Arioch.4810 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 > @"ErazorZ.5209" said: > > @"Gulbasaur.1865" said: > > > @"Apolo.5942" said: > > > So 166 votes, 80%+ of rejection towards the class, is this actionable yet? > > > > > > I think this deserves a comment by devs. > > Are you aware of the terms "[vocal minority](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VocalMinority "vocal minority")" and "[silent majority](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silent_majority "silent majority")"? > > > > Mirage is easy to pick up in PvP, but they're also easy to flatten. There is a bit of paper-beats-scissors to it, but that's true of all builds. My mirage is _utterly_ incapable of going up against, say, guardians, so for me they're a major threat and I usually run away from them (luckily all their skills are easy to spot). Rangers can wipe the floor with me because I've run out of evades before I'm anywhere near them and then they knock me back even further. Necromancers swishing that scythe thing about are a no-no. > > > > I think the trouble is that mirage is all-or-nothing in this regard. You're either dominating or dead already. > > with 20 sec of uptime defenses you cannot get closer to a ranger? wat. How?....... > > I am sorry but i feel if you cannot even get close to a ranger, and if you cant 1v1 a guardian or necro. You really shouldnt be talking about the specs balance like its fact. lol. I believe Guldbasaur's view is based on his experience in game: From that i can deduct that he plays axe+torch and staff variant of Mirage. Problems against Guard, Rangers and Reapers arise with that particular weapon set. Had he decided to play axe+torch and sword+pistol variant, with better mobility, kiting power (and extra interrupt on pistol 5) his experiences would be different. Also, I don't see particular reference to 1v1 situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulbasaur.1865 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 > @"ErazorZ.5209" said: > with 20 sec of uptime defenses you cannot get closer to a ranger? wat. How?....... Longbow ranger has a lot of, well, range (1200 vs 900 for two jaunts) and a knockback. If they engage you while in combat with someone else or you don't have everything off cooldown, it's hard to close the gap. Where do you get the 20 seconds from, out of interest? Two or three evades with a weapon swap and four seconds of distortion in a best-case scenario. > You really shouldnt be talking about the specs balance like its fact. lol. I wasn't. I repeatedly referred to myself and I used to phrase "as for me" and the words "I" and "my" several times to show that I was talking about my experience and giving my opinion. In my final paragraph, I said "in this regard", referring back to the previous paragraph. I can go back and highlight them for you if that would help you. Just let me know. > @"Arioch.4810" said: > axe+torch and staff variant of Mirage Yeah. I did play axe/torch axe/pistol but I got bored with it. Pistol is arguably stronger than staff but it's fun in unranked to bamf about with staff and plop chaos storm on people. Pistol's range is still quite short, though. I think one of the fundamental issues with mirages is that it pays to keep three clones up at once, which makes things harder in PvP as people can't just automatically go for the nearest target, but it's the core mechanic for mesmers so altering it would be against the design concept of the profession. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinyreborn.1938 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 > @"ErazorZ.5209" said: > > @"Gulbasaur.1865" said: > > > @"Apolo.5942" said: > > > So 166 votes, 80%+ of rejection towards the class, is this actionable yet? > > > > > > I think this deserves a comment by devs. > > Are you aware of the terms "[vocal minority](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VocalMinority "vocal minority")" and "[silent majority](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silent_majority "silent majority")"? > > > > Mirage is easy to pick up in PvP, but they're also easy to flatten. There is a bit of paper-beats-scissors to it, but that's true of all builds. My mirage is _utterly_ incapable of going up against, say, guardians, so for me they're a major threat and I usually run away from them (luckily all their skills are easy to spot). Rangers can wipe the floor with me because I've run out of evades before I'm anywhere near them and then they knock me back even further. Necromancers swishing that scythe thing about are a no-no. > > > > I think the trouble is that mirage is all-or-nothing in this regard. You're either dominating or dead already. > > with 20 sec of uptime defenses you cannot get closer to a ranger? wat. How?....... > > I am sorry but i feel if you cannot even get close to a ranger, and if you cant 1v1 a guardian or necro. You really shouldnt be talking about the specs balance like its fact. lol. Why you think you are allowed to talk anything if all you do is just a lie ? I feel sorry for you since best what you can do in your life is spam nonsense in mapchat and spread misinfo/lie on forum > @"Arioch.4810" said: > I believe Guldbasaur's view is based on his experience in game: From that i can deduct that he plays axe+torch and staff variant of Mirage. Problems against Guard, Rangers and Reapers arise with that particular weapon set. Had he decided to play axe+torch and sword+pistol variant, with better mobility, kiting power (and extra interrupt on pistol 5) his experiences would be different. Also, I don't see particular reference to 1v1 situations. Who even play sword after all those nerfs on vigor/bf ? IH doesnt benefit from sword at all . What better mobility, lack of any swiftness ? I wouldnt want to use sword ambush for mobility to start a fight without a single dodge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arioch.4810 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 > Who even play sword after all those nerfs on vigor/bf ? IH doesnt benefit from sword at all . What better mobility lack of any swiftness ? I wouldnt want to use sword ambush for mobility to start a fight without a single dodge While you will almost always start fight with 1 less dodge (sword ambush used as mobility ) it's good value for rotating across points: You use sword2 and pistol interrupt to survive (replace that dodge) Raw dmg is lover (a lot! ) but it plays differently and kites much better. Not sure iit is "the" build but it's close to meta in my opinion, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinyreborn.1938 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 > @"Arioch.4810" said: > > > Who even play sword after all those nerfs on vigor/bf ? IH doesnt benefit from sword at all . What better mobility lack of any swiftness ? I wouldnt want to use sword ambush for mobility to start a fight without a single dodge > > While you will almost always start fight with 1 less dodge (sword ambush used as mobility ) it's good value for rotating across points: You use sword2 and pistol interrupt to survive (replace that dodge) Raw dmg is lover (a lot! ) but it plays differently and kites much better. Not sure iit is "the" build but it's close to meta in my opinion, Sword from being good for all kind of builds became trash for all kind of builds. Rooting yourself for 1s and unclear animation when its ends and weird after cast AND really pathetic raw damage... oh did i meantion retal into 2-3 ppl shrekts you ? What they did is trashed weapon >! July 10, 2018 >! The animation time of this skill has been reduced from approximately 1.75 seconds to 1 second while retaining all previous attacks. (8)suicidal into retal >! Damage of this skill has been reduced by 17% in PvP and WvW, with PvE being reduced by 36%. >! The baseline recharge time has been reduced from 12 seconds to 10 seconds. For nerfing evade twice as much -2s rofl Skill n3 is garbage as well since clone die from some1s sneezing even before u can use it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincolnbeard.1735 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > Also weaken knees and some other hex that did damage on moving foes (forgot the name was used to kill carriers on jq) that made torment look like childs play. GW2 spoiled everyone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnfall.9573 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** BRAVO!!  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincolnbeard.1735 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQuickFox.3826 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Too many interrupts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnfall.9573 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 step in with guild team members;; 1 shot= heading to Square Enix: FF14 online. Definitely enjoying Gw2 'competitive' scene. (Great way to keep 39 player including observing new players streaming live motivated with your game) later (here is a 6 years old video of a mesmer one shooting. Fast forward 6 years later....what do you find new here?) no offense-Seriously, where can i find the rewind button ? mesmer one shot https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZaXBMCznB4 Published on May 16, 2012 **'The Future Belongs To All Who, Refusing To Look Back At The Past'** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solaris.2489 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 The perma reflect on Mesmer is terrible (I play longbow Soulbeast in WvW). I will usually test if the Mesmer has a reflect build with Evasive Mirror and all that trash and then just flee cause its impossible to get even 1 hit with longbow and going melee is just suicide with all the condis, detargeting and evasions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagrant.7206 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Core and chrono I don't have too many issues with. Sure, there's some BS now and then, but generally it's relatively tame and not impossible to counter. You always felt like you could get a fair fight with core and chrono, unless they were during the stupid tanky periods. Mirage takes it to a whole new level of frustration though. Constant detargeting, stealth, attacking while dodging, dodging while stunned, spamming multiple conditions endlessly... all of it makes for an immensely frustrating fight. No other class pisses me off more consistently -- at least deadeyes you can counter if you're prepared. Mirages... just no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henrik.7560 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Power Mesmer/Mirage/Chrono yes because they can one shot you but you just have to stay focused and you can out sustain them as they have very little heal or condi clear. Condi just gives me ebola because the axe has extra evades, and you can take extra vitality/healing/condi clear while doing maximum dps for your build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincolnbeard.1735 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on > > Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... Clones have counterplay, they die in one auto attack. There's a reason mesmers want a cloneless spec, clones provide defense for a split sec while you're targeting the mesmer yeah, but they're a nuisance for the mesmers themselves, kill clones and the mesmer damage is turns pathetically low. As for stealth I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of people that wants stealth removed from the game and I'm one of them, there's not single mmo that has a good stealth system, stealth is a kitten mechanic. And again, GW1 mes in GW2 would make the forums explode from all the qq. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpapasmurf.5623 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 I typically fight anyone on anything. If I lose, I lose, if I win, I win. Condi mirages are cancer, however I like beating them the most...knock em down a peg or 2 ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > > > > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > > > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on > > > > Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... > > Clones have counterplay, they die in one auto attack. > There's a reason mesmers want a cloneless spec, clones provide defense for a split sec while you're targeting the mesmer yeah, but they're a nuisance for the mesmers themselves, kill clones and the mesmer damage is turns pathetically low. > As for stealth I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of people that wants stealth removed from the game and I'm one of them, there's not single mmo that has a good stealth system, stealth is a kitten mechanic. > > And again, GW1 mes in GW2 would make the forums explode from all the qq. Basically my signature being added to the game. It would be shit storm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero.3871 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > > > > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > > > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on > > > > Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... > > Clones have counterplay, they die in one auto attack. > There's a reason mesmers want a cloneless spec, clones provide defense for a split sec while you're targeting the mesmer yeah, but they're a nuisance for the mesmers themselves, kill clones and the mesmer damage is turns pathetically low. > As for stealth I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of people that wants stealth removed from the game and I'm one of them, there's not single mmo that has a good stealth system, stealth is a kitten mechanic. > > And again, GW1 mes in GW2 would make the forums explode from all the qq. you cant destroy them in 1 hit when Mirage is using infinite horizon and clones become in fact invul most of time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincolnbeard.1735 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 > @"Zero.3871" said: > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > > > > > > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > > > > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on > > > > > > Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... > > > > Clones have counterplay, they die in one auto attack. > > There's a reason mesmers want a cloneless spec, clones provide defense for a split sec while you're targeting the mesmer yeah, but they're a nuisance for the mesmers themselves, kill clones and the mesmer damage is turns pathetically low. > > As for stealth I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of people that wants stealth removed from the game and I'm one of them, there's not single mmo that has a good stealth system, stealth is a kitten mechanic. > > > > And again, GW1 mes in GW2 would make the forums explode from all the qq. > > you cant destroy them in 1 hit when Mirage is using infinite horizon and clones become in fact invul most of time... > Define "most of the time". Because mirage is one of the professions with least vigor uptime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeknar.6184 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > > > > > > > > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > > > > > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on > > > > > > > > Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... > > > > > > Clones have counterplay, they die in one auto attack. > > > There's a reason mesmers want a cloneless spec, clones provide defense for a split sec while you're targeting the mesmer yeah, but they're a nuisance for the mesmers themselves, kill clones and the mesmer damage is turns pathetically low. > > > As for stealth I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of people that wants stealth removed from the game and I'm one of them, there's not single mmo that has a good stealth system, stealth is a kitten mechanic. > > > > > > And again, GW1 mes in GW2 would make the forums explode from all the qq. > > > > you cant destroy them in 1 hit when Mirage is using infinite horizon and clones become in fact invul most of time... > > > > Define "most of the time". > Because mirage is one of the professions with least vigor uptime. Duel/Chaos Mirages have a decent Vigor uptime as they receive Vigor from shattering, Vigor from Critical Strikes and Vigor from Cry of Frustration specifically (so 2 stances of vigor for that shatter). To not mention the sigils of Energy and Rune of Adventurer. In fact, I'm pretty sure that's the meta build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincolnbeard.1735 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 > @"Jeknar.6184" said: > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > > > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > > > > > > > > > > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > > > > > > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on > > > > > > > > > > Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... > > > > > > > > Clones have counterplay, they die in one auto attack. > > > > There's a reason mesmers want a cloneless spec, clones provide defense for a split sec while you're targeting the mesmer yeah, but they're a nuisance for the mesmers themselves, kill clones and the mesmer damage is turns pathetically low. > > > > As for stealth I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of people that wants stealth removed from the game and I'm one of them, there's not single mmo that has a good stealth system, stealth is a kitten mechanic. > > > > > > > > And again, GW1 mes in GW2 would make the forums explode from all the qq. > > > > > > you cant destroy them in 1 hit when Mirage is using infinite horizon and clones become in fact invul most of time... > > > > > > > Define "most of the time". > > Because mirage is one of the professions with least vigor uptime. > > Duel/Chaos Mirages have a decent Vigor uptime as they receive Vigor from shattering, Vigor from Critical Strikes and Vigor from Cry of Frustration specifically (so 2 stances of vigor for that shatter). To not mention the sigils of Energy and Rune of Adventurer. In fact, I'm pretty sure that's the meta build. Only bountiful is a good source of vigor, vigor from shatter and crit (crit chance with meta build is low) uptime is pitiful with the successive nerfs, sigils and rune were nerfed as well. And that's not to say that by running chaos both sustain damage and burst will be a lot lower than duel/illu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kovu.7560 Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 > @"incisorr.9502" said: > condi mirage cause its the most skill based spec in the game. ... and now I have to clean all of the water I was drinking off of my keyboard. That aside, I've never been overly fond of fighting mesmers in group scenarios. Regardless of balance, the visual clutter has always been obnoxious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > > > > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > > > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on > > > > Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... > > Clones have counterplay, they die in one auto attack. > There's a reason mesmers want a cloneless spec, clones provide defense for a split sec while you're targeting the mesmer yeah, but they're a nuisance for the mesmers themselves, kill clones and the mesmer damage is turns pathetically low. > As for stealth I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of people that wants stealth removed from the game and I'm one of them, there's not single mmo that has a good stealth system, stealth is a kitten mechanic. > > And again, GW1 mes in GW2 would make the forums explode from all the qq. Clones dieing in one autoattack must mean you're running some sort of super glass spec...which typically lack any resemblance of reasonable condi removal against mesmer, killing clones to negate the mesmers was a possible counterplay during 2013..before the whole powercreep started. You keep mentioning GW1 like a typical domination mesmer was any serious threat, again there was massive counterplay in GW1, all you needed to do against a dom mesmer was to wear him down as his only offensive was I believe a couple hexes and in GW1 there was a max of -8 degenaration and you could cover it with 7-8+ regeneration easily, after that fake cast low energy cost skills and hit the mesmer with your big hits...mesmer was down np. In no shape or form was the mesmer in Gw1 OP, annoying af to deal with for certain but the class was well designed with clear weaknesses that could be exploited by an attentive player on any of the other 8 classes. The fake casting/ defensive-swap was one of the most loved nuances of GW1...not like the macroed insta burst crap of GW2, I am sorry but in terms of design GW2 is hundreds of miles behind GW1...no comparison whatsoever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnfall.9573 Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > > > > > @"getalifeturd.8139" said: > > > > > > > @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said: > > > > > > > Think I can speak for most mesmers when I say that would have prefer GW1 type of mesmer instead of this one as well. > > > > > > > But since you played both, how hard do you think the qq would be if mesmer was like the previous one? > > > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/List_of_hex_spells > > > > > > > > > > > > I can only imagine the Q.Q in this game if players were punished for spamming skills. Empathy and Insidious Parasite would hard counter melee. Backfire and Arcane Conundrum would make casters rage. Visions of Regret and Spiteful Spirit would make zergs cry and ragequit the game forever. And those are only some of the many things that made Guild Wars 1 more of an Esport than this game will ever be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Guild Wars 1 there was no stealth.....no reflect...no low CD teleport..no distortion...no clones...basically 90% of GW2 mesmers would insta die in GW1 but most of all....**nobody could jump on mesmer and next day spam laugh/dance emotes thinking of being ESL champions** > > > > > > > > All true but GW1 mesmer was way more deadly and annoying than GW2 counterpart. > > > > Forums would explode from all qq. "Empathy op, backfire op, visions of regret op, wastrel's worry op". "omg what am I supposed to do, if I attack/cast I die if I don't attack/cast I die ANet nerf please". "perma rupted isn't fun ANet nerf please" and so on > > > > > > Again...no stealth and clones allow for massive counterplay regardless of what the mesmer was running..... > > > > Clones have counterplay, they die in one auto attack. > > There's a reason mesmers want a cloneless spec, clones provide defense for a split sec while you're targeting the mesmer yeah, but they're a nuisance for the mesmers themselves, kill clones and the mesmer damage is turns pathetically low. > > As for stealth I can count with the fingers of one hand the amount of people that wants stealth removed from the game and I'm one of them, there's not single mmo that has a good stealth system, stealth is a kitten mechanic. > > > > And again, GW1 mes in GW2 would make the forums explode from all the qq. > > Clones dieing in one autoattack must mean you're running some sort of super glass spec...which typically lack any resemblance of reasonable condi removal against mesmer, killing clones to negate the mesmers was a possible counterplay during 2013..before the whole powercreep started. > > You keep mentioning GW1 like a typical domination mesmer was any serious threat, again there was massive counterplay in GW1, all you needed to do against a dom mesmer was to wear him down as his only offensive was I believe a couple hexes and in GW1 there was a max of -8 degenaration and you could cover it with 7-8+ regeneration easily, after that fake cast low energy cost skills and hit the mesmer with your big hits...mesmer was down np. > > In no shape or form was the mesmer in Gw1 OP, annoying af to deal with for certain but the class was well designed with clear weaknesses that could be exploited by an attentive player on any of the other 8 classes. > > The fake casting/ defensive-swap was one of the most loved nuances of GW1...not like the macroed insta burst kitten of GW2, I am sorry but in terms of design GW2 is hundreds of miles behind GW1...no comparison whatsoever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now