible (DH trap) to pretty good (scrapper reveal), but few of them are on good builds. Could good counters be designed for the mechanic? No, it's a black or white mechanic, there's no gradient to how stealthed you are, this generally means that making good designed counters to the mechanic hard as they would either be useless or completely invalidate the mechanic. What does the mechanic actually add to the game? It allows some classes the ability to disengage at will, it allows the same classes to burst players who do not expect it (if they start stealthing from outside your FoV) and it allows classes to either hard or soft reset a fight. If these things are good or bad is obviously a subjective question, but I would personally say that these things are bad. Now regarding the suggestion to make stealth be removed on hit: Does it provide good gameplay while playing with/against it? I would say so, the stealth player has to avoid getting even one hit and the person trying to reveal gets rewarded for hitting the player. Does it provide interesting decisions for either player: To some degree the stealth player might need to considering using a movement skill instantly/before stealthing, while the revealer might wanna save their bigger (in radius) pbAoEs til the stealther stealths. Does it have good counters? Yes, all stealth classes are mobile. Could good counters be designed for the mechanic? Yes, a trait such as "You can take X amount of hits before you are revealed" could be designed, this has a lot of knobs which you can turn to balance it and has the counter play of using multihits. What does the mechanic actually add to the game? This would add a universal counter to stealth gameplay with a lot of designspace to play around with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now