EnderzShadow.2506 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > I'll email this thread to the soulbeast designer. Hey Ben, care to fix the gazillion other issues before you intiate the swing of the nerf bat? ;) Much Appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > Again the player started in the Alive state while shadowpass says it only happens to players already in the downed state clearly the first charge happened while the player was alive. #readcomp > You're completely wrong in this. Don't try to argue. The video you were talking about clearly shows the bug taking affect only AFTER the asura goes down. **If the asura had not gone into the down state after the inital hit of charge, the rest of the hits would NOT have occurred.** There seems to be something about that statement that you cannot seem to comprehend. You are proving my point and others agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > @Arheundel.6451 said: > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > @Felipe.1807 said: > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > @Felipe.1807 said: > > > > > > I honestly dont know how some people think these new ranger pets are okay...I remenber when I used to play ranger and most of the time you would choose your pet based on the utility that he would bring and how that would synergise with your build. These days you just pick whatever is the most OP pet that will be able to shred someone HP by using some easy to do combos. > > > > > > Just because pvp is full of cancers like scourges and spellbreakers dosent mean that is okay to look to the other way when it comes to balance other professions...this kind of thinking "if everything is op then nothing is op, so is balanced" is what led this game to the mess that is now. > > > > > > > > > > The old pets are completely trash. > > > > > > > > > > So you're saying, just because scourge and spellbreakers are OP, we should just nerf ranger instead of looking at the stuff that is actually meta changing. Nice. > > > > > > > > Thats the thing, old pets you would choose to get a extra knockback, or maybe a fear, immobile, etc...rangers where doing extremely well back in the day, you just needed to use wisely your pet...post HoT ranger just got extremelly dumbed down, just like everything else, and that was not healthy to the game mode. > > > > No, i am not saying we should nerf rangers because other professions are OP...i am saying the balance team should look at these pets damages, and nerf then, regardless of other professions...we must start somewhere and bring the numbers down. > > > > > > No, rangers were not doing _extremely well_ back in the day... As a class, we were so terrible it wasn't even funny. Our rapid fire could be completely avoided just by moving left and right, our pet AI was (and is still) terrible and they couldn't hit moving targets (lol they still can't). Our pets actually became usable once HoT came around and introduced Smokescale and Bristleback. Why were they good? Oh, because Smokescale had a tracking ability through Smoke Assault that actually allowed it to hit a moving target, and Bristleback had its f2, which also was able to hit a moving target. But nooooo, people had to go and cry over everything rangers get so we get nerfed in every patch and it pisses me the kitten off. Bristleback is borderline unusable now as a result. > > > > > > Okay, well I'm fine with balancing everything overall, but why start with Gazelle when there are much more pressing matters to tend to such as SCOURGE AND SPELLBREAKER?!! Why start nerfing things on ranger when there are other things that are more concerning to the balance and overall meta of the game? -.- > > > > Will you calm down now my friend? > > They will simply fix the charge issue, the utility of the rock gazelle will be left untouched , furthermore with the applied fix, it will be possible to request the addition of standard leap to some of the gazelle attacks > > No one gives a kitten about the utility. We need the damage from our pets! Stop nerfing the kitten out of them and then I'll calm down. They made Bristleback _useless_ because people were crying so much. Do you not realize that? Its always nerf ranger while actual unbalanced stuff goes untouched. > > We had many, many threads created in the ranger subforum over all of the bugs we had on Soulbeast and no answer on ANY of them! But the moment someone complains that our pet is bugged because it does a lot of damage, Anet responds immediately. This kitten ticks me off. You are over-reacting because bristleback is still one of the TOP dps pet against moving targets, it still hits hard and in even in soulbeast mode its skills are a great. Getting angry won't stop the fixes from happening and neither will attract the devs attention; yes soulbeast still has some glaring bugs like : -Bird leap in soulbeast mode being 300 range instead than 1200 -Unstoppable union stunbreak not working -Live fast not applying to Beast skills outside soulbeastmode -Signet of renewal possible bug not working in soulbeast mode -Guard shout like SoR not working in soulbeast mode All should be fixed and on that much I agree with you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > Again the player started in the Alive state while shadowpass says it only happens to players already in the downed state clearly the first charge happened while the player was alive. #readcomp > I don't know how to explain this any better, if you are not getting it at this point, i just dunno. If the Asura did not go into down state from that initial strike, the others would not have hit, ie, it's only a bug on downed targets. If they fix the skill being able to hit downed targets multiple times, then it wouldn't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crinn.7864 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again the player started in the Alive state while shadowpass says it only happens to players already in the downed state clearly the first charge happened while the player was alive. #readcomp > > > > You're completely wrong in this. Don't try to argue. > > The video you were talking about clearly shows the bug taking affect only AFTER the asura goes down. > > **If the asura had not gone into the down state after the inital hit of charge, the rest of the hits would NOT have occurred.** There seems to be something about that statement that you cannot seem to comprehend. > > You are proving my point and others agree. Ok, but that still means that the initial hit literally 1-banged the Asura from full health. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqueFyre.5678 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again the player started in the Alive state while shadowpass says it only happens to players already in the downed state clearly the first charge happened while the player was alive. #readcomp > > > > You're completely wrong in this. Don't try to argue. > > The video you were talking about clearly shows the bug taking affect only AFTER the asura goes down. > > **If the asura had not gone into the down state after the inital hit of charge, the rest of the hits would NOT have occurred.** There seems to be something about that statement that you cannot seem to comprehend. > > You are proving my point and others agree. Ah look you are changing what you said originally since all your original posts said it only happened to players already in the the downed stated, smh got to get your story straight buddy. > The multiple hits only occur when it charges against someone in the down state. > Second, I can see the log and it does NOT tell me anything about whether you were already in the downstate or not. Or did you not say these things? /popcorn Like I said I couldn’t care less if this skill ever gets fixed/nerfed since it almost never lands to begin with, I was pointing out what you said was wrong on the claims that the multi hit only happens to already downed players. Now the fact that it happens to players if the attack is the one that downs them then that is correct but you stated multiple times only on already downed players is when it will only multi hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again the player started in the Alive state while shadowpass says it only happens to players already in the downed state clearly the first charge happened while the player was alive. #readcomp > > > > > > > You're completely wrong in this. Don't try to argue. > > > > The video you were talking about clearly shows the bug taking affect only AFTER the asura goes down. > > > > **If the asura had not gone into the down state after the inital hit of charge, the rest of the hits would NOT have occurred.** There seems to be something about that statement that you cannot seem to comprehend. > > > > You are proving my point and others agree. > > Ah look you are changing what you said originally since all your original posts said it only happened to players already in the the downed stated, smh got to get your story straight buddy. > > > The multiple hits only occur when it charges against someone in the down state. > > > Second, I can see the log and it does NOT tell me anything about whether you were already in the downstate or not. > > Or did you not say these things? > > /popcorn > > Like I said I couldn’t care less if this skill ever gets fixed/nerfed since it almost never lands to begin with, I was pointing out what you said was wrong on the claims that the multi hit only happens to already downed players. Now the fact that it happens to players if the attack is the one that downs them then that is correct but you stated multiple times only on already downed players is when it will only multi hit. Lol indeed...the gazelle rarely hit so any change/fix in reality won't add/detract anything from the table Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zealex.9410 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > @kKagari.6804 said: > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said: > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said: > > > > > > > @"Hyper Cutter.9376" said: > > > > > > > I love how people screech with outrage whenever a ranger pet is actually capable of hurting them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No wait, no I don't because Anet always nerfs our pets into oblivion because God forbid they actually _do their jobs_ in battle. > > > > > > > > > > > > To be fair, there's a difference between the pet doing its job, and the pet doing the job of two other players as well as its own. Rock gazelle charge is legitimately one-shotting people, which needs to be toned down. Now, if it takes an ele from 75% to downed? I'm okay with that level of damage. That's high enough that the pet is still a significant threat, but not so high that the pet is all you (Ranger or target) focus on. > > > > > > > > > > Tell me how to hit all of its skills reliably on a moving target, then I'll be okay. Until then, the pet is bad on its own. > > > > > > > > > > It's like a blind person with a bazooka. It misses 99% of the time, but if you get lucky, someone (a downed player) will take a lot of damage. > > > > > > > > I never said pets in general didn't need work, just that the damage of *this* pet needs to be toned down. > > > > > > > > Pets actually hitting a moving target needs to happen badly. Maybe ANet can do something with them like having the strike range be significantly larger, but the pet will only initiate the skill if within its current listed range. > > > > > > Fair enough. This pet doesn't actually do that much damage on a non-downed player unless you spec heavily into pet damage though. Without any modifiers, it only hits for 4k. > > > > > > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" > > > 1. The damage on Gazelle **IS NOT** bugged. > > > 2. The damage against downed players **IS** bugged. It functions similar to a necro's Flesh Golem if the target is pinned against a wall and you use its active. > > > 3. Please, do not nerf the damage from its abilities. If anything, fix the interaction against downed players. > > > 4. Asides from this, this pet gives us a "safe stomp" similar to a Daredevil's elite and Scrapper's Function Gyro. If you left this in the game, it would give rangers more group utility, which may benefit us in WvW in the long run. > > > > Er, no. I've tested this extensively yesterday, 20k hp guardian, with aegis, downed instantly, only about 20% hp left while downed also. > > For clarification, it does NOT hit for 20k on its own. You need to take several traits/utilities for it to hit that hard. It only does a single hit on a standing target. If that target goes down, it will get hit by the rest of the ability. I got 1 shot and i wasnt against any wall so /shrug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turk.5460 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 I don't understand why this guy is so stalwartly defending an obvious bug that is detrimental to any sort of competitive experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateBlaze.7840 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @Turk.5460 said: > I don't understand why this guy is so stalwartly defending an obvious bug that is detrimental to any sort of competitive experience. No one is defending the bug or claiming that it doesn't need to be fixed. What you're not getting is HOW the bug works. People are claiming that the intended damage from the gazelle's charge is the bug/needs to be nerfed. That is not the the bug and it doesn't really need to be toned down. This is just like any other one trick high burst pony. It requires a lot of setup and the kittening stars have to align for the gazelle to do that much damage. And the one part that a lot of people are overlooking is the fact that not only can you dodge this most of the time by just walking away, the ranger is going to be hella squishy with this build. That's called compromise. He one shots you, you can one shot him back/kill him very quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unholy Pillager.3791 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @Turk.5460 said: > I don't understand why this guy is so stalwartly defending an obvious bug that is detrimental to any sort of competitive experience. Because "bug fixes" on rangers and pets have a notable history of removing either the pet/skill/trait in question from viability, or simple remove the profession entirely from the meta. Plus, even with the bug, Rangers are not nearly as powerful as Scourges and Spellbreakers right now. There are 55 Ranger pets in the game right now. At any given time, fewer than half a dozen of them are even considered viable, and even those usually have detrimental bugs (such as the fact that only a few pets are affected at all by quickness) and/or cannot reliably hit moving targets. That is a serious problem, and I think that it needs to be addressed rather than ignored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again the player started in the Alive state while shadowpass says it only happens to players already in the downed state clearly the first charge happened while the player was alive. #readcomp > > > > > > > You're completely wrong in this. Don't try to argue. > > > > The video you were talking about clearly shows the bug taking affect only AFTER the asura goes down. > > > > **If the asura had not gone into the down state after the inital hit of charge, the rest of the hits would NOT have occurred.** There seems to be something about that statement that you cannot seem to comprehend. > > > > You are proving my point and others agree. > > Ah look you are changing what you said originally since all your original posts said it only happened to players already in the the downed stated, smh got to get your story straight buddy. > > > The multiple hits only occur when it charges against someone in the down state. > > > Second, I can see the log and it does NOT tell me anything about whether you were already in the downstate or not. > > Or did you not say these things? > > /popcorn > > Like I said I couldn’t care less if this skill ever gets fixed/nerfed since it almost never lands to begin with, I was pointing out what you said was wrong on the claims that the multi hit only happens to already downed players. Now the fact that it happens to players if the attack is the one that downs them then that is correct but you stated multiple times only on already downed players is when it will only multi hit. I'm not changing what I originally said. What I said is 100% true. You don't know how the bug works and that's what I'm trying to say. Charge will only hit once if the target is alive. That clip you showed proves that point. After the initial hit, the asura went into downstate, therefore, the bug came into effect and the multi hit occured. The claims I made are perfectly correct. You are in the wrong here. The multiple hits will only occur once the target is downed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @Arheundel.6451 said: > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > > > > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again the player started in the Alive state while shadowpass says it only happens to players already in the downed state clearly the first charge happened while the player was alive. #readcomp > > > > > > > > > > You're completely wrong in this. Don't try to argue. > > > > > > The video you were talking about clearly shows the bug taking affect only AFTER the asura goes down. > > > > > > **If the asura had not gone into the down state after the inital hit of charge, the rest of the hits would NOT have occurred.** There seems to be something about that statement that you cannot seem to comprehend. > > > > > > You are proving my point and others agree. > > > > Ah look you are changing what you said originally since all your original posts said it only happened to players already in the the downed stated, smh got to get your story straight buddy. > > > > > The multiple hits only occur when it charges against someone in the down state. > > > > > Second, I can see the log and it does NOT tell me anything about whether you were already in the downstate or not. > > > > Or did you not say these things? > > > > /popcorn > > > > Like I said I couldn’t care less if this skill ever gets fixed/nerfed since it almost never lands to begin with, I was pointing out what you said was wrong on the claims that the multi hit only happens to already downed players. Now the fact that it happens to players if the attack is the one that downs them then that is correct but you stated multiple times only on already downed players is when it will only multi hit. > > Lol indeed...the gazelle rarely hit so any change/fix in reality won't add/detract anything from the table It will make a huge difference. There's a reason why some ranger players are better than others. One of the reasons is because the good ones can control their pets A LOT better than the average player can. For the record, I hit the gazelle's skills almost every time. So yes, having the damage on the skills nerfed will essentially punish me for playing well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @Turk.5460 said: > I don't understand why this guy is so stalwartly defending an obvious bug that is detrimental to any sort of competitive experience. I'm not defending the bug. I'm saying, Anet can fix the bug IF they also address all of the other bugs we've been posting about since PoF came out. Yet all of those posts and threads that fellow ranger players have made and spent the time and effort to create have been completely ignored. The moment someone complains that ranger has something overpowered, Anet responds immediately. This shouldn't be the case and its what I'm arguing against right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @ChocolateBlaze.7840 said: > > @Turk.5460 said: > > I don't understand why this guy is so stalwartly defending an obvious bug that is detrimental to any sort of competitive experience. > > No one is defending the bug or claiming that it doesn't need to be fixed. What you're not getting is HOW the bug works. People are claiming that the intended damage from the gazelle's charge is the bug/needs to be nerfed. That is not the the bug and it doesn't really need to be toned down. This is just like any other one trick high burst pony. It requires a lot of setup and the kittening stars have to align for the gazelle to do that much damage. > > And the one part that a lot of people are overlooking is the fact that not only can you dodge this most of the time by just walking away, the ranger is going to be hella squishy with this build. That's called compromise. He one shots you, you can one shot him back/kill him very quickly. > @"Unholy Pillager.3791" said: > > @Turk.5460 said: > > I don't understand why this guy is so stalwartly defending an obvious bug that is detrimental to any sort of competitive experience. > > Because "bug fixes" on rangers and pets have a notable history of removing either the pet/skill/trait in question from viability, or simple remove the profession entirely from the meta. Plus, even with the bug, Rangers are not nearly as powerful as Scourges and Spellbreakers right now. > > There are 55 Ranger pets in the game right now. At any given time, fewer than half a dozen of them are even considered viable, and even those usually have detrimental bugs (such as the fact that only a few pets are affected at all by quickness) and/or cannot reliably hit moving targets. That is a serious problem, and I think that it needs to be addressed rather than ignored. Thank you, you both understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitten.4162 Posted October 6, 2017 Author Share Posted October 6, 2017 > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > This video pretty much sums up the reason I posted this thread lol I honestly don't see how many dumb ranger mains can be arguing that this is "intended" lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaqueFyre.5678 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > > > > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again the player started in the Alive state while shadowpass says it only happens to players already in the downed state clearly the first charge happened while the player was alive. #readcomp > > > > > > > > > > You're completely wrong in this. Don't try to argue. > > > > > > The video you were talking about clearly shows the bug taking affect only AFTER the asura goes down. > > > > > > **If the asura had not gone into the down state after the inital hit of charge, the rest of the hits would NOT have occurred.** There seems to be something about that statement that you cannot seem to comprehend. > > > > > > You are proving my point and others agree. > > > > Ah look you are changing what you said originally since all your original posts said it only happened to players already in the the downed stated, smh got to get your story straight buddy. > > > > > The multiple hits only occur when it charges against someone in the down state. > > > > > Second, I can see the log and it does NOT tell me anything about whether you were already in the downstate or not. > > > > Or did you not say these things? > > > > /popcorn > > > > Like I said I couldn’t care less if this skill ever gets fixed/nerfed since it almost never lands to begin with, I was pointing out what you said was wrong on the claims that the multi hit only happens to already downed players. Now the fact that it happens to players if the attack is the one that downs them then that is correct but you stated multiple times only on already downed players is when it will only multi hit. > > I'm not changing what I originally said. What I said is 100% true. You don't know how the bug works and that's what I'm trying to say. > > Charge will only hit once if the target is alive. That clip you showed proves that point. After the initial hit, the asura went into downstate, therefore, the bug came into effect and the multi hit occured. > > The claims I made are perfectly correct. You are in the wrong here. The multiple hits will only occur once the target is downed. That target was alive when the first hit happened, it still multi hit, you originally stated and my post directly quoted you saying that it only multi hits Already downed players, not players that are hit then downed by the first Charge. Go re-read what I posted and what you posted which was directly quoted.#readcomp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rap Tiger.1257 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > @"Rap Tiger.1257" said: > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > @"Rap Tiger.1257" said: > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > @"Rap Tiger.1257" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > @kKagari.6804 said: > > > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > > > @Gahzirra.8639 said: > > > > > > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > > > > > For clarification, it does NOT hit for 20k on its own. You need to take several traits/utilities for it to hit that hard. It only does a single hit on a standing target. If that target goes down, it will get hit by the rest of the ability. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please explain, I was not downed https://imgur.com/a/ijHHW > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So the set up for this 28K is just root? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If the initial hit downed you, you'd take 28k total. It does NOT do 28k damage upfront. It's not possible. The multiple hits only occur when it charges against someone in the down state. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I thought you told me earlier that you can achieve that damage if you have a lot of setup. Like I said, I was downed instantly in the PvP area of HotM. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respectfully, I'm not sure if you are unaware of the instances where the gazelle can one shot you at full 20k+ HP, or you are arguing the case that this is OK. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 30k in a single hit is impossible. 20k is reasonable if you spec fully into damage. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tiger can hit 16k. Gazelle can hit 20k. Both require a full burst setup to achieve. Yet the fact remains, 28k in a single hit is impossible. > > > > > > > > > > > > The kid who made a dueling video on one vs one is crying because they're going to nerf the gazelle? I play Soulbeast and I really need to nerf these gazella attacks, taking more damage than normal, hope that anet fix this bug, I'm not in favor of something so op and look I'm not too ask nerf.The gazelle already took me 20k in a single attack > > > > > > > > > > Tiger can hit for roughly the same amount on a lower cooldown. > > > > > > > > Interesting, I have played PVP for almost 5 years and since the launch of HOT I have received 20k damage in an attack, maximum 10k down when used sic and other buffs for the pet, the tiger is absolutely normal, since the gazella does not . > > > > > > I'm having a bit of trouble understanding what you wrote. Both pets require a lot of setup in order to achieve that burst. The gazelle on its own will NOT hit for 20k > > > > As incredible as it seems the gazelle takes an absurdly bigger damage than a tiger with all the buffs, putting the buffs gets to take 30k, needs to receive nerf, smokescale and bristleback also in the time of the beginning of the HOT had absurd damages.You are only defending the gazelle not to receive nerf because it uses druid, then ends up using root in the enemies and then without being able to move uses the attack of the gazella to take off in an attack. > > Can you tell me why people pick Smokescale now? Its sure as hell not because of its damage. In most cases, it will barely hit for 3k on its Smoke Assault against a single target in PvP. Given the fact that you are rarely fighting against a single target, the Smokescale is mainly taken for the utility with its smoke field. > > Also, tell me how many people you see actually using Bristleback now? It's probably close to none. Why? Because even through all of the projectile hate in this game, landing a Bristleback f2 was worth it for the burst it provided. Constant complaining due to people like you caused this pet and Smokescale to be nerfed into oblivion. The Bristleback was ONLY taken for its burst with its f2. The low damage coupled with its extreme difficulty in the current meta of actually landing it, makes this pet worthless. > > I am not defending the gazelle to not receive a nerf because it uses druid. Honestly, that statement probably doesn't even make that much sense. I am saying, if you nerf the damage on charge, this pet will becomes worthless like Bristleback. I REPEAT. THE PET WILL BECOME USELESS. I am fine if they nerf charge's interaction with a downed body if they fix the AI to compensate for it. So by your justification I'll ask Anet to put my wyverns to apply 20k in a single blow, who told you that bristleback is useless? I think better about the new pets of POF, gazella is being used more because of this bug, I took 9k of this animal without totally buff ... Smokescale's teleportation helps, F2 also, the knock as he knocks down, not only by F2, now if the best ranger here as you call yourself needs something abnormal to kill other players, take the title of better ranger . Remembering that Ranger game since September 2012, practically since launching the game, I have almost 16k of games in PVP, so do not tell me that I have no experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @Kitten.4162 said: > > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > > > > > > It’s funny the claim of the multi hit bug only happening against downstate players when there is a video showing it happening against an Asuran on skyhammer that at full health alive and doing multi hit over 56k. > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, first off, I already said the attack can hit 20k if you spec full burst. Second, there's no possible way it could hit 56k unless the target went down and the bug came into effect. You see what I mean? No single person could take 56k worth of damage and live. That number came because the asura was downed, then the rest of the hits came from the bug, totaling 56k. You helped me prove my point. > > > > > > > > > > Sorry it was 48k Multi hit bug while the player was standing at full health. The multi hits hit while the player was still up, not when they were downed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > _Sorry_, a single player will not take 48k while living. The extra damage came when he was downed. > > > > > > Again you keep saying the multi hit only happens against downed players, the multi hit bug happens against players that are alive, re-read what I wrote it stated that it started multi hit before it downed the Asuran then finished it at 48k... #readcomp > > > > I think you should watch that video again. The asura is clearly downed on the 1st hit from the fully buffed charge. If the skill did not multi-hit downed players, there would be nothing wrong with it. > > > > > > > > This video pretty much sums up the reason I posted this thread lol > > I honestly don't see how many kitten ranger mains can be arguing that this is "intended" lol No one has said the bug was intended. I'm saying, I want anet to fix this bug and ALL of the other ones we've been posting about. Don't just nerf this without looking at EVERYTHING else wrong with Soulbeast... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @zealex.9410 said: > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > @kKagari.6804 said: > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said: > > > > > > @shadowpass.4236 said: > > > > > > > @"Drarnor Kunoram.5180" said: > > > > > > > > @"Hyper Cutter.9376" said: > > > > > > > > I love how people screech with outrage whenever a ranger pet is actually capable of hurting them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No wait, no I don't because Anet always nerfs our pets into oblivion because God forbid they actually _do their jobs_ in battle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To be fair, there's a difference between the pet doing its job, and the pet doing the job of two other players as well as its own. Rock gazelle charge is legitimately one-shotting people, which needs to be toned down. Now, if it takes an ele from 75% to downed? I'm okay with that level of damage. That's high enough that the pet is still a significant threat, but not so high that the pet is all you (Ranger or target) focus on. > > > > > > > > > > > > Tell me how to hit all of its skills reliably on a moving target, then I'll be okay. Until then, the pet is bad on its own. > > > > > > > > > > > > It's like a blind person with a bazooka. It misses 99% of the time, but if you get lucky, someone (a downed player) will take a lot of damage. > > > > > > > > > > I never said pets in general didn't need work, just that the damage of *this* pet needs to be toned down. > > > > > > > > > > Pets actually hitting a moving target needs to happen badly. Maybe ANet can do something with them like having the strike range be significantly larger, but the pet will only initiate the skill if within its current listed range. > > > > > > > > Fair enough. This pet doesn't actually do that much damage on a non-downed player unless you spec heavily into pet damage though. Without any modifiers, it only hits for 4k. > > > > > > > > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" > > > > 1. The damage on Gazelle **IS NOT** bugged. > > > > 2. The damage against downed players **IS** bugged. It functions similar to a necro's Flesh Golem if the target is pinned against a wall and you use its active. > > > > 3. Please, do not nerf the damage from its abilities. If anything, fix the interaction against downed players. > > > > 4. Asides from this, this pet gives us a "safe stomp" similar to a Daredevil's elite and Scrapper's Function Gyro. If you left this in the game, it would give rangers more group utility, which may benefit us in WvW in the long run. > > > > > > Er, no. I've tested this extensively yesterday, 20k hp guardian, with aegis, downed instantly, only about 20% hp left while downed also. > > > > For clarification, it does NOT hit for 20k on its own. You need to take several traits/utilities for it to hit that hard. It only does a single hit on a standing target. If that target goes down, it will get hit by the rest of the ability. > > I got 1 shot and i wasnt against any wall so /shrug I never mentioned a wall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bossun.2046 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > I'll email this thread to the soulbeast designer. All the scourge and spellbreaker threads and you decide to reply to the soulbeast one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > That target was alive when the first hit happened, it still multi hit, you originally stated and my post directly quoted you saying that it only multi hits Already downed players, not players that are hit then downed by the first Charge. > > Go re-read what I posted and what you posted which was directly quoted.#readcomp You are basing your argument on the word "already" and just semantics at this point. If it doesn't hit a downed player, it doesn't happen, so a player would have to be downed before the charge was activated or downed immediately after the 1st hit connects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @Bossun.2046 said: > > @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said: > > I'll email this thread to the soulbeast designer. > > All the scourge and spellbreaker threads and you decide to reply to the soulbeast one... That's what I'm talking about. I don't mind the interaction, but a little more interaction would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 > @"Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582" said: > > @BlaqueFyre.5678 said: > > That target was alive when the first hit happened, it still multi hit, you originally stated and my post directly quoted you saying that it only multi hits Already downed players, not players that are hit then downed by the first Charge. > > > > Go re-read what I posted and what you posted which was directly quoted.#readcomp > > **You are basing your argument on the word "already" and just semantics at this point.** > > If it doesn't hit a downed player, it doesn't happen, so a player would have to be downed before the charge was activated or downed immediately after the 1st hit connects. Thank you. He's making it seem like what I said was incorrect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shikigami.4013 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 It is hard to believe how bad some people are at understanding the meaning of words. A hit is one hit, a multi-hit are several hits. If someone says "a multi-hit only occurs when a target is down" that means it will only hit the target multiple times if the target is down. How often did it hit the player in the video while he was up? Once. Is one hit a multi-hit? No. The following hits started at hit number two, at which time the target was down. So it mutli-hitted a downed player. If the player had not gone down on the first hit, the other hits would not have happened. It is as simple as that. Show us a video with a player who gets hit like this while standing, then you can say the claim that it only multi-hits downed players is false. PS: About the word "already: It becomes only a multi-hit on the second hit because the first hit is only one hit and not a multi-hit, so even if a player is not _already_ downed when the first hit happens he is still only multi-hitted when _already_ down.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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