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Great job on the recent update. Please look at Ranger next


mes.4607

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@"mrauls.6519"

 

Against other rangers I just time a cc for when the smoke assault evade ends. If I was playing DH I would use lb3 or shield 5. Even if they dodge it, that means they weren't able to try and maul or wi you. Even lb5 works if you cast it the moment you see them merge with smokescale and you think they're going to use SA. I'll be home tonight in 4-5 hours or so if you want to practice vs. me while I give you tips. ^^

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> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> @"mrauls.6519"

>

> Against other rangers I just time a cc for when the smoke assault evade ends. If I was playing DH I would use lb3 or shield 5. Even if they dodge it, that means they weren't able to try and maul or wi you. Even lb5 works if you cast it the moment you see them merge with smokescale and you think they're going to use SA. I'll be home tonight in 4-5 hours or so if you want to practice vs. me while I give you tips. ^^

 

**I'm definitely down to duel.** I get what you're saying, but LB3 is not a very viable option against smoke assault (and unrelenting assault) anymore. The weird cast time they added messed everything up. A well timed shield 5 still works though. LB5 during smoke assault isn't a viable option because of the long cast time. I'd have to precast it well in advance... but then they will probably wait before doing anything. CC hurts way more (for everyone) and I definitely feel the pain after point-blank shot into rapid fire. 1v1s are one thing, but Ranger seems to have 'strong' performance in 2v2. One missed spear of justice and the ranger can reset on me and my team mate.. Focusing the other enemy can sometimes mess us up badly, because then the Ranger is left to free cast. Just trying to share where my frustration comes from.

 

I'm not trying to make Ranger unviable. I see a lot of similar threads popping up. They're all pretty consistent: Ranger burst damage needs to be dialed down

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One of the big problems with ranger is pet passive skills. There shouldn't be a CC on a pet passive skill (smokescale for example). Pet CCs should only be on the player active skill for the pet. There are much less stunbreaks and stability now, so getting set up for a huge burst by scripted content is not healthy. Ive been hit by 10k maul + 6k worldly impact on a build with over 3300 armor post-patch. Thats a full hp bar in most cases, and its often set up by a pet knockdown out of nowhere.

The problem with ranger is that it does crazy damage at melee and at range. You cant trade with them at range and if you get close they have the potential to delete your whole hp bar in 2 seconds with barely any tell. I think anet needs to reduce the numbers alot on maul and worldly impact. Give GS the evade on auto attack again and make it a more defensive / moderate dps weapon. It shouldnt be able to decide or swing a fight in 2 seconds.

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> @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > 7.1k mauls are pretty insane to me... Smoke Assault needs an animation as well

> >

> > This is the problem with 2v2s. You lose to me 4 times last night in 2s. A lot of the matches were super close. I think I was playing extremely well and barely pulled off some of the wins... and then you log on here and complain about ranger. If I was barely winning... then I imagine you must be thrashing pretty much every other ranger out there...

> >

> > And you absolutely kitten me up some games. You speared me, I couldn't stealth, and I had to inefficiently waste cds and got farmed... yet I'm not on here complaining about how guardian can pull people through evades, how spear is unblockable, or that it has a low cast time. Cause honestly if I dont dodge or LoS your spears I lose...

> >

> > So this kinda makes me think ranger might not be that much of a problem and you're just salty you lost?

> >

> > I think those were close games and they felt pretty balanced to me. I had to work really hard for those wins.

>

> I haven't fought many rangers in 2v2, but so far (I believe) I've lost most matches to them (for different reasons). I wasn't salty, I even said gg after the first match we lost. I sincerely think maul needs a damage nerf and smoke assault needs a (better) animation. I've also gotten smashed by Miaz (ranger) & Vallun. Ranger is definitely proving to be a very difficult match up. From my perspective it definitely feels 'impossible' sometimes to lock a good Ranger down. Zol and I discussed what we found difficult about the match up, and smoke assault into worldly impact / maul was what really wrecked us. There was one point you killed me from ~8k HP after smoke assault was used.. The maul literally hit 7.1k. If it hit somewhere between 4-5k I'd at least have time to follow up with something. I know 'L2P' and 'dodge', but sometimes that just doesn't work. Just sharing my perspective on the forum. I have no hard feelings

>

> Edit: Just remembered I beat a ranger using axe last night (totally different build)

 

In the top 75 there are 4 rangers. In the top 60 there is 1 ranger... after that I don't really know who is playing what. So there really aren't that many I imagine you're losing to. Underrepresented yet still OP.

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> @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > > 7.1k mauls are pretty insane to me... Smoke Assault needs an animation as well

> > >

> > > This is the problem with 2v2s. You lose to me 4 times last night in 2s. A lot of the matches were super close. I think I was playing extremely well and barely pulled off some of the wins... and then you log on here and complain about ranger. If I was barely winning... then I imagine you must be thrashing pretty much every other ranger out there...

> > >

> > > And you absolutely kitten me up some games. You speared me, I couldn't stealth, and I had to inefficiently waste cds and got farmed... yet I'm not on here complaining about how guardian can pull people through evades, how spear is unblockable, or that it has a low cast time. Cause honestly if I dont dodge or LoS your spears I lose...

> > >

> > > So this kinda makes me think ranger might not be that much of a problem and you're just salty you lost?

> > >

> > > I think those were close games and they felt pretty balanced to me. I had to work really hard for those wins.

> >

> > I haven't fought many rangers in 2v2, but so far (I believe) I've lost most matches to them (for different reasons). I wasn't salty, I even said gg after the first match we lost. I sincerely think maul needs a damage nerf and smoke assault needs a (better) animation. I've also gotten smashed by Miaz (ranger) & Vallun. Ranger is definitely proving to be a very difficult match up. From my perspective it definitely feels 'impossible' sometimes to lock a good Ranger down. Zol and I discussed what we found difficult about the match up, and smoke assault into worldly impact / maul was what really wrecked us. There was one point you killed me from ~8k HP after smoke assault was used.. The maul literally hit 7.1k. If it hit somewhere between 4-5k I'd at least have time to follow up with something. I know 'L2P' and 'dodge', but sometimes that just doesn't work. Just sharing my perspective on the forum. I have no hard feelings

> >

> > Edit: Just remembered I beat a ranger using axe last night (totally different build)

>

> In the top 75 there are 4 rangers. In the top 60 there is 1 ranger... after that I don't really know who is playing what. So there really aren't that many I imagine you're losing to. Underrepresented yet still OP.

 

I don't think too many people are taking this mini season of 2v2 seriously. Also, we have to account for the fact FB, Necro & cRevenant were running wild before the patch hit yesterday. Now we're taking a look at what may be performing too well after they were brought down. We have to be honest here man, no class should have a single attack that crits that high. If True Shot was hitting that high, I would probably expect people to complain about it too. I'm also not the only person on the forum bringing this up.. People don't like getting bursted for crazy numbers, that's why people hated on pMesmer & DE so much

 

All I want is for damage to not be absurdly high (which is why anet dropped the most recent balance patch). If Ranger needs to crit that high to survive, then maybe their sustain skills need to be improved. I think that is part of having this discussion. I don't want any class unplayable, I just want everyone to have a good experience in PvP. I'll give it my best when we face each other again, but that's my current perspective on things at the moment

 

Something I took from a twitch chat that sums up a lot of feelings: https://i.imgur.com/Rh9sNqN.png

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That's what people complaining about ranger are too bad/new to realize. Every class has the capability to play glass cannon memes.

 

Complaints on this forum are simple: I died to something, something must be horribly OP about it. It's not that people care about being hit with big power numbers more so than giant condi stacks or being cancer-ed down slowly by perma CC or whatever it is, it's that they don't like being killed, and god forbid they die 1v1.

 

Get over it people, or stick to PvE.

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> @"Madisonlee.9641" said:

> That's what people complaining about ranger are too bad/new to realize. Every class has the capability to play glass cannon memes.

>

> Complaints on this forum are simple: I died to something, something must be horribly OP about it. It's not that people care about being hit with big power numbers more so than giant condi stacks or being cancer-ed down slowly by perma CC or whatever it is, it's that they don't like being killed, and god forbid they die 1v1.

>

> Get over it people, or stick to PvE.

 

The funny thing is, that glass cannon soulbeast build everyone seems to be dying to only has ONE condi clear in the form of Bear Stance.

 

In other words, you can literally apply some weakness on them and their pet and they're rendered useless unless they blow their heal to get rid of it (which has a 30 second cooldown btw).

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> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > @"Madisonlee.9641" said:

> > That's what people complaining about ranger are too bad/new to realize. Every class has the capability to play glass cannon memes.

> >

> > Complaints on this forum are simple: I died to something, something must be horribly OP about it. It's not that people care about being hit with big power numbers more so than giant condi stacks or being cancer-ed down slowly by perma CC or whatever it is, it's that they don't like being killed, and god forbid they die 1v1.

> >

> > Get over it people, or stick to PvE.

>

> The funny thing is, that glass cannon soulbeast build everyone seems to be dying to only has ONE condi clear in the form of Bear Stance.

>

> In other words, you can literally apply some weakness on them and their pet and they're rendered useless unless they blow their heal to get rid of it (which has a 30 second cooldown btw).

 

Not only that, but the glass sic' em soulbeasters usually run 2-3 utilities just to get the damage off; Sic'em for damage, perhaps zepher for quickness, perhaps signet of hunt for unblockable, etc. Compare that to my one shot mes that only needs ONE utility for the burst, mantra of pain.

 

I've seen countless full glass soulbeasts running around and my god do they friggin melt.

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> @"Madisonlee.9641" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > @"Madisonlee.9641" said:

> > > That's what people complaining about ranger are too bad/new to realize. Every class has the capability to play glass cannon memes.

> > >

> > > Complaints on this forum are simple: I died to something, something must be horribly OP about it. It's not that people care about being hit with big power numbers more so than giant condi stacks or being cancer-ed down slowly by perma CC or whatever it is, it's that they don't like being killed, and god forbid they die 1v1.

> > >

> > > Get over it people, or stick to PvE.

> >

> > The funny thing is, that glass cannon soulbeast build everyone seems to be dying to only has ONE condi clear in the form of Bear Stance.

> >

> > In other words, you can literally apply some weakness on them and their pet and they're rendered useless unless they blow their heal to get rid of it (which has a 30 second cooldown btw).

>

> Not only that, but the glass sic' em soulbeasters usually run 2-3 utilities just to get the damage off; Sic'em for damage, perhaps zepher for quickness, perhaps signet of hunt for unblockable, etc. Compare that to my one shot mes that only needs ONE utility for the burst, mantra of pain.

>

> I've seen countless full glass soulbeasts running around and my god do they friggin melt.

 

Like seriously there are so many ways every class can deal with that glass Soulbeast build.

 

1. Ele - Lightning Rod, projectile denial, CC

2. Necro - (They won't die to a SLB 1v1 anyways, too tanky), unblockable boon corrupts, projectile denial, condis

3. Mesmers - Projectile denial, counter attacks, aegis, blind, condis, unblockable slow and boon corrupts

4. Guardians - Weakness, blind, projectile denial, aegis, condis

5. Warriors - They have enough evades to dodge the CC, full counter for the Sic Em burst, tether (reveal), unblockable boon strip

6. Revenant - Weakness, unblockable boon strip, reveal, tormet for the pet

7. Ranger - CC, evades for their CC

8. Thief - Unblockable swipe CC + boon steal, evades, projectile denial

9. Engineer - Projectile denial, CC, stealth/invuln

 

And way more but those are just some things off the top of my head that could shut SLB down.

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> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> ![](https://i.imgur.com/36jZBZ0.jpg?1 "")

> ![](https://i.imgur.com/LTwz19o.jpg?1 "")

>

> ?

 

What is the context of those screen shots? I need a video to see the conditions under how that happened. I run 3 modifiers, and Test of Faith crits for 3-5k. Hunter's Ward definitely doesn't hit that high... If this did indeed happen post patch, was it a DH with Berserker's amulet & scholar rune? No one will ever take that serious in 2v2 or 5v5. It doesn't have the same defensive / disengage abilities as a Ranger with Berserker's amulet

 

If DH becomes an issue, people will definitely complain about it. That doesn't justify Ranger hitting as high as it does with Worldly Impact & Maul. Burst skills that hit too high need to be nerfed. **DH is no different if it becomes the case**

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> @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > ![](https://i.imgur.com/36jZBZ0.jpg?1 "")

> > ![](https://i.imgur.com/LTwz19o.jpg?1 "")

> >

> > ?

>

> What is the context of those screen shots? I need a video to see the conditions under how that happened. I run 3 modifiers, and Test of Faith crits for 3-5k. Hunter's Ward definitely doesn't hit that high... If this did indeed happen post patch, was it a DH with Berserker's amulet & scholar rune? No one will ever take that serious in 2v2 or 5v5. It doesn't have the same defensive / disengage abilities as a Ranger with Berserker's amulet

>

> If DH becomes an issue, people will definitely complain about it. That doesn't justify Ranger hitting as high as it does with Worldly Impact & Maul. Burst skills that hit too high need to be nerfed. **DH is no different if it becomes the case**

 

I wasn't recording but I was on demo and got gaped by these 2 skills.

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Condi thief. Apply condis. Ranger heals. Wait. Apply more condis. Wait. Stomp.

 

Ranger blocks? Short bow 4 is unblockable daze. Ranger mauls? Blind. Ranger uses smoke assualt? Smoke field blinds through evades. Smokefield blocks projectiles. Dagger storm reflects projectiles.

 

There are just so many ways to farm glass soulbeast.

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> @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> Condi thief. Apply condis. Ranger heals. Wait. Apply more condis. Wait. Stomp.

>

> Ranger blocks? Short bow 4 is unblockable daze. Ranger mauls? Blind. Ranger uses smoke assualt? Smoke field blinds through evades. Smokefield blocks projectiles. Dagger storm reflects projectiles.

>

> There are just so many ways to farm glass soulbeast.

 

This works for core too, and guardians are real good about that too, since they get decent uptime on block.

 

 

 

 

 

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> @"Axl.8924" said:

> > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > Condi thief. Apply condis. Ranger heals. Wait. Apply more condis. Wait. Stomp.

> >

> > Ranger blocks? Short bow 4 is unblockable daze. Ranger mauls? Blind. Ranger uses smoke assualt? Smoke field blinds through evades. Smokefield blocks projectiles. Dagger storm reflects projectiles.

> >

> > There are just so many ways to farm glass soulbeast.

>

> This works for core too, and guardians are real good about that too, since they get decent uptime on block.

>

>

>

 

Stay out of these threads man, you never add anything. This doesn't work that well for guardian because 1. Despite guard having access to blind, it's most reliable one (sword) is on a weapon set that really isn't that great vs ranger. Hammer is actually way stronger vs ranger because the ring denies smoke assualt, lightning reflexes, and other ranger evades. But it's not used because it's not as good vs other classes.

 

2. Marksmanship mauls are unblockable.

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> @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > @"Axl.8924" said:

> > > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > Condi thief. Apply condis. Ranger heals. Wait. Apply more condis. Wait. Stomp.

> > >

> > > Ranger blocks? Short bow 4 is unblockable daze. Ranger mauls? Blind. Ranger uses smoke assualt? Smoke field blinds through evades. Smokefield blocks projectiles. Dagger storm reflects projectiles.

> > >

> > > There are just so many ways to farm glass soulbeast.

> >

> > This works for core too, and guardians are real good about that too, since they get decent uptime on block.

> >

> >

> >

>

> Stay out of these threads man, you never add anything. This doesn't work that well for guardian because 1. Despite guard having access to blind, it's most reliable one (sword) is on a weapon set that really isn't that great vs ranger. Hammer is actually way stronger vs ranger because the ring denies smoke assualt, lightning reflexes, and other ranger evades. But it's not used because it's not as good vs other classes.

>

> 2. Marksmanship mauls are unblockable.

 

That roast tho... crispy!

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> @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > @"Axl.8924" said:

> > > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > Condi thief. Apply condis. Ranger heals. Wait. Apply more condis. Wait. Stomp.

> > >

> > > Ranger blocks? Short bow 4 is unblockable daze. Ranger mauls? Blind. Ranger uses smoke assualt? Smoke field blinds through evades. Smokefield blocks projectiles. Dagger storm reflects projectiles.

> > >

> > > There are just so many ways to farm glass soulbeast.

> >

> > This works for core too, and guardians are real good about that too, since they get decent uptime on block.

> >

> >

> >

>

> Stay out of these threads man, you never add anything. This doesn't work that well for guardian because 1. Despite guard having access to blind, it's most reliable one (sword) is on a weapon set that really isn't that great vs ranger. Hammer is actually way stronger vs ranger because the ring denies smoke assualt, lightning reflexes, and other ranger evades. But it's not used because it's not as good vs other classes.

>

> 2. Marksmanship mauls are unblockable.

 

Considering i've been dueling for days, and fighting some classes, i have some to add. I've had my sic em not blocked but if i don't at least d o some prep work like first trying to knock back and stun hten combo with that sec em burst, there is a good chance it wil be missed if seen.

 

granted i haven't pvped that much on ranger and its true i could get better, freedom of speech.

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> @"Axl.8924" said:

> > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > @"Axl.8924" said:

> > > > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > > Condi thief. Apply condis. Ranger heals. Wait. Apply more condis. Wait. Stomp.

> > > >

> > > > Ranger blocks? Short bow 4 is unblockable daze. Ranger mauls? Blind. Ranger uses smoke assualt? Smoke field blinds through evades. Smokefield blocks projectiles. Dagger storm reflects projectiles.

> > > >

> > > > There are just so many ways to farm glass soulbeast.

> > >

> > > This works for core too, and guardians are real good about that too, since they get decent uptime on block.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Stay out of these threads man, you never add anything. This doesn't work that well for guardian because 1. Despite guard having access to blind, it's most reliable one (sword) is on a weapon set that really isn't that great vs ranger. Hammer is actually way stronger vs ranger because the ring denies smoke assualt, lightning reflexes, and other ranger evades. But it's not used because it's not as good vs other classes.

> >

> > 2. Marksmanship mauls are unblockable.

>

> Considering i've been dueling for days, and fighting some classes, i have some to add. I've had my sic em not blocked but if i don't at least d o some prep work like first trying to knock back and stun hten combo with that sec em burst, there is a good chance it wil be missed if seen.

>

> granted i haven't pvped that much on ranger and its true i could get better, freedom of speech.

 

A converted necro main giving us some insight.

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> @"ArlAlt.1630" said:

> > @"Axl.8924" said:

> > > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > > @"Axl.8924" said:

> > > > > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > > > Condi thief. Apply condis. Ranger heals. Wait. Apply more condis. Wait. Stomp.

> > > > >

> > > > > Ranger blocks? Short bow 4 is unblockable daze. Ranger mauls? Blind. Ranger uses smoke assualt? Smoke field blinds through evades. Smokefield blocks projectiles. Dagger storm reflects projectiles.

> > > > >

> > > > > There are just so many ways to farm glass soulbeast.

> > > >

> > > > This works for core too, and guardians are real good about that too, since they get decent uptime on block.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Stay out of these threads man, you never add anything. This doesn't work that well for guardian because 1. Despite guard having access to blind, it's most reliable one (sword) is on a weapon set that really isn't that great vs ranger. Hammer is actually way stronger vs ranger because the ring denies smoke assualt, lightning reflexes, and other ranger evades. But it's not used because it's not as good vs other classes.

> > >

> > > 2. Marksmanship mauls are unblockable.

> >

> > Considering i've been dueling for days, and fighting some classes, i have some to add. I've had my sic em not blocked but if i don't at least d o some prep work like first trying to knock back and stun hten combo with that sec em burst, there is a good chance it wil be missed if seen.

> >

> > granted i haven't pvped that much on ranger and its true i could get better, freedom of speech.

>

> A converted necro main giving us some insight.

 

Converted? nah i still play necro i Just like playing multiple classes. A lot of folks play multiple classes. I am trying to find my niche of what i enjoy regardless of being UP.

 

 

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> @"Axl.8924" said:

> > @"ArlAlt.1630" said:

> > > @"Axl.8924" said:

> > > > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > > > @"Axl.8924" said:

> > > > > > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > > > > Condi thief. Apply condis. Ranger heals. Wait. Apply more condis. Wait. Stomp.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ranger blocks? Short bow 4 is unblockable daze. Ranger mauls? Blind. Ranger uses smoke assualt? Smoke field blinds through evades. Smokefield blocks projectiles. Dagger storm reflects projectiles.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > There are just so many ways to farm glass soulbeast.

> > > > >

> > > > > This works for core too, and guardians are real good about that too, since they get decent uptime on block.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Stay out of these threads man, you never add anything. This doesn't work that well for guardian because 1. Despite guard having access to blind, it's most reliable one (sword) is on a weapon set that really isn't that great vs ranger. Hammer is actually way stronger vs ranger because the ring denies smoke assualt, lightning reflexes, and other ranger evades. But it's not used because it's not as good vs other classes.

> > > >

> > > > 2. Marksmanship mauls are unblockable.

> > >

> > > Considering i've been dueling for days, and fighting some classes, i have some to add. I've had my sic em not blocked but if i don't at least d o some prep work like first trying to knock back and stun hten combo with that sec em burst, there is a good chance it wil be missed if seen.

> > >

> > > granted i haven't pvped that much on ranger and its true i could get better, freedom of speech.

> >

> > A converted necro main giving us some insight.

>

> Converted? nah i still play necro i Just like playing multiple classes. A lot of folks play multiple classes. I am trying to find my niche of what i enjoy regardless of being UP.

>

>

 

You get a +1 for seeing the way.

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> @"Starbreaker.6507" said:

> That's funny some is asking for context when a guard screenshot with high damage gets posted, but if some posts for the millionth time they got smoked by a pet because they couldn't dodge GS 2-5-2 everyone takes it at face value.

>

> Never change forums, you make me smile every day.

 

Of course I'm going to ask for context when I play DH an obscene amount of hours per day and have never seen numbers that high in my life post patch

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> @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > @"Starbreaker.6507" said:

> > That's funny some is asking for context when a guard screenshot with high damage gets posted, but if some posts for the millionth time they got smoked by a pet because they couldn't dodge GS 2-5-2 everyone takes it at face value.

> >

> > Never change forums, you make me smile every day.

>

> Of course I'm going to ask for context when I play DH an obscene amount of hours per day and have never seen numbers that high in my life post patch

 

Radiance dh should be able to hit those numbers with unscathed contender, zealots aggression and bgh. But yeah, have fun staying alive on that.

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> @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > @"Starbreaker.6507" said:

> > > That's funny some is asking for context when a guard screenshot with high damage gets posted, but if some posts for the millionth time they got smoked by a pet because they couldn't dodge GS 2-5-2 everyone takes it at face value.

> > >

> > > Never change forums, you make me smile every day.

> >

> > Of course I'm going to ask for context when I play DH an obscene amount of hours per day and have never seen numbers that high in my life post patch

>

> Radiance dh should be able to hit those numbers with unscathed contender, zealots aggression and bgh. But yeah, have fun staying alive on that.

 

You couldn't pay me to run that...

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